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Would be hilarious if this was as worded... Imagine dying during combat phase, triggering the shooting attack, shooting a sonic blaster into a blob, killing a model, shooting again, wash rinse repeat... Also include the DttFE... Imagine a single dying noise marine deleting an entire blob of guardsmen!

 MinscS2 wrote:


Emperor's Children Stratagem:
Activates in the combat phase. Each time a model of this squads kills an enemy model, he can immediately make another attack with the same weapon on the same enemy unit.

.

 Azreal13 wrote:
You only need to read ADB's Night Lords books to see examples where CSM are worshipping in deed, but not in thought. It's quite possible to attract the attention of a god without courting it.

Yea there's a bunch of inner monologues from Talos about a particularly insane chainaxe wielding member of his small squad who sits there ranting similarly to Kharne as they drop pod to a planets surface to murder a bunch of scrubs. He expresses his disgust for the guy slowly being drawn to Khorne despite him being a basic unmarked squad member.

So i dont know if anyone already did this but i took my phone camera and zoomed in on the picture in the white dwarf.

Black Legion: +1 to morale and when a unit with this advances all of their rapid fire guns become assault. the Example they give is rapid fire 2 -> assault 2
World Eaters: hard to read but i think it is "if a unit with this charges you can make an aditional melee attack"
Word Bearers: also hard to read but i think its "A Unit with this can reroll morale checks"
Alpha Legion: We joked about it but they did it. -1 to hit at 12" or more. Raven Guard copy paste
Night Lords: -1 leadership (for enemies) for every unit with this in 6" range
Renegades: They can advance and charge

Also theres a new special rule but i cant quite make it out. could be objective secured aswell but im not sure

Imgur-album with (of course) horrible quality and german language: http://imgur.com/a/eBLDn

Bonk_EU wrote:


Black Legion: +1 to morale and when a unit with this advances all of their rapid fire guns become assault. the Example they give is rapid fire 2 -> assault 2

that's GOT to be an error. if it isn't... well hooooly crap

So in a weird reflection of the fluff Alpha Legion might as well play from the loyalist codex as the chaos one since we're getting the same bonus.

I need to step away from here until the preview article. Seeing that turd of a Word Bearer Legion Trait among the other far superior options is really annoying me.

 Eldarain wrote:
I need to step away from here until the preview article. Seeing that turd of a Word Bearer Legion Trait among the other far superior options is really annoying me.

well I suppose once way to look at it would be if a space marine chapter has "Death to the false emperor" as their chapter tactics, granting an additional attack on a roll of 6+ (which would be under whelming yeah)

BrianDavion wrote:

Bonk_EU wrote:


Black Legion: +1 to morale and when a unit with this advances all of their rapid fire guns become assault. the Example they give is rapid fire 2 -> assault 2

that's GOT to be an error. if it isn't... well hooooly crap

you think? its basicly just letting them shoot after advance but is worded in this way so that you cant advance into rapid fire range and use it (since rapid fire 1 would be assault 1 even withing 12")

I need to step away from here until the preview article. Seeing that turd of a Word Bearer Legion Trait among the other far superior options is really annoying me.

but wouldnt culist hordes profit from having ATSNF?

 ScarletRose wrote:
So in a weird reflection of the fluff Alpha Legion might as well play from the loyalist codex as the chaos one since we're getting the same bonus.

To be fair that's been true of most Chaos Legions for the about 7+ years now.

I think the new Legion traits are fantastic. GW are finally giving Chaos Marine Players what they have been asking for. A similar treatment to that of the loyal marines. We are even getting codexes for two of our "big" legions (1000 Sons and Death Guard). It is right proper, and it is good news, and about time. Now we just need a few new model set.

I think it is a shame that so many use this as an opportunity to complain.

May Nurgle bless you for your efforts....

Jack Spratt wrote:
GW are finally giving Chaos Marine Players what they have been asking for

I don't remember there being plastic Havocs, Oblits or new Bikes in this release?

And have Chaos players been asking for a single special rule that defines their whole army?

I'm sure World Eater and Emperor's Children armies would love something akin to the Thousand Sons and upcoming Death Guard books. Personally I believe we'll get those eventually, but for the moment this Codex seems to be a slightly bigger stop-gap than the Index books.

Jack Spratt wrote:
I think it is a shame that so many use this as an opportunity to complain.

Consider the near decade that Chaos spent in the wilderness. Chaos players have every right to be worried. Their Codex is going to be one of the first again, which means if it's another wash we're stuck with it. Tyranid players often have this feeling.

During the 24 live stream Jeremy Vetock let slip that he had seen Slaanesh stuff in the studio. This segment is mysteriously missing from the facebook archive.
I feel pretty certain that we will see emperors children next year and probably world eaters in 2019. GW seems determined to push 40k chaos as hard as they have been pushing Aos chaos.

Im just hoping that the relics and strategems can make up for the seemingly lackluster "Chapter Tactics" Personally I believe that the big 4 legions will eventually have their own dexes, released beside their primarch. So we'll see mortarian with the Death guard dex, then thousand sons, Fulgrim then Angron. I wouldn't be surprised to see the loyalist dexes mirror this, with the Lion and Russ on the way. Sorry Blood angels.

Chikout wrote:
During the 24 live stream Jeremy Vetock let slip that he had seen Slaanesh stuff in the studio. This segment is mysteriously missing from the facebook archive.
I feel pretty certain that we will see emperors children next year and probably world eaters in 2019. GW seems determined to push 40k chaos as hard as they have been pushing Aos chaos.

Well the new Greater Demon is already done

Bonk_EU wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I need to step away from here until the preview article. Seeing that turd of a Word Bearer Legion Trait among the other far superior options is really annoying me.

but wouldnt culist hordes profit from having ATSNF?

Yes, but not very much. Same with CSM horde units.

The problem though is that it will typically only save one or two models from those horde units - which really isn't much - and has the potentially to actually cause you to lose more models.

If 8th's Morale was like 7th and other previous editions where it was 'you either fail or pass' it'd be way better, as you'd re-roll every time you fail without question. Unfortunately with 8th's system re-rolling anything other than a 6 poses the risk of losing more models, which makes re-rolling a 3 or 4 a risk and making re-rolling a 2 a terrible decision. At least it's (hopefully) a choice - if it was forced than it would be even worse because of that.

If it was more reliable like '2D6 use the lowest' it'd be way better if still weak, because at least then it wouldn't have a chance to backfire.

Thebiggesthat wrote:

Chikout wrote:
During the 24 live stream Jeremy Vetock let slip that he had seen Slaanesh stuff in the studio. This segment is mysteriously missing from the facebook archive.
I feel pretty certain that we will see emperors children next year and probably world eaters in 2019. GW seems determined to push 40k chaos as hard as they have been pushing Aos chaos.

Well the new Greater Demon is already done

Keeper of Secrets?

I'm the one who decipher the french leak one B&C.

Just fyi i made it with a better screen and could translate the 3 new Dark Hereticus power.

One power i coudnt decipher, maybe adding strenght to a unit.

One power to cancel Invulnerable save

One power to target a unit, roll D6, if the result is > Target thougness she take 1D3+3 mortal wound.
If the target is a character and is killed, he's transformed into a Chaos spawn (dunno if we have to take the point in army list like for the Tzeencht staff).

Take it with salt, the quality of those images are pur garbage.

 dan2026 wrote:

Thebiggesthat wrote:

Chikout wrote:
During the 24 live stream Jeremy Vetock let slip that he had seen Slaanesh stuff in the studio. This segment is mysteriously missing from the facebook archive.
I feel pretty certain that we will see emperors children next year and probably world eaters in 2019. GW seems determined to push 40k chaos as hard as they have been pushing Aos chaos.

Well the new Greater Demon is already done

Keeper of Secrets?

Yaarp. Although I still maintain the old 2nd Ed model was the pinnacle

So we won't see a return of the bull head KoS? :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Thanks, DreamIsCollapsing and Bonk_EU

Alpha Legion are pretty much Raven Guard now. Is is kind of ok because I was always torn between wanting to play both stealth armies. Now they're the same army, maybe I'll play RG too with my AL army now. Funny thing is AL would play better if they had scouts as troops instead of CSM or cultists. Kind of lends weight to the idea that RG are completely infiltrated by AL though :-D

As for the WB's I think ATSKNF isn't something to sneeze at. SM's get that in place of DTTFE on their sheet, getting both for free is pretty good. It's much safer with a re-roll to take larger CSM squads and to take blob cultists. It's a shame morale works the way it does though, GW missed a trick by keeping fall back morale and not adding battleshock as a special mechanic for certain units. But it is what it is. A re-roll is better than no re-roll. It might work out worse that's always a possibility but you ahve the option at least to re-roll, and without the cost of a CP. This edition is about re-rolling dice, it's how you leverage statistics and averages and offset the extreme end of bad luck. Anything that gives you free re-rolls is strong in 8th ed. My question is does this re-roll apply to Daemons summoned by WB's? Keyword interactions would be interesting here. If ATSKNF were to apply to Daemons in WB's armies wouldn't this make the tactic very very strong? Daemons die easily with weak armour saves, and they often benefit you by taking them in large squads. If this isn't the case due to the lack of Heretic Astartes rules then I'd urge all WB players to hound GW with requests to extend the rule to Daemons summoned by WB characters.

The BL thing is funny, because if it's worded as rapid fire weapons becoming assault weapons then those bolters and plasma guns are being reduced to a single shot only with a profile of Assault 1 24". It'd have to say something like "Rapid Fire weapons *count as* Assault for purposes of determining if a model can advance and fire." Then they'd retain the double shots at 12".

Thebiggesthat wrote:

 dan2026 wrote:

Thebiggesthat wrote:

Chikout wrote:
During the 24 live stream Jeremy Vetock let slip that he had seen Slaanesh stuff in the studio. This segment is mysteriously missing from the facebook archive.
I feel pretty certain that we will see emperors children next year and probably world eaters in 2019. GW seems determined to push 40k chaos as hard as they have been pushing Aos chaos.

Well the new Greater Demon is already done

Keeper of Secrets?

Yaarp. Although I still maintain the old 2nd Ed model was the pinnacle

Personally I think that the Forgeworld Keeper captured the androgynously beautiful and the monstrous quite well.
But I am interested to see what GW has come up with for theirs.
Hopefully it has a few alternate heads.

But before that I hope we are getting a new Great Unclean One/ Ku'gath.
Come on GW don't let me down.

Daemons don't have the Legion keyword and can't be Word Bearers, so they can't ever benefit from the trait.

Jack Spratt wrote:
I think the new Legion traits are fantastic. GW are finally giving Chaos Marine Players what they have been asking for. A similar treatment to that of the loyal marines. We are even getting codexes for two of our "big" legions (1000 Sons and Death Guard). It is right proper, and it is good news, and about time. Now we just need a few new model set.

I think it is a shame that so many use this as an opportunity to complain.

May Nurgle bless you for your efforts....

Pretty sure no one has been asking it for be this horrible.

Aplha is the exact same as ravenguard. Boring as
Iron Warriors same as imperial fists, see above
Word Bearers, gain the traint every freaking marine has. Wow.

Yup this is what people wanted, look at all that flavor and originality!

We haven't seen the other stratagems so far.
Reading the comments I think GW can only lose. If we get other Legion traits people say: "Mimimi, SM got better than us!" If we get the same people are like: "B-b-b-but that's boring! It's the same!"

CSM are a different army. What we share with loyalist marines are tactical squads, raptors, bikes, Havocs, rhinos, Land Raiders, Vindicators, Predators, Dreads and Terminators. Our Terminators have a very different load out though. I'd be surprised if you'd ever encounter two players, one plays Raven Guard, the other Alpha Legion, one has 3 squads of tactical marines, a captain, a librarian, 1 Predator, 2 squads of devastators and a squad of Jump pack marines. The other has a Lord, a sorcerer, 3 squads of CSM, 1pred, 2 Havocs, 1Raptors.
Even if that was ever the case (it won't, as you'll see Centurions, Primaris stuff, Land speeders or what have you) these two armies would still have different warlord traits, psykic disciplines, equipment and stratagems aside from the 4 we know they share. Yes, you could call it bland that they share a Legion rule, but even if that situation happened... wouldn't that be fluffy as hell for an Alpha Legion army? People overreact to the similarities of these traits, ignoring whatelse there is in the SM and CSM codex in actual units to differentiate the two. We have neither a Stormraven nor Guilliman, so don't be afraid to meet an SM army that looks like your CSM army .

str00dles1 wrote:

Jack Spratt wrote:
I think the new Legion traits are fantastic. GW are finally giving Chaos Marine Players what they have been asking for. A similar treatment to that of the loyal marines. We are even getting codexes for two of our "big" legions (1000 Sons and Death Guard). It is right proper, and it is good news, and about time. Now we just need a few new model set.

I think it is a shame that so many use this as an opportunity to complain.

May Nurgle bless you for your efforts....

Pretty sure no one has been asking it for be this horrible.

Aplha is the exact same as ravenguard. Boring as
Iron Warriors same as imperial fists, see above
Word Bearers, gain the traint every freaking marine has. Wow.

Yup this is what people wanted, look at all that flavor and originality!

If you look at the collected amount of rules in 40K, It find it very hard to accuse GW of not being original. If you just look at Chaos Space Marine I still find it hard. We are talking about hundreds of rules. It just makes no sense. Why is it a problem for a Ravenguard player, that an Alpha player has similar rules? Same for IW and IF. Both rules are useful. Enjoy them and find cool ways to use them instead.Be positive.
On top of that GW have introduced Strategems and Legion/Chapter specific artefact to further define the different forces. What more can you want?

What will be next? Are you going to be angry that several units in the game have a BS of 3+...? Or that a chainsword used by all marines are the same...?
You do not have a case.

Haters will hate.

The new edition of 40 K i looking fantastic. In my opinion it is shaping up to be the best edition yet.

Reading the comments I think GW can only lose.

Welcome to Dakka. There is no point in positive comment, as it's just stomped on by the backslapping crew

Jack Spratt wrote:
Haters will hate.

Dismissing criticism as 'hate' will get you no where.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Jack Spratt wrote:
Haters will hate.

Dismissing criticism as 'hate' will get you no where.

Oh come on, it'll get him somewhere.

Just not the place he wanted to be dragged into and soundly beaten!

Jack Spratt wrote:

str00dles1 wrote:

Jack Spratt wrote:
I think the new Legion traits are fantastic. GW are finally giving Chaos Marine Players what they have been asking for. A similar treatment to that of the loyal marines. We are even getting codexes for two of our "big" legions (1000 Sons and Death Guard). It is right proper, and it is good news, and about time. Now we just need a few new model set.

I think it is a shame that so many use this as an opportunity to complain.

May Nurgle bless you for your efforts....

Pretty sure no one has been asking it for be this horrible.

Aplha is the exact same as ravenguard. Boring as
Iron Warriors same as imperial fists, see above
Word Bearers, gain the traint every freaking marine has. Wow.

Yup this is what people wanted, look at all that flavor and originality!

If you look at the collected amount of rules in 40K, It find it very hard to accuse GW of not being original. If you just look at Chaos Space Marine I still find it hard. We are talking about hundreds of rules. It just makes no sense. Why is it a problem for a Ravenguard player, that an Alpha player has similar rules? Same for IW and IF. Both rules are useful. Enjoy them and find cool ways to use them instead.Be positive.
On top of that GW have introduced Strategems and Legion/Chapter specific artefact to further define the different forces. What more can you want?

What will be next? Are you going to be angry that several units in the game have a BS of 3+...? Or that a chainsword used by all marines are the same...?
You do not have a case.

Haters will hate.

The new edition of 40 K i looking fantastic. In my opinion it is shaping up to be the best edition yet.

Im not saying the rules are not useful. Every legion has special abilities in the heresy rules they could have super easily converted to 40k to make them more fluff based and flavorful. In its place we get laziness. A chainsword is the same because its a weapon, and marines are the same stats they have always been. Legions, how they operate and fight are all very different. That was the entire point of the emp creating them. This shows GW doesn't understand their own fluff/just being lazy.

I never said I hate the game. It is criticism, big difference.

Glitter covered crap is still crap.

My wishful legion tactics would have been:

IW:
Roll an additional d6/d3 when determining the damage value of a weapon and the effects of mutilators/obliterators and keep the highest.

NL:
Enemy units within 6" roll their morale tests as if they had lost twice as many models.
Opponent must add -1 to their hit rolls in their first shooting phase of the battle.

AL:
Vanguard movement.
May have one more unit in tactical reserve.

WB:
Can summon demons regardless of their alignment if character is unaligned. Do not have to stay stationary to do so. Unit champions can summon as if they were characters.

WE:
Reroll failed to hit and wound rolls against psykers in the fight phase. Each unit can attempt to deny one psychic power in each opponent's psychic phase. Do not roll any dice but instead is considered to have a rolled an 8.

EC:
May replace any combi-bolter or boltgun with a sonic blaster. May replace any Lascannon or Twin-Lascannon with a Blastmaster. May replace any flamer or heavy flamer with a doom siren. (these weapon options extent to all units with the emperors children keyword, not just infantery, bikers and helbrutes.)

May reroll to-wound rolls of 1 with sonic blasters, blastmasters and doom sirens.

BL:
Each detachment with this legion keyword generates an additional command point.
Each d6 a black legion unit would roll in the morale phase is considered to have a result of 4.


It is entirely possible that some of the above is op as [explicit] but at least it is somewhat more original.