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You'll be needing a Wolf Priest or two to get it all there. The problem with TWC and Wulfen at the moment is that they're priority targets, not too many people see them and think anything else is scarier.
Maybe it's just where I play but I've found TWC is a tad less than useful in 8th, 10' movement, maxing out at S8 and nothing really making many S8 attacks.
This combo you guys are playing with will be a high priority blob but damn it'll hit hard when it arrives.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
Bjørn with twin las
Arjac
5 grey hunters
5 wulfen w/ 3x TH/SS, 1xGFA
5 TWC, 3xdual wolf claws, 2x chainsword/SS 5 fenrisian wolves
5 long fangs w/ missile launchers
5 long fangs w/ missile launchers
Culexus assassin
Eversor assassin
1500 pts. Only 2 cp.
Plan is to get two more units of grey hunters, one unit with flamer and one unit with power sword and arm the TWC pack leader with TH/SS, exhanged for a thunderwolf dual claws, fenrisian wolves and eversor assassin (1499 pts, 8 cp).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/26 23:13:14
2018/05/27 01:25:15
Subject: Re:Owoo!! Space Wolf Tactica: 8th Edition.
So I built this 1k list off the Arjac plus wulfen idea. It's for a tourney but I would take it for fun not to win! Just to see people's face when I charge in with lots of extra attacks. The list has lots of s4 dakka but no real antitank. As opposed to my last list that had lots of plasma scouts and long fangs to support the wulfen outflank. My wulfen have traditionally eaten vehicles no problem. Plan is to start the bikes and thunderwolves on the board in cover best as I can. Then deepstrike arjac near the outflanking wulfen an deepstriking jumppack wolfguard.
TheunlikelyGamer wrote: So I built this 1k list off the Arjac plus wulfen idea. It's for a tourney but I would take it for fun not to win! Just to see people's face when I charge in with lots of extra attacks. The list has lots of s4 dakka but no real antitank. As opposed to my last list that had lots of plasma scouts and long fangs to support the wulfen outflank. My wulfen have traditionally eaten vehicles no problem. Plan is to start the bikes and thunderwolves on the board in cover best as I can. Then deepstrike arjac near the outflanking wulfen an deepstriking jumppack wolfguard.
I'll be testing it Monday. There are SS sprinkled about all over. I just want to see the wulfen and thunderwolves make combat. We will see Monday how I do. My brother plays chaos. I was going to test out my new deathwatch list but the wolves are my fav.
TheunlikelyGamer wrote: I'll be testing it Monday. There are SS sprinkled about all over. I just want to see the wulfen and thunderwolves make combat. We will see Monday how I do. My brother plays chaos. I was going to test out my new deathwatch list but the wolves are my fav.
You play Deathwatch and Space Wolves? Me too, can't wait to try allying them.
I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go.
2018/05/28 20:33:23
Subject: Re:Owoo!! Space Wolf Tactica: 8th Edition.
So i'm working on my Space Wolves army list. I have a few questions
HQ
Wolf Lord x2
T. Hammer & SS Is this the current auto choice for weapons, or are people doing something else?
I want to give them extra mobility. Jump Packs are a cheap option, or is a Wolf Mount just too good to pass up?
FAST
5 Skyclaws x3
Plasma Pistols (I can take 3 even without a Wolf Guard), or Plasma Guns? If I go Plasma Guns then I really need to take a Wolf Guard with Combi-Plasma.
The choice of Pistols or Guns really changes how I will use the unit. But the 'Claws 4+ BS is an argument in favor of the pistols.
If I go Pistols, should I try to cram a Power Weapon of some kind in there? If so, what one?
TROOPS
10 Grey Hunters x4
CCWs, Plasma Gun x2, Wolf Guard with Combi-Plasma
These will be doing their best to stay in Rapid Fire range. Should I give the unit a Power Weapon? If so then what one, and who should carry it?
Should I REALLY shoe horn in extra Plasma Pistols? I know the rules allow it, but it just seems so WAAC...
ELITES
10 Wolf Scouts
BP&CCW, P. Pistol & Power Weapon
What Power Weapon?
Lone Wolf x3
Bonesword & Storm Shield
Or am I better off with a T. Hammer?
Thanks for the input.
2018/05/28 21:58:29
Subject: Re:Owoo!! Space Wolf Tactica: 8th Edition.
phydaux wrote: So i'm working on my Space Wolves army list. I have a few questions
HQ
Wolf Lord x2
T. Hammer & SS Is this the current auto choice for weapons, or are people doing something else?
I want to give them extra mobility. Jump Packs are a cheap option, or is a Wolf Mount just too good to pass up?
FAST
5 Skyclaws x3
Plasma Pistols (I can take 3 even without a Wolf Guard), or Plasma Guns? If I go Plasma Guns then I really need to take a Wolf Guard with Combi-Plasma.
The choice of Pistols or Guns really changes how I will use the unit. But the 'Claws 4+ BS is an argument in favor of the pistols.
If I go Pistols, should I try to cram a Power Weapon of some kind in there? If so, what one?
TROOPS
10 Grey Hunters x4
CCWs, Plasma Gun x2, Wolf Guard with Combi-Plasma
These will be doing their best to stay in Rapid Fire range. Should I give the unit a Power Weapon? If so then what one, and who should carry it?
Should I REALLY shoe horn in extra Plasma Pistols? I know the rules allow it, but it just seems so WAAC...
ELITES
10 Wolf Scouts
BP&CCW, P. Pistol & Power Weapon
What Power Weapon?
Lone Wolf x3
Bonesword & Storm Shield
Or am I better off with a T. Hammer?
Thanks for the input.
If you’re going with a lord, use his 2+ WS by giving him a ranged weapon (re-rolling 1s). The SS is not that good since he has an in-build 4+ invul save. The battle leader is just as good in melee offensively, but cheaper, if you want to go SS. Thunderwolf is a good choice.
Skyclaws is in a tight spot, they’re frankly not that good on paper - especially with the new beta rules. I guess i would go with flamers due to poor WS, and plasma for the wolf guard. Wg and pack leader should have melee weapons of some kind, but it all depends on how you want to use them. If you synergize them with Lukas, then go all-out plasma. Lukas makes blood claws/skyclaws viable on paper, since you can overcharge without consequence and hit on a roll of 3+ (2+ for the wolf guard!).
Grey hunters. Personally i would divide them into two units of 5, to hold objectives and kill MSU/chaff. Gear is dependant on your meta.
Scouts. I would always include a WG here. If your meta includes big models, tanks etc i would go all melta. If not, all plasma. Basically use them like “on the hunt” hellblasters, but cheaper, less effecient and saving you a CP.
Lone Wolfs: both, if you’re going with three. But they’re too expensive for what they do.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/28 21:59:40
phydaux wrote: You seem to be saying that I should deemphasize assault and change my list across the board to be more shooty.
If I'm gonna do that then aren't I better off playing vanilla Marines?
No, no - just that IMO skyclaws, lone wolves and such arent the most effecient melee units in our arsenal. Skyclaws can be good combined with Lukas, but your regular skyclaw is only dealing S4 0ap dmg1 attacks, while being fragile. Lone wolves are very pricey, but tankey in my experience - not very damaging with only 3 A. They are obviously good against characters and monsters, and their 4+++ on last wound combined with a TH synergizes well with a wolf priest.
Scouts are poor melee units due to being fragile, arriving on T2, then having to make a 9” charge. They need to be shooty. If i recall correctly, there’s only around 30% chance to make a 9” charge.
In general though, for any assault oriented list, wulfen are absolutely essential. Not only because they are good on their own, but because of their aura. This could be combined with sky claws or blood claws (with fully kitted WG) and Lukas to be devastating. For WG/TWC, you’ve got Arjac. It is all about playing around synergies IMO, because we’re underpowered at the moment being one of the few armies without a codex.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/28 22:56:06
phydaux wrote: You seem to be saying that I should deemphasize assault and change my list across the board to be more shooty.
If I'm gonna do that then aren't I better off playing vanilla Marines?
No, no - just that IMO skyclaws, lone wolves and such arent the most effecient melee units in our arsenal. Skyclaws can be good combined with Lukas, but your regular skyclaw is only dealing S4 0ap dmg1 attacks, while being fragile. Lone wolves are very pricey, but tankey in my experience - not very damaging with only 3 A. They are obviously good against characters and monsters, and their 4+++ on last wound combined with a TH synergizes well with a wolf priest.
Scouts are poor melee units due to being fragile, arriving on T2, then having to make a 9” charge. They need to be shooty. If i recall correctly, there’s only around 30% chance to make a 9” charge.
In general though, for any assault oriented list, wulfen are absolutely essential. Not only because they are good on their own, but because of their aura. This could be combined with sky claws or blood claws (with fully kitted WG) and Lukas to be devastating. For WG/TWC, you’ve got Arjac. It is all about playing around synergies IMO, because we’re underpowered at the moment being one of the few armies without a codex.
how are wulfen best armed BTW? pure thunderhammer/SS a mix of weapons?
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
"It is all about playing around synergies IMO, because we’re underpowered at the moment being one of the few armies without a codex."
Yeah, I'm waiting rather IM-patiently for the new codex to roll around. Could be worst. I could play Sisters, right? sigh...
It just seem that to make room for a big blob of Wolfen and a named character then I'd have to pull a lot of other stuff out of the list. I really want the core of the army to be Grey Hunters backed up by.... Something.
If I drop the Storm Shields from my Lords & Lones and replace them with Plasma Pistols. Hmm... T. Hammers still for the Lords. How about the Lones, what melee weapon for them?
I was counting on the Skyclaws eating the Turn One shooting while my Hunters advanced to Rapid Fire range. Now I'm unsure how to get them there short of Rhinos For Everyone.
What if I took a couple of Dreads to act as Bullet Magnets? Dreads are Wolfy....
2018/05/29 00:18:39
Subject: Re:Owoo!! Space Wolf Tactica: 8th Edition.
right now with my space wolves I'm just building "rule of cool" and focusing on a nice looking army that I can pull units out to make a list. so far I have 3 squads of grey hunters with 10 people (1 combiplas and 2 plasma rifles) a 5 man devestator squad with 4 plasma cannons and a plasma rifle, some "bare bones" thunder wolf cavlary I have some unassmbled wulfen. a rhino a land raider crusader and a predator. Might buy another 2 rhinos so I can do the full mechanzied thing.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
2018/05/29 02:38:18
Subject: Re:Owoo!! Space Wolf Tactica: 8th Edition.
So I just finished playing a game against my brothers daemons. I used my 1000pt list from a few posts up with arjac and wulfen buffing wolf guard bikers/ jumppacks and thunder wolves. My brother brought a bloodthirster, Lord of change with impossible robe, 30 bloodletters, khorne herald, and squad of pink horrors. We played a maelstrom mission and At the end of turn 5 he tabled me but I had 7 VP to his 1. All he had left was 3 remaining wounds on his LOC and the pink horrors. Arjac and the wulfen buffed each other really well as well as the bikers shooting the blood letters to pieces. All the storm shields worked amazingly. My weakness was mortal wounds from smite. He super smited me every turn. He literally rolled an 11 or higher every time. Rolled 6 for super smite 3 of those times deleting two thunderwolves and several bikers before they could do anything in close combat. I feel my fix would have been to take a long fangs squad instead of the thunderwolves and shoot the big baddies making them waste their special rerolls for save and 2+ invul save in the shooting phase instead of the fight phase.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/29 02:39:04
phydaux wrote: You seem to be saying that I should deemphasize assault and change my list across the board to be more shooty.
If I'm gonna do that then aren't I better off playing vanilla Marines?
No, no - just that IMO skyclaws, lone wolves and such arent the most effecient melee units in our arsenal. Skyclaws can be good combined with Lukas, but your regular skyclaw is only dealing S4 0ap dmg1 attacks, while being fragile. Lone wolves are very pricey, but tankey in my experience - not very damaging with only 3 A. They are obviously good against characters and monsters, and their 4+++ on last wound combined with a TH synergizes well with a wolf priest.
Scouts are poor melee units due to being fragile, arriving on T2, then having to make a 9” charge. They need to be shooty. If i recall correctly, there’s only around 30% chance to make a 9” charge.
In general though, for any assault oriented list, wulfen are absolutely essential. Not only because they are good on their own, but because of their aura. This could be combined with sky claws or blood claws (with fully kitted WG) and Lukas to be devastating. For WG/TWC, you’ve got Arjac. It is all about playing around synergies IMO, because we’re underpowered at the moment being one of the few armies without a codex.
how are wulfen best armed BTW? pure thunderhammer/SS a mix of weapons?
At least 2TH/SS plus the leader who has fixed loadout. Then you may choose as you want, all the three melee weapons are good. I prefer using wulfen as anti tank so leader, 2 TH/SS and 2 axes or even leader plus 4 TH/SS.
TheunlikelyGamer wrote: So I just finished playing a game against my brothers daemons. I used my 1000pt list from a few posts up with arjac and wulfen buffing wolf guard bikers/ jumppacks and thunder wolves. My brother brought a bloodthirster, Lord of change with impossible robe, 30 bloodletters, khorne herald, and squad of pink horrors. We played a maelstrom mission and At the end of turn 5 he tabled me but I had 7 VP to his 1. All he had left was 3 remaining wounds on his LOC and the pink horrors. Arjac and the wulfen buffed each other really well as well as the bikers shooting the blood letters to pieces. All the storm shields worked amazingly. My weakness was mortal wounds from smite. He super smited me every turn. He literally rolled an 11 or higher every time. Rolled 6 for super smite 3 of those times deleting two thunderwolves and several bikers before they could do anything in close combat. I feel my fix would have been to take a long fangs squad instead of the thunderwolves and shoot the big baddies making them waste their special rerolls for save and 2+ invul save in the shooting phase instead of the fight phase.
Wow, incredible luck on those smite rolls! I also play daemons often, which is why i always bring a culexus (got demolished by a tzeench list in my very first 8ed game, and ordered a culexus straight away )
phydaux wrote: "It is all about playing around synergies IMO, because we’re underpowered at the moment being one of the few armies without a codex."
Yeah, I'm waiting rather IM-patiently for the new codex to roll around. Could be worst. I could play Sisters, right? sigh...
It just seem that to make room for a big blob of Wolfen and a named character then I'd have to pull a lot of other stuff out of the list. I really want the core of the army to be Grey Hunters backed up by.... Something.
If I drop the Storm Shields from my Lords & Lones and replace them with Plasma Pistols. Hmm... T. Hammers still for the Lords. How about the Lones, what melee weapon for them?
I was counting on the Skyclaws eating the Turn One shooting while my Hunters advanced to Rapid Fire range. Now I'm unsure how to get them there short of Rhinos For Everyone.
What if I took a couple of Dreads to act as Bullet Magnets? Dreads are Wolfy....
I really dont see the benefits of going more troops than is neccesary for a battalion, but i guess it depends on meta too. Maybe a horde type list could work.
Your lone wolves should have a SS, and i would go TH on them, since they should target characters and monsters. I would support them with a wolf priest, to heal them once they get back up. Potentially very frustrating for your opponent (and fun for you!), but an expensive strategy that wulfen does cheaper.
I dont think your grey hunters would be target priorities, so i think you could foot-slog them.
Shield dreads are great, its on my painting schedule
"I really dont see the benefits of going more troops than is neccesary for a battalion"
It's the old adage of Boys Before Toys.
Plus, Grey Hunters are best Troops choice out there. No other MEQ unit can rock two Plasma Guns, a Combi Plasma, two Power Weapons, a couple of Plasma Pistols, a bunch of Bolters, and everyone has a Chainsword and some kind of pistol.
That's an awesome mix of short range firepower and assault power. Grey Hunters do yeoman's work in a Space Wolf's army.
I've dropped the Lone Wolves in favor of two Wolf Priests with Jump Packs, and the Wolf Lord is going to foot slog along with the Hunters with T. Hammer & P. Pistol. The Sky Claws get Plasma Pistols, and I've added some Long Fangs.
So the wulfen aura and the charge V bonus attack. How does that work? I've been figuring if you charged while in range of the aura, you don't get the bonus attack. Or is it only if you had to re-roll the charge?
gwarsh41 wrote: So the wulfen aura and the charge V bonus attack. How does that work? I've been figuring if you charged while in range of the aura, you don't get the bonus attack. Or is it only if you had to re-roll the charge?
If you were in range of the aura in the charge phase while not in combat, then you dont get the aura in the charge phase.
gwarsh41 wrote: So the wulfen aura and the charge V bonus attack. How does that work? I've been figuring if you charged while in range of the aura, you don't get the bonus attack. Or is it only if you had to re-roll the charge?
If you were in range of the aura in the charge phase while not in combat, then you dont get the aura in the charge phase.
There’s a reading of it whereby the simple fact of being within range in the charge phase makes it not happen in the fight phase, regardless of all other factors. It’s a badly written rule and I’d hope the Codex makes it work a lot smoother.
gwarsh41 wrote: So the wulfen aura and the charge V bonus attack. How does that work? I've been figuring if you charged while in range of the aura, you don't get the bonus attack. Or is it only if you had to re-roll the charge?
If you were in range of the aura in the charge phase while not in combat, then you dont get the aura in the charge phase.
There’s a reading of it whereby the simple fact of being within range in the charge phase makes it not happen in the fight phase, regardless of all other factors. It’s a badly written rule and I’d hope the Codex makes it work a lot smoother.
That is how it reads in the index, but the index errata changed it to only affect units that made a charge. So all eligible units that didnt make a charge within 6” of wulfen in the charge phase gets the extra attack in the combat phase if within 6”. Since we have a movement phase before it, it isnt too hard to pull of - just move them forward so that they end up 6” apart, unless you’d rather want to reroll charge distance (i usually do this if the charge distance is above 7)
Automatically Appended Next Post: Two games today:
Lost massively to khorne/nurgle due to lucky/unlucky rolls. By the end of his T2, i had lost half my army.. 10 wounds from smite. Unlucky on my part.
Won against ultramarines due to VPs. He fielded Guilliman, 3 centurions and a relic leviathan as the central pieces. Had almost nothing left in the end, but i managed to kill Big G. Wulfen did really well. Long fangs died before doing anything. Bjørn killed the centurions before dying.
All in all, i think Bjørn is very fragile for a guy who is the oldest soldier in the imperium.. need a 5+ invul on him, atleast. At no point did i get the combo off, as the TWC died in T 1 or 2 (i got last turn both games).
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/06/01 20:59:25
phydaux wrote: "At no point did i get the combo off, as the TWC died in T 1 or 2 (i got last turn both games)."
Play on tables with more terrain. It's the only way to deal with the gunline.
We had 16 ruins/buildings on the board, but it is very hard hiding 5 TWC with the huge bases they’re on :( The nurgle/khorne player had barely any shooting, but got lucky with smite rolls (super smite). I also failed 5x9” charge rolls in a single turn against ultramarines, including one on 3d6 and CP re-roll
)
