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Jump pack is what tells you how much space they take up in transports.

My current favorite Tankbusta unit is this one:

6 Orks - 5 TBs and a Boss Nob, 6 Rokkits, and 4 Bomb Squigs in a Trukk (227).

Those Squig bombs are solid gold. 4 dice hitting on 2+ going S8 -2 d6? Yes please. You hammer them off turn one or two to put a serious hurt on something. Tankbustas aren't going to survive targeted fire anyway, in a Trukk or not, so maximizing their damage potential for the first turn or two seems like the best way to spend those points.

40 points of Bomb Squigs will drop about 10 wounds onto a Predator level target. That's pretty keen.

Holy fek something cool I noticed in the rules.
Ok boss zagstruk has cyborg body it says he doesn't lose a wound on a 5 or 6 AND this doesn't stack w Dok tools...

Mad doc has Super cybork body that's says the same thing BUT doesn't restrict it from stacking w doc tools. Doc tools also doesn't restrict it from stacking w cybork body..

Sooooo everytime mad doc loses a wound you roll 2 dice... one prevents the wound on a 5+ the other prevents it on a 6+

In addition at the end of your movement phase he can heal HIMSELF....by rolling a d6 and anything but a 1 he regains d3 wounds.

He is a super durable character.....

gungo wrote:
Holy fek something cool I noticed in the rules.
Ok boss zagstruk has cyborg body it says he doesn't lose a wound on a 5 or 6 AND this doesn't stack w Dok tools...

Mad doc has Super cybork body that's says the same thing BUT doesn't restrict it from stacking w doc tools. Doc tools also doesn't restrict it from stacking w cybork body..

Sooooo everytime mad doc loses a wound you roll 2 dice... one prevents the wound on a 5+ the other prevents it on a 6+

In addition at the end of your movement phase he can heal HIMSELF....by rolling a d6 and anything but a 1 he regains d3 wounds.

He is a super durable character.....

Huh, impressive. However hes a Deathskull (for some reason,afaik his Clan has never been stated) so he can't buff Ghazzy, which i find strange.

 Fenris-77 wrote:
Jump pack is what tells you how much space they take up in transports.

My current favorite Tankbusta unit is this one:

6 Orks - 5 TBs and a Boss Nob, 6 Rokkits, and 4 Bomb Squigs in a Trukk (227).

Those Squig bombs are solid gold. 4 dice hitting on 2+ going S8 -2 d6? Yes please. You hammer them off turn one or two to put a serious hurt on something. Tankbustas aren't going to survive targeted fire anyway, in a Trukk or not, so maximizing their damage potential for the first turn or two seems like the best way to spend those points.

40 points of Bomb Squigs will drop about 10 wounds onto a Predator level target. That's pretty keen.

I wish and agree on bomb squigs (they also get the reroll to hit) but you can only take 2 squigs for every 5 bustas. You need 10 bustas for 4 squigs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grimmor wrote:

gungo wrote:
Holy fek something cool I noticed in the rules.
Ok boss zagstruk has cyborg body it says he doesn't lose a wound on a 5 or 6 AND this doesn't stack w Dok tools...

Mad doc has Super cybork body that's says the same thing BUT doesn't restrict it from stacking w doc tools. Doc tools also doesn't restrict it from stacking w cybork body..

Sooooo everytime mad doc loses a wound you roll 2 dice... one prevents the wound on a 5+ the other prevents it on a 6+

In addition at the end of your movement phase he can heal HIMSELF....by rolling a d6 and anything but a 1 he regains d3 wounds.

He is a super durable character.....

Huh, impressive. However hes a Deathskull (for some reason,afaik his Clan has never been stated) so he can't buff Ghazzy, which i find strange.

Actually he's the only painboy who can heal any clan
The other painboys doc tools say <clan> infantry or biker
Maddoc doc tools say any Ork infantry or biker

He however won't receive any buffs from other character abilities that don't specifically allow his clan. Which is only really the waagh banner that matters for him everything else is ork infantry or morale.

@grungo - it's two squigs for every 5 TBs and/or Boss Nob, that six man unit does indeed get to take four Bomb Squigs. Neat huh?

I see how you read it but I don't agree. I wish it did but

The exact wording is
For every 5 tankbustas or boss nobz in the unit, it may be accompanied by up to 2 bomb squigs.

But hey if we can get it clarified I'd be happy to be proven Wrong. I'd gladly run w 6 bustas and 4 squigs per trukk.

I actually agree with you that that your interpretation is what they probably meant. I looked at it a couple of times and really got hung up reading the 'or' rather than the pluralization of 'Nobz'. If the 'or' is the key then yeah, it works like I said it does (5 TBs. Check. One Nob. Check. = 4 BS). However, the more I think about the pluralization of Nob the more I think a serious grammatical deconstruction would support your reading. Plural + plural = total group. Especially when there's no option to literally include more than one Boos Nob in the unit anyway.

Sigh. Stupid grammar.

I am reading some people taking squads with strange numbers 6 orks, 12 orks etc

Does it say somewhere that the squad sizes arnt fixed?

I know you can take an understrength squad (but still have to pay the same points as the full strength squad) but when it says 5 boys + 5 boys for X or + 10 boys for 2X. that means a squad is either 5,10 or 15 boys strong, no 8, no 12?

Or is there a rule I have missed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 wtwlf123 wrote:

It's just a bummer that the model I've used since 5th is no longer a viable model to field. :-/

I wouldnt change your model, you will be 10x more pissed if the codex comes out and the PK is added as an option

 Grimmor wrote:

gungo wrote:
Holy fek something cool I noticed in the rules.
Ok boss zagstruk has cyborg body it says he doesn't lose a wound on a 5 or 6 AND this doesn't stack w Dok tools...

Mad doc has Super cybork body that's says the same thing BUT doesn't restrict it from stacking w doc tools. Doc tools also doesn't restrict it from stacking w cybork body..

Sooooo everytime mad doc loses a wound you roll 2 dice... one prevents the wound on a 5+ the other prevents it on a 6+

In addition at the end of your movement phase he can heal HIMSELF....by rolling a d6 and anything but a 1 he regains d3 wounds.

He is a super durable character.....

Huh, impressive. However hes a Deathskull (for some reason,afaik his Clan has never been stated) so he can't buff Ghazzy, which i find strange.

In (one of the ork codex) blurbs about Ghazzys origin story they do mention that it was a death skullz painboy named grotsnik who saved him. Also makes sense, since he's Looting all those body parts on the battlefield.

gungo wrote:

The new way to make an army list is an absolute pain in the arse. It took me like a dozen times to get the points right. Each Mek gun is accompanied by 5 grots that cost 2pts each so each kmk Mek gun is 48 points.

Ahhh crap. I forgot I had to pay for grots for the gunz as well.

Yes, list building in this edition sucks the big one :(

 Grimmor wrote:

 koooaei wrote:
*killsaw maths*.

I had a feeling that the Killsaws would be straight up better.

I miscalculated the killiness per point a bit cause i thought the saw is 27 and not 28.But it doesn't change the picture that much.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anywayz, badrukk doesn't seem that bad. I'm actually thinking of taking him. 24 range can be an issue but with his re-rolls and s8 ap-3 and 3 damage overcharged Da Rippa, he's passable for 84 pts. He might be not that much worse vs tanks than tankbustas point-for-point - providing he doesn't move, ofc. But even if he does, badrukk doesn't need a transport. Which makes him cheaper overall.

 Grimmor wrote:

zamerion wrote:
Sorry if it was asked, but, if a unit with heavy weapons is embarked in a battlewagon, do they benefit from the rule of move and shoot heavy weapons without penalty ?

In open tropped rule said that models embarked shoot as the model (vehicle)

It does seem to work that way, and i hope that that is intentional, cuz the Battlewagon would feel a bit expensive otherwise.

Heres a 2k list i cobbled together, its comprised mostly of Kommandoes and Stormboyz, and its whole point is mobility to the extreme.

Spoiler:

Outrider Detachment
HQ
Boss Zagstrukk-88

Fast Attack
30 Stormboyz w/ BC Nob-249
30 Stormboyz w/ BC Nob-249
30 Stormboyz w/ BC Nob-249

3 Warbuggies w/ Rokkit Racks-216
3 Warbuggies w/ Rokkit Racks-216


Vanguard Detachment
HQ
Boss Snikrot-69

Elite
10 Kommandoes w/ 2 Burnas, Nob w/ BC-99
10 Kommandoes w/ 2 Burnas, Nob w/ BC-99
10 Kommandoes w/ 2 Burnas, Nob w/ BC-99


Spearhead Detachment
HQ
Big Mek w/ KFF-75

Heavy Support
3 Mek Guns w/ KMKs- 114
2 Mek Guns w/ KMKs- 76
2 Mek Guns w/ KMKs- 76

Total:1974

The Big Mek hangs with the KMKs that can be spread out wherever (plus Mek Guns can actually benefit from cover so you only really need to protect ones that are most likely to be in danger). The Stormboyz blitz up the field (like they should) and the Buggies can outflank or just run up the normal flank and snipe Vehicles that the KMKs can't get. The Kommandoes are for Objective nabbing and being the hammer to the Stormboyz other hammer (Orks don't do anvils )

This list has a fair few models (over 100) and it hits fairly hard. Its main issue is, is that it has to get in melee to crush hordes, which really isn't an issue.

I hacked together a very similar list a couple nights ago, the bulk of which is Kommandos and Stormboyz. I felt I needed a bit more heavy damage so went with some nob bikers too. Lemme know how your games go.

Grimmor 2000pt list


Your list looks similar to one I was considering running (https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727918.page); let me know how it works out for you.

Also, the warbuggies look fast plus can reserve/Outrider - however, I'm concerned they might be expensive for what they do; I'm looking at a 6 man unit of Tankbustas+Trukk, and it comes out to a little less than the price of a 3 man Warbuggy+Rack of Rokkits squad. You get the same number of shots, but have rerolls (and potential bomb squig) and about the same number of wounds (5x3 vs 10+1x6). If the Trukk is destroyed too, the Tankbusta unit can't be shot at by the unit that destroyed the Trukk during the shooting round (as the models weren't on the table when shooting selection began). The Trukk also has Ramshakle, which can very unreliably save it from random strong attacks.

Warbuggies
M14" WS3+ BS5+ S4 T5 W5 A4 Sv4+ ; Outriders

Trukk
M12" WS5+ BS5+ S6 T6 W10 A3 Sv4+ ; Ramshackle

Hard to say if a squad of 3 Warbuggies with Rokkits or a 6 ork Squad of Tankbustas+Trukk is the way to go for 200/216 points.

They have slightly different uses; the Warbuggies are better in combat, but more and less vulnerable to shooting. The Tankbustas are better vs tanks, but aren't as versatile (can't tie something up in combat).

Thoughts?

 MangoMadness wrote:
I am reading some people taking squads with strange numbers 6 orks, 12 orks etc

Does it say somewhere that the squad sizes arnt fixed?

I know you can take an understrength squad (but still have to pay the same points as the full strength squad) but when it says 5 boys + 5 boys for X or + 10 boys for 2X. that means a squad is either 5,10 or 15 boys strong, no 8, no 12?

Or is there a rule I have missed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 wtwlf123 wrote:

It's just a bummer that the model I've used since 5th is no longer a viable model to field. :-/

I wouldnt change your model, you will be 10x more pissed if the codex comes out and the PK is added as an option

Understrength squads (the ability to take less then 10 or 15, etc) only matters for power points. When you purchase a squad for matched play it specifically allows you to buy models UP TO the max amount individually. There is definitely a minimum unit model count and a maximum. However unless the unit entry specifically says you can only take 5 or 10 or something similiar UP TO allows you to take any amount in between.

The main reason you see amounts of 6 and 12 is because our trukk transport holds 12 models.

I agree don't change the model ffs the official waagh banner literally has a power fist cybork arm. I'm just glad gw didn't force us to take a powerklaw like they did w the painboy. Also the urty syringe should be a mortal wound since there is almost no point to use it over the str10 ap-3 d3 klaw.

gungo wrote:

Understrength squads (the ability to take less then 10 or 15, etc) only matters for power points. When you purchase a squad for matched play it specifically allows you to buy models UP TO the max amount individually. There is definitely a minimum unit model count and a maximum. However unless the unit entry specifically says you can only take 5 or 10 or something similiar UP TO allows you to take any amount in betwee.

Could you tell me where that is shown? I looked in the rules and it isnt mentioned in the matched play section, is it detailed at the start of the codex books? (the first 11 pages are missing in the uploads so it could easily be in there)

@MangoMadness

Page 242, "Understrength Units"; the page after "Battle-forged Armies".

Regarding the Waaagh banner power klaw - it's a super Waaagh Banner holding claw, so it doesn't fall down. No need to remodel.

One more rules question.
Do you think I can decide not to take the default weapon of a model? I am thinking about running a painboy, but do not need the power klaw, just the healing. I dont't really see him fighting that much...

You must take whatever weapons are listed in the unit entry, but you can swap them out if it says you can swap them out (say, Painboy Power Klaw upgrading to a Killsaw) - if the base model has something different that's not listed in the unit entry, that's a separate issue; you either fix them up if it's an egregious difference, or just roll with it.

Depends who you're playing with and where at; casual play it's not an issue too much if it's one or two models that aren't perfect, but tournaments are usually pretty strict on it.

If painbosses didn't require a klaw/saw they'd be great. On the other hand, i have an old metal small painboy with a saw. So, i guess it's time to run one!

fe40k wrote:
@MangoMadness
Page 242, "Understrength Units"; the page after "Battle-forged Armies".

Thanks for the reply but it doesnt say that I can take 12 models instead of 15.

BUT i did find the answer in the unit entry....

Ork boyz for example says 'it can include up to an additional 10 orks", the 'UP TO' was the bit I missed when reading the unit entry, all solved now

 koooaei wrote:
If painbosses didn't require a klaw/saw they'd be great. On the other hand, i have an old metal small painboy with a saw. So, i guess it's time to run one!

Same i got one old in metal and one in finecast.

But what a pain in the ass to have to pay for the PK, who gives a feth, we don't play the painboy because we want him to do damage. Bad move gw, bad move.

Even including the PK it's dirt cheap for what it does though.

I would have preferred some sort of shooty option, but I guess GW first and foremost went with what the models they sell have.

I'd not call pk dirt cheap. If something, they actually do much less than they used to. And still cost the same.

What's our most effective means of dealing with fliers do you all reckon? Shooting at it with a load of stuff, using our own fliers to shoot/ assault it, use trakktor cannons or simply wait till they charge us?

 Jangus wrote:
What's our most effective means of dealing with fliers do you all reckon? Shooting at it with a load of stuff, using our own fliers to shoot/ assault it, use trakktor cannons or simply wait till they charge us?

I think tankbustas will do the trick.

How do you see the new KMKs? Being heavy D6 means they have an average of 3 hits every turn, which is better than before, for 48 points each (if I did the calculations right). No more possibility to hurt our own units. Even if the new gets hot rule brings an average of 1 wound suffered everytime a KMK fires with 6W this piece of artilley looks pretty intimidating, and a cheap mek or even a big mek positioned near the battery can restore lost wounds. I'm not sure if they can take ammo runts though, the profile don't show this possibility but I guess it doesn't really matter now.

The KFF seems another interesting item now, especially on a biker mek that gives an invuln to multiple vehicles. For that purpose are bikes still better than buggies to ride with the bik mek? I think so, but I really like the new buggies and finally they're going back to the battlefields.

The nob upgrade in now free right? I mean in units of boyz, tankbustas, bikes... also the 'ard case seems a free update and now that every vehicle allows the assault it looks like mandatory for those transports that carry melee units like meganobz, nobz or slugga/choppa boyz.

Probably stormboyz. They can assault it and fliers have enormous bases and are easier to catch cause they can't controle their movement as well as other stuff.

Stormboys for sure! I can't wait to try that too.
Not sold on the KMK yet. Heavy D6, then roll to hit. So. Can that be averaged? (I'm not a math guy. I'm a weight of number, Down some Jagermeister and swing for the fences kinda guy.)
Do we have anything close to a consensus about which Mek guns are reliable yet? One thing about power Levels I've noticed, I could be way off here but it seems to me, Some units are begging to be fielded in certain costs. 5 Lootas is 8. 15 Lootas is 16. Split fire is a thing. So why would I take Lootas in anything less than their full unit size. They should draw more fire to wipe them out and have the LD15 going for them So they son't seem any more vulnerable than 3 mobs of 5. Maybe better.as they would be 8 PL cheaper.

Hello chaps, wondering what you think about this for a long range backline unit. I'm sorta kinda feeling like it's more effective in 8th than it was in 7th, where i used it a number of times, btu obviously noticed you're all up on the KMKs back there (I need way more Grots...).
Basically, 3 Lobbas and 1 or 2 SAGs. Really just because I've always loved the SAG and occasionally it will hit very hard indeed.
Firstly, I was surprised the Lobba was D6 shots, I expected D3 since the max a small blast would ever get was 3 models. So in the past, with barrage and often full scatter, I'd be lucky to land even a few hits on a hidden unit with the 3 of them. Now I'm getting 3D6 shots hitting on 4+ (really feel like it should be at least -1 for non LOS).
Add in the SAGS. I know they feel a lot worse now but they're still -5 AP with an average S of 7. Plus, they no longer go badly wrong, they can fix up damaged Gunz and plus plus, they can't be directly targeted from anywhere if you bubble the Gunz round them. Apart from by snipers, who'll inevitably get Deffkopta'd, Kommando'd or Stormboy'd at the earliest opportunity.
I do see that KMKs with a KFF may well be more efficient but still, looking at considerably less range and being restricted to LOS there so I thought it might be worth a thought.
If we get the Gitfinda back in the codex I'll be delighted...

Also pondering how one Weirdboy slingshotting another could be applied... Must be something in that.... Was thinking about teleporting Ghaz''s buffs about the place but that's seeming like a 3 or 4 turn play, lol.

@ Kooaei - The morale issue with the kans never really came up in my game since I'd either roll good on the morale or CP points to auto pass.

@GrimTeef - Never thought about putting the waagh banner with the Kanz. lol I'm mainly wanted to see how the dread mob would play out in the new edition. Its very promising.

@Sledgio- Sorry the Morkanaut has a KFF. I forgot it in my list. I just always take it. Now the reason for having a second big mek with a KFF is for the Gorkanaut to run around and not have to worry about being in the range of the Morkanaut's KFF. This mainly is because in order to benefit from the KFF you have to be completely within 9" of the KFF. It also gives some tactical flexibility to the list. You can have some dreads and the Gorkanaut break off from the Morkanaut and Kanz and go fight something else on the table instead of trying to stay in 1 giant group.