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2022/12/30 21:02:39
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I’ve been trying Orks on and off all of 9th and seem to have poor results. I feel like my units are made of wet paper and hit like a feather. I don’t feel like I can ever make a meaningful dent in my opponents armies and I end up being tables relatively quickly.
Can you all provide some tips/tricks for alleviating these frustrations? I love ork models and lore and kitbashing but I hate being annihilated
2022/12/30 22:56:02
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I’ve been trying Orks on and off all of 9th and seem to have poor results. I feel like my units are made of wet paper and hit like a feather. I don’t feel like I can ever make a meaningful dent in my opponents armies and I end up being tables relatively quickly.
Can you all provide some tips/tricks for alleviating these frustrations? I love ork models and lore and kitbashing but I hate being annihilated
It kinda depends on what you have been using vs what you are fighting. If you have been going against marines and other AoC armies, then you are in luck. Armor of contempt is going away soon so now we might be able to kill them in combat. Many people tend to think that orks just run forward, charge, then kill whatever... sadly this isn't very true. You have to make sure your are lining up favorable charges. You have to leave units back for counter charges.
Can you give us an example of the armies you are bringing? What kulture and so on?
2022/12/31 08:39:37
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I’ve been trying Orks on and off all of 9th and seem to have poor results. I feel like my units are made of wet paper and hit like a feather. I don’t feel like I can ever make a meaningful dent in my opponents armies and I end up being tables relatively quickly.
Can you all provide some tips/tricks for alleviating these frustrations? I love ork models and lore and kitbashing but I hate being annihilated
I've found the main thing with Orks is that maneuvering is key. As Domandi said, it's not always about rushing forward and charging, unless you can do it relatively unscathed and if its pertinent to the mission.
Sometimes you rush in, sometimes you hold back and hide, then pounce turn two or three. I've had some games where I've not made a decent push forward until quite late relatively speaking.
Orks have a codex that currently leads towards big alpha strikes in the current climate, looking to prevent your opponent from scoring (either by killing them, tying them up in melee, or physically blocking them and limiting their lines of fire/movement), while your slower units score points early and let things snowball.
That alpha strike can be mostly melee focused with Squig units, Snaggas and Kommandos, or through massive shooting from buggies, jets, etc.
Post your list and let us know what your regular opponents are and we'll help out where we can.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/12/31 08:41:12
2022/12/31 21:08:24
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Had semi casual 1500pt game against my friends guard and tried out the triple killtank. Also brought 2 kannonwagons cause I figured might as well try them too. I went with blood axe for the light cover. He brought a plasma russ, vanquisher russ, tank commander, stormlord, command squad, lord solar, and kaskrin all inside the stormlord.
First impression is holy kaskrin are insane for a 100pt unit now. You have to dump a decent amount of cp into them plus Solar's buffs, but they no joke were nearly one shotting a full health killtank every turn due to their mw's and bucket of ap3 wounds I would have to take. My friend said commanders can issue orders and tag units with their auras inside transports now which I didn't really see anywhere in the dex but I also didn't look too hard so idk if any of you guys know anything about that.
Overall impressions were the killtanks and kannonwagons actually did pretty good and I actually had a chance to win had I not left his stormlord and vanquisher on 1 wound remaining bottom of 2. Between command orders, solar buffs, and stratagems, degrading doesn't really matter that much to guard so it's better to just confirm the kill and not be greedy. I will say I had basically the best possible scenario by getting first turn and having dense terrain I could hide some of my killtanks in plus the light cover from blood axe's, and still lost. If guard do become the meta I think infantry spam will likely be orks best or possibly only option sadly.
It felt weird that I was more afraid of his infantry than his tanks. His kaskrin did more damage than the rest of his army combined and orks don't really have a way to quickly take down a 28W T9 stormlord and even without the transport they can just infiltrate the kaskrin and use them as cheap throw away missile units. The command squad is also absolutely insane. T5 because of the bullgryn bodyguards which have like 7 wounds, are decently punchy, have a 5+ fnp from the medic and if you manage to kill them both they can resurrect both of them with FULL WOUNDS for 1 cp... I think our best option is gonna be to completely ignore it and focus the rest of the army.
Anyways moral of the story is kaskrin are nuts and need to be target number 1 and/or stay out of their double tap range.
Friendship is like peeing on yourself: everyone can see it, but only you get the warm feeling that it brings.
2023/01/01 02:38:30
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
tag units with their auras inside transports now which I didn't really see anywhere in the dex
yah thats going to be a show me situation because thats a pretty big departure. units in transports cant be the target of anything nor do their auras exist unless specifically stated otherwise.
they CAN disembark during the movement phase then immediately give an order as if it were the command phase, but not seeing anything about their auras working while in a vehicle with transport capacity.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/01 02:38:47
2023/01/02 00:04:55
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
tag units with their auras inside transports now which I didn't really see anywhere in the dex
yah thats going to be a show me situation because thats a pretty big departure. units in transports cant be the target of anything nor do their auras exist unless specifically stated otherwise.
they CAN disembark during the movement phase then immediately give an order as if it were the command phase, but not seeing anything about their auras working while in a vehicle with transport capacity.
Sounds like a mistake (or cheating) since the only transport that can do anything remotely like that is the chimera because it has the mobile command tank special rule. And even that only allows an officer to issue orders from inside the vehicle.
2023/01/04 19:54:54
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Deffkoptas were ok with speed waagh but I've found em wanting of later. In a post Armor of contempt world they could be ok again.
Dump the 4*big shootas on the battlewagon and upgrade the normal boys to beast snaggas. From experience they're way better. If you made the warbike squad 2*3 or even dropped it down to 5 models you could. Make the second boys squad beast snaggas and make the meganobz truckboyz.
Also the boss on squigasaur only buffs beast snaggas (+1 to hit against non vehicles).
Do you have two specialist mobz? Dunno if we'll be able in the new detachment.
- Gorka and Morkanaut down for 35p to 330/315p
- Killakans down from 35p to 30p + sale on rokkit from 15p to 10p
- sales on Boyz heavy weapons - kombiweapons and rokkits down to 5p, same with the nobz
- Painboy 70->60p
- Flashgitz 25->20p
- both squighogs and kustom stompa also little bit down
- the price for rokkits and killsaws etc is now different in every unit. From 5 to 15p….
This message was edited 8 times. Last update was at 2023/01/05 15:20:54
Also, some gear shenanigans:
- big choppa and stabbas are free for nobz
- git finda free and ammo runt free for flash gits
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2023/01/05 14:46:11
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
1. Speedmob is dead. Change in detachements limits the number of FA slots to 6 strict. Without completely new wording of AOR list build, it can hardly works. I expect explicit stop for them.
Which is pitty, because I paint last two buggies right now to have complete speedmob. Damn….
2. I see a wide push for troops. Extra be benefits if completing the missions with troops, a lot of troop slots etc.
3. Trukkboyz and other Spec Mobs nerfed. Because just one per detachement and in new AoO we can have one or 2 detachements only..
4. In combination with the secondaries, melee oriented hord of orks is the way to go.
Bloody hell, I love my speedmob! It was the best army I ever had. Damn! 11000p of orks and nothing to play again…
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2023/01/05 14:59:02
- Gorka and Morkanaut down for 35p to 330/315p - Killakans down from 35p to 30p + sale on rokkit from 15p to 5p - sales on Boyz heavy weapons - kombiweapons and rokkits down to 5p, same with the nobz - Painboy 70->60p - Flashgitz 25->20p - both squighogs and kustom stompa also little bit down
- the price for rokkits and killsaws etc is now different in every unit. From 5 to 15p….
The big choppa appears to be free for nobz?
as Jidmah said. but i had written this before i had even read the remaining posts.
My question is then; Where do we stand on Nobz? Are nobz with big choppas for 17 points worth it? Are Nobz at 22 points with powerklaws worth it? What about 27 points for double killsaws?
Rokkits for killa kanz says +10 points, not +5. Unless you meant that you save +5 from the discount on the models, and +5 for the rokkit giving a total of 10 in reduction from the original price if you wanted a rokkit killa kan, versus getting one now?
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2023/01/05 15:10:46
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2023/01/05 15:11:54
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
How was it made up to the factions that lost AoC? I only play orks. just so that im aware of it. Unless there was nothing to make up for it and GW just said: Well, F you AoC factions.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/05 15:23:04
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2023/01/05 15:25:58
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Boyz: Kombi Weapons -5pts
Power Stabba - Free (Lose 1 attack for -1AP...Who gives a feth)
Rokkit Launcha -5pts
Big Shoota - Free (who gives a feth)
Nobz: Killsaw -5pts
PK -3pts (Had totally forgotten they were previously only 8pts on nobz now)
Kombi Weapons -5pts
Big Choppa - Free (minor upgrade for nobz...still not good)
Power Stabba - Free
Painboy: -10pts (Now 60pts base...still not worth it)
FlashGitz: -5pts each (Ammo-runt and Gitfinda are still 5pt upgrades.)
KillaKanz: -5pts Each
Grotzooka and Big shoota still remain free (AKA Trash)
Skorcha stays at 5pts
Rokkit Launcha -5pts
You can now field a unit of Rokkit KillaKanz for 40pts each. At T5, 5wounds and a 3+ Save this isn't terrible, but remember they still have LD6 and are a grot unit.
Gorkanaut: -35pts (now its only 50pts over priced)
Morkanaut: -35pts (Now its only 50pts over priced)
Forge World: Squiggoth -20pts
Gargantuan Squiggoth -40pts
Kustom Stompa -25pts (No seriously...they thought this was enough)
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/01/05 15:33:55
Beardedragon wrote: How was it made up to the factions that lost AoC? I only play orks. just so that im aware of it. Unless there was nothing to make up for it and GW just said: Well, F you AoC factions.
For marines specifically, a bunch of unit upgrades (i.e. thunder hammers) are now basically for free and there's been price cuts on borderline all the units across the board. So they get to bring more bodies since they're less resilient now with better weapons.
2023/01/05 15:29:01
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Kustom Stompa -25pts (No seriously...they thought this was enough)
This is gold. Just another 250p sale and could be ok
On the other side, if we start counter-meta thinking, in new troops meta, such stompa could be real pain to kill
Not really since SM were just given FREE everything. All upgrades for SM Troops are free. In fact, in most cases, upgrades are now free for Marines with only a few exceptions.
Well. on another note. Squiggoth is down in points, flash gitz are down in points. While its not competitive, and with armor of contempt gone, i will attempt to run around with my newly acquired squiggoth with flash gitz in it.
Beardedragon wrote: How was it made up to the factions that lost AoC? I only play orks. just so that im aware of it. Unless there was nothing to make up for it and GW just said: Well, F you AoC factions.
For marines specifically, a bunch of unit upgrades (i.e. thunder hammers) are now basically for free and there's been price cuts on borderline all the units across the board. So they get to bring more bodies since they're less resilient now with better weapons.
thank you.
How that will affect us i dont know yet.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/05 16:27:16
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2023/01/05 16:28:44
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
At 85pts and with free BC? I have to disagree, nobz are way better now then boys. I think they compete with snagga boys since they can bring 3 claws for the same price. Still subjective, i play they as MSU as troops and they have a large flexibility and good resilience, also 5 is easier to hide then 10.
We were all grumbling about moral in start of the codex, haven't rolled moral ever since i went MSU nobz
I think wazbom is going to get better with automatic reserves. We are also forgetting AoC is going away so that's a big buff.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/01/05 16:31:43
2023/01/05 17:02:29
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
The fact they removed the supreme detatchment also means i cant run Ghaz in a supreme detatchment and a freebootas next to him.
I used to have a fun army like that with buggies, ghaz and some grots. Sure i CAN still do it, but now ghaz will have to be in the freebootas detatchment and not get his exploding 6s. Nor can i even use the exploding 5s stratagem because he doesnt get his own klan this way.
Its not a big loss but i dont really see any vehicle play for orks this time around. Not next to rigs and transports that is.
But buggies and planes? Not sure how you should use that.
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2023/01/05 17:05:36
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Beardedragon wrote: Well. on another note. Squiggoth is down in points, flash gitz are down in points. While its not competitive, and with armor of contempt gone, i will attempt to run around with my newly acquired squiggoth with flash gitz in it.
Beardedragon wrote: How was it made up to the factions that lost AoC? I only play orks. just so that im aware of it. Unless there was nothing to make up for it and GW just said: Well, F you AoC factions.
For marines specifically, a bunch of unit upgrades (i.e. thunder hammers) are now basically for free and there's been price cuts on borderline all the units across the board. So they get to bring more bodies since they're less resilient now with better weapons.
thank you.
How that will affect us i dont know yet.
To put it bluntly its going to be bad, but its now going to completely depend on who goes first. Losing AoC means Marines are squishier to our Orkz. 10 Boyz just went from doing 3.33dmg to Marines in a turn back up to 5dmg per turn in CC. But on the other hand those Marines are now ridiculously cheap in comparison. A Dev squad armed with Lascannons just dropped 40pts AND the Sgt will now be equipped with up to 20pts of upgrades for free. So if the Marines go first there is a decent chance that they just utterly destroy a huge swath of your army. If you can get stuck in quick enough though there is a chance you can tie up, kill or reduce the dmg they do to you. Overall I think Marines just got significantly better while we got tiny buffs on units that were really terrible. Realistically we were talking about if Nobz would be good if they were given FREE PKs, and the consensus was that they would have a role but wouldn't be spammed. With these changes I can maybe see a unit of Trukk Nobz with free Big choppas being used instead of trukkboyz but that is about it.
Nobz are not troops (important in AoO) and not obsec and low body count for holding objectives.
Nobz have a very much SM profile so there is too many guns ready to kill them.
With single detachement, just one truknobz can be used (or 2 with the patrol).
I can imagine a list with a single 10 truknobz blob in the trukk for long range charge in T1/2. That can do a damage and stop one side of the front for a turn. But they die in a single turn. Is it good investment for about 250p incl trukk?
Tomsug wrote: Nobz are not troops (important in AoO) and not obsec and low body count for holding objectives.
Nobz have a very much SM profile so there is too many guns ready to kill them.
With single detachement, just one truknobz can be used (or 2 with the patrol).
we can't take the patrol - the patrol must be one of the allied ones listed in the book and orks get none. yes you get 1 specialist mob period now. choose wisely.
2023/01/05 19:00:10
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
certainly seems like their pushing us back into infantry spam, except we still get boned by moral. So then we'll have to spam like 30 msu. Sounds super fun...
Also tf is that harlies nerf? they didn't even try to fine tune them they're just like "aaannnnnd your the worst army in the game now." I feel like every time I get the smallest amount of confidence in the rules team they put out patches like this.
Oh well, guess I'm just gonna be rocking 3 killtanks and 2 wazbomms as my army until 10th ed
Friendship is like peeing on yourself: everyone can see it, but only you get the warm feeling that it brings.
2023/01/05 19:23:37
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
flaming tadpole wrote: certainly seems like their pushing us back into infantry spam, except we still get boned by moral. So then we'll have to spam like 30 msu. Sounds super fun...
Also tf is that harlies nerf? they didn't even try to fine tune them they're just like "aaannnnnd your the worst army in the game now." I feel like every time I get the smallest amount of confidence in the rules team they put out patches like this.
Oh well, guess I'm just gonna be rocking 3 killtanks and 2 wazbomms as my army until 10th ed
Sounds fun. what would you fill the remaining slots with?
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2023/01/05 19:31:05
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
AoC going away is a massive buff considering almost ALL of our major damage threats are AP1/2.
I legit stopped playing Badmoonz because AoC was pissing me off. Oh i situationally get slightly better AP that...youre entire army flatout ignores ok cool yeah thats fair...
I dont know what all the marine gear previous costs were but generally in the past even sweeping changes to an army's costs rarely enabled a drastic amount of bodies to be included. Do i expect more marines now? Yeah. Do i feel like theyre going to be running something silly like 30% more bodies? Hell no.
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys
2023/01/05 20:17:38
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
flaming tadpole wrote: certainly seems like their pushing us back into infantry spam, except we still get boned by moral. So then we'll have to spam like 30 msu. Sounds super fun...
Also tf is that harlies nerf? they didn't even try to fine tune them they're just like "aaannnnnd your the worst army in the game now." I feel like every time I get the smallest amount of confidence in the rules team they put out patches like this.
Oh well, guess I'm just gonna be rocking 3 killtanks and 2 wazbomms as my army until 10th ed
Sounds fun. what would you fill the remaining slots with?
Probably just some grots, 1-2 warboss and kff mek will be all I can afford haha. I may have missed it but do we know if orks will have access to patrol detachments so we can take ghaz in a separate one? If so I might just make a hero hammer list with ghaz, 2 squig bosses and zagstruck. Could be fun.
Friendship is like peeing on yourself: everyone can see it, but only you get the warm feeling that it brings.
kaskrin are insane for a 100pt unit now. You have to dump a decent amount of 
10k p fullpaint orks finally ready to krump!!! 
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang. 
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys