40K RPG WRATH & GLORY

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**MarkNorfolk**

A chat with C7 at UKGE mentioned 'themed' books focusing on groups of similar characters as well as working on manuscripts sent to them by Ullises.

**schoon**

Ross Watson, the lead developer for the game, came over to C7 along with the game, so I doubt the change in publisher will affect things TOO much.

I'm interested in seeing C7's plan for the e game.

**BrianDavion**

if the system is poorly received I could see them returning to the 2d10 system the FFG stuff did.

**Apple Peel**

I’ve only just recently found out about this system. It sounds pretty dicey for future support so far. Would someone give me a rundown on if this game will live or receive support? Any players? How do you like this compared to the Dark Heresy, Only War, et al?

**H.B.M.C.**

BrianDavion wrote:
if the system is poorly received I could see them returning to the 2d10 system the FFG stuff did.

I'd be all up for 2nd Ed's of RT/DW/BC/OW and a relaunch of DH2.0.

Means I can get back into it.

**warboss**

schoon wrote:
warboss wrote:
Thanks to both for the confirmations. I signed up to their mailing list to see what the news will be since no one else (here.. on youtube... elsewhere) seems to be talking about the game. Does anyone have the rules for the ogryns and ratlings btw? How are they? What tiers are those races meant to start at?

I'll check for you tomorrow.

Thanks, I appreciate it. I'm curious as to what tiers they're meant for and how the ogryns compare tier for tier with astartes.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Has anyone here on dakka played more than a one-off/intro adventure session? I'm curious what the opinion might be from someone who played enough to actually advance a character a rank or two or even a full tier.

**reds8n**

via the Cubicle 7 FB page

Since we announced that we would be publishing Warhammer 40,000 roleplaying games there has been many questions on what our plans are.

Our FAQ below answers the most asked questions so far. We hope this helps and we will continue to update and answer more as we progress!

So let’s dive into the questions…..

I bought the core book before the announcement, will I need to buy it again? No! We love Wrath & Glory; it’s the perfect system to jump into adventure in the Age of the Dark Imperium. We’re not going to change the game, so if you own a Core Rulebook it will be fully compatible with all of the adventures and supplements coming soon.
What exactly is included in the revision, how much will you change? As with any game, there has been feedback on Wrath & Glory since its release, and we’ve listened. Our writers are making sure the epic world of Warhammer 40,000 oozes off every page, and we’ll edit any text errors and implement errata. We’re going to take some time to revamp the layout for maximum readability, whether you’re using a dataslate or a cogitator. We’re working with Warhammer 40,0000 Roleplay luminary and original game designer Ross Watson to bring you streamlined character creation, whilst retaining the depth of the original system.
When will the revised core book be released? We’re aiming to have a PDF available in September, with a physical release in November.
What is timeline for the other releases? Our plans are to begin releasing supplements at the start of next year.
Will C7 change the art for W&G? The vast vault of Warhammer 40,000 artwork has illuminated and inspired gamers for decades, and we’re excited to add to it where we can. We may change some of the Wrath & Glory artwork and will continue to use classic images from the 40k archives to make the Revised Rulebook as inspiring as the Uplifting Primer.
How involved is Ross Watson? Ross Watson is heavily involved in the writing and design of the Revised Rulebook – nobody knows the game better.
What are the differences between Dark Heresy and W&G? The original Warhammer 40,000 Roleplaying system used d100s and was focused on a particular part of the setting, like the lower levels of the Inquisition or a Rogue Trader and their retinue. Wrath & Glory is a more accessible d6 dice pool system that will feel instantly familiar to any 40k veteran. The characters you play can be from any part of the vast universe you want; love Space Wolves, but your best buddy can’t wait to play an Aeldari Warlock? That’s fine in Wrath & Glory – and you can bring your Commissar and Hive Scum friends too!

https://www.cubicle7games.com/40k-faq/

**BrianDavion**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
if the system is poorly received I could see them returning to the 2d10 system the FFG stuff did.
I'd be all up for 2nd Ed's of RT/DW/BC/OW and a relaunch of DH2.0.

Means I can get back into it.

me too. I much prefer FFG's concept of "seperate games with a unified system" to W&G's "yeah you can play a comissar an eldar and a space marine all in the same party"

**Yodhrin**

BrianDavion wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
if the system is poorly received I could see them returning to the 2d10 system the FFG stuff did.
I'd be all up for 2nd Ed's of RT/DW/BC/OW and a relaunch of DH2.0.

Means I can get back into it.

me too. I much prefer FFG's concept of "seperate games with a unified system" to W&G's "yeah you can play a comissar an eldar and a space marine all in the same party"

Same, but these days it seems like most RPG groups are all about the "lol that's so randumb bro" attitude - which, for the record, I am not disparaging or saying people aren't allowed to prefer, it's just a trend I've noticed and personally don't care for - and the "this is our party; a Sphess Marin(Primaris, natch), a Commissar who's player thinks threatening to execute everyone for cowardice constantly will be totes hilarious, and an IRL relationship pair playing an Eldar Ranger & Ork Commando odd-couple sitcom scenario" approach is much more conducive to that style than the FFG "come up with a character concept that actually fits into [organisation], from a range of broadly appropriate choices" systems.

**Arbitrator**

Yodhrin wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
if the system is poorly received I could see them returning to the 2d10 system the FFG stuff did.
I'd be all up for 2nd Ed's of RT/DW/BC/OW and a relaunch of DH2.0.

Means I can get back into it.

me too. I much prefer FFG's concept of "seperate games with a unified system" to W&G's "yeah you can play a comissar an eldar and a space marine all in the same party"

Same, but these days it seems like most RPG groups are all about the "lol that's so randumb bro" attitude - which, for the record, I am not disparaging or saying people aren't allowed to prefer, it's just a trend I've noticed and personally don't care for - and the "this is our party; a Sphess Marin(Primaris, natch), a Commissar who's player thinks threatening to execute everyone for cowardice constantly will be totes hilarious, and an IRL relationship pair playing an Eldar Ranger & Ork Commando odd-couple sitcom scenario" approach is much more conducive to that style than the FFG "come up with a character concept that actually fits into [organisation], from a range of broadly appropriate choices" systems.

I think a lot of it comes down to 'marketability'. Every designer wants their system to be the one that spawns Sir Bearington or Mexican Monk memes that get shared everywhere, or to be the next Critical Roll. Everything's so ludicrous, which when it's a group of friends only barely taking the game seriously is pretty appealing at a glance, to an outsider. People remember the dumb, absurd jokes but when the games/systems become nothing more but desperately trying to fill situations with quips and 'implausible' situations, it all feels a bit weightless.

Selling a more lore-appropriate, if not serious premise rather than EPIC and AWESOME adventures BLAM'ING THOSE HERETICS, YESSSS is a lot trickier. That's not saying "STOP HAVING FUN" or anything, but we've definitely seen a big swing towards these games being less Band of Brothers and more Guardians of the Galaxy.

**warboss**

reds8n wrote:
via the Cubicle 7 FB page

Spoiler:

Since we announced that we would be publishing Warhammer 40,000 roleplaying games there has been many questions on what our plans are.

Our FAQ below answers the most asked questions so far. We hope this helps and we will continue to update and answer more as we progress!

So let’s dive into the questions…..

I bought the core book before the announcement, will I need to buy it again? No! We love Wrath & Glory; it’s the perfect system to jump into adventure in the Age of the Dark Imperium. We’re not going to change the game, so if you own a Core Rulebook it will be fully compatible with all of the adventures and supplements coming soon.
What exactly is included in the revision, how much will you change? As with any game, there has been feedback on Wrath & Glory since its release, and we’ve listened. Our writers are making sure the epic world of Warhammer 40,000 oozes off every page, and we’ll edit any text errors and implement errata. We’re going to take some time to revamp the layout for maximum readability, whether you’re using a dataslate or a cogitator. We’re working with Warhammer 40,0000 Roleplay luminary and original game designer Ross Watson to bring you streamlined character creation, whilst retaining the depth of the original system.
When will the revised core book be released? We’re aiming to have a PDF available in September, with a physical release in November.
What is timeline for the other releases? Our plans are to begin releasing supplements at the start of next year.
Will C7 change the art for W&G? The vast vault of Warhammer 40,000 artwork has illuminated and inspired gamers for decades, and we’re excited to add to it where we can. We may change some of the Wrath & Glory artwork and will continue to use classic images from the 40k archives to make the Revised Rulebook as inspiring as the Uplifting Primer.
How involved is Ross Watson? Ross Watson is heavily involved in the writing and design of the Revised Rulebook – nobody knows the game better.
What are the differences between Dark Heresy and W&G? The original Warhammer 40,000 Roleplaying system used d100s and was focused on a particular part of the setting, like the lower levels of the Inquisition or a Rogue Trader and their retinue. Wrath & Glory is a more accessible d6 dice pool system that will feel instantly familiar to any 40k veteran. The characters you play can be from any part of the vast universe you want; love Space Wolves, but your best buddy can’t wait to play an Aeldari Warlock? That’s fine in Wrath & Glory – and you can bring your Commissar and Hive Scum friends too!

https://www.cubicle7games.com/40k-faq/

Thanks for the update/link. I was one of the folks who asked them and I was told to sign up to their newsletter; so far, I haven't gotten anything from that route. I wonder if they'll update the pdf on drivethrurpg for confirmed buyers when they release the new version. That certainly would be a pro-consumer move given how soon they're significantly changing it. Hopefully they'll include the ratling/ogryn info.

**Kid_Kyoto**

But a good GM and group can slap down the nonsensical ideas pretty quickly.

"OK folks we're playing a campaign with an Inquisition team on a stealth mission, so no Xenos or Marines unless you can pass as human."

vs

"OK folks, a bunch of random characters are stranded on a Space Hulk and you have 24 hours to find a working shuttle and fight off the mutant hordes before it disappears into the warp forever."

Both are fine games, so a system that can accomedate both has an advantage over one that can only handle a team of IG troopers (for example).

**Yodhrin**

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
But a good GM and group can slap down the nonsensical ideas pretty quickly.

"OK folks we're playing a campaign with an Inquisition team on a stealth mission, so no Xenos or Marines unless you can pass as human."

vs

"OK folks, a bunch of random characters are stranded on a Space Hulk and you have 24 hours to find a working shuttle and fight off the mutant hordes before it disappears into the warp forever."

Both are fine games, so a system that can accomedate both has an advantage over one that can only handle a team of IG troopers (for example).

As a Forever GM, I strongly disagree. I could do that, to an extent, with *one* of the groups I used to run, because the people in it were reasonable, several were actual friends, and they appreciated the amount of work I put in curating our own little corner of 40K to play in(which group is now deadzo, because GW opened their big fat rift right on top of said corner, joining my one other decent group of WFRP'rs who bogged off after the End Times debacle - thanks GWbama).

That isn't most groups in my experience. It's certainly not most new groups, when everyone is still in the process of feeling out what everyone else is into and will accept and will find annoying. The stronger the theme of the ruleset being used, the less I have to fight against That One Guy Who's Not Really A Proper That F'n Guy But Still who keeps trying to slip Rock & Morty or other meme'y BS into things, or the tendency of some players to devolve into Subversive Special Snowflakery.

"It can do whatever you want!" sounds great on paper, but it also makes it really difficult for a GM to say "no" without seeming like an unreasonable old grog trying to railroad the players because hey, it's right there; whatever you want, so why can't I play my ridiculous borderline-Deadpoolish meme-factory, huh Mr GM? Sure, you can boot people who try and take the piss, but lots of people will disagree with what exactly constitutes taking the piss, and IME if a GM tries removing a player(no matter how politely, no matter how much any reasonable person might think them justified) from a group that's using a very open system, there's a better than even chance the group will fracture entirely.

And, of course, if a GM were to lament that state of affairs, the typical response will be "you should have chosen a system that better represented the type of game you wanted to run then, shouldn't you".

Hence why I much prefer being able to say "I'm running an Only War group, who wants in", because if anyone then tries to pitch their half-Eldar Rogue Trader Who's Sekritly A Custodian And Also Alpharius they will be seen as the unreasonable prat and I can get shot of them without anyone else taking umbrage.

**warboss**

It looks like they'll be updating the pdf for free to the new version as well as coming out with a free update pdf detailing the changes for physical book owners.

https://www.cubicle7games.com/40k-pdf-update/

As for what some of his the changes will be, this is what they posted for the link click lazy.

Here’s a list of some of what you can expect to find inside:

A full integration of all the errata for the Core Rulebook.
A new, streamlined method for creating characters.
An expanded set of flexible Frameworks.
Updated layout with an expanded index.
An extra round of editing and proofreading.

**H.B.M.C.**

*shrugs*

It's still a book that's trying to be all things to all people, and for that reason collapses under the weight of its own ambition.

**warboss**

I agree but I figured I'd post at least nominally good news. A free update to a subpar book is still better than "your book is officially useless after one year" FWIW.

**reds8n**

via FB

Yesterday, we were delighted to reveal the cover art for our upcoming Wrath & Glory Core Rulebook! Today we want to share an update from Cubicle 7’s Wrath & Glory Producer Zak Dale-Clutterbuck and show you the book cover with the logo.

In the 41st Millenium, there is only war. In the Gilead system, the battle for the survival of the Imperium rages. Cut off from the light of the Emperor by Noctis Aeterna, they have no reinforcements, no means of travel, no means of communication with the wider Imperium. Desperate agents of different factions put aside their differences (for now) to defend this bastion of humanity isolated in the darkness.

In Wrath & Glory, you’ll build a group of unique characters based on Warhammer 40,000 Archetypes and embark on your own perilous adventures. By choosing or creating your own Framework, you can define what kind of stories you’d like to tell in the Dark Imperium. The Rulebook cover shows a group of Iconic adventurers battling off Orks and Chaos cultists in a mission to save the Gilead system. Continue reading for a break down of the cover here: https://www.cubicle7games.com/wrath-glory/

If you missed our 40k FAQ a while back you can find it here: https://www.cubicle7games.com/40k-faq/

Update on the PDF: https://www.cubicle7games.com/40k-pdf-update/

**Crimson**

I want a 40K model of that Inquisitor with a thunder hammer.

**Lord Damocles**

The hammer is so good, the ork has fallen over before he's has even been hit by it!

**warboss**

Overall, I like the cover although I was a fan of the previous one as well so didn't see a reason to change it (other than maybe for instant recognition of the revised version to prevent confusion). That said... the angle of the arm/hand and gun for the primaris is sligntly off. Once you see the awkwardness of that, I don't think you can unsee it.

**schoon**

I think the new cover hits all the wickets. Nice.

**Kanluwen**

Lord Damocles wrote:
The hammer is so good, the ork has fallen over before he's has even been hit by it!

I think the Inquisitor just knows that ya gotta follow-through!

**reds8n**

better image

Spoiler:

by Johan Grenier

**Kid_Kyoto**

Lord Damocles wrote:
The hammer is so good, the ork has fallen over before he's has even been hit by it!

made you flinch!

**reds8n**

https://www.cubicle7games.com/wrath-glory-pdf-pre-order-live/

We are so excited to announce that the PDF for Warhammer 40,000 Roleplay: Wrath & Glory is finished! You can pre-order your copy of the book here and get hold of the PDF straight away!

Own the previous Rulebook?
We will add the new PDF to the existing one on DrivethruRPG so those who purchased the previous Rulebook can access it through their Library. If you bought only the physical copy previously, we are working on a free PDF to highlight the changes and will release this soon too. Please keep an eye on our social media channels for more on this.

We will also add the PDF to Bits and Mortar so stores can fulfil their direct pre-orders.

Below producer Zak Dale-Clutterbuck has outlined what you can expect from this edition and has broken down each chapter. In case you missed it, check out our recent layout reveal here!

What is Wrath & Glory?
Wrath & Glory is the story of the Gilead System, eight Imperial worlds cut off from the Emperor’s light by the Great Rift. The new Rulebook focuses on the Gilead System, allowing you to tell your own stories in a society beset by daemonic invasion and internal corruption.

Character Creation has been streamlined, with a focus on Frameworks. With so many choices of who and what you can play, you’ll want to decide the focus of your game early!

The Factions Chapter is a primer on life in the 41st Millennium, detailing each of the organisations vying for supremacy in the Warp-torn Gilead System. Here you’ll find expanded background options for every Faction, each of which provides a bonus during play.

The Archetypes you know and love have been presented in an easy-to-read, single-page format. All requirements have been removed, and extra bonuses have been added to complement the slight changes to Wrath & Glory. The Attribute, Skill, and Talent suggestions are ideal for guiding new players through making a character, or building quick NPCs on the fly.

The Wrath & Glory Talent list has been massively expanded into an entire chapter for a greater range of character customisation. Some of these are classic Warhammer fare we know and love — tearing through armour, proficiency with blazing promethium, and, of course, MORE DAKKA! There are other choices for investigative or social-based games. Talents like Conversational Cogitator bring the focus back to roleplaying, letting you use the augmetics of your mechanised mind to calculate the best response in any conversation.

Once you’ve survived a few adventures (hopefully without losing too many limbs), you’ll have gathered some Experience Points (XP). The new Advancement chapter has overhauled the Ascension system, allowing you to change Archetypes, take new Ascension Packages, or just spend your XP on cool stuff. The system is designed to be both robust and flexible to suit any group.

The essential Rules have been reviewed, edited, playtested, and presented with a focus on clarity and quick understanding. Very little has changed bar a few simplifications, which will mean you’re using the book less and your imagination more.

Combat is around every corner in the grim darkness of the 41st Millennium. We’ve gone through all the errata for Wrath & Glory, taking the same approach as with the Rules. Combat is largely unchanged, apart from simplification, clarification, and some cool new optional rules, including an entirely new Stealth system.

We’ve addressed errata issues with everything from Reloads to Wounds, but rest assured we won’t stop here. We’d love if you would help us by letting us know about any typos or other errors that you may find in the PDF via this Errata link only. Thanks!

**Kid_Kyoto**

So what do we think, new thread?

**warboss**

I hope they improve upon the lackluster first release although I'm a bit hesitant about the simplification description they use above given that the original felt like butter spread too thin over toast to begin with. Fingers crossed...

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, I'm fine with a new thread.

**Albertorius**

Well, for starters layout looks like a massive improvement.

**warboss**

Albertorius wrote:
Well, for starters layout looks like a massive improvement.

How does the lack of restrictions on archetypes on talents affect min-maxing? Should we expect a glut of astartes librarian cripples wheeling around in mobile sarcophagi who exited their dreadnoughts because of some sort of beneficial munchkin rules interaction? I'm apprehensive about how focusing on putting all the rules for a character archetype on one page and the "streamlining" that entails will actually affect the process.

**Albertorius**

warboss wrote:
Albertorius wrote:
Well, for starters layout looks like a massive improvement.

How does the lack of restrictions on archetypes on talents affect min-maxing? Should we expect a glut of astartes librarian cripples wheeling around in mobile sarcophagi who exited their dreadnoughts because of some sort of beneficial munchkin rules interaction? I'm apprehensive about how focusing on putting all the rules for a character archetype on one page and the "streamlining" that entails will actually affect the process.

I expect that the same way that any other game with free XP expenditure does, which is mainly to say, it really doesn't and it's left up to the table and the GM.

From what I can see, archetypes have species limitations, logically enough in 40k, and suggestions on attributes, skills and talents, but no general hard caps (there are talents with specific limitations, though).

Suggested Purchases
Your Archetype will give you bonuses to Attributes and Skills, but you’ll still have a lot of XP left over to customise your character. If you’ve never built a character before or you’re short on time, you can use the suggested purchases presented with each Archetype to start playing quickly.
These costs are calculated using the tables on p.24-25. The suggested Attributes and Skills are tailored to each Archetype, highlighting their strengths or what they need to succeed. You might want to take either or both of the suggested arrays, and use your remaining points to customise them further using the tables on p.24-25.
The suggested Talents have also been tailored to each Archetype, including any particular quirks or what might be useful to them. Talents can also help differentiate between different individuals with the same Archetype. If you have two Inquisitorial Acolytes in your group, they’ll probably have different backstories. For instance, one might be a proficient lip reader, and the other could have a secret identity.