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 Vineheart01 wrote:
Tulun, you might wanna update battlescribe.
10x flashgitz should be 248pts not 308.
And Smashas went up 2pts

You have 40pts not being used atm. Shed the extra random grotz you could squeeze a kopta w/ rokkits in there.
(note: Biker boss is "Legends" now. Basically if you allowed Index before hes still legal but note that he has DakkaDakkaDakka now properly)

Is the new data out? Seems like it’s still under the old one.

Thought mine worked out to 1999 points.

Ah yup. I had to delete and reinstall to download it :p

pfft i derped twice in one post that kinda shows how my day is going..
i didnt see you had slightly more than 2k points.

The data is available, my battlescribe is updated.

It's updated. Just replace or adjust something in your lists, the total ammount will update that list to the new points

Looks like if I scrimp the grots down to 30 on freebootas, I can take a basic deffkopta (I'd rather the rokkit one to be honest, but I'd be 10 points over) and I can add a grot to either the 2nd SAG or Big Mek for an ablative wound.

Any other thoughts? Seems like it could be fun. I just worry that 30 grots won't be enough for the Gits. A 5++, 6+++ does give them a 45% chance of shrugging off shooting, though.

Decided to drop 2 boys, down to 28, and upgrade to Kopta Rokkits. Harder to ignore 2 Rokkits that get a reroll to hit / wound over a twin big Shoota.

What do you mean by "SSAG"?

Kebabcito wrote:
What do you mean by "SSAG"?

If that’s directed towards me, souped up shock attack gun ( relic version ).

tulun wrote:

Kebabcito wrote:
What do you mean by "SSAG"?

If that’s directed towards me, souped up shock attack gun ( relic version ).

Well, it was a question to everyone, but thanks for answering.

What do you guys prefer, 8 smasha guns or 15 lootas? I've got a space in my 1500p list since I completely removed the trukk+10 nobz, absolutely useless.

Kebabcito wrote:

tulun wrote:

Kebabcito wrote:
What do you mean by "SSAG"?

If that’s directed towards me, souped up shock attack gun ( relic version ).

Well, it was a question to everyone, but thanks for answering.

What do you guys prefer, 8 smasha guns or 15 lootas? I've got a space in my 1500p list since I completely removed the trukk+10 nobz, absolutely useless.

I’d probably say 8 smashas, but it sort of depends on your list.

tulun wrote:

Kebabcito wrote:

tulun wrote:

Kebabcito wrote:
What do you mean by "SSAG"?

If that’s directed towards me, souped up shock attack gun ( relic version ).

Well, it was a question to everyone, but thanks for answering.

What do you guys prefer, 8 smasha guns or 15 lootas? I've got a space in my 1500p list since I completely removed the trukk+10 nobz, absolutely useless.

I’d probably say 8 smashas, but it sort of depends on your list.

2x30 boyz
10 gretch
Warboss
MeKFF
Painboy
Weirdboy
Tankbusta in a battlewagon
3 deffkoptas

I need moar dakka, need some backline to help my team

Smashas. If you don't add at least SOME grots the lootas die to gentle breeze.

Yup. No Grots, no Lootas.

You guys right, my point of view was "lootas worth cuz I'll spend my CP in them" but they will die first turn.

My trukk with big chopper nobz was such a fail, they did nothing in any match I've played

Kebabcito wrote:
You guys right, my point of view was "lootas worth cuz I'll spend my CP in them" but they will die first turn.

My trukk with big chopper nobz was such a fail, they did nothing in any match I've played

I'm probably one of the few people here who likes the Nobby boys, but I think the optimal ways to use them are:

1) Turn 1 bonebreaker charge -> Turn 2 jump out and charge
2) Da Jump -> Charge. Hide them behind / in cover first turn so they have a 3+ save or can't be shot if you don't go first.
3) Tellyporta -> Charge. Use them as a distraction boy squad replacement (so lose a Da Jump boy squad for cheaper nobs).

I think 2 or 3 are the better ways. The Bonebreaker way is quite expensive, unless you're already doing that sort of thing. Requires a Wartrike too. Add in some grots for ablative wounds.

 some bloke wrote:
Bloodaxe culture I can see some uses for - I am planning to use it for a list with 2 battlewagons and 3 killtanks (or vice versa) so that I can't get bogged down in combat too easily. Increased killyness without the drawbacks of falling back and not shooting - I can move, shoot, charge, stop an enemy unit from shooting because of the charge, inflict mortal wounds, and if still in combat in my turn I can fall back and still shoot. Turn 1 cover for kill tanks gives them a passable save and from then on it's just fluke if they're over 18" away.

The thing you're missing here is that nothing ever wants to stay in combat with a deffrolla unless it has a decent chance of smashing it to bits.
The vast majority of my games as blood axes not a single unit could ever fall back because:
- The ork unit was dead. Ork units are squishy and tend to not survive two turns of combat
- The enemy unit was dead. Ork are pretty killy in combat, so few units survive two turns of combat
- The enemy left combat on their turn to shoot the orks/not get killed
Both the fallback and the cover save matter so rarely, you might as well just not have a culture at all. On top of that, both the stratagem and the warlord trait are pretty useless. Literally any other clan is better.

Snakebites I see as moderate for high wound models like stompas, gargantuan squiggoths, and kill tanks - in short, some of our worst units. But as these will be the ones targeted by D6 damage weapons, having 6+++ will be better than a deffskulls 6++, especially couples with a KFF. Snakebites are renowned for having the biggest tanks, right?


...right?

Not sure whether you are joking. Snakebites is somewhere on the same level as goff - decent relic, decent stratagem, culture that works for pretty much any unit... but none of that is really going to win you a game, unlike evil suns, deffskulls or bad moons.
Deffskulls is awesome because of the re-rolls. More dead enemies is a better defense than having 16.66% more wounds on your units.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 flandarz wrote:
Biker Boss isn't Legends (no datasheet in there). No idea why he isn't, but speculation is that he'll be released with a KFF Mek sometime in the future.

That speculation would be about a decade late.
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Ork-Warboss-on-Bike

Nice model. Where's rhe datasheet? Which is kinda what I was talking about?

You quite obviously use the index one since it's the most recent one for this model.

 flandarz wrote:
Nice model. Where's rhe datasheet? Which is kinda what I was talking about?

That's the problem at the moment. Its under the FW section but we only have Zhadsnark in the actual IA Xenos rules. So it seems like we would still use the Index profile as a stopgap for now since there's nothing explicitly official about it.

What Grimskul said. There's no "official" FW Biker Boss, and though it has a datasheet in the Index, the speculation that a datasheet will be released alongside the KFF Mek is still plenty valid. For that matter, what are you doing with the KFF Mek, which also has points in CA? Just using Big Mek points and giving him a KFF (possibly included in the cost)?

6+ FNP is 20% more effective wounds, not 16.67%.

One interesting thing...

So, Nobs index wargear options were *not* put into the legends bucket.

With us still using the Warboss on biker index entry, does this give us access to things like Kustom Shootas?

Are they in codex? If not there or legends they are nowhere so rather they are worse than before

 JNAProductions wrote:
6+ FNP is 20% more effective wounds, not 16.67%.

You're dice just have 5 sides?

T1nk4bell wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
6+ FNP is 20% more effective wounds, not 16.67%.

You're dice just have 5 sides?

No, he is right - you can save a wound more than once, which brings you up to 20%. Which doesn't change that snakebites still aren't great.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 flandarz wrote:
What Grimskul said. There's no "official" FW Biker Boss, and though it has a datasheet in the Index, the speculation that a datasheet will be released alongside the KFF Mek is still plenty valid. For that matter, what are you doing with the KFF Mek, which also has points in CA? Just using Big Mek points and giving him a KFF (possibly included in the cost)?

Technically, the rules tell you to pick a datasheet to represent your model. There isn't actually any rules to tell you what source to use, except the datasheets from instruction manuals telling you to use your codex and the index flowchart. Common sense dictates that you always use the newest iteration of a datasheet, because otherwise things like the new Space Marine codex wouldn't make sense.

Therefore, for running a Warboss on Warbike, you simply use the one datasheet available for that.
I seriously doubt that there will be a datasheet released for the Biker Warboss alongside with the KFF mek, because one is a GW model and one is now a FW model - those have never been in the same rules source.

Also technically, the KFF mek is an illegal model right now, since the Big Mek lost its ability to take KFF and the other entry doesn't have a datasheet yet. It's also 100% safe to assume that the Big Mek with Kustom Force Field is paying 20 points for the KFF, just like every other model with a KFF.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
thats pretty much the reasoning i use House Taranis for my knights when i field them along my admech.
That 6+++ on a high wound model is annoying, it generally keeps it alive a full turn longer than it should. The amount of times that has kept my knight at 1 wound so i get another turn with it is laughable.

Sadly, knight a stompa is not. Still about 150pts overpriced.

Also, 3 killtanks? jeez thats terrifying to think of (also what 1300pts?)

I'm not sure how my old list worked (lost the file), just made a new one and it's not as scary, think perhaps my old one was 3 battlewagons and 2 kill tanks instead of vice versa.

List:

1998pts

I'm still 50:50 on snakebites or bloodaxes but I think the 6+++ and the buzzbomm is swinging it for me. haven't got my 'dex to hand (using battlescribe), pretty sure buzzbomm is one use only but it doesn't say so on 'scribe, am I right in that? If not, could be an amazing charge deterrent...

Do you have any buggies? That list seem predestined to run a bunch of them. I would just drop all the boyz and battlewagons for gretchin and cram in as many buggies as you can fit..

Well, if you use Goffs you can always resort to use Buzzgob (FW big mek) who has a KFF. 75 points but better stats than the normal one and has mek arms (3*base attacks).

Buzzgob is not equipped with a KFF and therefore does not provide a save despite having the rule.

 Jidmah wrote:
Buzzgob is not equipped with a KFF and therefore does not provide a save despite having the rule.

Wasn't that FAQed?

I don't understand the discussion here. There is clearly an entry on CA 19 with a KFF mek. Why should it be illegal?

Because it doesn't have a datasheet, Emi.