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Derek H wrote:

Chikout wrote:

Let’s say hypothetically a box costs half of the sales price to assemble ship and store. In this scenario if gw produces 50,000 but sells 34,000 they would make less profit than by selling out a run of 20,000. If gw produces 100,000 copies but sells 49,000 copies they would lose money.

That's not a sensible way to consider things. Due to the many fixed costs involved (design time, cost of making a mould, marketing costs etc etc) GWs cost per box is hugely variable. The first one off the production line has cost an absolute fortune, but the price per box goes down thereafter.

Marginal costs (the extra cost of a box added on to a production run) can be really low, 20% or less of retail, and are dependent on the size of a production run among other factors. .

That's why I said hypothetically. I just chose 50% as it makes the math easy. The principal is sound though. There is a point at which doing a larger run does not actually mean more profit.

Many companies have gone bankrupt by over producing products; Atari and thq being two well known examples. There are fairly reliable rumours that the over production of Gorkamorka almost did for GW.

Holy fething gak. One more thing to keep and sell for 300%. I'm shocked, but happy as I will end up profiting from it :'D

The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

Chikout wrote:

Derek H wrote:

Chikout wrote:

Let’s say hypothetically a box costs half of the sales price to assemble ship and store. In this scenario if gw produces 50,000 but sells 34,000 they would make less profit than by selling out a run of 20,000. If gw produces 100,000 copies but sells 49,000 copies they would lose money.

That's not a sensible way to consider things. Due to the many fixed costs involved (design time, cost of making a mould, marketing costs etc etc) GWs cost per box is hugely variable. The first one off the production line has cost an absolute fortune, but the price per box goes down thereafter.

Marginal costs (the extra cost of a box added on to a production run) can be really low, 20% or less of retail, and are dependent on the size of a production run among other factors. .

That's why I said hypothetically. I just chose 50% as it makes the math easy. The principal is sound though. There is a point at which doing a larger run does not actually mean more profit.

​Your hypothesis has been tested and it has been proved to be wrong. The maths may be easy but the principle is nonsensical.

There is indeed a point for any product at which a larger run does not mean more profit, for the company, but you're not shedding any light on what that number might be with your calculation.

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

ERP means something else where I live

This seems likely for preorder disruption, not really for Cursed City vanishing.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

ERP means something else where I live

This seems likely for preorder disruption, not really for Cursed City vanishing.

ERP literally controls everything. If GW can't track where it is, where they are going to store it, how many they can manufacture, how they can get it to stores, how much the components cost etc etc I could quite easily see them doing a short, safe run for now and then looking at re-releasing it later if they can.

Derek H wrote:


​Your hypothesis has been tested and it has been proved to be wrong. The maths may be easy but the principle is nonsensical.

There is indeed a point for any product at which a larger run does not mean more profit, for the company, but you're not shedding any light on what that number might be with your calculation.

I think you're missing the point. I wasn't trying to say what the number is, simply that GW's production decisions are based on how likely they are to make a guaranteed profit rather than the potential of a higher profit. This is something you just agreed with so I'll leave it there.

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

OMG, El Reg and GeeDubs, this is the best crossover episode I have ever seen.

Thanks for the articles, I think you hit the nail on the head here. It all makes more sense now and I get why GW is going to be cagey about this sort of thing. I'd still like to see more transparency but now I can sympathize a little more.

As somebody who used to build data integration software and sadly had to work heavily with Dynamics AX...

I now understand every logistical problem GW has had since 2012

At least it wasn't AX 2009

Rihgu wrote:
As somebody who used to build data integration software and sadly had to work heavily with Dynamics AX...

I now understand every logistical problem GW has had since 2012

At least it was AX 2009

Yeah, this makes me so much more sympathetic to their plight. There are a lot of companies way savvier than GW who still fall into this same moirass.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

ERP means something else where I live

This seems likely for preorder disruption, not really for Cursed City vanishing.

In "my" region we usually name it after the company the main software comes from, SAP
and if there are problems with this it not only affect warehouse numbers or pre-orders but productions as a whole (and a minor error can change how many boxes are produced etc.)

 kodos wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

ERP means something else where I live

This seems likely for preorder disruption, not really for Cursed City vanishing.

In "my" region we usually name it after the company the main software comes from, SAP
and if there are problems with this it not only affect warehouse numbers or pre-orders but productions as a whole (and a minor error can change how many boxes are produced etc.)

Where I live ERP means EroticRolePlay

Well, I think we can put to rest the theory that Cursed City's production shortage was pre-planned by GW to show those puny consumers who is boss.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Don't wanna say i called it but i called it

No. You said that it was GW's plan to make only a fraction of the copies that would be needed to even meet demand for preorders. But as you did not engage with anything anybody else said, I'm not sure if you're just trolling at this point.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Where I live ERP means EroticRolePlay

OK, trolling.

TheGoodGerman wrote:
Well, I think we can put to rest the theory that Cursed City's production shortage was pre-planned by GW to show those puny consumers who is boss.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Don't wanna say i called it but i called it

No. You said that it was GW's plan to make only a fraction of the copies that would be needed to even meet demand for preorders. But as you did not engage with anything anybody else said, I'm not sure if you're just trolling at this point.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Where I live ERP means EroticRolePlay

OK, trolling.

Both sentences are genuine

Oh, and the Cursed City copy I've ordered from GW on the morning of the 9th, where I tried to cancel the order on the 10th but they sent it out anyway four days later, is still with UPS. Currently sitting at the customs agent in UK. Yay, Brexit!

But the copy I ordered at noon on the 9th from an online seller here in Germany arrived 20hours after I put the order in.

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

Given the so-called journalists couldn't be bothered to do the thing you're meant to do with acronyms - explain what they mean the first time you use them in a piece - in either fething article, can someone explain in plain English what ERP is meant to mean in this context?

 Dysartes wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

Given the so-called journalists couldn't be bothered to do the thing you're meant to do with acronyms - explain what they mean the first time you use them in a piece - in either fething article, can someone explain in plain English what ERP is meant to mean in this context?

Enterprise resource planning.

Wikipedia wrote:Enterprise resource planning (ERP) is the integrated management of main business processes, often in real time and mediated by software and technology.

ERP is usually referred to as a category of business management software—typically a suite of integrated applications—that an organization can use to collect, store, manage, and interpret data from many business activities. ERP Systems can be local based or Cloud based. Cloud based applications are growing in recent days .

JWBS wrote:

deano2099 wrote:


Of course GW use artificial scarcity to boost sales. Every tried to get one of the limited edition Siege of Terra hardbacks? They go in minutes. They could clearly print twice as many and still sell them.

Boosting sales by selling half as many as they clearly could. fething genius!

It works though. In book publishing the scarcity of first editions drives their value. People are literally buying the books as collectables. So the small number available helps drives sales. And the people that don't get the £50 limited edition will still then buy the £20 hardback so they don't out entirely.

 Dysartes wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

Given the so-called journalists couldn't be bothered to do the thing you're meant to do with acronyms - explain what they mean the first time you use them in a piece - in either fething article, can someone explain in plain English what ERP is meant to mean in this context?

ERP stands for Enterprise Resource Planning and refers to software and systems used to plan and manage all the core supply chain, manufacturing, services, financial and other processes of an organization

A better description in plainer english than I can give. I mostly worked with/on the back end of them so am only barely familiar with what they actually do from a user perspective

So I guess DXC Technology wrote GW a really good covering letter saying how much they love Space Marines, and got the contract based on that???

Crispy78 wrote:
So I guess DXC Technology wrote GW a really good covering letter saying how much they love Space Marines, and got the contract based on that???

Better than the company before them (or possibly 2 before) who got it because their boss was married to GW's boss...

I mean, its not like DXC isn't a ~$20 billion multinational corporation or anything.

EDIT - Ironically this poster in the regs comments seemed to have called it last year: https://forums.theregister.com/forum/all/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/?force_isolation=true

If the partner is DXC, for example, they are screwed. But any other D365 partner should be more than capable.

Yeah I saw that too.

My comment above was intended to be flippant - but it is perfectly possible for big companies to screw things up. And an ERP migration is a hard thing to get right.

I think it took my employers a good 5-6 years and about a billion dollars...

This has suddenly become the most genuinely interesting thread on Dakka, despite not knowing what anyone is talking about.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

Spoiler:

 kodos wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

ERP means something else where I live

This seems likely for preorder disruption, not really for Cursed City vanishing.

In "my" region we usually name it after the company the main software comes from, SAP
and if there are problems with this it not only affect warehouse numbers or pre-orders but productions as a whole (and a minor error can change how many boxes are produced etc.)

Where I live ERP means EroticRolePlay

I suppose you speak for your milieu, not your country.

Crispy78 wrote:
So I guess DXC Technology wrote GW a really good covering letter saying how much they love Space Marines, and got the contract based on that???

I worked for a company and legend was the only reason we were using a particular software(which was really outdated) was that our CEO played golf with the guy who owned the software company..

I'm a little late to this Cursed City fiasco, but here's a thought...

Being an intellectual property attorney with experience in trademark and copyright infringement litigation, it occurred to me that this behavior by GW, particularly the scrubbing of its websites of all Cursed City content, could mean that GW received a legitimate cease and desist letter. There is no good PR to address such a mess so late in a products release cycle. If the models are coming back later, then the issue is with the game setting (i.e. copyright infringement) or junior trademark (i.e. TM infringement).

callidusx3 wrote:
I'm a little late to this Cursed City fiasco, but here's a thought...

Being an intellectual property attorney with experience in trademark and copyright infringement litigation, it occurred to me that this behavior by GW, particularly the scrubbing of its websites of all Cursed City content, could mean that GW received a legitimate cease and desist letter. There is no good PR to address such a mess so late in a products release cycle. If the models are coming back later, then the issue is with the game setting (i.e. copyright infringement) or junior trademark (i.e. TM infringement).

This is very unlikely, especially as the Cursed City website is still live.

I think the reason they have removed the product from the webstore and the links on the Warhammer Community pages is simply because people can't get the game. The WarCom articles are also still active though, you just can't link to them from the main page. And the YouTube videos are also still active.

If they had removed all online content I would agree it sounds plausible, but there still official GW content available online.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
This has suddenly become the most genuinely interesting thread on Dakka, despite not knowing what anyone is talking about.

Can’t say I’m really knowledgable on the topic, but wholeheartedly agree.

Obviously all I really want is to see more models and cool stuff, and ideally things not disappear from sale etc.
But in the mean time, interesting reads.

Rihgu wrote:

Spoiler:

 Dysartes wrote:

StraightSilver wrote:
The main reason for all of the issues at GW right now is this:

https://www.theregister.com/2021/01/15/games_workshop_erp_saga/

An earlier post about the same thing:

https://www.theregister.com/2020/01/14/games_workshop_warns_of_risks_in_microsoft_dynamics_365_erp_project/

This is a big deal for any company and if you read the first article can be devastating if not implemented correctly.

Frankly, it hasn't gone swimmingly and now a 3rd party has been drafted in to help (now on GW payroll permanently).

This has affected absolutely every aspect of their business and is causing quite a few headaches.

Combine this with the move into the new distribution hub (delayed by COVID and the above), Brexit (GW is being hit hard because it's products are manufactured in multiple countries of origin), Nottinghamshire Council not playing ball relating to GW's need for extra electricity supply so it can ramp up manufacturing, COVID causing all sorts of delays/problems, and Ever Green and you have a perfect storm that is hitting GW really badly right now.

Given the so-called journalists couldn't be bothered to do the thing you're meant to do with acronyms - explain what they mean the first time you use them in a piece - in either fething article, can someone explain in plain English what ERP is meant to mean in this context?

ERP stands for Enterprise Resource Planning and refers to software and systems used to plan and manage all the core supply chain, manufacturing, services, financial and other processes of an organization

A better description in plainer english than I can give. I mostly worked with/on the back end of them so am only barely familiar with what they actually do from a user perspective

Thanks for that, Rihgu - always annoys me when people doing news assume that anyone reading an article automatically knows what the acronyms mean.