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Hey folks!

As I travel around the country playing in tournaments and meeting new people, I've discovered an unsettling trend of people referring to Dakka in unpleasant terms, usually with reference to lack of literary ability, garbage posts, trying to filter through junk, and worst of all the repeating polls.

I've been a loyal Dakkaite for a couple of years now; even paying for DCM status to show my support for Dakka and its endeavors. My personal posting on Dakka has significantly dwindled in the last year, and I don't even go into sections of the forum (Army Lists, General Discussion) except for rare moments because of the effluence of garbage that has to be sorted through to find something worth reading. It didn't really hit home until yesterday, when I was at an RTT in a new store that I hadn't visited before, and got hit with another dose of, "No, I don't read Dakka...too much garbage there anymore, but instead I use XXXX forums, which are smaller and have more worthwhile content."

I got to thinking about it today as I was looking through the forums for something interesting to read....Dakka *is* full of garbage, isn't it?

What is the Best Space Marine Chapter?
Who would win in a fight? X Character vs. Y Character?
Beat this unit with this other unit!
Which is better, Fantasy or 40k?
Rank the Primarchs!
What's the most powerful unit in 40k?
What's the most powerful unit in XX Codex
Rank this codex vs. that codex.
Which Chaos God is best?
What 40k creature would you keep as a pet?
What's the best 40k novel?
Does X Army suck?
Rank the codexes by power!

Polls have played a large part in saturating and drowning intelligent thought from our forums. Just when one dies, someone starts an identical topic with the same question. I wonder how many dozens of threads have been created with the title "Beat this unit?" How many hundreds of thousands of posts have been made to nonsensically argue back and forth about the merits of things that have no practical application to our hobby?

The amount of valuable content - what brought me here in the first place has been diminished and swamped in a raging torrent of useless posts and pointless argument. I've largely stopped contributing content personally because I get overwhelmed with private messages asking me for personal help - most people aren't willing to dig through the refuse looking for something that will help them. "Dash, I heard you're the guy to ask about Orks....could you help me XYZ?" My story is the same story as many others who have taken either a passive role or no role in Dakka as the sum of its parts have been dragged kicking and screaming downhill into offal.

YOU can help.

1. Don't support the polls. They are evil and unholy and repetitive and ultimately lead nowhere - causing their unholy rebirth to continue to plague our forums.

2. Don't be a bystander. When someone creates a topic and posts an illiterate collection of words, ask them to be considerate of everyone else on the internet. Ask them to carefully consider their words and try expressing them in a manner others can understand.

3. Link, Bookmark, and paste repetitive threads! When someone creates a thread to discuss or question something already under discussion, or that has recently been discussed, link the old thread into the new with a note "OP, there is an identical thread here you can discuss this at" and then report the thread as a duplicate. It will get locked/removed - and that's one less piece of clutter!

4. Enforce Rule #1: A lot of threads spin out of control because of how people are treat each other and talking to each other in a thread. Don't wait for one party to become offended enough to report it, hit the report button and get it back on track early!

5. Send a PM to Legoburner/Yakface: Dakka has an offtopic board, and it has a "Dakka Poll" section....it needs a "Gaming Polls" section, or to rename Dakka Poll as a gaming poll section, and have this be the place for all of those "What's the best unit in 40k" arguments to go to. Just because a post has words doesn't mean it contains content, as I'm sure someone will show up to point out this thread for shortly.

Dakka has a large community, but it isn't so big that the little actions we individually take can't help keep Dakka a place that gamers want to visit.

Yeah, but the important thing is that a Xenomorph would totally kick a Genestealer's ass.

There is always a rash of what might be characterised as juvenile polls and threads in the summer holiday season.

Things tend to calm down once the schools go back

Amen to that!

I mean, all of the various country's educational systems have to be good for SOMETHING, right?

I think we should take a poll...

Seriously though, Dash has a point. A lot of stupid threads come up. Some are legitimately humorous/a good read, but many are just a waste of bandwidth. I also agree that anybody who registers an account in a country where English is the primary language should be held accountable for the readability of their posts.

Having a place for humor would be nice, though I imagine moderating a subforum for that sort of thing would be a nightmare.

Just my 2 cents.

Been here a long time, and one thing is absolutely true:

Some topics will always be rehashed after a certain amount of time.



I think I have seen at least 20 threads on the topic of what music you listen to while gaming. This is without even slightly resorting to exaggeration. I am even willing to bet that there have been far more threads about that specific topic.

Once you have seen a specific topic arise that that you know has already been discussed, its natural to feel that the signal to noise ratio is out of whack.

Lets take this very topic we are currently reading right now.

Thats right. It too has been done before.

You raise valid points, but ultimately nothing will come of it.
I am not being cynical, I am going by over a decade of experience with this site and that simply is how it is.

New people will continue to come to the site wanting to discuss certain topics and people who have been on a forum for awhile who had participated in that very topic a month ago will feel annoyed.

Its not like newbs can search for a topic of discussion and participate in it. If they comment on it and its over two months old the thread will just get locked so why bother looking for old crap when you can start a new discussion?

Good luck with trying to get people to do the stuff on your list. I agree with you and find those topics dull and tired, but thats because we have been there and done that. Lots of kids on here havent yet and the topics are valid.

Dakka is fine.

If someone doesn't like a poll they don't have to read it. I certainly don't.

According Alexa, Dakka's right in the running with(Warseer, BOLS) or burying completely(40konline, TauOnline) any other major GW Fansite I can think of. That list is by no means exhaustive. I'm also going to withhold my opinions on pots, kettles and their calling each other on their respective colors.

Part of the problem is that the attitude from the Off-Topic forum is seeping into the useful parts of the forum. The other part of the problem, noted by Polonius, is that the administration seems indifferent to promoting quality content.

So we get the same subject discussed thread after thread because continuing the previous thread where the topic has been beaten to death is necromancy and therefore to be abhorred. That's when certain moderators can't be relied upon to actively troll users...

Articles, well, I gave up on them with my article on Chaos Sorcerers because an illiterate chump kept on screwing it up with his inability to spell, or indeed write at all. Why bother when most of the articles are trash, and whatever you write will be trashed by the next teenager accessing Dakka Dakka without adult supervision?

Posting in You Make Da Call is a lost, for obvious reasons, and Tactics is basically spillage from Army Lists populated by a bunch of regulars with an axe to grind rather than any real interest in discussing actual tactics.

To be honest I've been doubting my own reasons for showing up and posting for a while now, it doesn't seem to do any good, and most of my favourite posters seem to have given up already. If it wasn't for the Swap Shop I think I would have gotten myself banned years ago.

At least Dark Eldar have been released so we don't have the interminable weekly DE rumours thread.

Most forums get pretty repetitive after awhle.. on another forum years ago I swear EVERY day someone started a thread asking "Do you still overheat if you reroll the 1 to hit?"

my only main issue with dakka is that I wish it had a bigger WFB following as 40k hasnt really added much new to the game in awhile. I hate having to go to euro dominated boards for WFB stuff because europe uses wackass rules and bans everything competitive.. not the best place to read about tactics

Hey! Theres nothing wrong with my "what is the best 40k novel" poll. There are a lot of people who are interested in what other people think about the novels. It is a good way to get feedback on different books and to see which is worth reading and which is worth missing. I, and a lot of other people don't want to waste their money buying poor reads.

This is timely.

Noticed that Alpharius has been quoted in someone's sig.
"DakkaDakka is NOT a democracy!"

To which my first thought was, if Dakka is not a democracy, how come there are so many fething polls?!

If you go to latest posts it tends to be dominated by OT threads. (Guilty of contributing your honour )

The same questions keep cropping up.
Need a better search engine and people need to actually look before posting a question.
And how many more, I am new Skaven/HE player what do I do now threads are there going to be

Haha, I put a similar post up about a year ago.

Dakka has changed a LOT.

Back when I came on board, you didn't speak up unless you had something intelligent to say. That was because you got flamed like crazy for saying dumb gak.

Not for the thin skinned, but if you could take a little ribbing Dakka offered up the best tactics and list building advice on the net.

A lot of the best players still hang out in Dakka, but the quality of content has gone down, down, down. I still love it here, but I truly cringe at some of the unbelievable garbage that gets toted as sound tactical or list building advice in those sections. I don't even bother posting in those areas now because it's so frustrating.

Dakka is still great for tournament information, News and Rumors and WIP blogs. Those areas are top notch. As for being the best place to go to learn how to play the game well, not even remotely close to what it was.

We are becoming what we used to mock in Warseer.

Im pretty sure Just Dave would'nt be too happy to here his Thread was'nt appreiciated, personally If a thread is usefull or well written I.E. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/311758.page then it is welcome, and if you are annoyed with repeating threads then you, as a DCM can block the thread and direct them to a previous thread.

Reecius wrote:We are becoming what we used to mock in Warseer.

Thats because self moderation is no longer tolerated. Posters are not allowed to call BS on another poster here. As you noted, say something worthwhile or GFTO.

Nowadays even moderators are trolls, so there you have it.

I would'nt call your Day in the Life of a pro 40k player thread valuable, but it was funny and a great read and for that reason it deserves to be on Dakka.

What was that about other sites being more literate than dakka?

A bit about Strength Through Pain over on BoLS (Credit to GrenAcid):

So I was talking with Phill for a while and this is what I know:

Mandreaks are shadow bit chaos thing that eats souls and glow green(you on cover)
New character former DE queen..and Vects wive....after he dump her, she started planning revange on him.

From this thread

@Hellfury

You know better than I do what it used to be like. If you were acting like a dumb ass, you got called on it. Now, any knucklehead can say what ever he or she likes, no matter how inane, and we can't say anything to help correct the situation.

The MODs are like ninjas too, they delete posts in stealth mode. Trying to encourage a healthy, friendly environment is one thing, but protecting the idiots at the expense of the site is only going to be detrimental in the long run. What made Dakka unique was the fact that you got the straight dope on playing well. No one tried to candy coat anything. You were expected to be an adult about giving and taking criticism. Now everyone's feelings are involved and the quality of the content has greatly suffered, IMO.

nickmund wrote:Hey! Theres nothing wrong with my "what is the best 40k novel" poll.

Actually, it's the only non-stickied thread with over 100 posts on the front page of 40k General Discussion so that should speak for itself. Judge your thread by the number of views and replies, not on someone's opinion of polls.

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:What was that about other sites being more literate than dakka?

A bit about Strength Through Pain over on BoLS (Credit to GrenAcid):

So I was talking with Phill for a while and this is what I know:

Mandreaks are shadow bit chaos thing that eats souls and glow green(you on cover)
New character former DE queen..and Vects wive....after he dump her, she started planning revange on him.

From this thread

Poetry. Sheer poetry.

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:And how many more, I am new Skaven/HE player what do I do now threads are there going to be

I always thought that there should be army specific sub-forums in each game systems respective section, just for this reason. Sort of like how MMO's have class specific forums, so you can turn to a specific forum community for a question/advice for a particular subject, and ignore topics that mean nothing to your army, since they are already sorted for you.

But after thinking on it, that would make alot more forums that need modding, or those forums would not get enough modding which could exacerbate the problem of crap topics.

The OP does make a good point. I was a lurker for 2 years before I started posting and I can notice a difference, and I only use about 1/10th of the forums. Must be an even more profound change for those that have be around for a good while?

With the Dark Eldar going up for pre-order on the 5th, I'm sure we can expect some price whining threads to come. I know I don't have to read them(but I usually do for laughs, this hobby was always expensive), but the mere existence of them just increases the likelihood of good discussions being pushed into the oblivion beyond the first page.

With that said, I think this is still the best forum out there for tabletop gaming discussion, it just seems like it could be even better with a few fixes.

nickmund wrote:Im pretty sure Just Dave would'nt be too happy to here his Thread was'nt appreiciated, personally If a thread is usefull or well written I.E. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/311758.page then it is welcome, and if you are annoyed with repeating threads then you, as a DCM can block the thread and direct them to a previous thread.

Refer to my OP on literacy.

Yeah, Dakka is still the best, IMO. I just wish we could find a happy medium between the out of control egotistical flame wars combined with incredibly good advice of times gone by with the nicer environment mixed with utterly terrible advice that we have now.

I really don't find the "good advice to bad advice" ratio to be worse here than on any other site.

ooooh! Sorry a spelling mistake!

Hellfury wrote:Nowadays even moderators are trolls, so there you have it.

I think this is an important problem. Whether they acknowledge it or not, the moderators exercise a leadership role in Dakka Dakka, and if they're going to troll then they've set the tone.

Would be interesting to note the increase of population since the time you're talking about Dash. I suspect it's the whole 'victim of it's own success' problem.

I'm all for punting spankers, but not chumps or kids.

None the less, tell me who a spanker is? I know of one or two here I'm less than taken with, but if you think that poster is great but you and I have no issue with each other and have enjoyed good communication (I've been glad of your advice with my orks, for example), allowing open season would lead to me railing him, him railing me, you possibly getting involved, siding with one or the other, the other then attacking you, then folks on my side weighing in, then more on his side...

I don't see 'the community' rising up to exorcise individual demons, I see the 'self rule' ending up as the factions drawing lines in the sand and brawling until dakka sinks into a bog of loathing. 'The League of Cynical Haters' warring with 'Apologist Sons of Jervis', 'Rules as Written Adherents' in vicious hand to hand combat with 'The Common Sense Regime'...

Messy... Very messy...

In the Grim Future of Dakka Dakka, there is only drama.

Monster Rain wrote:In the Grim Future of Dakka Dakka, there is only drama.

It happens to most forums eventually. The last forums I posted on regularly (I was a member for probably 5 or so years) had all sorts of behind the scenes back-stabbings, cliques, the bulletproof and the trolls. I was only on the outer edges of most of the goings on (I had a blanket disinterest in getting involved) but bloody hell - there was all sorts of stuff going on that trickled into the forums and influenced the meta game, as it were.

Can't believe I was apparently on the admin shortlist for that place at one point

Join doomfart.


.....PROFIT!

MeanGreenStompa wrote:'The League of Cynical Haters' warring with 'Apologist Sons of Jervis', 'Rules as Written Adherents' in vicious hand to hand combat with 'The Common Sense Regime'...

There should be a feature to join one of these 'guilds''.