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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Well they don't sell actual BB HWTs, Sentinels, Russes or Chimeras kits, so...

Sadly true, the GSC upgrade sprue was a surprisingly elegant solution to that problem. Whilst not as extensive as the new Templar one it really helped improve the older guard infantry. So do we think the Brood Brother infantry squad will go the way of the dodo and not get an updated box either?

To show my pain, see that amount of Guard units in my army that were in the last GSC codex , all of them bar The Baneblade:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Well they don't sell actual BB HWTs, Sentinels, Russes or Chimeras kits, so...

The do sell HWTs, you get one in every Brood Brother Infantry Squad box, and the Brood Brother Infantry Squad was also removed from the codex.


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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oooh….GSC Ogryns.

Only because Ogryns are ace!

Nope, no more. Only <Regiment> units now. So no Scions either, cause they're both Militarum Tempestus and <Tempestus Regiment>.

Jarms48 wrote:
The do sell HWTs, you get one in every Brood Brother Infantry Squad box, and the Brood Brother Infantry Squad was also removed.

Sorry, I was thinking more of the 3 HW squads, not the gun in the squad. My bad.

If true exchanging:

1 Troop
1 Fast Attack
2 Heavy Support
1 Transport
1 Fortification

Datasheet in exchange for a solitary elite choice, and expecting me to pay for another whole (probably soon to be updated?) codex to be able to field my army is shocking.

Fragdrill has been oop for some time now, as reflected in the ebay pricing.

Well, prophesy fulfilled I guess: Without warning and without reason.

Like Germany, the UK store has the Fragdrill, female Magus and the Nexos showing as "No longer available online".

Given how GW's store operates, however, that could mean they're actually gone, or it could just mean a 2022 "9th ed style" new set of packaging for them.

We'll have to wait and see which is the case.

I'm predicting oop because I was looking for it a few weeks ago and it appears unavailable from my usual sellers (un-searchable for one of them) and then there's the ever ambiguous GW "Unavailable", but yeah could be another case of mixed messaging. Maybe some repackaging for the upcoming GSC releases? I hope so.

Well, the Big'ed Bossbunka completely vanished from the website - not even searchable - for a while.

I asked GW about it and they said it was a mistake.

It would be a weird move to dump the fragdrill but yeah as we all know it's well documented that they do this with terrain. The Sector Imperialis terrain is still good, but those big statues still haven't resurfaced from oop purgatory. Fingers crossed the Fragdrill is just temp unavailable.

Some terrain kits have been made in China before, so it could be a supply issue. Possible that the kit comes back into stock but not until a while after the codex release.

I'm surprised they just never made faction terrain cost 0 points like it is in AoS. Seemed a good way to get most people to buy a kit they otherwise wouldn't.

 Arbitrator wrote:
I'm surprised they just never made faction terrain cost 0 points like it is in AoS. Seemed a good way to get most people to buy a kit they otherwise wouldn't.

There's a much wider variety in 40k terrain than AOS. Most of the latter were produced specifically for that rule and are a similar scale, while 40k has a history of larger terrain pieces specifically intended for larger Apocalypse or Planetstrike games. It would be a bit arbitrary which terrain pieces could be free without introducing auto-include options.

For 40K it might make more sense if they just scrapped the fortification detachment altogether and just assigned a CP cost to each terrain piece instead. So for example a Mekboy Workshop is 1CP while a Fortress of Redemption could be 4CP.

This is all dependent on them fixing the 9E fortification deployment rules too of course.

 Arbitrator wrote:
I'm surprised they just never made faction terrain cost 0 points like it is in AoS. Seemed a good way to get most people to buy a kit they otherwise wouldn't.

I think originally they wanted to make something like AoS faction terrain in 40k since the first three armies got terrain (Space Marine bunker, Necron starsteles and Death Guard chimney) but discarded that idea pretty soon in development which is why no army after that got something. For the first half of AoS 2nd edition nearly every army got endless spells and a terrain piece but in the later half that also stopped so maybe they just saw that it wasn't worth it and only released what was already designed for SM/Necrons/DG.

Article about the Primus today.


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 Matrindur wrote:

 Arbitrator wrote:
I'm surprised they just never made faction terrain cost 0 points like it is in AoS. Seemed a good way to get most people to buy a kit they otherwise wouldn't.

I think originally they wanted to make something like AoS faction terrain in 40k since the first three armies got terrain (Space Marine bunker, Necron starsteles and Death Guard chimney) but discarded that idea pretty soon in development which is why no army after that got something. For the first half of AoS 2nd edition nearly every army got endless spells and a terrain piece but in the later half that also stopped so maybe they just saw that it wasn't worth it and only released what was already designed for SM/Necrons/DG.

Orks got a terrain piece. They've technically got two at this point between the Gargant head bunker and the Mek Workshop.
Sisters got a terrain piece too.

There isn't really a rhyme or reason behind this stuff.

 Kanluwen wrote:



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 Matrindur wrote:

 Arbitrator wrote:
I'm surprised they just never made faction terrain cost 0 points like it is in AoS. Seemed a good way to get most people to buy a kit they otherwise wouldn't.

I think originally they wanted to make something like AoS faction terrain in 40k since the first three armies got terrain (Space Marine bunker, Necron starsteles and Death Guard chimney) but discarded that idea pretty soon in development which is why no army after that got something. For the first half of AoS 2nd edition nearly every army got endless spells and a terrain piece but in the later half that also stopped so maybe they just saw that it wasn't worth it and only released what was already designed for SM/Necrons/DG.

Orks got a terrain piece. They've technically got two at this point between the Gargant head bunker and the Mek Workshop.
Sisters got a terrain piece too.

There isn't really a rhyme or reason behind this stuff.

Right forgot about the ork bunker but the sisters one and the mek workshop was pre 9th so I didn't count it here. Then you would also have to count the GSC Drill, Webway Portal, CSM Noctilith Crown, Tau Tidewall and that IK Forgeshrine.

 Matrindur wrote:

Right forgot about the ork bunker but the sisters one and the mek workshop was pre 9th so I didn't count it here. Then you would also have to count the GSC Drill, Webway Portal, CSM Noctilith Crown, Tau Tidewall and that IK Forgeshrine.

Sisters one was pre-9th, but it's still in their 9E codex.

All of the ones you named are awaiting releases of their codices. We'll have to see what's happening. Worth mentioning though that the IK Forgeshrine was tagged under the AdMech range up until the most recent AdMech book removed all Knights from their roster.

I wouldn't be shocked if the GSC drill was removed from the book to become a generic scenery piece down the line. They still haven't released the STC prefab stuff that the Kelermorph and Techpriest Manipulus both came with.

The Fronteris was re-released as a killzone.

JWBS wrote:
The Fronteris was re-released as a killzone.

It was a Killzone to begin with. It's no longer available again, if it was in fact re-released.

The problem, bluntly, is that it had a weird release. It came out alongside of the Manipulus and Kelermorph Kill-Teams...and then when those sold out they got marked as "temporarily out of stock", until they just poof'd off the webpage.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/01/06/6-stratagems-from-the-new-adeptus-custodes-codex-to-help-you-tear-the-enemy-to-pieces

Yes it was re-released w/o the miniatures and is again no longer available now. Suffered from the same availability problems as a lot of GW terrain, only more so.

You're conflating two different things.

Real-quick:
There was the single frame of ruins, crate, and escape hatch that came with each of the Kill-Teams.

The Killzone was the big buildings. That included no models.

The killzone has the ruins also, it's only missing the hatch and that little barricade thing. The more substantial bits (ruined wall sections) are near pretty much identical to the killzone ruin sections. Different sprue though.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Matrindur wrote:

Right forgot about the ork bunker but the sisters one and the mek workshop was pre 9th so I didn't count it here. Then you would also have to count the GSC Drill, Webway Portal, CSM Noctilith Crown, Tau Tidewall and that IK Forgeshrine.

Sisters one was pre-9th, but it's still in their 9E codex.

All of the ones you named are awaiting releases of their codices. We'll have to see what's happening. Worth mentioning though that the IK Forgeshrine was tagged under the AdMech range up until the most recent AdMech book removed all Knights from their roster.

I wouldn't be shocked if the GSC drill was removed from the book to become a generic scenery piece down the line. They still haven't released the STC prefab stuff that the Kelermorph and Techpriest Manipulus both came with.

Well the Drill, Forgeshrine and Sisters one may be in their codex but they also are all part of actual terrain lines with Sector Mechanicus and Sector Imperialis, thats why I didn't count them. The Mek Workshop also kind of falls in there as its part of the terrain line that first showed up in Speed Freaks and got some more in Kill Team Octarius. The Bossbunka does have similar optics but is still feels different to me since it has weapons so you can use it as an actual unit not just a terrain piece with slapped on rules.
The Webway portal and the Tau Tidewall are actual faction terrain but are pretty old so they wouldn't be part of a faction terrain plan like the one in AoS GW had in the last years , so the only one that could actually have been part of something like that (Except the four 9th edition ones) would be the Noctilith Crown.

There's at least three of them in this recent photo, but that could be an old photo I suppose:


Also I don't understand why being a meticulous planner would make it so your troops wound things more easily.

Of course now I'm imagining a Primus yelling "Their armour is weak at the neck and under the arms!" to his men as a horde of Orks comes towards them.

Also yay... transhuman...

 Matrindur wrote:

Well the Drill, Forgeshrine and Sisters one may be in their codex but they also are all part of actual terrain lines with Sector Mechanicus and Sector Imperialis, thats why I didn't count them.

Honestly? It feels like you're just cherrypicking what you want.

The Mek Workshop also kind of falls in there as its part of the terrain line that first showed up in Speed Freaks and got some more in Kill Team Octarius. The Bossbunka does have similar optics but is still feels different to me since it has weapons so you can use it as an actual unit not just a terrain piece with slapped on rules.

The Mek Workshop was closer to what most people were expecting for faction terrain to be in the first place. Something small and relatively portable for players but not necessarily a full on "fortification" piece.

The Bossbunka is the fortification piece that one would have expected back in the days of Apocalypse, Planetstrike, or Stronghold Assault. It's big. It has guns(like the Bastion, Firestorm Redoubt, and Gunrig) and bolsters commanders hunkered down inside.

The Webway portal and the Tau Tidewall are actual faction terrain but are pretty old so they wouldn't be part of a faction terrain plan like the one in AoS GW had in the last years , so the only one that could actually have been part of something like that (Except the four 9th edition ones) would be the Noctilith Crown.

The Webway Gate is from 8th edition. It was part of the Codex drop for Craftworlds.
The Tau Tidewall came out with the Damocles Gulf Crusade books(Kau'yon and Mont'ka) in 7E. It debuted as part of the "updated" codex from the outset.

To circle back to my comment about cherrypicking?
C: Sisters of Battle dropped in 8th, with the scenery as part of it.
It then dropped again in 9th, also with the scenery as part of it.

If Tau don't have their Tidewall stuff or if CSM don't have their Noctilith Crown? I'll believe the hype that it's a dead concept for 40k. As it stands, the Fragdrill was a terrain piece that never really stood out as anything but a cool piece for modelers. For all we know it's being pulled back to get redesigned to come with a truck variant to tow it, since the most common thing one would see it being used for was with a Deathstrike or a Goliath towing it.

Wow, so the primus seems like junk lol. The ability procs in the command phase, so if I'm ambushing, I can't use it, and if I'm using trucks and transporting, I can't use it...

Meanwhile every other faction with this ability not only has this in aura form which is better, but it's a passive trait that isn't tied to the command phase.


He was originally designed for aiding in ambushes and actually was incredibly valuable, now he is just a dork with a situational aura, oops! Sorry, targeted ability that I can apparently pay points into so one time in the game I can theoretically give it to two units.

Somebody tell me I'm missing something here...

Also that heroic intervention strat is one of the worst intervention strats they have produced. Instead of just giving strat to herioc intervene with a unit near the 3 said models they had to add the additional stipulation that those characters already have to be engaged, except this happens in your opponents turn so unless your playing fast and loose and exposing those 3 characters this is never coming into play lol.

 Red Corsair wrote:
Somebody tell me I'm missing something here...

You're just going to have to plan out how you use it. Y'know, meticulously!

"I get every detail ready, right down to the smallest variables! My troops know that if they stick to my plan, our enemies will fall faster before our might. Unless they're in a vehicle, I don't know how to plan for that. Or waiting in ambush, those sorts of ploys are beyond me, apparently. But hey, my pistol shoots further now, so that's nice!"

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Somebody tell me I'm missing something here...

You're just going to have to plan out how you use it. Y'know, meticulously!

Seriously, it never stops with GW. They have to over cook everything. This isn't a unique ability, it's a tired old one from the start of 8th. So they try to make it seem fresh by overly restricting it and over complicating the timing of it. Good rules design right there lmao

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Matrindur wrote:

Honestly? It feels like you're just cherrypicking what you want.

Honestly? It is kind of cherrypicking. After all all I was doing was subjectively grouping up the different terrain pieces. But in the end what I wanted to say was there are some terrain pieces like the GSC/Sisters/IK/Mekboy ones which, to me at least, feel like terrain pieces that started as general terrain but where repurposed as faction terrain by adding some details so they would fit their factions. The others instead look like they where designed from the ground up to be terrain for their factions.

The Webway Gate is from 8th edition. It was part of the Codex drop for Craftworlds.

Sorry about the Webway Gate, thought it was pre 8th, my mistake here.

If Tau don't have their Tidewall stuff or if CSM don't have their Noctilith Crown? I'll believe the hype that it's a dead concept for 40k. As it stands, the Fragdrill was a terrain piece that never really stood out as anything but a cool piece for modelers. For all we know it's being pulled back to get redesigned to come with a truck variant to tow it, since the most common thing one would see it being used for was with a Deathstrike or a Goliath towing it.

Also I wasn't trying to say faction terrain is dead and we won't be getting anything else ever, just that I would have actually liked every army to get one and that may have been the plan once but doesn't seem to be the case anymore