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2021/11/14 12:06:14
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
cody.d. wrote: So, managed to get 2 games using the new speedwaagh. One against a cron list with a varity of stuff but with a heavy focus on destroyers. The other against a chaos knight and belakor list.
Stomped the crons, was stomped by the knights which matches what I was expecting honestly.
What are peeps building? I kinda lean heavily into the warbikers, just because it's so much fun to be able to run them. While a pair of wazbombs punch big holes in anything chunky.
Mate suggested perhaps running two detachments, but after you have a trike with Speedking what other worthwhile buffs are there to hand out to the army?
Detachment 1 evil sun outrider
Warbike w killaklaw and fasts then yoos- adv and charge
2 max units of 9x warbikers
5x warbiker
5x deffkoptas (boomboys specialist +1ap) use crashing thru to destroy knights w 5 mortals on charge
Detachment 2 freebooter
Wartrike(warlord) freebooter banner, speedking- (shut down knights obj sec armigers)
2x boosta blasta (pyromaniacs)
2x scrapjets
3x squig buggies
1x Dakkajet w 2x shootas- benefits from +1 to hit freebooter
1x wazbom w 2x shootas-benefits from +1 to hit freebooter (use wazbom on knights)
Play the objective game vs knights w freebooter banner shutting down armigers and wazbom and deffkoptas doing as much damage to knights as possible… the mass str 6 ap2 Dakka might take out a few armigers or plink a few wounds off a knight, but anti tank is limited.. it’s more about durability w 7 buggies, 23x warbikers, wartrike and boss on bike, and 2 aircraft. Deffkoptas are kinda fragile but they hit hard in this list. Just remember in this list try to have scrapjets or squigbuggies finish off a unit so your wazbom/Dakkajet gets +1 to hit.
After the balance update I think knights, Tyranids, greyknights, drukari and even admech still are all going to be strong codexes.. which is good because we don’t need anymore focus on nerfing orks even though I think the points increase is still coming.
Apparently i was just recruited on to a very large tournement in my country. I was not meant to go but apparently they had a man down so ill be covering with my orks.
They dont use the updated new games workshop lists so if i wanted to i could slam down several scrapjets, but i only have 3 of those and no squig buggies. Its my first tournement so im damn excited! i do run 3 planes though, because they dont use the new rules (lists were submitted before the rules came out) so thats that. I kind of wish i had to use the new rules, but i also dont want to give myself a handicap when no one else is being given any. But i dont own a large quantity of scrapjets and squigbuggies.. So in either way it should be a fun event!
Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points) [12CP]
Clan Kultur: Freebooterz
Detachment Command Cost [-3CP]
+ HQ [6 PL, -1CP, 120pts] +
Big Mek in Mega Armour [6 PL, -1CP, 120pts]: Da Ded Shiny Shoota, Grot Oiler [5pts], Kustom Force Field [30pts], Kustom Shoota, Power Klaw, Stratagem: Extra Gubbinz [-1CP]
Tiberius501 wrote: Hey guys, getting back into the orkies and was wondering how this combat patrol list looks?
Spoiler:
Goffs
HQ - Mega Boss, Warlord, Brutal but Kunnin, Super Cybork Body
TROOPS
- 10x Boyz, Nob w/ Klaw, rest w/ choppas
- 10x Boyz, Nob w/ Bog Choppa, rest w/ choppas
ELITE
- 3x MANz w/ Klawz
HEAVY
- Deff Dread w/ Klaws
500 on the dot
Well I’m probably the least experienced player here but I do play patrol a lot. I personally wouldn’t be comfortable running your list against anything with good shooting as you risk being shot off the board before getting into melee. You would need very forgiving scenery or a strat like Teleporta.
2021/11/14 19:51:27
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Tiberius501 wrote: Hey guys, getting back into the orkies and was wondering how this combat patrol list looks?
Spoiler:
Goffs
HQ - Mega Boss, Warlord, Brutal but Kunnin, Super Cybork Body TROOPS - 10x Boyz, Nob w/ Klaw, rest w/ choppas - 10x Boyz, Nob w/ Bog Choppa, rest w/ choppas ELITE - 3x MANz w/ Klawz HEAVY - Deff Dread w/ Klaws
500 on the dot
Well I’m probably the least experienced player here but I do play patrol a lot. I personally wouldn’t be comfortable running your list against anything with good shooting as you risk being shot off the board before getting into melee. You would need very forgiving scenery or a strat like Teleporta.
I'd agree with that. Boyz aren't that great and you competely lack shooting. If there is an enemy shooting unit sitting in a place with great overview, there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. In general, you should aim to keep boyz to a minimum in combat patrol games and have at least one or two units which have a chance of shooting a marine unit or dread dead (not necessarily in one round). Options for that would be most of the buggies, lootas, mek guns, koptas, flash gits or a SAG. Almost anything that's less than 200 for a unit and doesn't blow itself up when shooting works.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/11/14 19:52:43
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/11/14 20:05:01
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I ran a kill rig for the first time. I ran it as freebooterz. It wasn't supper killy, but it also did not die...which was a big deal towards the end of the game. I think going forward there is no reason not to give it "Tough as Nails" warlord trait. That seems borderline broken.
Does anyone know what to do with the Beasthead Discipline powers? In a buggy list it seems like I should just give in the MW powers and hope for the best.
orks 10000+ points
"SHHH. My common sense is tingling."--Deadpoool
Daemon-Archon Ren wrote: ...it doesn't matter how many times I make a false statement, it will still be false.
2021/11/14 21:26:10
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Geemoney wrote: I ran a kill rig for the first time. I ran it as freebooterz. It wasn't supper killy, but it also did not die...which was a big deal towards the end of the game. I think going forward there is no reason not to give it "Tough as Nails" warlord trait. That seems borderline broken.
Does anyone know what to do with the Beasthead Discipline powers? In a buggy list it seems like I should just give in the MW powers and hope for the best.
you cant give it specific warlord traits. If you give it a warlord trait it will be given a specific one.
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/11/14 21:34:22
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
cody.d. wrote: So, managed to get 2 games using the new speedwaagh. One against a cron list with a varity of stuff but with a heavy focus on destroyers. The other against a chaos knight and belakor list.
Stomped the crons, was stomped by the knights which matches what I was expecting honestly.
What are peeps building? I kinda lean heavily into the warbikers, just because it's so much fun to be able to run them. While a pair of wazbombs punch big holes in anything chunky.
Mate suggested perhaps running two detachments, but after you have a trike with Speedking what other worthwhile buffs are there to hand out to the army?
Detachment 1 evil sun outrider
Warbike w killaklaw and fasts then yoos- adv and charge
2 max units of 9x warbikers
5x warbiker
5x deffkoptas (boomboys specialist +1ap) use crashing thru to destroy knights w 5 mortals on charge
Detachment 2 freebooter
Wartrike(warlord) freebooter banner, speedking- (shut down knights obj sec armigers)
2x boosta blasta (pyromaniacs)
2x scrapjets
3x squig buggies
1x Dakkajet w 2x shootas- benefits from +1 to hit freebooter
1x wazbom w 2x shootas-benefits from +1 to hit freebooter (use wazbom on knights)
Play the objective game vs knights w freebooter banner shutting down armigers and wazbom and deffkoptas doing as much damage to knights as possible… the mass str 6 ap2 Dakka might take out a few armigers or plink a few wounds off a knight, but anti tank is limited.. it’s more about durability w 7 buggies, 23x warbikers, wartrike and boss on bike, and 2 aircraft. Deffkoptas are kinda fragile but they hit hard in this list. Just remember in this list try to have scrapjets or squigbuggies finish off a unit so your wazbom/Dakkajet gets +1 to hit.
After the balance update I think knights, Tyranids, greyknights, drukari and even admech still are all going to be strong codexes.. which is good because we don’t need anymore focus on nerfing orks even though I think the points increase is still coming.
Oh, I forgot about the faster than youz trait. Yeah a full unit of bikers advancing, shooting and charging is rather awesome. Especially if you can manage to get a speedking in range for those extra re-rolls on a bucketload of dice. Though perhaps I'd have 2 small units of koptas to fill out that detachment. Leave more in the freebootaz detachment so you have more chance of giving those fliers that wonderful accuracy boost.
I don't think I had any issues killing anything but the demon prince himself, the negative modifiers he passively puts out makes anything but the fliers struggle to land a solid hit.
On the plus side overall it was a fun game, lots of stupid things happening. I charged in some KBBs with ramming speed to try and finish off a knight, he managed to kill them both in overwatch with a buffed, exploding lightning gun. Used careen to try and knock off the last 3 wounds and got a one. He charged my speedking and died to overwatch in return. One of my flyers tried to careen as well, again, just one mortal short of killing it. Such a silly match.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Geemoney wrote: I ran a kill rig for the first time. I ran it as freebooterz. It wasn't supper killy, but it also did not die...which was a big deal towards the end of the game. I think going forward there is no reason not to give it "Tough as Nails" warlord trait. That seems borderline broken.
Does anyone know what to do with the Beasthead Discipline powers? In a buggy list it seems like I should just give in the MW powers and hope for the best.
Yeah, the beasthead powers are mostly used for mortal wound output. Taking off a few wounds from support characters as well. I suppose Roar of Mork could be a niche power too. Giving -1 LD within 18" could be the tipping point for some units passing or failing morale.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/14 21:44:44
2021/11/14 22:23:29
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Geemoney wrote: I ran a kill rig for the first time. I ran it as freebooterz. It wasn't supper killy, but it also did not die...which was a big deal towards the end of the game. I think going forward there is no reason not to give it "Tough as Nails" warlord trait. That seems borderline broken.
Does anyone know what to do with the Beasthead Discipline powers? In a buggy list it seems like I should just give in the MW powers and hope for the best.
you cant give it specific warlord traits. If you give it a warlord trait it will be given a specific one.
This. The only warlord trait the kill rig can have is beast gob, which is both fairly useless and only affects nearby squighogs, smasha squigs and squigosaurs - not the rig itself.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/11/14 22:35:48
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Grimskul wrote: I have to give SemperMortis a shout out with regards to his Alphork list that he shared earlier. I ran an approximation of his army list and did very well with it, even after going 2nd. I was able to borderline table my CSM opponent by T2 who was running a World Eaters Khorne Berserker list supported by Dreadclaws and a Khorne Daemon detachment. My kommandos forward deployed far enough that even on T1 he was forced to basically just drop pod deploy his berserkers in his own deployment zone and unfortunately he rolled terribly even with rerolls and +1 to charge, meaning he couldn't get the drop on my kommandos. Only his Bloodthirster was able to clear one of my kommando units. My turn 1 I called a WAAAGH! and was able to get pretty much all the units I needed to get into combat and was able to wipe out all his berserker squads and BT, while leaving his Heldrake on one wound remaining. At this point, he was left with only his two CSMHQ's, 2 dreadclaws and a full unit of Bloodcrushers that deep struck and managed to charge a Trukk and explode it and charge again with a strat into my deffkoptas and MA Warboss, but was only able to kill the deffkoptas and left my MA Warboss with 3 wounds remaining (what a tanky boy!). At that point I had full board control and he knew I was going to countercharge him so he conceded. Definitely a fun alternative to Traffic Jam: The Army List.
Appreciate it Grim and I am glad you enjoyed the Alphork strike Shenanigans It's still undefeated for me and I am going to a larger tournament next week so hopefully the trend continues
Played against a Buggy spam list this weekend and my opponent was absolutely floored at how quickly his models evaporated in the face of the alphork strike. Very memorable moment, I managed to get my Koptas into his face turn 1, launched a rokkit barrage which popped 2 buggies in a squad and then they bum rushed a trio of scrapjetz after he had wasted his overwatch shooting a unit of trukkboyz to basically no effect. 36 Attacks hitting on 3s with exploding 5s (Goff Strat and buffed with Warpath) had me end with 44 hits, 26 wounds and popped 2 of them. He just sat there stunned at the fact that Deffkoptas get 12 attacks EACH in CC during a WAAAGH! and with warpath. My Kommandos came in and smoke checked another pair of Buggy units and gutted one of them entirely with the bomb squig and Tankbusta strat 1 CP to do 2D3 mortals is worth it! Turn 2 started up and he was basically done, all he had left was 3 rukkatrukkz, his pair of planes and his warboss. He attempted to kill the koptas but failed to do more than killing 1, his Dakkajetz each tried taking out a kommando unit but even with 42 shots they failed to kill a unit thanks to not proc'ing Freeboota in time and I had -1 to hit thanks to some cover so in the end he managed to plink 2-3 kommandos each. At that point he conceded defeat to my Alphork strike list and told me that he may consider taking that to the next GT he goes to
You cant cast warpath on Deffkoptas. They can only be cast on characters or cores.
You essentially over buffed your deffkoptas by accident. Its an easy over sight, like the "Da jump" changes, but.. yea kind of a big thing here as its the difference between 3 hit rolls per model. Ive learned recently that if it sounds too good, theres a decent chance ive misread the rules.
Or an FAQ will arrive.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/15 00:40:16
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/11/15 00:50:16
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Yeah, I think the only way to get extra attacks on the koptas is either speedmob or the foot waagh. Which sadly are mutually exclusive. Cause 5 base attacks on koptas would be a funny thing to dump on the enemy.
2021/11/15 01:19:01
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
sure. you can get it from a normal waaagh, a great waaagh from ghaz, and i believe... maybe the army of renown? I cant fully remember the last one, but one definitely cant cast warpath on them.
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/11/15 01:51:41
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Semper, are you upgrading your triple patrol list with the new bloodaxe Strats/clan in that tournament? There seemed to be some decent stuff in the bloodaxe codex for it.
I mean without the speedwaagh guy you defeated having enough aircraft to block your assault freebooter buggies have a hard time when they are locked in combat. I mean he should have still used 2 to a pretty good effect of making g your charges longer and harder but it’s no longer easy to block off all paths to assault.
I honestly think orks have 3 decent competitive lists…
Freebooter speedwaagh alpha strike-now with other buggies- (this list was taken down a bit)
Army of renown bike/buggy spam- (looks strongest but has its own issues with missions)
And the triple patrol rush assault- (fun and strong but might have issues with certain lists, knight freeblade lists, greyknights, and other strong assault focus lists.. drukari?
2021/11/15 03:28:26
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
gungo wrote: Semper, are you upgrading your triple patrol list with the new bloodaxe Strats/clan in that tournament? There seemed to be some decent stuff in the bloodaxe codex for it.
I mean without the speedwaagh guy you defeated having enough aircraft to block your assault freebooter buggies have a hard time when they are locked in combat. I mean he should have still used 2 to a pretty good effect of making g your charges longer and harder but it’s no longer easy to block off all paths to assault.
I honestly think orks have 3 decent competitive lists…
Freebooter speedwaagh alpha strike-now with other buggies- (this list was taken down a bit)
Army of renown bike/buggy spam- (looks strongest but has its own issues with missions)
And the triple patrol rush assault- (fun and strong but might have issues with certain lists, knight freeblade lists, greyknights, and other strong assault focus lists.. drukari?
Yeah, I think about sums up the majority of our competitive archetypes atm. Not bad at all, all things considered. Do hope they make some other units more viable within those archetypes or something towards our Walker units though. Stuff like lootas, tankbustas, flash gitz and Dred Mob really fall behind compared to some of our other stuff in the army.
2021/11/15 06:44:57
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Lootas have already been in a list placing second at a GT
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/11/15 07:18:37
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
gungo wrote: Semper, are you upgrading your triple patrol list with the new bloodaxe Strats/clan in that tournament? There seemed to be some decent stuff in the bloodaxe codex for it.
I mean without the speedwaagh guy you defeated having enough aircraft to block your assault freebooter buggies have a hard time when they are locked in combat. I mean he should have still used 2 to a pretty good effect of making g your charges longer and harder but it’s no longer easy to block off all paths to assault.
I honestly think orks have 3 decent competitive lists…
Freebooter speedwaagh alpha strike-now with other buggies- (this list was taken down a bit)
Army of renown bike/buggy spam- (looks strongest but has its own issues with missions)
And the triple patrol rush assault- (fun and strong but might have issues with certain lists, knight freeblade lists, greyknights, and other strong assault focus lists.. drukari?
Death guard and battle nuns, if played right, should also crush that triple patrol alphork rush list with ease.
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
2021/11/15 07:49:07
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
IMODG solely depends on how long he can prevent them from moving midfield. Mortarion would probably be a disaster, but luckily he tends to not appear in top tier lists.
However, Semper doesn't seem to meet any serious DG opponents, so we don't really know for sure.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/11/15 08:49:59
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Tiberius501 wrote: Thanks for the replies guys, I appreciate it. I like the look of your list, DoktaRoksta so I might give that a shot when I can pick up some squighogs.
You’re welcome, I like the squigs mainly because they are fast and give MW from the smasha. Any fast attack would be good though, bikes or coptas will work.
It’s more about balancing fast attack, melee and AT to allow you to deal with multiple threat types.
Automatically Appended Next Post: My strategy is to call the waaagh early and charge the squigs at the opponents most threatening shooting. Move the boyz and warboss towards objectives and then teleport the dread in turn 2 to cause mayhem
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/15 08:52:11
2021/11/15 11:43:10
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Im still not fully sold on lootas though even in a blood axe detatchment. Because usually, wouldnt you have lootas in a vehicle? So you cant use stratagems on them.
You would have to jump out, which will probably get you killed in the next round
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/11/15 12:13:57
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I also was remembering it wrong, he won that tournament.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/11/15 12:35:06
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Beardedragon wrote: Im still not fully sold on lootas though even in a blood axe detatchment. Because usually, wouldnt you have lootas in a vehicle? So you cant use stratagems on them.
You would have to jump out, which will probably get you killed in the next round
The extra protection that a trukk grants combined to the higher chances to be in dakka range to get max shots given by the trukk's movement are superior bonuses than being able to throw stratagems on the unit.
2021/11/15 12:39:45
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Beardedragon wrote: Im still not fully sold on lootas though even in a blood axe detatchment. Because usually, wouldnt you have lootas in a vehicle? So you cant use stratagems on them.
You would have to jump out, which will probably get you killed in the next round
The extra protection that a trukk grants combined to the higher chances to be in dakka range to get max shots given by the trukk's movement are superior bonuses than being able to throw stratagems on the unit.
sure but that would mean lootas benefit from freebootas or bad moon more than they benefit from blood axes. Because that stratagem is what makes them interesting but you lose them the next round because they arent protected.
I can see a semi use maybe for freebootas lootas driving around hitting on 4s, but im unsure how im meant to play the lootas if they cant be in vehicles to get the full reroll against vehicles.
Edit: well i guess i can see lootas in a blood axes detatchment but one has to be a bit clever about it
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/11/15 12:46:43
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/11/15 13:40:55
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Jidmah wrote: Lootas have already been in a list placing second at a GT
Huh, must have missed that one! Fair point and I'm pleasantly surprised. I do feel Lootas could go down a smidge at the very least though points wise, maybe 2 points? Definitely not at the top of the list that needs points revision though.
2021/11/15 14:07:38
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
IMO lootas are just what shoota boyz should be. They definitely could use a point drop though.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/15 14:09:51
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/11/15 14:17:13
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Jidmah wrote: IMO lootas are just what shoota boyz should be. They definitely could use a point drop though.
Ain't that the truth? Shoota Boyz are in a really rough spot right now, mass S4 AP0 shooting with no gimmicks generally ain't that great this edition.
Shoota Boyz either need a points drop, or the base Shoota needs to really chuck out a boatload of shots to justify the cost.
I would even consider Shoota Boyz as vaguely niche viable if they got the old DDD rule. I'd consider the same for lootaz as well. If it makes sense for any unit to have a rule for vomiting out loads of bullets it's shootas and lootas.
It's still undefeated for me and I am going to a larger tournament next week so hopefully the trend continues 
