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The infantry look a little boring, but the jacks look cool. I'm hoping the third faction they reveal with the Kickstarter will knock it out of the park.

40k uses both dice and cards for randomness so I don't understand that criticism.

 D6Damager wrote:
The list building is straight from Monsterpocalypse as well.

30"x30" is a weird board size when most people already have 36x36 (Malifaux or Star Wars Legion) or 48x48 (Warmahordes or Infinity).

30"x30" is only for small games. They mentioned larger games will use 4x4 tables, and that may end up being the standard once the game has been out long enough.

 Kanluwen wrote:
I'm a fan of the Marcher Worlds, personally, but I think it's the color palette that gets me.

Iron Star is too close to Infinity for me to really enjoy it.

The color palettes are very weird and seem to be trying to deliberately hide their inspirations. If Marchers were Blue/White/Gold they would be pretty obviously Cygnar for example.

 warboss wrote:
It's like they took a bunch of unused Infinity designs and applied some sort of chonky filter in their 3d modelling program. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

Yea, I'm not in love. I do think the Mantic connection is a little stronger than the Infinity connection, due to chonk levels maybe (and Angel not having painted these). Honestly the basing style is particularly reminiscent of Infinity's promotional painted minis for me. Also not thrilled that these are metal, I'd rather they went with resin + token metal parts, especially when it comes to magnetizing the 'jacks, which I'm assuming is a thing? When they talk about customization and all that? I mean, ideally they'd take a page out of Puppets War* and include sculpted magnet holes and magnets with the big guys. But I have a doubt.

*Speaking of chonk ...

 Boss Salvage wrote:

 warboss wrote:
It's like they took a bunch of unused Infinity designs and applied some sort of chonky filter in their 3d modelling program. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

Spoiler:

Yea, I'm not in love. I do think the Mantic connection is a little stronger than the Infinity connection, due to chonk levels maybe (and Angel not having painted these). Honestly the basing style is particularly reminiscent of Infinity's promotional painted minis for me. Also not thrilled that these are metal, I'd rather they went with resin + token metal parts, especially when it comes to magnetizing the 'jacks, which I'm assuming is a thing? When they talk about customization and all that? I mean, ideally they'd take a page out of Puppets War* and include sculpted magnet holes and magnets with the big guys. But I have a doubt.

*Speaking of chonk ...

Yeah, that's about right, lol. Did you make that image up right now or is that a thing/meme?

 Boss Salvage wrote:

 warboss wrote:
It's like they took a bunch of unused Infinity designs and applied some sort of chonky filter in their 3d modelling program. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

Yea, I'm not in love. I do think the Mantic connection is a little stronger than the Infinity connection, due to chonk levels maybe (and Angel not having painted these). Honestly the basing style is particularly reminiscent of Infinity's promotional painted minis for me. Also not thrilled that these are metal, I'd rather they went with resin + token metal parts, especially when it comes to magnetizing the 'jacks, which I'm assuming is a thing? When they talk about customization and all that? I mean, ideally they'd take a page out of Puppets War* and include sculpted magnet holes and magnets with the big guys. But I have a doubt.

*Speaking of chonk ...

They Are resin + metal parts.

 AduroT wrote:
Once you remove all the fancy details, you’re left with a miniature without fancy details.

Once you get rid of recycled and cribbed details, you're left with nothing original.

No, I don't believe that every story is another story retold, nor do I believe that every model is another model recombined: certainly it takes rare genius and/or an utter rupture with society to create something radically new, but that doesn't excuse a lack of basic/some originality. The point was, I saw zero originality, just tired repetition. Even GW occasionally has a spark of something fresh in their setting that's 30+ years old, but I see no new life here.

warboss wrote:Did you make that image up right now or is that a thing/meme?

I made it for this Was surprised the internets couldn't provide.

AduroT wrote:They Are resin + metal parts.

!!!

I must have misunderstood when the dev dudes (or whoever I heard it from) were talking about metal that resin might also be involved. Good stuff.

 Boss Salvage wrote:

warboss wrote:Did you make that image up right now or is that a thing/meme?

I made it for this Was surprised the internets couldn't provide.

Thanks! I'm sure I'll have use for it in the future as well.

I’m interested in the not-Broadside, but not much else. To be frank, my Warmahordes stuff is sitting in a drawer with just a handful painted. Might grab a few neat models, but I can’t imagine investing in the game itself.

 Boss Salvage wrote:
You know, there're a lot fewer pics than I expected in a N&R thread. Here's the minis from the two faction starter sets:

Spoiler:

Keen to see the third faction, Fleshcrafter Mercenary-Guild Nomads (or whatever) tends to push my buttons a little more than the Marchers or Iron Star (tho I guess Marchers with a gun to my head).

I don't know what you guys are complaining about. I see some awesome Gue 'Vesa auxiliaries with a Primaris Psyker backup and some pretty sweet Van Saar.

I watched the demo, and it might just be that the hosts have zero charisma, but the game just seems a bit sterile and boring.

 Canadian 5th wrote:
I watched the demo, and it might just be that the hosts have zero charisma, but the game just seems a bit sterile and boring.

To be fair, not everyone can be Ben Mulrooney.

The lack of unique characters is notable. Maybe were past the "avatar gaming" era and that doesn't matter, but it does make it a little harder to care about what happens to these models.

'Recycling' the units seems to double down on that as well.

Warmachine got to the point that it had named Warjacks with personalities and veteran sergeants and named solos. This seems more like endless waves of nameless clones. It doesn't matter who dies or what they do as long as you toggle victory points in the scoring phase.

I think its better that way. No wierdness when you and the opponent bring the same named character. No grumping when you customize a model and 'XXX doesn't look like that'.

Nurglitch wrote:
To be fair, not everyone can be Ben Mulrooney.

You mistake me for somebody who watches TV...

Still, letting game designers instead of dedicated ambassadors for your game host a demo is an odd choice.

 Canadian 5th wrote:

Still, letting game designers instead of dedicated ambassadors for your game host a demo is an odd choice.

Not necessarily. The game designer is the person most familiar with the new system, which does rather make them the most qualified to run a demo, at least from a rules and gameplay perspective.


And if the company doesn't currently have a dedicated brand ambassador, or that person isn't on top of the new system yet, then that does restrict the options a bit.

 insaniak wrote:

 Canadian 5th wrote:

Still, letting game designers instead of dedicated ambassadors for your game host a demo is an odd choice.

Not necessarily. The game designer is the person most familiar with the new system, which does rather make them the most qualified to run a demo, at least from a rules and gameplay perspective.


And if the company doesn't currently have a dedicated brand ambassador, or that person isn't on top of the new system yet, then that does restrict the options a bit.

A quick search of YouTube will prove this statement false.
It’s quite easy to send out demo copies to proven and popular channels which will provide companies with much better gameplay overviews, hype and marketing. All for the cost of a cheap prototype or PnP.

In this day and age, there is absolutely no reason to not have someone charismatic present your game and run a demo.
Don’t make excuses for less than stellar marketing.

 insaniak wrote:

 Canadian 5th wrote:

Still, letting game designers instead of dedicated ambassadors for your game host a demo is an odd choice.

Not necessarily. The game designer is the person most familiar with the new system, which does rather make them the most qualified to run a demo, at least from a rules and gameplay perspective.

That's almost never true in my experience. Most designers are dealing with rules in flux, and make mistakes based on rules that have changed or been adjusted (or will be adjusted).

If its someone else, you can just give them a packet with the current snapshot of the rules, have them play some practice games, and then plop them in front of a camera. Its much smoother.
Even if they do make mistakes, Ghool is right. The charisma difference matters a lot more than little mistakes (that with a new game, the viewers won't necessarily even recognize as mistakes).

 Canadian 5th wrote:
I watched the demo, and it might just be that the hosts have zero charisma, but the game just seems a bit sterile and boring.

The demo interaction was awkward at best, and annoyingly clunky. I agree that designers are not usually a good demo team, and PP should have made a different choice.
I had trouble getting though it so unrehearsed, but the system does seem a bit interesting. I'm also curious about appearance of third faction.

 Ghool wrote:

A quick search of YouTube will prove this statement false.
It’s quite easy to send out demo copies to proven and popular channels which will provide companies with much better gameplay overviews, hype and marketing. All for the cost of a cheap prototype or PnP.

Er... some random YouTuber is not a dedicated brand ambassador.

That sort of arrangement can work. The problem is that it removes the control of the presentation from the hands of the company, which can be a very bad thing. You also have no guarantee when sending out a sample like this that the presenter will actually do anything with it. An awful lot of sample material just disappears into the ether. And, of course, sending out actual copies of the game to people outside the company means that your product is now out in the wild, which is potentially not what the company wants.

And, of course, some random guy on YouTube who has skimmed through the rules to put together a review or a playthrough video is not going to have as thorough a knowledge of the rules as the guy who wrote them, which was my original point.

I mean, it would be great if every miniatures company could have a dedicated marketing team producing slick videos and running demos and the like... but ultimately, I'd rather see a presentation with the correct rules, than a slightly slicker presentation from someone who doesn't actually know how to play the game properly.

 insaniak wrote:

 Ghool wrote:

A quick search of YouTube will prove this statement false.
It’s quite easy to send out demo copies to proven and popular channels which will provide companies with much better gameplay overviews, hype and marketing. All for the cost of a cheap prototype or PnP.

Er... some random YouTuber is not a dedicated brand ambassador.

That sort of arrangement can work. The problem is that it removes the control of the presentation from the hands of the company, which can be a very bad thing. You also have no guarantee when sending out a sample like this that the presenter will actually do anything with it. An awful lot of sample material just disappears into the ether. And, of course, sending out actual copies of the game to people outside the company means that your product is now out in the wild, which is potentially not what the company wants.

And, of course, some random guy on YouTube who has skimmed through the rules to put together a review or a playthrough video is not going to have as thorough a knowledge of the rules as the guy who wrote them, which was my original point.

I mean, it would be great if every miniatures company could have a dedicated marketing team producing slick videos and running demos and the like... but ultimately, I'd rather see a presentation with the correct rules, than a slightly slicker presentation from someone who doesn't actually know how to play the game properly.

You still aren't necessarily getting the correct rules. I've seen Jervis flub Warhammer rules in person, on editions where he was the primary author.
He at least (at the time) had enthusiasm going for him, but it still made the room awkward.

Oh dear...
Well being PP it won't last.
So the few almost none existent shops that stock their garbage won't waste shelf space long on this.

Voss wrote:

You still aren't necessarily getting the correct rules. I've seen Jervis flub Warhammer rules in person, on editions where he was the primary author.
He at least (at the time) had enthusiasm going for him, but it still made the room awkward.

Given Jervis' general 'the rules don't matter' attitude, that doesn't surprise me in the slightest. I'm not sure that GW are the best example of anything here, though, since getting rules wrong is fairly endemic with them regardless of who it was written by... likely due to everything always being in such a state of flux.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ValentineGames wrote:
Oh dear...
Well being PP it won't last.

That's an odd thing to say, given that Warmachine has lasted 17 years, so far... In a niche where most games are lucky to last 5, it's a venerable ancient.

 AduroT wrote:


They Are resin + metal parts.

Not true - they said: "Right now, most of the models we’ve previewed so far will be made in metal, even the warjacks. " (from here: https://home.privateerpress.com/2020/02/20/warcaster-neo-mechanika-answers-to-your-burning-questions/)

Which is disappointing - as it makes it sound like only the biggest of units will get resin pieces. (Apparently the 2 jacks we've seen so far don't qualify as big yet).

It would have been cool if the jack kits, made in a more appropriate material, would have been hot-swappable without the hassle of magnetizing. (ala Rivet Wars - RIP) - since it sounds like they each will have a few different loadout options.

 insaniak wrote:

 Canadian 5th wrote:

Still, letting game designers instead of dedicated ambassadors for your game host a demo is an odd choice.

Not necessarily. The game designer is the person most familiar with the new system, which does rather make them the most qualified to run a demo, at least from a rules and gameplay perspective.


And if the company doesn't currently have a dedicated brand ambassador, or that person isn't on top of the new system yet, then that does restrict the options a bit.

If the company doesn't have a brand ambassador they might want to hold off on launching a new brand until they have one and that person is up to date on the product. This is business 101...

Most companies don't actually have unlimited resources... If nobody released new product until they could afford a social media professional on staff, there would be an awful lot less product being released.

Article about the three factions with some art for the Aeternus Continuum, which genuinely look very cool.


https://home.privateerpress.com/warcaster/factions/

More information on the factions, including the third one. No models, but some artwork.
https://home.privateerpress.com/warcaster/factions/




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Missed it by That much...

The artwork for the other two factions looked cool as well. Although the three factions are all sort of looking like the same thing in different colours, so far. Maybe it's just because they're new and I'm not used to the visuals yet, but it feels like the factions in Warmachine and Hordes all had much stronger aesthetic differences.