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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:17:38
Subject: Re:US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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This is a view on how things started in 1933 in a certain country. It's definitely worth a read as a comparison to todays events.
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1008724417470521344.html
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"Because while the truncheon may be used in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth. And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there? Cruelty and injustice, intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror. " - V
I've just supported the Permanent European Union Citizenship initiative. Please do the same and spread the word!
"It's not a problem if you don't look up." - Dakka's approach to politics |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:22:51
Subject: US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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NinthMusketeer wrote: cuda1179 wrote: sebster wrote:[
Anyhow, I don't agree it's worse, but I guess it doesn't really matter which recent acts by GW Bush or Trump were objectively greater breaches of human rights. Jesus, what a conversation.
Hey, I think you missed a President in there that had a history of human rights violations. Obama's policy of drone striking the Hell out of anything that moves, and targeting even American citizens abroad without due process is also pretty heinous.
If it wasn't you I'd think this was a sarcastic joke.
So, you're saying Obama didn't have his share of human rights violations?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:24:24
Subject: Re:US Politics
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Hey... can we dial it down a bit ya'll? We just got this thing reopened.
As to the splitting the families when caught entering illegally... how likely do you think if Trump were to re-institute the catch & release policy (ie, no more zero tolerance), that traffickers would exploit that even more by buying/kidnapping kids in order to cross the border w/o being detained? Automatically Appended Next Post:
Zero comparison.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:25:17
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:25:22
Subject: US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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NinthMusketeer wrote: nels1031 wrote: d-usa wrote:
You do understand the difference between unaccompanied and accompanied, right?
Yeah, bro.
You do understand the question was : Anyone remember that time Obama built prisons for children, or kept them in cages raise a hand.
, right?
You realize that's a disingenuous argument that entirely dances around the point and amounts to whataboutism defending what's happening, right?
Hey, someone specifically asked for "whataboutism". When they ask for it, don't be shocked when it happens.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:25:25
Subject: US Politics
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Lord of the Fleet
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Really? Tell me, where in that article does Obama suggest that he's a-ok with al-Sisi' actions? I seem to be missing that part reading through it, so.... no, he did not endorse him. Whereas Trump came back from the 'Summit of the Dictators' as some wag at FOX called it with rave reviews of Kim Jung Un and his policies, and then made excuses for him committing crimes that make al-Sisi look like an amateur. And then has suggested American press should be more like North Korean state TV.
There's a very big difference there.
Perhaps you should take off your own colored glasses.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:27:22
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:27:33
Subject: US Politics
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: nels1031 wrote: d-usa wrote:
You do understand the difference between unaccompanied and accompanied, right?
Yeah, bro.
You do understand the question was : Anyone remember that time Obama built prisons for children, or kept them in cages raise a hand.
, right?
You realize that's a disingenuous argument that entirely dances around the point and amounts to whataboutism defending what's happening, right?
Hey, someone specifically asked for "whataboutism". When they ask for it, don't be shocked when it happens.
So you support seperating children from their parents and in the process submitting them to emotional torture that can very well scar them for life. In the name of partisan politics. Good to know that's your quality as a human being.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:30:04
Subject: Re:US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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Oh for the love of God, you know the thread has jumped the shark when someone whips out the Nazi parallels. Disingenuous at best.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:33:17
Subject: US Politics
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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NinthMusketeer wrote: cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: nels1031 wrote: d-usa wrote: You do understand the difference between unaccompanied and accompanied, right? Yeah, bro. You do understand the question was : Anyone remember that time Obama built prisons for children, or kept them in cages raise a hand.
, right?
You realize that's a disingenuous argument that entirely dances around the point and amounts to whataboutism defending what's happening, right? Hey, someone specifically asked for "whataboutism". When they ask for it, don't be shocked when it happens.
So you support seperating children from their parents and in the process submitting them to emotional torture that can very well scar them for life. In the name of partisan politics. Good to know that's your quality as a human being.
NinthMusketeer... how is that any different than citizens breaking the law and gets incarcerated? Who is at fault here? We really have two choices: 1) Have open borders, and the country deals with such ramifications. or 2) Enforce the laws on the books, and potentially separating families...and deal with such ramifications (ie, build better detention center to handle families, adjust laws, etc...).
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:33:38
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:34:09
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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BaronIveagh wrote:
Really? Tell me, where in that article does Obama suggest that he's a-ok with al-Sisi' actions? I seem to be missing that part reading through it, so.... no, he did not endorse him. Whereas Trump came back from the 'Summit of the Dictators' as some wag at FOX called it with rave reviews of Kim Jung Un and his policies, and then made excuses for him committing crimes that make al-Sisi look like an amateur. And then has suggested American press should be more like North Korean state TV.
There's a very big difference there.
Perhaps you should take off your own colored glasses.
I don't think it really matters that Obama said he had "concerns" or whatever. Dude still droned people and supported dictators. You're just falling for a veneer of respectability because Obama looked better in a suit.
whembly wrote:
We really have two choices:
1) Have open borders, and the country deals with such ramifications.
or
2) Enforce the laws on the books, and potentially separating families...and deal with such ramifications (ie, build better detention center to handle families, adjust laws, etc...).
Well, you could pick the one that doesn't involved putting people in concentration camps and traumatising children.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:36:38
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:34:20
Subject: Re:US Politics
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Lord of the Fleet
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whembly wrote:
As to the splitting the families when caught entering illegally... how likely do you think if Trump were to re-institute the catch & release policy (ie, no more zero tolerance), that traffickers would exploit that even more by buying/kidnapping kids in order to cross the border w/o being detained?
Catch and Release didn't keep them from being detained, so how would it benefit them? It just set limits on how long they were held.
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Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:34:37
Subject: US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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NinthMusketeer wrote: cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: nels1031 wrote: d-usa wrote:
You do understand the difference between unaccompanied and accompanied, right?
Yeah, bro.
You do understand the question was : Anyone remember that time Obama built prisons for children, or kept them in cages raise a hand.
, right?
You realize that's a disingenuous argument that entirely dances around the point and amounts to whataboutism defending what's happening, right?
Hey, someone specifically asked for "whataboutism". When they ask for it, don't be shocked when it happens.
So you support seperating children from their parents and in the process submitting them to emotional torture that can very well scar them for life. In the name of partisan politics. Good to know that's your quality as a human being.
You could make a fortune selling all those strawmen you're building. The question wasn't whether this was good or bad. The question being asked was whether Obama had done it. The answer is YES, he did.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:35:30
Subject: US Politics
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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whembly wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: nels1031 wrote: d-usa wrote:
You do understand the difference between unaccompanied and accompanied, right?
Yeah, bro.
You do understand the question was : Anyone remember that time Obama built prisons for children, or kept them in cages raise a hand.
, right?
You realize that's a disingenuous argument that entirely dances around the point and amounts to whataboutism defending what's happening, right?
Hey, someone specifically asked for "whataboutism". When they ask for it, don't be shocked when it happens.
So you support seperating children from their parents and in the process submitting them to emotional torture that can very well scar them for life. In the name of partisan politics. Good to know that's your quality as a human being.
NinthMusketeer... how is that any different than citizens breaking the law and gets incarcerated? Who is at fault here?
We really have two choices:
1) Have open borders, and the country deals with such ramifications.
or
2) Enforce the laws on the books, and potentially separating families...and deal with such ramifications (ie, build better detention center to handle families, adjust laws, etc...).
So you are also willing to separate children from their parents, submitting them to emotional torture that can scar them for life, in the name of partisan politics. Good to know your quality as a human being.
I've reached the point of just ignoring the deflections and holding people accountable for what they are defending. Automatically Appended Next Post: cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: nels1031 wrote: d-usa wrote:
You do understand the difference between unaccompanied and accompanied, right?
Yeah, bro.
You do understand the question was : Anyone remember that time Obama built prisons for children, or kept them in cages raise a hand.
, right?
You realize that's a disingenuous argument that entirely dances around the point and amounts to whataboutism defending what's happening, right?
Hey, someone specifically asked for "whataboutism". When they ask for it, don't be shocked when it happens.
So you support seperating children from their parents and in the process submitting them to emotional torture that can very well scar them for life. In the name of partisan politics. Good to know that's your quality as a human being.
You could make a fortune selling all those strawmen you're building. The question wasn't whether this was good or bad. The question being asked was whether Obama had done it. The answer is YES, he did.
So you do not support the Trump administration's actions, or you do and what I said is true. Let us know which.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:37:00
Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:38:15
Subject: Re:US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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The pictures being circulated of children in cages are of the temporary holding units. Here is what an actual youth detention facility looks like.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:41:27
Subject: US Politics
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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So you are deflecting, the only reason to do so is because what I said is true.
Let's reiterate: you support seperating children from their parents, causing emotional torture that can scar them for life, in the name of partisan politics. This is something that you support.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:42:43
Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:42:40
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Some random thoughts on politics and society these days....
** I'll give any politician credit where credit is due. Trump, while appearing bat-gak crazy at times, is actually confronting many issues I have had a huge problem with. Our previous 'traditional' politicians haven't done jack so I will give him props for that. Illegal immigration - I don't want it. NAFTA and trade with China - I want something to change. Sort something out with NK? If you aren't going to blow the crap out of them, might as well try talking to them. Have we pissed off some of our allies in the process? Sure, but I don't care. Everyone serves their own interest, and they are no more innocent of that. Everyone has enjoyed riding our backs the last 70 years and I am tired of it. Don't like it? Cry me a river. I never heard Bannon really speak until that CNN interview and I couldn't believe I agreed with almost everything he said. I don't know much about him beyond that interview, but if that's what has influenced Trump then I wish him the best.
A couple of years ago, all the landscaping and tree service crews I noticed around my neighborhood looked like they had a lot of illegals in their crews, if not completely made up of illegals. Today? All red-blooded American from what I can tell. What does that mean? More Americans working. I like that. No, I love that.
Is Trump a pig? Sure. I don't care. Didn't stop some hot women from sleeping with him left and right. Let's not forget our beloved Bill Clinton was sticking cigar's up Monica's cha-cha while discussing peace in the middle east on the phone with Arafat. I could care less. He's a liar you say? Find me one politician that isn't. They all sell their souls long before they move up the political ladder. I have never looked at a president as the guy to steer my moral compass. He is there to make sure the economy is doing well and to defend this country. Beyond that, you are making him out to be more than what he is.
And to be fair, I do not agree with a lot of things he has done.
** Children separated at the border from their parents who are braking the law? Here's a novel idea PARENTS: don't break the law. If I rob a liquor store with my kid in the car, and get busted on the way home, is the law going to keep the kid and me together while I am in jail? No. And some of you want to give them special treatment? They broke the law, now they can go through the process like any other criminal. Sucks for the kids tho, I will admit, but lets point most of the blame on their parents, where it belongs.
** I used to consider myself a wavy line between both parties and proudly stated I was an independent, but I am so sick of liberals and the extreme/elitist left that it's pushing me to the right. I am not racist, sexist, or anything else liberals like to use on Trump supporters. And I didn't even vote for the guy. But just about everyone in my family did. So yes, I resent that label of 'basket of deplorables'. Its astonishing to me that many of the servicemen and women who are defending America's interest around the world are thrown into that basket too. And then you have Bill Maher hoping for a recession so Trump loses? Of course he does, cause he knows Trump will win re-election because the democrats haven't a single candidate to lead them. All liberals can do is hope Trump fails. Which is absolutely crazy and damn near treasonous to me. The last thing I want to see is Americans lose their jobs, families to suffer, etc, so my choice of candidate can take office.
So all those who bash the right and Trump should spend some time checking out what is coming from the left. Its pretty poisonous too.
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This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:47:33
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:43:01
Subject: Re:US Politics
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Lord of the Fleet
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cuda1179 wrote:
Oh for the love of God, you know the thread has jumped the shark when someone whips out the Nazi parallels. Disingenuous at best.
Hmm... well, let me ask this: at what point would you consider it acceptable? I mean, we really have reached the point that a man aligned with Nazism is putting up detention camps for people he does not like. I mean, there's times it's hyperbole, but others...well..
I know we can do it if he comes out on stage in a brown shirt and a toothbrush mustache draped in the Blutfahne, but at the same time...
Strange Days indeed.
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Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:46:33
Subject: US Politics
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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KTG17 wrote:Some random thoughts on politics and society these days....
** I'll give any politician credit where credit is due. Trump, while appearing bat-gak crazy at times, is actually confronting many issues I have had a huge problem with. Our previous 'traditional' politicians haven't done jack so I will give him props for that. Illegal immigration - I don't want it. NAFTA and trade with China - I want something to change. Sort something out with NK? If you aren't going to blow the crap out of them, might as well try talking to them. Have we pissed off some of our allies in the process? Sure, but I don't care. Everyone serves their own interest, and they are no more innocent of that. Everyone has enjoyed riding our backs the last 70 years and I am tired of it. Don't like it? Cry me a river. I never heard Bannon really speak until that CNN interview and I couldn't believe I agreed with almost everything he said. I don't know much about him beyond that interview, but if that's what has influenced Trump then I wish him the best.
A couple of years ago, all the landscaping and tree service crews I noticed around my neighborhood looked like they had a lot of illegals in their crews, if not completely made up of illegals. Today? All red-blooded American from what I can tell. What does that mean? More Americans working. I like that. No, I love that.
Is Trump a pig? Sure. I don't care. Didn't stop some hot women from sleeping with him left and right. Let's not forget our beloved Bill Clinton was sticking cigar's up Monica's cha-cha while discussing peace in the middle east on the phone with Arafat. I could care less. He's a liar you say? Find me one politician that isn't. They all sell their souls long before they move up the political ladder. I have never looked at a president as the guy to steer my moral compass. He is there to make sure the economy is doing well and to defend this country. Beyond that, you are making him out to be more than what he is.
** Children separated at the border from their parents who are braking the law? Here's a novel idea: don't break the law. If I rob a liquor store with my kid in the car, and get busted on the way home, is the law going to keep the kid and me together while I am in jail? No. And some of you want to give them special treatment? They broke the law, now they can go through the process like any other criminal. Sucks for the kids tho, I will admit, but lets point most of the blame on their parents, where it belongs.
** I used to consider myself a wavy line between both parties and proudly stated I was an independent, but I am so sick of liberals and the extreme/elitist left that it's pushing me to the right. I am not racist, sexist, or anything else liberals like to use on Trump supporters. And I didn't even vote for the guy. But just about everyone in my family did. So yes, I resent that label of 'basket of deplorables'. Its astonishing to me that many of the servicemen and women who are defending America's interest around the world are thrown into that basket too. And then you have Bill Maher hoping for a recession so Trump loses? Of course he does, cause he know Trump will win re-election because the democrats haven't a single candidate to lead them. All liberals can do is hope Trump fails. Which is absolutely crazy and damn near treasonous to me. The last thing I want to see is Americans lose their jobs, families to suffer, etc, so my choice of candidate can take office.
So all those who bash the right and Trump should spend some time checking out what is coming from the left. Its pretty poisonous too.
The hypocrisy of the last statement sums it all up.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:48:50
Subject: US Politics
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Lord of the Fleet
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KTG17 wrote:
** Children separated at the border from their parents who are braking the law? Here's a novel idea: don't break the law. If I rob a liquor store with my kid in the car, and get busted on the way home, is the law going to keep the kid and me together while I am in jail? No. And some of you want to give them special treatment? They broke the law, now they can go through the process like any other criminal. Sucks for the kids tho, I will admit, but lets point most of the blame on their parents, where it belongs.
So, you admit then that taking the children of people who DIDN'T break that law is wrong then? Because that's also an effect of this policy. People in favor of this seem to have this weird delusion that every kid they're grabbing is from someone who committed a crime. And in other fun, at least one Immigration Court judge has already been using the seizure of their children to force people who may or may not have committed a crime to plead guilty if they want to see their kids again.
So, before you open your mouth and tell us all how great it is, please be sure to remove your foot from your mouth before speaking.
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Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:49:03
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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You are exactly the kind of person I have grown to dislike. Automatically Appended Next Post: BaronIveagh wrote:
So, you admit then that taking the children of people who DIDN'T break that law is wrong then?
We're talking about illegal immigrants crossing the border, correct?
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:50:28
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:51:02
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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KTG17 wrote:** Children separated at the border from their parents who are braking the law? Here's a novel idea: don't break the law. If I rob a liquor store with my kid in the car, and get busted on the way home, is the law going to keep the kid and me together while I am in jail? No. And some of you want to give them special treatment? They broke the law, now they can go through the process like any other criminal. Sucks for the kids tho, I will admit, but lets point most of the blame on their parents, where it belongs.
That's massively socially irresponsible. Those children are going to grow up, and... then what? Do you actually want a permanent underclass of essentially homeless orphans? The supposed wardens of society need to take a broader view of things than you can.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:51:18
Subject: US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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NinthMusketeer wrote:[]So you do not support the Trump administration's actions, or you do and what I said is true. Let us know which.
The answer to this is a bit nuanced and not exactly a "yes or no". Ordering less leniency when it comes to catch and release does have it's ups and downs. Do I feel that more effort should be made to keep families together? Yes, I do. I feel that at least a good faith effort to keep them in the same facility should be made when possible, even if they aren't in the same "cell" in that facility. However, this is sometimes not possible when you consider space, age, gender, and other conditions and complications.
Temporary separation for medical and psychological evaluations are okay (measured in hours, not days)
If a parent has shown signs of drug use, gang activity, hostility, or has a warrant out for another crime or there are signs of child neglect or abuse, I'm totally fine with separating them. I think even you would agree with this.
If the parent crossed into the US, and in doing so put the child at great chance of physical harm (some desert crossings have a 10% chance of death for adults, let alone children), I'd possibly consider it okay to separate them.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:52:47
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:53:46
Subject: US Politics
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Lord of the Fleet
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KTG17 wrote:
We're talking about illegal immigrants crossing the border, correct?
No. That's the problem. There's a little fine print to this: What they've been doing is just taking the kids of people like asylum seekers, and taking their kids too, even those that followed all the laws regarding their entry. Illegals are the biggest group having their kids taken, but not the ONLY one. What's going on is that under Zero Tolerance they're assuming that all asylum applications are fraudulent. This has already led to lawsuits over this, which are ongoing.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:56:04
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:54:23
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Rosebuddy wrote:
That's massively socially irresponsible. Those children are going to grow up, and... then what? Do you actually want a permanent underclass of essentially homeless orphans? The supposed wardens of society need to take a broader view of things than you can.
???????????????????????
What is your impression of what is going on? That the parents are thrown in prison and the kids are thrown out on to the curb?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/19 20:54:37
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:55:49
Subject: US Politics
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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KTG17 wrote:
You are exactly the kind of person I have grown to dislike.
Yeah, its understandable that you wouldn't like someone holding you accountable for what you say, given how disingenuous and fallacious it is.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:56:19
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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BaronIveagh wrote: KTG17 wrote:
We're talking about illegal immigrants crossing the border, correct?
No. That's the problem. There's a little fine print to this: What they've been doing is just taking the kids of people like asylum seekers who are here legally and taking their kids too. Illegals are the biggest group having their kids taken, but not the ONLY one.
Please show me an example of that happening.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:56:53
Subject: US Politics
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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cuda1179 wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote:[]So you do not support the Trump administration's actions, or you do and what I said is true. Let us know which.
The answer to this is a bit nuanced and not exactly a "yes or no". Ordering less leniency when it comes to catch and release does have it's ups and downs. Do I feel that more effort should be made to keep families together? Yes, I do. I feel that at least a good faith effort to keep them in the same facility should be made when possible, even if they aren't in the same "cell" in that facility. However, this is sometimes not possible when you consider space, age, gender, and other conditions and complications.
Temporary separation for medical and psychological evaluations are okay (measured in hours, not days)
If a parent has shown signs of drug use, gang activity, hostility, or has a warrant out for another crime or there are signs of child neglect or abuse, I'm totally fine with separating them. I think even you would agree with this.
If the parent crossed into the US, and in doing so put the child at great chance of physical harm (some desert crossings have a 10% chance of death for adults, let alone children), I'd possibly consider it okay to separate them.
So you DON'T support what the administration is doing? Because what you described is not the same as what they are doing.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:57:13
Subject: US Politics
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Tzeentch Aspiring Sorcerer Riding a Disc
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Rosebuddy wrote:I don't think it really matters that Obama said he had "concerns" or whatever. Dude still droned people and supported dictators. You're just falling for a veneer of respectability because Obama looked better in a suit.
You could expand on that argument and widen it to how everyone is terrible and were all going to hell. No, there is a difference even if you don't like Obama.
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Sorry for my spelling. I'm not a native speaker and a dyslexic.
1750 pts Blood Specters
2000 pts Imperial Fists
6000 pts Disciples of Fate
3500 pts Peridia Prime
2500 pts Prophets of Fate
Lizardmen 3000 points Tlaxcoatl Temple-City
Tomb Kings 1500 points Sekhra (RIP) |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:57:54
Subject: US Politics
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Fixture of Dakka
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BaronIveagh wrote: KTG17 wrote:
** Children separated at the border from their parents who are braking the law? Here's a novel idea: don't break the law. If I rob a liquor store with my kid in the car, and get busted on the way home, is the law going to keep the kid and me together while I am in jail? No. And some of you want to give them special treatment? They broke the law, now they can go through the process like any other criminal. Sucks for the kids tho, I will admit, but lets point most of the blame on their parents, where it belongs.
So, you admit then that taking the children of people who DIDN'T break that law is wrong then? Because that's also an effect of this policy. People in favor of this seem to have this weird delusion that every kid they're grabbing is from someone who committed a crime. And in other fun, at least one Immigration Court judge has already been using the seizure of their children to force people who may or may not have committed a crime to plead guilty if they want to see their kids again.
So, before you open your mouth and tell us all how great it is, please be sure to remove your foot from your mouth before speaking.
Just to be clear, I'm not defending either of those things and I think that a Judge that does things like that should be on the short-track to disbarment.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:59:23
Subject: US Politics
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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NinthMusketeer wrote: KTG17 wrote:
You are exactly the kind of person I have grown to dislike.
Yeah, its understandable that you wouldn't like someone holding you accountable for what you say, given how disingenuous and fallacious it is.
Holding me accountable?! I wrote it, I stand by it. Not sure where the disingenuous and fallacious part comes in. But you keep on throwing out names there. I know the left likes to throw out names, force peeps to get defensive, dig their heels, and waste time arguing with false accusations. This is what you do. This is why I do not like you.
When you actually do something that's accountable, point it out to me.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2018/06/19 20:59:38
Subject: US Politics
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Lord of the Fleet
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KTG17 wrote:
What is your impression of what is going on? That the parents are thrown in prison and the kids are thrown out on to the curb?
Actually the parents are generally being let go with time served (illegal boarder crossing is only a misdemeanor) but the kids are being held longer than the parents.
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Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
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