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Not really. A single superheavy is kind of meh in this edition, especially if you can’t outflank it to protect it from the alpha. If you want to take multiple superheavies, at that point you may as well play straight guard as they’d benefit from doctrines

Does anyone think we might see our Codex in September? Given that GSC was featured in both Kill Team and "Tooth and Claw" and given how quick the Space Wolves codex came out alongside "Tooth and Claw" and given how it seems Orcs are coming out in October I think there's good reason to think that we'll see ours in the next 3 weeks. Gotta keep the hype train crashing through people's bank accounts!

You have to consider not just 40k releases, but all of GWs releases. I would rather wait a couple more months and avoid the SW treatment, haha.

A little sad the abominant only has 3 attacks at WS 3. Happy about the FnP, but not thrilled at 5+ armor, and no invul.

Could be super worth it for his points though.

The Marauder Destroyer is decent if you want a worthy flyer.

Caspian89 wrote:
Does anyone think we might see our Codex in September? Given that GSC was featured in both Kill Team and "Tooth and Claw" and given how quick the Space Wolves codex came out alongside "Tooth and Claw" and given how it seems Orcs are coming out in October I think there's good reason to think that we'll see ours in the next 3 weeks. Gotta keep the hype train crashing through people's bank accounts!

Three months at least - Armigers were Mar to June, and that seems to fit with GW's current preview window and the only thing officially announced for the Genestealer Cult codex is that it isn't coming out with the new models.
Maybe a November release before Christmas, or one of the first books in the new year if it's something that is revealed at the November 40K Open day rather than announced at one of the US events later this year.

Abominant is around 80 pts - 4 power.

So then Tooth and Claw will be the only way to get the new Abberants and the Abominant until the Codex drops....Ya if I were them I'd want it to be exclusive for a few months before I dropped the individual boxes.

Updated the entries for the Abominant and Aberrants with the latest information from Tooth and Claw. Looking forward to getting some table time with the new rules.

 Asmodas wrote:

Just for a bit of perspective on my experiences with the army, I have been having a lot of trouble with flyers (in particular, Eldar flyers). […] Has anyone else run into similar issues with flyers, and if so, come up with any alternative solutions?

Flyer usage dropped off in our area after the early edition FAQ that made it so they cannot score or count for tabling, so I haven't had much experience fighting them in 8th edition unfortunately. The last time I fought multiple fliers (two Stormtalons) I was able to bring them down with weight of autocannon fire and a few well placed Smites, but they are rather light targets and don't have the -2 penalty.

Could you perhaps provide the Eldar list? Might be easier to find a weakness if we know what else there is.

Asmodas wrote:
Maybe I should just post my current list so you guys have a better idea what I'm actually working with.

Spoiler:

2000 points

GSC Battalion

HQ:

Primus
Primus

Troops:

Acolyte Hybrids x 9
- 2x Demo Charges

Acolyte Hybrids x 9
- 2x Rock Saw

Neophytes x 10
- 6x autogun (including unit leader)
- 2x grenade launcher
- 2x seismic cannon

Neophytes x 13
- 11x shotgun
- 1x grenade launcher
- 1x seismic cannon
- power maul and autopistol on unit leader

Aberrants x 6
- 3x power hammer
- 3x power pick

Goliath Rockgrinder (heavy seismic cannon)

Goliath
Goliath

Tyranids Spearhead (Hive Fleet Kraken)

HQ:
Flyrant w/2x devourers and monstrous rending claws
- adrenal glands
- warlord - heightened senses
- bio-artifacts - chameleonic mutation

Troops:
Genestealers x 20

Heavy:
Biovore x 1

Exocrine

T-Fex w/Acid Spray

As mentioned previously, you could turn that Spearhead into a Patrol if you wanted to save a few points on the Biovore and Exocrine. I'd consider dropping the Seismic Cannon from the Shotgun squad in favor of more bodies if available, as they tend to be on the move more often than not so the cannon will rarely be able to fire to full effect. If available a few more Acolyte weapons would be good as well, as they have generally performed best for me when maxing out on their specials.

ph34r wrote:Are any Brood Brothers superheavies worth taking?

In the current meta I don't think any of them are especially compelling unfortunately. A lot of the competitive lists are building to handle Knights so any Titanic model without some form of invulnerable save is very vulnerable. The Abominant and improved Aberrants ironically are also probably going to add further to the problem, since they should be extremely good at tearing up knights and the like with the upcoming changes.

Caspian89 wrote:Does anyone think we might see our Codex in September? Given that GSC was featured in both Kill Team and "Tooth and Claw" and given how quick the Space Wolves codex came out alongside "Tooth and Claw" and given how it seems Orcs are coming out in October I think there's good reason to think that we'll see ours in the next 3 weeks. Gotta keep the hype train crashing through people's bank accounts!

I'm leaning towards November at the earliest. I recall reading somewhere that there is a major Moonclan Grots release for AoS in the pipeline and they still have the Reaver and Warhound titans for Titanicus that need a release.

I do think someone at GW likes GSC though. The fluff booklet for Kill Team was the first time I can recall in recent memory where a Xenos faction defeated a major Imperial one.

So, aberrants now is a good unit?

zamerion wrote:
So, aberrants now is a good unit?

Still a little bit pricey but I loooove that stopsign!

 jifel wrote:

zamerion wrote:
So, aberrants now is a good unit?

Still a little bit pricey but I loooove that stopsign!

Do we know the point cost for aberrants in the new dex?

zamerion wrote:So, aberrants now is a good unit?

They were fairly solid with Hammers before, though mixed units or even full Pick units are now more viable options due to the buffs from Tooth and Claw. The changes to Bestial Vigor is also going to be interesting, as it makes Aberrants unusually tough against weapons with good AP and Damage 2 or Damage D3, since they now always get the 5+++ against wounds suffered and the damage per wound is reduced by 1.

 jifel wrote:
Still a little bit pricey but I loooove that stopsign!

Yeah, I'm a bit shocked as to how good its stats are. The question becomes do you value the extra AP and point of damage from the Hammer or flurry of attacks from the Signpost more? I'm hesitantly thinking that the "Improvised Weapon" is going to be better in most cases unless the squad is being built specifically for knight smashing.

Heafstaag wrote:
Do we know the point cost for aberrants in the new dex?

Technically Tooth and Claw is for the Index. Still, I think the costs remain unchanged from the reductions in chapter approved.

The stop sign looks so cool that it does not make sense to not include them!

And here I've gone and converted all my Overkill Aberrants to have Power Hammers...

It's frustrating that in the new Aberrants sprue there are only 3 picks included....Well time for more conversions!

Aberrant cost is unchanged, only the sign and tail that is different. And the Abominant is 80

Just go with the rule of cool. If you want the whole unit to have picks... tell them the sign post is an improvised pick.

The signpost is an amazing weapon. I can see myself buying that bit just to use on marines to partially live out the angry marine fantasy.

I haven't really seen anyone point out how awesome it is that Aberrants can now field up to 10 models in a unit. It's used to be 8, max. 10 Abberants with Picks and an Abominant (dare I dream of 2!?), or 9 and an Abominant inside a truck is pretty powerful payload. There's only so many Primuses to go around and only one stratagem a turn for the good Cult Ambush rolls and it seems to me we have to make use of transports for some of our close combat units because of that.

This is a bonkers expensive package though: 463 for 10 Abberants (can include 2 Hypermorphs for no extra cost) w/picks, Abominant and Chimera with 2x Heavy Flamers.
430 for 9 picks, Abominant and a Goliath Truck w/o Demo charges.

Rockgrinder package: 339 for 5 picks, Abominant and a Rockgrinder w/Clearance Incinerator

Mind you I like the Chimera/Truck because you can decide based on your opponent which unit you NEED to ambush and which units you can afford to drive up the board, so the tactical flexibility is great.

Abominant though...I'd want to pair him with Hammers, not Picks. At least then they have the same sorts of targets.

Yeah, I think transports are key. Something like 3 transports, 10 aberrants + HQ, rock saw acolytes, 3 11-12 stealer blobs would give great flexibility in deployment, whilst leaving enough points to put in enough HQs/Neophytes to fill 2 batallions

Hello guys, new recruit for the Cult here!

Started to build my GSC army about a week ago. Have been lurking in this thread since. I've actually read the whole thing, eager to get a better understanding of the army.

I'm a fairly experienced player. My other armies are Deathwatch, Thousand Sons, Dark Eldar and Death Guard. So I'm familiar with squishy T3 models from my Dark Kin but they are so fast and ignore the penalty for moving and shooting heavy weapons.

Which makes the GSC a bit of a mistery for me.

Here's what I understand so far:

Patriarch: Papa Blender. But expensive and really wants to go with the Purestrains for synergie. I'm not a fan of the Purestrain models so I'll likely rarely play him/them.

Magus: Standard budget Psyker. Strange that he is fluff-wise as strong as a Librarian but much weaker on the Tabletop. Also my Thousand Sons are offended that he simply got born with his psychic talent. (Any TS psyker would probably still crush him in psychic combat).

Primus: LOVE the model. Actually converted a Commissar into a Primus so that I can play two Pimuses without having identical twins on the table. Very useful delivery tool and good against GEQ/MEQ infantry in melee. Will probably die to any real CC Character, however.

Acolyte Iconward: Very cool model but right now pretty meh. The artefact is useful but the 6+ FNP won't keep a squad alive.

Acolytes w/ Rocksaws are gold. Ambush with a Primus (+Stratagem) to get where they want and kill their target. But after that they'll very likely die as even ordinary Bolters can really hurt them. Workaround to this seems to be the same as for my Dark Eldar: Target saturation. Just throw more troops/Abberants/etc. at the opponent so that he can't deal with everything at once, thus ensuring that some of the threats survive.

Neophytes are Guardsmen +1. Good for screening or grabbing objectives. What is hard for me to grasp is how to play them in a Goliath Truck. They want to get into 12" (or 6" with the Demo Charges from the Truck). To get there they'll need probably 2 turns. However, they will only hit on 5+ with their heavy weapons when they move, which is odd since for example the Seismic Cannon actually does more damage when it's close. So we have a unit that has to move in close to do some form of damage but at the same time wants to stay stationary to actually hit stuff. How do you handle this?

Abberants: Yay they just got some love and seem really strong. However let me tell you that a 5+ FNP on a T4 frame won't do too much. My Death Guard have better armour and toughness and that FNP doesn't do too much for them either. And since most weapons can easily punch through the 5+ armour that the Abberants have that FNP won't keep them alive for long.

Goliath Rockgrinder: I am a bit surprised that it can be benefit from the +1 to-hit the Primus gives. Very cool but I think when the Codex drops that'll change. I also think it is slightly overcosted. It will hardly do any damage with its ranged weapons but it is quite sturdy. I plan on using one or two to deliver 5 Abberants w/ an Abominant into the enemy lines.

Metamorphs: Not really worth their points right now. Their whole reason for existing is that they can take tyranid-esque melee weapons. But those weapons are pretty bad in their current form, thus rendering them useless as a unit.

Leman Russes, Purestrains and Sentinels are all quite self explanatory.


I would also love to hear your speculations on what we might see in the Codex!

 Causalis wrote:
Hello guys, new recruit for the Cult here!

Started to build my GSC army about a week ago. Have been lurking in this thread since. I've actually read the whole thing, eager to get a better understanding of the army.

I'm a fairly experienced player. My other armies are Deathwatch, Thousand Sons, Dark Eldar and Death Guard. So I'm familiar with squishy T3 models from my Dark Kin but they are so fast and ignore the penalty for moving and shooting heavy weapons.

Which makes the GSC a bit of a mistery for me.

Here's what I understand so far:

Patriarch: Papa Blender. But expensive and really wants to go with the Purestrains for synergie. I'm not a fan of the Purestrain models so I'll likely rarely play him/them.

Magus: Standard budget Psyker. Strange that he is fluff-wise as strong as a Librarian but much weaker on the Tabletop. Also my Thousand Sons are offended that he simply got born with his psychic talent. (Any TS psyker would probably still crush him in psychic combat).

Primus: LOVE the model. Actually converted a Commissar into a Primus so that I can play two Pimuses without having identical twins on the table. Very useful delivery tool and good against GEQ/MEQ infantry in melee. Will probably die to any real CC Character, however.

Acolyte Iconward: Very cool model but right now pretty meh. The artefact is useful but the 6+ FNP won't keep a squad alive.

Acolytes w/ Rocksaws are gold. Ambush with a Primus (+Stratagem) to get where they want and kill their target. But after that they'll very likely die as even ordinary Bolters can really hurt them. Workaround to this seems to be the same as for my Dark Eldar: Target saturation. Just throw more troops/Abberants/etc. at the opponent so that he can't deal with everything at once, thus ensuring that some of the threats survive.

Neophytes are Guardsmen +1. Good for screening or grabbing objectives. What is hard for me to grasp is how to play them in a Goliath Truck. They want to get into 12" (or 6" with the Demo Charges from the Truck). To get there they'll need probably 2 turns. However, they will only hit on 5+ with their heavy weapons when they move, which is odd since for example the Seismic Cannon actually does more damage when it's close. So we have a unit that has to move in close to do some form of damage but at the same time wants to stay stationary to actually hit stuff. How do you handle this?

Abberants: Yay they just got some love and seem really strong. However let me tell you that a 5+ FNP on a T4 frame won't do too much. My Death Guard have better armour and toughness and that FNP doesn't do too much for them either. And since most weapons can easily punch through the 5+ armour that the Abberants have that FNP won't keep them alive for long.

Goliath Rockgrinder: I am a bit surprised that it can be benefit from the +1 to-hit the Primus gives. Very cool but I think when the Codex drops that'll change. I also think it is slightly overcosted. It will hardly do any damage with its ranged weapons but it is quite sturdy. I plan on using one or two to deliver 5 Abberants w/ an Abominant into the enemy lines.

Metamorphs: Not really worth their points right now. Their whole reason for existing is that they can take tyranid-esque melee weapons. But those weapons are pretty bad in their current form, thus rendering them useless as a unit.

Leman Russes, Purestrains and Sentinels are all quite self explanatory.


I would also love to hear your speculations on what we might see in the Codex!

Spoiler:

I think it's very likely we'll see a WT or Relic that'll give +1/-1 to the Ambush roll or maybe grant a re-roll.

Maybe a stratagem which gives +1 to the FNP rolls the Iconward dishes out (for one phase).

A relic bonesword or claw for the Primus, giving something like re-roll to-wound rolls and/or +D3 attacks.

Maybe faction traits for the different cults? GW's policy on which faction to give those seems fairly random. The Death Guard got a huge release and new codex etc. but didn't get any rules for their Septic Cohorts. But the Dark Eldar on the other hand got a deluxe version.

I think the Seismic Cannon and Mining Laser might see a slight adjustment. Maybe indirectly by giving the Goliath Truck a rule that changes heavy weapons to assault weapons if the squad is in the vehicle. Would love to see a buff to the SC to S4 on its long-range profile and the heavy SC to maybe deal a mortal wound on a to-wound roll of a 6+.

I expect to see a stratagem that lets transports outflank or do a scout move etc.

A stratagem or Cult specific rule that restores D3 wounds (or models woth D3 wounds if no injured models are there) when the unit comes in via Cult Ambush. Maybe with the option to spend 2CP to make it D6 wounds.

BOOBYTRAPS! A Stratagem that lets us rig D3 terrain pieces with explosives and if an enemy unit enters them it suffers D3 MW. I don't think that is strong or anything but it is fluffy as hell!

A warlord trait or stratagem (or relic?) that makes Unquestioning Loyalty pass on a 2+.

Some form of CP generation/recovery.

That Gunslinger/Cowboy model we have seen could be a Primus with a ranged loadout.

I would at least get proxy pruestrains as they are the best TAC/anti bubblewrap unit the cult has IMO. ambush a blob, buff them with fast running patriarch, and shred GEQ/MEQ. I find acolytes too fragile for that task and typically only use them as heavy weapons + ablative wounds.

I prefer acolytes in small teams to basically ruin a specific important units day via primus ambush. I had a game where a 4 saw 10 man acolyte blob and primus wiped a kharn escorted berserker squad then the blender himself in melee, (though kharn killed half the squad himself between rounds) WhatI really want to try is a huge blob with power drills vs knights. (Mine is the heavy rock drill that will pierce the heavans, or at least your Lord of war )

 Causalis wrote:

Patriarch: Papa Blender. But expensive and really wants to go with the Purestrains for synergie. I'm not a fan of the Purestrain models so I'll likely rarely play him/them.

I've generally found the best offensive use of the Patriarch is as a tool for picking off enemy leaders. He is fast and relatively well protected by the standards of GSC with their invulnerable save and Unquestioning Loyalty, plus they are very consistent at laying down damage with their innate ability to reroll failed to-wound rolls.

The main problem of course lies in biting off more than they can handle. Genestealers are a good bodyguard since they are equally fast, but the more important factor is to insure that the Patriarch has one at all. Blobs of Shotgun Neophytes are fairly good at the job for cheap wounds and Acolytes appreciate the moral immunity as well.

 Causalis wrote:

Magus: Standard budget Psyker. Strange that he is fluff-wise as strong as a Librarian but much weaker on the Tabletop.

I think they are better at denying psychic powers than the Librarian is. The Spiritual Leader bubble does help in shutting down Smite and similar offensive powers, while the Magus focuses on denying the augment powers.

 Causalis wrote:

Primus: LOVE the model. Actually converted a Commissar into a Primus so that I can play two Pimuses without having identical twins on the table. Very useful delivery tool and good against GEQ/MEQ infantry in melee. Will probably die to any real CC Character, however.

They aren't really meant to fight other combat specialists, but they can do very well against things you would not expect them to due to the Toxin Injector Claw's 2+ to wound ability.

 Causalis wrote:

Acolyte Iconward: Very cool model but right now pretty meh. The artefact is useful but the 6+ FNP won't keep a squad alive.

Truthfully the 6+ FNP bubble isn't really the main draw for an Iconward so much as their moral reroll bubble and relatively good combat stats. I tend to use my non-relic Iconwards alongside Neophyte squads working on foot or ambushing, as they appreciate the reroll for moral checks (bigger squads than the other infantry and usually not so threatening as to draw all available anti-infantry fire, so moral is more likely to come into play) and a buddy to provide counter-assault if they get charged by a backfield harassment unit.

 Causalis wrote:

Acolytes w/ Rocksaws are gold. Ambush with a Primus (+Stratagem) to get where they want and kill their target. But after that they'll very likely die as even ordinary Bolters can really hurt them. Workaround to this seems to be the same as for my Dark Eldar: Target saturation. Just throw more troops/Abberants/etc. at the opponent so that he can't deal with everything at once, thus ensuring that some of the threats survive.

One trick that helps improve their survivability a bit is to "trap" an enemy model by surrounding it, preventing the enemy from withdrawing so the Acolytes can stay locked in combat through the opponent's shooting phase and ideally clear the combat on their turn. Target saturation is a key element for the army as a whole though, which thankfully the army does well since just about everything shares the same defensive profiles.

 Causalis wrote:

Neophytes are Guardsmen +1. Good for screening or grabbing objectives. What is hard for me to grasp is how to play them in a Goliath Truck. They want to get into 12" (or 6" with the Demo Charges from the Truck). To get there they'll need probably 2 turns. However, they will only hit on 5+ with their heavy weapons when they move, which is odd since for example the Seismic Cannon actually does more damage when it's close. So we have a unit that has to move in close to do some form of damage but at the same time wants to stay stationary to actually hit stuff. How do you handle this?

I tend to run mechanized lists more often than not, and my general experience has been that it is usually better to treat the close-range profiles as a threat deterrent than to try to use them proactively unless the match-up requires closing quickly (like say vs AM, Craftworld Eldar, or Tau). Goliath Trucks themselves generally want to hang back towards the rear of the midfield to take advantage of the long range on their own weaponry and to reduce the amount of mid-strength shooting they have to endure, so I tend to have mine move towards the objectives on the first turn and put them in park once in a good spot until conditions require them to move. Generally 24'' out is fine, as the enemy will have to move towards the Goliaths at some point to either grab objectives or to escape the melee threats running amuck in their own backfield.

Also as an aside, if you want to run Goliath Trucks aggressively load them up with Acolyte squads carrying Demolition Charges. The open topped ability works for them as well and the speed of the Goliath provides an impressive 18'' threat range for bombing targets. Once charges are spent (and the target hopefully crippled/dead), the squad can disembark to go pick on objective sitters and the Goliath can either withdraw or go act as an overwatch sponge.

 Causalis wrote:

Abberants: Yay they just got some love and seem really strong. However let me tell you that a 5+ FNP on a T4 frame won't do too much. My Death Guard have better armour and toughness and that FNP doesn't do too much for them either. And since most weapons can easily punch through the 5+ armour that the Abberants have that FNP won't keep them alive for long.

The new 5+ FNP aspect of Bestial Vigor alone isn't quite as exciting as the 5+ FNP combined with -1 damage (to a minimum of 1) on a 2 wound model. Basically the two together means that against any 2 damage weapon with good AP Aberrants effectively have a 5+ invulnerable save, since they only suffer 1 damage per shot which can then have the 5+ made against it. Against anti-infantry guns without AP they effectively have a rerollable 5+ save.

They are going to be vulnerable to high rate of fire mid-strength weaponry that relies on weight of wounds to kill targets rather than quality shots (which is good, better saturation with the other troops) but on the other hand, they are going to be obnoxiously hard to deal with via plasma and other weapons that traditionally are the bane of multi-wound infantry.

 Causalis wrote:

Goliath Rockgrinder: I am a bit surprised that it can be benefit from the +1 to-hit the Primus gives. Very cool but I think when the Codex drops that'll change. I also think it is slightly overcosted. It will hardly do any damage with its ranged weapons but it is quite sturdy. I plan on using one or two to deliver 5 Abberants w/ an Abominant into the enemy lines.

I've been mostly running mine with Clearance Incinerators since 8th dropped and using them as assault transports that coincidently are happy to get into assault as well. Auto-hits are nice for the Rockgrinder, and it focuses the guns on anti-infantry while the Drilldozer blade (and/or cargo) provides anti-armor functions. They really want other vehicles to provide threat saturation though, since otherwise they are a very stand-out target in an army of infantry or artillery.

I'm somewhat expecting the Rockgrinder to get a rule similar to Carnifexes where they get a bonus to-hit rolls on the charge when the codex drops. If that is the case I could see the Primus no longer providing benefit, but it is worth noting that the Magus' bubble works on vehicles as well so it isn't without precedent.

 Causalis wrote:

Metamorphs: Not really worth their points right now. Their whole reason for existing is that they can take tyranid-esque melee weapons. But those weapons are pretty bad in their current form, thus rendering them useless as a unit.

Agreed for the most part, though their original intended role was a mass rending attacks squad for anti-infantry (basically what purestrains do now). In 7th edition a squad would be looking at 5 rending claw attacks each on the charge that either had better chances of hitting than their Acolyte counterparts (Talon), attacked before their Acolyte counterparts (Whip) or hit at S6 (Claw). At the time Purestrains had the advantage of better Weapon Skill and Initiative along with their invulnerable save, so they were better suited to taking on other melee specialists while Metamorphs bludgeoned things to death with weight of attacks.

If they were to bring Metamorphs back to their old costs and drop the cost on their weapons to something more reasonable (maybe add AP -1 to the Talon and D2 on the Claw), I think they could compete fairly well with their current stats. A cheap and disposable chaff clearing melee squad is something the army would love to have, allowing Purestrains to return to their old role of melee superiority while Acolytes remain focused on their special weapons.

Also in regards to the Abominant, going over his rules I noticed that he benefits from his own Chosen One ability as he has the Aberrant keyword and the ability itself does not specify that the affected models need be "another friendly Aberrant" model, just "a friendly Aberrant" model. Sixes to hit with an Abominant are going to hurt...

Any suggestions for a dope Primus conversion? Something any of you guys were even considering?

Hey there! Started collecting GSC not a long ago and finally making some progress. Having problems with Thousand Sons player, and looking for some tips and list building ideas.. I know codex is on the way and many things might change.

I can sometimes win by victory points, capturing or holding lucky objectives, since my units are quite mobile. But in a fair fight I'm getting my ass kicked pretty everytime. I feel kinda cheaty winning only by hiding my units on objectives or behind scenery to get those points...
His inferno bolters rip through transports with ease and wipe my hybrids. Scarab occult terminators teleport into my back line mopping up long range weapon teams
His psychic phase is nightmare... deleting purestrains units with his powers... (no inv saves), messing up my charges. My poor Magus getting locked by his Sorcerers and its hard for me to deny all his powers... Mostly for his + to range on physic powers (it's hard to get closer to them - alive)
Since he is blobbing much, my units cannot go toe to toe with his so I mainly avoid fights. I am betting on good ambushes but even then his units are really tanky (rubrics, terminators), so its like hitting brick wall...

Should I focus on eliminating his Sorcerers with kamikaze charges? I found out he is hurt by long range weapons... but aside leman russ I dont have any...
Some tips for killing TS?

Thanks!

oem0909 wrote:
Hey there! Started collecting GSC not a long ago and finally making some progress. Having problems with Thousand Sons player, and looking for some tips and list building ideas.. I know codex is on the way and many things might change.

I can sometimes win by victory points, capturing or holding lucky objectives, since my units are quite mobile. But in a fair fight I'm getting my ass kicked pretty everytime. I feel kinda cheaty winning only by hiding my units on objectives or behind scenery to get those points...
His inferno bolters rip through transports with ease and wipe my hybrids. Scarab occult terminators teleport into my back line mopping up long range weapon teams
His psychic phase is nightmare... deleting purestrains units with his powers... (no inv saves), messing up my charges. My poor Magus getting locked by his Sorcerers and its hard for me to deny all his powers... Mostly for his + to range on physic powers (it's hard to get closer to them - alive)
Since he is blobbing much, my units cannot go toe to toe with his so I mainly avoid fights. I am betting on good ambushes but even then his units are really tanky (rubrics, terminators), so its like hitting brick wall...

Should I focus on eliminating his Sorcerers with kamikaze charges? I found out he is hurt by long range weapons... but aside leman russ I dont have any...
Some tips for killing TS?

Thanks!

remember that magus gives ALL GSC infantry within a bubble deny the witch, you can string out a neophyte blob to extend the range of denies

Thousand Sons player here!

If you say that Inferno Bolters kill your transports that means your opponent likely plays 20+ Rubrics? Consens of the TS community is that Rubricae are quite meh. Yes they'll just tank autoguns for days. But they are hot garbage in close combat and Purestrains should just rampage right through them.

Why does blobbing keep you from engaging in melee? Sounds like a perfect opportunity to tie up 2+ units in close combat! Most of the TS units are bad at CC. Tzaangors are quite good at it but will simply die to a volume of S4 attacks, which the GSC army has plenty of.

You can also screen your weapon teams with Neophytes, thus pushing the deepstriking Scarabs further away.

I would advise on bringing at least two Magi (Maguses?) to try and disrupt a few spells.

Abberants with the new Power Picks should also work really well against Rubrics or Scarabs since their "All is Dust" rule doesn't work against D3 weapons and with S5 you'll be wounding them on 3+.

As a heads up, it looks like "City of Traps" might be more than just an Echoes of War/Mission Specific thing.

It modifies the Cult Ambush table for two of its results.

SHUPPET wrote:Any suggestions for a dope Primus conversion? Something any of you guys were even considering?

I've seen Commissars conversions that made for rather convincing Primus (example, not mine). I think you could probably make one using the torsos from the Neophyte heavy weapon gunners (similar style) and some Acolyte arms as well. The trickiest part is finding spare parts to make the needle pistol, since the only other plastic needle weapons that I am aware of are the House Escher combi-Needler and the Eversor Assassin's gun.

Also simple head swaps can make a big difference. On my second Primus I used a spare 3rd generation Neophyte head and turned it the opposite direction of the head on the official model. It makes it look like he is smugly challenging his opponent to a duel rather than posed to charge forward.

oem0909 wrote:Hey there! Started collecting GSC not a long ago and finally making some progress. Having problems with Thousand Sons player, and looking for some tips and list building ideas.. I know codex is on the way and many things might change.

Welcome! Could you provide your list and what models you have available? It is hard to give specific advice without knowing what you have to work with.

One thing that might help a bit on the psyker side of things, the Magus' Spiritual Leader ability allows friendly GSC units (including vehicles) within range to deny the witch as though they were psykers if they are directly targeted by an enemy psychic power. With careful positioning you should be able to insure that the majority of your units have the potential to deny powers which will take some of the burden off the Magus. They can still focus spells against a single unit, but the first deny attempt is basically free.

Kanluwen wrote:As a heads up, it looks like "City of Traps" might be more than just an Echoes of War/Mission Specific thing.

It modifies the Cult Ambush table for two of its results.

I don't think so. If you look at the fluff text before the rules regarding how to use the table it mentions the setting of Tooth and Claw specifically along with the Cult of the Thirsting Wyrm and Space Wolves specifically. If it were something intended for wider use I'd assume they would use something more generic (like the descriptions for Cult Ambush results).

That said, there is nothing preventing the use of the rules if both players agree. I think they would be great for Stronghold Assault missions with GSC defenders.

Hey folks, so I'm having an army building problem:

I want to run GSC, but feel like I either end up with Tyranids + a little gsc, or IG + a little gsc. (Or, IG + Tyranids with a patrol of gsc).

My issue is, as I assess units i look for "who does X better than my other options?"

Right now I feel like Tyranids have "better" options than GSC when it comes to... most everything (horde killers elite killers, durable midfield, artillary, anti tank etc) for the points cost.

Can someone highlight to me what they think GSC can do better than IG or Nids?

(Side note: drills, and rock saws have caught my eye as cool... but on easily disposed bodies).

weaver9 wrote:

Right now I feel like Tyranids have "better" options than GSC when it comes to... most everything (horde killers elite killers, durable midfield, artillary, anti tank etc) for the points cost.

Can someone highlight to me what they think GSC can do better than IG or Nids?

From my experience GSC is better at assault overall compared to Tyranids due to superior weapon skill values (3+ minimum, 2+ possible) and vastly superior armor cracking abilities provided by universal rending claws and their special weapons (Rock Saws, Power Hammers, Drills, Cutters, Demolition Charges, etc.). Delivering units to assault is easier for GSC since all infantry come equipped with Cult Ambush at a minimum while their transports are relatively inexpensive and allow their passengers to remain embarked for shelter rather than being forced to disembark upon arrival. Another key advantage is that GSC has easy access to strength buffs for the mass attack units (chiefly Purestrain Genestealers) so they can pull double duty as armor crackers if necessary.

The key difference between the two is that GSC hitting power is concentrated in its infantry while its large models focus on keeping them alive. For Tyranids, most of the hitting power is concentrated in Monsters (with some exceptions - Genestealers and Hive Guard being the standouts) while the infantry work to support and protect them. In a meta built to slay Knights, this is advantageous for GSC and detrimental for Tyranids.

Now compared to Astra Militarum/Imperial Guard, I've found GSC does mechanized infantry slightly better due to Goliath Trucks being open topped, so the squishy infantry can hide in their bunker and still contribute offensively while Guardsmen that are embarked on a Taurox or Chimera are not contributing anything (GSC melee units incidentally love the Chimera, Guardsmen not so much). The industrial vehicles are also slightly more durable against dedicated anti-tank weaponry than most vehicles thanks to Rugged Construction. Lastly, if/when a transport is destroyed GSC infantry can still redeploy using Return to Shadows, so they are not as vulnerable to getting stranded as their Guardsmen counterparts.

Also if nothing else, GSC still does alpha strikes better than just about anyone since Cult Ambush was not effected by the deep strike nerf in the Spring FAQ.