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The new set is a real disappointment.

Nothing too exciting. Models lack unique character, far cry from such teams as Kommandos, the Blooded or Hierotek. Scorpions are even less varied than the Intercession Astartes. They could have at least added a sprue with characterful bits like they did with the Hand of the Archon to add character to individual models.

Also what's the deal with the helmetless Scorpions? Isn't going into battle without the helmet taboo for the Aspect Warriors?

Terrain is equally uninspired. Do we really need more Imperial installations? Doesn't even look like it will play well, with reduced playable area and just some predefined, bottlenecky routes to meet your opponents on. Just compare it to the incredibly cool Warcry terrain from the last set!

All in all a very lacklustre release.

Cyel wrote:
Also what's the deal with the helmetless Scorpions? Isn't going into battle without the helmet taboo for the Aspect Warriors?

Blame the Ynnari. All but gone, but still leaving their mark on the models.

Aspect Warriors should have that uniformity. That may make them a bad choice for Kill Team after GW spend the last two years releasing flavorful and varied teams, but it's at least not a retcon for the sake of selling more plastic. It's a rare case of GW getting their priorities straight. I'd call that a positive. Plus, the Aspect team can be made up of only Striking Scorpions, but can also be mixed Aspects. So while the kit itself is pretty monotonous, the team doesn't have to be.

Bare heads are supposed to be an Ynnari thing. GW started with that when they released the plastic Banshees. I seem to remember the whole path thing isn't that big of a deal for Ynnead cultists because Ynnead is supposed to eat their souls after death, thus keeping them safe from Slaanesh.

My issue with the terrain is more that it doesn't seem very interactable. You get some high ground but no cover, cover on the ground floor is very much limited to the pillars, and while directional cover isn't a bad thing per se, if you arrange the walkways such that they look like they're built to resemble a functional human facility, you'll have a lot of it provide cover from a single direction no matter where on the board you are. Seems kind of dull in gameplay terms.

The rumour is that KT was never intended to last more than 2 seasons (typical GW there...) and so when it did unexpectedly well (again, typical GW being surprised that releases with 0 Marines do well) they sort of cobbled together a season 3 out of bits and pieces.

The new KT set is not 2 bespoke Kill Teams originally made for the system, it is 2x5 Scorpions and 2x5 Scouts bundled together with a KT branding on it.

From my perspective; that's fine and I would love 10 new Scorpions without having to get a load of terrain that I will never use or be able to sell. Plus I get 10 Scouts that I can sell to someone.

 Bosskelot wrote:
it did unexpectedly well (again, typical GW being surprised that releases with 0 Marines do well) they sort of cobbled together a season 3 out of bits and pieces.

Expect new edition next year

I like this new model wave, but the "story" irks me. It has absolutely nothing to do with the space hulk that just crashed into this planet. I expected some crashed terrain bits, planetary survivors fighting hulk survivors... not "oh yea this planet that was just hit by a space hulk, well it has this unrelated subplot going on right now with two factions that are unrelated to the hulk and to each other"

While I am happy that it looks like they finally release rules for a mixed aspect team, an obvious omission right from the start. The only good news I can see out of this is that it will spare my wallet and give me time to work on my backlog.

All I can think of seeing that terrain is American Gladiators. Silly crap out of the 90s. Weirdly enough, Killteam 2018 managed the same approach of high rise terrain a lot better with their initial AdMech vs GSC set.

GW really never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity. KT has a big following, good balance, a smart balancing management (run by just one guy it looks like) and started of with some nice creativity (and guts to finally not orbit around marines at all).

But for almost a year now it looks like they want to run this into the ground. No more white dwarf teams. The only good releases on way too low stock, then the no heart at all Inquisition release, even the preview of that was crap. And after half a year of dry spell, they open the season with....this? Ha bloody ha!

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I like this new model wave, but the "story" irks me. It has absolutely nothing to do with the space hulk that just crashed into this planet. I expected some crashed terrain bits, planetary survivors fighting hulk survivors... not "oh yea this planet that was just hit by a space hulk, well it has this unrelated subplot going on right now with two factions that are unrelated to the hulk and to each other"

Well, you know who's great at missing opportunities?

Mr Hamer must be feeling bummed right about now. Looks like the glory days of KT21 are over. Guess that with LI and Old Wold getting added to the range, there is less room (and hence product resources) for sidegames such as KT21

Not keen on the Season launch stuff, but not keen on seeing another edition of Killteam either. If KT21 reaches EOL after season 3, I'll just collect all the books for it, and keep on playing it in its archived state

Lastly, it must be said, Valrak has had a 100% correct track record so far when it comes to KT21 rumours.. Even his original rumour regarding Octarius turned out to be correct, and he has since been right on the money

What other rumours has he said for any upcoming kill team releases?

I had hoped that this would have been an on-ramp into KT and had the full rules, counters, measuring widgets etc. I play both these factions and want to get into KT, but really dislike paying full price to get a out of box rulebook.

 Nevelon wrote:
I had hoped that this would have been an on-ramp into KT and had the full rules, counters, measuring widgets etc. I play both these factions and want to get into KT, but really dislike paying full price to get a out of box rulebook.

Assuming you aren't content with just the free lite rules GW offers, your cheapest option is still buying the Kill Team starter from a discounter and selling off the miniatures to cover your costs partially. In addition to the Core Rules, I recommend getting at least the tokens, and these plus the barricades are also included in the starter


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 dan2026 wrote:
What other rumours has he said for any upcoming kill team releases?

I dont recall he has said anything definite yet, but he did mention hearing some chatter about "jump troops" for this season.. which now seems to be on point

Elsewhere, some juicy new rumours have surfaced, hinting at Elysians among other things.. but these rumours are reported to have originated from 4chan so IDK

Here are the 4chan rumours:

"›Box 2 is Spawn of Typhon (Genestealer Cults) vs Veritas Kill Team
(Deathwatch)
›Box 3 is Pit Gladiators (World Eaters) vs Elysian Mobile Infantry
(Imperial Guard)
›Box 4 is The Shadowspawned (Chaos Daemons) vs Strike Squad
Excalibur (Grey Knights)"

boatload off salt recommended.. I'll he keeping a tab on Valrak's youtube for more credible rumors down the line..

A guy from Spain was posting yesterday on reddit, says he got the rumours from a play tester and had said it was scouts vs scorpions (with mixed aspect, 9 models and 3 AP each) on Friday.

Their rumours were:
A new chaos cult vs genestealer cult
Tau vs Dark Eldar wracks (with new minis)

After that it's 3rd edition in September.

New Wracks seem super bizarre considering its 99% of the rest of the Dark Eldar range desparately needs updating.

Daemons potentionally getting some new infantry could be cool. Although again all their basic troops really need an update as they are so old now.

I guess we need to wait until the next edition to get Tyranids KT.

 Tastyfish wrote:
A guy from Spain was posting yesterday on reddit, says he got the rumours from a play tester and had said it was scouts vs scorpions (with mixed aspect, 9 models and 3 AP each) on Friday.

Their rumours were:
A new chaos cult vs genestealer cult
Tau vs Dark Eldar wracks (with new minis)

After that it's 3rd edition in September.

To be more precise, here's the exact post:

Hopefully this post won't be removed. These are the new KTs that will join our game until KT3:

- Craftworld Scorpions

- Scouts (box with scorpions, confirmed today)

- New Chaos Cult

- New Genestealer Cult

- New Tau

- New Drukhari Wracks - New minis

The composition of the next two boxes is unknown. It seems that after Craftworld vs Scouts (mid November) they expected next box to be sold by the end of December, but we don't know if this will finally happen.

The third box will come mid-end Q1 2024, and by mid-end of Q2 2024 new Kill Team 3 will be announced, expected official date for release by August/Sept (completing 3 year circle).

KT3 will simplify some rules (line of sight, obscured, climbing, among others). It is unknown if they will sell a Compendium for all the KTs by KT3 launch or the same rules will be used. It is unknown the new KTs for the starter box of KT3.

3 months prior post on reddit from same poster wrote:A close friend of mine (insider) told me this weekend that Craftworld is coming to KT hopefully by November.

Scorpions

Banshees

Dire Avengers

3 APL

9 agents

KT hability - you can buff at the beginning of an activation i.e. you can reroll, +1 attack, + circle movement etc.

So new Scorpion models confirmed.

They called the Striking Scorpions as part of a multi-Aspect Kill Team three months ago, which adds a bit more credence to their claims...but it could also just be a lucky guess.

They did not, unless there's been an update, call out specifics of who goes with what. They outright said that the composition is "unknown".


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 tauist wrote:

Lastly, it must be said, Valrak has had a 100% correct track record so far when it comes to KT21 rumours.. Even his original rumour regarding Octarius turned out to be correct, and he has since been right on the money

Octarius wasn't "his" rumor originally. It cropped up on B&C from someone else long before he ever started talking about it.

Wracks could be one of the old kits plus upgrade sprue options. Or maybe there was a mixup with Mandrakes?

I'm not sure we will be seeing any more upgrade sprue teams.. the new release model of Season 3 throws all old assumptions to the trash. These might all be brand new kits from now on, and might even be more tailored towards filling out gaps in the 40K range rather than being KT21 specific boxes. We simply dont know until the next box gets released

From what the S3 launch box is looking, there doesn't seem to be much parts in the kits for "specialist" type of operatives, both the Scouts and Scorpions kit look like they might just as well be 40K kits with a KT21 labeling. Wouldn't want this to become a habit, makes for boring teams IMHO..

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Wracks could be one of the old kits plus upgrade sprue options. Or maybe there was a mixup with Mandrakes?

Mandrakes would be more fitting for KT with their shadow tricks.

Feel like it doesn't need new Tau. Could do with making sure everyone has a custom team first.

 Shadow Walker wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Wracks could be one of the old kits plus upgrade sprue options. Or maybe there was a mixup with Mandrakes?

Mandrakes would be more fitting for KT with their shadow tricks.

And AdMech would be more fitting "guards" for a Magos' facility than Raven Guard Scouts but here we are...


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 Olthannon wrote:
Feel like it doesn't need new Tau. Could do with making sure everyone has a custom team first.

One of the issues with the bespoke teams from the Annual is they never got model support.

Valrak has said a few times on live streams that his understanding is that the Tau models this season are Vespids, but he's sounded a bit less sure about it than some of his more locked in rumours so take that for what it's worth.

I can't see them doing another squad of Chaos Cultists to be honest.

 The Phazer wrote:
Valrak has said a few times on live streams that his understanding is that the Tau models this season are Vespids, but he's sounded a bit less sure about it than some of his more locked in rumours so take that for what it's worth.

I can't see them doing another squad of Chaos Cultists to be honest.

Vespid would be awesome! Maybe that Chaos cult is actually daemon KT?

 The Phazer wrote:
I can't see them doing another squad of Chaos Cultists to be honest.

Have you seen Warcry

 The Phazer wrote:
Valrak has said a few times on live streams that his understanding is that the Tau models this season are Vespids, but he's sounded a bit less sure about it than some of his more locked in rumours so take that for what it's worth.

I can't see them doing another squad of Chaos Cultists to be honest.

Note that he wasn't rumoring the Vespid. He kept talking about it being a "season of flight teams".

Cultists could be Slaaneshi, right? Slaanesh is the only chaos power that hasn’t had a range refresh at this point, IIRC.

Could be Slaanesh, could be Nurgle, could be anyone.

Were I betting man I would say that GW was on the fence about refreshing scouts and skorps for the fourth or fifth time so someone came up with the plan to sell them in two games for the price of one mold.

My question, any word about availability? Arbites have been out of stock for 6 months or more.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 The Phazer wrote:
Valrak has said a few times on live streams that his understanding is that the Tau models this season are Vespids, but he's sounded a bit less sure about it than some of his more locked in rumours so take that for what it's worth.

I can't see them doing another squad of Chaos Cultists to be honest.

Note that he wasn't rumoring the Vespid. He kept talking about it being a "season of flight teams".

Flight teams for Tau could also include stealth suits. I think stealth suits or Vespid could be interesting for Tau. Vespid need the update more, but stealth teams could have some interesting gameplay. I think they could interact with the concealed state in some way, perhaps having a greater range of actions that can be completed whilst concealed.

Could Wracks be a misidentification of Grotesques?

The current wrack kit is pretty new, and is chock full of options. Meanwhile the Grotesque is a single Finecast monopose model that is only occasionally available on MTO.

Going with the idea that Scorpions got chucked into KT to generate sales and/or cover a third season GW didn’t anticipate the same could be a rationale for popping out the Grotesques rather than wait for the Drukhari codex.

A Coven KT could work well thematically with a Haemonclus, Wracks and Grotesques out hunting for interesting subjects or rare substances.

I know this is tying a lot of other speculative comments from other folks into a bundle with a cord of hopium.