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Well Dakka, I come seeking advice. Recently, I have "lost it" with my IG army. I can't win games anymore. Whether it is bad dice rolls, bad lists or bad tactics or a combination of the three, I am having difficulty playing with any sort of success. At this point, games feel like I am just playing until all of my stuff is dead. The biggest problem I am having is that I have no money to expand my army. So I am stuck with what I have. This is especially problematic, because I am slated to be going to Adepticon and am losing faith in my ability to play my IG. I need to find some way to fix this, because IG is the only army I can play at this point (my BA are in bad shape and I havn't played them in over a year) The first place to start, I believe, is in the list building. The following are models I own and I am hoping someone with significant experience with IG can help my figure out what to do with them.

Command Squad: Captain with PP
Captain with PF
Banner
Medic
MoO
MoF
Astropath
2x Plasma guns
Lascannon

Primaris Psyker

Lord Comissar

2x Priests, one with an evisorator

Marbo

10 man PBS

10 Man stormtrooper squad with 2x melta guns

2x Veteran squads with access 3x Plasma guns, plasma pistols, lascannons and autocannons

1x Harker squad with access to Plasma Guns, snipers and a Heavy Bolter

1x Vet squad with access to melta guns and a demo charge

2x Penal Legion squads (One of which is used to make members of Harkers Squad)

A vendetta

4x Chimeras (3x ML/HF and one NOS)

A bolter boat pask exterminator

A LRBT

A Demolisher

An Executionr with Plasma cannon sponsons

A Bastion

An ADL (Lascannon or Quad Gun)

And a few flamers and extra lasguns, as well as about 3x more lascannons and 4x more auto cannons.

I really need some help here, as I honestly can't figure out how to get things working again. Originally, I was playing footguard, but it slowly morphed into me playing a mech list. I enjoy both styles of play, but as of late I have not been very effective with either.

Any input would be much appreciated.

What point level are we talking about here? You have enough models listed to be able to make almost anything happen.

For the record, "Vets with 3x Plasma mounted in a Chimera" is *NOT* the only way to play Guard.

Cheesedoodler wrote:
What point level are we talking about here? You have enough models listed to be able to make almost anything happen.

For the record, "Vets with 3x Plasma mounted in a Chimera" is *NOT* the only way to play Guard.

I am looking at the 1850 points level. I figure I can scale down a list relevantly well once I hit the "normal" competitive level.

What sort of tactics/lists have you tried and what have you been loosing to?

As far as I can tell from the model list your cannot field a pure foot 1850 pts IG list. So mech guard is probably the way to go. So it would have to be mech-vets with LR tanks for support but without vendetta support. You also don't seem to have artillery.

Can I ask how good you are at conversions? With the basic models you have exterminator LR might actually be the best anti air option you can convert up and still have chimeras (I have been seeing these do decently against air units).

 Happygrunt wrote:

Cheesedoodler wrote:
What point level are we talking about here? You have enough models listed to be able to make almost anything happen.

For the record, "Vets with 3x Plasma mounted in a Chimera" is *NOT* the only way to play Guard.

I am looking at the 1850 points level. I figure I can scale down a list relevantly well once I hit the "normal" competitive level.

I will try to help you out some. I was the only IG player to make the final 16 last year so I figure I might know a thing or two about them. I have found that neither foot guard nor mech guard are doing well but a mix of both manages to get the job done.

Try the following list:

CCS w/ 4x Melta guns in chimera ML/HB 145pts

8+Primaris PBS (goes behind ADL) 100pts

1x Veteran squads with access 3x Plasma guns in chimera ML/HF 170pts

1x Veteran squads with access 3x Plasma guns in chimera ML/HF 170pts

Inf Squad 350pts
PCS w/ 4 flamer Chimera with ML/HF
INF squad w/ Las Cannon (commissar)
INF squad w/ Las Cannon
INF squad w/ Las Cannon

Demolisher 165pts
LRBT 150pts
ADL with quadgun 100pts

That is a start... you lack the area's guard is really good. Heavy support and fast attack.

I personally auto-include a manticore, hyrda flak tank/tanks and 2 vendetta in every list. They are apart of my standard shell for a competitive ig build. Do you have any armies for allies?

When 6th came out I actually ran a hybrid type list similar to the one above and struggled a fair bit. I have since gone back to a full mech list for 1850. I have 2x Manticores, 2x Vendettas with HB Sponsons a CCS with 4x Plasma Guns, Marbo and 6x Squads of Plasma Vets in Chimeras. All the Chimeras have ML/HF but I have been considering swapping out a few Heavy Flamers with Heavy Bolters.

The trick with running Mech Guard now is to keep some distance between you and your opponent. You want to stay out of charge range so when you finish your move you want to be 19" away from a charging squad the only time you get closer is if you are absolultly sure you will completly destroy the squad you are shooting at or you want to threaten them enough to tempt them off an objective. Once all AV13-14 is gone target the troops with Manticores the rest of the list can take care of the rest.

Your Manticores and your Vets should be the work horse. Let the Manticores take out the AV13-14 vehicles between the two you should be able to strip the hull points off anything. Let the Plasma take care of AV10-12 (Including Flyers combined with bring it down & pleanty of shots plasma is really good a killing flyers) & the Multi-Lasers take care of AV10-11 try and de-mech your opponent ASAP to take away there mobility in the first few turns.

Once the mech is all dead or if there is no mech in the list turn guns to the fast stuff like bikes, jump Infantry, Beasts, ect. The slower your opponent is the less of a threat they will be in assault. Also watch out for anti-tank and indirect weapons with long range and high strength they should also be taken out as quick as possible. So for example a melta gun 24" away from your vehicles won't do much where as a Lascannon 24" will cause you problems.

Vendettas and Marbo should be used to finish off threats that you have eith been unlucky with or simply unable to deal with. Eg a Land Raider is down to 1 Hull Point from the Manticores in turn 1 or a Tact Squad has been shot down to 1x Marine with a Lascannon or an Ork shoota boy mob has been shot down to 11 guys and is still fearless so 2x extra dead orks could force a moral check etc

Just remember that Chimeras aren't an Armoured Bunker any more used like a sledge hammer to kill your opponent with blunt force truma like in 5th they are more like scapel designed to cut small insisitions into the enemys major arteries to let them slowly bleed to death. Hug cover and keep your distance evem if you only get to shoot the Multi-Laser the first two turns to keep them alive its all good. It might even be a good idea to read up on some 4th edition mech tactics or some mech dark eldar tactics they are all useful as to how to run Chimeras in 6th

Sinji... he doesn't have a Manticore nor the money to buy any.... or half of the stuff you listed. I am sure alot of people would love to have a couple of manticores in the back blasting away as your Chimeras try to bait opponnets out of cover (since your firing nothing but the ML for the first couple of turns). But the problem is your list will be destroyed by Drop pods, since you depend on your manticores so much.

Happy, can you list your current list so we can get an idea of what you were playing? Also as mentioned, what you had issues with? What do you have for Blood Angels? Perhaps you can use them as Allies and to fill in some holes in your list (or make a BA list with IG Allies).

I know this. ^

I was simply giving him some goals to aim for and things to think about. Drop Pod lists are a problem or any lists that appear in your face turn 1 for that matter daemons and deathwing to name a few but I have been facing a drop pod blood angels list a fair bit lately and with the correct positioning you can make a come back. Its hard but do-able

Looking at what models are above he can make a few plasma vet squads and CCS with some plasma putting them into the Chimeras would be the best option for them.

With the Storm Troopers take 5 with the 2 meltas deep stike them in kill something that willl be a pain for you if it lives.

I'd fill the HS with 3 LR's all the listed above are good options. Just be careful that the excutioners sponsons don't glance it to death

The Vendetta should definatly go in and if there are Heavy Bolter Sponsons available to go on it. Put them on.

Fill the rest of the points with the Agies and a Platoon. If you can swap the CCS's plasma guns to make a 4th Plasma Vet squad do that and run the CCS near the platoon with a Reg Standard and a Lascannon. Give the PCS 4x flamer if you have enough and put them in the Vendetta. Some people say if you one member of a platoon in reserve then you have to have the entire platoon in reserve this is not true.

With the Platoon squads load them with either all Autocannons or Lascannons depending on what your leman Russ's will.be weakest against

Happygrunt wrote:I am looking at the 1850 points level.

This is your problem.

You may have had the models for a razor-sharp 1850 point list in 5th ed, but now 6th ed is out, and that changes things. Because things have changed, either you need to buy more models, or play lower points games, where the fact that you don't have quite the right models won't make as big of a deal.

The only other remedy you have at your disposal is to do some proxying. I mean, you have 4 russ models. If you're willing to break wysiwyg on them, then you have enough flexibility to perhaps make something work. If you're not going to counts-as, and you're not going to get new models, and you're not going to play lower point games, then there's not very much we can do to help you here.

He could forgo the chimeras and scratch build some artillery to fit on their hulls. Are you handy with plastic card?

Well you could... http://bloodbanker.org/plasma?gclid=CKX7-eyK-rQCFehDMgoduzsAlw

Donate blood for money?


Just kidding. Scratch build yourself some Manticores or something. Though honestly I don't see what's wrong with your list...

3x squads of Plasma Vets in Chimeras

1x Melta CCS in Chimera

Marbo

PBS

Vendetta

DS'ing Storm Troopers

Executioner

Exterminator

Demolisher

ADL


That ought to be around 1850 no?



The only problem I see is that you're going to be playing Mech Vets, and you don't have multiples of anything. I like running my armies with multiples of a single unit, but that doesn't mean that you have to per se.

 BlkTom wrote:


Happy, can you list your current list so we can get an idea of what you were playing? Also as mentioned, what you had issues with? What do you have for Blood Angels? Perhaps you can use them as Allies and to fill in some holes in your list (or make a BA list with IG Allies).

Okay, if it helps I also have a small Tau Army (Trade a chaos army to a friend who really wanted one), which consists of two squads of fire warriors, a commander with a plasma rifle, MP and shield, 3 suits with burstcannon/ melta gun, 6 stealth suits with 2 melta guns, a bunch of drones and two devilfish.

In the GK department, I have Crowe, Coteaz, 10 purifiers and a 5 man strike squad.

Now for BA (Who were my staple army for 5th edition, I just haven't found I good way to run them in 6th), I have:

Reclusiarch with a Plasma Pistol

The Sanguinor

3 Librarians (One on foot, on with a jump pack and one in terminator armour)

A furioso librarian

5 man assault terminators with 3 lightning claws and two hammers

Around 5 priests, 2 with power weapons and Corbulo

2 tactical squads with one plasma gun, plasma cannon and plasma pistol each

20 assault marines, 10 with JP, Flamers and a sergeant with a power weapon and 2 five man squads with power fists and melta guns

10 death company with two infurneus pistols, 4 power swords and 2 hammers

5 scouts with snipers

A drop pod

A land raider with Storm Bolter

two razorbacks with tl-lascannon and storm bolter

one razorback with tl-plasma/ lascannon

A ball predator (Assault cannons)

Two vindicators

3 dev squads, one with all HB, one with all ML and one with all Lascannons

A stormraven with MM/Assaultcannon and HB

So, I think my ally options with my BA is extensive. I sure as heck can fit a ton of psykers into a list with them.

My main problems have been with my friend who plays orks. Two dakka jets, 5 deffkopters, lots of lootas, ghazzy and 60+ boyz in almost every list. I have also been unsuccessful when playing the new chaos armies either. The only thing I have done well against, oddly enough, is other IG players.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 TheLionOfTheForest wrote:
He could forgo the chimeras and scratch build some artillery to fit on their hulls. Are you handy with plastic card?

I have never tried, although I do have the missile portion of the Empire Hellblaster, so I could build on sort of convincing Manticore if I needed to.

I should also mention that I am not completely out of the "non-leman russ" HS department, as I do own one kitbashed Medusa.

 Ailaros wrote:

Happygrunt wrote:I am looking at the 1850 points level.

This is your problem.

You may have had the models for a razor-sharp 1850 point list in 5th ed, but now 6th ed is out, and that changes things. Because things have changed, either you need to buy more models, or play lower points games, where the fact that you don't have quite the right models won't make as big of a deal.

The only other remedy you have at your disposal is to do some proxying. I mean, you have 4 russ models. If you're willing to break wysiwyg on them, then you have enough flexibility to perhaps make something work. If you're not going to counts-as, and you're not going to get new models, and you're not going to play lower point games, then there's not very much we can do to help you here.

This. Your list suffers from a classic guard problem. The "Take one of everything" syndrome. Your models are all over the place. If you're low on money, I suggest going mech guard, picking up another infantry squad and chimera or two, and going from there.

Captain and Ailaros beat me to the trigger. You don't have bad models per se, you just have one of everything. Ask your regular opponents if they'd be cool with a little proxying, since you're trying to figure out which way your list should go. Try taking multiples of things, i.e. instead of an executioner, a demolisher, and an exterminator, pick only 1 or 2 variants and take multiples of them. Same for troops and HQ.

You may not be able to buy anything at the moment, but you can at least get an idea of what works. Other than try allying your Blood Angels in, or play at lower points levels. I went through a burnout period with my guard a while ago so i only used my orks for a bit, and it helped me quite a bit. Maybe you should give the blood angels a go again to give you a fresh perspective on things

 MrMoustaffa wrote:

You may not be able to buy anything at the moment, but you can at least get an idea of what works. Other than try allying your Blood Angels in, or play at lower points levels. I went through a burnout period with my guard a while ago so i only used my orks for a bit, and it helped me quite a bit. Maybe you should give the blood angels a go again to give you a fresh perspective on things

This is good advice. Take a break from them. I played my SW for a while and even though they're fun, it just made me want to play guard even more! Went back with a fresh look and updated the army just as 6th hit.

I think this is the best I can do with what you've got. An all IG list would not be strong enough as you lack the essential models in the right places for the current meta/edition. I would build my list differently but this one should manage okay.

1850 Pts - Imperial Guard/BA Roster

HQ:
4 Company Command Squad, + Meltagun x4 145 pts
1 Company Commander,
1 Chimera, ML/HF

Elite:
8 Psyker Battle Squad, 100pts
1 Overseer,

Troops:
9 Veteran Squad, Plasma gun x3 170 pts
1 Veteran Sergeant,
1 Chimera, ML/HF

9 Veteran Squad, Plasma gun x3 170 pts
1 Veteran Sergeant,
1 Chimera, ML/HF

Infantry Platoon (170 pts)
4 Platoon Command Squad (mans the aegis or rides in the vendetta as a troop you can drop off in later rounds, If on quadgun the platoon commander is BS4)
1 Platoon Commander
7 Infantry Squad,
1 Heavy Weapons Team (Lascannon)
1 Sergeant,
7 Infantry Squad,
1 Heavy Weapons Team (Lascannon)
1 Sergeant,

Fast Attack:
1 Vendetta, 130 pts

Heavy Support:
1 Leman Russ Demolisher, 165 pts

1 Leman Russ Battle Tank, 150 pts

HQ:
1 Librarian in Terminator Armour (HQ) [BA], 125 pts (blood lance, Fear of Darkness) Goes in the IG blob!

Troops:
4 Assault Squad (Troops) [BA], 110pts (meltagun)
1 Sergeant [BA]

Fast attack:
1 Baal Predator (flamestorm cannon) 115pts (can trade this out for a suicide CCS w/ 4 melta in the vendetta if you want)

Heavy Support:
1 Stormraven Gunship (preferably lascannon/MM if you can trade out your assault cannon) [BA], 200 pts

1 Aegis Defence Lines 100 pts = (Quad-gun)

Total Roster cost: 1850

If you have the above models for a list I think its one of the better options you can manage with what you got. The stormraven helps fill the void of only having one vendetta. It should help you in the flier defense as well as taking out ground targets. I would mainly keep it to an anti-mech build. It wont do enough to infantry to warrant wasting its points in that regard. Set up the blob squad behind the aegis. The CCS can issue orders to them as needed. The librarian in there should help them stick around and if needed you can roll rulebook powers to boost your forces.

The 5 man assault squad can deepstrike with melta nothing really to depend on but something that can threaten your opponents backfield. They can also deepstrike on a distant objective. Just about everything else in your army can deploy and utilize the cover of the aegis. The demolisher and the baal predator are the only models that need to be able to close the distance to the enemy. Ide lean towards outflanking the baal predator. The vets in the chimera utilize their range and try to keep your enemy from getting to close. I do pretty well with 6 plasma guns in my build. On average causing 7-8 ap2 wounds on MEQ. Your company command squad is just your heavy hitters in the backfield that can take out any armor that gets to close or anything nasty that S8 can double tap.

What do you think of the build? Your concerns and/or discrepancies with the build? Just ask and I will try to fill the void with how I handle that situation or how I have dealt with it in past games...

Wow.... you have a ton of BA and alot of good stuff there! If your going to Adepticon and need WYSIWYG, I would seriously do a BA list with IG Allies. Take two IG guys and kit them up as a Astropath and a Officer of the Fleet (or just buy a super cheap 'wizard' model from another line and a military officer type with a laspistol). Put them in your CCS (Plasma/LC/Camo Cloaks?). A blob squad and a HWS as your single troop choice (this is where IG really shine as Allies because a single troop can give you a ton of options if a Platoon), kitted out as you see fit (plasma/LC?). Get a Commissar to keep them in the fight and put them behind a ADL. Then as another option you can squad up your LR or take a single (if you have points, BA are expensive) and make sure you take that Vendetta to go wity your Stormraven to give you 2 Flyers!

Stick with the Allies rules and make a composit list, get a few games in to play test. Your Battle Brothers with BA so you can do tricks like ditch the Commissar in your Blob and put a Librian in it attached, which gives the whole blob ATSKNF and can use Psychic powers on them. Your Advisors effect both your Enemy and your BA Allies to get both of your flyers in faster and if you do any DSing... which BA do alot of if you build an Assaulty list. Though they make one heck of a shooty list which works with IG really well. You could also do a combined Mech list with your Chimeras and Razorbacks... just keep that CCS hidden with the advisors. But add in your Executioner or use your one artillery (call it a Colosus so it ignores cover saves instead of a Medusa... it is a kitbash and both look alike anyway).

You have the stuff to make a competitive list, but you do need Allies one way or another. Get those Officers and use them, they are a must, specially with Flyers starting in reserve! When you get more cash, get another Vendetta or two and double up a LR variant you like. Maybe get asecond Colosus and a Manticore or two and you will have alot of versitality for your IG.

Good luck!

Thanks for the input guys. I am thinking of trying to get two librarians in my IG with access to Divination (A normal libby and a dread) to start throwing around psychic powers. A general idea of what my list mgith look like:

Foot CCS with Officers/ lascannon

Platoon with lascannons
PCS with Flamers in a chimera

2x Plasma vet squads in chimeras

Leman Russ

Leman Russ Demolisher

Ally in:

Libby with Jump Pack

Furioso Librarian

10 man assault squad with 2x melta guns

Baal Predator

Storm Raven

ADL

That will give my mobility, access to divination, a solid flyer and a good amount of mechanised support.

I will write up a list here soon, but thanks for all the input you guys.

 BlkTom wrote:
Get those Officers and use them, they are a must, specially with Flyers starting in reserve!

I would have to disagree here but ymmv. I dont want my fliers coming in immediately most games. I want my opponents to come in first so i can come in and kill theirs. In the same situation -1 reserves to my enemy has hurt me in the past as I could not do enough damage to my enemy before his entire army showed up late in the game. If you want + or - to reserves just roll strategic and you got a 33% chance of getting one or the other.

 Happygrunt wrote:
A general idea of what my list mgith look like:

Still suffers from the "a little of everything" plan and doesn't seem to have a coherent plan for winning the game. The units are all good ones, but they just don't seem to have any common purpose in being in that list.

Is your budget a literal nothing, or just "I can't afford to spend much"? If you can afford a small budget you could probably make a much stronger list, but it's going to be hard to get anywhere with such a random collection of stuff and no ability to expand it.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:
A general idea of what my list mgith look like:

Still suffers from the "a little of everything" plan and doesn't seem to have a coherent plan for winning the game. The units are all good ones, but they just don't seem to have any common purpose in being in that list.

Is your budget a literal nothing, or just "I can't afford to spend much"? If you can afford a small budget you could probably make a much stronger list, but it's going to be hard to get anywhere with such a random collection of stuff and no ability to expand it.

It is literally nothing at the moment, but for this argument, I have a small budget (~$100). What would you suggest?

 Happygrunt wrote:
It is literally nothing at the moment, but for this argument, I have a small budget (~$100). What would you suggest?

Goals, in order of priority:

1) Get a unified set of Leman Russ turrets. Find a bits seller or local trade and get just the turret parts.You'll be able to keep the hulls you already have, you just need to get all of your tanks armed with the same weapons (including sponsons, if any). This should be pretty cheap even if you're on a low budget.

2) Get some melta for your veterans/CCS. Your final list will have a mix of plasma and melta but it will make it a lot easier to playtest and find that balance if you can try a wider range of mixes, and right now you're short on melta. Get some extra melta guns so you can run a 4x melta CCS and 2-3 melta veteran squads (but keep the plasma models), and playtest with a higher proportion of melta units. Like the turret swaps, this should be pretty cheap since you just need the melta bits and a little conversion work on some spare basic guardsmen.

3) Get another Vendetta, and include both of them. They're your best AA, your only mobile troops late in the game (once the Chimeras are destroyed), and solid anti-tank. Two of them will give you a lot more redundancy, and that's something you need in a high-point game. Unfortunately this will probably consume most of your remaining budget unless you get lucky with a good deal on it, but it's worth it.

4) Expand your GK. This is a fairly low priority until you get really competitive, but eventually you need a counter to demons. Expand the strike squad to 10 models so you can combat squad and cast warp quake x2 for a nice safe buffer zone that demons can't arrive in, and consider adding some terminators (durable objective holders) and maybe a Razorback or two (more synergy with your Chimera vets) in the long run or if your budget suddenly gains some extra space.

5) Consider a Manticore. Manticores are very versatile, they give you decent anti-tank (though more frequently through HP removal than "explodes" results in 6th) and strong anti-horde. You may or may not find that you need one once you've done some playtesting against the lists you expect to face, but it's something to keep in mind.


Depending on your tolerance for ebay salvage you should be able to afford the first two options, and at least 1-2 of the lower priorities. If you can somehow afford the first four (or get lucky with ebay deals) then that gives you a good base to work with. Your end goal is a core of mech vets with appropriate support tanks/Vendettas, and either an objective holding blob or GK allies.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Happygrunt wrote:
It is literally nothing at the moment, but for this argument, I have a small budget (~$100). What would you suggest?

Goals, in order of priority:

1) Get a unified set of Leman Russ turrets. Find a bits seller or local trade and get just the turret parts.You'll be able to keep the hulls you already have, you just need to get all of your tanks armed with the same weapons (including sponsons, if any). This should be pretty cheap even if you're on a low budget.

2) Get some melta for your veterans/CCS. Your final list will have a mix of plasma and melta but it will make it a lot easier to playtest and find that balance if you can try a wider range of mixes, and right now you're short on melta. Get some extra melta guns so you can run a 4x melta CCS and 2-3 melta veteran squads (but keep the plasma models), and playtest with a higher proportion of melta units. Like the turret swaps, this should be pretty cheap since you just need the melta bits and a little conversion work on some spare basic guardsmen.

3) Get another Vendetta, and include both of them. They're your best AA, your only mobile troops late in the game (once the Chimeras are destroyed), and solid anti-tank. Two of them will give you a lot more redundancy, and that's something you need in a high-point game. Unfortunately this will probably consume most of your remaining budget unless you get lucky with a good deal on it, but it's worth it.

4) Expand your GK. This is a fairly low priority until you get really competitive, but eventually you need a counter to demons. Expand the strike squad to 10 models so you can combat squad and cast warp quake x2 for a nice safe buffer zone that demons can't arrive in, and consider adding some terminators (durable objective holders) and maybe a Razorback or two (more synergy with your Chimera vets) in the long run or if your budget suddenly gains some extra space.

5) Consider a Manticore. Manticores are very versatile, they give you decent anti-tank (though more frequently through HP removal than "explodes" results in 6th) and strong anti-horde. You may or may not find that you need one once you've done some playtesting against the lists you expect to face, but it's something to keep in mind.


Depending on your tolerance for ebay salvage you should be able to afford the first two options, and at least 1-2 of the lower priorities. If you can somehow afford the first four (or get lucky with ebay deals) then that gives you a good base to work with. Your end goal is a core of mech vets with appropriate support tanks/Vendettas, and either an objective holding blob or GK allies.

Those seem like very achievable goals. I can start working towards them once I get a steady income. Untill then, I will start messing with the IG/BA idea.

Out of curiosity, what would you suggest for the leman russ turrets? I have two chassis with sponsons and two without.

 Happygrunt wrote:
Untill then, I will start messing with the IG/BA idea.

TBH I wouldn't bother. Your BA/IG list seems to suffer from the same "a little of everything" problem as the pure IG list thanks to your limited model options, so I'd just go with pure IG and try to play smaller games as often as possible. The BA just really don't seem to add very much to your list, and are a dead end in the long run.

Out of curiosity, what would you suggest for the leman russ turrets? I have two chassis with sponsons and two without.

That depends on the rest of your list, how many points you're willing to invest, and what kind of playing style you prefer. You could have an entire thread on "what LR variant should I take", but some good options to consider as a starting point:

LRBT, no upgrades. Cheap and efficient, but not amazing.

LR Demolisher, no upgrades. STR 10 AP 2 is awesome, but 24" range means you have to be comfortable with being very aggressive with them.

LR Executioner, sponson PCs and hull LC. Tons of AP 2 that massacres marines and MCs, decent anti-vehicle threat, but very expensive.

LR Punisher, either sponson HB/hull HB (volume of fire) or sponson MM/hull LC (versatility), one of them with Pask (33% more killing for less than 33% more points). Lots of anti-infantry dice, then either more anti-infantry dice with HBs, or some anti-tank threat with MM/LC. Like the Executioner, these are expensive.

LR Exterminator, sponson HBs and hull LC. Reasonably cheap, does a little of everything. I'm not a fan, but some people like it.

I would definitely recommend the #3 option and #5 option both move up to #1 and #2.

The biggest issues with your army is the lack of those two vehicles which are one of the best options you can have in 6th edition. The vendetta is the best flyer in the game point for point. And the manticore puts out the most fire-power for a 160pt model. Ymmv but 2 vendetta and a manticore are seriously in every guard list i build.

 Tomb King wrote:
I would definitely recommend the #3 option and #5 option both move up to #1 and #2.

The whole point was that the #1 and #2 options were important and cheap. Even on a minimal budget the OP should be able to do them, a set of five melta guns from GW is only $10 and should cover the OP's needs (since they've already got a few), and spare Leman Russ guns should be very cheap since any IG player who doesn't magnetize their tanks has a sprue full of extra guns they aren't using.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Tomb King wrote:
I would definitely recommend the #3 option and #5 option both move up to #1 and #2.

The whole point was that the #1 and #2 options were important and cheap. Even on a minimal budget the OP should be able to do them, a set of five melta guns from GW is only $10 and should cover the OP's needs (since they've already got a few), and spare Leman Russ guns should be very cheap since any IG player who doesn't magnetize their tanks has a sprue full of extra guns they aren't using.

Roger, but if tight. I usually only run 1 leman russ and it is the most expendable of my heavy support slots. Its pretty clear we have different play styles. That is why i said ymmv.

 Tomb King wrote:
I usually only run 1 leman russ and it is the most expendable of my heavy support slots.

Sure, but the OP's current model collection and nonexistent budget mean that their heavy support options are going to be limited to the Leman Russes they already own, and Leman Russes are better than no heavy support at all. Changing to an entire different set of heavy support options (Manticores/Medusas/etc) might be nice, but it's way outside the OP's budget. Getting proper turrets for them, on the other hand, is a decent improvement that is easily within the OP's budget.

Cheesedoodler wrote:

For the record, "Vets with 3x Plasma mounted in a Chimera" is *NOT* the only way to play Guard.

No but against the most common type of foe, i.e. varients of space marines, they're by far the most effective. Most armies have the firepower to obliterate foot guard, which rather limits its ability to inflict damage in return, especially in 6th. Mech vets can simply drive up to MEQ or TEQ and devestate them, and in return the enemy has to concentrate on them since they're doing a lot of damage and are already close to the enemy (since they need to shoot).

This means a)Your big hitters will attract less attention. It varies by game of course, but with the damage that plasmavets can do it it will mean they are a higher priority for the enemy's anti-tank. In extreme cases you can saturate the enemy's anti-tank and essentially role over them. This is unsportsmanly though so try not to look too smug and b)The relative cheapness of plasmavets vs damage output means that if you use distance to your advantage you can surround and destroy enemy formations by sacrificing units one by one.

A plasma veterans in a chimera will need to kill 3.3 terminators to get its points back, which will take them 4 shots. Now consider what playing foot guard involves and it becomes, imo, a no brainer.

Now a lot of what I have just put is irrelevent against certain enemies, namely horde ork, nid and guard. Against those armies, a guard army full of plasma vets will fold like a cardbox box under a tonne of gak. So if you are wanting a TAC list then you probably wouldn't want more than a couple.

tl;dr

Mech Vets are hard counters to most popular armies.

They should not be taken seriously in a TAC list.

 BryllCream wrote:
Most armies have the firepower to obliterate foot guard


Mech Vets are hard counters to most popular armies.