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I for one am quite excited by PA5. It's given me exactly what I wanted for my IG, which is the ability to play them in new ways without cheesing my way through.

Armoured companies look like they could be fun to run again, mechanised Scions, even just scions with meltas and flamers have a purpose.

The -1 Ap bonus combined with the +1 to wound might even make grenade launchers almost viable. Still nowhere near as good as plasma, but for the sake of variety and rule of cool, playable without handicapping yourself.

Supplements might be just more bloat for competitive players, but for non-competitive people like me, it gives me flavour to add to my army.

I think that whoever has been doing IG rules for 8th clearly enjoys playing them themselves.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I love the idea of PA. Another person’s ‘bloat’ is my ‘complexity’ I guess. It is money hungry but this isn’t new for GW. They are one of the most successful British companies of recent times for a reason.

The only thing I wished they did differently in PA is give all factions equal love in terms of models and rules. Some factions have obviously had favouritism.

PA6 and Thraka next and I’m really interested to see if SW get no new character (something I find very unlikely but at the same time it will make clear the disparity in how GW treats it’s poster boys compared to other factions). Obviously I’m also interested in the green skin rules. Hopefully my biker gang, mad max style army gets a boost. I love having more choices so I’d quite like these ‘not-warlord traits’ for units too ala Adaptive Physiology. Do any of the reliable French guys have rumours on the next book? Will there be a boxed set?

While I appreciate the power, it isn't complex it's just bits and pieces from other in game assets ported to other factions that didn't already have them. With maybe a small tweak here or there and some new strats that give +1 to this, -1 to that , half this, ignore that. It's not really complex its just buffs. While I can appreciate them for my factions, I'm not blind to what it is and why I'm getting it.

The only reason I say any of this is in the hopes people on the fence actually know what GW is doing. Not everyone has played the game forever and see's their patterns. It's also important to know what you are buying and they are power jumps, not campaigns and not really mandatory unless you like being behind the 8 ball in most games. Which, assuming Grey Knights players feelings , isn't all that fun.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 small_gods wrote:

AngryAngel80 wrote:
Yes but while this is a fine theory, we've seen GW change dramatic direction at the drop of a hat. As well, while testing is good,

I'd be much happier to beta test for them for free as opposed to have to be buying half baked product to test their theory on things just to probably have them do the more consistent thing they do and scrap it all, call no joy and just start the whole process again. Which judging by how they usually operate is the far more likely outcome.

I see this argument all the time and just don't get it. GW is not omniscient, it is impossible to know exactly how balanced thousands of rules and hundreds of units will be. You can tweek things with points changes but at some point they have to bring out new rules to stop all eldar players only using alaitoc flyers and to allow thousand sons to not have to soup etc.

Also I can't imagine any large company giving away books for free, for several years.

You don't need to be Nostrildomus to see and know that if you don't bloat thousands of rules all over the place it's much easier to find balance. At this point, assuming balance is the name of the game is silly. They want to power up people, so people feel excited and buy the books, and expand their collections or start new ones. Hype sells. They aren't gods of planning but neither do they have to be. As well plenty of companies put out beta rules for free to try things out before they go into full production or settle on a final game state to push. GW is not the hungry orphan child asking please sir may I have some more ?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sentineil wrote:
I for one am quite excited by PA5. It's given me exactly what I wanted for my IG, which is the ability to play them in new ways without cheesing my way through.

Armoured companies look like they could be fun to run again, mechanised Scions, even just scions with meltas and flamers have a purpose.

The -1 Ap bonus combined with the +1 to wound might even make grenade launchers almost viable. Still nowhere near as good as plasma, but for the sake of variety and rule of cool, playable without handicapping yourself.

Supplements might be just more bloat for competitive players, but for non-competitive people like me, it gives me flavour to add to my army.

I think that whoever has been doing IG rules for 8th clearly enjoys playing them themselves.

I had to quote just to say this is right on. The armored forces did get a lot of love. Like one of my honorable mentions is sentinels, for me I only have armored sentinels and they got some good stuff in this release so I'm thrilled.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
PA6 and Thraka next and I’m really interested to see if SW get no new character (something I find very unlikely but at the same time it will make clear the disparity in how GW treats it’s poster boys compared to other factions). Obviously I’m also interested in the green skin rules. Hopefully my biker gang, mad max style army gets a boost. I love having more choices so I’d quite like these ‘not-warlord traits’ for units too ala Adaptive Physiology. Do any of the reliable French guys have rumours on the next book? Will there be a boxed set?

Given we've seeing the Kelermorph finally get an individual release alongside TGG, what'll your position be if the SW Lieutenant finally gets a blister release alongside Saga, as opposed to being in a big boxed set and a SC set?

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I love the idea of PA. Another person’s ‘bloat’ is my ‘complexity’ I guess. It is money hungry but this isn’t new for GW. They are one of the most successful British companies of recent times for a reason.

The only thing I wished they did differently in PA is give all factions equal love in terms of models and rules. Some factions have obviously had favouritism.

PA6 and Thraka next and I’m really interested to see if SW get no new character (something I find very unlikely but at the same time it will make clear the disparity in how GW treats it’s poster boys compared to other factions). Obviously I’m also interested in the green skin rules. Hopefully my biker gang, mad max style army gets a boost. I love having more choices so I’d quite like these ‘not-warlord traits’ for units too ala Adaptive Physiology. Do any of the reliable French guys have rumours on the next book? Will there be a boxed set?

Honestly I'm in the same boat, I like the additional stuff. there sometimes I think GW misses the mark, but by and large I love having options. new ways to play a game, UNPREDIABILITY.

if you and I sit down for a game, I want both our armies to do well, I want us to each have options (to the point where everyone's army feels slightly differant) and I want to have FUN. Some of the people on this forum I don't think I'd wanna play with at all. for what it's worth AAE, we occasionally but heads but I think we both want the same thing from the game.

 small_gods wrote:

AngryAngel80 wrote:
Yes but while this is a fine theory, we've seen GW change dramatic direction at the drop of a hat. As well, while testing is good,

I'd be much happier to beta test for them for free as opposed to have to be buying half baked product to test their theory on things just to probably have them do the more consistent thing they do and scrap it all, call no joy and just start the whole process again. Which judging by how they usually operate is the far more likely outcome.

I see this argument all the time and just don't get it. GW is not omniscient, it is impossible to know exactly how balanced thousands of rules and hundreds of units will be. You can tweek things with points changes but at some point they have to bring out new rules to stop all eldar players only using alaitoc flyers and to allow thousand sons to not have to soup etc.

Also I can't imagine any large company giving away books for free, for several years.

Competent designers could do lot better though with testing, number crunching and not deliberately reseting things just to sell books.

Gw's idea of testing is give couple premade armies and ask how it went.

They clearly don't give finished text to new person(ie one who didn't write it) to read through since so much obvious errors is spotted instantly by others. If random player can spot those professionals should as well.

But then again gw staff aren't professionals nor is gw hiring based on skill. For gw what matters more than skill is how loud you shout waaaaagh or for the emperor.

tneva82 wrote:They clearly don't give finished text to new person(ie one who didn't write it) to read through since so much obvious errors is spotted instantly by others. If random player can spot those professionals should as well.

But then again gw staff aren't professionals nor is gw hiring based on skill. For gw what matters more than skill is how loud you shout waaaaagh or for the emperor

I feel like you're not exactly giving "random player" enough credit. He's not just a random guy, he's thousands of sets of eyes with different points of view and interpretations. The public will always be better at spotting flaws than any designer, be it a game, a car or a lamp. For 40k, given the release rate of books they in no way get to play multiple test games with every combination of factions, while on day 1 we the players will easily achieve it.

Indeed.

Play testing is, by necessity, a limited affair. Only some folks trusted to give honest feedback, and not go sharing materials etc. And given you want to release it at some point, your time window is finite.

Soon as it hits the shelves? Any play test time is eclipsed as thousands get their mitts on it.

Some feedback and comments will be constructive. Some sour grapes, removed - rule #1 please

 small_gods wrote:

AngryAngel80 wrote:
Yes but while this is a fine theory, we've seen GW change dramatic direction at the drop of a hat. As well, while testing is good,

I'd be much happier to beta test for them for free as opposed to have to be buying half baked product to test their theory on things just to probably have them do the more consistent thing they do and scrap it all, call no joy and just start the whole process again. Which judging by how they usually operate is the far more likely outcome.

I see this argument all the time and just don't get it. GW is not omniscient, it is impossible to know exactly how balanced thousands of rules and hundreds of units will be. You can tweek things with points changes but at some point they have to bring out new rules to stop all eldar players only using alaitoc flyers and to allow thousand sons to not have to soup etc.

Also I can't imagine any large company giving away books for free, for several years.

It's shocking idea, I know, but they could try not releasing books and instead giving rules for free online if they know they're essentially just beta testing or figuring things out. Like the initial indexes, those could've been free PDFs and it wouldve smoothed the transition to codexes quite a bit as far as PR was concerned. Same for chapter approved. They're making record profits, don't pretend they couldn't afford for that to be a free update online as a PDF so its easily accessible. Not only for PR, but to make it widely accessible so all players are aware of it and actually using it. Think about the outrage people had for the latest Chapter approved where they paid $40 for a balance patch and it had glaring issues day one. If that was a free off people would've been annoyed but they would understand.

And to a degree, pyschic awakening and vigilus are this way too, but there's a lot more argument for them to be paid for when they have campaign rules and lore. I just wish they felt like they were worth the $40-50 they run, especially when Gw insists on hardback for so many of their books. I remember times in college where my books were cheaper than my 40k ones, and that's a bit concerning. The pyschic awakening books feel like $30 paperbacks, not really much more than that. Because in many ways they're a balance patch with some lore thrown in, they're not brand new codexes, unless you're playing marines and most likely admech of course.

But that's mainly just a gripe I have about GW's book situation. If they weren't often riddled with typos and errors that needed to be patched, perhaps they'd feel like more value. If GW either did that or lowered the cost people wouldn't balk as much when new books are released. Especially if the chapter approved was free.

 Sentineil wrote:

tneva82 wrote:They clearly don't give finished text to new person(ie one who didn't write it) to read through since so much obvious errors is spotted instantly by others. If random player can spot those professionals should as well.

But then again gw staff aren't professionals nor is gw hiring based on skill. For gw what matters more than skill is how loud you shout waaaaagh or for the emperor

I feel like you're not exactly giving "random player" enough credit. He's not just a random guy, he's thousands of sets of eyes with different points of view and interpretations. The public will always be better at spotting flaws than any designer, be it a game, a car or a lamp. For 40k, given the release rate of books they in no way get to play multiple test games with every combination of factions, while on day 1 we the players will easily achieve it.

Then they shouldn't be releasing books at that rate and actually take care into what goes into their product, big think time

 Sentineil wrote:

tneva82 wrote:They clearly don't give finished text to new person(ie one who didn't write it) to read through since so much obvious errors is spotted instantly by others. If random player can spot those professionals should as well.

But then again gw staff aren't professionals nor is gw hiring based on skill. For gw what matters more than skill is how loud you shout waaaaagh or for the emperor

I feel like you're not exactly giving "random player" enough credit. He's not just a random guy, he's thousands of sets of eyes with different points of view and interpretations. The public will always be better at spotting flaws than any designer, be it a game, a car or a lamp. For 40k, given the release rate of books they in no way get to play multiple test games with every combination of factions, while on day 1 we the players will easily achieve it.

Lol. I do not have thousands of eyes to help me yet i spot mistakes quickly. If i can do so could professional. But gw doesn't do things professionally. They don't have proper playtesting(they literally give premade lists so forget about seeing too cheap. Hard to say is stuff too cheap when you don't see costs...). And evidently they either don't give final version to anybody who hasn't written text or if they do they give to one who can't read. We aren't dealing even hard to spot errors but dirt simple ones. 55 pts basic troops indeed. Assault weapons that still don't work. Bybass rotate ion shield with heavy bolter. If gw claims they have professionals they are either lying or are idiots depending on do they believe claim or not.

Gw isn't professional game maker and it shows. Ability to shout waaagh is more important than professional writer's ability.

Don't give them credit on being professionals when they aren''t.

Any random player will know broken combos from leaks in no time as well. 40k isn't complex game and what's broken is seif evident. So either it's intentional or writer is just rando average fan putting in what he thinks is cool with zero thought about balance

tneva82 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

tneva82 wrote:They clearly don't give finished text to new person(ie one who didn't write it) to read through since so much obvious errors is spotted instantly by others. If random player can spot those professionals should as well.

But then again gw staff aren't professionals nor is gw hiring based on skill. For gw what matters more than skill is how loud you shout waaaaagh or for the emperor

I feel like you're not exactly giving "random player" enough credit. He's not just a random guy, he's thousands of sets of eyes with different points of view and interpretations. The public will always be better at spotting flaws than any designer, be it a game, a car or a lamp. For 40k, given the release rate of books they in no way get to play multiple test games with every combination of factions, while on day 1 we the players will easily achieve it.

Lol. I do not have thousands of eyes to help me yet i spot mistakes quickly. If i can do so could professional. But gw doesn't do things professionally. They don't have proper playtesting(they literally give premade lists so forget about seeing too cheap. Hard to say is stuff too cheap when you don't see costs...). And evidently they either don't give final version to anybody who hasn't written text or if they do they give to one who can't read. We aren't dealing even hard to spot errors but dirt simple ones. 55 pts basic troops indeed. Assault weapons that still don't work. Bybass rotate ion shield with heavy bolter. If gw claims they have professionals they are either lying or are idiots depending on do they believe claim or not.

Gw isn't professional game maker and it shows. Ability to shout waaagh is more important than professional writer's ability.

Don't give them credit on being professionals when they aren''t.

Any random player will know broken combos from leaks in no time as well. 40k isn't complex game and what's broken is seif evident. So either it's intentional or writer is just rando average fan putting in what he thinks is cool with zero thought about balance

Get back on topic please, we get it, you don't like GW, move on.

It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I love the idea of PA. Another person’s ‘bloat’ is my ‘complexity’ I guess.

The problem is that it's not really any more complex in most instances, allowing something to hit on 2's or automatically get max number of shots or count their AP/Damage as being one better really isn't adding depth, it's just adding direct attritional combat utility in the most straightforward way possible.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

 Dysartes wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
PA6 and Thraka next and I’m really interested to see if SW get no new character (something I find very unlikely but at the same time it will make clear the disparity in how GW treats it’s poster boys compared to other factions). Obviously I’m also interested in the green skin rules. Hopefully my biker gang, mad max style army gets a boost. I love having more choices so I’d quite like these ‘not-warlord traits’ for units too ala Adaptive Physiology. Do any of the reliable French guys have rumours on the next book? Will there be a boxed set?

Given we've seeing the Kelermorph finally get an individual release alongside TGG, what'll your position be if the SW Lieutenant finally gets a blister release alongside Saga, as opposed to being in a big boxed set and a SC set?

I'd be surprised if SW didn't get an entirely new model aka Ragnar. A separate release of a previously available model is not favouritism, for me. Can't see it though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BrianDavion wrote:

Honestly I'm in the same boat, I like the additional stuff. there sometimes I think GW misses the mark, but by and large I love having options. new ways to play a game, UNPREDIABILITY.

if you and I sit down for a game, I want both our armies to do well, I want us to each have options (to the point where everyone's army feels slightly differant) and I want to have FUN. Some of the people on this forum I don't think I'd wanna play with at all. for what it's worth AAE, we occasionally but heads but I think we both want the same thing from the game.

I love you too bro.

I also completely agree with what you've stated so far, variety and flexibility is key and GW are trying to give every faction some of it.

Adding variety and flavor to factions is what I want from these books. The problem is that they don't do that equally among factions. Sm chapters are given rules that make them act as they should for free. Other factions lose all their uniqueness once the cp runs out.

That said I love what Faith and Fury gave to Night Lords. Whoever wrote that stuff was mainlineing ADB's trilogy.

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

I'm not really bothered by bloat - I feel its part and parcel of the game.

I guess I am a bit negative about this build your own faction stuff. I had a dream that the chapters system would allow for GW to explore alternate design space within factions. This has happened for Marines - i.e. an RG army doesn't look like an IH army - but it is rarer elsewhere. We are now in a sort of internal-soup world, where mixing and matching to optimise rules in a detachment rather than an army is clearly the intent. Which is fine, but a bit sad. It means they will likely never fix the weaker "chapters" because... just take the good custom traits.

I know some people will enjoy making their dues *their dudes* - but for the most part it is just "take X and Y, its the best".

I think IG and Tau have benefited from this book both in terms of power, but also in opening at least slightly different builds to what currently existed. This might be a false hope - but I think people will at least try say Farsight Enclaves and custom traits.

GSC sadly seem to have got the weaker end of the stick. There may be some sleeper hits in there but the psychic powers seem kind of meh, while the new traits seem uninspired. I mean... ignore moving and shooting with heavy weapons, reroll mining laser misses on an army which spams neophytes like they are going out of fashion. If you don't rate that 6++ arguably its better that bladed cog. But it doesn't feel like its opening a new... way to play. You are just swapping one buff for another.

I can for example imagine Orks will get the same. But I'd like... idk, to see something different. Not see the clan traits get cut up, say you can put the peices together, plus a few new ones that probably don't... really stack up.

I mean for buggy lists maybe there would be something in being able to combine deathskulls reroll a hit, a wound and (where relevant) a damage roll, with ignoring the penalty for shooting after advancing. But its not really... exciting. If that makes sense.

I wouldn't be surprised if SW get something, but if it was a vaguely fluff relevant model I think it would have been shown off by now.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for News and Rumours don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for [I]News and Rumours [\i]don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

So when we get the news about terrible layouts or rules or pricing, they're gonna be discussed. Simple as that. If all you want is positivity and always giving the benefit of the doubt no matter what, go to their official pages.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for [I]News and Rumours [\i]don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

So when we get the news about terrible layouts or rules or pricing, they're gonna be discussed. Simple as that. If all you want is positivity and always giving the benefit of the doubt no matter what, go to their official pages.

If you want to obsessively complain about their products and not contribute to the topic at hand, please direct yourself to the GW feedback emails and stop cluttering the thread.

Gadzilla666 wrote:Adding variety and flavor to factions is what I want from these books. The problem is that they don't do that equally among factions. Sm chapters are given rules that make them act as they should for free. Other factions lose all their uniqueness once the cp runs out.

That said I love what Faith and Fury gave to Night Lords. Whoever wrote that stuff was mainlineing ADB's trilogy.

If you run out of CP and your army is entirely based on using it, it should start sucking. If I run out of units that can take objectives & the game win condition is objectives, my army should start to suck. CP is a resource and you should manage it appropriately. I rarely use all of my CP & most of them are spent on re-rolls & two 1CP strats.

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for [I]News and Rumours [\i]don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

So when we get the news about terrible layouts or rules or pricing, they're gonna be discussed. Simple as that. If all you want is positivity and always giving the benefit of the doubt no matter what, go to their official pages.

If you want to obsessively complain about their products and not contribute to the topic at hand, please direct yourself to the GW feedback emails and stop cluttering the thread.

I have sent emails. Also people here have every right to complain about a shoddy product.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Racerguy180 wrote:

Gadzilla666 wrote:Adding variety and flavor to factions is what I want from these books. The problem is that they don't do that equally among factions. Sm chapters are given rules that make them act as they should for free. Other factions lose all their uniqueness once the cp runs out.

That said I love what Faith and Fury gave to Night Lords. Whoever wrote that stuff was mainlineing ADB's trilogy.

If you run out of CP and your army is entirely based on using it, it should start sucking. If I run out of units that can take objectives & the game win condition is objectives, my army should start to suck. CP is a resource and you should manage it appropriately. I rarely use all of my CP & most of them are spent on re-rolls & two 1CP strats.

Yeah, screw the Chaos Marine players that want a functional army, screw those Harlequins players too!
GW making armies function off an outside resource is ridiculous.

Racerguy180 wrote:

Gadzilla666 wrote:Adding variety and flavor to factions is what I want from these books. The problem is that they don't do that equally among factions. Sm chapters are given rules that make them act as they should for free. Other factions lose all their uniqueness once the cp runs out.

That said I love what Faith and Fury gave to Night Lords. Whoever wrote that stuff was mainlineing ADB's trilogy.

If you run out of CP and your army is entirely based on using it, it should start sucking. If I run out of units that can take objectives & the game win condition is objectives, my army should start to suck. CP is a resource and you should manage it appropriately. I rarely use all of my CP & most of them are spent on re-rolls & two 1CP strats.

I didn't say they SUCKED I said they stopped being unique, ie. a Night Lords army plays just like a black legion army that has the same list composition without strategems.

My point was that strategems are required to make certain factions play to their fluff while others play to their fluff without them. I find that to be unequal design philosophy. Gw places too much emphasis on strategem use for certain armies.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Spoiler:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for [I]News and Rumours [\i]don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

So when we get the news about terrible layouts or rules or pricing, they're gonna be discussed. Simple as that. If all you want is positivity and always giving the benefit of the doubt no matter what, go to their official pages.

If you want to obsessively complain about their products and not contribute to the topic at hand, please direct yourself to the GW feedback emails and stop cluttering the thread.

I have sent emails. Also people here have every right to complain about a shoddy product.

Then you've complained in the correct place, this thread is about psychic awakening and not for your personal monologue.

Dragging it back on topic, now we've seen a 4 faction book I'm slightly less nervous about engine wars mishandling some of the factions. If they give all 4 of those factions similar coverage, that'll be nice.

Racerguy180 wrote:

Gadzilla666 wrote:Adding variety and flavor to factions is what I want from these books. The problem is that they don't do that equally among factions. Sm chapters are given rules that make them act as they should for free. Other factions lose all their uniqueness once the cp runs out.

That said I love what Faith and Fury gave to Night Lords. Whoever wrote that stuff was mainlineing ADB's trilogy.

If you run out of CP and your army is entirely based on using it, it should start sucking. If I run out of units that can take objectives & the game win condition is objectives, my army should start to suck. CP is a resource and you should manage it appropriately. I rarely use all of my CP & most of them are spent on re-rolls & two 1CP strats.

Yeah, I'm going to have to decide if the extra warlord traits, relics, and new unit buffs are actually worth taking, mono Genestealer Cult can blow through CP so easily. I used to consider Perfect Ambush/Lying in Wait/They Came From Below as essential stratagems, but they also eat up a ton of CP just to give my deepstrikers a good chance of doing something useful before they die next turn. I can spend 5-8 CP on good stuff before the first round even begins.


Extra Relic: 1/3 CP (we have great relics, I think it's worth taking at least 1 extra)
Specialist Detachment: 1 CP - Deliverance Broodsurge
Specialist Warlord Trait: 1 CP - Charge reroll aura (Patriarch has to be the Warlord if its in your list, and he can't take this)
Broodcoven: 1 CP - 2 extra warlord traits
Cult's Psyche: 1 CP - cast twice with a Magus (unsure on this, we have amazing powers but our 2 psykers are very limited)
Heart of the Creed: 1CP - double primus' ability (probably not worth taking this)

Turn 1-3: 6+ CP
They Came From Below: 1 CP - put 3 units from the board into deepstrike
A Perfect Ambush: 3CP - shoot or move d6" after deepstrike
Lying in Wait: 2CP - deepstrike 3" away


I guess there's a silver lining with Psychic Awakening not offering super essential strategems, lol.

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Spoiler:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for [I]News and Rumours [\i]don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

So when we get the news about terrible layouts or rules or pricing, they're gonna be discussed. Simple as that. If all you want is positivity and always giving the benefit of the doubt no matter what, go to their official pages.

If you want to obsessively complain about their products and not contribute to the topic at hand, please direct yourself to the GW feedback emails and stop cluttering the thread.

I have sent emails. Also people here have every right to complain about a shoddy product.

Then you've complained in the correct place, this thread is about psychic awakening and not for your personal monologue.

Dragging it back on topic, now we've seen a 4 faction book I'm slightly less nervous about engine wars mishandling some of the factions. If they give all 4 of those factions similar coverage, that'll be nice.

So we're allowed to discuss Psychic Awakening as long as it isn't negativity that bothers you. Got it.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Spoiler:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Sentineil wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
It is on topic because it's related to the speed of the books being put out and the quality of them. It's pretty simple. Either defend them or don't.

What news or rumour content does it contain? Discussing the general quality of their publications isn't for in here.

Yes it is, otherwise there would be absolutely NO posts here besides the rumors and news and all threads would be locked.

Imagine that, news and rumours threads in the news and rumours forum!

So why not just lock every single thread here? Every thread and post is X is happening, Y might happen, and bam lock the thread!

Yes of course! There can be no middle ground, and everything needs to be black and white.

News and rumours is for posting news and rumours, and then discussing them. When a thread stops being on topic, then yes, it should be locked so that people who come here for [I]News and Rumours [\i]don't have to wade through the usual nonsense GW bashing and complaining.

So when we get the news about terrible layouts or rules or pricing, they're gonna be discussed. Simple as that. If all you want is positivity and always giving the benefit of the doubt no matter what, go to their official pages.

If you want to obsessively complain about their products and not contribute to the topic at hand, please direct yourself to the GW feedback emails and stop cluttering the thread.

I have sent emails. Also people here have every right to complain about a shoddy product.

Then you've complained in the correct place, this thread is about psychic awakening and not for your personal monologue.

Dragging it back on topic, now we've seen a 4 faction book I'm slightly less nervous about engine wars mishandling some of the factions. If they give all 4 of those factions similar coverage, that'll be nice.

So we're allowed to discuss Psychic Awakening as long as it isn't negativity that bothers you. Got it.

Discuss it how you like, talking about gw's playtesters missing the incorrect values in chapter approved isn't about psychic awakening.

I'll not reply further unless its pertinent to the topic at hand.