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So yeah, this show is a thing I totally forgot had started. Just caught up on the first four episodes, and as someone who's not read the book series on which it's based: wow, very impressed. I suspect this will be replacing Dark Matter in my viewing schedule going forward, since they both appear to be aiming for a "serious sci-fi" vibe, but The Expanse actually pulls it off(Killjoys, the last of the three main new shows in recent times, is distinct IMO since it's more of a pew-pew fun adventure sci-fi).

Dark Matter uses the usual sci-fi plot devices like FTL, AI androids, energy shielding and so on, but in the end I think that actually works against them because their budget can't support a "realistic" far-future aesthetic, so everywhere they go looks like what it is; a redressed factory, or a redressed warehouse, or a soundstage with a hastily-repainted facade. The Expanse, by contrast, combines IMO better set design with a more grounded technological base such that even when the locations do seem a touch "basic", that doesn't feel incongruous. I love that they're actually bothering to try to represent plausible space travel and colonisation(and apparently that's a faithful adaptation of the source material); ships without artificial gravity, where the decks are aligned along the ship's axis so that the engine thrust provides pseudogravity, and having everyone be forced to wear footwear with a mag-locking function for times when the ship isn't under active thrust; space combat between ships conducted mainly with long-range guided torpedoes and automated anti-torpedo defence turrets, with railguns as last-ditch knife-fighting weapons, as well as ship damage done properly(no BS energy shields and occasional sparks coming off the ceiling; hull plates peel off, railgun shots punch through whole compartments and force the survivors to patch the holes to prevent loss of atmosphere), and best of all they managed to edit the combat sequences in a way that preserves the pacing yet still manages to convincingly imply the glacial pace and huge distances that would be inherent in actual void combat; the way the "Belters" who spend most of their lives in zero-G over several generations have begun adapting to their environment, being taller and skinnier, with reduced muscle mass and weaker bones, but not to a ridiculous degree(ie, they look like tall skinny people, not aliens), and have developed a realistic patois language that mixes English, contracted slang words, and sign language which is exactly what you would expect from a culture that spends a lot of their time in space suits.

I understand from the wiki that things get a bit more speculative as the story progresses, so we'll have to see if they can pull that off, but I'm optimistic given what we've seen so far.

I love the Expanse. Easily the best new scify show lately. Dark Matter is good, but is reminiscent of all the other basic sci fi out there. Reminds me of a modern Andromeda.

The Expanse has this great three-story web going where all the storylines are part of a whole, rather than just another "adventures of a dashing starship crew" story setting.

I hope the shadow faction is using some sort of discovered alien tech as their basis, as what I've seen so far makes me think this show could handle a bit of an alien angle without being cheesy. Although some sort of fringe evil science would work, too, because then the show would be firmly about humans.

Having read the first and second books, and with the rest on my shelves (...I'd have read them sooner if they weren't tomes - try taking those to work on the train), I'm surprised to see them turned into a tv series. The trailer makes it come across as your standard sci-fi affair with politics involved. It hinted towards what's her face - Razorback lady - , but doesn't really give away just how cosmic horror story things get...

Does the series open the same way the books did? A derelict ship in space with a lady stuck in a locker and all the gribbly nastiness outside ...or am I giving away half the plot here? Just wonder if they're keeping it fairly tame until later on so as to remain generic sci-fi as long as possible.



The trailer at least does carry seem to carry through the theme of reality checking the lead and his good intentions.



Edit, and damn, they better include that scene where a starship gets hit by a railgun and they cover up the entry/exit holes with clipboards.

You should probably do a better job with the Spoiler Tags, maybe?

 Wyrmalla wrote:


Edit, and damn, they better include that scene where a starship gets hit by a railgun and they cover up the entry/exit holes with clipboards.

That's exactly the scene I was referring to, and it's perfectly executed, right down to the floating blood ball from the chap who's head goes walkabout going *splat* over his corpse when the engines kick back in

At the moment they seem to be keeping any weird stuff "off-screen". We're getting three simultaneous plotlines; the shifty business going on at the UN, following the XO of the Canturbury and his immediate crew as the galaxy repeatedly gaks on them, and the "missing person with a twist" case involving the girl you allude to and the corporate Detective on Ceres. They're revealing little bits of the bigger plot/conspiracy/mystery here and there as each of them proceeds along, I expect that the proper big reveal will be the season finale cliffhanger since it's already been renewed for a second season.

EDIT: And also apparently Mormons building Generation Ships is a thing. Damn I love this show

How are you defining "proper" sci fi? It seems like all the praise I'm seeing is being directed at the science principles and the setting mechanics.

How are the actual characters? Realistic, well rounded? Is the plot complex or flat? Are the conflicts multifaceted or just standard tropes? How is the actual story?

 Jimsolo wrote:
How are you defining "proper" sci fi? It seems like all the praise I'm seeing is being directed at the science principles and the setting mechanics.

How are the actual characters? Realistic, well rounded? Is the plot complex or flat? Are the conflicts multifaceted or just standard tropes? How is the actual story?

I praise the setting and the attention to scientific detail because those aspects are so often utterly neglected by TV sci-fi, where the "sci" is often just a flimsy veneer over the soap opera-esque "fi" that gives the writers easy access to tropes and deus ex machina.

We're 4 episodes in to an adaptation of an entire series of novels, and the structure of the show following three distinct plotlines at once and slowly weaving them together means we've only really spent just over one episode with each group, so it's a tad early to be judging that aspect IMO. Still, on that limited basis, the writing seems solid and the characters mostly have a good balance of flaws and positive qualities, although the flaws are being somewhat emphasised by their present circumstances. The central conflict and related mystery is very plausible and to me extremely interesting;

Earth and Luna are under the governance of the UN, which has its own armed forces and space navy, their society appears somewhat utopian. Mars has been colonised, and has its own independent government and military, with a seemingly very unified culture focused on self-sacrifice and duty as they all work together to terraform the planet. The two exist in a state of moderate cold war since in reality both societies are utterly reliant on the resources of the asteroid belt and outer planetary systems, which are controlled by a labyrinthine intersection of the UN and corporate interests, which treat the "Belters" who work to provide said resources like gak, and who in turn are directing growing support towards a terrorist/freedom fighting group who demand political independence from Earth AND Mars. As of ep 4 everything is presently turning to crap because a mysterious stealth ship nuked an ice miner called the Canterbury and it looks at first like Mars were behind the attack.

I've thoroughly enjoyed the first few episodes.

@Yodhrin. What you write is bet put in spoiler tags. Please attend.

 Alpharius wrote:
You should probably do a better job with the Spoiler Tags, maybe?

What plot points given away in the first chapter of the novel, or that a space opera may involve some sort of space battles?

The setting seems interesting, but at 4 episodes in, it's still too early to tell if the characters are engaging? (Or did I misunderstand?) That seems like it could be a big red flag.

Or is it one of those first seasons where the writers are struggling to find their footing?

 Jimsolo wrote:
The setting seems interesting, but at 4 episodes in, it's still too early to tell if the characters are engaging? (Or did I misunderstand?) That seems like it could be a big red flag.

Or is it one of those first seasons where the writers are struggling to find their footing?

Neither, that comment was more regarding your story/plot/conflict tropes remark. I addressed the character question specifically.

But more generally; yeah I usually think judging a non-monster of the week TV show after only 4 episodes is premature. If I stuck to that kind of standard, I'd have switched off Game of Thrones in season 1 and never looked back, because the "scene setting" of those early episodes is pretty slow going especially with a week long gap between each when watching "live" and only really begins to feel vital to the story as you move into the second half of the season.

I actually really like the mix of the crew of the Cant, as well as Thomas Jane's character is a nice rough guy that you can hate at first but begin to enjoy see him doing the good things that need getting done as the show goes on.

And everyone hates politicians.

Sorry, amigo, no offense meant. Only saw one generalized sentence about the cast as a whole, without any specifics to make any kind of a judgment on.

Are the protagonists relatable? Engaging? Entertaining? Are the antagonists sympathetic? Grandiose? Is it about one or two people, or is it an ensemble cast? Does the cast seem like they interact together well, or do you see some casting/writing changes being necessary to make everything work?

I'm legitimately intrigued by the ads I've seen, and you seem super-stoked about the show.

I have been wanting to watch this, but I dont have cable.
anyone know, LEGAL streaming available?

Yeah, www.syfy.com

Alright, this show is good. I love it

 Jimsolo wrote:
Sorry, amigo, no offense meant. Only saw one generalized sentence about the cast as a whole, without any specifics to make any kind of a judgment on.

No probs, probably could have typed it out more clearly.

Are the protagonists relatable? Engaging? Entertaining? Are the antagonists sympathetic? Grandiose? Is it about one or two people, or is it an ensemble cast? Does the cast seem like they interact together well, or do you see some casting/writing changes being necessary to make everything work?

The problem I have giving specific answers to this kind of thing is we're not actually sure who the antagonists are yet(The shady UN Security character? The OPA? Some unknown group? The Mormons, even?), and the motivations of many of the protagonists are unclear enough that you have niggling doubts about even the ones who seem straightforward. For example, the corporate Detective character seems like your standard "slimeball with a heart of gold", but I won't trust that characterisation for another few episodes at least. And that's not a criticism, they seem to be setting up "suspects" and ruling them out to be replaced by further mysteries at a reasonable pace, and do so in a logical way; this isn't Lost yet

At the moment the three plot threads are still distinct enough that you could say there are two stories about a couple of people and one ensemble; the UN character has primarily interacted with her direct superior, an old diplomat friend, and briefing rooms full of faceless suits so far, while the Detective's story is very much about him and the girl he's looking for(the other characters are more foils/plot devices/antagonists for him - on which note, I continue to be amazed by Jared Harris who, after a moment's shock while your brain goes "haud on, isn't that Moriarty?", manages to pull off the Belter patois convincingly and with his trademark quiet menace); the plotline about the Cant is pitched as being Jim Holden's story at first, but the group dynamic is the real focus as it moves along. The casting seems to be pretty good, there's a couple of actors who might need a bit of settling-in-time but they don't break you out of the narrative.

I'm legitimately intrigued by the ads I've seen, and you seem super-stoked about the show.

You really should give it a go; I'm actually legit impatient for the next episode, which is seriously rare these days with TV shows other than GoT and Vikings.

Liking this show a lot. A bit on the slow side starting up but not near as bad as other series on TV like Breaking Bad where the only reason my wife and I continued past the drek of the first season was other people said it was so good. I haven't finished the 4th episode yet so am waiting for a time when the wife isn't hogging the TV, she got bored in the first episode and lost interest.

I wanted to like it, but I'm finding the show mostly boring :( Still watching it, but I'm hoping it picks up more. I should like it, there's been plenty of explosions, but I usually find myself watching the first half of the episode and then paying more attention to the models I'm painting instead... then it's suddenly over and I don't remember what happened and I'm too lazy to rewind.

Looks like there's some other sci fi show on USA coming soon called the Colony .. might check that out. Also gonna check out the Sharnara chronicles but since it's on Mtv I'll probably hate it.. I remember reading some of those books a long time ago. As long as they don't fill it with CW teenage lovers quadrangles that change every other episode, it might be good.

Watched the first 4 episodes and thoroughly enjoyed it. Looking forward to see more.

I've been enjoying "Expanse" quite a bit. It's making me think about reading the books.

The Colony is already on my DVR list.

I'm not sure about Colony to be honest, I could really do without another American alien invasion show where the aliens are thinly veiled analogues for grotesque caricatures of the British soldiers during the War of Independence.

Another? What other shows/movies have given you this impression?

Col. Dash wrote:
Another? What other shows/movies have given you this impression?

That rubbish one with the whiny family, whassitcalled, Falling Skies.

Falling Skies was good until the final episode, which soured the entire series

Good god, quoted for truth.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Falling Skies was good until the final episode, which soured the entire series

What happened in the last episode? Was it worse than nBSG's finale?

Pretty much, dues ex machina and a stupid reveal of the aliens intentions

Well I just saw episode 1 and I'm really keen for more. Turns out good things can come out of the Off Topic subforum, who knew.