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AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
kingheff wrote: The bonesinger is a character but an elite, not an hq, similar to apocathary in marine lists.
No he means the Bonesinger datasheet in Legends show him as an HQ choice (skull icon)
Instead the previous elite one shown in older entries (crux terminatus)
kingheff wrote: The bonesinger is a character but an elite, not an hq, similar to apocathary in marine lists.
No he means the Bonesinger datasheet in Legends show him as an HQ choice (skull icon)
Instead the previous elite one shown in older entries (crux terminatus)
That is exactly the source of my confusion; Legends has the skull icon on the datasheet, but the points list the Bonesinger as an Elites choice.
Playing it as an Elite choice is probably the safer option as that's what it was before, but GW has certainly done random stuff like this before so who knows?
Madness is however an affliction which in war carries with it the advantage of surprise - Winston Churchill
Been playing with this list recently as there are now a lot of marines at my local while still maintaining some semblance of a take all comers list.
I think the obvious changes that could be made is to drop the Dark Reapers but they have been really effective when hidden well and with psychic support and the potential for an added 6 inches to their weapons they're a real menace and do well against intercessors.
There is no sheet for Bonesinger now, other than in Legends. That means that they're +20pts and an HQ choice, full stop. Anything else is a house rule and while that's cool and all, is not in the rules of the game.
So yeah, my understanding is that if you're playing Legends, it's an HQ, if you're not, it no longer exists as a unit.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/28 11:29:14
Tyranid Horde wrote: Been playing with this list recently as there are now a lot of marines at my local while still maintaining some semblance of a take all comers list.
I think the obvious changes that could be made is to drop the Dark Reapers but they have been really effective when hidden well and with psychic support and the potential for an added 6 inches to their weapons they're a real menace and do well against intercessors.
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
grouchoben wrote: There is no sheet for Bonesinger now, other than in Legends. That means that they're +20pts and an HQ choice, full stop. Anything else is a house rule and while that's cool and all, is not in the rules of the game.
So yeah, my understanding is that if you're playing Legends, it's an HQ, if you're not, it no longer exists as a unit.
Except for the fact that he's litteraly listed in CA 2019 as 55 pts model. Since CA was released after legends, it is the official book source.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Been playing with this list recently as there are now a lot of marines at my local while still maintaining some semblance of a take all comers list.
I think the obvious changes that could be made is to drop the Dark Reapers but they have been really effective when hidden well and with psychic support and the potential for an added 6 inches to their weapons they're a real menace and do well against intercessors.
Id try 3x3 reapers. Tou get a lot more value out of exarch traits and expert crafters and dont have to worry about guide.
I am personally not a fan of MSU reapers. Guide on the big unit in an army that hasn't got many other guide targets and the ability to get it to go off with focus will I find is immensely more valuable than a single reroll.
While MSU is useful in some aspects, they also can't be fire and faded into LoS blocking cover, or used as a good forewarned target with the Farseer.
Niiru wrote: Just curious what would be the recommended craftworld trait / custom traits for a small (750pts) wraith-heavy list?
Something like:
Spiritseer
Wraithseer
Guardian Squad
Wraithblades x6
2x Wraithlords (sword + shuriken cannons)
Was thinking Expert Crafters + something would be good. I did consider Wrath of the Dead, as well as Hail of Doom.
Suggestions?
my go-to with wraiths is Headstrong + wrath of the dead.
Expert crafters brings very little to big squads of wraiths, and since youre not running backfield lords, its basically unneeded.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/28 21:00:44
Tyranid Horde wrote: Been playing with this list recently as there are now a lot of marines at my local while still maintaining some semblance of a take all comers list. I think the obvious changes that could be made is to drop the Dark Reapers but they have been really effective when hidden well and with psychic support and the potential for an added 6 inches to their weapons they're a real menace and do well against intercessors.
Id try 3x3 reapers. Tou get a lot more value out of exarch traits and expert crafters and don't have to worry about guide.
I am personally not a fan of MSU reapers. Guide on the big unit in an army that hasn't got many other guide targets and the ability to get it to go off with focus will I find is immensely more valuable than a single reroll. While MSU is useful in some aspects, they also can't be fire and faded into LoS blocking cover, or used as a good forewarned target with the Farseer.
Then just don't guide? I don't even bother taking it anymore. Doom/smite/executioner and autarch reroll 1's.
I find having 3 exarchs in 3 different places on the board is better than 1 big blob. I like presenting 3 separate targets as opposed to 1 juicy target. If you layer lots more saturation on top as well as take advantage of their long range, most people won't bother wasting long-range firepower vs them because having MSU means they have to be severely overkilled(they are only T3 1 w models but with a 2+ in cover, they can shake most small arms/bolter shots) or risk having an exarch with 1 W and a tempest launcher chiling behing some LOS terrain for the rest of the game... Making people split shots and not allow focus fire is my style though. I like to use them more as fire support rather than the main damage dealers.
Having a big blob with guide certainly deletes stuff and works great too. I won't argue with that.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/28 23:47:34
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
Then just don't guide? I don't even bother taking it anymore.
Doom/smite/executioner and autarch reroll 1's.
ever since we got expert crafters i've been skipping doom/guide in all my lists. I usually run my farseer with fortune + executioner but thats because i'll usually run wraithblades that i want to protect+fortune+LFR
Does anyone put Wraithguard sword Axe and shield to footslog up with a warlock or are they exclusively Deepstruck/Wave serpented to the front line in your armies?
Im planning on running more wraith units and Im curious what other generals are running?
Does anyone put Wraithguard sword Axe and shield to footslog up with a warlock or are they exclusively Deepstruck/Wave serpented to the front line in your armies?
Im planning on running more wraith units and Im curious what other generals are running?
Axe+Shield can technically slog up the board on foot but you need to dumb a lot of resources into them to keep them alive (Protect, Fortune, LFR, Conceal, etc.) and to get them there (Quicken, matchless agility x2, ghostwalk)
Swords and Guards are just too fragile for their points and they basically HAVE to be protected somehow.
I personally always get 6 of them in a wave serpent with the -1 to hit engine when it advances. Put LFR on it and you force your opponent to break one nut open before getting to another layer of resilient models. Ive rarely had my wave serpent destroyed on turn 1(dont put it in a spot where their whole army can see it either.
Deepstriking is also an option but you have to make a custom craftworld with Headstrong (+1 to charges) and put Ghostwalk (+2 charge) on them. Needing a 6" charge has a lot more change of being successful than the traditional 9", especially if you have a wraithseer in there to make them charge on 3d6, keep the highest.
I feel like wraiths are a good solution to current marines because of their high toughness. They really fit well in a "hammer and anvil" type of list.
Does anyone put Wraithguard sword Axe and shield to footslog up with a warlock or are they exclusively Deepstruck/Wave serpented to the front line in your armies?
Im planning on running more wraith units and Im curious what other generals are running?
I use footslogging Wraithblades with axes on a regular basis. I'm not winning any tournaments (or even playing in them), but it does alright in casual games. The advantage of the unit is that it's reasonably difficult to kill and the opponent has to deal with them because they can kill pretty much anything in melee. It also allows you to control the center of the board, which can be quite useful in some scenarios.
I find it's usually sufficient to buff them with Protect and LFR; Fortune is nice, too, but not necessary. A Spiritseer with Protect/Jinx and Ghostwalk (from the Runes of Fortune) is usually all the buffing they need. They don't do well against things with a minimum 3 damage, like certain Imperial guns and close combat Dreadnoughts.
It also helps to attack the enemy with multiple threats at once -- deepstriking Wraithguard, bikes, planes, etc. Just throw as much dangerous stuff at the enemy as you can. A well-built army can kill most of a unit of Wraithblades in a turn, but if the enemy focuses on the Wraiths he's not killing your other units. And if the enemy tries to tie your Wraithblades up with a disposable unit, your other units can come in and help clear the Wraiths off.
Madness is however an affliction which in war carries with it the advantage of surprise - Winston Churchill
I used to run alitoic with swords blades and spirit seer inside a WS with both engine updates+spirit stones and Shuri cannons for a 2d6" +16" movement -2/-3 serpent bombing towards the most critical part of their line. Very fun especially if they take the bait and get scared of measily dmg 1 swords LFR that bad boy for a -3 to really rub it in.
Now days for fun I take 5 axes(or d-schythes) in a serpent with CTM plus twin heavy(EML or BL) + spirit stones with master crafters and concealment to go with the rest of the army and go character hunting. Have ghost walk/protect on spirit seer with seer of the shifting vector. And have another unit of wraithguard DS. ideally in specialist detachment. +1a attack is good value for 2 CP..
Im currently working on an alitoic list built around DS spirit seer and blades. Seer with shiftrshoud of alassanar to avid paying 2 CP to DS him in.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/30 21:29:50
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
I run 5 with a spirit seer(protect) and warlock(quicken) and it has always performed well. My scythes and swords go in serpents with guard in DS. It seems to be the most effective way to run those units IMHO.
kryczek wrote: I run 5 with a spirit seer(protect) and warlock(quicken) and it has always performed well. My scythes and swords go in serpents with guard in DS. It seems to be the most effective way to run those units IMHO.
Yeah I think I'll need to do this. My final casual list is looking like Falcons with Dire Avengers, Wave serpents with Scythes + Warlock and deepstriking the wraithblades in to be a distraction carnifex
I ran it at 1k vs UM tonight but I only had the seer with them. They really need the mobility of a quick-lock and the full investment is only for 2k+ in future IMHO.
That's me been utterly gubbbed by UM and IH in recent weeks, by crikey they are tough. Unit's just vaporise, mega frustrating.
replaying UM at 1.5k again shortly in a semi narrative mission from CA19 (pg29) the trap is sprung.
List I'm going to try is 2x battallion for 13CP, CWtrait: ignore cover and X?
Farseer: SS, Doom, Executioner,
Farseer: SS, Fortune, Mind war,
Autarch: stock,
Warlock: SS, Protect
5 DA with ex: 2x a-cats X5, (In WS)
18 defenders: 1xSC, (webway)
WW: 2 starcannon,
WL: 2 starcannon, Glaive,
WS Tw StCannon, SC, CTM, X3
I'm unsure of 2nd part of trait although I'm considering Masters of Concealent, warlord and DA powers and if anyone has any suggestions it would be appreciated.
Cheers.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/01 01:24:29
I think cramming 2 battalions in a 1.5k game is not going to work. Sadly, If you are looking to have a fair chance vs marines you have to take the most efficient options possible and be rutheless with your builds. Our troops/ wraiths, and HQs to a degree, are sadly not great.
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
Im going to finaly et to play a game tomorrow. Got a variation of the same concept in different formats. A sniping wraith built hybrid type lists. Mainly im just wanting to use the new midels I have been working on really... lol.
So Let me know which ones ya'll favirites and if theres anything that clearly wont work:
SO Im pretty attached to my wraithlords having ghost glaives and shuriken cannons. They are modelled with cool swords and shuricanon a piece so I find it realy hard to let go lol. The Wraithseers can be loaded out with anything as they are magnetised (apart from wraith cannons.. havent looked into modeling those plus I fully expect them to drop that option come FW update as they dont come with the kit). D cannon loook cool but at 35pts they just expensive on a model tat wants to be advancing/moving.
Also trying to fit shadow specters and warp spiders wherever possible because they cool units. However they want to be alitoic which is hard to fit into the overall army as expert crafters and concealment is mostly what the big wraiths want. However this creates opportunity of getting the wraithguard in the webway with a spirit seer for only 1 CP thanks to shiftshroud of altsanar. Anywya. Im pretty torn on this I need to make a decision and pack my gak at some points. Will be up vs deathguard. Last time was lots of marines and pox walkers plus those crazy flamer characters and the blight haulers. I experct to be up against 2-3 BPC.. Kind want 2 battalions so that I can heal my wraiths with tears of isha nad bone snger and have enough left over for extra atatcl start /invuln on wraithguard when they come out of DS.
I think its clear what im going for. Not sure how effective this is going to be though lol.
EDIT:
I played with list no.2 vs deathguard: Defiler, 3 PBC, 3 Blighhaulers, pox walkers, 1 marines, termies and two flamer dudes, 2 sorcerors, 2 lords I actually managed to Kill 2 PBCs the defiler and one blighauler plus all of his sorcerers and flamer dudes and most pox walkers by T3 but only had two wrath seers left and 2 units of reapers. I pretty much lost the game due to my own poor tactical decisions..Not knowing enemies army. I didn't screen my backside properly, thought the defiler has disgustingly resilient so didn't go for it, gave up my wave serpent way too easily as I overestimated PBC's flamers, and also forgot the wraith seers psychic powers all the time lol. I think the terrain didn't help as he could hide his characters from my sniping quite easily. Also he rolled 5's and 6's way above average his entire game for his disgustingly resilient so that did not help. Like he shrugged 8/11 wounds from 2 BL shots and made countless saves. Putting both wraiths and spirit seer in reserve was a mistake and waste of 2 CP which would have allowed for an LFR. Will play this list again soon because I liked using the models. But Would like to try same thing with alitoic and have a couple of spectres and warp spiders for screening...
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/02/09 22:56:11
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
How do you guys feel about warp spiders now? I've had some decent success with deepstriking + the exarch surprise assault power. Free re-rolls to hit anywhere on the board is pretty awesome for grabbing objectives
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/24 00:55:03
Eldar- 4436 pts
LFR that bad boy for a -3 to really rub it in.
Craftworlds Eldar: 8500
Harlequins: 1000
Raven Guard: 1500