Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

tbh was looking at Singularity Generators as would be better for mowing down screens while its charging up the board to charge the nasty targets.

But for its points, would not leave the shelf outside casual games.

Think who ever play tests necrons, just hates the army as nothing rules wise seems to go our way really

moonsmite wrote:
tbh was looking at Singularity Generators as would be better for mowing down screens while its charging up the board to charge the nasty targets.

But for its points, would not leave the shelf outside casual games.

Think who ever play tests necrons, just hates the army as nothing rules wise seems to go our way really

Wouldn't the 11 shots from other config be better chaff clearer than 6 from singularity generators?

And hey necrons have it good. That might be bad but it's still miles ahead of stompa AND costs only 66% of it.

I like the rules quite a lot, but as previously mentioned, most of it's targets will have at least 4+ inv saves and only having a 5+ inv itself doesn't help.

It's probably about 100 points over costed though, what a suprise

moonsmite wrote:
So what are peoples thoughts on this?

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/PDF/Downloads//Forgeworld_Necron_Seraptek_Datasheet.pdf

find it fairly meh, but want it to decide how i feel

I love it, M16 fall back, shoot and charge sounds like so much fun. The 3D6" explosion on a 6 is baller, could be amazing against melee armies, they basically have to give it a wide berth.

Is it bad? It's better than two Monoliths and it's less than two Monoliths. Keep in mind the turn 1 advance and charge. Ah gak. Seraptek, still possible on a 9 if your opponent isn't careful, or even easier on some deployment types, M16 IS a ton. Maybe it is worse than two Monoliths. Definitely not something I'd feel bad about bringing to a casual game, whether it'll feel as bad as bringing a Monolith I'll have to see. I'll try and playtest it soon, if it's not too bad I'll buy the real model.

Now do you take 12 S 8 AP -3 Dd6 with 1 and 1/3 mortal wounds or 7 S 6 AP -3 Dd3 with 2/3 of a mortal wound and 4 S 16 AP -4 D6? I'm leaning toward the latter, more split fire is good. Each D3 S 16 AP -4 D6 weapon has a good chance at wrecking a vehicle, pick off a couple of dudes or do a couple of wounds to a vehicle with the smaller shots, against T7 the former probably does more damage, but it being less spread out and the D6 damage makes me think it's likely to boom or bust. Take it as Novokh? In case it loses wounds, it can fall back, then charge and still hit a good amount of times, of course you'd most likely spend 1 CP to function optimally. Fighting twice might make it worth it, then it's like a shooting knight and a melee knight stuck together, just much more fragile. Sautekh is very meh, advancing D6" and getting -1 to hit is not worth it, +1 to hit is neat, but eh. Nihilakh for the ability to go into full dakka mode, eh, more for the Stratagem I think. Nephrekh is full troll mode because it's Seraptek.

The Necron Stratagems are amazing, but they just don't support it enough, the only busted Stratagems it has are Novokh and Nihilakh, those are amazing, but so are Knight Stratagems. Definitely nowhere near competetive. The game needs to change a lot for it to become viable, it really just needs a price reduction. 500 pts like the Vault would make it very viable, 550 is good, 625 is a very hard sell. I still think I'm going to win some games with it, I'll probably have to not warn my opponent about it's movement though. Damn 16, fast lil' bugger.

Lost a game against AM with a quantum shielding spam list, rolled a lot of 1s and 2s, good for the shielding, bad for the damage output. Got shot off the table around turn 4 or 5, having killed most of his infantry, and one of his 8 vehicles. Destroyer Lords took a beating, but when everything in front dies they'll go down eventually. Not amazing, I rolled well enough on their saves they at least survived more than they should. But the fact they did maybe 6 wounds combined just isn't enough to justify them, I'd rather have more shooting. Spyder and Cryptek stayed with my two DDAs while the rest of my list moved forward, opponent ignored them so Spyder and Cryptek were wasted. Rolled badly for DDAs so spending the pts on Spyder and Cryptek for him to ignore them was not worth it. Spyder died very quickly when my opponent eventually felt like it. No healing done.

Won a game against Death Watch with the same list. Lost about a third of my list. Destroyer Lord with Nanoscarab Casket died like a complete chump, 3 wounds from Overwatch, then did two wounds and died to a Captain without getting back up. I was much more aggressive with my DDAs and Spyder. My opponent was at least forced to make the Spyder a priority, so that wasn't bad. Making a little castle and hoping your opponent leaves a vehicle to live isn't an effective use of a Spyder I don't think, it really needs to be able to cover a lot of vehicles at once before it becomes worth it, but even then it's absurdly easy to kill. Not worth the pts in these games. Nightmare Shroud wasn't very good in the first game, it was better in the second game, I'd rather have had the veil of darkness in the former and void scythe in the latter game. Destroyer Lords were the right choice for this army, but nowhere near amazing and the list they are supporting isn't amazing in the first place. Healing a Warrior a turn just isn't worth a Ghost Ark and hiding them inside gives them a little more utility, but I'd rather have had Immortals. Used Sautekh once to Advance and fire once in two games, I'll try it as Mephrit next time.



Played an ITC game against another DW player who was apparently 4/0 so far, having beaten two Knights lists. I was bringing my double Tesseract list so everything was fine. My opponent was a really nice guy so when I forgot about my powers T2 he allowed me to do them... I forgot them again T3 and this time I declined to use them. I won the game easily, I lost a Vault and two DDAs, at least one of them would have lived had I remembered my powers turn 3. This list continues to be amazing. I think I'm going to stick with Sautekh Vaults, the +1 to hit seems more valuable than the +1 to saving throws. I was too focussed on annihilating my opponent, I could have easily gotten more VP, but I just wanted to win the game ASAP. Also need to keep a unit alive for T 5 and T 6.

I think the Seraptek is great. 2 ways to deal flat DMG 6, is a beast in CC, very fast.

Only issue is the pts cost and 5++. If it was 4++ and around 500pts it would be an auto take for the most part.

Best way to play is either have it in the cover with LOSB terrain and using it's gun to pick of models with lots of wounds. OR, equip the other guns, have it go up the baord, shoot and charge into enemy infantry/swarm blobs for protection.

We can also use the stratgem to bring it to it's too bracket so it can do the dmg after soaking some wounds. Might be worth it to bring a spyder and cloaktek for healing.

It can move over infantry and swarm models, do knights do that too or are they still not fixed?

Knights can only move over infantry and swarm when falling back. This thing has some nice rules, but 3+/5++ and 625 pts. is a no go.

Could be cool to build a canoptek army around this thing, with the Nihilakh stratagem save it should be quite fearsome, and it should be able to reach an objective marker with 16" move.

Oh, you get FW rules for free now? That's nice.
As I thought, you do a dedicated AT weapon and a more anti-infantry weapon, with the singularity generator being somewhere in between.

Interesting that is says it may replace the singularity generators with projectors AND Obliterators. That would imply its part of the same weapon.
Edit : Ah, and so it is, according to the store page. I think this might be the optimal weapon configuration for it, especially as if you buy one its one configuration or the other. Unless you want to spend like 50 on the other weapons. Goddammit FW.

You also don't pay extra for the weapons, it seems, which is odd.
I don't see what's wrong wiith 625 poins. Seems reasonable to me.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 p5freak wrote:
Knights can only move over infantry and swarm when falling back. This thing has some nice rules, but 3+/5++ and 625 pts. is a no go.

With T8, 28w, regen and you have other units that can repair it. As well as some nice weapons.
It doesn't look that bad.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

With T8, 28w, regen and you have other units that can repair it. As well as some nice weapons.
It doesn't look that bad.

A knight has T8, W24 and can get 2+/3++, for less than 500 pts. Without ranged weapons the gallant can get 2+/3++ for less than 400 pts.

Hm. It doesn't have the Canoptek keyword. For a second I was hoping it could move, advance, shoot and charge for 1CP.

2 of these and a Gauss Pylon and then... yeah little else.. sounds like some nice Friday fun.

 p5freak wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

With T8, 28w, regen and you have other units that can repair it. As well as some nice weapons.
It doesn't look that bad.

A knight has T8, W24 and can get 2+/3++, for less than 500 pts. Without ranged weapons the gallant can get 2+/3++ for less than 400 pts.

How good are the weapons though? Can they get a S16 gun? For whatever reason, it seems they are pricing the Construct based on that configuration, rather than doing the convenient thing and giving you the usual base model cost + weapon options.
It takes 4 unsaved wounds from that obliterator to kill a knight, and they are going to wound it on 2s at 72" range. How many unsaved wounds would the knight have to inflict on the Construct to destroy it?

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Oh, you get FW rules for free now? That's nice.
As I thought, you do a dedicated AT weapon and a more anti-infantry weapon, with the singularity generator being somewhere in between.

Interesting that is says it may replace the singularity generators with projectors AND Obliterators. That would imply its part of the same weapon.

You also don't pay extra for the weapons, it seems, which is odd.
I don't see what's wrong with 625 poins. Seems reasonable to me.

5 units of Ultramarine Devastators with 4 lascannons each, a Captain and a Lieutenant. That's 900 pts and kills it in one turn, that's a moderately good counter and that's a devastating loss. Then there's a Shadowsword or a Pylon which will kill it for less than 600 pts. It's damage is fine for it's cost, but it's most likely going to die before getting enough damage off to justify it's cost. 3 DDAs is 50% more wounds, worse saves and toughness, but QS, much more survivable against most opponents and same damage output. There are few things that are able to keep up with it as it runs up the table, making it hard to screen against smite. With a good explodes result it'll probably make it's pts back, with a bad one it'll take half your army with it as it dies T1.

Being the only wholly positive guy about this new thing you'll be laughing when it turns out to be meta, but I doubt it.

Why would you run it up the table though? It has 72" range. There is little reason to move it anywhere. And even if you do move it, you don't have to move it its full distance.
Shadow Swords and Pylons are designed to kill units like that, so yeah, of course its an efficient counter.
Try hiding it. Yes, its big, but if you don't have large LOS blockers you aren't playing 40k right.

Yes, 25 devastators could probably kill a construct in 1 turn. Provided they all have line of sight and the first turn. What about the 275 pts of other necron models too? For that I can take 5 destroyers, and use them to kill some devastators.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Why would you run it up the table though? It has 72" range. There is little reason to move it anywhere.
Shadow Swords and Pylons are designed to kill units like that, so yeah, of course its an efficient counter.
Try hiding it. Yes, its big, but if you don't have large LOS blockers you aren't playing 40k right.

shoot a tank first first, then smash up two more in a parking lot in CC

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Why would you run it up the table though? It has 72" range. There is little reason to move it anywhere.
t.

because when it blows ... it's taking half your army with it ... you want it 12" away from all your toys

Also ... 18 stomps ...with Novokh re-rolls (and more hits on 6's if you're brave to put the warlord up there with it) and a 16" movement ... yeah ... it needs to be in the enemy face asap

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Try hiding it. Yes, its big, but if you don't have large LOS blockers you aren't playing 40k right.

because if it's well hidden enough to get cover .. then the enemy is also able to deny you 625 points of your killing potential

Reanimation_Protocol wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Why would you run it up the table though? It has 72" range. There is little reason to move it anywhere.
t.

because when it blows ... it's taking half your army with it ... you want it 12" away from all your toys

Also ... 18 stomps ...with Novokh re-rolls (and more hits on 6's if you're brave to put the warlord up there with it) and a 16" movement ... yeah ... it needs to be in the enemy face asap

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Try hiding it. Yes, its big, but if you don't have large LOS blockers you aren't playing 40k right.

because if it's well hidden enough to get cover .. then the enemy is also able to deny you 625 points of your killing potential

You can move, you know? Hiding is to stop it from being destroyed on the first turn. On your turn you can move it out and try to eliminate or cripple a threat with the support of your army.
As it doesn't suffer hit penalties from moving, there is no reason not to do that.

You wont get far with the stupid movement rules of 40k. Even the tiniest piece of terrain will cost you movement. A piece of terrain that is both 1" tall and wide will cost you 3" to move over it. If you hide inside a ruin your 16" move will barely get you out of it.

I think it's priced fairly well, I don't want to see Forgeworld Titans coming out and dominating the meta.

Its offense is much better than its defense, which means it's not going to be a tournament favorite due to the possibility of being blown up on turn 1. It can do some serious damage though with all the flat 6's and mortal wound explosion. This is how forge world units should be: great potential damage, so that you can have some fun games stomping face with your fancy model, but too inconsistent to be showing up in all the tournaments.

You wont get far with the stupid movement rules of 40k. Even the tiniest piece of terrain will cost you movement. A piece of terrain that is both 1" tall and wide will cost you 3" to move over it. If you hide inside a ruin your 16" move will barely get you out of it.

Nobody in the real world is going to tell you to take 3" off your big spider walkers movement because of a bit of debris.

Let’s not be a bunch of Debbie-downers. At least we finally have a large walker option. This thing is awesome!

It won’t likely be competitive, but neither is the rest of our army (which might be contributing to its unplayabiity as well!), so who cares?

I almost missed the whole "Replace Singularity Generators with Synaptic Obliterators and Transdimensional Projectors" part

Things got a solid amount of dakka in either case. Really Really high AP, and solid damage output. Could it be run Nihiliak for the save boosting strategem, paired with "Take Cover Beta Strategem to functionally give it 1+ Armor Save turn 1 to help keep it safe vs anti vehicle fire?

I WANT to run this thing, but that points (and USD) price tag scares me. i want to have a plan for it before i buy.

Cant get cover from going second strat as its titanic

Aw shucks. You're right. Never mind.

Also that new strat doesn't stack with cover anyway.

To get the most out of this thing you probably want to go Nihilak, and take the Deceiver.

It's durability is it's biggest weakness, so the Nihilak strat will be the biggest benefit. The Deceiver lets you redeploy it after you see where your opponents guns are, which also helps improve it's chances of surviving the first turn. Bit of an expensive investment though.

 iGuy91 wrote:
I almost missed the whole "Replace Singularity Generators with Synaptic Obliterators and Transdimensional Projectors" part

Things got a solid amount of dakka in either case. Really Really high AP, and solid damage output. Could it be run Nihiliak for the save boosting strategem, paired with "Take Cover Beta Strategem to functionally give it 1+ Armor Save turn 1 to help keep it safe vs anti vehicle fire?

I WANT to run this thing, but that points (and USD) price tag scares me. i want to have a plan for it before i buy.

You can run it in a Supreme or Heavy Aux detachment for dynasty benefits.

It's best ran in Nihilakh or Novokh. Novokh because you can make it go from 18 S8 -2 d D3 to 36 s8 -2 d D3 attacks. Or, 6 S16 -4 d 6 to 12 S16 -4 db6 for the cost of 3CP.

Oddly enough, it does more DMG in CC than shooting. So, like all Canoptek stuff, it's built for CC and the guns are secondary. Singularity Generator is better for deleting basically anything from a far while also being your Deployment zone defender if you get Deepstriked by the opponent because of it's 18 S8 -2 d D3 attacks. Or, you can run the S. obliterators + T.Projectors and have it walk up the filed soaking up dmg while laying out a respectable amount of dakka.

We could run it in a Heavy Aux w/ Construct, 2 Vaults + Supreme com. Of 2 D Lord's, Cloaktek and Deceiver. Cloaktek to heal the Construct, Construct w/ Singularity Generators for anti- tank/Mortation/Magnus, vaults for C'tan MWs, 24 Tesla shoots, Deceiver to move stuff around and D Lord's for some CC up front or to help the Construct in CC. Not that it needs it.

To be fair, was thinking the deceiver was needed. set it up as if going first, then change if need to hide

However good it is, it looks super fun. Running it headlong at the enemy on a 16 INCH move (that's potentially a t1 charge there) to be an enormous distraction as well as doing heaps of damage. It looks like, if used correctly, could be really really good.

That explosion? Oh boyyyyyyy

 p5freak wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

With T8, 28w, regen and you have other units that can repair it. As well as some nice weapons.
It doesn't look that bad.

A knight has T8, W24 and can get 2+/3++, for less than 500 pts. Without ranged weapons the gallant can get 2+/3++ for less than 400 pts.

But ony 1 knight. Strategems etc aren't part of prices. Knight is same with less wounds.

(And nevermind stompa that is softer, shoot less and costs 50% more. Oh and slower


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 p5freak wrote:
You wont get far with the stupid movement rules of 40k. Even the tiniest piece of terrain will cost you movement. A piece of terrain that is both 1" tall and wide will cost you 3" to move over it. If you hide inside a ruin your 16" move will barely get you out of it.

Well 2" less. You don't need to cover it at once. 1" up, 1" down. 1" wide you would be going forward anyway

 iGuy91 wrote:
I almost missed the whole "Replace Singularity Generators with Synaptic Obliterators and Transdimensional Projectors" part

Things got a solid amount of dakka in either case. Really Really high AP, and solid damage output. Could it be run Nihiliak for the save boosting strategem, paired with "Take Cover Beta Strategem to functionally give it 1+ Armor Save turn 1 to help keep it safe vs anti vehicle fire?

I WANT to run this thing, but that points (and USD) price tag scares me. i want to have a plan for it before i buy.

Nihilakh stratagem is end of turn

 iGuy91 wrote:
Aw shucks. You're right. Never mind.

Its ok, most things that want to kill Titanic units don't really care about 2+ saves that much anyway. Its why you have an invul.
You're better off trying to hide it to completely negate shooting.