Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

These are pretty lame. Suspicious-Of-GW me feels like someone mapped out one good set of spare weapons, and then spread it out over multiple sets, in hopes that folk will give up and buy the lot. Doesn't feel like there's much utility or value, here.

I feel the same way I felt with the Escher ones: one look at the sets and suddenly I don't want to buy weapon sets no more. If this is what they want to offer (and in resin, no less) I'll make my own stuff, thank you very much.

I'll go one better and say to use the weapons from the IG, Old Weapons, or anything else on any other sprue.

Looks like I have to get my Gear from a Warhammer store, In the states, do they still order stuff through GW stores, and you can pick it up there, o have them send it to your house?

I picked up gang war 2 and a box of Orlocks. Not bad, and the way that the figures are super broken down leads to some Top Tier level models. Each guy is his own load-out, and th figures really look to take well to add ons from any other sprues you have.

I'm happy with the figures, even if some of the rules are a little more extensive then honestly need to be. Seriously, GW, get your head out of your fourth point of Contact and simplify some of this stuff.... You are going to lose people if this trend continues.

Echoing the sentiment of the weapons sets, K.I.S.S. please!!!!

Verdun, and resin bits, and old Tamiya kit load out for 1/35 or 54 mm figures still is your best bet, even now where they make the old technique that much easier.

All in all, Way to Go, GW... I hate to say it, but the figures are really a great improvement from what I ever expected them to develop into.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
But with so many blank hands

These are easily the best feature of this pack. The melta/flamer/HB harness not only looks ace, it showcases the strength of Goliaths in a way better than any slapping of exaggerated muscle on the sculpt ever could. I wish SM had the same one handed gun poses with the other hand free/holding a knife, the 'chest grab' thing has gotten really old by now. The design is really nice, too, bolters easily look far more refined than ones SM use, combi-guns look like they actually could work (no teleporting ammo or spent casing windows in dumb places), this set has nice value for a really broad range of conversions!

Though, yeah, I don't get FW fixation on melee weapons, more shotguns/lasguns would be nice too. Maybe they are in the third pack though (yeah, I know...)?

 Irbis wrote:
These are easily the best feature of this pack.

Hands holding nothing is the best feature of the pack?

 Irbis wrote:
The melta/flamer/HB harness not only looks ace, it showcases the strength of Goliaths in a way better than any slapping of exaggerated muscle on the sculpt ever could.

I don't see what that has to do with blank hands...

I wanted some one-handed stubcannons. They'd be nice.

What's up with empty hands? They are useful.

Feed it back, folks.

They've included female sculpts on the Van Saar due to feedback. Seems they would've included it on Goliath and Orlock, but were too far along production to make the change - but they'll get those as Resin expansions.

They're listening. Speak to them.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Feed it back, folks.

They've included female sculpts on the Van Saar due to feedback. Seems they would've included it on Goliath and Orlock, but were too far along production to make the change - but they'll get those as Resin expansions.

They're listening. Speak to them.

Really? Has that been confirmed? Be fantastic if so - the female Orlock ganger artwork in Gand War 2 looked great, and would be a welcome addition.

But I recall them speaking about resin add-on positional packs for Blood Bowl teams that would potentially include female players a whole year ago, and that hasn't borne any fruit (yet...)

Yup. Comment regarding it is on their FB page. Somewhere. Don't think I had the foresight to take a screen grab!

Vorian wrote:
What's up with empty hands? They are useful.

Very true! Empty hands are surprisingly hard to find too.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yup. Comment regarding it is on their FB page. Somewhere. Don't think I had the foresight to take a screen grab!

How long ago was the feed back.

these molds take quite a while to get done.

if these were finished years ago then ima call BS on that.

unless technology has caught up that they can pump these molds out in like months.

Also empty hands are indeed very useful. though personally id rather do full plastic kit bashes anyway.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yup. Comment regarding it is on their FB page. Somewhere. Don't think I had the foresight to take a screen grab!

Awesome sauce! Thank you for the heads up, shall see if I can track it down, ^_^

New models don't necessarily take years to go from concept to model - Sisters of Battle are looking to be made end of this year for release next year -so that suggests a 12 month or less turn around time. Many a KS group has, with much smaller teams, made multiple models and moulds in well under a year

A lot will also depend on size and complexity of the model and experience of the model designer. Other things like additional projects and workload will also come into play as will a likely few chokepoints like design meetings or how many staff are trained in parting models for the moulds as well as testing of the moulds etc...

That said I would expect GW to measure new models in months not years when it comes to actual design to production and if its the focus of a person or team. What might stretch out releases is fitting them into existing release time frames; other projects; workload etc.... Ergo its likely that with GW the greatest slowdown is other work and other releases already scheduled.

I'm super excited for the empty hands. I don't always want my models clutching something all the time.

 Desubot wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yup. Comment regarding it is on their FB page. Somewhere. Don't think I had the foresight to take a screen grab!

How long ago was the feed back.
these molds take quite a while to get done.
if these were finished years ago then ima call BS on that.
unless technology has caught up that they can pump these molds out in like months.
Also empty hands are indeed very useful. though personally id rather do full plastic kit bashes anyway.

It doesn't take months to create the model or to go from model to mould, never has.

What does take months is finding a production slot. That's always been a problem for GW because they have so many moulds and relatively few machines. (remember that you lose a day's production switching moulds and setting up the machine for the new one) That's what delayed Eldar jetbikes (just for example) for so long.

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yup. Comment regarding it is on their FB page. Somewhere. Don't think I had the foresight to take a screen grab!

How long ago was the feed back.
these molds take quite a while to get done.
if these were finished years ago then ima call BS on that.
unless technology has caught up that they can pump these molds out in like months.
Also empty hands are indeed very useful. though personally id rather do full plastic kit bashes anyway.

It doesn't take months to create the model or to go from model to mould, never has.

What does take months is finding a production slot. That's always been a problem for GW because they have so many moulds and relatively few machines. (remember that you lose a day's production switching moulds and setting up the machine for the new one) That's what delayed Eldar jetbikes (just for example) for so long.

ah i always assumed they just took a while or was already done years ago.

recalling how some "recent" kits was dated a year backwards when it was released (on the spure it self)

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Irbis wrote:
These are easily the best feature of this pack.

Hands holding nothing is the best feature of the pack?

Yes. Look at Deathwatch, they look amazing next to other SM as they finally learned to not chest clutch their bolters. It makes for some really nice poses, but then you run into dumb problem of DW sprue not having enough empty hands (or anything, really, besides power swords) for the other arm. Having that in the pack naturally, without hassle of combing through bit sites (or fishing for leftover left hands in SM kits with chest clutch problem and trying to greenstuff them into natural pose), is really saving time and money/effort. I am so sick of painting chest clutchers in stages to make them look any good I'll take any break I can from that.

 Desubot wrote:

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yup. Comment regarding it is on their FB page. Somewhere. Don't think I had the foresight to take a screen grab!

How long ago was the feed back.
these molds take quite a while to get done.
if these were finished years ago then ima call BS on that.
unless technology has caught up that they can pump these molds out in like months.
Also empty hands are indeed very useful. though personally id rather do full plastic kit bashes anyway.

It doesn't take months to create the model or to go from model to mould, never has.

What does take months is finding a production slot. That's always been a problem for GW because they have so many moulds and relatively few machines. (remember that you lose a day's production switching moulds and setting up the machine for the new one) That's what delayed Eldar jetbikes (just for example) for so long.

ah i always assumed they just took a while or was already done years ago.

recalling how some "recent" kits was dated a year backwards when it was released (on the spure it self)

There is definitely a situation where moulds are ready but they're just too busy making more of existing models to make something new so the mould sits unused for ages.

Empty hands are useless when the most basic weapon arm (that is actually needed) are missing :right hand stubgun, left hand combi-plasma, right hand shotgun, how about a left hand grenade launcher? Why are all the 1 handed special weapon right?

Are these designers even play the game?

 Irbis wrote:
Yes. Look at Deathwatch, they look amazing next to other SM as they finally learned to not chest clutch their bolters. It makes for some really nice poses, but then you run into dumb problem of DW sprue not having enough empty hands (or anything, really, besides power swords) for the other arm. Having that in the pack naturally, without hassle of combing through bit sites (or fishing for leftover left hands in SM kits with chest clutch problem and trying to greenstuff them into natural pose), is really saving time and money/effort. I am so sick of painting chest clutchers in stages to make them look any good I'll take any break I can from that.

Again, not really talking about "chest clutchers". Talking about hands that don't have any weapons at all. They seem like something that could have been better used for increased variety - more of the basic Necro weapons especially (Las/Stub/Autopistol & Las/Auto/Shotguns)

Do we know when they will be releasing the Orlock alternative weapons? We've seen them, so we know they are made. I'm just patiently waiting for the new weapons to come out before putting my Orlocks together.

Chopstick wrote:
Empty hands are useless when the most basic weapon arm (that is actually needed) are missing :right hand stubgun, left hand combi-plasma, right hand shotgun, how about a left hand grenade launcher? Why are all the 1 handed special weapon right?

Are these designers even play the game?

I'd agree this is the main issue with the pack. Also why are all the 1 handed special weapons in the same basic pose with the barrel pointing towards the floor? Why aren't any of them in aiming poses or with the gun pointing up?

The Escher pack is only slightly better in this regard. They did get right handed Autopistols and Plasma pistols but no right handed combi-bolter or one without the leaders coat sculpted to it. No left handed shock whip or one without the leaders coat. No one handed shotguns or autoguns. No power knife model either. Instead they got an arsenal of hand flamers???

Maybe they feel that the game is balanced with the gangs largely armed with the weapons as they are, and providing a bunch of the 'missing' weapons would lead to power gaming?

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Maybe they feel that the game is balanced with the gangs largely armed with the weapons as they are, and providing a bunch of the 'missing' weapons would lead to power gaming?

I think that's unlikely seeing as the packs have added loads of special and Heavy weapons to the mix while it's the basic weapons and pistols that are largely absent.

From warhammer french forum (google translate)

I have the WD since Tuesday but did not have time and I did not understand some passages.

In short to summarize some points the leader is called "demagogue" and there are 2 types of champion: disciple and sorcerer, the latter can use a power chosen from 5.

The cultists (gangers) have little choice of equipment, those of dark revenge: pisto gunner, shotgun, autogun, machine gun and flamethrower in heavy weapons and for the cac: baton / mass / hammer, flail, sword and the flawless claw found on one of the champions of DV.

In equipment, we find flak armor, respirator and photolunettes. For grenades it's frag and krak.

At the level of primary skills it is "ruse" and "ferocity" for the demagogue, the followers, the specialists and "cunning" and "knowing" for the wizard.

 

In game a cultist can be changed into a child of chaos and skirmish you can buy up to 2 for 130 each.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Maybe they feel that the game is balanced with the gangs largely armed with the weapons as they are, and providing a bunch of the 'missing' weapons would lead to power gaming?

If there's a powergaming concern regarding Lasguns/pistols and autogun/pistols, then failing to allow you to start with them has zero impact. You just take unequipped gangers game 1, then buy the common equipment from the trading post. All you have to do is throw an unequiped juve in the line of fire, then bottle after a single casualty.

Trafalgar Law wrote:


I'd agree this is the main issue with the pack. Also why are all the 1 handed special weapons in the same basic pose with the barrel pointing towards the floor? Why aren't any of them in aiming poses or with the gun pointing up?

Because, like new Necromunda rules themselves, they were done over a lunch break one Friday by digitally copy pasting different guns on existing arm poses.

Looking forward to see the rules here. We'll see a greatly extended Goliath house list. An official bolter (not gangs of legend pdf). And I assume a bunch of random changes to costs and stats.

zamerion wrote:
The cultists (gangers) have little choice of equipment, those of dark revenge: pisto gunner, shotgun, autogun, machine gun and flamethrower in heavy weapons and for the cac: baton / mass / hammer, flail, sword and the flawless claw found on one of the champions of DV.

And no model/no rule hits Necromunda. Hard.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

zamerion wrote:
The cultists (gangers) have little choice of equipment, those of dark revenge: pisto gunner, shotgun, autogun, machine gun and flamethrower in heavy weapons and for the cac: baton / mass / hammer, flail, sword and the flawless claw found on one of the champions of DV.

And no model/no rule hits Necromunda. Hard.

Rumour is that the WD gang is a get you by list, and a more fulsome chaos gang will come later.