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2021/03/05 14:33:35
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
They were also troop back then. Not by default, but in practise they always were as all lists involving nob bikers also had a warboss or ghaz.
Not to mention that they could abuse wounds allocation and general rate of fire was extremely lower than the current standards while their damage output was way higher than now.
2021/03/05 14:40:09
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
oh yeah, also the walking cover save. So they always had a 4+ unless you ignored cover AND had ap4 or greater (which wasnt that common to have both).
The walking coversave became a nigh useless stratagem though that we have to pre-emptively use for some god forsaken reason... and -1 to hit is simply NOT as good as a 50-50 save
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/05 14:40:57
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys
2021/03/05 14:48:59
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Vineheart01 wrote: oh yeah, also the walking cover save.
So they always had a 4+ unless you ignored cover AND had ap4 or greater (which wasnt that common to have both).
The walking coversave became a nigh useless stratagem though that we have to pre-emptively use for some god forsaken reason... and -1 to hit is simply NOT as good as a 50-50 save
Agreed, that -1 to hit should have been part of their profile with a strat to boost it.
3500+
3300+
1000
1850
2000
2021/03/05 14:49:07
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
And let's not forget the Waaagh! banner on bike which just went poof in 8th.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/03/05 14:52:23
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Bikernobz basically lost more than half of their kit and remained roughly the same cost, PKs went down but i dont think they did themselves (prior to the FW book of course)
But given that theyre stuck in FW now and FW seems to ignore 40k...theyre stuck in their current iteration for a loooong time. Which is sad.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/05 14:52:58
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys
2021/03/05 15:00:42
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Yeah....the best we can hope for are some Nob keyword strats that boost their survival or offense and maybe a kustom job that gives them some sort of options beyond just more movement.
2021/03/05 19:09:02
Subject: Re:We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
So I just read that with Mek Boss Buzzgob's +1 to hit and Sparkly Bitz stack, because sparkly bitz increases the BS on the datasheet rather than being a +1 to hit buff. Did goff morkanauts just become a thing?
2021/03/05 19:32:45
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
i imagine the math on going to a 3+ to hit but losing the reroll wound/damage roll for Deathskullz is about the same, possibly slightly less still since rerolling a D6 damage is insane.
Buzzgob having a KFF or not doesnt really impact anything since he'd be sitting next to a Mork, which would have a KFF. But Buzzgob doing something else on top of buffing the Mork would be nice, given his price.
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys
2021/03/05 22:05:41
Subject: Re:We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Vineheart01 wrote: i imagine the math on going to a 3+ to hit but losing the reroll wound/damage roll for Deathskullz is about the same, possibly slightly less still since rerolling a D6 damage is insane.
Buzzgob having a KFF or not doesnt really impact anything since he'd be sitting next to a Mork, which would have a KFF. But Buzzgob doing something else on top of buffing the Mork would be nice, given his price.
The bonus to hit is in the command phase, so you could definitely split them up after the buff was given.
You could also give it to a Gork, making the damn thing potentially hitting on 2s in combat (bonus: give it the +1 BS as well instead of the other Kustom Job).
But yeah, if he had a KFF he would be super interesting, as is, I think he's just too much for what he does. He's not a combat threat, he doesn't give an invul, and his buff although good, is given to an overpriced unit that is borderline untakeable in the meta of supercharged melta.
2021/03/06 01:42:39
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Vineheart01 wrote: i imagine the math on going to a 3+ to hit but losing the reroll wound/damage roll for Deathskullz is about the same, possibly slightly less still since rerolling a D6 damage is insane.
Buzzgob having a KFF or not doesnt really impact anything since he'd be sitting next to a Mork, which would have a KFF. But Buzzgob doing something else on top of buffing the Mork would be nice, given his price.
Having used Buzzgob with a walker heavy Goff list, I would say that it really isn't worth missing out on the DS buffs, since it's usually rerolling the damage that is the most valuable when rolling for a variable damage weapon.
2021/03/06 02:34:55
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Vineheart01 wrote: i imagine the math on going to a 3+ to hit but losing the reroll wound/damage roll for Deathskullz is about the same, possibly slightly less still since rerolling a D6 damage is insane.
Buzzgob having a KFF or not doesnt really impact anything since he'd be sitting next to a Mork, which would have a KFF. But Buzzgob doing something else on top of buffing the Mork would be nice, given his price.
The bonus to hit is in the command phase, so you could definitely split them up after the buff was given.
You could also give it to a Gork, making the damn thing potentially hitting on 2s in combat (bonus: give it the +1 BS as well instead of the other Kustom Job).
But yeah, if he had a KFF he would be super interesting, as is, I think he's just too much for what he does. He's not a combat threat, he doesn't give an invul, and his buff although good, is given to an overpriced unit that is borderline untakeable in the meta of supercharged melta.
Trust me when i say buffs happening in the command phase are bad.
Necrons are covered in that problem, so much crap i do in the command phase that if i wasnt in position for a full turn ago i cant do now. Its absolutely bonkers dumb and i wish command phase would go away.
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys
2021/03/06 11:30:47
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
I use 2 jets - wazboom and burna bommer - and they works fine.
I' ve analyzed last about 10-15 games and I seriously consider to skip KFF on Wazboom at all. Keep it like a pure anti-tank plane.
1. I play Deathskulls, so it' s just improve from 6++ to 5++
2. In practise the KFF cover something more than Wazboom itself just in T1 if I go second.
So in 50% of the games, it gives better invu just to the plane itself.
And if the KFF covers something in T1, it' s the Bommer and no more 2 buggies, mostly behind the LOS block anyway.
15p for it seems to be pretty high price (20p kff - 5p stickbomb f.)
Does anybody else comes to the similar conclusion?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/06 11:32:58
Also, have anyone here tried actually running a super heavy auxillary detatchment and bringing an Evil Sunz Kustom Stompa? I mean you dont get the detatchment rules for it, but you still get the keyword, so if your batallion detatchment or what ever else you run is also evil Sunz, you could still buff the kustom stompa with visions in the smoke.
Some bloke made a youtube video about it i think yesterday, and i liked the idea. Is it competitive? probably not, but still interesting.
Of course theres the risk part of failing your roll of 9 (bring 30 boys and a painboy for the weirdboy) or even being denied. I was thinking id bring an evil Sunz Da boomer gunwagon or maybe something else shooty that has less wounds, so if you get a roll of 7 instead of 9, at least the ability isnt wasted entirely.
Kustom Stompa - Visions in the smoke --> More dakka.
Sounds terrifying (and expensive). I dont even have a kustom stompa, but the model is awesome so i kinda wish i had one, then i would try this. I guess when i finally sit down and make my TTS working ill try it then.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2021/03/06 12:44:30
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/03/06 13:42:48
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Vineheart01 wrote: yeah theres plenty of mass AP1 which even at S4 just devours bikers now and if theyre a melee-capable unit at all and dont have a mass of attacks they probably do 2+ wounds and totally strip armor.
Also we lost the painboy on bike and the ability to give them Cybork invuls which was a HUGE aspect why they were awesome in 5/6th
For whatever reason GW decided to strips Orks of invuns (mainly for melee) during 7th and some degree 8th. Whilst we have the KFF, it is fairly restrictive compared to similar abilities that don't require the unit to be wholly within its aura. Cybork Bodies got changed into the trash that it is of a 6+++ when we can already get that in a Painboy or being Snakebites. Nobz were always unique when compared to Space Marines with them being tougher (the extra wound) and stronger (furious charge/str 5 base) and Meganobz again being generally more resilient than Terminators due to that extra wound then dealing more damage in combat with more attacks and strength. The draw back was no invuns and being slower (Grotsnik would help with giving Cybork Bodies).
That all changed come 9th edition, we already lost access to a 5++ (real painful on our Warbosses), then suddenly Marines across the board get +1 wound, Shock Assault, better melee weapons and rerolls galore. So what makes Nobz and Meganobz unique now to their Imperial counterparts? Bad leadership, worse BS and costing more? Hopefully when we get our new Codex it addresses this issues (and numerous other issues). Personally I'd like to see Cybork Bodies be -1 damage that way it doesn't conflict with a Painboy, and I have no idea what can be done for Meganobz because I don't think Orks will be getting an extra wound and I dont think being toughness 5 will save them much.
If GW wants to restrict us from having invuns in melee (Barring Deathskulls but not all of us play them ), then they need to come up with another way to mitgate damage so we feel actually tougher than what we are now.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/06 13:46:40
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
2021/03/06 13:56:15
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Prior 8th edition banner nob was not a character, just a possible loadout for a single guy in a nobz squad. In the 5th edition codex (that one released at the end of 4th) the painboy wasn't a character either, but just an option for a nobz squad. So in conclusion both painboy and waaagh banner were possible options for nobz squads. And warbikes were just equipment for nobz squads.
In 5th edition Nobz were extremely powerful. Typically 5 man squads, including a painboy to provide cybork bodies, a banner dude and a couple of power klaws at least. All on bikes or riding into a Battlewagon.
Also, have anyone here tried actually running a super heavy auxillary detatchment and bringing an Evil Sunz Kustom Stompa? I mean you dont get the detatchment rules for it, but you still get the keyword, so if your batallion detatchment or what ever else you run is also evil Sunz, you could still buff the kustom stompa with visions in the smoke.
Some bloke made a youtube video about it i think yesterday, and i liked the idea. Is it competitive? probably not, but still interesting.
Of course theres the risk part of failing your roll of 9 (bring 30 boys and a painboy for the weirdboy) or even being denied. I was thinking id bring an evil Sunz Da boomer gunwagon or maybe something else shooty that has less wounds, so if you get a roll of 7 instead of 9, at least the ability isnt wasted entirely.
Kustom Stompa - Visions in the smoke --> More dakka.
Sounds terrifying (and expensive). I dont even have a kustom stompa, but the model is awesome so i kinda wish i had one, then i would try this. I guess when i finally sit down and make my TTS working ill try it then.
We used to have a lot of things then they all went away...
I dont think it'll be that good, it might sound terrifying (well not really when you think of the cost of the unit, all the support units and then getting the power off) butreally its a 1 trick pony. Yeah sure load it up with double lifta-droppas and fling Deathwing and Deathguard into orbit but what about the mission? What about obscuring terrain? Its gonna be mighty useless when it cant fire at what it wants to and then it has to dance around models and terrain if it can even fit. I dont think with even a new Codex the Stompa or Kustom Stompa will ever be good, the age of Super Heavies is kinda over. They just dont play well towards missions and it isnt even that durable (plus everything in the known galaxy will see it).
It might have a bit of shock and awe to it when put on the battlefield if the person hasn't fought a Stompa before, but take out its support and its gonna live up to its moniker pretty well. Its a relic from a bygone age, for Apocalypse. I sold all mine quite early on into 8th and it wasn't like I used them much anyway, I think I've played Apocalypse 8 times in my entire life as Orks... Might aswell have 3 Killtanks for the cost of the Stompa. Hell 3 Nauts is probably better than a Stompa.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
2021/03/08 05:51:43
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Burna bommers seem to be back, and both rely on high quality shooting - kind of makes sense with all those DG and deathwing running around.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/03/08 11:47:03
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
So I ran a squad of 10 nobz this weekend - 7 with big choppas + choppas, 3 with dual choppas. The unit costs 205 pts, about 45 less than the typical boyz squad of 30. I jumped them in round 1 and because of their smaller footprint, was able to sneak them in and assassinate his warlord and 3 bikes, consolidated into a squad of 5 intercessors, fought again and killed the squad, and consolidated into ANOTHER squad of 5 intercessors. At the end of the carnage I still had 7 nobz left. I was HIGHLY impressed, and am actually thinking this might be more efficient than trying to jump 30 boyz round 1. It's much easier to find a spot for 10 nobz, it's cheaper, and it catches the opponent by surprise. Also, if you're running deffskullz like I was, the nobz are far more efficient in combat than regular boyz. They also gain obsec which is nice and could also be a neat trick if your opponent leaves their objective marker open. The nobz become something they have to deal with ASAP and usually devote more resources than necessary to eliminate them. This move essentially won the game for me round 1.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/08 13:32:15
2021/03/08 13:38:07
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
Jidmah wrote: Burna bommers seem to be back, and both rely on high quality shooting - kind of makes sense with all those DG and deathwing running around.
Bommers were never gone, just the lockdown turned down the number of tournaments and screw the stats imho... And the first list do it right, only good way how to use the Bommers is in pairs. If you go second, Bommer is on cca 70% dead before he moves. If you go first, you can scare your opponent twice and let him waste his heavy shooting on something with -1 to hit above his head with 50% chance of exploding into his units anyway. That can turn their attention away from the rest of the field really well. Plus you collect the VP for Engage
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/03/08 13:52:14
...Some bloke made a youtube video about it i think yesterday, and i liked the idea.
I did no such thing!
We also had the option for a SAG mek on a warbike. Warbikes gave relentless so he could move and shoot an ordnance weapon, in a time where you couldn't move and shoot heavy weapons. I made a really cool model for that, sadly we lost the option before it saw the paintbrush.
12,300 points of Orks
9th W/D/L with Orks, 4/0/2
I am Thoruk, the Barbarian, Slayer of Ducks, and This is my blog!
I say it all the time - ork army is full of options and wonderful unexpected new combinations
Honestly, both lists are pretty much different from we saw before. They stink by TTS, I saw some deffdreads in alpha league videos and just the madman tries to move 3x30boyz in TTS in to the area terrain with more floors
We also had the option for a SAG mek on a warbike. Warbikes gave relentless so he could move and shoot an ordnance weapon, in a time where you couldn't move and shoot heavy weapons. I made a really cool model for that, sadly we lost the option before it saw the paintbrush.
Yeah! I' ve almost started the construction of 3 SAGbikes to ad them to my 3 regular SAGs and play 6 of them in one game! Like 2 years ago? Sweet memories.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/08 13:58:30
Morkanaut [16 PL, -1CP, 340pts]: Kustom Force Field
. Kustom Job: Sparkly Bitz
+ Dedicated Transport +
Trukk [4 PL, 65pts]
++ Total: [100 PL, 4CP, 1,998pts] ++
I know it wasnt super optimal but..
Game 1 vs UM:
Spoiler:
I decided to put the wagon with MANz and boyz in the tellyporta instead of the Mork because the deploy zone wouldnt cover all the buggies and I needed the KFF -- I might exchange a rokkit to give the big mek KFF for this reason in the future.
I went second and was able to only take damage on my trukk in the opening salvo -- Mork eats up a lot of deployment real estate! Turn 1 I got good pot shots on his dreadnaught with the dragsta and popped a transport. I bait out his anti armor inf with MANz on a point, which he kills quickly turn 2, while retreating the dread to his tech priest to heal a bit. The KFF and dense terrain prevent him from landing anything significant on the vehicle blob. My turn 2, I use the big mek to heal up the incidental damage to a scrapjet and post up in the center with all 3 scrapjets and mork to blow up the few visible units. My stormboyz drop back to bait auspex scan from his intercessors around his tech priest, and promptly lose all but 1, but now my wagon drops in front of the baited tank killer inf and ramming speeds them down. I was a bit surprised he didnt intervene, but he mentioned he did not want to pop my vehicle full on MANz around his characters. I questioned the call but neither were outfitted to melee well so I didnt argue. Turn 3 I get amazing invul rolls with KFF which pretty much sealed my return fire to be decisive enough to call it.
Overall, I learned that having any modifiers going into a 5++ invul can hold important zones for a turn or two. Also, if they split anti-armor fire, its best to swarm one of the sides instead of taking the center. Baiting out defensive fire/auspex scan/overwatch can pay off a lot, so using dragstas/stormboyz/kommandos/tellyporta all at the same time can force some confounding choices. Also, MAmek can heal but cannot shoot and da jumping gretchin to complete scramblers is so very nice and easy.
Game 2 vs DG:
Spoiler:
He was running a pox/typhus list with some heavy vehicles in the back line. I tellyporta the Mork this time because there was less opening firepower with LOS. Turn 1 was a pretty big snooze fest with some incidental shots and forward waltzing. I did get to pop a bloat drone with 2 scrapjets having some absolute lucky DDD rolls. Turn 2, the pox/typhus blob take a right center obj and he keeps his termies off board. The firing lane for left objective kills my trukk and his power inf move towards the boyz/mek that popped out. I dump my wagon boyz out near the pox and extra stikkbomb them (60 rolls!), but crap rolls only take away 7 models and pull my MANZWagon back a bit to screen out and protect my weirdboy/smasha guns from the termie drop. Mork, the dragsta, and the stormboyz all take up a space in his backboard and blow up a defiler even before the charge (DDD on 3 of the megazappa shots into 2 more hits was not expected). I complete deploy scramblers with my firing lane boyz on the stormboyz in the back. Turn 3, his termies can only find space enough to shoot/charge and kill a mekgun opposite my MANzWagon but threaten they my weird boy. I lose both sides of boyz and contemplate how I am behind 10 points in primary already... I turn my bikeboss back and clean the termies up (2+ 12S with full rerolls hit/wounds is brutal) and scrapjets pick and pop some non/pox infantry. Overall, it looks like the pox side is gonna be all his and the firing lane is gonna be all buggies. After turn 4 results in some abysmal rolls to shoot for my DG friend (1 wound out of the whole round...) we talk out the rest and find that, because of the second turn advantage I was going to be able to screen his pox blob from reaching my obj while I can stormboyz move to get the last 3 points needed no matter what to eek out a win.
Here I learned that you never want to even get in charge range of pox or plague marines (I knew it was strong, but they just beat the crap on the buggies). Psykers will stop weirdboys from mattering unless you play them far far back -- so far they wont matter (I think da jumping around the board to position better next time. I forget about it), and blast doesnt matter for guns that hit on 5+ anyways. I felt like this was won because of a few critical lucky rolls and less about the impact of decisions I made, but hey, it was fun to play anyways!
The UM player already has already talked about a new list that will be much more punchy and oppressively vs what I was doing, so I cant wait till we next meet up. I wanna build a slightly different list next -- I sort of want to do a goffs Mork/dread/bikeboss/Ghaz/Boyz/MANZ/Wagons/Trukks thing. I might comeback for more questions.....
All this bike talk has me pondering how worthy they will be post/codex and whether I should pick some up....
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/03/08 17:22:01
2021/03/08 20:45:52
Subject: We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics
I say it all the time - ork army is full of options and wonderful unexpected new combinations
Honestly, both lists are pretty much different from we saw before. They stink by TTS, I saw some deffdreads in alpha league videos and just the madman tries to move 3x30boyz in TTS in to the area terrain with more floors
We also had the option for a SAG mek on a warbike. Warbikes gave relentless so he could move and shoot an ordnance weapon, in a time where you couldn't move and shoot heavy weapons. I made a really cool model for that, sadly we lost the option before it saw the paintbrush.
Yeah! I' ve almost started the construction of 3 SAGbikes to ad them to my 3 regular SAGs and play 6 of them in one game! Like 2 years ago? Sweet memories.
Furthermore, every winning list having 12-18 smasha gunz just drives home the likelihood that they will get nerfed with the next codex. Probably reduce unit size to 2 per or something along those lines.
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang. 
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
3500+
3300+
1000
1850
2000 
10k p fullpaint orks ready to krump! …
then they all went away...
and pull my MANZWagon back a bit to screen out and protect my weirdboy/smasha guns from the termie drop. Mork, the dragsta, and the stormboyz all take up a space in his backboard and blow up a defiler even before the charge (