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I'd recommend going Nurgle for the -1 buff, and dank apostle to stack a further -1 on turn 1. That should buy you enough to live a round. Then a second threat for turn 2, probably obliterators deep striking, allowing you to transfer the apostle's prayer to that unit.

Either that or offer up a juicier target.

Either way CC is the death of a LR, so you have to screen it very well.

You could try buffing the landraider with tons of defensive buffs and then put the nastiest stuff you can think of in it. Like Alpha legion nurgle (cast miasma of pestilence of it) Landraider with a Dark Apostle to give it a further -1.

So now you have a -3 to hit Landraider. Then put in something utterly digusting like 3 thunder hammer chaos lords, 3 exalted champions and 3 executioners. And then your dark apostle cast cast the reroll to hit in melee in the turn you charge out.

Provided you have lots of juicy targets in range, you will wreck face when you charge 9 characters out of that Land Raider. You actually may need to escort such LR with other stuff. Because you absolutely do not want your LR surrounded such that it cannot unload anyone. And with such a deadly cargo in it, you can be sure some opponents will try exactly that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another possibility would be not to go so overboard. Just have some berserkers in it. Maybe do Alpha legion nurgle LR, but build your list as a shooty list. So the berserkers in the LR would serve as a sort of counter charge melee unit if something scary reaches your shooty lines. I mean, the LR is still 4 lascannons and a heavy bolter, with the option to add a havoc launcher too.

Might work well in a Nortilith crown list. Because the crown will give the LR a 5++ save as well. And the Crown tends to encourage building a castle around it anyway. Have Abby, Havocs, the buffed LR, and other possible shooty stuff around a Nortilith Crown. If they get close, Abby and a bunch of berserkers will counter charge them and make them cry.

Buffing a Landraider is absolutely NOT the way to go about it. It is a very inefficient unit offensively and buffing it's defense isn't going to help at all. If you do that then your opponent will just ignore it or tie it up in melee. Spending another 200 points for a Sorceror and DA for a not even guaranteed -2 to hit is absolute madness. Spending 500 points for 4 lascannons is a bad idea.

If you are deadset on using a Landraider then you could try something I've seen work before but it was a while ago. Basically you put 10 Chosen with combi-bolter and chainsword inside and march up the table with Abaddon and gak loads of cultists. Your opponent either shoots the cultists or the LR and any guns built for heavy infantry or light vehicles are useless. Abaddon gives rerolls and your Chosen jump out eventually and start spitting bullets everywhere. The guy I saw run this actually used Noise Marines but now Chosen are better imo. This was before the cultist nerf which will reduce the efficacy of the list. You could run PBs instead but then why bother with Abaddon and a LR.

The main issue is that Landraiders just aren't that tough and there's pretty much nothing valuable enough worth transporting in one vs a Rhino.

Thanks to everyone for the advice!

Lots of useful ideas for me to think about. I hadn't even considered running two LRs in a 2000 pt list but it's nice to know that it's not beyond the realm of possibility!

Here's a sample list I made that I think actually might work OK.


Basic idea is screen with your Cultists and CSMs who focus on killing infantry while your Levis and LR sit behind Abaddon and focus on shooting tank type units. Remember Levis have double Hellflamers so they can flame gak that gets into your lines.

Clocks in at a tad under 1650 points. Remember you need to include at least 1 more HQ for the battalion but that'll give you at least another 250 points for whatever else you want to include.

The biggest problem with this list? The Landraider. It does 4.14 wounds average to a T8 4++ unit (inc. Abaddon re-rolls). A single Leviathan does 7.11 wounds average (inc. Abaddon re-rolls) to the same target after moving and it's slightly cheaper! If you keep your Leviathans stationary and use a Lord to babysit them (since 2+ BS you don't need Abaddon) then the Levis come out even further on top. True, the Landraider brings your plasma-toting Chosen into the fray relatively safely, but you can just drop Oblits or plasma Termis for basically the same result.

"Buffing a Landraider is absolutely NOT the way to go about it. It is a very inefficient unit offensively and buffing it's defense isn't going to help at all. If you do that then your opponent will just ignore it or tie it up in melee."

- It is absolutely the way to go, otherwise the damn thing is a piñata. Giving your opponent only one big target to shoot at at a time, and then stacking that target with negatives to hit, is one of the only ways I can think of a LR working. With no buffs it's dead turn 1 every single time. As for CC, I agree, CC is the death of a LR. It needs screening, which means it's best off not delivering assault troops (eg instead protecting havocs from t1 alpha), or delivering troops that are so mean your opponent will have no wish to get near CC (eg zerkers). I think its best role is the former, buffed with minuses to hit, shielding blits or havocs. More likely to stay out of cc that way, and gives you more deployment flex, as you're not focussed on trimming those inches for your assault troops.

A LR sucks. Get a terrax pattern assault drill. Its a transport as well, and it doesnt need screening. Deepstrike, disembark, fire/charge.

 grouchoben wrote:
"Buffing a Landraider is absolutely NOT the way to go about it. It is a very inefficient unit offensively and buffing it's defense isn't going to help at all. If you do that then your opponent will just ignore it or tie it up in melee."

- It is absolutely the way to go, otherwise the damn thing is a piñata. Giving your opponent only one big target to shoot at at a time, and then stacking that target with negatives to hit, is one of the only ways I can think of a LR working. With no buffs it's dead turn 1 every single time. As for CC, I agree, CC is the death of a LR. It needs screening, which means it's best off not delivering assault troops (eg instead protecting havocs from t1 alpha), or delivering troops that are so mean your opponent will have no wish to get near CC (eg zerkers). I think its best role is the former, buffed with minuses to hit, shielding blits or havocs. More likely to stay out of cc that way, and gives you more deployment flex, as you're not focussed on trimming those inches for your assault troops.

I disagree strongly with this. DA and Nurgle Sorc will cost you 208 points. Nurgle Sorc requires first turn and gives 72% chance to get off his -1 to hit. DA is 83% chance to go off. For another 90 points you can buy another Landraider which is far more points efficient. Or you can spend 200 points on good units like DPs instead of throwing good points after bad.

edit: nicer tone

You transfer the buffs over to a second unit once the first is gone, as I said in my first post.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Agreed on the Sorc though, it is T1 dependent.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'd much rather stack buffs on a unit with one already inherent to it (eg AL Lev or Storm Eagle) but hey, it is what it is, and we're talking LRs.

Problem is that you only have a 60% chance of getting both buffs off if you get first turn. Is it worth spending 200 points for those odds on a unit that is not valuable offensively?

For the price of the LR + Sorc + DA you could buy 3 lascannon havoc squads. That's 12 lascannons v 2 twin lascannons (technically worse than 4 lascannons).

I'll admit that you can find other units for the buffs to go on if the LR dies but your opponent doesn't *need* the LR to die. I'd be more than happy for 4 lascannons that are effectively 25% of the enemy army to shoot at me all day long.

In my sample list a couple of posts above the LR kinda works because it acts as a delivery method for the plasma Chosen, it can still use its average offense (it's main point of difference to the FW termite or even dreadclaw) and because of the two accompanying Levis that are T8 you have strong target saturation.

I agree, it's not ideal. But with a CP preroll you're looking pretty good for both buffs: 2+ followed by 6+ on 2 die with a reroll is reliable, if not nailed on.

And yes, the price is extortionate! I'd much rather have the havocs too.

That's my idea too, make the LR do work, but by filling it full of things that simply must die (ideally 2 squads of chain havocs), and then stacking negs to make the cost of killing it high.

Regarding the trio of hammer lords jumping out of a Land Raider: may well be overcosted right now, but there’s an absolutely epic Wrathmongers kitbash in that idea.

 lindsay40k wrote:
Regarding the trio of hammer lords jumping out of a Land Raider: may well be overcosted right now, but there’s an absolutely epic Wrathmongers kitbash in that idea.

Now this, this would probably be awesome.

On the subject of World Eaters...

I play more smaller points games... 1000 to 1500 and I find them pretty effective.

Last game I played was 1000 points and got me...

1 Lord on Juggernaught w/ Powerfist and combigun
2x 8xman Squads of Beserkers w/ chainaxe + Chainsword, Champion w/ powerfist and chainsword (don't forget they also have grenades).
2x Rhinos with 1x Combi bolter, 1x Combiflamer, 1x havoc launcher
Exalted Champion w/ Murder Sword and combibolter

1 Dark Apostle w/ illusiary supplication
2x Dark apostle support people
1x 20 man squad of cultists
1x 16 man squad of cultists

The powerfists sorted any vehicles out, the rhinos did well soaking up overwatch - maybe the extra guns on it were a bit overkill but it was nice to get tonnes of shots off them. I did come against a squad of hellblasters... they took out a rhino round one and I had to run with one squad of berserkers, but my Lord on Juggernaut took them out next round, so that was pretty points effective. He survived a round of Wulfen attacks with some good rolling, but when killing a couple of them in retaliation he died (a wulfen attack on their own death).
It was actually the cultists that won the game as they were mostly ignored (with a 5+ invulnerability save and leadership 9) and they took 3 control points between them and I got line breaker and slay the warlord (with the exalted champion and murder sword). The cultists also just had a massive weight of shots behind them... up to 40 shots in rapid fire range killed a few primaris marines.

Out of interest I've been thinking of fielding even more beserkers especially on something like the vigilus maps where speed is of the essence to get to the backfield... red ones go faster eh? Something like...
3x 8 man squads as above
3x rhinos
1x exalted champion
1x biker lord
3x bikes

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:
Can anybody give me some advice on how to get the best out of a chaos land raider?

I know that they are considered to be a sub-par choice, but I've loved the model ever since it came out and would love to be able to field one in one of my CSM armies without feeling that I'm handicapping myself.

Would the best way to utilise it be to advance for a couple of turns then unleash it's deadly contents?

Completely understand the urge to use a Land Raider. It's one of my favorite models too.

I only use mine in games at 1250 points and below. Opponents tend to lack massed high strength, long-range firepower in these games, making the LR more survivable.

As has been pointed out, Land Raiders are expensive and inefficient. They have mediocre shooting and the transport capacity doesn't matter as much in low-point games.

What it does extremely well, better than most other units, is getting in the way. It's tall and occupies a lot of space, be careful about positioning and use it to disrupt your opponent. Most commonly, mine gets used for multicharges, providing a mobile shield, and blocking access to objectives. I can think of a few examples where my Land Raider locked several units in combat to shut down a flank while the rest of my army went to town. I can think of a few examples where I parked the Land Raider between my opponent and an objective, forcing him to chew through wounds on the LR with AP- weapons for several rounds. Another tactic which has worked for me is backing the Land Raider up to a building to create an alcove that acts as a shield for shooting units.

You really have to optimize around the rest of your list to use a Land Raider in a low points game. My experience has been fast-moving lists with lots of cheap infantry are the best compliment. Jump-pack Lords and Sorcerers are good for buffing the Land Raider while it's moving (auras for rerolling 1s and prescience make the lascannons a lot more potent.) Chaos Bikers are good for grabbing objectives and forcing your opponent to split his forces. Large cultist blobs are good for board control so long as they have some morale protection. Helrbutes and Chosen can be priced right to fill out the list.

I've also won a few games with purely elite lists. Abaddon, an Exalted Champion, 3 squads of Berzerkers and a Land Raider can be a threat just marching up the board. When the only target your opponent has is the Land Raider and they don't have melta / mass-plasma, you can get them to waste a lot of shots before you clean up in close combat. Keep Abaddon on the board for full rerolls to hit and fire the lascannons at anything that could wound the LR.

Another list I played was a mechanized list with Abaddon, 3 squads of 12 Cultists, a Land Raider, and a pair of Hellforged Scorpius tanks. In one game, I had Abaddon and the Scorpius' firing from behind a building while the LR and the Cultists were spread out. The LR was taking charges while the Cultists grabbed objectives, I just kept falling back strategically with the LR and nuking him with double shooting from the Scorpius. My opponent's Tyranids had no answer for that, he had half his army advancing on the Scorpius' all game and not getting there.

Again, there are better units than a Land Raider. If you really want to use one, keep it out of 2000 point games and play to its strengths as much as possible.

So I have been playing Red Corairs a lot lately and I have to say Huron is a swiss army knife and may be the most entertaining character in the game. He always wins me games.

I always take warp time on him and in every game at some point he ends up running 20" or more before making an assault and killing something vital.

Red Corsairs in general are just so much fun. With a lord discordant from a hellforged pack plus some dreads and some berserkers in a drill (deployed, never DS it), the table coverage you achieve is nightmare fuel for your opponent.

Last night I played my bros dark angels and huron and his pet were the last models I had verse my brothers last 2 inceptors with plasma. Huron was on 2 wounds remaining, he warp timed to within 5" and smote for 3 mortals. I declared my charge and the inceptor got 2 shots overcharged and rolled a 1 and a 6 killing himself and wounding Hruon who failed his sigil. Literally the last model on the table was the Hymadrya. Funniest end to a game I can remember in a long time.

My list isn't hard core but is a ton of fun:

Red Corsairs 1500

Huron (warlord)
Lord Discordant (relic mechatendrals) Hellforged pack WLT

3X5 CSM with a reaper Chain Canon

Helbrute w/ double power scourge
Greater possessed
8 Khorne Berzerkers

Terrax drill

Venom crawler
Mauler fiend
2 oblits

Has been a blast at 1.5K

I use a LR in some Death Guard lists, since they need all the Las Cannons they can afford, but only in friendly fluff lists with lots of Plague Marines and Infantry. The LR is either ignored most game, and runs out of viable targets, or is charged and locked in combat becoming a paperweight.

Not Online!!! wrote:
The problem is not that Berzerkers aren't good, the problem is with their Mobility, which is bad. Rhinos might help but that is also more points. If you can cast warptime, the things allready changing but again WE can't have psykers.
Also berzerkers are not particular sturdy.

What legion/warband might you recommend in lieu of World Eaters? I want to have one with a Khornate allegiance but with fewer restrictions that you mentioned.

I use World Eaters and Alpha Legion together and have had success. Alpha nets me most of what pure WE are lacking plus there is plenty of fluffy explanation even if you paint everything WE colors. (Everyone is just Alpha Legion anyway)

Last game I played Sunday I played 1500pts and had 2 battalions, one of each Legion, and used cultists as troops minus WE who got the tasty bezerkers unit of 8, and threw them in a rhino. They actually took out a full squad of Deathwing termies before they got to do anything. Granted it was me and my friends Death Guard at 1500pts each versus our friends Dark Angels at 3k playing the Vigilus Bold the Gate scenario. Fun game. We held the gate and were able to keep it.

 ArcaneHorror wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
The problem is not that Berzerkers aren't good, the problem is with their Mobility, which is bad. Rhinos might help but that is also more points. If you can cast warptime, the things allready changing but again WE can't have psykers.
Also berzerkers are not particular sturdy.

What legion/warband might you recommend in lieu of World Eaters? I want to have one with a Khornate allegiance but with fewer restrictions that you mentioned.

Honestly if you just want to stick in some units, red Corsairs, their trait gives you advance + charge, has no god limit and "more where they came from" generates mobility for regular csm.

Alternativly alpha legion, forward operatives + warptime allows for further reach.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Red Corsair wrote:
So I have been playing Red Corairs a lot lately and I have to say Huron is a swiss army knife and may be the most entertaining character in the game. He always wins me games.

I always take warp time on him and in every game at some point he ends up running 20" or more before making an assault and killing something vital.

Red Corsairs in general are just so much fun. With a lord discordant from a hellforged pack plus some dreads and some berserkers in a drill (deployed, never DS it), the table coverage you achieve is nightmare fuel for your opponent.

Last night I played my bros dark angels and huron and his pet were the last models I had verse my brothers last 2 inceptors with plasma. Huron was on 2 wounds remaining, he warp timed to within 5" and smote for 3 mortals. I declared my charge and the inceptor got 2 shots overcharged and rolled a 1 and a 6 killing himself and wounding Hruon who failed his sigil. Literally the last model on the table was the Hymadrya. Funniest end to a game I can remember in a long time.

My list isn't hard core but is a ton of fun:

Red Corsairs 1500

Huron (warlord)
Lord Discordant (relic mechatendrals) Hellforged pack WLT

3X5 CSM with a reaper Chain Canon

Helbrute w/ double power scourge
Greater possessed
8 Khorne Berzerkers

Terrax drill

Venom crawler
Mauler fiend
2 oblits

Has been a blast at 1.5K

Now only the opposite should work, got a list planed, probably not usefull for people who face a lot off armor.

Is anyone having any success with the Red Corsairs giant CSM blobs? I haven't heard anything about them in any big events, but then I could easily have missed it as I don't follow that stuff as closely as I probably should. Reason I ask is that there's a new CSM discount box coming out soon and it includes 3 of the new CSM kits (so 30 marines). I kind of want to get it if that strategy actually works, but I'm just not sure it's worth all the points and CP to get Tide of Traitors: Marines edition. Especially since as renegades Red Corsairs do not get access to Veterans of the Long War.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Is anyone having any success with the Red Corsairs giant CSM blobs? I haven't heard anything about them in any big events, but then I could easily have missed it as I don't follow that stuff as closely as I probably should. Reason I ask is that there's a new CSM discount box coming out soon and it includes 3 of the new CSM kits (so 30 marines). I kind of want to get it if that strategy actually works, but I'm just not sure it's worth all the points and CP to get Tide of Traitors: Marines edition. Especially since as renegades Red Corsairs do not get access to Veterans of the Long War.

I tested once a 20 man squad, morale really Starts to hurt there's, also 260 pts baseline price Tag with only 2 slots for equipment.

Overall i found 10 man squads better, they draw less fire, suffer less from morale and still have the same weapon saturarion.

Hamadrya as the last thing standing made me shriek with laughter in heretic, well played @Red_Corsair

Hey guys,

2 questions.

First, is the Maulerfiend and Forgefiend the same box set? I keep looking for a Maulerfiend on Amazon but Forgefiend comes up and it shows pictures of the maulerfiend. Just wanted some confirmation before I order.

Second, what is the Terrax Drill Red Corsair?
Thanks!

sturguard wrote:
Hey guys,

2 questions.

First, is the Maulerfiend and Forgefiend the same box set? I keep looking for a Maulerfiend on Amazon but Forgefiend comes up and it shows pictures of the maulerfiend. Just wanted some confirmation before I order.

Second, what is the Terrax Drill Red Corsair?
Thanks!

Yes, Maulerfiend and forgefiend are the same box set. The box allows you to build either one.

The Terrax Drill is a new forgeworld model I think.

Eldenfirefly wrote:

sturguard wrote:
Hey guys,

2 questions.

First, is the Maulerfiend and Forgefiend the same box set? I keep looking for a Maulerfiend on Amazon but Forgefiend comes up and it shows pictures of the maulerfiend. Just wanted some confirmation before I order.

Second, what is the Terrax Drill Red Corsair?
Thanks!

Yes, Maulerfiend and forgefiend are the same box set. The box allows you to build either one.

The Terrax Drill is a new forgeworld model I think.

the terrax drill is this thing: https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-BE/Terrax-Pattern-Termite-Assault-Drill-2018
It's quite the melee and shock transport thing.,

And let's not forget it's a beauty of a model.

 grouchoben wrote:
And let's not forget it's a beauty of a model.

Eh, I prefer the older model.

Can anyone give me an idea of the rules for it? Thanks

d3 meltas, 2 storm bolters, T8, W13, any model that it wounds in CC but doesn't kill takes cascading mortal wounds, on a 2+, 3+, 4+, etc. WS 4+ is its only really weakness.