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HEll i have nothing against them for not advertising, i think its noble but for a company that big not advertising, why dont they?

its a niche that needs to be fed, and their the only ones doing it. PP doesn't count.

they have a large enough fan base that you can play almost anywhere, go online and get tips and talk to people, their models advertise themselves, etc.

and actually they do advertise, i'm sure you FLGS has GW posters and things up the arse. They don't advertise on TV or in 'most' magazine's because thats not their target audience.

the xbox 360 doesn't run an add for gears of war 2 in vogue, GW doesn't put space marine models on tv. while I"m suprised gw hasn't stooped to releasing the macrage marines (sounds better then skull pass marines) at the hobby section of the local wolly world, you have to see the game to want to play.

think of all the work and money you've put into your army, would you still do that if there wasn't a promise that somewher along the line you'd be able to play this game? its like buyng WoW offline, or half a chess board that you have to painstackingly put togethor.

also I started wanting to play 40k when they kicked us yu-gi-oh kids to the backroom for them. all the pretty models and creatures where fun to look at. however they died in my town and I went to playing mechwarrior clix until that died out as well.

so yeah, thats why they don't advertise.. I guess.

GW advertises.

It's called "White Dwarf"

Think of when M:tG advertised on tv; it was sort of wierd. Games like this don't really look good when the notion is crammed into a 30-45 second TV spot. In fact, they tend to make the players look REALLY strange and socially unacceptable.

Some things are better left spread by word of mouth, or in venues where similar hobbies are already accepted, e.g. games/hobby magazines, shops etc.

Wehrkind wrote:Think of when M:tG advertised on tv; it was sort of wierd. Games like this don't really look good when the notion is crammed into a 30-45 second TV spot. In fact, they tend to make the players look REALLY strange and socially unacceptable.

Some things are better left spread by word of mouth, or in venues where similar hobbies are already accepted, e.g. games/hobby magazines, shops etc.

In all fairness to play MTG you have to be socially unacceptable and have no chance to ever get laid.

I think its good that they don't mass advertise, it makes it more like a club with a member ship. If they start advertising on TV we could end up with an army of snot nosed brats running around and infesting our hobby shops with there squawking and crap. And honestly, we don't need more SM players...

@Joker: Interesting observation. I'm assuming you're a long-time Magic player to make this statement, yes?

I am surprised that they don't take a page ad in a comic book though. If I hadn't seen the ads in Spider-Man growing up for AD&D, I never would have had a clue about the hobby...

I'm surprised they don't advertise on channels like G4 and SciFi, really. Chances are some one watching either are big enough dorks to like 40k.

Oh and in response to GW @ Walmart>>>

idk about you, but all the walmarts within 50 miles of me don't have a 'hobby' section anymore. There is crafts but thats not the same.

There is advertising for most of the spin off products, the console and pc games, but I've never seen core product advertised.

Advertising doesn't make sense for every company. It's very expensive, and if you don't do it right, you just throw that money away.

In my professional opinion, it'd be tricky for GW to hit exactly the right audience with traditional print, radio and TV ads. And as others have alluded, it'd be hard to accomplish much more than brand awareness in the ads. This hobby is something that has to be demonstrated.

That's why GW sees their store chain and magazine as their advertising. While I think there are some inherent flaws in that thinking, I give them credit for knowing the small, niche nature of their business. They're at least under no pretense that they're the next mass market game company.

The Dawn of War computer series and Black Library novels do a pretty good job of opening up their target demographic to the hobby. I got started onto Warhammer40k with the Eisenhorn trilogy. Then Dawn of War came out and I was like 'hey, that's from the book'. Then I actually saw how cool things were and began jumping into the rest of it. Now I've got 3 armies and seem to buy even more models every month...

Advertising costs money. I'd rather see them make that investment into hiring competent game designers, rather than advertising.

We joke around here, if Budweiser would spend as much on their beer as they do on their ads, they might have a product worth drinking.

Redbeard wrote:Advertising costs money. I'd rather see them make that investment into hiring competent game designers, rather than advertising.

We joke around here, if Budweiser would spend as much on their beer as they do on their ads, they might have a product worth drinking.

Ohh.. now that's a *great* set of jokes!

JokerGod wrote:

Wehrkind wrote:Think of when M:tG advertised on tv; it was sort of wierd. Games like this don't really look good when the notion is crammed into a 30-45 second TV spot. In fact, they tend to make the players look REALLY strange and socially unacceptable.

Some things are better left spread by word of mouth, or in venues where similar hobbies are already accepted, e.g. games/hobby magazines, shops etc.

In all fairness to play MTG you have to be socially unacceptable and have no chance to ever get laid.

I think its good that they don't mass advertise, it makes it more like a club with a member ship. If they start advertising on TV we could end up with an army of snot nosed brats running around and infesting our hobby shops with there squawking and crap. And honestly, we don't need more SM players...

LOL at jokergod. M:TG has a Pro Tour where $35k can be won 5-6 times a year. It's safer to say playing Magic is better way of getting laid than pushing "dollies" around the table in front of the ladies. Just saying....

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:

JokerGod wrote:

Wehrkind wrote:Think of when M:tG advertised on tv; it was sort of wierd. Games like this don't really look good when the notion is crammed into a 30-45 second TV spot. In fact, they tend to make the players look REALLY strange and socially unacceptable.

Some things are better left spread by word of mouth, or in venues where similar hobbies are already accepted, e.g. games/hobby magazines, shops etc.

In all fairness to play MTG you have to be socially unacceptable and have no chance to ever get laid.

I think its good that they don't mass advertise, it makes it more like a club with a member ship. If they start advertising on TV we could end up with an army of snot nosed brats running around and infesting our hobby shops with there squawking and crap. And honestly, we don't need more SM players...

LOL at jokergod. M:TG has a Pro Tour where $35k can be won 5-6 times a year. It's safer to say playing Magic is better way of getting laid than pushing "dollies" around the table in front of the ladies. Just saying....

I know, I just like to rag on Magic players XD

And all the ones at my local shop are annoying and a general pain in the ass, and quite a few need to find out what a show is, and fast...

I know how they roll. All smelling like a dirty taint and just foul.

In addition to the above mentioned possibilities, there's also the desire to avoid bad publicity. 40K and Fantasy both require lots of time, money, and especially EFFORT to set things up before you're ready to play. How many hours does it take you to get your army gathered, cleaned, assembled, and painted before your even ready to start looking at terrain? You start advertising to the general public, you're going to get people who buy a GW starter set, and then are taken aback when they realize they have to work to get it togethor before they can play. If it's not the kind of thing they're already inclined to do, they will be unhappy. And as anyone who spends anytime whatsoever on a forum can tell you, people love to complaign. So these people who have a 'bad experience' with the game will tell all their friends not to bother. There's an axiom that if a customer is happy with a product, he/she will tell one or two people, if they're unhappy, they'll tell everyone they know.

@ zamboniknight I also remember the D&D ads in comic books but I also remember comercials during saturday morning cartoons & any kid of the 80's can't forget the cartoon on saturday morning as well. I won't comment on the cartoon, being I was already playing D&D years before it came out. That might be why D&D gaming circles steadily died out where I was growing up.

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:I know how they roll. All smelling like a dirty taint and just foul.

I personally hate MTG and all games like it, I"m not going to spend a sh** load of money on crappy cards that I haul around with me until someone notices and pulls out their's.

not to mention that when I did play they just beat the living gak out of me scoffed at my cards and ignored me. god unless you have the "you automatically win" card no one gives a damn. and when I found out that actually existed I threw my cards away.

@wash-away: play better next time.

MtG has a lot of strategic depth. But you need to invest effort into it. Just like 40k.

JohnHwangDD wrote:@wash-away: play better next time.

MtG has a lot of strategic depth. But you need to invest effort into it. Just like 40k.

I had the starter box from years ago, they just had all these guys that could untap and attack again.

GW is actually a printing and advertising company that also sells some merchandising products (models & figures...)

Rudi

wash-away wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:@wash-away: play better next time.

MtG has a lot of strategic depth. But you need to invest effort into it. Just like 40k.

I had the starter box from years ago, they just had all these guys that could untap and attack again.

In that case, they were either playing wrong, or cheating you. Nothing can attack more than two times in a player turn, and that's with a spell expended each turn. Just because you can attack and then untap, doesn't let you attack again in and of itself.

On the other hand, the actual "auto-win" combos are much, much less amusing. Buried Alive + Animate Dead + Worldgorger Dragon + Ambassador Laquatus. (IIRC)

I used to play when I was young, it was fin to play back then because people pretended to be civil, once I got older they all became dicks that needed a shower.

Thats why I prefer WH, the people are nicer (a few exceptions) and they know how to work there shower...

Gw benefits from third party advertising.

More mainstream media forms advertise themselves in the Gw franchises they buy up.

Also the franchises advertise GW.

So GW gets advertised through

Gw IP replated computer games in the games themselves.

Then in actual advertising of those products. I saw plenty of advetrtising for GW's benefit on Sky One when the producers of Fire Warrior sponsored showings of Star Trek Voyager some years back.

Before and after each commerical break, one saw Tau vs Space Marines.

People are people. I play both M:tG and WH. I know unwashed mouthbreathers who play both games. I also know well-adjusted normal social people who play both games.

Anyone belittling another because of which nerd game they play is missing the point entirely. We're all gamers and we have more in common than we have differences.

GW would do well to learn from a lot of how WotC has managed to create a game that works for both casual, beer&peanut players and also for hardcore tournament types.

Redbeard wrote:People are people. I play both M:tG and WH. I know unwashed mouthbreathers who play both games. I also know well-adjusted normal social people who play both games.

Anyone belittling another because of which nerd game they play is missing the point entirely. We're all gamers and we have more in common than we have differences.

GW would do well to learn from a lot of how WotC has managed to create a game that works for both casual, beer&peanut players and also for hardcore tournament types.

Going to a Magic torny, even at your local hobby shop will will have more bad players (as in there more insulting and are rude) then you will going to one for WH.

And considering creating a table top game is a LOT more work then a card game, I think GW is doing a good job with it. Its not perfect, but neither is magic, and despite the constant crying and bickering over new rules that come out GW dos a very good job at doing what is good for the game and there company.

Advertising Costs Money.

GW is a very big fish in a very small pond.

The potential revenues from Advertising has to be weighed up against it's cost.

For GW, this is not cost effective, hence no advertising.

sourclams wrote:The Dawn of War computer series and Black Library novels do a pretty good job of opening up their target demographic to the hobby.

True, which is why I say that I'll never understand their aversion to doing a HH 40K supplement. The HH books are easily the most popular series they've ever done...you'd think you'd leverage that across the enterprise. Instead we're going to get Planetstrike or whatever.

GW is like a woman...you can get to know them, but you'll never really understand them.

JokerGod wrote:
Going to a Magic torny, even at your local hobby shop will will have more bad players (as in there more insulting and are rude) then you will going to one for WH.

This has not been my experience. Maybe, as an adult, people are just generally less insulting towards me than towards younger people. I don't know. But, I've encountered roughly the same types of people in WH and MtG tournaments.

And considering creating a table top game is a LOT more work then a card game, I think GW is doing a good job with it.

I do not agree with you. I think that perhaps the type of work is different, but to claim that one is more work than the other is showing ignorance of what goes into each.

Having seen the progress that each company has made over the last 15 years, it's apparent that WotC is doing a much better job than GW. GW has the same issues that it had 15 years ago. GW has the same rules problems, the same imbalances, the same 'give the new models the best rules' approach. WotC made several early missteps, but has largely corrected them. Over the past five years, their new releases have been balanced and fun, both for competitive tournament play and for casual play (as well as for several different types of games, multi-player, drafting, sealed, as well as the traditional 1-on-1 constructed).

GW's biggest problem, as a rules company, is their success as a miniatures company and community. It's easy for them to turn a blind eye to their rules problems when they still sell bucket-loads of miniatures.