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2017/09/09 14:36:06
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Are there any reviews out that aren't miniwargaming because it's becoming increasingly difficult to not scream at them for being absolute morons who feel the need to spend a solid two minutes discussing useless and important aspects of units.
Wouldn't be so bad if I could just mute them but they don't show they important bits of the new units in screen because they are probably aware we'd all do that and what to make us suffer through their inane annoying and frankly useless hypotheticals.
Oh god one them literally was arguing rolling 7 or more on a 2d6 was 50% exactly.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/09/09 14:48:16
2017/09/09 14:42:49
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
SilverAlien wrote: Are there any reviews out that aren't miniwargaming because it's becoming increasingly difficult to not scream at them for being absolute morons who feel the need to spend a solid two minutes discussing useless and important aspects of units.
Wouldn't be so bad if I could just mute them but they don't show they important bits of the new units in screen because they are probably aware we'd all do that and what to make us suffer through their inane annoying and frankly useless hypotheticals.
Oh god one them literally was arguing rolling 7 or more on a 2d6 was 50% exactly.
I know. The arguing about the Tallyman and the 2d6 roll being "so unlikely" was the most annoying. I felt like screaming "The average roll of 2d6 is 7!"
2017/09/09 15:00:04
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
what I mean is it fits the profile aesthetically ... from the early rogue trade models to current aesthetics with the nurglins and artwork for great unclean ones ... I imagine they wanna re-vision the BoN this way
this is how it looked back then
2017/09/09 15:00:34
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
So after this, I think Death Guard has more unique kits than the Primaris Have for now... Obviously, Primaris are gonna receive more kits the next year, but probably this is one of the biggest releases in GW history of a new faction, no?
Compared with Death Guard, Thousand Sons received... just crumbs
Thousand Sons: Tzaangors, Rubric Marines, Scarab Ocult Terminators, Magnus, Exalted Sorcerrers, Ahriman (6 kits)
Death Guard: 2 kits for Terminators, Plague Marines, PoxWalkers, 9 characters ( The 3 DI ones, Mortarion, Typhus, Tallyman, the dude with the poison bottles, the Aphotecary, and the one with the plague-mask), Bloat-Drones, The Tank, and the ground Bloat-drone. ( 16 kits)
If that image is the new beast of nurgle, I think it looks very... humanoid, and not so... beast-y.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/09/09 15:22:21
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.
2017/09/09 15:00:41
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Mymearan wrote: Why would those top ones be Beasts of Nurgle?
Fits the classic description/model; slug-like with head tentacles and leaves a slime trail. Also note the joyous expression that BoN are noted for having.
"The Omnissiah is my Moderati"
2017/09/09 15:13:51
Subject: Re:Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Plagueburst Crawlers seem really strong. If I understood everything correctly they are just 162 points for a T8 12W 3+/5++/5+++ tank weapons included. And he can have 2 entropy cannons which are basicly Darklances. I like it
2017/09/09 15:16:24
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Motarion has really good things going for him.
He seems to destroy hordes, killing about 30 horde units a turn not counting morale.
Also he can kill big stuff even easier than magnus.
AND he pulses mortal wounds every turn.
AND he removes toughness.
Bastard has 5 weapons to choose from:
Pistol with "beam"(can hit mutiple units) 1, S8, -3, 3
Grenade 2D6, S5, -1, 1
Nurglings like always D6, S2, 0, 1,
Silence has 2 modes:
anti big stuff: S user x2, -4, D6 anti horde 3x for every attack, S user, -2, 1
Re-roll 1s to hit for deathguard(like magnus but no fail save re-roll)
Psychic: knows 3 contagion, deny 3, casts 2. Can't take warp time :(
Mathammer wise he is a bit worse than Magnus on paper due to not casting warptime. His damage is better though and he can take on hordes as well as big dudes so he is waaaay more versatile.. Also the -1T aura and the pulsating 3 mortal wounds are hard to judge.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/09 15:16:32
Plague Surgeon has an aura that gives infantry units within 3 inches a reroll on a 1 for their DR save. And they are elite choice and quite cheap too.
And for those who were worried Mortarion might be singled out and gunned down by heavy weapons. Deathshroud Terminators have 4++ save, DR, 2 wounds, and they can take wounds for any character near to them. So, yeah, all those lascannon shots directed at Mortarion can be rediracted at the Deathshroud terminators first!
Blightlord Terminators are T5, DR, 2W terminators that kind take the regular combi weapons stuff as well as the plague marine weapons like blight launchers and such and they are only a few points more expensive than regular CSM termninators.
The bloat drone with fleshmower sounds so fun to use! It adds 6 attacks to the Bloat drones attacks ... 6 !!! And its str user+2, so that's str 8 attacks on an uninjured bloat drone. This fleshmower will literally mow down stuff. lol Bloat drone has 3 attacks base, so at full health, it will do 9 Str 8 attacks. lol
The blight Hauler is a really interesting unit too. fast attack choice, moves 10 inches. 8 wounds, does not degrade, has 5++ as well as DR, packs 3 ranged weapons and 1 melee. And it gives a special aura that is 7 inches radius. Infantry units wholly within its aura get cover save! So, your 5 man plague marine unit close to the Blight Hauler is now a 2+ armor save as it trudges up the board. Nice! Its really cheap too. Under 100 points base. @@
The Plague burst crawler is really cheap too (its only slightly over 100 points base!) and quite hitty! Firstly, its really resilient, becuase it has T8, 3+ save and DR and 12 wounds. And it has a fair amount of heavy weaponery. You can swop the side sponstones into basically the equivalent of 36 inch range lascannons. And the Plague burst mortar is the heavy duty weapon. It does d6 hits, Str 8, AP -2. d3 damage at range 12 to 48 inches and you don't need line of sight to fire it! lol. With this, a gun line deathguard army is a distinct possibility.
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2017/09/09 15:52:41
2017/09/09 15:39:42
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
SilverAlien wrote: Are there any reviews out that aren't miniwargaming because it's becoming increasingly difficult to not scream at them for being absolute morons who feel the need to spend a solid two minutes discussing useless and important aspects of units.
Wouldn't be so bad if I could just mute them but they don't show they important bits of the new units in screen because they are probably aware we'd all do that and what to make us suffer through their inane annoying and frankly useless hypotheticals.
Oh god one them literally was arguing rolling 7 or more on a 2d6 was 50% exactly.
I know. The arguing about the Tallyman and the 2d6 roll being "so unlikely" was the most annoying. I felt like screaming "The average roll of 2d6 is 7!"
Indeed every 6th time you will roll a 7. Not bad for getting back command points. Maybe you can take multiple Tallymen. Take 3 and you get the points of half your stratagems back (on average).
This range looks really great and with its own charme. Much better than the DIDG.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/09 15:41:08
2017/09/09 15:57:26
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
I don't think it works with multiple Tallymen. The hability triggers is theres at least one, so it means that they can be 1, 3, or 10, only triggers once.
Plus, I declare myself fan of this Nurgling with a helmet!
Spoiler:
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/09/09 16:00:22
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.
2017/09/09 15:58:36
Subject: Re:Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Horus Luperkermit wrote: I took some notes in the Miniwargaming Vid about Mortarion. (...) Lastly he is the Primarch of the DG rerolling Hitroles of 1 for all DG units including himself in 7" and if he dies he explodes on a 4+ dealing D3 Mortal wounds in 7" around him to all Non-Deathguard Units. The rest is as we know it. Please correct me if I heard something wrong
Wait what.. that's huge!
Means he does get another aura and it's the one we've all been hoping he'd have.
Wow that changes everything I guess!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/09 16:03:15
2017/09/09 16:02:39
Subject: Re:Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
I'm not sure how I feel about the new beasts of nurgle. We'll have to see how they pan out as miniatures. I could imagine them looking too goofy, even for Nurgle. Also, there seems to be a lot of overlap with Great Unclean Ones, which is lazy. But the miniatures make or break a concept, so I look forward to seeing this resolved. Also, I too am really scratching my head at this point over just what that Ultralisk-looking thing in that picture is now. Maybe a new Nurgle Daemon to be released? If so this was leaked WAY ahead of schedule. I don't want new daemons, I want them to make plastic kits for the old ones...
2017/09/09 16:13:36
Subject: Re:Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.
2017/09/09 16:21:32
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Would the tallyman CP ability stack or is it worded in such a way to prevent it? I refuse to open that video again
anyways, my thoughts:
Spoiler:
The bright crawler looks fairly good at first glance. It's really tough for cost and seems to have a lot of dakka. If all it's weapons are plague weapons I'd be even happier, as the str 8 might struggle a bit vs T 8 compared to str 9 lascannons, but that's not a huge deal. I think it'll do well given, enough it might actually screw over some alpha strike lists who rely on thinning out anti tank weapons turn 1.
What really struck me as impressive were the new blight haulers. Being able to keep nearby infantry in cover while having a lot of anti tank dakka is nice. They pair well with PM, who don't have the ork problem of trying to fit big squads entirely in the radius, not with msu being the smart choice. They are good enough I don't think I'll feel the loss of havocs as heavily as I imagined.
I'm excited for blight lord terminators, though I want a better description of their kit and loadout, whether the blight launchers are limited choices or can be taken across the squad, etc. Their price looks solid compared to normal csm terminators for the various defensive boosts. Again, a much better deal than what plague marines get.
The blight drones continue to look alright, the melee version is I think the most promising, though all could be useful. I do think the heavy blight launcher variant might struggle compared to the blight haulers though.
Our new characters are a mixed bag. The good is the tallyman, offering us both the dark apostle melee utility as well as a weaker version of the ultramarine warlord trait that everyone loved. Given it's 1/6 instead of 1/3 it's without a doubt still worth including at least one. If it stacks or you are running a melee based army probably a few more.
The biologis and foulspawn are both... alright. Being able to disrupt charges a little helps a defensive DG army, while the grenade boost could be useful in very specific situations (the stratagem). I just don't see either really doing enough work to justify their inclusions.
The apothecary is probably the biggest disappointment of the codex but I may have just expected too much from him. Going from a 33% chance to block a wound to a 38% chance just isn't very significant and the short range also hurts as you'll have to spam them. The fact it only works with infantry makes it even more mediocre, doesn't boost the demon engine DR. The helm might help one be useable, but honestly this unit (and the two above) are all going to need to pull their weight in combat to be worth their cost, they aren't particularly impressive force multipliers. Which disappoints me.
As for the other disappointing choices, deathshroud look just awful. So expensive, practically useless out of deepstrike, these are really just for dropping in in front of morty to shield him for a turn, or maybe loading into a LR with your HQ of choice.
Poxwalkers didn't go down in price, which shocked me. They can gain synergy bonuses cultists can't but I already mentioned the apothecary being kinda meh and typhus is fairly expensive for baby sitting what is a chaff unit. Honestly, I'd rather take plague bearers for screening if I can spare a detachment. It helps that DGHQs don't seem to benefit from the CT much at all, and I don't think there is anything else they lose by being part of a mixed detachment so long as the main detachment is DG, so they can be added without much issue or even needing specific demonic HQs.
So my favorites of the codex are likely either the blight haulers or blight lord terminators, my most disappointing is deathshroud and the apothecary.
2017/09/09 16:28:12
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
Seriously, I think bloat drones with these fleshmowers will be the best thing to accompany Mortarion up the field. A bunch of these plus mortarion are going to be doing a filthy amount of CC damage and ALL of them blow up on a 4+ when they die (Mortarion too lol).
Automatically Appended Next Post: @Silveralien, I think the apothecary is ok. Its quite cheap, and giving a reroll 1 to DR saves isn't bad. Over time, this might add up to quite a few wounds saved on infantry close to it. So, if your plague marine squad is near to a plague surgeon as well as a Blight hauler will now have a 2+ armor save as well as reroll 1s on its DR. Said plague marine squad is now gonna be really tough!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/09/09 16:32:47
2017/09/09 16:33:05
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
I'm just loving this release. My wallet isn't. Normally I don't jump to the "new faction" crow because I need variety in an army to enjoy collecting it, thats why I didn't bought Kharadron Overlords or Thousand Sons... but with Deathguard? Oh my god. THIS is how you release a new faction!
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.
2017/09/09 16:36:16
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
First, a 5 man unit of BlightLord terminators all with Flails of Corruption, DG Termie Lord and a DG Termie Sorcerer.
Second, any CSM Termie Sorcerer.
Turn 1: Drop these guys in, Warptime the BlightLords, throw on Blades of Putrification and Prescience if you're feeling spicy. Charge in and throw down VotLW. Now you have a tasty 11d3 attacks, hitting on 2s, re-rolling 1s to hit, S6 with +1 to wound, AP-2 going to AP-3 on a 6 and doing mortal wounds on a 5+. That's an average of 7 mortal wounds on top of any regular damage done.
(Wanna go extra cheaky? Throw Skarbrand in for another 5d3 attacks! Do we have any other ways of getting more attacks with these guys?)
Ghorros wrote: The moral of the story: Don't park your Imperial Knight in a field of Gretchin carrying power tools.
Marmatag wrote: All the while, my opponent is furious, throwing his codex on the floor, trying to slash his wrists with safety scissors.
2017/09/09 16:39:44
Subject: Death Guard + Nurgle Daemons [News: First reviews p.60 onwards / Preorder September 9th]
I know everyone's clamouring for the rules, but I wanna see the models.
Look who is playing right into GW's Model Company First philosophy
I agree though, if a model has bad rules, I might still play it, but if good rules have a bad model, there is next to no chance it will see play from me.
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.