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Tiberias wrote:
This thread is unnecessary and the poll is ridiculous bait.

Bait for what?

There are many threads that I might consider "unnecessary" in Dakka... But rarely do I post to say so.

If you thing this thread is useless, why waste your time posting in it?

Tiberias wrote:
This thread is unnecessary and the poll is ridiculous bait.

Agreed. I don't think I've met anybody or even seen anybody post about being against painting. It's often more that people can't paint, think they won't do a good job, or simply have other priorities. The thread title seems to posit that there are some people who are philosophically opposed to painting minis. If so, I've yet to see evidence of them.

 Amishprn86 wrote:
I have friends that can not paint, nerve damage, muscle issues, etc.... I have painted armies for them before even. Not everyone has time as well. Its a hobby and not having painted models wont effect other players, so why does it matter if they are painted if someone is unable to or unhappy to do so?

This literally has nothing to do with the poll question.

Being unable to drive because you have some sort of cognitive condition (ie being blind) and insisting to drive even if you are blind are two different issues... A third, different, issue would be being against driving because its bad for climate change, due to frecuent accidents or whatever.

Its so difficult to stay on topic? Since I was curious about an specific issue I open a poll not to hijack other fellow posters threads.

The Black Adder wrote:
Agreed. I don't think I've met anybody or even seen anybody post about being against painting. It's often more that people can't paint, think they won't do a good job, or simply have other priorities. The thread title seems to posit that there are some people who are philosophically opposed to painting minis. If so, I've yet to see evidence of them.

It was in one of the other threads, but someone in response to a modified 10 VP rule where you still get the 10 VP as long as you have painted more since your last game said that they would deliberately make the smallest possible amount of progress on a single unit, put that unit in reserve, and leave it there to be automatically destroyed on turn 4 without ever seeing the table. Why? Pure self-destructive spite at the idea of having painted models.

The Black Adder wrote:

Tiberias wrote:
This thread is unnecessary and the poll is ridiculous bait.

Agreed. I don't think I've met anybody or even seen anybody post about being against painting. It's often more that people can't paint, think they won't do a good job, or simply have other priorities. The thread title seems to posit that there are some people who are philosophically opposed to painting minis. If so, I've yet to see evidence of them.

Well, some people seem indeed very angry due to the fact that painting is a relevant part of the hobby and they are therefore "pressured" someway to paint their armies (just check other recent posts in this forum). Since they express a vehement opossition to this situation, I opened this poll to better understand there reasoning.

What issue were you curious about? Was it something brought up in a different board? Why not ask it there? Have you ever actually heard someone say they are “vehemently against” painting? It just seems like a silly, baiting, non issue to make a poll about. And based on the results so far, most people here agree. I bet if one of your options was, “this is a trolling poll”, it would be winning in a landslide.


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Vatsetis wrote:

The Black Adder wrote:

Tiberias wrote:
This thread is unnecessary and the poll is ridiculous bait.

Agreed. I don't think I've met anybody or even seen anybody post about being against painting. It's often more that people can't paint, think they won't do a good job, or simply have other priorities. The thread title seems to posit that there are some people who are philosophically opposed to painting minis. If so, I've yet to see evidence of them.

Well, some people seem indeed very angry due to the fact that painting is a relevant part of the hobby and they are therefore "pressured" someway to paint their armies (just check other recent posts in this forum). Since they express a vehement opossition to this situation, I opened this poll to better understand there reasoning.

If you want to understand their* reasoning, try posting options that they themselves are giving: don’t like to paint, bad at it, don’t have time, have different priorities, physically unable. Instead your options are for people who paint their toys and dislike unpainted toys.

People who are vehement against painting are people who hate the idea that GW or their gaming community is telling them to do something. Some people just hate being told what to do, even if that thing is good for them. If they will rebel against that, what do you expect from being required to meet an esthetic requirement?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Vatsetis wrote:
-If you fill personally offended by the content or wording of this poll, I apologize and assure you that my intentions are honest.

Option 1 in your poll is that people don't paint because they "dont fully understand the 40K hobby". In option two you suggest that these people are "just Trolling".

So forgive me if I don't believe your statement above.

Well those both of those options could actually be real reason for someone to actively reject painting in a hobby were painting is a core part of the experience.

Trolling could also stand for "I reject painting because I want to win an internet argument" and ofuscation could also stand for "I wont allow anyone to tell me if I should or shouldnt paint my 40K minis"... I simply didnt want to disperse the poll results.

Its very dificult for me to see a sensible reason why anyone will actively oppose painting... Is like actively opposing better security measures in a car (no fancy high tech things "aka propinted NMM" im refering to basic elements like having an extra wheel or safety belts "aka base coat and shades").

Can you understand people who only model, paint and enjoy the fiction, but don’t actually play?

 Gordon Shumway wrote:
Can you understand people who only model, paint and enjoy the fiction, but don’t actually play?

Yes, just as I can understand people that just play but dont actually enjoy the fiction or model/paint.




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 Gordon Shumway wrote:
Can you understand people who only model, paint and enjoy the fiction, but don’t actually play?

A smart question. This situation those indeed happen, but we should ask why?

Did those people actually played the game in the past but dont do currently because they have lost the community, their community has became toxic or they dont like the current rules/meta?

If he has or have never had any interest on the rules is this just because no one has introduce him to that element of the hobby.

If this person has actually never played a 40K game (and therefore dosent really understand that side of the hobby) but nevertheless constantly and publickly complains about how boring 40K games are and how toxic competitive play is I wouldnt really find that perspn POV to be weird.

 Gordon Shumway wrote:
Can you understand people who only model, paint and enjoy the fiction, but don’t actually play?

That's a lot easier to understand. It's just someone who enjoys an art hobby, much like people paint model historical tanks or build model railroads without any game rules attached. What makes a lot less sense is people who invest in a miniatures hobby where the whole point of playing with miniatures instead of cardboard tokens is the aesthetic value of the models but don't bother to make aesthetically appealing game pieces. Why not play a cardboard token game instead and spend $20-50 instead of $2-5000? Why play a game where even most of the people who play it admit that the rules suck and its only redeeming quality is that it allows you to use your cool miniatures?

Vatsetis wrote:


Its very dificult for me to see a sensible reason why anyone will actively oppose painting..

Thats because no one does. They just don't want to or aren't able to do it.

But people just dont do things "because" (they might themselves ignore tbe reasons why, but there is almost always a reason, things dont happend due to pure luck or unhinged will).

If they cannot paint (or any alternative like hiring painters or buying painted minis), for what ever reason... why dont just look for a different tabletop hobby that dosent require painting (like eurogames)... If they like 40K lore but "Cant paint" why not just play videogames or even Necromunda or Killteam which have a much lower mini count and therefore require much less modelling and painting effort that tbe massive 40K?

Vatsetis wrote:
But people just dont do things "because" (they might themselves ignore tbe reasons why, but there is almost always a reason, things dont happend due to pure luck or unhinged will).

If they cannot paint (or any alternative like hiring painters or buying painted minis), for what ever reason... why dont just look for a different tabletop hobby that dosent require painting (like eurogames)... If they like 40K lore but "Cant paint" why not just play videogames or even Necromunda or Killteam which have a much lower mini count and therefore require much less modelling and painting effort that tbe massive 40K?

Maybe because they like this hobby?

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Maybe because they like this hobby?

Why would you like this hobby if you don't value the aesthetics of the miniatures? Without that all you're doing is spending thousands of dollars on a game you could be playing with cardboard tokens instead. Or you could even play a better game, since you're not committed to using the rules that match your miniatures collection.

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Maybe because they like this hobby?

Why would you like this hobby if you don't value the aesthetics of the miniatures?

Bunch of reasons. Some people actually like the game, shocking though that may be. Or the socialisation that comes with it. 40k isn't JUST about aesthetics for a lot of people.

It’s not about being staunchly anti-paint, it’s about not wanting to paint because you don’t enjoy it. The trouble starts when people start throwing out labels like “lazy” or “selfish” against them that the flames start to grow.

 Sim-Life wrote:
40k isn't JUST about aesthetics for a lot of people.

But the reason you play with thousands of dollars worth of models instead of $5 in cardboard tokens is 100% about the aesthetics.


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DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
It’s not about being staunchly anti-paint, it’s about not wanting to paint because you don’t enjoy it. The trouble starts when people start throwing out labels like “lazy” or “selfish” against them that the flames start to grow.

And oddly those words often seem to be introduced by people like you, who turn "I don't play against unpainted miniatures" into "you're lazy and selfish if you don't paint" even if those words were never said.

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
40k isn't JUST about aesthetics for a lot of people.

But the reason you play with thousands of dollars worth of models instead of $5 in cardboard tokens is 100% about the aesthetics.

No it isn't.

 Sim-Life wrote:

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
40k isn't JUST about aesthetics for a lot of people.

But the reason you play with thousands of dollars worth of models instead of $5 in cardboard tokens is 100% about the aesthetics.

No it isn't.

Then why do you spend thousands of dollars on the models, if not because they look cooler than cardboard tokens?

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Sim-Life wrote:
40k isn't JUST about aesthetics for a lot of people.

But the reason you play with thousands of dollars worth of models instead of $5 in cardboard tokens is 100% about the aesthetics.

No it isn't.

Then why do you spend thousands of dollars on the models, if not because they look cooler than cardboard tokens?

Well I personally don't anymore but when I did its because its a fairly standard requirement for playing the game but also I like the models. I assume those are the main reason for like 99% of the people who play the game. Just because a person doesn't paint the model they like doesn't mean...actually what DO you think that means?

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Maybe because they like this hobby?

Why would you like this hobby if you don't value the aesthetics of the miniatures? Without that all you're doing is spending thousands of dollars on a game you could be playing with cardboard tokens instead. Or you could even play a better game, since you're not committed to using the rules that match your miniatures collection.

Who says that they don't value the aesthetics of the models? To be clear, you're complaining about people with unpainted models, not just unpainted armies. Maybe they intend to paint everything, but haven't yet, but still want to play with the unpainted models before they're finished. Maybe they can appreciate the aesthetics of the miniatures without painting them. Maybe they like the game, everyone doesn't have the same opinion on that either. And how do you know that they aren't committed to using the rules that "match their miniatures collection"?

Which is the important part: It's their miniatures collection. And they can do whatever they want with them. They paid their own hard earned $$$ for them, and it's none of your business whether they paint them or not. If you don't want to play against unpainted models, then don't play them.

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
It’s not about being staunchly anti-paint, it’s about not wanting to paint because you don’t enjoy it. The trouble starts when people start throwing out labels like “lazy” or “selfish” against them that the flames start to grow.

Even if you dont enjoy painting yourselve there are at least two alternatives... hiring a pro painter or buying 2nd hand painted minis.

If you actually like the 40K hobby and since many tournaments have a painting code, why dont expand your gamming experience and circle by adquiring/paying for painted minis?

If you only play with your local circle of gamers, were unpainted minis are fully accepted, why would you be disturbed by the POV of a random internet "paint supremacist".

Vatsetis wrote:
If you only play with your local circle of gamers, were unpainted minis are fully accepted, why would you be disturbed by the POV of a random internet "paint supremacist".

'Cause I've yet to come across another group here that is as absolutist as them.

Most people here - hell the overwhelming majority of people here - just don't care. But there's a rare few here who won't stop going on about painting miniatures, and they're becoming quite insufferable.

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Maybe because they like this hobby?

Why would you like this hobby if you don't value the aesthetics of the miniatures? Without that all you're doing is spending thousands of dollars on a game you could be playing with cardboard tokens instead. Or you could even play a better game, since you're not committed to using the rules that match your miniatures collection.

youre so fething annoying with that gatekeeping.

how hard is it to understand that some people are part of the hobby even if they only enjoy the actual game. you don't need to love the lore or painting to love moving dudes around and shooting down your opponent ffs.





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 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

But the reason you play with thousands of dollars worth of models instead of $5 in cardboard tokens is 100% about the aesthetics.

theres a difference between cardboard cutouts and unpainted models

Well some people collect old functional cars and dont know how to drive them and actually pay others to drive them so they dont break down.

Some people eat a lot of food but dont digest them and rather vomit it.

Some people drink alcohol in unhealthy cuantities far beyond the point it might provide them some pleasure.

Surely if someone point out to this people that they were not ussing their cars or food or drinks in a sensible manner they would be pissed off and cry some nonsense about their "personal freedom and property". :(

Vatsetis wrote:
Well some people collect old functional cars and dont know how to drive them and actually pay others to drive them so they dont break down.

Some people eat a lot of food but dont digest them and rather vomit it.

Some people drink alcohol in unhealthy cuantities far beyond the point it might provide them some pleasure.

Surely if someone point out to this people that they were not ussing their cars or food or drinks in a sensible manner they would be pissed off and cry some nonsense about their "personal freedom and property". :(

wtf kinda point are you even trying to make here?

Vatsetis wrote:

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
It’s not about being staunchly anti-paint, it’s about not wanting to paint because you don’t enjoy it. The trouble starts when people start throwing out labels like “lazy” or “selfish” against them that the flames start to grow.

Even if you dont enjoy painting yourselve there are at least two alternatives... hiring a pro painter or buying 2nd hand painted minis.

If you actually like the 40K hobby and since many tournaments have a painting code, why dont expand your gamming experience and circle by adquiring/paying for painted minis?

If you only play with your local circle of gamers, were unpainted minis are fully accepted, why would you be disturbed by the POV of a random internet "paint supremacist".

Hiring other people to paint your stuff can often be just as expensive as the model itself, sometime more. And having a bunch of randomly painted minis without an effective reasoning as to why they are like that triggers my OCD.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Maybe because they like this hobby?

Why would you like this hobby if you don't value the aesthetics of the miniatures? Without that all you're doing is spending thousands of dollars on a game you could be playing with cardboard tokens instead. Or you could even play a better game, since you're not committed to using the rules that match your miniatures collection.

youre so fething annoying with that gatekeeping.

how hard is it to understand that some people are part of the hobby even if they only enjoy the actual game. you don't need to love the lore or painting to love moving dudes around and shooting down your opponent ffs.





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 Shas'O Ky'husa wrote:

But the reason you play with thousands of dollars worth of models instead of $5 in cardboard tokens is 100% about the aesthetics.

theres a difference between cardboard cutouts and unpainted models

Yes that cardboard can be printed with colour and therefore be aesthetically more pleasing and easy to identify that unpainted minis.

Actually, willingly limiting your 40K hobby to unpainted minis is like willllingly limiting your adult sexual live to masturbation... There might be some very few fringe cases in which both are understandable, but on most cases it just making your own experience poorer.

What in the actual feth are you talking about? Do you even know any more?