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Don't they want to get all the articles out to the masses by EOD this Friday...before the pre-release? Won't all of the youtubers be out in force with new content showing off the codex as soon as the pre-release happens? Just wondering.

drakerocket wrote:

And the second thing that's bad for the hobby is the high lethality mixed with an IGOUGO system. One person gets to Slaughter the other player, then that player responds with whatever they have left. In such a lethal game, it sort of requires alternate activation, or the meta goes strait for alpha strike which really isn't fun at all. Or reduce the lethality if they want to stick with IGOUGO so people can enjoy using their units that they've spent hours building and painting.

40k will never reach its full potential as a game until alternating activations or even alternating sub-phases like Kill Team is implemented.

Everything is way too lethal in this game. You should be able to react to the opponent more.

In general I think the game would be a lot better with much reduced lethality. You'd get to have your nicely painted miniatures on the table longer. Everything wouldn't be about getting that alpha strike bomb off and just removing the opponent's best units before they get to do anything. And presumably the focus would shift more to completing objective and suppression or interfering with an opponents objectives, making it more tactically interesting.

Waaaghbert wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
They're quite late on today's article. I wonder if they're reworking it.

Yeah, I was wondering about that too. Maybe they'll skip it today because they released two yesterday?

They still haven't done Word Bearers right? If not I can see why that might take them some time as pretty much everything unique to them is HOT GARBAGE.

It might take a bit to shine that up to any presentable degree.

When I was developing Titanomachina I found that alternating activations has its own list of problems. What I did was have (a) card-driven activations, and then (b) separate resolution.

For example, player A would activate a Leg card to move, and player B would activate a Weapon card to shoot. If player B wanted to shoot at player A, they would have to shoot that Weapon at that Leg. No activated system, then player B would get a called shot. An initiative system meant that while B could activate in reaction to A, A could resolve before B (and run behind a building, for example).

In Warhammer terms imagine each unit in the army has a card. You play a card, and then your opponent plays a card. Those activated units can move, shoot, move & shoot, etc, but in relation to each other. Activated cards go on the bottom of the deck, so horde-based armies are balanced against MSU armies.

Something for the Game Design forum, but just thought I'd throw that in here.

Also that I miss the options of going to ground and pinning.

Mr.Church13 wrote:

Waaaghbert wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
They're quite late on today's article. I wonder if they're reworking it.

Yeah, I was wondering about that too. Maybe they'll skip it today because they released two yesterday?

They still haven't done Word Bearers right? If not I can see why that might take them some time as pretty much everything unique to them is HOT GARBAGE.

It might take a bit to shine that up to any presentable degree.

I doubt it unless they already added it to the 2.0 codex or Vigilus

 Brutus_Apex wrote:
40k will never reach its full potential as a game until alternating activations or even alternating sub-phases like Kill Team is implemented.

Everything is way too lethal in this game. You should be able to react to the opponent more.

I was preaching this for years but GW is not interested in this because it would require work. Just introduce homebrew rules for your group and everything will be fine. At least tanks can shoot laser beams from their antenna in 8th. That´s progress which GW likes.

WB UP
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/21/21st-mar-heretic-astartes-focus-the-word-bearersgw-homepage-post-1/

OMFG they actually NERFED the dark apostle a bit you need a 3+ to get his re-rolls ahah

oh no, lol. They made it worse, haha.

And the poor Word Bearers, their trait sucks

to be fair though, at least there are other options to use when the reroll hits isn't going to be in effect that turn. But still.....

So no new trait, as expected :(

and the prayer roll is a joke.....

New model is actually really awesome when given a quality paint job and a decent photo. I am sure they read the comments over the previous photo

Mixed feelings on the random power since

1. rerolls for days everywhere anyway

2. Apparently 11 total powers available to combo from means at least a few should be decent.

But failing a roll is going to be sour grapes, at least the attendants boost this and give a good excuse to run them.

Now to be fair he now has 6 prayers to choose from not just the re-roll. Technically not a nerf. We just haven't seen the others yet

That model though

His face looks stupid to me

Mr.Church13 wrote:

Waaaghbert wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
They're quite late on today's article. I wonder if they're reworking it.

Yeah, I was wondering about that too. Maybe they'll skip it today because they released two yesterday?

They still haven't done Word Bearers right? If not I can see why that might take them some time as pretty much everything unique to them is HOT GARBAGE.

It might take a bit to shine that up to any presentable degree.

Good news! They don't get anything unique.

Everything they focus on in that article is better as a corsair. Because then your melee troops being buffed can advance and charge.

----
Huh. Also out of everything yet presented for 'chaos marines', I want the disciples the most.

yeah, the model is worth adding alone. Should easily be able to be converted to a cool Ordo Malleus Inquisitor too

 Latro_ wrote:
WB UP
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/21/21st-mar-heretic-astartes-focus-the-word-bearersgw-homepage-post-1/

OMFG they actually NERFED the dark apostle a bit you need a 3+ to get his re-rolls ahah

If I had to guess they were concerned about the MW output from the rerolls and Shepherd of the True Faith, but jesus this make running a DA in a WE army less appealing unless you plan on running possessed instead of berserkers.

I really like the look of the new mechanic, very promising with a 2+. And that literal word-bearing disciple model is amazing...

This is how all chaos cultists should be. Not like mad max NPC's.

My life for Ner'zul!

That daemonkin strat seems pretty good though.

More pictures of Terminators:



Well those got Word Bearer decals.

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
In general I think the game would be a lot better with much reduced lethality. You'd get to have your nicely painted miniatures on the table longer. Everything wouldn't be about getting that alpha strike bomb off and just removing the opponent's best units before they get to do anything. And presumably the focus would shift more to completing objective and suppression or interfering with an opponents objectives, making it more tactically interesting.

So you want the game to last LONGER than it already does?

....Saying the Dark Apostle is nerfed now is pretty much like if they released a preview for guard orders in 8th ed and only showed off the 8th version of "bring it down" so you conclude "hot damn they've actually nerfed guard orders guard are gonna be the suxors now!"

They nerfed a fight phase reroll to hit, making it go off on a 3+.

Hey MEQ players you guys are a melee army right? You use those rerolls to hit in the fight phase all the time!

If a single one of those chants is defensive in nature or shooty in nature this is a buff to the DA.

The idea for the new Dark Apostle is really cool, but it depends on how good the other choices are; if you're only ever going to pick a Dark Apostle for one of them then yeah, this is a pretty unwarranted nerf. If nothing else, Omen of Potency makes it so that a Dark Apostle with the Black Mace hits about as hard as a Daemon Prince, which is fun.

The model is great, but I hope he has a helmeted version. >.>

I think we will get alpha legion later today, since i don't think they do reveals on saturday and they likely want all the previews out before pre orders go up, I think they will pair up emperor's children and world eaters since they are the mono god legions.

Also new dark apostle looks great apart from the head which is an easy fix, really looking forward to this release

Those cultist types with the Dark Apostle are what I've wanted for 40K for literally years.

GW, please give us a box of them! (Ideally mixed gender, and with options for lasguns to convert to Brood Brothers).

Amazing that Word Bearers (already a faction no one uses) is nerfed in a book that is barely playable if you use power armor. What in the world is the purpose of this unit now? They were already pretty bad except with Berserkers and now they're downright terrible.

Again, to say GW has some kind of game design direction is saying that throwing spaghetti against the wall is evidence of a "pattern".

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Albino Squirrel wrote:
In general I think the game would be a lot better with much reduced lethality. You'd get to have your nicely painted miniatures on the table longer. Everything wouldn't be about getting that alpha strike bomb off and just removing the opponent's best units before they get to do anything. And presumably the focus would shift more to completing objective and suppression or interfering with an opponents objectives, making it more tactically interesting.

So you want the game to last LONGER than it already does?

Not longer. Still it's gonna be 6 turns. In fact with less shooting the phases will end sooner and the duration of the game will shorten. What he means is: When I spend a month painting and polishing my great army centerpiece, don't make me put it back in the case before I get the chance to even roll some dice with it just because more damage could be translated as having more fun.

I know it's almost a heretical thought these days, but it's actually not a bad thing to have models left on the table at the end of the game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kirasu wrote:
Amazing that Word Bearers (already a faction no one uses) is nerfed in a book that is barely playable if you use power armor. What in the world do non-word bearer dark apostles do then? They were already pretty bad except with Berserkers and now they're downright terrible.

Again, to say GW has some kind of game design direction is saying that throwing spaghetti against the wall is evidence of a "pattern".

Maybe they gone to like 30 pts and you can spam them.

 Brutus_Apex wrote:
40k will never reach its full potential as a game until alternating activations or even alternating sub-phases like Kill Team is implemented.

Everything is way too lethal in this game. You should be able to react to the opponent more.

I really agree with this. It's just such a mad thing to keep IGOUGO when no other comparable game does. 8th ed feels like a potentially good game, ruined by a rotten mechanic right at its core.

At the UKGT this weekend there were at least two games that were obvioulsy going to be won by whoever went first. That basically applies to all games in which there are a lot of vehicles - which are just really good at killing each other. Fights between infantry tend to be resolved later once they start rapid firing and hitting each other in cc.

So I guess another solution might be modifiers to hit for range, like the old night fighting rules.