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Can't wait for the regular rulebook to come out!

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
Sounds a lot like Firestorm Armada from that game overview. Minimum distance before turning, turns being 45 degrees, compulsory movement, initiative phase, alternating activations, firing arcs - sounds very reminiscent of Firestorm, which is fine by me as I find that game a lot of fun too. Really looking forward to this! Hoping I can strongarm my group into giving this a go. I absolutely love that it uses abstracted sight rules. Not being able to see as far as you can fire sounds very cool.

Its based on ACTA - which draws on Battlefleet Gothic - Firestorm def has some similar mechanics.

It looks like a bunch of the UK sellers (Wayland, Firestorm, The Outpost) have immediately gone out of stock. Bit of a bummer as a few of them were offering 20% off the starter set..

 Ruckdog wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
How are you getting on with it Ruckdog?

I see the starter set is due to go on general sale from tomorrow on the Warlord site.

There are a couple of neoprene mats on the Warlord site - which size is recommended, is it 4x4 or 6x4?

I have barely started to go though it all to be honest! Looking through the rulebook, I couldn't find any specified table size. The diagrams for the setup configurations show a 4x6' table, but the only labeled dimension is the width, which shows 4' (including the deployment zones). So, I would guess that either the 4x4 or the 6x4 could work. My preference would be to go for the 6x4' if you can afford it, as it will be more versatile; you can always block off 2' of it with tape if you want to do a 4x4 battle area (I do this with the 4x6 neoprene mat I have).

Thanks very much !

It does sound like the 6 x 4 option sounds the better one.

Got a few minutes to pull out the USS Arizona mini last night, assemble it, and pull out the old WotC W@S mini to compare it to:

[img width=450 height=600]https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/8/28/1075146_sm-.jpeg[/img]

The model consists of a resin hull/base, with multiple metal add-ons.



Some of the parts (masts and cranes especially) were a bit fiddly and a challenge to get off the "sprue" without damage.



Sadly, the posts for the turrets are too long to permit magnetizing without modification (this pic shows two 1/32" thick magnets in the well, with the "B" turret on top.



Here is the mini next to the WotC mini. As one might expect, the overall proportions and level of detail are nicer, though the barrels of the turrets on the Warlord version do look a bit chunky.



The tripods in particular are much nicer than the WotC mini, and the new model also has more details such as the boat and aircraft cranes.



Overall, I think the level of detail on the new Victory At Sea mini is much nicer than the WotC mini, though were not quite up to GHQ level here. Not sure how it compares to a 3-D printed one, though.

 schoon wrote:
Can't wait for the regular rulebook to come out!

The rulebook in the starter box was included with the August Wargames Illustrated.

Follow-up releases have already been announced. The aircraft in the fleet boxes are getting an immediate seperate release. USS Missouri is due out in October, and Graf Spee and Admiral Scheer are releasing together in December. That's a bit slower than I'd prefer. But things are a bit weird right now in the world.

Currently waiting on the US West Coast for my order to arrive. I've got 3-D printed copies of Portland and Myoko at the same scale that I can compare the models with once my package arrives.

That looks pretty cool Ruckdog - thanks for posting.

Eumerin wrote:

 schoon wrote:
Can't wait for the regular rulebook to come out!

The rulebook in the starter box was included with the August Wargames Illustrated.

Follow-up releases have already been announced. The aircraft in the fleet boxes are getting an immediate seperate release. USS Missouri is due out in October, and Graf Spee and Admiral Scheer are releasing together in December. That's a bit slower than I'd prefer. But things are a bit weird right now in the world.

Currently waiting on the US West Coast for my order to arrive. I've got 3-D printed copies of Portland and Myoko at the same scale that I can compare the models with once my package arrives.

That rule book has pretty much all the aircraft stat blocks messed up - not sure about the rest of the rules.

nice freebee though

My pre-order arrived last night. Took a quick peek and cleaned the resin, but I only had enough time to put together Mogami and Furry Taco (Furutaka).

Will post more later.

The real question is: can you take the ships off those terrible bases?

 lasgunpacker wrote:
The real question is: can you take the ships off those terrible bases?

Nope.

But the bases look fine when seen from typical game table angles. They only really look overly thick when seen from close to horizontal.

Eumerin wrote:

 lasgunpacker wrote:
The real question is: can you take the ships off those terrible bases?

Nope.

But the bases look fine when seen from typical game table angles. They only really look overly thick when seen from close to horizontal.

Please post pics when you get a chance. I was all in but when we saw the bases both my wife and I noped right out.

Of course there's nothing preventing you from getting the rulebook (when it comes out) and purchasing whatever miniatures you desire.

Particularly if you like a different scale.

 Phobos wrote:

Eumerin wrote:

 lasgunpacker wrote:
The real question is: can you take the ships off those terrible bases?

Nope.

But the bases look fine when seen from typical game table angles. They only really look overly thick when seen from close to horizontal.

Please post pics when you get a chance. I was all in but when we saw the bases both my wife and I noped right out.

Ruckdog posted pictures of the USS Arizona up above.

Eumerin wrote:

 Phobos wrote:

Eumerin wrote:

 lasgunpacker wrote:
The real question is: can you take the ships off those terrible bases?

Nope.

But the bases look fine when seen from typical game table angles. They only really look overly thick when seen from close to horizontal.

Please post pics when you get a chance. I was all in but when we saw the bases both my wife and I noped right out.

Ruckdog posted pictures of the USS Arizona up above.

Yeah, and that base is just terrible. Oversized, too thick, and with the name on the side? No thanks.

No, the separate rule-book is probably the way to go here, provided that it has decent editing.

Does the rulebook have stats for the navies, or do you need the cards which come with the ships?

 CptJake wrote:
Does the rulebook have stats for the navies, or do you need the cards which come with the ships?

The video that they released a little while ago states that there will be a book of ship stats. For the time being, the ship stat cards included with each ship have stats and refits for every ship of the class. For example, the Northhampton-class card has the refit schedule for every Northampton-class cruiser that was in use during the War. The starter rule book also includes the unrefitted stats for each of the four battleships that are available separately, on the odd chance you have a hankering to have a battle between the Yamato and the Bismark (a battle between either of those and the USN representative - USS Idaho - is likely to be rather one-sided).

I'm also pretty confident that a bigger rulebook is planned. The rulebook in the starter has some rather obvious gaps. For instance, some of the battleships get radar. But the starter rules currently only incorporate radar in smaller ships. Ergo, there's likely some missing rules that will apply to radar-equipped battleships.

Yeah, and that base is just terrible. Oversized, too thick, and with the name on the side? No thanks.

Given that if you get the starter, the US fleet box, and the US battleship, you have two Portland-class cruisers, four Northhampton-class cruisers, two New Mexico-class battleships, and two Mogami-class cruisers (the IJN starter has the remaining Mogami-class cruisers), you need to put those names somewhere. The ship stat cards track refits on cruisers and larger vessels on a year by year basis. And those vary between individual ships in each class. So it's handy to be able to tell at a glance which Northampton-class is Northhampton, and which is Chicago (smaller ships - including destroyers - within the same class are all identical, which makes sense given the huge numbers of the things built during the war). In any case, to each their own. I'm fine with the bases, and I think the horizontal shots that Warlord keeps releasing are horrible.

Could anyone tell me what an average point level for games would be (not including scenarios)?

Pahil wrote:
Could anyone tell me what an average point level for games would be (not including scenarios)?

The rulebook doesn't include recommended point values. The included generic scenario generator merely duggests that players come up with their own points value for a game, and then - based on dice rolls by each - adjust the points for an individual player by ten percent either upwards or downwards based on the randomly assigned objective for that player.

I'm not at home right now, so I don't have my cards available with their points costs. But I do have the rulebook handy, and that has a few costs. The Northhampton-class is 130 points. Warspite is 375 points. New Mexico is 400 points. Bismark is 600 points. Yamato is 1000. The costs for a stand of aircraft ranges from 10 points to 25 points (the later F4U Corsairs).

Pahil wrote:
Could anyone tell me what an average point level for games would be (not including scenarios)?

We don't specify a 'standard' points value for games, but ensured things scale well. You will have perfectly decent games with a couple of battleships on each side (Denmark Strait) or have a couple of dozen vessels on the table across all types without getting massively bogged down. It also allows for 'unusual' battles where one side is all aircraft, for example, or all MTBs.

The War at Sea scenario was written with a nod to tournament style games in mind, but I would also expect TOs to make their own adjustments to it (something we go over when it comes to the variable objectives, for example), and I would imagine the variable points values would also be taken out.

Recommend you use them all in your club night games though

To further emphasize MongooseMatt's comment about aircraft -

The scenario pdf book from the beta testing that he linked earlier contains a Pearl Harbor scenario. It'll be the perfect place to use the USS Arizona model, if you got it.

Thanks for your replies.
I saw the Pearl Harbour Scenario (and also the similar Midway Scenario)
Im waiting for my stuff to arrive to have a deeper dive into it.

I've got a couple of rules questions for Matt -

The first question is regarding Dual Purpose guns with the Restricted trait. The Dual Purpose trait allows you to fire the guns as anti-aircraft, but with only half of the usual attack dice. The Restricted trait only allows you to fire half of your dice (rounded up) at targets in the Port and Starboard arcs.

USS Idaho in her default configuration has a set of 5", 360 degree guns with 6 attack dice that are both DP and Restricted. She's being approached by a flight of Kates on her starboard side, a flight of Vals on her port side, and a flight of Zeroes from her bow. Her priority is to deal with the Kates, so her captain announces that she's firing her DP guns as anti-aircraft, and targeting the Kates. Her attack dice for this are halved from 6 to 3. Because the Kates are on her starboard side, and the guns are Restricted, are they halved again (rounded up) to 2? Or is Idaho allowed to use all three dice against the Kates? If the dice are halved again, can she use the remaining die against the Vals on her port side? Or is she only allowed to use it against the Zeroes flying toward her bow?


The second question regards the USS Essex. She has a battery of light DP guns that have a 360 degree firing arc. But they also have a special rule that prohibits them from firing at targets in the starboard arc. Is there any particular reason why they have this special rule instead of having a firing arc that only includes fore, aft, and port?

Eumerin wrote:
I've got a couple of rules questions for Matt -

Of course!

Please bear in mind I have not got my rulebook beside me, so I may come back and change my mind (!), but...

Eumerin wrote:
The first question is regarding Dual Purpose guns with the Restricted trait. The Dual Purpose trait allows you to fire the guns as anti-aircraft, but with only half of the usual attack dice. The Restricted trait only allows you to fire half of your dice (rounded up) at targets in the Port and Starboard arcs.

USS Idaho in her default configuration has a set of 5", 360 degree guns with 6 attack dice that are both DP and Restricted. She's being approached by a flight of Kates on her starboard side, a flight of Vals on her port side, and a flight of Zeroes from her bow. Her priority is to deal with the Kates, so her captain announces that she's firing her DP guns as anti-aircraft, and targeting the Kates. Her attack dice for this are halved from 6 to 3. Because the Kates are on her starboard side, and the guns are Restricted, are they halved again (rounded up) to 2? Or is Idaho allowed to use all three dice against the Kates? If the dice are halved again, can she use the remaining die against the Vals on her port side? Or is she only allowed to use it against the Zeroes flying toward her bow?

Yes, apply both DP and Restricted so you will be using 2 Attack Dice. You can also split fire, but you are still subject to the Restricted rule, so that last Attack Dice can only be used against the Zeroes.

Slightly deeper answer... Yes, you are right in thinking that perhaps it _should_ be able to get a dice off to the Vals and, if you choose to play it that way I am not going to send the Gaming Police round to your place. The answer above comes purely from keeping things simple, which is where I would lean in an 'official' capacity. It may also encourage you to escort the Idaho with some decent AA ships

Eumerin wrote:
The second question regards the USS Essex. She has a battery of light DP guns that have a 360 degree firing arc. But they also have a special rule that prohibits them from firing at targets in the starboard arc. Is there any particular reason why they have this special rule instead of having a firing arc that only includes fore, aft, and port?

This is down to gun positioning - again, I don't have my notes to hand, but if you take a gander at the Essex you will see that those weapons physically cannot fire to starboard.

Thanks for the first answer.

The Essex question was more about the decision to go with a special rule for Essex instead of creating a firing arc that did the same. I was curious whether this had some rules interaction that I was missing. But it doesn't appear to be the case.


As for better AAA escorts for Idaho...

Idaho's got AAA that's as good as any of the other USN ships currently available. Maybe when the Atlanta class eventually shows up?

Hello all, I very recently got into the new VaS game, and I'm having a lot of fun so far.

I know that I might be going against the popular opinion, but personally I love the bases - they make me think of ships-in-a-bottle, or small dioramas. And they also allow me to handle my ships without touching the most fragile parts; for a klutz like me, that's a big plus!

Got some photos of my Japanese fleet and my pre-order Altmark, but as this is my first post, I'll link to them later...

Matt, could I ask you to clarify something I saw in the beta-testing docs and which was never addressed in the documents themselves or the short rules published by Warlord?

1. Can carriers not scout for themselves? From what I can see, scouting can only be conducted by catapult-launched Observation Flights and ships (cruisers, DDs..) Can't CVs detail some of their strike planes to spotting duty, if floatplane-equipped cruisers are unavailable?

2. The topic of Green and Veteran pilots is raised but never addressed in the rules. Specifically, the beta-test document mentions that Green and Veteran crews may be purchased to improve or degrade plane performance, and it is noted that 'fleet lists will allow you to purchase...', but how such pilots may be assigned to a flight is never specified (costs).

Any comment on that? Thanks in advance, and thanks for the fun my friends and I have been having over the past few days...

Hey there,

As always, these comments should be considered unofficial, and I do not have the starter set rulebook in front of me, but...

1. The main rulebook (forthcoming) will allow you to use Flights to scout with. So, a big carrier might all but guarantee you those high scouting rolls, but it won't be much use to your carrier if you have nothing for it to launch

2. If I recall correctly (I may not), the green/veteran pilots were considered an over-complication so they came out of the fleet lists, but the rules were retained as we figured they would be useful for historical scenarios.

Hope that helps!

It does indeed, thanks Matt!

So (yes, while fully acknowledging the unofficial nature of your response), it should be possible for the CV to assign X number of flights to scouting, assuming it's willing to sacrifice their availability in combat? And would those flights be returning (with the necessary rolls) à la scouting ships, or gone forever à la scouting Observation Flights?

Apologies for hounding you with questions, but my mates and I are running a couple of Discord-based tabletop games, where I host the game and the two players send their orders in via messages, and we are really fascinated with the air aspect of VAS, but we keep getting games where the CVs are outspotted by a couple of cruisers and it seems a bit off...

Veteran / Green crews being unavailable for purchase is a bit of a disappointment, but I can definitely see why you would choose to not include them in custom scenarios, would have definitely been a nightmare to balance.

Also, apparently I can post images now. Hooray! Have some Japships:









I've magnetized all my turrets for extra shiny, too.

The ships from the starter box have gone up for pre-order. The cruisers will be available individually, and the destroyers will be sold in packs of three. They'll be available in December. These will join Hood, Admiral Graf Spee, Admiral Scheer, and a convoy box with a variety of transport ships, all of which are scheduled for December as well. Iowa is due out next month. And the aircraft sold in the fleet boxes are already available separately.

So in December, you'll have all of the ships that you need to refight Denmark Strait (with Duke of York standing in for Prince of Wales).


Given the starter ships being available individually, and the convoy box, I suspect that the rule book(s) will be available by December. There hasn't been an announcement about them yet, though.

Enioch wrote:

So (yes, while fully acknowledging the unofficial nature of your response), it should be possible for the CV to assign X number of flights to scouting, assuming it's willing to sacrifice their availability in combat? And would those flights be returning (with the necessary rolls) à la scouting ships, or gone forever à la scouting Observation Flights?

Gone for the battle - they will be busy refuelling and will miss the fighting (or still be flying off in completely the wrong direction as they continue searching for more ships).

You will have to make the choice between scouting and fighting for those planes.

Hey MongooseMatt,

I got the rules booklet from the recent WarGames Illustrated, but I can't seem to find any way to play - there aren't any ship cards. Am I just missing something, or are there examples we can use for a test game?