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2018/05/05 23:10:26
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Don't quite see destroyers working with nephrekh. But then again, destroyers don't really work that well with most dynasty traits.
Sautekh doesn't really do anything for them, as they rarely have to advance to get into range and they already ignore heavy weapon penalties.
Nihilakh is just useless. They already reroll 1s.
You always want to shoot, so the advance buff from nephrekh is pointless.
Mephrit is nice, but they have to be close to use it. Usually you don't want your destroyers close, unless you are sure they will survive.
Same problem with novokh. You rarely want to charge with them unless you are certain you can win. They do get 2 attacks though, so they sort of benefit from the rerolls.
That said, novokh, sautekh, and mephrit are probably the best choices for them, as they do get mileage out of the traits. Just not as much as you'd think.
Destroyers are weird in that they are strong by themselves, but they don't synergize with traits that well even though they can take them. Sort of like triarch units, except they can actually benefit from buffs and strats.
You'd think there would be a dynastic trait that destroyers would love, but nope. Maybe they will release an outcast supplement that covers flayed one dynasties, destroyer dynasties, and the Empire of the Severed. I doubt it though.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/05 23:14:02
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2018/05/05 23:11:29
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Nagerash wrote:The ccb can take the VoD, but why would you take the destroyers with you? The destroyers can't really support the ccb if he want to go slice up some dudes, and he does need support. And if you want to go off killing things he really needs a 4++ as I don't think his QS alone will keep him alive against a lot of enemies.
The idea was to alpha strike if necessary, or fallback to a safe position. The CCB can keep up with the destroyers, and it can buff them if i run out of CP. The CCB supports the destroyers, not the other way around.
Nagerash wrote:
I also don't think the destroyers or ccb need the VoD the most as they have a high movement to get in range already.
24" weapon range isnt much.
Xachariah wrote:
- Swap the CCB to your outrider detachment, and give the CCB Lightning Field instead. CCBs are actually solid in close combat with a field and can support instead of being 85 point Crimson Haze totems.
Why a novokh CCB ? It only has three attacks, hitting on 2s. Its unlikely i will have any missed hit rolls, no real benefit from novokh. It cant buff scarabs or wraiths with WOC. Neither is INFANTRY. It can buff the destroyers with WOC, but isnt sautekh better for the CCB and destroyers ?
Nagerash wrote:
- Swap your destroyers to outrider too so the CCB has something to support and replace out the heavy destroyer with a normal destroyer. (Yes, if they're using extermination protocols it's not as efficient, but it's better than nothing.)
Ok, i will replace the heavy destroyer with a normal one. But why novokh destroyers ? I dont see any sense in that, destroyers arent CC units. As sautekh they can advance and still fire.
Nagerash wrote:
- Add in a 3xWraith group. To pay for this, remove the excess cryptek, 1 of the scarab groups, and a single immortal for points. (Note, you can't have 4 selections of scarabs under new FAQ anyways)
Good Idea, i will add 3 wraith. The max 3 same datasheet rule is only a suggestion, though. Its not an official rule. Its up to the TO if he wants to use it, or not.
Nagerash wrote:
- Plan on using CP to buy Veil with your Overlord, so you can get a squad of immortals into the fight.
The plan for the overlord was to buff the two 10 model units of immortals with MWBD (phaerons will) and use the MD stratagem to get exploding 4+ with tesla. If the overlord takes one immortal unit with him he cant do that anymore.
Nagerash wrote:
As for the less constructive part of my comment... why pick up necrons to focus so much on Novokh?
You told me to move the destroyers to the outrider, which adds 300 points to the detachment, and now you ask me why i focus so much on novokh ?
Nagerash wrote:
For a 423 point detachment, you get 108 attacks, that with Novokh and crimson haze translate to 54+27+20.25 =~101 hits at S3 AP0 D1. All of that can't even kill a unit of Destroyers or Tomb Blades... or a LRBT. Or an ork Boyz squad.
Orks will do well over double that at better BS and toughness.
Hell, imperial guard infantry squads with character support can do that without orders, AND double that with orders, AND can shoot while doing it. With a better save profile. And it's not like it's melee guardsmen are great build sweeping tournaments or anything.
I just don't get why you'd come to necrons to build into our weaknesses. Why not a nice Tesseract Vault list instead or something?
Are you saying novokh is not worth playing ? Is tesla exploding on 4+ a necron weakness ? Scarabs are useless ? Should i drop everything and play a 3 tesseract vault list ?
2018/05/06 00:56:29
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Don't quite see destroyers working with nephrekh. But then again, destroyers don't really work that well with most dynasty traits.
Sautekh doesn't really do anything for them, as they rarely have to advance to get into range and they already ignore heavy weapon penalties.
Nihilakh is just useless. They already reroll 1s.
You always want to shoot, so the advance buff from nephrekh is pointless.
Mephrit is nice, but they have to be close to use it. Usually you don't want your destroyers close, unless you are sure they will survive.
Same problem with novokh. You rarely want to charge with them unless you are certain you can win. They do get 2 attacks though, so they sort of benefit from the rerolls.
That said, novokh, sautekh, and mephrit are probably the best choices for them, as they do get mileage out of the traits. Just not as much as you'd think.
Destroyers are weird in that they are strong by themselves, but they don't synergize with traits that well even though they can take them. Sort of like triarch units, except they can actually benefit from buffs and strats.
You'd think there would be a dynastic trait that destroyers would love, but nope.
Maybe they will release an outcast supplement that covers flayed one dynasties, destroyer dynasties, and the Empire of the Severed. I doubt it though.
Are you honestly being serious right now? Destroyers LOVE the Nephrekh Dynasty, not because of the Code, but because it gives them access to Translocation Crypt. Being able to DS protects your Destoryers from first turn attacks, guarantees that they will get at least one turn of shooting, and gives them positioning advantages. Nephrekh is undoubtedly the best Dynasty for them, and not because it is the best of the worse, but because their Stratagem makes Destoryers far more threatening and efficient.
Also, Battalions went from 3 CP to 5 CP, not 6 to 8. I think you are accidentally adding on the default 3 CP every list gets for being battle-forged.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/06 01:18:21
2018/05/06 01:14:56
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Why a novokh CCB ? It only has three attacks, hitting on 2s. Its unlikely i will have any missed hit rolls, no real benefit from novokh. It cant buff scarabs or wraiths with WOC. Neither is INFANTRY. It can buff the destroyers with WOC, but isnt sautekh better for the CCB and destroyers ?
Ok, i will replace the heavy destroyer with a normal one. But why novokh destroyers ? I dont see any sense in that, destroyers arent CC units. As sautekh they can advance and still fire.
Good Idea, i will add 3 wraith. The max 3 same datasheet rule is only a suggestion, though. Its not an official rule. Its up to the TO if he wants to use it, or not.
The plan for the overlord was to buff the two 10 model units of immortals with MWBD (phaerons will) and use the MD stratagem to get exploding 4+ with tesla. If the overlord takes one immortal unit with him he cant do that anymore.
You told me to move the destroyers to the outrider, which adds 300 points to the detachment, and now you ask me why i focus so much on novokh ?
Are you saying novokh is not worth playing ? Is tesla exploding on 4+ a necron weakness ? Scarabs are useless ? Should i drop everything and play a 3 tesseract vault list ?
My extended logic on the CCB and Destroyers swapping is that if you're running a non-Novokh Battalion with a Novokh Outrider that's not infantry based, you've got limited options.
- Throw away the HQ slot (basically a cheap cryptek or lord). Least preferred option since it's ~75-85 dead points.
- Slot in a named HQ that can abandon the Novokh group and help your main group (Anrakyr or Szeras). A better option, but they're not necessarily efficient and you need to build around them.
- Put in a fighty HQ alone and hope it does well. Eg, a lone CCB or DLord. It's okayish? But you're wasting their auras.
- Go with an HQ that's useful, then swap in another unit to get the most out of it. Not always an option, but you already had destroyers, and they lose nothing by swapping detachments.
CCB or Destroyer Lords are our efficient options that can also keep up with scarabs/wraiths, which you want to do with your warlord trait. CCBs with lightning field are almost identical efficiency to DLords assuming you spend any time shooting, and are better at buffing if you're using extermination protocols. Also, you presumably already wanted to run one, so better to suggest that. I also think Szeras would go well with your list, but that means changing warlords, which changes the style of the list even more.
The overlord with Veil isn't just for veiling in to shoot things, although that's good too. A veil to steal objectives near endgame works and only needs one squad. A defensive veil lets you absorb a charge then shoot that same turn without falling back. (Note that in the new FAQ, I think RAW veil causes any units that veil to lose the effects of MWBD, but maybe I'm wrong on that interpretation. I'd need to double check.)
As for if Novokh is worth it, I don't think so unless you've got a specific idea in mind of what you're going to do with them, and even those are chancy. Like, 100% novokh list that's wraith heavy and focuses on tying up gunlines and supersaturing threat? It could work, even if it autoloses to eg Orks. Or, multiple squads of Scytheguard coming in on night scythes? I wouldn't want to risk that personally, but I can see a strat built around it that would win some games. But with 420+ points into Novokh scarabs, they don't strike me as a key component of victory.
Necron melee doesn't have the stats, points efficiency, or stratagems to just run at the enemy and hope the dice sort it out.
2018/05/06 01:22:42
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
The overlord with Veil isn't just for veiling in to shoot things, although that's good too. A veil to steal objectives near endgame works and only needs one squad. A defensive veil lets you absorb a charge then shoot that same turn without falling back. (Note that in the new FAQ, I think RAW veil causes any units that veil to lose the effects of MWBD, but maybe I'm wrong on that interpretation. I'd need to double check.)
RAW the FAQ states movement and setup via a strategem removes buffs. Doesnt currently effect relics or abilities. The argument has also been made that MWBD is not a persistent buff as it has a built in duration.
2018/05/06 05:17:54
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
DeChevalier wrote: #1 - I'm struggling with which HQ should be my warlord and what trait I should assign...
#2 - I'm not completely convinced on the Outrider Dynasties, but I'd like to keep at least 2 detachments the same for Cryptek redundancy...
#3 - Do you think the list is viable/competitive?
#1 - If any of your detachments are Sautekh, you should have that HQ be the Warlord so you can take Hyperlogical Strategist. Too valuable not to in my opinion.
#2 - That first Outrider should be Nephrekh. Stick the Sautekh Scarabs in with the Nephrekh ones (yes, it's currently just "recommended" that only three of any units are taken in a list, but if you want to play in competitive scenes it's "recommended" you abide by that restriction so you're ready for it once it actually comes up, which should be almost every tournament bar maybe small store ones).
The Tomb Blades are in an awkward position. I would consider dropping the Mephrit detachment entirely and moving the Scarabs and TBs into the new Nephrekh detachment (making them Tesla. Better to keep them away from charge range if you can help it).
#3 - Maybe? Might be better if you could turn that Spyder into a 3rd DDA. Still a little light on CP comparatively. If you dropped every Cryptek you could probably make the Sautekh HQ Imotekh for an extra added help/surprise.
DeChevalier wrote: #1 - I'm struggling with which HQ should be my warlord and what trait I should assign...
#2 - I'm not completely convinced on the Outrider Dynasties, but I'd like to keep at least 2 detachments the same for Cryptek redundancy...
#3 - Do you think the list is viable/competitive?
#1 - If any of your detachments are Sautekh, you should have that HQ be the Warlord so you can take Hyperlogical Strategist. Too valuable not to in my opinion.
#2 - That first Outrider should be Nephrekh. Stick the Sautekh Scarabs in with the Nephrekh ones (yes, it's currently just "recommended" that only three of any units are taken in a list, but if you want to play in competitive scenes it's "recommended" you abide by that restriction so you're ready for it once it actually comes up, which should be almost every tournament bar maybe small store ones).
The Tomb Blades are in an awkward position. I would consider dropping the Mephrit detachment entirely and moving the Scarabs and TBs into the new Nephrekh detachment (making them Tesla. Better to keep them away from charge range if you can help it).
#3 - Maybe? Might be better if you could turn that Spyder into a 3rd DDA. Still a little light on CP comparatively. If you dropped every Cryptek you could probably make the Sautekh HQ Imotekh for an extra added help/surprise.
(actually, on second consideration I put the TBs into the Sautekh detachment so they could benefit from Methodical Destruction)
That's a pretty good list, but why imotekh? You're waisting his MWBD ability. You could put it on the tomb blades, but then he'd have to keep up with them and you waist your chance to use it twice. The destroyers also don't need it as the already have an OL for that + EP.
- Power corrupts, Absolute power.... is a whole lot of fun...-
2018/05/06 09:05:29
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
(actually, on second consideration I put the TBs into the Sautekh detachment so they could benefit from Methodical Destruction)
That's a pretty good list, but why imotekh? You're waisting his MWBD ability. You could put it on the tomb blades, but then he'd have to keep up with them and you waist your chance to use it twice. The destroyers also don't need it as the already have an OL for that + EP.
I added him simply for the extra 1 CP and the Lightning. He's the easiest way to get the Methodical Destruction train rolling.
(but, no, he can't give the Tomb Blades MWBD as they're not infantry).
Can easily replace him with a Cloak-tek to keep the DDAs repaired or to keep up with the TBs, adding the rest of the freed up points into more Scarabs or upgrading the two 4x Scarabs out for one 4x Wraith unit.
Like so-
Oh right my bad. I didn't have the book with me, and thought imotekh had a special MWBD that could target more but could only target Sautekh Infantry twice.
Why not make the ccb Sautekh/Warlord and give the nephrekh a Lord? The lord could still buff the destroyers and advance to keep up.
Nothing much you can do about only 5 Cp. And with so few Cp the Sautekh trait isn't as good either. Not sure how to fix that without throwing it all overboard and going for a battalion.
- Power corrupts, Absolute power.... is a whole lot of fun...-
2018/05/06 10:11:14
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Don't quite see destroyers working with nephrekh. But then again, destroyers don't really work that well with most dynasty traits.
Sautekh doesn't really do anything for them, as they rarely have to advance to get into range and they already ignore heavy weapon penalties.
Nihilakh is just useless. They already reroll 1s.
You always want to shoot, so the advance buff from nephrekh is pointless.
Mephrit is nice, but they have to be close to use it. Usually you don't want your destroyers close, unless you are sure they will survive.
Same problem with novokh. You rarely want to charge with them unless you are certain you can win. They do get 2 attacks though, so they sort of benefit from the rerolls.
That said, novokh, sautekh, and mephrit are probably the best choices for them, as they do get mileage out of the traits. Just not as much as you'd think.
Destroyers are weird in that they are strong by themselves, but they don't synergize with traits that well even though they can take them. Sort of like triarch units, except they can actually benefit from buffs and strats.
You'd think there would be a dynastic trait that destroyers would love, but nope. Maybe they will release an outcast supplement that covers flayed one dynasties, destroyer dynasties, and the Empire of the Severed. I doubt it though.
Are you honestly being serious right now? Destroyers LOVE the Nephrekh Dynasty, not because of the Code, but because it gives them access to Translocation Crypt. Being able to DS protects your Destoryers from first turn attacks, guarantees that they will get at least one turn of shooting, and gives them positioning advantages. Nephrekh is undoubtedly the best Dynasty for them, and not because it is the best of the worse, but because their Stratagem makes Destoryers far more threatening and efficient.
Also, Battalions went from 3 CP to 5 CP, not 6 to 8. I think you are accidentally adding on the default 3 CP every list gets for being battle-forged.
Is there anything that doesn't like the crypt? Its a strong stratagem that's locked to a specific dynasty. If it weren't dynasty specific destroyers wouldn't fit at all, as the trait doesn't work that well on them. I really dislike that decision, as you'd think that every dynasty would have access to such teleportation tech. Nephrekh probably has the best relic weapon too.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/05/06 13:04:29
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2018/05/06 12:59:13
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Nagerash wrote: Nothing much you can do about only 5 Cp. And with so few Cp the Sautekh trait isn't as good either. Not sure how to fix that without throwing it all overboard and going for a battalion.
That's just the point: it IS probably better to go with the Battalion.
Gonna come down to which you value more, having more CP to use on vital strategems or not paying the troop+extra HQ tax so you can spend points on more of the toys you actually want to take.
2018/05/06 14:19:59
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
DeChevalier wrote: I posted this list over in Army Lists, but it would seem most of the Great Phaerons hang out here... and I'd like your opinions/constructive critiques.
#1 - I'm struggling with which HQ should be my warlord and what trait I should assign...
#2 - I'm not completely convinced on the Outrider Dynasties, but I'd like to keep at least 2 detachments the same for Cryptek redundancy...
#3 - Do you think the list is viable/competitive?
Salut ami!
Many things:
1- Get a bataillon. 3X 5 immortals is cheap. Gives 5 CP. Throw in your DDA in it, remove the spider.
2- Mephrit? Only good with rapid fire stuff, else you want to keep your range at a maximum to avoid being charged. Warriors, Ghost arks, even Monoliths. Not good on destroyers (ap-3 is good enough anyway). Destroyers are good sautekh or nephrek to deepstrike.
3- Same with tomb blade. Mephrit can be good in that configuration, sautekh would give you a better chance to advance and shoot on your first turn.
4- Scarab LOVES nephrek. Advance 6'', stratagem to charge still, stratagem to blow one up for D3 MW. I assure you, your opponent will waste the next turn focussing on your scarabs, and the rest of your army is free. Cheap distraction.
2018/05/06 14:40:10
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Yeah, ghost arks with mephrit are pretty good. That single vehicle can churn out a surprising number of shots. Remember that due to the removal facings you can always fire the max number of shots. You can also do that with DDA, but you'd don't want to move much with them. Makes for a great deterrent though.
Mephrit is good on destroyer though. -4 ap is enough to completely remove 3+ and downgrade 2+ into 6+. The problem is that you have to get close, which is risky. Unless you are finishing off an isolated unit, that is.
In theory, I can see nephrekh working well with particle tomb blades. You don't have to worry about the hit penalty like with telsa, as the modifier doesn't remove anything special. The reason I don't like advancing with tesla is because a lot of tesla's strength comes from proccing the extra hits. If you advance you can't do that unless you have an overlord nearby. You don't have to worry about that with particle weapons, as they are just pure damage. No gimmicks, just a High strength, high rof assault weapon.
You know, at first I had misgivings about using the advance and charge strat on scarabs, but comboing it with the kamikaze strat does sound hilarious. Its only 2 CP to pull off, which is pretty cheap for what it can do.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2018/05/06 14:46:58
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2018/05/06 16:38:30
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
punisher357 wrote: I think with mephrit you need to be heavy in tesla due to the mephrit stratagem....i think it's called methodical destruction?
You move, advance, and fire the tesla weapons until you get in half range. Then you pop the stratagem.
Mephrit's strat is Talent For Annihilation. Yes, it works best with Tesla, as every 6 to hit will generate extra Tesla hits AND give you a bonus dice to roll, which if results in a 6, will give you MORE Tesla bonus hits (but no extra Talent For Annihilation dice that time). The downside being it only works on one unit at a time so you've gotta use it on something that puts out a lot of shots (highest being a unit of 9 Tesla Tomb Blades, which will be rolling a whopping 36 dice when shooting. That should give you a pretty decent number of 6s)
2018/05/06 17:01:03
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
punisher357 wrote: I think with mephrit you need to be heavy in tesla due to the mephrit stratagem....i think it's called methodical destruction?
You move, advance, and fire the tesla weapons until you get in half range. Then you pop the stratagem.
Mephrit's strat is Talent For Annihilation. Yes, it works best with Tesla, as every 6 to hit will generate extra Tesla hits AND give you a bonus dice to roll, which if results in a 6, will give you MORE Tesla bonus hits (but no extra Talent For Annihilation dice that time). The downside being it only works on one unit at a time so you've gotta use it on something that puts out a lot of shots (highest being a unit of 9 Tesla Tomb Blades, which will be rolling a whopping 36 dice when shooting. That should give you a pretty decent number of 6s)
It Will increase damage output by 1/6 regardless of Tesla. Play it on a unit that needs to increase damage, knowing that Tesla isn't part of the equation.
2018/05/06 17:02:14
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Mephrit works just as well with Gauss, though. The extra -1 AP can take even Warriors from being a threat to being an outright menace. I managed to table a custodes army at my league night last week mostly using a Warrior blob supported by a Ghost Ark.
2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress 2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
2018/05/06 17:05:22
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
punisher357 wrote: I think with mephrit you need to be heavy in tesla due to the mephrit stratagem....i think it's called methodical destruction?
You move, advance, and fire the tesla weapons until you get in half range. Then you pop the stratagem.
Mephrit's strat is Talent For Annihilation. Yes, it works best with Tesla, as every 6 to hit will generate extra Tesla hits AND give you a bonus dice to roll, which if results in a 6, will give you MORE Tesla bonus hits (but no extra Talent For Annihilation dice that time). The downside being it only works on one unit at a time so you've gotta use it on something that puts out a lot of shots (highest being a unit of 9 Tesla Tomb Blades, which will be rolling a whopping 36 dice when shooting. That should give you a pretty decent number of 6s)
I always get those 2 confused.
Immortals will work well for the strat also. It's okay that it only works for a single unit. You have mwbd for the immortals which will make them more effective. You can also supplement with gauss weapons
2018/05/06 17:39:08
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
The extra hit isn't more likely to become a new six just because it came from a six.
If you need to kill a tank, use it on the DDA instead, if you need to kill something medium T, use it on the destroyers
If you roll enough dice, you are likely to get a 6. Especially if you buff it with MWBD. A max squad of carbine immortals +MWBD + Talent can cause quite a few extra hits.
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2018/05/06 18:35:54
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
The extra hit isn't more likely to become a new six just because it came from a six.
If you need to kill a tank, use it on the DDA instead, if you need to kill something medium T, use it on the destroyers
If you roll enough dice, you are likely to get a 6. Especially if you buff it with MWBD. A max squad of carbine immortals +MWBD + Talent can cause quite a few extra hits.
Sure, just like any other unit is likely to hit or miss with whatever BS it has.
You're still just increasing your damage output by 1/6. That happens to any unit, with or without tesla. Tesla doesn'αΊ— make the stratagem stronger and the stratagem doesn't make tesla stronger. The stratagem makes any unit 1/6 stronger regardless of tesla weapons in it.
Some extra math:
3 hits is a 1/6 increase on 18
2 hits is a 1/6 increase on 12
Sure Immortals score 3 additional hits where 9 warriors score only 2. But that's because the Immortals are already a very strong unit.
20 warriors in RF in comparison without exploding 6s score 26.7 hits. With exploding 6s they score 31.1 hits, a 4.44 hit upgrade (1/6 of course)
10 immortals score 20 hits, and giving them exploding 6s in addition now scores them 23.333 hits, a 3.33 hit upgrade, (again 1/6).
Thus unless you need S5 at the moment (a different story), the warriors would benefit more than the immortals, just because they had more hits in the first place.
A relative increase in the number of hits, is just that, nothing more. If you start out with more this, then a relative increase (16.7% in this case), buys you more additional hits. Tesla has no part in it, except it makes the buffed unit strong in the first place, but you're still just getting a 1/6 increase.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/06 18:54:23
2018/05/06 21:36:09
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
skoffs wrote: I added him (Imhotekh the Stormlord) simply for the extra 1 CP and the Lightning. He's the easiest way to get the Methodical Destruction train rolling.
I think they changed this in the Necron FAQ.
It changed...
From "Use this Stratagem after a SAUTEKH unit from your army has inflicted an unsaved wound on an enemy unit..."
To "Use this Stratagem after a Sautekh unit from your army has attacked an enemy unit and the attack resulted in the enemy unit losing one or more wounds..."
My read is that now it's been changed to not activate as a result of abilities, and to only trigger on attacks. Since Imhotekh is our only ability that does damage (or lightning field I guess) during a shooting/fight phase, it seems like the change was to stop this synergy specifically.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/06 21:38:36
2018/05/06 22:11:04
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
skoffs wrote: I added him (Imhotekh the Stormlord) simply for the extra 1 CP and the Lightning. He's the easiest way to get the Methodical Destruction train rolling.
I think they changed this in the Necron FAQ.
It changed...
From "Use this Stratagem after a SAUTEKH unit from your army has inflicted an unsaved wound on an enemy unit..."
To "Use this Stratagem after a Sautekh unit from your army has attacked an enemy unit and the attack resulted in the enemy unit losing one or more wounds..."
My read is that now it's been changed to not activate as a result of abilities, and to only trigger on attacks. Since Imhotekh is our only ability that does damage (or lightning field I guess) during a shooting/fight phase, it seems like the change was to stop this synergy specifically.
It would make just as much sense to change the wording because it might not be clear if a mortal wound is "unsaved", since there was never any save attempt in the first place.
Nowhere in the rules does it say that "attack" is the specific action of shooting or swinging a weapon, and not using an ability or in other ways hurt your enemy.
2018/05/06 23:01:50
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
It changed...
From "Use this Stratagem after a SAUTEKH unit from your army has inflicted an unsaved wound on an enemy unit..."
To "Use this Stratagem after a Sautekh unit from your army has attacked an enemy unit and the attack resulted in the enemy unit losing one or more wounds..."
My read is that now it's been changed to not activate as a result of abilities, and to only trigger on attacks. Since Imhotekh is our only ability that does damage (or lightning field I guess) during a shooting/fight phase, it seems like the change was to stop this synergy specifically.
You are adding a meaning to the word 'attack' that is not backed up by any rules in the BRB.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/05/06 23:16:32
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2018/05/06 23:11:00
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
skoffs wrote: I added him (Imhotekh the Stormlord) simply for the extra 1 CP and the Lightning. He's the easiest way to get the Methodical Destruction train rolling.
I think they changed this in the Necron FAQ.
It changed...
From "Use this Stratagem after a SAUTEKH unit from your army has inflicted an unsaved wound on an enemy unit..."
To "Use this Stratagem after a Sautekh unit from your army has attacked an enemy unit and the attack resulted in the enemy unit losing one or more wounds..."
My read is that now it's been changed to not activate as a result of abilities, and to only trigger on attacks. Since Imhotekh is our only ability that does damage (or lightning field I guess) during a shooting/fight phase, it seems like the change was to stop this synergy specifically.
It would make just as much sense to change the wording because it might not be clear if a mortal wound is "unsaved", since there was never any save attempt in the first place.
Nowhere in the rules does it say that "attack" is the specific action of shooting or swinging a weapon, and not using an ability or in other ways hurt your enemy.
I definitely agree. It was a rule that made Mortal wounds sound like they didn't qualify because no save was rolled
2018/05/06 23:24:25
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Attack is referenced 74 times in the BRB core rules that steps through how to play, and each time is in reference to rolls that use BS, WS, or are overwatch, and never referenced for other abilities. But since they don't define it explicitly in the BRB, be can't know what an "attack" means.
By this sort of logic, Nemersor Zahndrekh's Counter Tactics ability does absolutely nothing because 'aura ability' isn't defined anywhere.
2018/05/06 23:28:09
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
I don't see how the stormlord's ability isn't also an attack. Doesn't he attack an enemy with that power? Where does it say it only applies to swords and guns?
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