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I don't think they take hosts, they just copy them by eating the original. They do gain the knowledge the original had, at least to some degree.

-STS

The problem with all discussions like this can be summed up as follows:
Who would win, an astartes or a genestealer? Even without mixing canon from other success, there is no clear answer. The space marine will win sometimes, the genestealer will win other times. A space marine can kill a genestealer yet a genestealer is capable of killing a terminator. It all comes down to circumstances.


If the question is, which is best/strongest/most dangerous, my answer will usually be the marine.
Most other protagonists and antagonists have one or two advantages over common soldiers: experience/skill, equipment or bio engineering. Marines have all 3.

As for magic/psychic powers vs a tactical marine, again it comes back to circumstances. Psychic powers can be resisted, even by non psykers. Marines are quite used to fighting against that particular advantage, they often lose, but not always.


I don't think I saw any Stargate references.
Jaffa would lose.
Goa'uld would probably lose
Replicants would lose one on one for sure.
Priest dudes whose name I have forgotten, also lose.

Zustiur wrote:

I don't think I saw any Stargate references.
Jaffa would lose.
Goa'uld would probably lose
Replicants would lose one on one for sure.
Priest dudes whose name I have forgotten, also lose.

I've been watching my way through stargate recently. Currently partway through season 8.
Kull warriors could possibly give them a fight. A legion of bio-engineered super soldiers wearing near impervious armour. Already sound pretty similar to marines honestly.


Replicators are basically a necron scarab swarm that self-replicates uncontrollably using any available metal and power sources, and captures then overclocks any new technology they encounter.
A few of their bug forms by themselves aren't a problem if dealt with swiftly, but their threat is kind of proportional to how far they are allowed to spread.

Arson Fire wrote:
I've been watching my way through stargate recently. Currently partway through season 8.
Kull warriors could possibly give them a fight. A legion of bio-engineered super soldiers wearing near impervious armour. Already sound pretty similar to marines honestly.

Spoiler:

Replicators are basically a necron scarab swarm that self-replicates uncontrollably using any available metal and power sources, and captures then overclocks any new technology they encounter.
A few of their bug forms by themselves aren't a problem if dealt with swiftly, but their threat is kind of proportional to how far they are allowed to spread.

I just restarted watching it again, and still in the middle of the first season.

Kull Warriors would have a good chance at range, I don't remember seeing them fight hand to hand, and no idea how their armor interacts with power weapons. I think I remember seeing them fought with heavy kinetics (flying logs, rock slides, etc) and them still surviving, but it has been a long while.

The Goa'uld's tech could be strong enough to defeat a Marine, but most of them are not fighters, and their reactions are decent, but still not enough to make up the difference. Their Jaffa's numbers with their staff weapons might be enough, but one on one, it would depend on who noticed who first and who is the protagonist.

And yeah, the Asgard Replicators are just "weak" and noisy Necron scrab swarms. Easy to handle one on one, depending on the materials making them, but their ability to swarm will be the problem. Good news is that most Marines don't use energy based weapons, but rely on kinetic/explosive weapons to which they are particularly vulnerable.

The Lantian Replicators, though. That required turning their planet in to a literal singularity to defeat, so I'm not sure how good the average Astartes would be.

The priests of the Ori I would classify as humans with very strong psyker powers. If the priest was prepared to deal with them, it would almost be like that Astartes part 4 video and very close to call.

Got any counts as? I suppose Replicators = scarabs
Aren't most Goauald just humanish+ I don't know much about the show.

-STS

slade the sniper wrote:
Got any counts as? I suppose Replicators = scarabs
Aren't most Goauald just humanish+ I don't know much about the show.

They're more like fish-worm parasires that live inside humans. But yeah, any human mini will work as their host body.

 Insectum7 wrote:

slade the sniper wrote:
Got any counts as? I suppose Replicators = scarabs
Aren't most Goauald just humanish+ I don't know much about the show.

They're more like fish-worm parasires that live inside humans. But yeah, any human mini will work as their host body.

Unless they go Unas instead, but they are incredibly rare by the time of the show. Only about 2-3 infected left at all.

Of course, there's Anubis. He would probably be the hardest one to quantify out of them all before getting to the Ori themselves. Phenomenal cosmic power and he can't use a lick of it.

Was just looking at someone's modification of the Mechanicus Flyer and it reminded my of Dune's Ornithopters.

That got me thinking about this thread, and the idea of a Devastator squad with Lascannons hitting a squad of shielded Sardaukar would be... interesting.

I also wonder how well they'd be able to handle slowing down at the last second to get past those shields in melee.

Fremen would have problems though. As good and quick as they are, I don't think they'd be fast enough to take on an armored Astartes. Against an unarmored Astartes they MIGHT have a chance, especially after learning the Wierding Way from the Atreides.

I've always wanted to to Fremin Kroot, this always seemed like the perfect swap to the 40k universe.

The weirding way (Forget the lynch movie fethover of it with the sonic steampunk boxes) might give marines a hard time.

Blndmage wrote:I've always wanted to to Fremin Kroot, this always seemed like the perfect swap to the 40k universe.

Honestly, I don't think the Kroot had the WS or the I to match up with Fremen. I'd put them halfway between Catachans and Wyches, personally. Still, they could work for basic presentation on the tabletop.

Matt Swain wrote:The weirding way (Forget the lynch movie fethover of it with the sonic steampunk boxes) might give marines a hard time.

I saw bits and pieces of Lynch's Dune before I read the book. After reading the book a few times, I managed to get my hands on it for rent and spent a some time going WTF, and the modules were probably the most consistent part of it.

ScyFy's mini-series was a better representation of it, but I still think that their Krys knives won't be very effective against Astartes Power Armor, and that against a seasoned Astartes out of armor, they would still be outmached over all. The Fremen might be faster and might be more precise (anti-shield training can seriously effective here, I think), but the strength and toughness in addition to experience that the average Tactical would have would be the most telling in most cases.

 Blndmage wrote:
I've always wanted to to Fremin Kroot, this always seemed like the perfect swap to the 40k universe.

Fremen Count As Kroot? Lemme check that stat line...hmmm, I don't think they really fit in terms of stats. I think Fremen would use a Incubus Klaivex using a single Demi-Klaive. Their ability would be the Lethal Precision from the Incubus and a 4+ Invulnerable save due to the Weirding Way.

As for Shields, those are a conundrum for 40K, buuuut, I would say that a Holtzman shield gives a 2+ armor save vs ranged weapons and a 3+ vs melee. A half shield gives a flat 4+ armor save. To cover the "atomic" power detonations of shields and lasers, there seems to be a huge variability as to the damage caused and where it is caused such as inside the shield, outside the shield, inside the laser weapon, killing one person, or both or an entire army. To mimic that on a tabletop, I would go with a large blast template and a 1d6 to determine the center of the explosion. On a 1-2 the explosion is centered on the shooter, on a 3-4 the explosion in centered on the middle of the path the laser took to the target, and on a 5-6, the blast is centered on the target (bypassing the shield). To all targets within the blast template all models take 1d6 mortal wounds, roll separately for model affected.

-STS

Astartes Marine vs Protoss Zealot is a fun one. The classic question is whether Protoss Psionics are treated as their own distinct thing or whether they interact with 40k's Psyker framework.

 Charistoph wrote:

A lot depends on the skill of the bender

Juvenile aside: international folks on this forum may not be aware, but in British schoolboy slang, 'bender' is a really well-known derogatory term for a male homosexual. The discussion in general, and this line in particular, damn near killed me...

It's like "Free Willy" all over again.

slade the sniper wrote:As for Shields, those are a conundrum for 40K, buuuut, I would say that a Holtzman shield gives a 2+ armor save vs ranged weapons and a 3+ vs melee. A half shield gives a flat 4+ armor save. To cover the "atomic" power detonations of shields and lasers, there seems to be a huge variability as to the damage caused and where it is caused such as inside the shield, outside the shield, inside the laser weapon, killing one person, or both or an entire army. To mimic that on a tabletop, I would go with a large blast template and a 1d6 to determine the center of the explosion. On a 1-2 the explosion is centered on the shooter, on a 3-4 the explosion in centered on the middle of the path the laser took to the target, and on a 5-6, the blast is centered on the target (bypassing the shield). To all targets within the blast template all models take 1d6 mortal wounds, roll separately for model affected.

They've usually presented it as both the lasgun and shield going kerblewy due to the resonances involved. And I think they are both nuclear-powered so reason of the big boom.

Honestly, I'd keep it as an Invul, as AP is unlikely to work against it. Heck, most AP is likely to work against the shot trying to penetrate the Holtzman Shield.

MagicJuggler wrote:Astartes Marine vs Protoss Zealot is a fun one. The classic question is whether Protoss Psionics are treated as their own distinct thing or whether they interact with 40k's Psyker framework.

For Zealots I don't think it would matter much. Most of their psionics are focused on powering their blades and linking to the Khala. The Khala provides unity and apparently helps in developing a group mind for combat if Legacy of the Void's intro cinematic is anything to go by.

It is the Templars who would be the ones needing to be addressed, as they are the ones with wacky powers.

For 7th/8th edition I did mine as Deathwing assault terminators. Lightning claws and the force field counts as terminator 2+ 5++. Havent seen what it would count as for the latest iteration.

Regarding stargate and gualuald, what would happen if the marines were subject to infection by the parasite? Would those marines become even stronger? Would such marines be able to spread the cult among other marines? Would the parasite be able to live inside an astartes?

Gitdakka wrote:
Regarding stargate and gualuald, what would happen if the marines were subject to infection by the parasite? Would those marines become even stronger? Would such marines be able to spread the cult among other marines? Would the parasite be able to live inside an astartes?

Well, the Imperium's propaganda will tell you that it would be impossible just like the Hive Guard did not develop out of the Astartes genetic sequences.

That being said, for the capacity of being infected, yes they could. If they could infect an Unas, then an Astartes should represent the same physical difficulty.

Could it control the Host? More than likely in 99% of cases. I'm not so sure about a situation of a Librarian/Grey Knight who already have disciplined minds to counter the Warp. There is the case of Kendra who was able to whisper to the parasite and convince it to ignore the warnings of the Asgard Hammer of Thor defense and get caught by it. She was a normal human raised under the Goa'uld, not a highly trained mentalist. I'd say it was a coin flip's chance at best, in favor of the parasite when not best.

Could it spread a cult? No and yes. It depends on how it approached creating the cult. It would literally have to work for centuries trying to warp the Chapter from within and eventually become a strong Captain or Chapter Master and turn them against the Imperium. We've seen it happen with numerous other cults of Choas and Renegades, so possible, but still a challenge.

I really don't think they'd have much chance in the star trek universe. Even TOS.

Watch this video:


Now they had antimatter mortar rounds badically the size of baseballs and a man familkiar with them was concerned that they'd be firing one at a target 'only" 1200 yards away. That's 3,600 feet.

For you metric types that's a about 100 meters over a kilometer.

Now, seriously, first off if they can stabilize anti matter enough to use it in mortar rounds ready to go at a moment's notice and if a weapon like that is possibly dangerous to the firer at 1200 yards/1100meters, imagine what it's going to be like on a 40k tabletop.

"Feth your invulnerable save, you're dead!"

That baseball sized warhead must have had a yield of 1 kilton or two.

 Matt Swain wrote:
I really don't think they'd have much chance in the star trek universe. Even TOS.

Watch this video:


Now they had antimatter mortar rounds badically the size of baseballs and a man familkiar with them was concerned that they'd be firing one at a target 'only" 1200 yards away. That's 3,600 feet.

For you metric types that's a about 100 meters over a kilometer.

Now, seriously, first off if they can stabilize anti matter enough to use it in mortar rounds ready to go at a moment's notice and if a weapon like that is possibly dangerous to the firer at 1200 yards/1100meters, imagine what it's going to be like on a 40k tabletop.

"Feth your invulnerable save, you're dead!"

That baseball sized warhead must have had a yield of 1 kilton or two.

Except that we can see that there's no explosion and that even the greenery on that hill is unaffected by the blast. They fired a glorified strobe light as if it was going to do anything.

A continuing problem for both Star Wars and Star Trek is that their visuals and descriptions just do not match. They talk about gigatons and then show some piddly explosion. They talk about massive fleet battles then show ships firing at each other in visual range where they look huge to an outside observer (thus negating the argument that they are using magnification tech on their bridge).

So, if you go by what you see...then apparently Star Fleet puts explosives in their control panels, Stormtroopers have armor that increases damage and the actual range of spacecraft weapons is about 100 kilometers.

Alternately you can go by what the characters say, which is still a bit stupid...BUT if you make the assumption that the characters in the movie/show are just about as competent as normal people, then they really don't a damn thing about anything that is not directly involved in their day to day job.

Ask a naval officer about a mortar, and you are going to get a really wide gap of knowledge. Ask a Columbian drug smuggler about US Navy detention facility SOPs and they probably won't know.

So basically, I sort of use a two pronged approach:
1. Most explosions IRL are not as OMFG WOW as they are in film. So, basically give the benefit of the doubt so that maybe the warhead isn't the best choice, or something like that...again, fireballs are not really a thing that happens IRL that you can see in real time.
2. Most of the people talking about tech things outside of their field probably don't know much beyond something they heard once. How many people have heard stupidity like you can't use a fifty cal on personnel, a bullet sucks in air, a fifty cal is so powerful a near miss can kill, the M-16 was designed to wound, ballistic armor could make getting shot more dangerous because it will cause the bullet to expand, etc etc. Basically, people are stupid, and if you think that Kirk and Spock somehow went to Infantry Mortar Leaders Course to learn how to use mortars and not just hipshoot it by kentucky windage and luck.

As for it being "a little close" we have to assume that they are accurately estimating distance (not easy), then having their mortar set for airburst (via proximity fuze). Then they move to the BACK of their position, which puts them at more risk of fragmentation or whatever weirdo radiation is emanating from said airburst. I would just assume they jacked up the range estimation, guessed on the height of airburst and fired. The enemy, upon taking indirect fire probably (and incorrectly) assumed that the humans had gotten some reinforcements and that since they would have to assault the humans, said assault would be at much more risk having to assault through indirect fire...so they pulled off. Stranger things have happened in war.

Finally, I am just going to headcanon that the dude was meaning 1200 feet and not 1200 yards.

-STS

Most of the stuff from Battletech is lightly to give Marines a hard time.

Even a comparison with Battletech battle armour against Marines doesnt leave them in a good place. Especially if you start talking about assault and heavy class suits.

Anything that can put down heavy fire is lightly to mess up Marines. The whole strength and close combat ability is overblown. It simply doesn't matter. CC hasn't caused major casualties in wars since the musket and cannon were developed.


On an operational level you'd actually start wondering how Marines would survive against other sci-fi forces as portrayed in Battletech, Dirtside, LaserStorm, etc. Can't actually see their ground forces making much impact in any of these universes.

40k is more fantasy in space than any real attempt at futuristic warfare. When 40k meets real military sci-fi I don't think the results don't look good for most 40k stuff - especially the Marines.

niall78 wrote:
Most of the stuff from Battletech is lightly to give Marines a hard time.

Even a comparison with Battletech battle armour against Marines doesnt leave them in a good place. Especially if you start talking about assault and heavy class suits.

Anything that can put down heavy fire is lightly to mess up Marines. The whole strength and close combat ability is overblown. It simply doesn't matter. CC hasn't caused major casualties in wars since the musket and cannon were developed.

At the scale that Battletech usually plays in, yes, but Battletech plays more at an Epic or Adeptus Titanicus level. But if you convert Battletech to 40K, things change as most Battlemechs would classify as Lords of War, and so would a lot of the Combat Vehicles. Battletech armor is intended to be ablative to prevent penetration, while 40K armor attempts to deflect the penetration, and Battletech weaponry is designed to deal with armor that ablates.

To use an example, their missile systems are racks of multiple munitions that individually aren't very strong, but whittle away the armor. Individually speaking, a short-range missile hits about as hard as a Multilaser, and the long-range missile is much weaker, closer to a lasgun (but hey, you're shooting up to 20 of them in a rack, though a good portion miss). You have to use Thunderbolts to match what 40K uses, but Battletech uses Anti-Missile Systems which make short work of Thunderbolts, while only reducing the number of hits that the SRM and LRM racks use.

Now, to be fair, I don't think an Astartes could handle a hit from a Medium Laser very well without engaging an Iron Halo, Storm Shield, or similar shielding system, much less a Particle Projection Cannon, but then heavy infantry isn't usually the target of such in Battletech (at least, before Clan Battle Armor was introduced).

niall78 wrote:
40k is more fantasy in space than any real attempt at futuristic warfare. When 40k meets real military sci-fi I don't think the results don't look good for most 40k stuff - especially the Marines.

True to a point, but on any level where Infantry can make a difference, you'll find that the Astartes start pushing ahead. They may not work well against Bolos (AI-driven Baneblades), David Weber's Dahak (a starship that hid itself as Earth's moon), or possibly Saberhagen's Berserkers (think Skynet with access to asteroid-sized starships), but against Star Wars, Halo, or Star Trek, they would fare rather well.

To use Halo as an example, Spartans are very few in number when compared to Astartes, and Astartes usually come in packs. Think about when you're playing Co-Op Halo 2 and just much you tear in to things, and then have up to 10 of you guys running around how easy it would be. The Astartes will also usually have better close combat skills and be tougher than the Spartans are without their shield (even if you consider the armor to be the same).

 Charistoph wrote:

niall78 wrote:
Most of the stuff from Battletech is lightly to give Marines a hard time.

Even a comparison with Battletech battle armour against Marines doesnt leave them in a good place. Especially if you start talking about assault and heavy class suits.

Anything that can put down heavy fire is lightly to mess up Marines. The whole strength and close combat ability is overblown. It simply doesn't matter. CC hasn't caused major casualties in wars since the musket and cannon were developed.

At the scale that Battletech usually plays in, yes, but Battletech plays more at an Epic or Adeptus Titanicus level. But if you convert Battletech to 40K, things change as most Battlemechs would classify as Lords of War, and so would a lot of the Combat Vehicles. Battletech armor is intended to be ablative to prevent penetration, while 40K armor attempts to deflect the penetration, and Battletech weaponry is designed to deal with armor that ablates.

To use an example, their missile systems are racks of multiple munitions that individually aren't very strong, but whittle away the armor. Individually speaking, a short-range missile hits about as hard as a Multilaser, and the long-range missile is much weaker, closer to a lasgun (but hey, you're shooting up to 20 of them in a rack, though a good portion miss). You have to use Thunderbolts to match what 40K uses, but Battletech uses Anti-Missile Systems which make short work of Thunderbolts, while only reducing the number of hits that the SRM and LRM racks use.

Now, to be fair, I don't think an Astartes could handle a hit from a Medium Laser very well without engaging an Iron Halo, Storm Shield, or similar shielding system, much less a Particle Projection Cannon, but then heavy infantry isn't usually the target of such in Battletech (at least, before Clan Battle Armor was introduced).

niall78 wrote:
40k is more fantasy in space than any real attempt at futuristic warfare. When 40k meets real military sci-fi I don't think the results don't look good for most 40k stuff - especially the Marines.

True to a point, but on any level where Infantry can make a difference, you'll find that the Astartes start pushing ahead. They may not work well against Bolos (AI-driven Baneblades), David Weber's Dahak (a starship that hid itself as Earth's moon), or possibly Saberhagen's Berserkers (think Skynet with access to asteroid-sized starships), but against Star Wars, Halo, or Star Trek, they would fare rather well.

To use Halo as an example, Spartans are very few in number when compared to Astartes, and Astartes usually come in packs. Think about when you're playing Co-Op Halo 2 and just much you tear in to things, and then have up to 10 of you guys running around how easy it would be. The Astartes will also usually have better close combat skills and be tougher than the Spartans are without their shield (even if you consider the armor to be the same).

Would agree with Halo and Star Wars. Haven't really been exposed to much Star Trek ground war stuff.

Star Wars has the fantasy in space thing going as well.

Against well fluffed out sci-fi universes that deal with ground combat 40k stuff isn't really at the races though. Especially if you start talking at the operational level or even larger force tactics. I'd agree that scale is an issue. Epic gave a good feel for bigger level 40k - it was still fantasy WW1 in space though. I don't mean that in a bad way either as I loved the original Space Marine and 2nd edition.

Epic again made a joke of the universe fluff. You could - in a bigger game - lose a Marine Chapter. Fluff in 40k is a moving feast as others have said before. Scale and power never seem to fit or be standardised within the universe.

People often focus on the toughness of Astartes, and forget about their sheer stamina.

Not only can they physically fight longer than their foes, but they don’t suffer from sleep deprivation, and are largely immune to psychological warfare.

Consider that Man and Dog are a successful hunting partnership, because both are persistence hunters. Sure, many animals are faster - but they can’t maintain it for very long.

An Astartes doesn’t just survive hit and fade attack strategies, but can maintain it for a ridiculously long period. Not hours, but days.

They don’t need to stop and tend to all but the most serious of wounds, because their bodies heal quickly and efficiently.

They can eat pretty much anything. So even the most inhospitable of terrain and that isn’t of much concern.

The issue with pitting the Imperium against the Empire is that they both want to fight very different types of wars. Star Wars wants to keep the fight in space and prevent you from ever landing. They also have hypermobility with ships able to traverse the galaxy in less than a day. No 40k force, aside from the Necrons, can ever pick a fight on its own terms.

This isn't even to mention that a pair of moon-sized battle stations were designed and built, in secret, in less than two decades. The shipyards of the IoM can barely repair some of the ships in their fleets let alone pull a Death Star out of nowhere. Other forces are equally limited otherwise the IoM would have been overrun already. Then there are things like a small collection of systems under Sith control building a fleet of planet-destroying warships.

If we assume that there is even rough parity between their space forces in a straight-up fight the IoM stands no chance against the First Order let alone the Empire.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
People often focus on the toughness of Astartes, and forget about their sheer stamina.

Not only can they physically fight longer than their foes, but they don’t suffer from sleep deprivation, and are largely immune to psychological warfare.

Consider that Man and Dog are a successful hunting partnership, because both are persistence hunters. Sure, many animals are faster - but they can’t maintain it for very long.

An Astartes doesn’t just survive hit and fade attack strategies, but can maintain it for a ridiculously long period. Not hours, but days.

They don’t need to stop and tend to all but the most serious of wounds, because their bodies heal quickly and efficiently.

They can eat pretty much anything. So even the most inhospitable of terrain and that isn’t of much concern.

How does that stack up to a robot/droid that can do that but better and which can be built at a rate that makes guard recruitment look slow?

 Canadian 5th wrote:
The issue with pitting the Imperium against the Empire is that they both want to fight very different types of wars. Star Wars wants to keep the fight in space and prevent you from ever landing. They also have hypermobility with ships able to traverse the galaxy in less than a day. No 40k force, aside from the Necrons, can ever pick a fight on its own terms.

This isn't even to mention that a pair of moon-sized battle stations were designed and built, in secret, in less than two decades. The shipyards of the IoM can barely repair some of the ships in their fleets let alone pull a Death Star out of nowhere. Other forces are equally limited otherwise the IoM would have been overrun already. Then there are things like a small collection of systems under Sith control building a fleet of planet-destroying warships.

If we assume that there is even rough parity between their space forces in a straight-up fight the IoM stands no chance against the First Order let alone the Empire.

On the other hand, Imperial-class Star Destroyers are little more than Cruiser sized ships at BFG's scale, and the Warp sometimes drops people out of it before they even leave.

As for those moon-sized battle stations, that assumes they can keep them operational long enough. One advantage of the Imperium of Man is that they have outside enemies that they can regularly focus on, as opposed to the Galactic Empire who had no real outside threats to work against. Also the Imperium of Man vastly outnumbers the population the Galactic Empire is willing to use.

Of course, one of the problems with having so many outside enemies is that one is always fighting so resources are always scattered.

 Charistoph wrote:
On the other hand, Imperial-class Star Destroyers are little more than Cruiser sized ships at BFG's scale

A cruiser-sized ship with 40k fighter-like speed and battleship class firepower sounds like a nightmare for the IoM.

[T]he Warp sometimes drops people out of it before they even leave.

As often it eats an entire fleet or causes it to arrive decades late. Unpredictable travel times for every ship in a given fleet is not an advantage.

As for those moon-sized battle stations, that assumes they can keep them operational long enough.

Does the IoM have an X-Wing equivalent that is piloted by somebody with GEoMK level predestined greatness? If not they never lose the first Death Star let alone any follow ups.

Also the Imperium of Man vastly outnumbers the population the Galactic Empire is willing to use.

That doesn't mean anything when we know Palpatine is willing to use clones and droids to his advantage.

Pfft, Space Marines would just storm the Death Star. I've seen how those storm troopers fight.

Seeing Terminators fight their way through the Death Star would be sick. Bring along a Librarian to counter Force shenennigans and it's on.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Pfft, Space Marines would just storm the Death Star. I've seen how those storm troopers fight.

Seeing Terminators fight their way through the Death Star would be sick. Bring along a Librarian to counter Force shenennigans and it's on.

How would they reach it? Warp travel is so much slower than hyperspace travel so there's a good chance they can't even reach the system that contains the DS. On top of that drop pods and boarding torpedoes are slower and less maneuverable than a Star Wars fighter making any such attack a suicide run at best. Vader's last-minute fighter screen would have cleaned up any such attack and even if it didn't I'm not sure how the Marines could even board.