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I ask this as Chaos Space Marines haven't been given the Primaris treatment, which is fair, but I think that to be what they were meant to be, they need something to fit the gap, however large or small it may be. That being said, I would really like it if they brought out:

1) Named characters for each Legion, such as Kor Phaeron, Erebrus, Shon'tu, etc. Chaos Primarchs would be welcomed but would seem like an overkill until the Imperium starts to get theirs. Seeings as all the Codex Chapters got new and improved Rubicon-Primaris, I don't see why it should be a problem for Games Workshop to whip up something decent.

2) Xenos courts, similar to what the Drukari have, as they have dealings with them in the Eye of Terror (Abaddon the Despoiler and the Black Crusades) and in the Maelstrom (Huron Blackheart and the Red Corsairs/other renegade warbands). Of course, they wouldn't be multipose, but just having them on the tabletop would match the lore.

What do you think they should be given, if at all? Thoughts? Suggestions? Criticisms?

Snipers.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Snipers.

Fair point. Good suggestion!

Honestly, if chosen could just have access to something that makes them at least almost an equivalent of a veteran besides being a budget berserker or special weapons. I would imagine if they could be like Horus heresy veterans that could pick a special rule to tack on like improving to hit in melee by one, sniper and outflank, etc. to drive home that they are supposed to be a scalpel designed for a very particular job. Also if they could expand on Chaos Space Marine apothecaries more than Fabius Bile, like maybe making Fabius bile work on a larger scale than he does now like 2 units at a time and make mini Biles priced where he is now and make bile more expensive by comparison. The issue in my opinion is simply that rather than give chaos space marines troops and chosen an identity, they made them the cheapest MEQ’s in the game with no actual flavor. Also possessed need to simply actually work without a Rube Goldberg machine and points drops to be mediocre instead of crap and disappointing. Most of the answers are in the codex and are even written elsewhere... I even feel like the Horus heresy itself (like gal verbal for possessed) would be a spectacular place to start looking. The problems I foresee is that at least the chosen overhaul idea would require a great deal of reworking the current codex. As long as you don’t intend to run generic Chaos space marines, or most MeQ’s For that matter, I suppose the codex has flavor XD it would help if every time we got something cool the space marines didn’t instantly get a dirt cheap hard counter for it...

Do a supplement with datasheets for the unique units from Legions that don't have theirs. Or don't have enough of theirs. Palatine Blades. Tyrant Terminators. Red Butchers. 30k is full of ideas.

The problem is trying to make the codex a catch-all. It should solely focus on the Legions, period. Consolidate Death Guard and Thousand Sons, update the Legion Traits, and give everything Vet stats at minimum.

Renegades should be handled in Codex Marines to begin with.

Here I was thinking I was insane for dreaming of porting the Horus heresy rules to 40k... I mean we are already half way there if you think about it.

I think the best idea would be to focus on more heavily mutated versions of conventional units. Like warp talons and even obliterators. A dual kit for oblits-mutilators is obviously needed, but a box of terminator-sized infantry that are in-between normal marines and them could work as well. Havocs where the gun has become a daemonic parasite and the marine is simply a puppet. Infantry with mutated limbs giving them faster move speed and pile-in/consolidation bonuses. There's plenty of ways they could go.

 Psionara wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Snipers.

Fair point. Good suggestion!

AL can have a sniper, but it requires a warlord trait, and a relic would be helpful.

My answer is doctrines.

I swear you half described what possessed basically are with the whole mutated limbs and movement speed thing. Spawn almost fit that bill too.

Better rules. The range is plenty diverse.

Legion traits on vehicles. Snipers (or give chosen the ability to take sniper rifle). The other 2 primarchs. Doctrines.

I think splitting the legions out to leave legions their own paths and then have a renegades/plain csm book extra that focuses more on the daemon encrusted weirdo units that arent god/legion specifc

Splitting renegades and legions, the renegades would be cheaper closer to current CSM(maybe a bit cheaper) points with no doctrines as they are not as well organized. Then the legion models would be much more elite for veterans but would be kind of expensive(compared to renegades) points wise for the veteran stats and would have a chaos version of doctrines.

snipers would be nice.

As much as primarchs would be nice I also kind of don’t want to see more of them, they are a balance nightmare, because they are either over costed trash for their abilities or they are way to good. They just don’t really fit well in 40k.

Forgot to add that it would be nice if now vehicles got that legion traits now that loyalists get them.

Split renegades and legions, give renegades limited access to loyalist weaponry and vehicles. Give legions the equivalent of the old "DIY Veteran traits" from 3.5

Or they could double down on Chaos having weird amalgamations and warp-infused mockeries of loyalist weapons and stuff. Since Heretek's don't have the "let's not touch this we don't understand it" stuff like AdMech, they should be using warp touched stuff all over the place. Ectoplasma insead of plasma, baleflamers instead of flamers, etc. double down on that.

I doubt it will happen, but I'd personally love to see 1-2 unique units for every traitor legion. We sort of have this already for death guard, world eaters and thousand sons, but not for the other ones.
Also I think it would be awsome if every legion could use all the specific, special units of other traitor legions like khorne berserkers, but if they only use their own ones, they get additional small boni.

Also please give mutilators new rules and models to make them interesting again....they really deserve it.

- New Characters for every legion

-Character options that include bikes, jump packs, terminator armour for everyone.

-New Chosen models with an insane amount of weapon options including sniper weapons

-Chosen Terminators with 3 wounds and some special weapons and rules to go with them

-Daemonically Possessed Biker unit. Possibly Jet Bikes from the Heresey Era with some of those weapon loadouts

-Daemonically Possessed unit of huge marines, more the size of Obliterators, but that are actually fast.

-Dread Claw

-Razorback

-Daemonically Possessed Land Raider with huge unit carrying capacity and Bale Flamers/Hades Autocannons

-An actual flying transport

I'd rather have less characters and more focus on units.

They've been spamming far too many characters lately, special and otherwise. Most with trivial or absurdly specific bonuses and absurd prices.

Character hammer is the worst way to go. The rare occasion that a special character gets dragged out a codex is a cause for celebration, as the game and the setting gets bigger by default.

An actual chosen box and yet another (better) attempt at possessed would be nice.



Partly, too, I don't think chaos marines need much expansion. Renegades, xenos, and the little armies (ad mech, sisters, daemons) I could see expanding those.

I just want models to match fluff. Traitor guard rules and models. Stalk tanks. Wire wolves. Chaos marines should be more expensive than loyalist and have better stats and drastically different wargear options than loyalist counterparts. They're regular marines + chaos bonuses. Why are they cheaper with worse stats? Makes zero sense to me. Also, the master of possession should not have been a psyker. He should've had ritual rules somewhere in between the psyker and prayer rules.

Big ritual type abilities that are always being attempted in the fluff. All the weapons in the lexicanum that aren't in the tabletop yet. Warp abilities that "taint" their victims like that we hear about all the time in the fluff. The ability to sacrifice/backstab units for interesting effects. Drop pods and sniper/assassins.

It would make sense Chaos just get Fortis Marines. Literally stronger marines. Chaos have always been on the nose, why stop now?

Then the name of Fortis can be made up of any fluff reason why they're stronger. Imbued with the rituals of the chosen. Their bodies can now accept more chaos gifts before corruption.

I dunno use your imagination.

Chaos marines are limited in that they must always be strictly worse than loyalists at everything except dying in droves like good NPC mooks (which their -1 pt helps accomplish). I think they're working as intended.

Armies in 40K don't need expansion. They simply need honest, well thought out balance. Expansion is, however, the GW model.

macluvin wrote:
Here I was thinking I was insane for dreaming of porting the Horus heresy rules to 40k... I mean we are already half way there if you think about it.

They don't all work (Heresy-era Thousand Sons are pre-Rubric, for instance) but where did the Headhunters go? Why are there no Berzerkers in Terminator armour (Red Butchers)? Did the Night Lords just to a Legionnaire decide the glaives weren't cool anymore one day?

Some sort of indication as to whether EC and WE get the DG/TS treatment or not.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Some sort of indication as to whether EC and WE get the DG/TS treatment or not.

Based on the book Faith and Fury. I'm gonna go with probably not in 8th edition.

This topic is a bottomless pit, so I'm gonna go with certain concepts that I'd like to see more of.

The human/xenos/etc aspect. There are tons of heretical humans or warp denizen mercenaries and what have you, dark mech, experiments and so on and so forth.
All we have now is really lame cultists (not counting R&H, which are holding on by the skin of their teeth atm).
The warp is an equal opportunities employer.

Which brings me to cults. There should be much more synergy there . I'd like to see something like a tome of X which works on anything. Could just be one book for all cults.
Everything down to inanimate objects can be possessed and/or corrupted and doing so in the lore is way more impressive than unlocking 1 psychic power which may not even work.
And ye gods, improve the daemonic gifts mechanic already, I find myself forgetting it is even a thing these days.

More Possession (not just the unit). We even had rules to possess vehicles, bring that back. Also, stop it with the randumb already.
Ideally allow anything to become possessed as per a tome of X. This would include daemonic weapons.
The Legacies or ruin were a really cool idea for example, or even just ammo variants, like malefic ammunition. IA had a ton of stuff like this and the index is a hollow shell of that.
Nobody used them because they were expensive as all hell mostly, but they were really cool.

More warp affinity. Of all factions in 40k, chaos worshippers would be both the most willing and most able to push their psychic abilities harder.
And this comes with benefits and risks as per my next point. Maybe even change how spells work, like turning a ranged direct spell into an AOE.

This plays into a risk/rewad system at large. The faction is somewhat self-destructive, but it comes with a bunch of perks.
Say you want to cast a spell multiple times, sure, but you don't just risk perils, you explode and that kind of stuff.
Enhance units at will, but face increasing odds of mortal wounds as you go, etc.
Or like the Red butchers stratagem, it's a pure buff, but it costs you precious CP

They need to stop expanding "CSM" and delve into individuating the primary legions in the same style as TS and DG!

I am tempted to run my OG marines as not loyalists with an irdo malleus inquisitor given that numarines are heresy. If one other person helped make this a thing then yeay. No chaos exactly. Just not loyalist mahweenies

Standardized drop pods like we see for Space Marines?