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KrispyXIV wrote:

 andysonic1 wrote:

 dan2026 wrote:
What's better for mashing tanks?
(Particularly of the Leman Russ variety)

Skarbrand or the Bloodthirster of Intense Rage?

Daemon Prince with Skullreaver?

It is pretty absurd. Especially since I just learned you can Stratagem to swing twice per round for as long as you can pay a Battalion's worth of CP a turn...

...but considering the amount of damage you can do, it may be worth it.

I ran it this weekend. It's pretty good, it can be finiky with the D6 damage. But boy oh boy when you hit those sixes to wound, BOY OH BOY REV UP THOSE FRYERS!

ballzonya wrote:
Question do those trees (forgot their name) get placed just like placing other units in your deployment? You don't need the snail to drop them do you?

Yes they are a unit in your army just like any other model. you can even deep strike them. Similarly when summoned they cost points.

Question: Which FW heavy support is the best choice: giant chaos spawn or spined chaos beast?

operkoi wrote:
Question: Which FW heavy support is the best choice: giant chaos spawn or spined chaos beast?

What's your god? Are you gunna deep strike it? What is its role in your army?

VoidSempai wrote:

 McGibs wrote:
Apologies if this has been brought up earlier, but has anyone noticed the ranged benefits of the Crimson Crown?
The Crimson Crown:
Each time you make a wound roll of 6+ for a friendly KHORNE DAEMON unit within 6" of the bearer, that model may immediately make an extra attack using the same weapon at the same target (sic)

so, for ranged weapons, this generates an entire extra attack (full shots) with the weapon. Like, for my Khorne laser Decimator with 10 shots, each roll of 6 generates 5 more shots. Get's even dumber with things like Lord of Skulls or Kytans.

Seems like something they'll catch in a FAQ (change to fight phase), but interesting nontheless.

Yeah, they’re going to have to rewrite this to melee only, or else clarify that it means a single extra shot. It clearly isn’t going to be ‘Lord of Skulls rolls to hit with Hades Gatling Cannon, hits 10 times, rolls three sixes to wound, FIRES THIRTY-SIX MORE SHOTS’.

 andysonic1 wrote:

operkoi wrote:
Question: Which FW heavy support is the best choice: giant chaos spawn or spined chaos beast?

What's your god? Are you gunna deep strike it? What is its role in your army?

Im thinking of mixing slaanesh and khorne and using the beastie as a high wound footslogger. Plan is to run batallion slaanesh, batallion khorne, and batallion CSM, footslog a horde of daemonettes/cultists with masque and herald to the enemy and deep strike skarbrand for +1a aura/chop up big enemy target with some miscellaneous units to provide some ranged damage. I figured a relatively fast and durable model would be useful to countering deepstrikes/transports or as a linebreaker

Also have a bunch of old nurgle stuff but haven't looked into it too much as i'm not a fan of alot of the new unit asthetics and those seem like necessary lynchpins

I don't think you'll be able to fit all of that into a list, honestly.

 andysonic1 wrote:
I don't think you'll be able to fit all of that into a list, honestly.

well its kind of for a 2000-2500 pt list and skarbrand is the only big guy i have so far. was mainly interested in the beasts because theyre cheaper then soul grinder/defiler and seem pretty good in melee. most of my hqs are heralds or ~100-120 pt chaos characters

Okay I really don't understand this but why do chaos spawn not have a 5++? They're clearly daemonic and would definitely make them way more useful. Is it because they cost 33 pts?

 Crastok wrote:
Okay I really don't understand this but why do chaos spawn not have a 5++? They're clearly daemonic and would definitely make them way more useful. Is it because they cost 33 pts?

Spawn aren't actually daemons. They are just hideously mutated blobs of flesh

 anticitizen013 wrote:

 Crastok wrote:
Okay I really don't understand this but why do chaos spawn not have a 5++? They're clearly daemonic and would definitely make them way more useful. Is it because they cost 33 pts?

Spawn aren't actually daemons. They are just hideously mutated blobs of flesh

like warp poop

Lol. Warp poop :p

So I am looking at the deamon codex right now and am loving it for the most part. I am trying to figure something out though, my deamon army is going to be rolling with my chaos marine army, right now a renegade chapter variety force. I wanted to use forgefiends and soul grinders as the focus of the shooting of the army, but I am not seeing any real options for helping the soul grinder shoot better in the deamon codex except for a deamon prince. I really don't want to pay for a dp to just make the soulgrinder shoot better, what other options could I take?

I don't have my chaos marine codex on me atm, but I am ok using a deathguard detachment and giving the grinder mark of nurgle, or just sticking with chaos marines and mark of tzeench for better save, as my deamon force is a soup list and not dedicated to any single force. Would rather not have to rely on stratagems like demonic Forge from the chaos marines book either.

Or are these guys just not tactically viable for long range fire Support? I am trying to tiptoe the line of fluffy and challenging vs all comers, not focused on taking on any specific army or force.

 lindsay40k wrote:

VoidSempai wrote:

 McGibs wrote:
Apologies if this has been brought up earlier, but has anyone noticed the ranged benefits of the Crimson Crown?
The Crimson Crown:
Each time you make a wound roll of 6+ for a friendly KHORNE DAEMON unit within 6" of the bearer, that model may immediately make an extra attack using the same weapon at the same target (sic)

so, for ranged weapons, this generates an entire extra attack (full shots) with the weapon. Like, for my Khorne laser Decimator with 10 shots, each roll of 6 generates 5 more shots. Get's even dumber with things like Lord of Skulls or Kytans.

Seems like something they'll catch in a FAQ (change to fight phase), but interesting nontheless.

Yeah, they’re going to have to rewrite this to melee only, or else clarify that it means a single extra shot. It clearly isn’t going to be ‘Lord of Skulls rolls to hit with Hades Gatling Cannon, hits 10 times, rolls three sixes to wound, FIRES THIRTY-SIX MORE SHOTS’.

No. BRB, page 179. Or simply read my previous comment where i have already answered.

Hi!
Long time lurker and now it is time to provide with some content to this lovely thread.
I made a 1500 points mono tzeentch army, and I want to see what you think:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Battalion Detachment 1:

HQ:
Changecaster (Warlord; Daemonspark)
- Psychic Powers: Boon of Change, Flickering Flames
- Artefacts/Wargear: -
- Comment: Warlord, reroll 1 wounds, provide Flickering Flames, Deepstrike

Daemon Prince
- Psychic Powers: Boon of Change
- Artefacts/Wargear: 2 Malefic talons
- Comment: Reroll 1 to hit, provide Boon of Change, Deepstrike

Troops:
24 pink horrors
- Comment: Deepstrike, 72 str 4-5 shots, reroll 1 to hit and wounds

10 brimstones
10 brimstones
- Comment: Objective holders, screen

Elites:
6 flamers
- Comment: Deepstrike, 6d6 str 4-5 shots, AP -1, reroll 1 to wound

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Battalion Detachment 2:

HQ: :
Lord Of Change with Baleful sword
- Psychic Powers: Infernal Gateway, Bolt of Change, Flickering Flames
- Artefacts/Wargear: The impossible Robe
- Comment: Set up middle, draw attention

Change Caster
- Psychic Powers: Gaze of Fate, Boon of Change
- Artefacts/Wargear: -
- Comment: Stay behind troops and provide rerolls

Troops:
10 brimstones
10 blue horror
10 blue horror
- Comment: Objective holders, screen (lack of brimestones)

Elites:
1 Exalted flamer
1 Exalted flamer
- Comment: Heavy armor destroyer

Fast Attack:
5 screamers
- Comment: Flyer killer and flanker

Total points:
1499

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Command points
9 Command points - Deepstrike Changecaster (1 CP), Daemon Prince (1 CP), pink horrors (2 CP), 6 Flamers(1 CP)
= 4 Command points

Use rest of the command points for rerolls, moral negation and +1 invulnerable saves

Game plan:
Try to deepstrike as soon as possible and try to position such that I can eliminate key sections of the enemy army.
The Lord of Change with the impossible robe are going move straight against the enemy on a suicide mission to draw attention from enemy gunfire. If he survives (3++) will be a somewhat threat in melee and in Infernal Gateway range.
Screamers are going on for flyer hunt or take down medium vehicle, since the high movement it is not impossible for them to take advantage of the Deepstriking blob aura.
Brimestones/Blue Horrors are going to take and hold objectives and screen the changecaster number 2 and exalted flamers.
Exalted Flamers are going to target various high armor trouble makers.

Possible changes:
1. I dont know if it is worth to choose the deepstriking changecaster as a warlord for the daemonspark (reroll 1 to wound in shooting phase) or if I should make the Lord of Change the warlord so he can get the Incorporeal form (-1 damage).
2. I really want to try out the screamers, but more flamers might be a better choice.
3. Daemon prince with 2 malefic talons is a beast, but I'm worried that deepstriking a Daemon prince for the reroll 1 to hit and a possible charge is a waste of points.

Anyone has some suggestions or see something obvious I should change?

I found a funny typo: obliterators have the faction keyords
"daemon" so they can be used in a battleforged detachment of chaos daemon.

They do not gain the specific ability of a daemon with alligiance but they can sinergy with psychic powers and relics...
A khorne obly unit can benefit from the crown....cool

Azuza001 wrote:
Lol. Warp poop :p

So I am looking at the deamon codex right now and am loving it for the most part. I am trying to figure something out though, my deamon army is going to be rolling with my chaos marine army, right now a renegade chapter variety force. I wanted to use forgefiends and soul grinders as the focus of the shooting of the army, but I am not seeing any real options for helping the soul grinder shoot better in the deamon codex except for a deamon prince. I really don't want to pay for a dp to just make the soulgrinder shoot better, what other options could I take?

I don't have my chaos marine codex on me atm, but I am ok using a deathguard detachment and giving the grinder mark of nurgle, or just sticking with chaos marines and mark of tzeench for better save, as my deamon force is a soup list and not dedicated to any single force. Would rather not have to rely on stratagems like demonic Forge from the chaos marines book either.

Or are these guys just not tactically viable for long range fire Support? I am trying to tiptoe the line of fluffy and challenging vs all comers, not focused on taking on any specific army or force.

Neither Foregfiends or Soul Grinders are really viable for long ranged support unless you shove Kharn next to them, buff them with psykic powers, and sacrifice a small goat before the game begins. You will get more mileage out of Havocs, Bikes, Obits, and pretty much any other shooting option.

brugner8 wrote:
I found a funny typo: obliterators have the faction keyords
"daemon" so they can be used in a battleforged detachment of chaos daemon.

They do not gain the specific ability of a daemon with alligiance but they can sinergy with psychic powers and relics...
A khorne obly unit can benefit from the crown....cool

All Daemons (and Daemon Engines) synergize with Daemons' psychic powers and relics, regardless of their faction's keywords. Faction's keywords only come into the picture when you're making a detachment and "possibly" when using faction's stratagems.

FLG has implied that'll be changed in a faq/errata, though how and whether just for demons or for the game as a whole is unsure. It is odd, given as recently as the DG faq they were doing it the other way around.

mmimzie wrote:

ballzonya wrote:
Question do those trees (forgot their name) get placed just like placing other units in your deployment? You don't need the snail to drop them do you?

Yes they are a unit in your army just like any other model. you can even deep strike them. Similarly when summoned they cost points.

By summoned do you mean from the snail character? They don't have the daemonic ritual rule, so they cannot be summoned.

 anticitizen013 wrote:

 Crastok wrote:
Okay I really don't understand this but why do chaos spawn not have a 5++? They're clearly daemonic and would definitely make them way more useful. Is it because they cost 33 pts?

Spawn aren't actually daemons. They are just hideously mutated blobs of flesh

Yep. I've run Spawn in 7th edition when their high movement was key. But they really need a price cut now considering Plague Drones do what they do better, faster, more resilient, and more reliably for 1 pt more. It's a pain because I have 11 of the beasties. Even at 30 pts, I'd be hard pressed to pick them over Drones i think Spawn are best used to escort slow moving characters on foot.

 andysonic1 wrote:

Azuza001 wrote:
Lol. Warp poop :p

So I am looking at the deamon codex right now and am loving it for the most part. I am trying to figure something out though, my deamon army is going to be rolling with my chaos marine army, right now a renegade chapter variety force. I wanted to use forgefiends and soul grinders as the focus of the shooting of the army, but I am not seeing any real options for helping the soul grinder shoot better in the deamon codex except for a deamon prince. I really don't want to pay for a dp to just make the soulgrinder shoot better, what other options could I take?

I don't have my chaos marine codex on me atm, but I am ok using a deathguard detachment and giving the grinder mark of nurgle, or just sticking with chaos marines and mark of tzeench for better save, as my deamon force is a soup list and not dedicated to any single force. Would rather not have to rely on stratagems like demonic Forge from the chaos marines book either.

Or are these guys just not tactically viable for long range fire Support? I am trying to tiptoe the line of fluffy and challenging vs all comers, not focused on taking on any specific army or force.

Neither Foregfiends or Soul Grinders are really viable for long ranged support unless you shove Kharn next to them, buff them with psykic powers, and sacrifice a small goat before the game begins. You will get more mileage out of Havocs, Bikes, Obits, and pretty much any other shooting option.

So I have to find a small goat? Dang. Oh well. Lol

My issue is I already have the models. So if soul grinders are not our demonic answer to range what is besides a skull cannon? And again what God works best with it?

 gwarsh41 wrote:

mmimzie wrote:

ballzonya wrote:
Question do those trees (forgot their name) get placed just like placing other units in your deployment? You don't need the snail to drop them do you?

Yes they are a unit in your army just like any other model. you can even deep strike them. Similarly when summoned they cost points.

By summoned do you mean from the snail character? They don't have the daemonic ritual rule, so they cannot be summoned.

Yes by the snail.

Azuza001 wrote:

 andysonic1 wrote:

Azuza001 wrote:
Lol. Warp poop :p

So I am looking at the deamon codex right now and am loving it for the most part. I am trying to figure something out though, my deamon army is going to be rolling with my chaos marine army, right now a renegade chapter variety force. I wanted to use forgefiends and soul grinders as the focus of the shooting of the army, but I am not seeing any real options for helping the soul grinder shoot better in the deamon codex except for a deamon prince. I really don't want to pay for a dp to just make the soulgrinder shoot better, what other options could I take?

I don't have my chaos marine codex on me atm, but I am ok using a deathguard detachment and giving the grinder mark of nurgle, or just sticking with chaos marines and mark of tzeench for better save, as my deamon force is a soup list and not dedicated to any single force. Would rather not have to rely on stratagems like demonic Forge from the chaos marines book either.

Or are these guys just not tactically viable for long range fire Support? I am trying to tiptoe the line of fluffy and challenging vs all comers, not focused on taking on any specific army or force.

Neither Foregfiends or Soul Grinders are really viable for long ranged support unless you shove Kharn next to them, buff them with psykic powers, and sacrifice a small goat before the game begins. You will get more mileage out of Havocs, Bikes, Obits, and pretty much any other shooting option.

So I have to find a small goat? Dang. Oh well. Lol

My issue is I already have the models. So if soul grinders are not our demonic answer to range what is besides a skull cannon? And again what God works best with it?

Honestly, the only list I’m even considering with dinobots in it is a casual play Epidemius one. They *might* finish some units off and charge up Epi; they are not doing as much ranged heavy lifting as Oblits, Blight-Haulers, or Decimators. But, honestly, their main use is as a fire magnet, moving forwards and intimidating the enemy. But even if you throw Kharn, Abaddon or Stratagems are them, they don’t seem to hit the AP/fire rate/range sweet spot.

And that’s not even answering the question of ranged Daemon *faction* firepower. The Soul Grinder, Skull Cannon, and Burning Chariot are not tempting me away from Chaos Soup, I’m sad to say.

CupOfBuckets wrote:
Hi!
Long time lurker and now it is time to provide with some content to this lovely thread.
I made a 1500 points mono tzeentch army, and I want to see what you think:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Battalion Detachment 1:

HQ:
Changecaster (Warlord; Daemonspark)
- Psychic Powers: Boon of Change, Flickering Flames
- Artefacts/Wargear: -
- Comment: Warlord, reroll 1 wounds, provide Flickering Flames, Deepstrike

Daemon Prince
- Psychic Powers: Boon of Change
- Artefacts/Wargear: 2 Malefic talons
- Comment: Reroll 1 to hit, provide Boon of Change, Deepstrike

Troops:
24 pink horrors
- Comment: Deepstrike, 72 str 4-5 shots, reroll 1 to hit and wounds

10 brimstones
10 brimstones
- Comment: Objective holders, screen

Elites:
6 flamers
- Comment: Deepstrike, 6d6 str 4-5 shots, AP -1, reroll 1 to wound

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Battalion Detachment 2:

HQ: :
Lord Of Change with Baleful sword
- Psychic Powers: Infernal Gateway, Bolt of Change, Flickering Flames
- Artefacts/Wargear: The impossible Robe
- Comment: Set up middle, draw attention

Change Caster
- Psychic Powers: Gaze of Fate, Boon of Change
- Artefacts/Wargear: -
- Comment: Stay behind troops and provide rerolls

Troops:
10 brimstones
10 blue horror
10 blue horror
- Comment: Objective holders, screen (lack of brimestones)

Elites:
1 Exalted flamer
1 Exalted flamer
- Comment: Heavy armor destroyer

Fast Attack:
5 screamers
- Comment: Flyer killer and flanker

Total points:
1499

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Command points
9 Command points - Deepstrike Changecaster (1 CP), Daemon Prince (1 CP), pink horrors (2 CP), 6 Flamers(1 CP)
= 4 Command points

Use rest of the command points for rerolls, moral negation and +1 invulnerable saves

Game plan:
Try to deepstrike as soon as possible and try to position such that I can eliminate key sections of the enemy army.
The Lord of Change with the impossible robe are going move straight against the enemy on a suicide mission to draw attention from enemy gunfire. If he survives (3++) will be a somewhat threat in melee and in Infernal Gateway range.
Screamers are going on for flyer hunt or take down medium vehicle, since the high movement it is not impossible for them to take advantage of the Deepstriking blob aura.
Brimestones/Blue Horrors are going to take and hold objectives and screen the changecaster number 2 and exalted flamers.
Exalted Flamers are going to target various high armor trouble makers.

Possible changes:
1. I dont know if it is worth to choose the deepstriking changecaster as a warlord for the daemonspark (reroll 1 to wound in shooting phase) or if I should make the Lord of Change the warlord so he can get the Incorporeal form (-1 damage).
2. I really want to try out the screamers, but more flamers might be a better choice.
3. Daemon prince with 2 malefic talons is a beast, but I'm worried that deepstriking a Daemon prince for the reroll 1 to hit and a possible charge is a waste of points.

Anyone has some suggestions or see something obvious I should change?

Dp has a PL of 11 so you need 2cp to ds him not 1, and no wings well.... mean is a sitting turkey. Honestly use a piece like the LOC costing 335pts like a distraction carnifex...no ty.

 blackmage wrote:

Dp has a PL of 11 so you need 2cp to ds him not 1, and no wings well.... mean is a sitting turkey. Honestly use a piece like the LOC costing 335pts like a distraction carnifex...no ty.

the LoC is a pretty durable model. A magnus the red trhat's always on a 3+ and -1 damage from big weapons. While it's abit suceptible to small arms fire, it's still a tough chicken. I think when your not going first... something is gonna die for sure x.x. That said i've switch to deep striking mine myself as the rest of the stuff i put down doesn't seems to get tabled turn 1.

mmimzie wrote:

 blackmage wrote:

Dp has a PL of 11 so you need 2cp to ds him not 1, and no wings well.... mean is a sitting turkey. Honestly use a piece like the LOC costing 335pts like a distraction carnifex...no ty.

the LoC is a pretty durable model. A magnus the red trhat's always on a 3+ and -1 damage from big weapons. While it's abit suceptible to small arms fire, it's still a tough chicken. I think when your not going first... something is gonna die for sure x.x. That said i've switch to deep striking mine myself as the rest of the stuff i put down doesn't seems to get tabled turn 1.

Except it doesn't have the amazing powers Magnus has access to and lacks Magnus' glorious damage output.

Any tips for Khorneys?
What useful/good with the new Dex?

Dp has a PL of 11 so you need 2cp to ds him not 1, and no wings well.... mean is a sitting turkey. Honestly use a piece like the LOC costing 335pts like a distraction carnifex...no ty.

In the new chaos daemon codex a Daemon Prince has power level 8, 9 with wings. am I missing something?
I don't think wings will be useful enough since the Daemon Prince will deepstrike, I would put wings on him if he were going to be deployed but 1 extra CP deepstrike cost for 4" more movement. naaah

the LoC is a pretty durable model. A magnus the red trhat's always on a 3+ and -1 damage from big weapons. While it's abit suceptible to small arms fire, it's still a tough chicken. I think when your not going first... something is gonna die for sure x.x. That said i've switch to deep striking mine myself as the rest of the stuff i put down doesn't seems to get tabled turn 1.

Yes, I agree that LoC isn't that bad people say it is. 3++ inv save, cheaper, +2 casting, 16 wounds. I also would love to have a Magnus the red but it has to wait until thousands sons codex is revealed.

What do you tournament players think about using the stratagem to deep strike the plague tree?

I can't find anything that says you cannot, but it seems like it shouldn't work. Fortifications can't move, and deep strike counts as moving right?

didn't notice demons DP has a PL of 8, btw you undersimate the big difference between fly and not.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ratius wrote:
Any tips for Khorneys?
What useful/good with the new Dex?

bloodletters, flesh hounds skull cannons and skarbrand now are pretty nice, 20+ letters with stendard+stratagem ds and roll 3d6 to charge, rerollable, near an herald and a Dp to re roll 1's hits like trucks.