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Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I NEED RULES LEAKS WHERE ARE THEY

I don't think they'll show up until 1 week before Easter

 catharsix wrote:

 Brutus_Apex wrote:
It’s happening, it’s really happening!

But *WHEN* is it happening? I've looked through this thread but can't quite find any info on when this might be available...

March, right? The Vigilus Countdown should end right around that time.

yeah shadow spear'll happen, and then we'll get vigilus book 2.

One thing intreasting is so far most of the books we've seen have been pyric victories for the IoM.

sure sounds like the space wolves acheived a "we won but we all died" result in tooth and claw.

proably the best way to do it, as it gives both sides a "win"

Yep, I believe the countdown is set to end around March 5th.

Apparently it's down to 2 weeks. So I guess it'll go on pre-order either this weekend or next, but since there was no "shadow spear up for pre-order this weekend" post on the community page it's not this Saturday.

 Togusa wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:

 Togusa wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
At this point, I'm pretty sure Eldar aspects will bever get some plastic kits. Theyll focus on the Ynari and quietly and slowly phase the aspects out.

I'm surprised most seem to think Chaos terminators are a bad kit. I think it still look pretty great, but I'm all for an update (but I sincerly doubt we'll get a new kit for them).

Must say that this box really emphase one of the reason I hate the primaris so much. Now the average CSM is smaller and weaker than the generic good guy. So not Grim dark

Uh, the new CSM scupts from Death Guard, 1k Sons and BS fortress are all as tall as primaris....


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
But new sets of combo kits (Scorp/Dragon, Banshee/Hawk, Reaper/Spider)

That seems like a good way to separate them. That and a dual Windriders/Spears kit.

you could also have each kit have the option for Exarch/Phoenix Lord and save even more space.

Hmm, no they aren't, they're a tad smaller, and they have worse stats that the primaris (I'm mostly talking about the regular CSM)

Well, that can change. Let's see what this release fully has in it first before going into panic mode.

Sorry but I live in the present, not in a hypothetical future world.

But *WHEN* is it happening? I've looked through this thread but can't quite find any info on when this might be available...

Indeed, but I’ve been waiting for over 15 years for new Chaos stuff, another couple of weeks should be no problem.

Looks like new Abaddon might go up on preorder for my birthday, how appropriate.

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:
I think it's clear that if these are just new CSM and Terminator kits without rule updates, they aren't gonna sell anywhere near what they could. They either need to be new units of their own, or we need a new Codex. But would that be a new Codex CSM, or a Codex Black Legion, as was rumored was coming last summer?

A Codex BL seems pretty redundant with regular CSM, so I hope it's not that. But if it is a new codex, will they be able to make updates to the marine stat line to fix them? If they do, they'll have to immediately follow with a new codex SM to update them too. And also updates to the basic marine stats in BA/DA/SW/1ksons/DG. Considering the difficulty of all that, I wouldn't be surprised if these end up being new units.

Now see if they didn't already have the 13th crusade it could have been a new Codex: Eye of Terror and include Traitor Guard and the like. But I think this will be a good telling point: If it's Codex Black Legion, then we may be in for more focused codex supplements to flesh out various armies. If it's Codex: CSM 8.5, then we may see them do like they currently are for AOS and updating older books with second/third passes to fix them. And if it's just Vigilus 2 with updated datasheets, then that could indicate "Warzone" campaign books that will be their way of updating various factions.

I actually would not mind seeing them go the Forgeworld campaign book approach and have a warzone book with sections for various factions with like updated datasheets and new datasheets if applicable. That could be an interesting way to do multiple updates at one shot for multiple factions instead of spreading out full codex releases every couple of months. Privateer Press managed to do that pretty well with Warmahordes; you would get a book every few months that moved the story along and had a new unit or couple of new units for everyone.

Aren't people going to hate having to buy every campaign book and bring them along with them in addition to their codex just to have all the rules for their army?

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Aren't people going to hate having to buy every campaign book and bring them along with them in addition to their codex just to have all the rules for their army?

Doubtful. I brought my codex, vigilus, and CA2018 to LVO, never once did I get any of the books out of my bag, the whole weekend, 9 games.

Over time the information gets commuted to memory for most people, and the books become a "i told you so" novelty.

They have got me hyped big time, very excited. Really want the Primaris for my crimson fists and I'm thinking of iron warriors for the new chaos stuff.

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Aren't people going to hate having to buy every campaign book and bring them along with them in addition to their codex just to have all the rules for their army?

I don't really care about books as long as I can play a good army with nice models. As others have said, it all ends up memorized. And I'll have .pdfs on my phone/laptop. And if needed, i'll even print out the needed pages of each book into my own binder. Not a lot of work compared to what goes into building and painting.

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Aren't people going to hate having to buy every campaign book and bring them along with them in addition to their codex just to have all the rules for their army?

I don't really care about books as long as I can play a good army with nice models. As others have said, it all ends up memorized. And I'll have .pdfs on my phone/laptop. And if needed, i'll even print out the needed pages of each book into my own binder. Not a lot of work compared to what goes into building and painting.

This is it right here. Play your army, learn it and the books can pretty much stay on the shelf. Plus printing stuff out seems to be the way to minimize everything to one book/binder. Seems like the people moaning about the problem aren't searching for a solution

 fraser1191 wrote:

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
Aren't people going to hate having to buy every campaign book and bring them along with them in addition to their codex just to have all the rules for their army?

I don't really care about books as long as I can play a good army with nice models. As others have said, it all ends up memorized. And I'll have .pdfs on my phone/laptop. And if needed, i'll even print out the needed pages of each book into my own binder. Not a lot of work compared to what goes into building and painting.

This is it right here. Play your army, learn it and the books can pretty much stay on the shelf. Plus printing stuff out seems to be the way to minimize everything to one book/binder. Seems like the people moaning about the problem aren't searching for a solution

That's fine for casual gaming, but should be considered unacceptable in tournament play. If you're going to play an army, it's your responsibility to be able to cite and show on demand the rules you're using. Your opponents can't be expected to know every rule that applies to your army.

New Termies and no new Havocs! Blasphemy!



But seriously, I wonder if Chaos Termies will finally get Combi-Plasmas?

 Brutus_Apex wrote:

But *WHEN* is it happening? I've looked through this thread but can't quite find any info on when this might be available...

Indeed, but I’ve been waiting for over 15 years for new Chaos stuff, another couple of weeks should be no problem.

Looks like new Abaddon might go up on preorder for my birthday, how appropriate.

I feel the same. And I’ve been hoping new CSM would come out ever since the awesome sculpts of Dark Vengeance. It’s about damn time they finally are coming out with equally great looking CSM troops. And that Sorcerer too...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
New Termies and no new Havocs! Blasphemy!



But seriously, I wonder if Chaos Termies will finally get Combi-Plasmas?

Well, we've had at least three units teased already, and one of those could be from a Havocs kit (although likely just from the CSM box), plus the Daemon Engine doesn't seem to be slowing down. I'm hopeful for a full CSM Undivided revamp including Havocs personally. If they redo CSMs, Terminators, Possessed, Havocs, and some of the HQs (most likely the Sorceror), then really only the Defiler will look horribly old within the range.

Of course, I am assuming Berzerkers and Noise Marines will come in their own releases similar to Thousand Sons and Death Guard.

I'm glad we're seeing more an more Chaos stuff, I really am.

But, considering the poor state of Chaos at this time, and for MANY years- I have no Chaos Army, and no desire to start one.

I'm playing Deathwatch, but I'm willing to make a very small force of standard loyalist Astartes- maybe even being limited to Kill-Team.

Not to be 'the bitter person' here, but I'd like to see some kind of information about using these models in Kill-Team, what other Astartes factions will be able to use them, and the additional box contents- Commando Librarian and Sniper guys are cool and all, but I''d like a bit more actual information and box content teasers.

You know, I would die laughing if, with all of these new Chaos releases (Marines, Terminators, Possessed, Obliterators, new Daemon Engine), they STILL didn't make a new Havoc kit. Just out of spite. Not that it would be a cool thing, it would just be so stupid, it would be funny.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
You know, I would die laughing if, with all of these new Chaos releases (Marines, Terminators, Possessed, Obliterators, new Daemon Engine), they STILL didn't make a new Havoc kit. Just out of spite. Not that it would be a cool thing, it would just be so stupid, it would be funny.

I think the clever workaround there would be to do what AoS does and have kits that let you build either of them with one box.

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
You know, I would die laughing if, with all of these new Chaos releases (Marines, Terminators, Possessed, Obliterators, new Daemon Engine), they STILL didn't make a new Havoc kit. Just out of spite. Not that it would be a cool thing, it would just be so stupid, it would be funny.

I think the clever workaround there would be to do what AoS does and have kits that let you build either of them with one box.

If they made the Marine kit in a way that supports that, it would be ideal. But GW is sort of getting away from universal kits. So far, it is One Kit=One Datasheet. There are obviously some exceptions, but for Primaris Marines and likely bog-standard Chaos Marines, this is probably going to be the case.

 Haighus wrote:
Of course, I am assuming Berzerkers and Noise Marines will come in their own releases similar to Thousand Sons and Death Guard.

I would hope so, with a full proper release of Power Armour/Termies/Specialist Unit/etc, that Thousand Sons and Death Guard got. Although I'd hope their miniatures are more of this, and less of this.

And if they put 6 Noise Marines in a box and charge you for 10 like they did for 7 Death Guard, then that's a whole other issue...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
New Termies and no new Havocs! Blasphemy!



But seriously, I wonder if Chaos Termies will finally get Combi-Plasmas?

Wouldn't be farfetched to assume that a revamped CSM kit will include a handful of heavy weapons to make Havocs out of. Also sounds like something they would do, not give you enough in one box to kit out duplicates which encourages buying multiple kits to have a unit with the same weapons

 NurglesR0T wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
New Termies and no new Havocs! Blasphemy!



But seriously, I wonder if Chaos Termies will finally get Combi-Plasmas?

Wouldn't be farfetched to assume that a revamped CSM kit will include a handful of heavy weapons to make Havocs out of. Also sounds like something they would do, not give you enough in one box to kit out duplicates which encourages buying multiple kits to have a unit with the same weapons

Optimum result would be a havoc box near identical to the sm devastator box. 5 bodies, and pairs of heavy weapons- heavy bolter, rocket launcher, lascannon, reaper autocannon, maybe ectoplasma cannon and one more, like baleflamer? Then some upgrades for the unit leader.

Csm squad will likely be just heavy bolter and reaper autocannon option for heavy, and flamer, melta, plasma for special, and leader options.

All I want to know is what is in the box set, and when I can buy it :(

We all do ritualnet.. we all do. This teasing and hyping is wearing on me.

Here’s a minority opinion: They shouldn’t bring out a havoc kit because havocs are just spiky devastators. Why do chaos marines have devastator squads?

Among the many things with chaos space marines that make no sense (starting with their stat line) is that they follow the codex astartes in their squad configuration, fielding tactical, devastator and assault squads. Why do they did they ever start doing that? Why are they still doing it, now that even the loyalist marines have stopped?

I don’t have a problem with there being CSMs with heavy weapons. But their organisation should be totally different. They should either follow the legion structure, say in the case of Iron Warriors, or for some of the more “out there” legions they should have barely any visible organisation at all.

I too demand rules leaks. I’m putting together a Primaris army for the GT finals. It’s looking like these models could be in shops the week before the event, which would mean some rapid painting on my part!

Mandragola wrote:
Here’s a minority opinion: They shouldn’t bring out a havoc kit because havocs are just spiky devastators. Why do chaos marines have devastator squads?

Among the many things with chaos space marines that make no sense (starting with their stat line) is that they follow the codex astartes in their squad configuration, fielding tactical, devastator and assault squads. Why do they did they ever start doing that? Why are they still doing it, now that even the loyalist marines have stopped?

I don’t have a problem with there being CSMs with heavy weapons. But their organisation should be totally different. They should either follow the legion structure, say in the case of Iron Warriors, or for some of the more “out there” legions they should have barely any visible organisation at all.

I too demand rules leaks. I’m putting together a Primaris army for the GT finals. It’s looking like these models could be in shops the week before the event, which would mean some rapid painting on my part!

So the marines that were in devastator equivalents during the HH should just put their heavy weapons down and go nuts with a bolt pistol and chainsword? What about chapters that have recently gone renegade?

Yeah, it's boring that they are just spikes marines, but the fluff justification of it is glaring and obvious.

There weren’t devastator equivalents in the heresy. There were heavy weapon squads, in which everyone had a heavy weapon. And I said I don’t have a problem with chaos marines with heavy weapons – just with CSM devastators.

To be fair to GW, the legion list didn’t exist when they wrote the fluff for chaos marines. But I’m pretty sure that the idea of the codex did, and it’s odd that CSMs follow it.

As for recent converts… yeah that’s a problem, and always has been. The age-old question of where their land speeders, razorbacks and assault cannons have gone and where they found reaper autocannons. I guess you can now add the question of what happened to all their Primaris stuff.

Personally I think it’d have been better to have “renegade” be a chapter tactic for normal marines and then do the old legions entirely separately. Or at least that would work for the fluff – I don’t know how well it would work in game balance terms.

Legion heavy weapon sergeants have the option to swap their heavy weapon for the normal mix of sergeant cc and ranged weapons. Maybe treat havoc squads more like long fangs than codex devastators.