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Post by: silent25
Schmapdi wrote: plastictrees wrote:The "Dwarf Battleline" might be something to wait for. Those sets have had actual discounts lately haven't they?
They have - but at $165 listed price for the set, it doesn't seem likely to have a lot in the way of content.
I'm guessing something like:
Longbeards/Hammerer box x2
Dwarf Warriors box
Dwarf Thunderers box
One new character model (that will effectively be "free" - ie the savings of the box)
Which isn't terrible, at a discount. But the old kits will mean existing dwarf players won't benefit, and the character model will prevent any real reason to double up on it.
The new "battalion" boxes have been seeing about a 20 ~ 30% discount. You will probably only see one box of Hammers, but also a gyrocopter, and maybe a cannon. That works out to about a 22% discount.
Also saw these little gems show up on the GW page for sale:
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440055a&prodId=prod1140287 Beware the dreaded dwarf wizard!
*edit* Not finding the info on Bugman's.
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Post by: plastictrees
That aiming musket guy was one of my favourite dwarf models. I think his name on the tab was 'Doc'.
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Post by: Schmapdi
Apparently - Bugmans has the following listed as the box set:
Warriors box,
Thunderers box,
2 cannons,
Hammerers box,
Runesmith.
So I wasn't too far off - except even fewer "new" things, and 2 cannons means doubling up even less desirable. Though at least they chose the Runesmith (which you could field two of) instead of the other less repeatable characters. I was spot on with the value though! IIRC the cannon kit is $25, so exactly the value of the hammerers box.
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Post by: Kanluwen
Schmapdi wrote:Apparently - Bugmans has the following listed as the box set:
Warriors box,
Thunderers box,
2 cannons,
Hammerers box,
Runesmith.
So I wasn't too far off - except even fewer "new" things, and 2 cannons means doubling up even less desirable. Though at least they chose the Runesmith (which you could field two of) instead of the other less repeatable characters. I was spot on with the value though! IIRC the cannon kit is $25, so exactly the value of the hammerers box.
So it's:
1 Lord/Hero Choice(Runesmith)
1 Core choice(Warriors)
A Core OR Rare choice(Thunderers--I'm thinking that Rangers are going to be Rare now)
A pair of Special choices(Cannons)
A Core OR Special choice(Hammerers can build Longbeards who are Core and Hammerers are Special)
Not a bad mix of stuff, it gets a bit better if Cannons can be fielded as a "battery" like Bolt Throwers can.
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Post by: Red_Zeke
The cannon kit also makes an organ gun, FWIW...
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Post by: Micky
What does everyone think of the D3 Wounds cannons rumour?
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Post by: pities2004
 Micky wrote:What does everyone think of the D3 Wounds cannons rumour?
false
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Post by: RiTides
Whoa. Does this mean something for 9th ed?
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Post by: pities2004
Nope, if that were the case then GW has been doing it for years cause they have the stats on GWs website when you go to the unit.
No cause for concern or theories
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Post by: decker_cky
Micky wrote:What does everyone think of the D3 Wounds cannons rumour?
The D3 wound rumour came from terrible reading of a posted rumour. It was a list of all the multiple wound weapons, and it included some explicitly listed as multiple wound (2). Cannons will be cannons.
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Post by: Red_Zeke
Yeah, I think it happened over on Bugman's. The poster who had a copy in hand mentioned that there were lots of D3 wound weapons in the book. When asked to expound, he listed off all weapons, abilities, runes that inflicted multiple wounds (though he didn't label the list as such). In this list were things like the cannon. It seems reasonable to expect that this was just a miscommunication.
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Nope. It just means they are putting stats in the box now. Like how they have stats for units in the back of the BrB.
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Post by: jonolikespie
 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Nope. It just means they are putting stats in the box now. Like how they have stats for units in the back of the BrB.
As pointed out earlier they don't have special rules listed, nor do they have equipment, options or points listed. This might have been GW exploring a system similar to PP or Spartan Games with the rules being in the box but if it is someone at the top clearly missed the point by a mile or two.
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Post by: Fenrir Kitsune
I've still got a box of grey hunters with the stats printed on the back.
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Post by: Herzlos
Schmapdi wrote:Apparently - Bugmans has the following listed as the box set:
Warriors box,
Thunderers box,
2 cannons,
Hammerers box,
Runesmith.
So I wasn't too far off - except even fewer "new" things, and 2 cannons means doubling up even less desirable. Though at least they chose the Runesmith (which you could field two of) instead of the other less repeatable characters. I was spot on with the value though! IIRC the cannon kit is $25, so exactly the value of the hammerers box.
How is that likely to be for a decent army starting point? Could I buy that with a rule book and be sorted, or does it need padding out?
I'm pretty tempted, depending on what I can get it for (I think I've got a place that's doing 30% off RRP).
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Post by: Tangent
 Alpharius wrote: Tangent wrote:Alpharius wrote:IF I wanted to buy lots of Dwarfs online for the best price possible, where should I be looking?
GW Dwarfs or non- GW?
GW ones, please!
No idea on that one. I mean, other than your typical discounts from third party sites. I use Miniature Market and TheWarStore, and Miniature Market is just barely cheaper than WarStore. Miniature Market is having their moving sale right now, though, where some GW stuff is 40% off.
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Post by: snurl
Consider these:
http://www.oldgloryminiatures.com/products.asp?cat=360
They cost $45 for 24 figures, no duplicates.
I have a bunch of them.
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Post by: Left Hand of the Pheonix
About the rules in boxes, they are doing that for model with no rules in books atm. The men of dale have their rules in the box, as they came out before the codex was revealed. It makes perfect sense, so i expect to see it in for future releases.
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Post by: Saldiven
decker_cky wrote: Micky wrote:What does everyone think of the D3 Wounds cannons rumour?
The D3 wound rumour came from terrible reading of a posted rumour. It was a list of all the multiple wound weapons, and it included some explicitly listed as multiple wound (2). Cannons will be cannons.
Yes, that was my fault.
I was answering so many questions from the book at the time that I kinda short-cutted answering that question by just including everything that had the Multiple Wounds rule, rather than specifying how many wounds were inflicted.
To be clear, the cannon in the Dwarf book just references the Cannon rules from the main rule book.
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Post by: Schmapdi
Herzlos wrote:Schmapdi wrote:Apparently - Bugmans has the following listed as the box set:
Warriors box,
Thunderers box,
2 cannons,
Hammerers box,
Runesmith.
So I wasn't too far off - except even fewer "new" things, and 2 cannons means doubling up even less desirable. Though at least they chose the Runesmith (which you could field two of) instead of the other less repeatable characters. I was spot on with the value though! IIRC the cannon kit is $25, so exactly the value of the hammerers box.
How is that likely to be for a decent army starting point? Could I buy that with a rule book and be sorted, or does it need padding out?
I'm pretty tempted, depending on what I can get it for (I think I've got a place that's doing 30% off RRP).
It's not too bad IMO. In the current dwarf book you could build a roughly 1000pt army with that, depending on what you take. (With some upgrades for padding).
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
Have these been posted yet? Or this?
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Post by: Herzlos
Schmapdi wrote:Herzlos wrote:Schmapdi wrote:Apparently - Bugmans has the following listed as the box set:
Warriors box,
Thunderers box,
2 cannons,
Hammerers box,
Runesmith.
So I wasn't too far off - except even fewer "new" things, and 2 cannons means doubling up even less desirable. Though at least they chose the Runesmith (which you could field two of) instead of the other less repeatable characters. I was spot on with the value though! IIRC the cannon kit is $25, so exactly the value of the hammerers box.
How is that likely to be for a decent army starting point? Could I buy that with a rule book and be sorted, or does it need padding out?
I'm pretty tempted, depending on what I can get it for (I think I've got a place that's doing 30% off RRP).
It's not too bad IMO. In the current dwarf book you could build a roughly 1000pt army with that, depending on what you take. (With some upgrades for padding).
Great, thanks 
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Post by: Tangent
Thanks! I don't think they've been posted yet. For the work blocked: 
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Post by: Azazelx
Pics of some next to GW dwarves please? (older GW dwarves are fine)
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Personally, I think the GW ones look better.
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Post by: Ehsteve
15pts a model for a 18" S5 armour piercing flaming attack at 3+ (factoring in long range/moving we're looking at worst 6+ if also firing at skirmishers). That is of course assuming dwarf-crafted = superior design.
It seems like a fairly good unit, if a little cumbersome to set up. Any unit capable of redirecting it or stealing fire away from other units will do well due to the high cost but if fired close range at a gutstar or similar unit, it could deal a lot of damage. That said if you're at 9" against a gutstar (unless you're in the flank for whatever reason) then those guns are going to do little good. I can see units of 10 working well but nothing beyond that due to cost. The advantage this unit may have over the Thunderers is their maneuverability, but that all depends on if Thunderers get a points reduction.
This unit would be fantastic if they hadn't put the 10+ restriction, a 5man unit to transport a trollhammer torpedo into enemy lines would have been golden. At 190pts (because they're a maneuverable unit you need to have that musician on hand as well) the unit doesn't exactly thrill, but it's not a complete waste of points provided that you can keep them alive long enough to get off at least 3 salvos. That said the torpedo isn't that great either considering you're normally needing a 4+ to make it hit (rarely will you be within 12" of the unit you want to use this against and not have to move that turn as well, on top of getting it to wound and then deal 2-3 wounds to differentiate it from the usual drakeguns, that's a 5 in 18 to make any difference for +30pts.
Definitely mixed feelings here, they should have made it possible to turn this unit into a 5 man torpedo unit but as it stands, very average rules-wise.
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Post by: rowenstin
Drake gun shoots "searing bolts of blazing energy"? Did WHF dwarves invent plasma guns now?
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Yes. Makes sense, really. All what plasma is is super heated ionized gas.
Now, we know the dwarves can get super heated gas, since they live near lava and what-not. Replace "ionized" with "rune powered," and it fits wonderfully.
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Post by: pretre
Wait is that more rules in White Dwarf?
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Yeah. There's a scan of the Iron Drake entry from the new WD somewhere on this thread.
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Post by: Saldiven
 Ehsteve wrote:15pts a model for a 18" S5 armour piercing flaming attack at 3+ (factoring in long range/moving we're looking at worst 6+ if also firing at skirmishers). That is of course assuming dwarf-crafted = superior design.
Dwarf crafted != superior design.
"Dwarf-Crafted: Shooting attacks made with weapons that have this special rule do not suffer the normal -1 To Hit penalty when performing a Stand and Shoot charge reaction."
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Post by: pities2004
Saldiven, so the anvil is not getting a new model, and can it go in a unit now?
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Post by: Ehsteve
Saldiven wrote: Ehsteve wrote:15pts a model for a 18" S5 armour piercing flaming attack at 3+ (factoring in long range/moving we're looking at worst 6+ if also firing at skirmishers). That is of course assuming dwarf-crafted = superior design.
Dwarf crafted != superior design.
"Dwarf-Crafted: Shooting attacks made with weapons that have this special rule do not suffer the normal -1 To Hit penalty when performing a Stand and Shoot charge reaction."
In that case this unit just got a serious downgrade. Too expensive to take a full charge with only a 5+ to hit (always assume long range) and it only functions in the front arc. A 4+ save will only get you so far in WHFB at 15pts a pop.
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Post by: flamingkillamajig
I think the new flying units look cool though maybe it's just me.
Btw didn't they used to have dwarf ironbreakers? Is that getting re-done too is was it fully removed because I'm not seeing it on the dwarf page anymore.
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Post by: Red_Zeke
This post got me pretty pumped. 'Course its easy to be excited without seeing points values...
For the lazy:
Jossy at Plastic Krak wrote:
The following is a summary of the new Rune system for Dwarfs upcoming Army Book. They are fairly solid and confirmed by multiple sources now. Although several points values are know for them I have left them out. There are definitely some very interesting combinations to be had and at first glance it appears that the main strength in the new Dwarf Army Book will be Banner Runes combined with heavy infantry...
Runes & Magic items:
Banner Runes (11 runes)
M. Rune of Stromni Redbeard: +1 Combat Res for all friendly units with 12"
M. Rune of Grungi: Ward save against missile attacks
M. Rune of Valaya: +2 to dispel attempts
Strollaz Rune: Vanguard.
Rune of Stoicism: Stubborn.
Ruen of Courage: Immune to Psychology
Ancestor Rune: Once per game, take test on single d6
Rune of Slowness: One rune, charging enemy unit subtracts 1d6 from their charge distance rolled.
Two runes of slowness, you roll 2d6 and take the highest for the charge distance reduction.
Three runes of slowness still use the 2d6 roll (pick the highest) for the charge distance reduction, and if the charging unit still makes it into contact, it has ASL until the end of the turn.
Rune of Battle: One rune of battle grants an extra 1 point of combat resolution.
Two runes of battle grant an extra 2 to combat resolution.
Three runes of battle grant an extra 2 to combat resolution and grant the unit the Fight in Extra Ranks special rule.
Rune of Sanctuary: One rune, MR(1)
Two runes, MR(2)
Engineering Runes (8 runes)
Rune of Forging: Reroll misfore on artillery dice.
Rune of Disguise: Warmachine counts as being in hard cover.
Rune of Immolation: Detonate your warmachine to hurt enemies; automatically blows up if killed in close combat.
Rune of Penetrating: Increases strength, can be taken twice. If on grudge thrower, affects both S values, as in x(y).
Rune of Stalwart: Grants bonus to machines combat resolution score
Rune of Accuracy: +1 to hit for warmachines.
Rune of Seeking: +1 to hit against flyers for WM.
Rune of Burning: Flaming attacks.
Armor Runes (8 runes)
M. Rune of Adamant: Grants T10.
??????: 5+ regeneration save.
??????: 2+ ward save against KB/HKB.
Weapon Runes (18 runes)
M. Rune of Skalf Blackhammer: Wounds on a 2+ unless target in magic armor, wounds on 3+
M. Rune of Alaric the Mad: No armor saves
Rune of Breaking: Destroys magic items on target character on roll of 2+.
Dragon Slaying: One rune, wounds dragons on 2+ with Multiple Wounds(2)
Two runes, +1 to hit and wound anything from Daemons of Chaos book + Multiple Wounds (d3)
Rune of Fury: One rune, +1 attack
Two rune, +1 attack + frenzy
Three rune, +1 attack + frenzy + every hit generates extra attacks
Rune of Cleaving: One rune, +1 S
Two runes, Armor Piercing
Three Wounds, Killing Blow
Rune of Smiting: Multiple Wounds (d6)
Rune of Might: One rune, double S v +T5 foes.
Two runes grants Multiple Wounds(D3).
Rune of Striking: One rune, +1 WS
Two runes, WS 10
Three runes, Reroll failed to-hits in combat
Rune of Fire: One rune, flaming attacks
Two runes, S3 breath weapon(50)
Three runes, Multiple Wounds(d3)
Talisman Runes (7 runes)
M. Rune of Balance: Steal PD on 4+.
Rune of Spellbreaking: One rune, dispel scroll.
Two runes, same as before
Rune of Dismay: One runes, causes fear
Two runes, causes terror
Three runes, causes terror and enemy units take -1 ld penalty
Rune of the Forge: One rune, 2+ ward vs flaming
Rune of Warding: One rune, 6+ ward
Two runes, 5+ ward
Three runes, 4+ ward
Rune of Luck: One rune, one re-roll per game
Master Rune of Passage: Auto pass difficult terrain test
Heirloom (6)
Heirloom: Hammer that grants +3 initiative, and if you wound an opponent, they have I1 until the end of the combat phase.
Heirloom: Axe that grants re-rolls to hit and to wound against Orcs & Goblins and Skaven. Cause Terror against those opponents.
Heirloom: Armor of 2+ save and 3++ vs attacks of S6 or higher.
Heirloom: A horn that is one use only and grants all units with 6" the Devastating Charge rule til the end of turn. After using, that character causes Fear to High Elves, Dark Elves, and Wood Elves for the rest of the game.
Heirloom: Ring that grants a S4 breath weapon with Flaming Attacks.
Heirloom: Banner to Re-roll failed to wound rolls.
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Post by: Triple_double_U
Wow! T10 on a 20mm square base with a decent armour save is mental!
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Post by: jorny
It will be interesting to see the point costs of those runes, unless they are very high there is a good chance that the dwarven runes will continue to be broken. The combination of customised magic items, unlimited dispel scrolls + dispel dice is insanely good.
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Post by: flamingkillamajig
The dude could probably Look out sir! too. Pretty insane stuff all this. My magic phases going off irresistibly doesn't do a fraction of this and a lot of these runes will just do whatever they want while by being dwarfs my spells are at a disadvantage. Well I can't beat them in close combat, magic is pretty much destroyed with all those dwarf priests, I'm about as bad at outflanking as they are and their shoot and machines would just torch me. I guess i'll have to think of something to handle high armor and high toughness or god maybe a way to win these combats.
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Post by: jonolikespie
Question, Rune of Slowness, does that mean with one your opponent only rolls 1d6 to charge then with two rolls 2 but only add the lowest?
That seems like the way to do it but reading it made me thing you roll both then roll another two and subtract the higher of those two from the charge roll, which just seems annoying.
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Post by: Bla_Ze
 jonolikespie wrote:Question, Rune of Slowness, does that mean with one your opponent only rolls 1d6 to charge then with two rolls 2 but only add the lowest?
That seems like the way to do it but reading it made me thing you roll both then roll another two and subtract the higher of those two from the charge roll, which just seems annoying.
Jossy at Plastic Krak wrote:
Two runes of slowness, you roll 2d6 and take the highest for the charge distance reduction. .
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Post by: jonolikespie
Right but are you, the person playing dwarves, rolling 2 d6 and taking the highest from your opponent's roll after he's rolled his dice for the charge?
That's how it reads and that seems unnecessarily complex and a waste of time/yet another 'roll more dice' game mechanic when you could just say 'take away the higher of your opponent's dice when he rolls his charge distance'.
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Post by: Bla_Ze
jonolikespie wrote:Right but are you, the person playing dwarves, rolling 2 d6 and taking the highest from your opponent's roll after he's rolled his dice for the charge?
That's how it reads and that seems unnecessarily complex and a waste of time/yet another 'roll more dice' game mechanic when you could just say 'take away the higher of your opponent's dice when he rolls his charge distance'.
No its not, and there is probably a reason for that. If it was worded as you say it would be less effective. Now it has a chance to reduce more than just a potential low Dice roll.
But who knows that the final wording is.
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Post by: Kroothawk
Seems like after 9 years of waiting, the Dwarfs get 1.5 new units: The flamer boys an the bomber variant of the gyrocopter. That's ... not much.
Also in the German translation (done in Nottingham), the Dwarf Kings were degraded to Dwarf Dukes ("Fürsten"). Can someone confirm that the English armybook still has Dwarf Kings as HQ units?
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Post by: Tangent
 Kroothawk wrote:Seems like after 9 years of waiting, the Dwarfs get 1.5 new units: The flamer boys an the bomber variant of the gyrocopter. That's ... not much.
Also in the German translation (done in Nottingham), the Dwarf Kings were degraded to Dwarf Dukes ("Fürsten"). Can someone confirm that the English armybook still has Dwarf Kings as HQ units?
Wow, it's been 9 years?!
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Post by: Mr Morden
Kroothawk wrote:Seems like after 9 years of waiting, the Dwarfs get 1.5 new units: The flamer boys an the bomber variant of the gyrocopter. That's ... not much.
Also in the German translation (done in Nottingham), the Dwarf Kings were degraded to Dwarf Dukes ("Fürsten"). Can someone confirm that the English armybook still has Dwarf Kings as HQ units?
Got more new stuff (and models) than the Adepta Sororitas in theri new Codex :(
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Post by: Saldiven
Kroothawk wrote:Seems like after 9 years of waiting, the Dwarfs get 1.5 new units: The flamer boys an the bomber variant of the gyrocopter. That's ... not much.
Also in the German translation (done in Nottingham), the Dwarf Kings were degraded to Dwarf Dukes ("Fürsten"). Can someone confirm that the English armybook still has Dwarf Kings as HQ units?
In the English book, the Lords selection consists of "Lord," "Runelord," and "Daemon Slayer." (Not counting special characters.)
The Heroes section consists of "Thane," "Runesmith," "Master Engineer," and "Dragon Slayer." (Again, not counting special characters.)
Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Bla_Ze wrote: jonolikespie wrote:Right but are you, the person playing dwarves, rolling 2 d6 and taking the highest from your opponent's roll after he's rolled his dice for the charge?
That's how it reads and that seems unnecessarily complex and a waste of time/yet another 'roll more dice' game mechanic when you could just say 'take away the higher of your opponent's dice when he rolls his charge distance'.
No its not, and there is probably a reason for that. If it was worded as you say it would be less effective. Now it has a chance to reduce more than just a potential low Dice roll.
But who knows that the final wording is.
I knows what the final wording is (grammar error intentional).
"Rune of Slowness:
This rune creates a physical barrier by drawing upon the intractable nature of the Dwarfs surrounding it.
Any foes charging a unit including a standard bearing a Rune of Slowness subtract D6" from their charge distance (roll after their charge distance has been determined). If the enemy fails to make contact, all the rules for failed charges apply.
A second Rune of Slowness means a foe rolls 2D6 and must choose the highest dice when subtracting from his charge distance.
A third Rune of Slowness maintains the previous effects and, should a foe contact the bearing unit, they have the Always Strikes Last special rule in the first round of combat." ( Pg. 63) Automatically Appended Next Post:
It also uses up 80% of a Lord's runic item allowance and cannot be combined with any other armor runes. So, sure, the model is T10, but the best armor save he can have is 3+ (unless he also takes Shieldbearers), the best ward save is 6+, and leaves not much at all for a runic weapon, should you want one.
Though, I guess you could do a build of Lord, Sheildbearers, Armor Rune of Adamant, a ring (or whatever) with Rune of Warding and Rune of the Furnace, and then take a great weapon.
That would give you a T10 Lord with 5 wounds and a 2+/6++ (2++ vs Flaming Attacks). He would have 4 WS 7 S 6 attacks and 2 WS 5 S 4 attacks (from the bearers). This would run the equivalent of 155.5 Skaven slaves in points. Automatically Appended Next Post:  pities2004 wrote:Saldiven, so the anvil is not getting a new model, and can it go in a unit now?
Dunno if it's getting a new model or not. I only have info because my FLGS got a copy of the Dwarf book on Feb 7th. I don't have any information about what's going on behind the scenes.
But, it cannot joint units. It's just unit type Warmachine with no other rules allowing it to go into a unit.
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Post by: Shamanlord1961
Saldiven wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Bla_Ze wrote: jonolikespie wrote:Right but are you, the person playing dwarves, rolling 2 d6 and taking the highest from your opponent's roll after he's rolled his dice for the charge?
That's how it reads and that seems unnecessarily complex and a waste of time/yet another 'roll more dice' game mechanic when you could just say 'take away the higher of your opponent's dice when he rolls his charge distance'.
No its not, and there is probably a reason for that. If it was worded as you say it would be less effective. Now it has a chance to reduce more than just a potential low Dice roll.
But who knows that the final wording is.
I knows what the final wording is (grammar error intentional).
"Rune of Slowness:
This rune creates a physical barrier by drawing upon the intractable nature of the Dwarfs surrounding it.
Any foes charging a unit including a standard bearing a Rune of Slowness subtract D6" from their charge distance (roll after their charge distance has been determined). If the enemy fails to make contact, all the rules for failed charges apply.
A second Rune of Slowness means a foe rolls 2D6 and must choose the highest dice when subtracting from his charge distance.
A third Rune of Slowness maintains the previous effects and, should a foe contact the bearing unit, they have the Always Strikes Last special rule in the first round of combat." ( Pg. 63)
This seems like it will be good or bad. Good in that it can remove the possibility of an auto charge. You are 6" out of an M6 unit and they roll double 1's, you roll a 6, bam, no charge. However the chance of rolling that one, kinda sucks that it might make no difference at all. It is a pretty awesome rune, but I would only take it on shooty units.
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Post by: pities2004
Means dwarfs can utilize charging more and get that +1 str
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Post by: Red_Zeke
This- and often you'd rather engage on your turn than the enemy's when considering magical buffs/debuffs and the like...
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Post by: silent25
Question I have is, can a unit easily take the Rune of Slowness and Strollza together? Vanguard combat unit up, minimize chance of being charged.
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Post by: godswildcard
Sorry if I've missed it, but has there been any word on special characters in the book?
Particularly Garagrim Ironfist?
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Post by: Orock
serious question from someone who only plays 40k And remember this is coming from someone who over the years of collecting has had 4 40k armies. How do they expect new people to get into this game? 50 dollars for 10 ironbreakers? And you need how many? Say you only need 100 guys at that price to fill out a decent army. That's still 500 bucks, almost 200 more than you would spend on a decent sized 40k army. Personally I love the idea of buying one box for the front line troops and having the rest of the bases be empty, but some places wont allow that. Even a comparable expensive game like warmahordes you can still get a decent army going for 200.
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Post by: lord_blackfang
Kroothawk wrote:Seems like after 9 years of waiting, the Dwarfs get 1.5 new units: The flamer boys an the bomber variant of the gyrocopter. That's ... not much.
It's been 9 years? I always thought Dorfs were in the fast lane along with Empire, Orcs and Chaos.
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Post by: spaceelf
 Orock wrote:serious question from someone who only plays 40k And remember this is coming from someone who over the years of collecting has had 4 40k armies. How do they expect new people to get into this game? 50 dollars for 10 ironbreakers? And you need how many? Say you only need 100 guys at that price to fill out a decent army. That's still 500 bucks, almost 200 more than you would spend on a decent sized 40k army. Personally I love the idea of buying one box for the front line troops and having the rest of the bases be empty, but some places wont allow that. Even a comparable expensive game like warmahordes you can still get a decent army going for 200.
GW has listened to our complaints. Thus they are only charging 50 for the dwarves. This is a substantial discount in comparison to the price of the Witchelves which are 60 for 10. Maybe if nobody buys these then the next release will have units back down to goldsword prices (40 for 10)
In terms of prices, I think that GW figures that most gamers have multiple armies. Thus they can afford 500+ in purchases. Given that they know some players have the money, they figure that they will charge that much for a single army.
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Post by: Alpharius
I pinged a couple of places to see if they could work with me on a large Dwarf order, but didn't get any replies.
So, almost by default, that means I'll be saving a bit of money by NOT starting a Dwarf army.
It is still mind boggling to me that it really would cost around $1000 full GW retail to get a Dwarf army on the table now... 
And that is cost BEFORE painting supplies are factored in too!
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Post by: Kroothawk
 lord_blackfang wrote: Kroothawk wrote:Seems like after 9 years of waiting, the Dwarfs get 1.5 new units: The flamer boys an the bomber variant of the gyrocopter. That's ... not much.
It's been 9 years? I always thought Dorfs were in the fast lane along with Empire, Orcs and Chaos.
I double checked it. Last armybook has copyright 2005, but was released January 2006, so is 8 years and one month old, last 6th edition book IIRC. Only Wood Elves (September 2005) and Bretonnia (February 2004, 10 years anniversary  ) are older
And in the German edition, one HQ unit has indeed been degraded from Kings to Dukes.
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Post by: pantheralegionnaire
"Rune of Slowness:
This rune creates a physical barrier by drawing upon the intractable nature of the Dwarfs surrounding it.
Any foes charging a unit including a standard bearing a Rune of Slowness subtract D6" from their charge distance (roll after their charge distance has been determined). If the enemy fails to make contact, all the rules for failed charges apply.
A second Rune of Slowness means a foe rolls 2D6 and must choose the highest dice when subtracting from his charge distance.
A third Rune of Slowness maintains the previous effects and, should a foe contact the bearing unit, they have the Always Strikes Last special rule in the first round of combat." (Pg. 63)
This clears it up to me--so you are essentially getting another chance to really knock some distance off their charge. The Always Strikes Last addition is also just an added bonus.
However, given what you've said about the T10 rune, I wonder how much this triple-Slowness would cost you?
I am really glad that they are allowing the Dwarfs to still have a bunch of runes (the general trend in new Army Books is to drastically reduce the number of "Arcane Forge" type items dedicated to only one Army) and that it will be possible to combine them. There will always be a cost to pay, and strategy involved depending on how you like to play and what you are facing, but I'm glad this didn't get totally nerfed.
I am also sad about the "1.5 new units" situation. No Monstrous Infantry (or Cavalry, obviously) for Dwarfs, which is a deviation from what's generally been going on with new Army Books. And no Monsters! I was really hoping for some mechanical monstrosity, or a Dwarfen Steam Tank or something! Oh well...it's only been 8 years and 1 month...
Thanks for the great inside info!
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Post by: ruff
I was sure hoping for plastic slayers.. No word on it yet..
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Post by: UNCLEBADTOUCH
 ruff wrote:I was sure hoping for plastic slayers.. No word on it yet..
They are already available, just google avatars of war ;-)
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Post by: schadenfreude
3 runes of battle=+2 combat res and an extra rank of iron breakers/hammerers gets to swing. Who needs to slow down an enemy's charge when charging that unit will be about as productive as smashing your face into a brick wall.
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Post by: pities2004
Well I have the book in hand, I am pretty happy with a lot of the changes, some of the units went up in points, runesmiths and rune lords dropped in price, same with miners.
The anvil of doom is poop. (it's a little better with thorek)
The anvil can move now however if you move it you can't use the magic bound spells.
I don't see many scenarios that this would be handy, plus it's super vulnerable
SLAYERS ARE AWESOME - Also Ungrim is in the book and he is just ridiculous, his only down side is he can only join a unit of slayers.
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Post by: Nerol
What are you liking about the slayers?
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Post by: reds8n
pities2004 wrote:Well I have the book in hand, I am pretty happy with a lot of the changes,
Good.
Please do let us know what you reckon overall.
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Post by: pities2004
Slayers kept the always wound on a 4+ or better, they retained the slayer axes, so they can use great weapon or two hands.
Slayers have a new ability that if the slayer dies in close combat (including stomps, but not impact hits) they get a free close combat attack back. This will also work with Slayers that have runic weapons, so lets say a Daemon slayer has some awesome runes, he gets all those bonuses.
Daemon Slayers Get D3 wounds to monsters and if the target of the daemon slayer must re-roll all successful ward saves.
Dragon Slayers get D3 wounds to monsters.
The Hero slayers also get the retaliation attack if they are killed.
Ungrim is WS 9, Str5, T6 with 4 attacks, his axe gives him +2 str so he's str 7 also with killing blow. He has a 4+ ward save (2+ against flaming) also has a 1+ armor save.
He is just wreck face.
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Post by: streetsamurai
Are the +1s on the charge, and randomly determined hatred rules true?
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Post by: Saldiven
pities2004 wrote:
Ungrim is WS 9, Str5, T6 with 4 attacks, his axe gives him +2 str so he's str 7 also with killing blow. He has a 4+ ward save (2+ against flaming) also has a 1+ armor save.
He is just wreck face.
Just need to correct some of this. Ungrim is totally awesome, but not quite that awesome.
Firstly, Ungrim is only S4 base, not S5. He does have a weapon that gives him +2S and Killing Blow. So, he's S6, or S7 on the charge. It's not a great weapon, so he swings at his normal I5.
He does not have a 1+ save. Ungrim has Gromril armor and an item called "The Slayer Crown." That item "adds +1 to Ungrim's armor save as well as +1 to his Toughness (which is already included in his profile)." Additionally, he has the "Drgon Cloak of Fyrskar" which grants him a 4+ ward save that improves to 2+ against hits with the Flaming Attack rule.
I assume that pities2004 misread the +1 to his armor save as 1+ armor save, but that would be an incorrect reading. Ungrim has a 3+/4++ (2++ vs flaming).
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
Saldiven wrote: pities2004 wrote:
Ungrim is WS 9, Str5, T6 with 4 attacks, his axe gives him +2 str so he's str 7 also with killing blow. He has a 4+ ward save (2+ against flaming) also has a 1+ armor save.
He is just wreck face.
Just need to correct some of this. Ungrim is totally awesome, but not quite that awesome.
Firstly, Ungrim is only S4 base, not S5. He does have a weapon that gives him +2S and Killing Blow. So, he's S6, or S7 on the charge. It's not a great weapon, so he swings at his normal I5.
He does not have a 1+ save. Ungrim has Gromril armor and an item called "The Slayer Crown." That item "adds +1 to Ungrim's armor save as well as +1 to his Toughness (which is already included in his profile)." Additionally, he has the "Drgon Cloak of Fyrskar" which grants him a 4+ ward save that improves to 2+ against hits with the Flaming Attack rule.
I assume that pities2004 misread the +1 to his armor save as 1+ armor save, but that would be an incorrect reading. Ungrim has a 3+/4++ (2++ vs flaming).
That is pretty amazing. Points?
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Post by: Saldiven
Yes.
It's funny; Dwarves are all apparently Daemons of Khorne (their Resolute rule is the same as the Daemon of Khorne rule).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CthuluIsSpy wrote:Saldiven wrote: pities2004 wrote:
Ungrim is WS 9, Str5, T6 with 4 attacks, his axe gives him +2 str so he's str 7 also with killing blow. He has a 4+ ward save (2+ against flaming) also has a 1+ armor save.
He is just wreck face.
Just need to correct some of this. Ungrim is totally awesome, but not quite that awesome.
Firstly, Ungrim is only S4 base, not S5. He does have a weapon that gives him +2S and Killing Blow. So, he's S6, or S7 on the charge. It's not a great weapon, so he swings at his normal I5.
He does not have a 1+ save. Ungrim has Gromril armor and an item called "The Slayer Crown." That item "adds +1 to Ungrim's armor save as well as +1 to his Toughness (which is already included in his profile)." Additionally, he has the "Drgon Cloak of Fyrskar" which grants him a 4+ ward save that improves to 2+ against hits with the Flaming Attack rule.
I assume that pities2004 misread the +1 to his armor save as 1+ armor save, but that would be an incorrect reading. Ungrim has a 3+/4++ (2++ vs flaming).
That is pretty amazing. Points?
175 skaven slaves.
Oh, I forgot one other thing. Some people may not think this is cool, but I like it. If Ungrim is your general, one of your Slayer units can take a runic standard of up to 50 skaven slaves in points. This makes it easier to fit in some of the better runic standards into your army. You could include the 5++ vs shooting on a Slayer unit, for example, while still having a BSB or Hammerer unit to take the +2 to dispel banner rune.
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Post by: godswildcard
Yep, I will be building a slayer army. Fact Jack.
I'm also picking up the Storm of Magic book from a friend, so my next project will be updating the slayer list in there to reflect 8th edition. No small task!
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Post by: Kanluwen
godswildcard wrote:Yep, I will be building a slayer army. Fact Jack.
I'm also picking up the Storm of Magic book from a friend, so my next project will be updating the slayer list in there to reflect 8th edition. No small task!
Quite, especially since "Storm of Chaos" is the book which has the Slayer list.
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Post by: Saldiven
I'm kicking around a Slayer list that looks something like this:
Ungrim
Runesmith (spell breaker talisman)
Runesmith (spell breakers x2 talisman)
20 Quarrellers (Great weapons)
25 Quarrellers (Great weapons)
39 Slayers (Standard bearer with Strollaz & Grungni)
40 Slayers (Standard bearer with Strollaz)
Grudge Thrower (Accuracy and Penetration)
Grudge Thrower (no runes; people play BotWD around here)
Leaves a few points open. The idea is to Vanguard up the two bricks of Slayers under their 5++ vs shooting ward. The Runesmiths stay with the two Quarrellers blocks. The Quarrellers and 'Throwers soften up units, then target units that aren't in combat. The Slayers should be in combat turn 2 at the latest, and being unbreakable, should stay there most of the game. The 45 greate weapon quarrellers clean up what's left.
At leas, that's the plan.
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Post by: pities2004
Both True
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Saldiven wrote: pities2004 wrote:
Ungrim is WS 9, Str5, T6 with 4 attacks, his axe gives him +2 str so he's str 7 also with killing blow. He has a 4+ ward save (2+ against flaming) also has a 1+ armor save.
He is just wreck face.
Just need to correct some of this. Ungrim is totally awesome, but not quite that awesome.
Firstly, Ungrim is only S4 base, not S5. He does have a weapon that gives him +2S and Killing Blow. So, he's S6, or S7 on the charge. It's not a great weapon, so he swings at his normal I5.
He does not have a 1+ save. Ungrim has Gromril armor and an item called "The Slayer Crown." That item "adds +1 to Ungrim's armor save as well as +1 to his Toughness (which is already included in his profile)." Additionally, he has the "Drgon Cloak of Fyrskar" which grants him a 4+ ward save that improves to 2+ against hits with the Flaming Attack rule.
I assume that pities2004 misread the +1 to his armor save as 1+ armor save, but that would be an incorrect reading. Ungrim has a 3+/4++ (2++ vs flaming).
Yeah whoops, got excited. he's still wreck face. Because he also gets all the slayer rules mentioned above.
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Post by: Ajroo
Hope Slayers will be good. I insisted on using them before so i'd like a reward for my persistance.
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Post by: godswildcard
 Kanluwen wrote:godswildcard wrote:Yep, I will be building a slayer army. Fact Jack.
I'm also picking up the Storm of Magic book from a friend, so my next project will be updating the slayer list in there to reflect 8th edition. No small task!
Quite, especially since "Storm of Chaos" is the book which has the Slayer list.
Yep! You got me! Meant Storm of Chaos. Although, now that I think about it, SoM would've been a perfect opportunity for GW to dust off the SoC Slayer list. This would've given the Dwarves something to take in the book, plus it makes sense fluff-wise. All those slayers gathering to fight powerful wizards, big monsters and get a good death!
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Post by: Saldiven
Ajroo wrote:Hope Slayers will be good. I insisted on using them before so i'd like a reward for my persistance.
They're ok, but not stellar. I can't say they're the best of the Special selections.
Their Deathblow rule helps mitigate their low Initiative to a degree; even if they get killed before I2, they still get to swing (except for deaths to Impact Hits). Heck, they even get some extra swings after getting Stomped on.
Haha...I kind of envision some Monster swinging a Thunderstomp on the Slayers, only to have the Deathblow swings deliver the final blows to kill said Monster.
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Post by: streetsamurai
SO, PRE order for the ironbreaker are up. What's the deal with theyr beard, are they supposed to be armored. And god, that drum is a mess. Otherwise, they seem rather cool, especially the hero
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Post by: Saldiven
 streetsamurai wrote:SO, PRE order for the ironbreaker are up. What's the deal with theyr beard, are they supposed to be armored. And god, that drum is a mess. Otherwise, they seem rather cool, especially the hero
It's what differentiates Irondrakes from Ironbreakers.
Ironbreakers will use the head that has the exposed face and beard.
In the fluff for the Irondrakes, they mention how dealing with the fiery missiles of their weapons resulted in hazardous beard ignitions, so they had to modify their helmets to put a fireproof barrier between the flammable beard hair and the weapon.
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Post by: TheyTarget
So anybody notice the Dwarf Thunderers / Quarrellers are in the rare section now? Is that because of rangers or am I missing something.
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Post by: Red_Zeke
TheyTarget wrote:So anybody notice the Dwarf Thunderers / Quarrellers are in the rare section now? Is that because of rangers or am I missing something.
Yes, because of rangers.
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Post by: Saldiven
 Red_Zeke wrote:TheyTarget wrote:So anybody notice the Dwarf Thunderers / Quarrellers are in the rare section now? Is that because of rangers or am I missing something.
Yes, because of rangers.
Personally, I'm using Avatars of War Pathfinders for Dwarf Rangers. They're eqipped appropriately with great weapons and crossbows, but the miniatures also come with hooded cloaks that make them look more like someone who would be sneaking through the woods. They're a little more expensive (I think $55 for 20 models, compared to $35 for 16 models), but not terribly so considering the quality of the finished product.
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Post by: timetowaste85
Is Gotrek in it? If not, I stand that the book is poo. Lol
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Post by: skullking
Yay! Slayer forces are a thing again!
Is the goblin hewer machine in the book this time?
I'm curious as to how many special characters are in the book? There's at least 2 new ones, right? And there's got to be a dozen older ones.
Is there only 1 new unit, and 1 new vehicle?
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Post by: godswildcard
 skullking wrote:Yay! Slayer forces are a thing again!
Is the goblin hewer machine in the book this time?
I'm curious as to how many special characters are in the book? There's at least 2 new ones, right? And there's got to be a dozen older ones.
Is there only 1 new unit, and 1 new vehicle?
Goblin Hewer isn't in the book, but it's very easy to field other parts of the SoC army list.
Strollaz rune on your banners gives you vanguard, while throwing a rune of sanctuary on there gives you MR 1. I made a list with 30 slayers and 15 Giant Slayers that looks like it will behave a lot like the old Karak Kadrin slayer lists.
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Post by: flamingkillamajig
 schadenfreude wrote:3 runes of battle=+2 combat res and an extra rank of iron breakers/hammerers gets to swing. Who needs to slow down an enemy's charge when charging that unit will be about as productive as smashing your face into a brick wall.
Was this rune combo possible with heavy shooty units like the iron drakes? I could imagine that being painful to face with those runes being stacked.
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Post by: Ehsteve
schadenfreude wrote:3 runes of battle=+2 combat res and an extra rank of iron breakers/hammerers gets to swing. Who needs to slow down an enemy's charge when charging that unit will be about as productive as smashing your face into a brick wall.
Not really. Dwarfs are I2 unless we're talking Hero/Lord here. So regardless of how many attacks they may get back, they still lack the ability to get first blood in any combat they participate in apart from Lizardmen. A 4+ armour save won't cut it against a dedicated CC unit, so they're still an army with high-cost elite units which lack the one critical feature that would allow them to compete with other armies on that level. If they have a 3+, they're hitting at S4, which is lacklustre, if they have a 4+ sure it's S6, but that's ASL, so even Lizardmen will get to strike before them.
You're essentially required to get Stubborn in some way in order to make sure that the elite units don't break, mainly because they're such a massive points sink. The one thing they have going for them is that they are still have the capacity of holding units in place and grind them down, but against a unit of say...zombies or other flak unit with Steadfast that are far cheaper, your units will never get the chance to make their points back. Cannons and cheap Steadfast are still king in 8thed.
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Post by: sonofruss
I am guessing no rules for the slayer pirates yet one more addition they sit in the mini box 
Forgot to post this as well
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Post by: Kanluwen
The Slayer Pirates are no longer listed on the GW webstore(along with Mengil's Manflayers, sadly...perfect stand-in Shades!) so I think it's safe to say they are kaput.
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Post by: Kroothawk
To be fair, the Slayer Pirate blister is still listed as "expected to dispatch within 4 weeks", code for cast on demand.
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat500015a&prodId=prod1140013
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Post by: gianlucafiorentini123
Is it just me or does the front of that battleline box look really empty?
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Post by: Kanluwen
Not on the US website they're not.
"Expected to dispatch within 4 weeks" by the way is not just 'code for cast on demand' but for 'we might still have some in the warehouse somewhere' as well.
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Post by: Herzlos
If anyone's got the Army book, can you tell me if it's still got Bolt Throwers in the list? I'm waiting for my FLGS to get it in.
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Post by: Erzanj
It definitly feels... underwhelming :(. If I were a new customer, I wouldn't find it very enticing (especially with such a price on it).
They made a strange choice there. Why didn't they take a closer shot so that the stunties fill the entire picture ?
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Post by: JHall
Yes, Bolt Throwers are still in the list.
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Post by: Herzlos
Excellent, thanks. Worth using? Automatically Appended Next Post:  Erzanj wrote:
It definitly feels... underwhelming :(. If I were a new customer, I wouldn't find it very enticing (especially with such a price on it).
They made a strange choice there. Why didn't they take a closer shot so that the stunties fill the entire picture ?
I agree, it's such a bad shot it makes the army look pretty empty. I wonder if they were following some mandate to include more terrain in the pictures or something though.
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Post by: Alpharius
 sonofruss wrote:I am guessing no rules for the slayer pirates yet one more addition they sit in the mini box
Forgot to post this as well
The Grand Army of Zhufbar 1- Click Collection includes: 1 Belegar Ironhammer, 1 Grim Burloksson, 1 Runelord with staff, 1 Dragon Slayer, 32 Dwarf Warriors, 16 Thunderers, 60 Longbeards/Hammerers, 50 Ironbreakers/Irondrakes, 4 Gyrocopters, 1 Cannon and 1 Dwarf Battleline of 59 miniatures.
It can be yours for the low GW Full Retail Price of $1103.00.
And that's pretty much why I won't be starting a Dwarf army.
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Post by: Kanluwen
 Alpharius wrote: sonofruss wrote:I am guessing no rules for the slayer pirates yet one more addition they sit in the mini box
Forgot to post this as well
The Grand Army of Zhufbar 1- Click Collection includes: 1 Belegar Ironhammer, 1 Grim Burloksson, 1 Runelord with staff, 1 Dragon Slayer, 32 Dwarf Warriors, 16 Thunderers, 60 Longbeards/Hammerers, 50 Ironbreakers/Irondrakes, 4 Gyrocopters, 1 Cannon and 1 Dwarf Battleline of 59 miniatures.
It can be yours for the low GW Full Retail Price of $1103.00.
And that's pretty much why I won't be starting a Dwarf army.
That's a 4000 point army according to White Dwarf, Alph.
Most people aren't going to be playing at those points levels--and the list is built almost purely around the new kits.
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Post by: Alpharius
So, to get down to 2500 points we'll shave, what, $250 off of that?
Still in "No Thanks!" territory.
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Post by: RoninXiC
Which of the two units are the heavily armoured and which one are the Longbeards? They look EXACTLY THE SAME from such a distance.
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Post by: RiTides
Book seems interesting. When 9th edition his next year, if allies get added a force of dwarfs allied with ogres could let me field all my chaos dwarf units in one rulebook based army. Unless they aren't allowed to ally  . Guess I'll find out when the time comes... unfortunately as cool as the dwarf book is, you really can't represent a full chaos dwarf list with it alone.
Basic dwarfs with great weapons seem pretty good for 10 points a pop, to me... there are likely some pretty nasty combos lurking with all those rune options, as well.
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Post by: Flashman
GW wrote:59 miniatures for £100!
Not really a massive discount here. You're basically only getting 4 Warriors, 4 Thunderers and the Runelord for free.
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Post by: Kanluwen
 Flashman wrote:GW wrote:59 miniatures for £100!
Not really a massive discount here. You're basically only getting 4 Warriors, 4 Thunderers and the Runelord for free.
That's a fair point, Flashman but one issue is that right now Warriors and Thunderers/Quarrelers are sold 16 to a box for $35 USD rather than 10 at some silly price point so doing an exact "price breakdown" is kind of difficult.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
It's 250$ in Canada. *shudders*
I'm moving to Australia.
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Post by: streetsamurai
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Post by: dlust1
so 200 in Canada, 250 in Australia and 290 in New Zealand? holy crap, no wonder people are crapping on gamesworkshop so much, It cant be that much more expensive to ship there than here Automatically Appended Next Post: Herzlos wrote:
Excellent, thanks. Worth using?
i think they are for the points cost and potential damage they can bring
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Post by: silent25
Flashman wrote:GW wrote:59 miniatures for £100!
Not really a massive discount here. You're basically only getting 4 Warriors, 4 Thunderers and the Runelord for free.
It is a 21% savings. I would say that is a rather good discount. Combine with typical 20% discount from retailers and it is nearly 37% discount off retail.
@Alpharius: What type of army are you looking at (shooting, combat, etc) and what is your budget? Those Battleline boxes are a good base. Two of those would make a solid starting army and bare bones works out to nearly1700 pts from the old book. And that is without any rune to enhance the units and assume the characters are basic rune smiths. Tool them up and you can easily reach 2000. Add in a lord on a shield and gyrocopter and you would be good to go at 2500.
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Post by: plastictrees
Not a huge fan of the Warrior sculpts myself. Can you just have Longbeards as your core?
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Post by: Triple_double_U
Yeah Longbeards are core - and the restriction on them from the old book is gone too. So you can have as many of them as you want
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Post by: plastictrees
In years gone by I would have picked up the army book to whet my appetite and play around with lists before buying in to the army. At $60, that's not happening.
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Post by: CommanderRyalis
Triple_double_U wrote:Yeah Longbeards are core - and the restriction on them from the old book is gone too. So you can have as many of them as you want
Yeah I haven't looked through the book yet, but yeah the old rule was no more that 50% of your warriors could be upgraded to longbeards, unless you had I think High King Thorgrim grudge bearer then he allowed you to take 50% + 1 additional unit.
That's good to know.
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Post by: Azreal13
Trolltrader posted this image on their FB page.
I really hope the bomber is the way for you guys to go, because £28 for that is a new low for GW IMHO.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
Wow. It's the size of a paint pot. "Gyro-Cockpit" indeed.
AUD$60 as well. Bargain!
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Post by: AlexHolker
Good lord, they're getting worse. What's the next one, just a hollow facade shaped like the front of an aircraft?
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
I think someone said it earlier, and now I have to agree. It looks like a happy meal toy.
It'd look more at home in Rivet Wars than in WFB.
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Post by: Medium of Death
You only get one?
I mean they should have included enough parts to at least make two or one bomber at the very least.
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Post by: Alpharius
 azreal13 wrote:Trolltrader posted this image on their FB page.
I really hope the bomber is the way for you guys to go, because £28 for that is a new low for GW IMHO.
A picture really is worth a thousand words...
...wow.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
And the model's not worth sixty dollars...
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Post by: Bolognesus
O_O!
That makes what the recasters charge seem expensive, never mind the actual plastic price...
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Post by: Schmapdi
Yowza - and here I thought that gyrocopter was actually somewhat reasonably priced. That's way smaller than it appeared in the promo pics.
I guess being on the flight stands made them look bigger than they were. Very disappointing, but I guess should have been expected.
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Post by: Alpharius
I in no way thought the Gyrocopter was that small.
Now I am REALLY looking forward to the third party versions.
Titan Forge, Avatars of War, etc.
Bring 'em on!
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Post by: Azreal13
They posted a second shot, because some of the "true believers" accused them of photoshopping!!
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Post by: plastictrees
GWs new four liter paint pots are huge!
Not sure why this is surprising. We knew that was a dwarf in there. Still a bit shocking somehow.
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Post by: Alpharius
So...not surprising but instead, shocking?
OK!
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
And seeing as though it's just gyro-copter, and not a Citadel™ Miniatures™ Dwarf™ Gyro™-™Copter™, anyone can make one. Some of us are eternal optimists and like to believe the best in people, and therefore they're quite surprised when a company charges $60 for a happy meal toy.
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Post by: RiTides
 plastictrees wrote:GWs new four liter paint pots are huge!
Not sure why this is surprising. We knew that was a dwarf in there. Still a bit shocking somehow.
I agree... I should've known better, but man, that is small. Actually kind of a cute model in that light, though
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Post by: Alpharius
It is kind of growing on me, and I'm liking it more and more, but that size, at that price?
I can't justify it.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
Amazingly, despite how much of a fad it is, through the power of the Internet I actually found a pic of that toy I was referring to:
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Post by: plastictrees
I am both layered and nuanced.
Any alternative Gyrocopters out there?
I really do like the GW mini, but, yeah.
Keep trying to jump through hoops to justify a Dwarf army here. The new infantry is just awesome. Automatically Appended Next Post:  H.B.M.C. wrote:Amazingly, despite how much of a fad it is, through the power of the Internet I actually found a pic of that toy I was referring to:
Did you find one next to a citadel paint pot?
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
From the top of Launchpad McQuack's head to the bottom of his itty bitty plane is, IIRC, about the same height as a GW paint pot.
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Post by: plastictrees
H.B.M.C. wrote:From the top of Launchpad McQuack's head to the bottom of his itty bitty plane is, IIRC, about the same height as a GW paint pot.
I appreciate you opening this very specific window in to your childhood.
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Post by: d-usa
So I can get three of those, or I can get a Knight?
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
I can't tell if you're being sincere or if you're being a condescending jerk, but either way, you're very welcome.  d-usa wrote:So I can get three of those, or I can get a Knight?
Or get one of each, and use the Gyro-Cockpit as the Knight's head. It's probably the right size. 
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Post by: fidel
Alright lets do this bearded fellows - find us links to miniatures that can replace the gyrocopter
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Post by: plastictrees
H.B.M.C. wrote:
I can't tell if you're being sincere or if you're being a condescending jerk, but either way, you're very welcome.
You wound me. I take trivial nostalgia very seriously and have the Roboto action figure to prove it.
New Gyrocopter idea...origami using three $20 bills.
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Post by: Nicky J
fidel wrote:Alright lets do this bearded fellows - find us links to miniatures that can replace the gyrocopter
only one i'm aware of:
http://www.blacktreedesign.com/uk/product.php?productid=23704&cat=2314&bestseller=Y
not exactly amazing, but quite a bit cheaper!
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Post by: Azazelx
Very reminiscent of the originals, though.
I'm disappointed with the Dwarf releases. I'd have liked to see more new kits and perhaps even a better army box deal than the one they have. I'll have to see what Felix does, I guess...
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Post by: AllSeeingSkink
I never expected them to be larger than a Terradon given the pictures we had. That's why I was surprised when they weren't cheaper or simply 3 to a box like Terradons.
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Post by: Schmapdi
As little as they are - they definitely should have been 3 for $60 like the Terradons.
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Post by: AlexHolker
Huh. I searched on Google for a chibi chinook helicopter, and that is not what I was expecting.
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Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
I still really like them,
but no chance of me actually buying one
way to small for the price which was always going to be the problem for multikitting it with the larger gyrobomber
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Post by: RiTides
Titan Forge are releasing a smaller version of this Zeppelin, shown below, that sounded like a good price (Kickstarter backers can get for 3 for 360 points, if I recall correctly? Which is about $10 apiece). They have yet to preview the smaller version, here is the large version as WIP:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1693348960/metal-beards-tabletop-dwarf-army/posts/741647
360 view gives a much better idea of it, as well:
https://d2pq0u4uni88oo.cloudfront.net/assets/001/609/973/cf5f9441e45dcf2410a36645898f1118_h264_high.mp4
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Post by: pretre
I'm not saying they aren't expensive, but isn't that the size of the current gyrocopter? It isn't like they made it smaller or something...
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Post by: Accolade
Argh, seeing that gryrocopter-paint pot size comparison is frustrating.
I really like the new dwarves, the idea of building up a medium-size dwarf army to fight against Skaven or perhaps demons is giving me some Dwarf Fortress vibes, a la sending dwarves into the mountain to be slaughtered by numberless foes. 
Heck, I was thinking this release would be the force to finally bump me away from 40k and into starting fantasy. I'm a big fan of the dwarf aesthetics. But $45 for one copter the size of a mini stapler...sigh...I mean I get that they're trying to fill out the whole range with these dual kits, but the trade-off is a massive bump in cost for the smaller version. Plus the Longbeards are expensive for core because again, flexibility of options.
I just can't justify it. Before buying a model or tank with a $45 price tag would have gotten me maybe a leery eye from my lady, but now if she saw a model that was as small as the gyrocopter and I told her it was $45 for plastic, she'd look at me like I was a complete buffoon.
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Post by: pities2004
It's small, but it's not suppose to be huge?
Gyrocopters are just ways to get from hold to hold and be in the occasional battle.
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Post by: caylentor
 pretre wrote:I'm not saying they aren't expensive, but isn't that the size of the current gyrocopter? It isn't like they made it smaller or something...
Unless I'm mis-remembering, I'm pretty sure it was about 3 modern paint pots long.
EDIT:
It's on a 40mm base.
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Post by: Accolade
So, pulling up the price of the metal kit on the GW site sets it at $33.
The best size comparison I could find was on the Bugman Brewery site, given this kit has the cockpit extended to twice its size, but it is shown next to a paint pot.
EDIT: ninja'd by caylentor
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Post by: pretre
I guess I'll wait to see them side by side. 33 to 60 is a big jump though. edit: Oh wait, he must have been talking AU prices. $45 for US is still a jump. Also, that seems to be the small version of the gyro: and base comparison So it's basically about the same mass, but less gangly. Got it. And $12 more expensive.
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Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
It's back to about the size of the original Dwarf gyrocopter, which in itself isn't a bad thing,
it's just the price that's the issue since it's duel kitted with the gyrobomber.
If they'd given 3 (or even 2) for that price it would be bareable
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Post by: Alpharius
That's the GyroBOMBER, the tiny one is the new GyroCOPTER.
Tiny...
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Post by: pretre
Alpharius wrote:That's the GyroBOMBER, the tiny one is the new GyroCOPTER.
Tiny...
Yeah, I edited it up. Still that explains why the kit is more expensive, probably. Although that's one of those 'what if I didn't want a gyrobomber' things. /shrug
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Post by: Alpharius
This would've been nicer/better received if it was like the Terradons kit - 3 in the box.
Even if it was 'only' with the ability to make two Copters and one Bomber too...
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Post by: AlexHolker
Lord Dan over on Warseer decided to take the paint pot-sized Gyrocopter and run with it:
Image 1
Image 2
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Post by: notprop
It's like you'd have to be a short arse to actually fit in the thing!
I'm not sold on the Gyrocopter but then I've never really been a fan of its previous iterations - the stripped down original was probably the best. I don't think size is the issue with this model.
I think I'll be looking for a ballon or a blimp to convert one for my army.
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Post by: Alpharius
Awesome!
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