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I was at my local gaming store today, and I was reminded of an incident in a Hordes starter box tournament that I entered with my Legion of Everblight starter.

In my first game I drew a Trollblood player, and due to a few amazing rolls I killed both of his Impalers on the second turn, but left myself wide open to his Axer due to his Thresher ability which lets him hit every model in combat range with him. I knew that it would be in combat the turn after next, so, to avoid this I chose to run away, utilising my warbeasts and casters faster movement in order to steer clear of his models, taking the odd potshot at his Axer with my warcaster and eventually killing that too. Obviously, during this time a few games had finished, and they had gathered around the table to watch the game, and I had no problem with this. However, I was getting continuously heckled by the other players, and even a Press Ganger for using "underhanded tactics" to win the game.

Do any of you guys agree with them? I know the motto of the game is "Play like you've got a pair", but I fail to see why I shouldn't use my miniatures advantages in order to gain the edge on an opponent?
Has anyone else had a similar experience?

you did nothing wrong, you advanced in a different direction.

If you had punched the other guy in the face, that would be a frowned upon tactic.

Cyporiean wrote:you did nothing wrong, you advanced in a different direction.

If you had punched the other guy in the face, that would be a frowned upon tactic.

Only in some circles.

You did fine good sir.

The fact that the press ganger fellow joined in on the heckling is BS. That guy is supposed to represent PP, organize tournaments, and introduce new players to the game, not make some stupid judgement on the tactics you chose to use. I'm not familiar with either faction mentioned by the OP, but if it doesn't make sense to engage a certain target, then you should not engage. My friend plays a mean eldar list and spends the entire game running from me and taking pot shots. It's a smart move on his part because engaging me directly would not be in his favor.

Yeah, you might want to send an e-mail to Privateer with the PG's name. I know we would have an issue with a demo team member heckling players.

Its fairly common for minor heckling at PP events when people withdraw from the smash mouth style, and resort to hit & run to win a game. However, where I play its all in good fun, and everyone knows tactically its the best decision sometimes. Also its only the guys that know each others heckling each other, we would not single out someone new to the shop.

Additionally, your playing Legion vs Trollbloods. You disabled his big nasty stuff, then pulled back and piecemealed for the win. Legion should not often be trying to go Toe to Toe with Trollbloods unless they have an advantage to exploit, as most Trollblood lists strength is in combat. You also were able to identify you had left a hole and over extended, then you compensated. That's just smart play. There is nothing wrong with what you did.

It seems especially strange that this happened while playing WM/H, which has a number of ways to avoid denial tactics if that is the intent of the event (read: scenarios!) If you weren't playing any scenario that required you to run into his loving troll arms, then bully for you for not doing so! And boo to anybody honestly giving you gak for playing as the event allowed.

- Salvage

Because a Well known military tactic is such a underhanded tactic.

That's up there with flanking and circling your opponent! So dirty and only reserved for cowards and castration victims!

Nothing wrong with that. In a warhammer 40k tournament I was 3 up on kill points so I ran away from his platoon that had just outflanked and won the game.

Running from a combat you knew you would lose... I can't see how that is considerd underhand, its called sensable.

He could've hid behind terrain and forced you to come to him ...nah you're fine.

Unless the comments were all in good fun, those people don't know how to play. Legion are supposed to play exactly like that. I will say that out of the box, the trollblood starter is the worst, as it has no heavy.

I got similar stick back when I played 40K a lot and I dug in and shot with my orks instead of charging at a better close combat force.

You should be ashamed for trying to win the game where the designer-intended end result is somebody winning.

Magnus the Traitor's feat is designed exactly for the tactics you used in your game. There is no shame in your tactics, it's called using your brain to defeat your opponent. They should be ashamed for acting like tools.

I know nothing of the game but if you have played to your strengths then the hecklers are morons. Period.

Kindly tell future spectators making comments on your tournament game which side of your ass you prefer to have kissed.

People seem to think Page 5 means you play recklessly, not realizing it enables you to take any and all measures to WIN.


EDIT: Within reason and the rules.

Win at any cost.

kronk wrote:Kindly tell future spectators making comments on your tournament game which side of your ass you prefer to have kissed.

This 100%. I have been called out and heckled at tournament games but my response is the same. "If you want a friendly game dont play a tournament. I did not come to go easy on you, I came to crush you and you should be trying to do the same."

Cyporiean wrote:you did nothing wrong, you advanced in a different direction.

If you had punched the other guy in the face, that would be a frowned upon tactic.

But depending on the opponent, a viable tactic. And possibly effective one.

a great man once said "You Play to win the game"

A wise man once said: "My father used to say that not playing to win is like sleeping with your sister. Sure she's a great piece of tail, with a blouse full of goodies, but... it's just illegal. Then you get into that whole inbred thing. Kids with no teeth who do nothing but play the banjo... eat apple sauce through a straw... pork farm animals."

It's not underhanded at all. It's perfectly sensible. "Underhanded" implies secretive or dishonest; you weren't either of those things, you just played to your strengths and his weaknesses, which is how you win games.

Underhanded (dishonest) would be cheating, or lying.

Underhanded (secretive) would be internet-stalking all the tournament-goers beforehand, and finding out if they had any particular phobias or foibles, then bringing out and petting your Realistic Spider Lucky Mascot in the game against the arachnophobe.

Ian Sturrock wrote:
Underhanded (secretive) would be internet-stalking all the tournament-goers beforehand, and finding out if they had any particular phobias or foibles, then bringing out and petting your Realistic Spider Lucky Mascot in the game against the arachnophobe.

lol thats just evil. I will just invite there wives and let them sweat it out when they explain why they werent mowing the lawn etc...

Have your girlfriend wear a low-cut top and stand next to you while you play, bending over the table to help you move your models.

That would be under-handedly distracting, but who would complain?



Alternatively:
During the game, ask them if they've seen the Human Centepede movie.

Ask them a lot.

kronk wrote:Have your girlfriend wear a low-cut top and stand next to you while you play, bending over the table to help you move your models.

That would be under-handedly distracting, but who would complain?

This man speaks the truth. At Throne of Skull when Tablewar brought a booth babe to help promote their cases and bring their players, and their opponents, drinks during rounds many opponents had the response of, "Shut up and take my favorite opponent vote already!"

I used to run into this same mindeset when I played WM, and sadly it is a byproduct of page 5 (or people's hijacking of it as an excuse to be an asshat), and the general culture of WM players which expected every game to end up in a slugfest to be doing things "in the spirit of the game".

I played Cygnar and often emplyed mobility, run & gun tactics and varous denial stratgies. I preferred to chip away at my opponent with spell/gun from afar, use terrain to foil his advances/charges, and make it difficult for him to pull off his desired combos, engage me, etc.

Often I would run into people just like you describe that woud tell me that I was "playing the game wrong", apparently because I wouldnt simply move into combat and slug it out. What was even funnier was often it would be a guy with a melee-centic army doing the complaining.

Yes, let me hand you a victory...

My response was always "write a letter to PP if you don't like how they created the game, but my tactics and playstyle are legal so STFU or rage quit...".

This prevailing attitude and bias in the game (both in rules mechanics and tourney culture expressed via senarios/ common win conditions) towards melee was one of the reasons I lost interest in the game and stopped playing tbh...

I was under the impression that WM was a powergamer's paradise, but it sounds like they have a sort of culture of taboos on certain things. I am generally a spirit of the game kind of guy, but if an army is clearly meant to not do something, is bending over and letting the opponent have his way with my force really in the spirit of the game? These sorts of undefined biases tend to alianate new players from a game, as well.

WM is really about where you play and what is the culture. You have just as many powergamers in WM as you do WFB / 40K. I used to get flak when I played Cygnar in Mk1 as I had a Centuarian Denial list. Where the list was built around Darius popping feat, and getting the Jacks back up and repaired.

People hated it. I never understood why was in my eyes you game to win, it was the strategy I employed. Over time, people came to accept that mind set. That people play different, its not just about run to the center and beat face. The tournment gamers have a very tournment gamer mentality of play to win, but play fair. Tournment WM players, are not asshats for the most part. They respect strategy, cunning, and guile.

You will run into casual gamers who are tools. But you will run into that anywhere, regardless of what you play.