I'm totally on board with Capaldi as the Doctor! He has done a lot of excellent work in his time - he was BRILLIANT in The Thick of It. And while I'm a big Matt Smith fan, I'm pretty excited by the rumors that Capaldi's going to be a much more old-school Doctor - grumpy and mysterious and more than a little fierce.
That raptor stare Capaldi gave in the 50th was amazing. It was also good to know that he has been a life long super fan of the show, and hearing him talk about what it was like finding out he was the next Doctor really made me look forward to his run.
Matt Smith will always be my favorite, being the Doctor that really drew me into the show, followed closely by Patrick Troughton (I wish Netflix had more of what is left of his series) who I enjoyed most of the classic doctors as I devoured whatever episodes I could from the classic era.
Ecclestone didn't get long enough, but had possibly the most consistent run of quality in his one season.
Tennant and Smith both had a lot more to work with, and at their best, both performed exceptionally well. Smith had some bad writing in his last series, but the 50th and Christmas special were a great send-off for him. If I had to pick just one to watch, though, Tennant would edge it.
Also, you're missing John Hurt! He counts, dammit!
I eagerly await Peter C as the Doctor, I think he's going to bring a kind of dark gravitas to the role that we haven't had since Tom Baker, which will make a nice change from the manic eccentric we've had so far. The costume we've seen so far is also cool, very down to earth and practical. I'm also hoping that him being older will cut down on the Doctor-Companion near-romance that has really run its course and in a lot of ways really annoys me.
All in all, I can't wait. The first full run in a couple of years, the possibility of The Master returning, a new doctor and a whole new arc waiting for us. Series 7 was a bit iffy in the latter half (although there were some real crackers) but the last two specials have restored my faith. I think this new series will mark a change of direction, hopefully for the better.
Besides, haw can you not love a character whose first lines are to complain about the colour of his kidneys and then crash a time machine?
Eh, I liked the doctor as that silly, random, and eccentric guy that looked like he was travelling time and space mostly for the lulz. It was what I was used to.
I've never seen the older Doctor Who episodes, so this will be a different change for me. I'm a bit curious as to how this will turn out.
Paradigm wrote: Besides, haw can you not love a character whose first lines are to complain about the colour of his kidneys and then crash a time machine?
SkavenLord wrote: Eh, I liked the doctor as that silly, random, and eccentric guy that looked like he was travelling time and space mostly for the lulz. It was what I was used to. .
Oh, I agree, that version of the character was great, and very well handled by Smith and Tennant. I just think it's time to move on from that now, maybe bring back a little more of the darkness that some of the earlier characters had. In the same way that Tennant's light-heartedness worked after Ecclestone's anger, contrast helps set up a new iteration of the character.
I eagerly await Peter C as the Doctor, I think he's going to bring a kind of dark gravitas to the role that we haven't had since Tom Baker, which will make a nice change from the manic eccentric we've had so far. The costume we've seen so far is also cool, very down to earth and practical. I'm also hoping that him being older will cut down on the Doctor-Companion near-romance that has really run its course and in a lot of ways really annoys me.
All in all, I can't wait. The first full run in a couple of years, the possibility of The Master returning, a new doctor and a whole new arc waiting for us. Series 7 was a bit iffy in the latter half (although there were some real crackers) but the last two specials have restored my faith. I think this new series will mark a change of direction, hopefully for the better.
Well, goin gby the set photos I've seen of Capaldi's Doctor being hugged by Clara, you won't have any worries there. He was visibly recoiling/looking really put-off and confused. Kinda like how I respond to unexpected hugs.
And if we get to see The Master again, please please please let him be played by Charles Dance. That would be INSANELY amazing.
Dance as The Master would be great, again potentially a huge contrast to the (great) John Simm version that would work really well with Capaldi.
And yes, those on-set shots do give me some hope. They're apparently bringing in a boyfriend character for Clara, but that's at least slightly less annoying than her excessively flirty relationship with Doctor 11 (or is that 12 now? Or 13? ) In all honesty, I'm hoping Clara goes at the end of this series, she's been better since she stopping being a plot point (seriously, after 'The Doctor-Donna','The Girl Who Waited' and 'The Impossible Girl', it would be nice to have a companion who is a character rather than a plot arc )
Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote: I'm totally on board with Capaldi as the Doctor! He has done a lot of excellent work in his time - he was BRILLIANT in The Thick of It. And while I'm a big Matt Smith fan, I'm pretty excited by the rumors that Capaldi's going to be a much more old-school Doctor - grumpy and mysterious and more than a little fierce.
~Tim?
For Me, I have never seen a single movie or show with hime in it. He sounds pretty good though!
SkavenLord wrote: Eh, I liked the doctor as that silly, random, and eccentric guy that looked like he was travelling time and space mostly for the lulz. It was what I was used to.
.
Oh, I agree, that version of the character was great, and very well handled by Smith and Tennant. I just think it's time to move on from that now, maybe bring back a little more of the darkness that some of the earlier characters had. In the same way that Tennant's light-heartedness worked after Ecclestone's anger, contrast helps set up a new iteration of the character.
Oh, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I'm actually looking forward to it. Like I said though, I never saw the older doctors so this will be quite the change for me.
Just at a curiosity, what were the older doctors like?
I really hope they don't use the Daleks or Cybermen this time round
they've been overused since the new run started
(I understand why as they've paid for the FX and don't have anything like the budget of a big US show, but still much as I like them the both need a rest)
SkavenLord wrote: Eh, I liked the doctor as that silly, random, and eccentric guy that looked like he was travelling time and space mostly for the lulz. It was what I was used to.
.
Oh, I agree, that version of the character was great, and very well handled by Smith and Tennant. I just think it's time to move on from that now, maybe bring back a little more of the darkness that some of the earlier characters had. In the same way that Tennant's light-heartedness worked after Ecclestone's anger, contrast helps set up a new iteration of the character.
Oh, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I'm actually looking forward to it. Like I said though, I never saw the older doctors so this will be quite the change for me.
Just at a curiosity, what were the older doctors like?
Ok, brief history:
Doc 1: Old eccentric who got increasingly cranky, very much a thinking man rather than a man of action (his companion tended to fill this role)
Doc 2: Younger, rather more light-hearted, but still a little irritable.
Doc 3: Older again, very scientific but also did a lot of combat stuff (Venusian Karate, Hiyaaa!) and worked with UNIT a lot.
Doc 4: Younger, very cheerful but capable of taking a darker streak, very adventurous.
Doc 5: Not seen much of him, but again younger, and rather active. Rather funny at times.
Doc 6: Fairly young, very funny and light-hearted but could be a little harsh or sarcastic.
Doc 7: Older, (Scottish!) pretty dark at times, but also exceptionally funny (and the only man to scream 'UNLIMITED RICE PUDDING at the Daleks)
Doc 8: Only in the 1996 film and the 2013 'Night of the Doctor' short. Pretty active and eccentric, also a bit of an idealist and not so dark.
There you go. Obviously, there's more to it than that, but that's the basics.
(I understand why as they've paid for the FX and don't have anything like the budget of a big US show, but still much as I like them the both need a rest)
The only thing I hope for with both of these series of characters is that they get rid of the "Skittles Daleks" and bring Cybermen back more inline with previous generations... instead of "delete" and "upgrade in progress" have them go more old school with their lines... Previously, the completely understood a human death and wished nothing more than to kill the Doctor.
(I understand why as they've paid for the FX and don't have anything like the budget of a big US show, but still much as I like them the both need a rest)
The only thing I hope for with both of these series of characters is that they get rid of the "Skittles Daleks" and bring Cybermen back more inline with previous generations... instead of "delete" and "upgrade in progress" have them go more old school with their lines... Previously, the completely understood a human death and wished nothing more than to kill the Doctor.
See, I think aesthetically the bronze NSD was the best incarnation by a long way, but then they followed it up with the horrible multiple-coloured blobs, which I hate with a passion. The storylines have also gone down in quality since Dalek and Bad Wolf/The Parting of the Ways.
Cybermen on the other hand, having not seen the classic episodes, I feel like Age of Steel/Rise of the Cybermen were my favourites so far. The last story with the Cybermen in, Nightmare in Silver, was some horrible atrocity which killed my interest in the new design, which is a shame, because it's a decent redesign from an aesthetic viewpoint.
My opinion on the subject is essentially "Go back to the beginning, or quit using them, you bastards!".
(I understand why as they've paid for the FX and don't have anything like the budget of a big US show, but still much as I like them the both need a rest)
The only thing I hope for with both of these series of characters is that they get rid of the "Skittles Daleks" and bring Cybermen back more inline with previous generations... instead of "delete" and "upgrade in progress" have them go more old school with their lines... Previously, the completely understood a human death and wished nothing more than to kill the Doctor.
See, I think aesthetically the bronze NSD was the best incarnation by a long way, but then they followed it up with the horrible multiple-coloured blobs, which I hate with a passion. The storylines have also gone down in quality since Dalek and Bad Wolf/The Parting of the Ways.
Cybermen on the other hand, having not seen the classic episodes, I feel like Age of Steel/Rise of the Cybermen were my favourites so far. The last story with the Cybermen in, Nightmare in Silver, was some horrible atrocity which killed my interest in the new design, which is a shame, because it's a decent redesign from an aesthetic viewpoint.
My opinion on the subject is essentially "Go back to the beginning, or quit using them, you bastards!".
The strange thing is, since series 5, they've been going back to having the bronze Daleks- the ones in 'Asylum of the Daleks' were about 90% bronze ones with the new abominations (or the Teletubby Daleks as I call them). I agree that the bronze were the best ever, even ahead of the awesome gunmetal grey in Genesis of the Daleks.
Nightmare in Silver was just that, a nightmare, and so far, one of only 2 episodes in the last series I can't find to have any redeeming features. (The other is Rings of Akhaten, everything else had at least something good about it). I mean, the Cybermen are not Borg, they can't just adapt to any weapon instantly. The redesign was all right, but not as cool as the Rise of the Cybermen ones.
Apparently, they are going to try and explain his previous Dr Who appearance in the plot, which might work, but does make me slightly nervous. There's been too much wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey recently, and being convoluted for the sake of it, so I hope that goes away.
I lost interest a while ago. My problems with Dr Who, when I gave up on it, were never anything to do with the actor so I don't think a change of actor is going to fix it for me.
Nicorex wrote: I would like to see a season about the life and times of John Hurt's Doctor.
This would indeed be awesome. The brief shots of the Time War in Day of the Doctor prove they can make it look great, and a more grimdark iteration of Dr Who would fill the Torchwood gap nicely. It could even be a show with a different main cast in which The Doctor (and maybe even The Master and Rassilon) only show up occasionally, just more of the Time War would be great.
Even better, though, would be a proper series for Paul McGann, about the start of the Time War and how he runs from it. At some point he could even regenerate into John Hurt (as per Night of the Doctor) and go from there.
I imagine both Hurt and McGann would do it in a flash, but the BBC probably wouldn't get behind t.
Not a Dr. Who fan. I'm not throwing rocks at anyone who likes the show, but it's one of those aspects of geek culture I just can't seem to get into. I watched sporadic episodes as a child, and pretty much all the Eccleston episodes, but after that I've just kind of not been able to hang.
Don't enjoy rotating casts and rotating cast members.
Not really a big fan of British television.
Really dislike time travel stories in general.
So, three strikes, and I'm out. I mean, none of my opinions reflect on the show's objective quality (which, I suppose, must be positive, given the high degree of fan support it enjoys), it's just not my personal cup of tea.
Still, I might give it a shot if the Doctor regenerated as a woman. Or someone who wasn't white as the driven snow.
I'd think John Hurt & the time war provide a perfect opportunity for another film
lots and action/explosions/daleks etc
no need to any time travel complications etc as none of the previous incarnations knew about him I(maybe Paul McGan if the want to include him although I suspect regeneration would be a harder sell for a non-dr who fan audience)
no human companions (although he could have had and sacrificed them
the only tricky bit would be the timelords are loosing and that might make it a hard sell
Nicorex wrote: I would like to see a season about the life and times of John Hurt's Doctor.
This would indeed be awesome. The brief shots of the Time War in Day of the Doctor prove they can make it look great, and a more grimdark iteration of Dr Who would fill the Torchwood gap nicely. It could even be a show with a different main cast in which The Doctor (and maybe even The Master and Rassilon) only show up occasionally, just more of the Time War would be great.
Even better, though, would be a proper series for Paul McGann, about the start of the Time War and how he runs from it. At some point he could even regenerate into John Hurt (as per Night of the Doctor) and go from there.
I imagine both Hurt and McGann would do it in a flash, but the BBC probably wouldn't get behind t.
Someone give this man a job. A multiple season show with a fixed end point and number of seasons would be awesome, especially if it were essentially split in half, with Paul McGann taking the beginning, and John Hurt the end.
Of course, it's not going to happen, but damn, would that be awesome.
So, three strikes, and I'm out. I mean, none of my opinions reflect on the show's objective quality (which, I suppose, must be positive, given the high degree of fan support it enjoys), it's just not my personal cup of tea.
Still, I might give it a shot if the Doctor regenerated as a woman. Or someone who wasn't white as the driven snow.
There are people out there who White Knight for DW as hard as some on this very forum white knight for GW
I also think it'd be awesome to have the Doctor regenerate as a woman, or some other minority (as it's in the canon that this can/does sometimes happen)
So, three strikes, and I'm out. I mean, none of my opinions reflect on the show's objective quality (which, I suppose, must be positive, given the high degree of fan support it enjoys), it's just not my personal cup of tea.
Still, I might give it a shot if the Doctor regenerated as a woman. Or someone who wasn't white as the driven snow.
There are people out there who White Knight for DW as hard as some on this very forum white knight for GW
I also think it'd be awesome to have the Doctor regenerate as a woman, or some other minority (as it's in the canon that this can/does sometimes happen)
The debate has been done to death, but I really don't think the Doctor needs to be a woman or a minority unless the actor that is best for the role fits in those categories. If a black actor performs best at auditions then no one would have a problem with it, but going to the casting process with the idea that 'we're looking for a black actor' is the wrong way of going about it. Age/gender/race ect needn't come into it; the only criteria should be whether or not the actor/actress in question is good enough for the role.
Selecting an actor based on gender/race would actually devalue the casting, as it would be little more than a PC token gesture.
Paradigm wrote: The debate has been done to death, but I really don't think the Doctor needs to be a woman or a minority unless the actor that is best for the role fits in those categories. If a black actor performs best at auditions then no one would have a problem with it, but going to the casting process with the idea that 'we're looking for a black actor' is the wrong way of going about it. Age/gender/race ect needn't come into it; the only criteria should be whether or not the actor/actress in question is good enough for the role.
Selecting an actor based on gender/race would actually devalue the casting, as it would be little more than a PC token gesture.
I completely agree, but thus far, I don't think they've had an "open casting call" for the role of the Doctor... Also, I'm not entirely convinced that Moffat or Gatniss could write a female doctor.
Gatiss maybe, Moffat probably not. If you look at all the female characters he's written (Amy Pond, River Song, Clara, and Irene Adler in Sherlock) they're all very much similar characters. In all honesty, I'm hoping Moffat steps down at the end of this coming series, it's time for a new head (preferably Gatiss, or Toby Whithouse)
Paradigm wrote: Gatiss maybe, Moffat probably not. If you look at all the female characters he's written (Amy Pond, River Song, Clara, and Irene Adler in Sherlock) they're all very much similar characters. In all honesty, I'm hoping Moffat steps down at the end of this coming series, it's time for a new head (preferably Gatiss, or Toby Whithouse)
Amy, River and Clara are all also primarily plot points, which is really irritating. I have no problem with Karen Gillan or Jenna Coleman, but good grief, is it so hard to write a normal female character?
River Song was just plain annoying. The idea of time travellers going in opposite directions was pretty cool, but I hated her character by the fourth/fifth episode.
(I understand why as they've paid for the FX and don't have anything like the budget of a big US show, but still much as I like them the both need a rest)
The only thing I hope for with both of these series of characters is that they get rid of the "Skittles Daleks" and bring Cybermen back more inline with previous generations... instead of "delete" and "upgrade in progress" have them go more old school with their lines... Previously, the completely understood a human death and wished nothing more than to kill the Doctor.
I hate the feel of the new Cybermen. Not crazy about their looks, either. I mean, yeah, they look well-made and professionally done (unlike some older costumes) but they don't look like cyborgs. they look like robots. Believe it or not, the super-cheap ski mask and scotch tape costume from Tenth Planet actually was the best costume, in my opinion. You could see the actors' hands and (most importantly) their eyes. It really helped to drive home that these things were not robots; they were originally people and that they planned to make everybody on Earth into more of them.
"Delete." feh. "Upgrade the universe." bah.
Not a patch on the much more chilling "You belong to us. You will become like us."
My main problem with the Nightmare in Silver Cyberman episode in the last series is not so much the 'delete' malarkey (which could be explained in the 2006-2012 versions as them being alternate-earth Cybermen with a slightly different take on the idea) but the whole 'upgrade in progress' thing, where they acquire an almost Borg-like ability to 'assimilate' to any weapon, and basically become invincible.
That, combined with the stupid 'the Doctor fights himself so he doesn't get a Cyber-brain' (great performance by Smith, but very poorly written and explained) and the super-speed which was just stupid put that episode firmly in the 'worst ever' category (along with tragedies such as 'Love and Monsters' and 'The Rings of Akhaten')
From my FB feed, apparently 12 and Clara were on set in Wales, with a bunch of Cybermen extras.... guess it should be obvious, we're not done with the silver dudes.
More Cybermen... the promise of redemption or further annihilation hangs heavy in the air.
Still, if they do fix it, it'll make a nice change from Daleks (I have nothing against Daleks, and can't think of a bad Dalek episode since 2005, but they're a little overused)
I want Craig Ferguson as the Doctor. Tired of the Doctor always being portrayed as a proper brit type. Would be fun to have the Doctor go through a coarse Scottish phase. Heck, make him an Aussie, a Kiwi, a Canadian or even a Kanuck(French Canadian).
Also, maybe he could have seasons that focused on continents other than Europe.
I await the cries of heresy at my suggestions.
Seriously though, Ferguson could pull of a working-class Scottish Doctor that has a healthy dose of Tom Baker's quirkyness.
Captain Avatar wrote: I want Craig Ferguson as the Doctor. Tired of the Doctor always being portrayed as a proper brit type. Would be fun to have the Doctor go through a coarse Scottish phase. Heck, make him an Aussie, a Kiwi, a Canadian or even a Kanuck(French Canadian).
Also, maybe he could have seasons that focused on continents other than Europe.
I await the cries of heresy at my suggestions.
Seriously though, Ferguson could pull of a working-class Scottish Doctor that has a healthy dose of Tom Baker's quirkyness.
Captain Avatar wrote: I want Craig Ferguson as the Doctor. Tired of the Doctor always being portrayed as a proper brit type. Would be fun to have the Doctor go through a coarse Scottish phase. Heck, make him an Aussie, a Kiwi, a Canadian or even a Kanuck(French Canadian).
Also, maybe he could have seasons that focused on continents other than Europe.
I await the cries of heresy at my suggestions.
Seriously though, Ferguson could pull of a working-class Scottish Doctor that has a healthy dose of Tom Baker's quirkyness.
I'm just SOOO glad that they've made him much older than his companion; I always found the prospect that the doctor looked like he was going to screw a companion appalling with my first doctors being Tom Baker and John Pertwee, two doctors who had a bit of a sting to them rather than this guilt ridden "I'm not worthy" Tennant and Smith crap. As much as I want to like Tennant (not so much smith, bloody oik) It really put me off, all of that soap opera crap
Paradigm wrote:Gatiss maybe, Moffat probably not. If you look at all the female characters he's written (Amy Pond, River Song, Clara, and Irene Adler in Sherlock) they're all very much similar characters. In all honesty, I'm hoping Moffat steps down at the end of this coming series, it's time for a new head (preferably Gatiss, or Toby Whithouse)
Moffatt in my opinion is a good choice for Sherlock where he only has to do 3 episodes a season but when he has to write 13 episodes with a season long plot he really can't hack it without Russel T. Davies around
Paradigm wrote:
New teaser. Sounds... Daleky! Almost a bit Davros at the beginning... which would be awesome.
Oh yay more Davros, not like he got blown up at all last time round And my expectations for this season have dropped through the floor
Paradigm wrote:Gatiss maybe, Moffat probably not. If you look at all the female characters he's written (Amy Pond, River Song, Clara, and Irene Adler in Sherlock) they're all very much similar characters. In all honesty, I'm hoping Moffat steps down at the end of this coming series, it's time for a new head (preferably Gatiss, or Toby Whithouse)
Moffatt in my opinion is a good choice for Sherlock where he only has to do 3 episodes a season but when he has to write 13 episodes with a season long plot he really can't hack it without Russel T. Davies around
Well, he only really does abour 5-6 a season, only edits the rest. Same with Sherlock, he usually only does one. But he does have control of the overall plot in both, and particularly in Who he has a habit of getting too convoluted for the sake of it.
Paradigm wrote:
New teaser. Sounds... Daleky! Almost a bit Davros at the beginning... which would be awesome.
Oh yay more Davros, not like he got blown up at all last time round And my expectations for this season have dropped through the floor
Well, you never saw him die, and I always figured he'd escape somehow. There will have been a backup plan, or a teleport, or [insert plot here]. It's far from the worst thing they could have done.
Well, you never saw him die, and I always figured he'd escape somehow. There will have been a backup plan, or a teleport, or [insert plot here]. It's far from the worst thing they could have done.
It's still the whole we must have cybermen and daleks in every new season, it's kind of irritating when they could be using other older creatures or new ones instead of just recycling those two, wiping them out and then having to come up with a more convoluted reason to resurrect them
Well, you never saw him die, and I always figured he'd escape somehow. There will have been a backup plan, or a teleport, or [insert plot here]. It's far from the worst thing they could have done.
It's still the whole we must have cybermen and daleks in every new season, it's kind of irritating when they could be using other older creatures or new ones instead of just recycling those two, wiping them out and then having to come up with a more convoluted reason to resurrect them
To be fair, the Daleks have a whole Empire at the moment (they're just forgotten the Doctor is all) and they won't have actually appeared (bar the brief role in Day of the Doctor, where they took a bit of a back seat to The War Doc and the Zygons) in about 2 years by the time this airs. Cybermen too are currently not wiped out, just one planet. It's been established since 'A Good Man Goes to War' that there's a full Cyber empire out there. So there's no real 'villain of the week' resurrection needed.
More oldies would be nice. I'd like to see The Ice Warriors back in some capacity larger than the one guy in Cold War. Silurians have been done to death, Sontarons would be nice to see again, The Yeti might be cool to bring back, and I thought they might with The Great Intelligence returning, but no, they didn't. Other than that, all the classics have been used recently.
Am I the only one that would like to see the Daleks be shelved for a bit? I like them and all, but showing up every season sort of dilutes them a bit for me. I think the best episode in the new series was "Dalek" back in series 1 becuase it A) made them seem dangerous B) made them mysterious and C) told us something about the Doctor and the Time War. That isn't to say I haven't enjoyed them since then either, just that I just feel they use them to often.
As I recall British actor that wasn't white was offered the role and turned it down. [The producers] didn't say who, just that it did happen.
Ahtman wrote: Am I the only one that would like to see the Daleks be shelved for a bit? I like them and all, but showing up every season sort of dilutes them a bit for me. I think the best episode in the new series was "Dalek" back in series 1 becuase it A) made them seem dangerous B) made them mysterious and C) told us something about the Doctor and the Time War. That isn't to say I haven't enjoyed them since then either, just that I just feel they use them to often.
I agree. I'm a little Dalek-ed out at the moment. There is a marked tendency to overuse them in the current series, just as there was at the beginning of the classic series. OG Who went three or four years without a Dalek, though. The long period between Evil of the Daleks and Day of the Daleks had a lot of good non-Dalek stories in it. Maybe the producers should read up on those old stories (most of the Troughton ones don't exist anymore, sadly).
Ahtman wrote: Am I the only one that would like to see the Daleks be shelved for a bit? I like them and all, but showing up every season sort of dilutes them a bit for me. I think the best episode in the new series was "Dalek" back in series 1 becuase it A) made them seem dangerous B) made them mysterious and C) told us something about the Doctor and the Time War. That isn't to say I haven't enjoyed them since then either, just that I just feel they use them to often.
As I recall British actor that wasn't white was offered the role and turned it down. [The producers] didn't say who, just that it did happen.
Dalek is one of the most overlooked episodes of the new who, people skip 9 and miss the doctor who equivalent of Alien.
Dalek was a great episode, I loved 9's performance in that and the Dalek was actually scary.
My big problem with the Daleks of late is that they're supposed to be crazy genius hovering battle tanks of genocidal power...but they just come off as goofy and inept, they're just too easily defeated in ridiculous ways.
Agreed, Dalek is easily one of the top 10 nu-who episodes. Great performances all round, and the best (re)introduction of a villain since Darth Vader strode through the smoke on Tantive IV.
To be honest, I'd like to see Daleks without some kind of Doomsday Weapon (Reality Bomb/Genesis Ark), Reincarnation (Human Daleks, Smarties Daleks) or playing second fiddle (Pandorica Alliance, Siege of Treznalore, Zygons). Just have, as Tennat put it, 'A Dalek Empire big enough to slaughter the Cosmos', so let's just have that. Victory and Asylum established there's a full-blown Dalek Empire out there, and to see it in action as the invincible, unstoppable force it is would be awesome, and not something the new show has really had. It's fine to give them a plan and a plot, as otherwise there's serious writing issues, but they're supposed to be all-but-invincible, and believe themselves the ultimate life form; why do they need tricks and traps, then? Reality Bomb is pointless when there's a few billion Daleks just ready to make war.
Has there ever been a Dalek story without 'tricks and traps'?
The Daleks: Nukes
Dalek IoE: Robomen and Slave-Humans
Daleks: Time Travel Assassin Squad, Robo-Doctor
Dalek Master Plan: Time Destructor
Power of the Daleks: Hiding as servants
Evil of the Daleks: Human-esque Daleks\
Etc, so on...
Automatically Appended Next Post: I think the recent arc with the Time War is closest since the Time Lords are the ones with the tricks and traps and the Daleks are just flooding them with Daleks.
Exactly, which is why I'd love to just see Daleks doing what they do best. To be honest, the plot wouldn't even need to be that complex, it could simply be the Doctor saving a planet under Dalek occupation (the population being used as slaves ect). You'd get to to see the Daleks utterly in their element (as opposed to scavengers/outcasts/ mutants), there would be plenty of potential for character development both of Doctor and Companion; For example, does he endanger the populace by getting them to try and fight back, or does he do it solo and subsequently fail without them (humans are important Companion lecture blah blah blah)
The thing with the Daleks is, along with the Master, they are everything the Doctor is not (or thinks he's not, even if he is at times) so they are the perfect foil for setting up a new version of the character. Put the Doctor completely on the back foot, facing the only enemy he hates as much as himself, wind him up and watch him go. A little less 'OHMYGOD the Daleks are blowing up the universe' and more character stuff*
I don't think the Daleks need tricks to be a threat or a foil, just by existing they cause all kinds of moral dilemmas for the Doctor, provide a danger to the companion and go around being awesome, which is all the things DW needs.
* stuff like the line in Asylum: 'you find Hatred beautiful?" "Perhaps that is why we have been unable to kill you."
Stuff that really sets up the character and his true nature that, maybe, only the Daleks have seen, and tests every aspect of his abilities, values, character and ideals.
Mr Morden wrote: They should get Helena Bonham Carter to be the Dr she'd be ace
Holy crap would that be amazing. I honestly can't think of any other female British actress I'd like to see as the Doctor.
~Tim?
How about halfway?
Spoiler:
Oh, Tilda Swinton as the Doctor? You know, I can see that. Actually, the more I think about it the better I like it. She has eccentric look that you need to be convincing as the Doctor, and she's a pretty versatile actress.
I'm not a particularly big Dr Who fan, I mean, I watch the show but that's about it.
However, the one thing that really, really annoys me, is that every enemy is completely unstoppable, utterly undefeatable, except for something pulled out of the rear end at the last minute (Heart of the TARDIS, Regeneration Energy of uber pwnage, sonic screwdriver of infinite calculations).
It's like Superweapon Top Trumps. Daleks come to wipe out humanity, oh no, superweapon wipes out the Daleks. Daleks come back with an unstoppable superweapon to wipe out the galaxy. Oh wait, Superweapon wipes out the Daleks and their unstoppable superweapon.
What I think they need to do, again, speaking as not a massive fan, is just depower, well... Everything.
Yeah, have the Cybermen / Daleks / Angels be huge threats. Just stop with the whole 'wiping out the galaxy / all-existence / time itself' thing.
Bad guys can still be huge enemies and bad guys, even if they take some proper casualties occasionally, or even lose the odd battle, fair and squarely.
Take for example, the Cybermen on the Theme Park planet episode from last season. You have like 30 guys, The Doctor, a few rubbish guns, a decent gun and a bomb.
VS what? 10000 cybermen. 10,000.
But, that wasn't a big enough threat. No, they felt they had to turn the cybermen into Sonic-The-Hedgehog, Ninja, psychic, Borg.
Would the Cybermen really have been massively less of a threat, if, instead of 'Adapting' or 'upgrading' or whatever it was, to the 1 good gun and the handful of rubbish guns, to just have the Good Gun, you know, run out of ammo after it killed a bunch? There'd still be 9,950 left or whatever. Have the other guns take some down too, after a lot of fire.
Sorry about that rant, but it does sort of annoy me that the show could be something that I'd genuinely enjoy but I just end up rolling my eyes at due to yet another arbitrary thing pulled out of thin air.
Compel wrote: I'm not a particularly big Dr Who fan, I mean, I watch the show but that's about it.
However, the one thing that really, really annoys me, is that every enemy is completely unstoppable, utterly undefeatable, except for something pulled out of the rear end at the last minute (Heart of the TARDIS, Regeneration Energy of uber pwnage, sonic screwdriver of infinite calculations).
It's like Superweapon Top Trumps. Daleks come to wipe out humanity, oh no, superweapon wipes out the Daleks. Daleks come back with an unstoppable superweapon to wipe out the galaxy. Oh wait, Superweapon wipes out the Daleks and their unstoppable superweapon.
What I think they need to do, again, speaking as not a massive fan, is just depower, well... Everything.
Yeah, have the Cybermen / Daleks / Angels be huge threats. Just stop with the whole 'wiping out the galaxy / all-existence / time itself' thing.
Bad guys can still be huge enemies and bad guys, even if they take some proper casualties occasionally, or even lose the odd battle, fair and squarely.
Take for example, the Cybermen on the Theme Park planet episode from last season. You have like 30 guys, The Doctor, a few rubbish guns, a decent gun and a bomb.
VS what? 10000 cybermen. 10,000.
But, that wasn't a big enough threat. No, they felt they had to turn the cybermen into Sonic-The-Hedgehog, Ninja, psychic, Borg.
Would the Cybermen really have been massively less of a threat, if, instead of 'Adapting' or 'upgrading' or whatever it was, to the 1 good gun and the handful of rubbish guns, to just have the Good Gun, you know, run out of ammo after it killed a bunch? There'd still be 9,950 left or whatever. Have the other guns take some down too, after a lot of fire.
Sorry about that rant, but it does sort of annoy me that the show could be something that I'd genuinely enjoy but I just end up rolling my eyes at due to yet another arbitrary thing pulled out of thin air.
I agree wholeheartedly with this, Deus Ex Sonic needs to happen less and the plots need to be resolved through actual confrontations/clever plans that don't rely on super-gadgets/blasting the enemy into the middle of next year. And I do agree about the Daleks/Cybermen/whoever are a credible threat without wanting to blow up the universe.
I mean, the Cybermen are human brains encased in metal bodies, stripped of all emotion and intent on eliminating all life that is not like them, simply because they believe themselves superior. Is that not enough of a threat when they also outnumber the protagonists 5 to 1? They didn't and don't need the superpowers.
The same is true for Daleks, as I outlined a few posts back. So less one-upmanship, more actual plot resolutions, please, BBC....
Wait wait, are you not familiar with the history of Doctor Who? Its been Deus Ex Sonic back to black and white grandpa Doctor taking his wee ones on educational adventures through history.
Frazzled wrote: Wait wait, are you not familiar with the history of Doctor Who? Its been Deus Ex Sonic back to black and white grandpa Doctor taking his wee ones on educational adventures through history.
Well, the sonic wasn't introduced until the second Doctor, I believe, and it's first use was to... guess what... undo a screw! I'm just annoying that these days, between the Sonic, the TARDIS and occasionally singing, the Doctor can apparently do anything. It's become too much of a crutch for bad writing, and I'd be happy for him to lose it irreplaceable for a few series if it meant the writers had to actually write something other than:
DOCTOR: I've got this....
waves sonic manically whilst babbling
THE END*
*and they all lived happily ever after as no non-enemy has died (permanently) in Dr Who in about 4 years! Yet another sign that the writers lack guts.
Doctor steps out of Tardis and surprises two Sontarans.
Sontarans surprised: shoot him.
Garg - he falls down and regenerates.
Sontarans shoot him again
"Bloody hell!" garg he falls down and regenerates.
Sontarans shoot him again.
"Oh come on!" garg he falls down and regenerates.
Sontarans shoot him again...
I agree wholeheartedly with this, Deus Ex Sonic needs to happen less and the plots need to be resolved through actual confrontations/clever plans that don't rely on super-gadgets/blasting the enemy into the middle of next year. And I do agree about the Daleks/Cybermen/whoever are a credible threat without wanting to blow up the universe.
I mean, the Cybermen are human brains encased in metal bodies, stripped of all emotion and intent on eliminating all life that is not like them, simply because they believe themselves superior. Is that not enough of a threat when they also outnumber the protagonists 5 to 1? They didn't and don't need the superpowers.
The same is true for Daleks, as I outlined a few posts back. So less one-upmanship, more actual plot resolutions, please, BBC....
The term I'd heard used was "Davies ex Machina" as a swipe at Russell T Davies' tendency to write himself into a corner, then sonic screwdriver his way out. If only Moffat hadn't continued the tradition. Oh well.
But I agree they need to tone down the threat level and power of the bad guys. Too many things are threatening the entire universe every episode. I can't manage to make myself care, because the scope is too big. Dalek, I could get excited over. The immediate threat was to the Doctor, Rose, and the other people in the underground base. It was small and I liked that. The episode about the plastic people in the acid mine becoming 'human' was a good one; again, the threat is just to the Doc, his sidekicks and the small guest cast. We need more like that.
squidhills wrote: But I agree they need to tone down the threat level and power of the bad guys. Too many things are threatening the entire universe every episode. I can't manage to make myself care, because the scope is too big. Dalek, I could get excited over. The immediate threat was to the Doctor, Rose, and the other people in the underground base. It was small and I liked that. The episode about the plastic people in the acid mine becoming 'human' was a good one; again, the threat is just to the Doc, his sidekicks and the small guest cast. We need more like that.
Okay, I just disagree. There have been plenty of 'retail' threats that were just vs Doc/Sidekick/Small Cast. In addition, there have been tons of 'Save the Earth' ones which the Doctor has been famous for since the beginning. So I'll assume we're talking about just 'the fate of all of creation is in the doctor's hands' episodes.
Let's look at the newest season: 17 Episodes - 7 Retail / 6 Save the Planet / 3 Wholesale / 1 Arguable
Spoiler:
Xmas - Retail vs Trees and Family 1 - Asylum - Retail. Daleks/Doctor/Amy/Rory vs Insane Daleks and Nanos 2 - Dinos - Retail/STP. Dr and Dinos vs Ship/Crazy old dude 3 - Mercy - Retail. 4 - Power of Three - Save the Earth. 5 - Angels - Save the Earth Xmas - Snowmen - Save the Earth 6 -BoSJ - STE 7 - Rings - Retail/STP 8 - Cold War - Retail 9 - Hide - Retail 10 - Journey to the - Retail 11 - Crimson Horror - Retail 12 - Nightmare in silver - Arguably retail, but potential for Wholesale 13 - Name of the Doctor - End of Season Arc. Definitely Wholesale DoTD - 50th Anni. Of course it is wholesale ToTD - Moving to new doctor wrapping up Day and Name. Wholesale
So the entire season is basically Retail saving the day and saving the earth until the big end of season bang. I think if you go back, you'll see a lot of similar things, but just for funsies, let's look at Baker's first, second to last and last seasons for comparison:
Robot - Save the Earth/Retail Ark in Space - Retail Sontaran Experiment - Retail/STE Genesis of the Daleks - Retail-esque but with Save the Universe connotations (similar to nightmare in silver) Revenge of the Cybermen - Retail
Destiny of the Daleks - Retail / Save the Planet City of Death - Retail Creature from the Bit - Retail Nightmare of Eden - Retail Horns of Nimon - Save the Planet Shada - Arguably save the Universe.
Leisure Hive - Retail Meglos - Retail Full Circle - Retail State of Decay - Save the Planet / Arguably StU Warrior's Gate - Retail-ish Keeper of Traken - Retail / StP Logopolis - Last Tom Baker and wait for it... Save the Universe... Which continues into the next season with Castrovalva, still Save the Universe.
Lookit that, just as much 'Save the Planet' or 'Save the Universe' in classic as there is now... Funny that. Especially at the end of a Doctor's tenure there's a tendency to go for big sweeping stories.
I agree wholeheartedly with this, Deus Ex Sonic needs to happen less and the plots need to be resolved through actual confrontations/clever plans that don't rely on super-gadgets/blasting the enemy into the middle of next year. And I do agree about the Daleks/Cybermen/whoever are a credible threat without wanting to blow up the universe.
I mean, the Cybermen are human brains encased in metal bodies, stripped of all emotion and intent on eliminating all life that is not like them, simply because they believe themselves superior. Is that not enough of a threat when they also outnumber the protagonists 5 to 1? They didn't and don't need the superpowers.
The same is true for Daleks, as I outlined a few posts back. So less one-upmanship, more actual plot resolutions, please, BBC....
The term I'd heard used was "Davies ex Machina" as a swipe at Russell T Davies' tendency to write himself into a corner, then sonic screwdriver his way out. If only Moffat hadn't continued the tradition. Oh well.
But I agree they need to tone down the threat level and power of the bad guys. Too many things are threatening the entire universe every episode. I can't manage to make myself care, because the scope is too big. Dalek, I could get excited over. The immediate threat was to the Doctor, Rose, and the other people in the underground base. It was small and I liked that. The episode about the plastic people in the acid mine becoming 'human' was a good one; again, the threat is just to the Doc, his sidekicks and the small guest cast. We need more like that.
Precisely why I like 'Journey To The Centre of the TARDIS', 'Asylum of the Daleks'. 'Hide' and to a lesser extent 'Cold War' and 'The Crimson Horror' in the last series. Each focused on a very small cast (who were consistently good, especially the guests) and the threat was no less for being localised. I found it far easier to be concerned about The Doctor, Clara and the miners in 'Journey' or the blind woman in 'Horror' than the guys in the Nightmare in Silver, as when you have enemies that powerful and no way to beat them, Deus Ex Machina becomes the only possible option, it's only a matter of time.
Other episodes that do this exceptionally well are fairly common (Flesh and Stone, Blink, Human Nature, Silence in the Library), so it's clearly possible and not massively difficult, so I'd like to see more of it.
Hmm, there's a theory. End of a Doctor is STU?
First - The Tenth Planet - Save the Planet.
Second - The War Games - Save the Universe
Third - Planet of the Spiders - Save the Universe
Fourth - Logopolis - Save the Universe
Fifth - Caves of Androzani - Save the Planet
Sixth - The Ultimate Foe - Retail with STU implications
Seventh - Survival - Retail
Eighth - Doctor Who - Save the Planet
War - Night of the Doctor - Kinda, but mostly retail
Nine - Parting of the Ways - Save the Universe
Ten - End of Time - STU
Eleven - Name/Day/Time of the Doctor - STU
So yeah, pretty much, 6 of the 12 times it was STU. Sounds like a tradition to me.
And to be clear, I totally get the complaints about Sonic'ing everything. I just think saying that 'everything is save the universe' is a little inaccurate.
Personally, I'm hoping that we get to see a return to Venusian Judo to solve problems.
pretre wrote: And to be clear, I totally get the complaints about Sonic'ing everything. I just think saying that 'everything is save the universe' is a little inaccurate.
Personally, I'm hoping that we get to see a return to Venusian Judo to solve problems.
Sometimes I actually get the feeling that The Doctor starts "sonic-ing" everything to make it appear that he knows what he's doing, which I guess the point is that he really doesnt half the time... Beyond that, yeah, I do also think it get's a bit over used, and hopefully with some of the War Doctor's lines, we'll see a turn towards 12 using his sonic as a "scientific instrument" again.
A slaughterhouse restaurant and a buried spaceship lead The Doctor into a confrontation with a long-forgotten foe...
Into The Dalek
"Imagine the worst thing in the universe, and then don't bother because you're looking at right now. This is evil refined as engineering."
In the dying days of a bitter war, a beleaguered army has one last hope: a Dalek so damaged it has become good. But can it be trusted? To find out, a miniaturised team, led by The Doctor and Clara, embark on a fantastic voyage into the Dalek itself...
Robot of Sherwood
"There's no such thing as Robin Hood!"
In a sun-dappled Sherwood Forest, The Doctor discovers an evil plan from beyond the stars. But with of Nottingham at stake (and possibly Derby), there's no time for the two adventurers to get into a fight about who is real and who isn't - which is probably why they do very little else!
Listen
"What's that in the mirror, and the corner of your eye? What's the footstep following, but never passing by?"
What scares the grand old man of time? What horrors lurk under his bed? Ghosts of the past and future crowd into the lives of The Doctor and Clara; a terrified caretaker in a children's home, the last man standing in the universe, and a little boy who doesn't want to join the army...
Time Heist
"Welcome to the bank of Karabraxos."
The Bank of Karabraxos is the deadliest bank in the cosmos - only a fool or genius would tempt to rob it. Fortunately, for The Doctor, he's both. But nothing even The Doctor has encountered can prepare them for the Teller: a creature of terrifying power that can detect guilt.
The Caretaker
"Human beings have incredibly short life-spans. Frankly, you should all be in a permanent state of panic. Tick tock, tick tock."
Clara has it all under control: her life at school, her life in space; her new boyfriend and her mad old Time Lord. Everything is humming along just fine, so long as everybody never actually meets. And then, one morning, just before assembly, Coal Hill welcomes a new relief caretaker with a Scottish accent.
Kill the Moon
"The little planetoid that's been tagging along beside you for a hundred million years, which gives you light at night and seas to sail, is in the process of falling to bits."
In the near future, The Doctor and Clara arrive on a decrepit shuttle making a suicide mission to the Moon. Crashing on the lunar surface, they find a mining base full of eviscerated corpses, spider-like creatures scuttling about in the dark, and a terrible dilemma.
Mummy on the Orient Express
"Start the clock!"
Aboard the most beautiful train in history, speeding among the stars of the future, a legend is stalking the passengers. Once you see the Mummy, you have 66 seconds to live. Clara sees The Doctor at his most deadliest and most ruthless - and finally she realises she's made the right decision. Because this is their last adventure: it's time to say goodbye to the Time Lord.
Flatline
"Look, your home isn't going anywhere. And neither is mine until I figure this out."
Separated from The Doctor, Clara discovers a new menace from another dimension. But how do you hide when even the walls are no protection?
In the Forest of the Night
"D'you like the forest being in Trafalgar Square? I think it's lovely."
One morning in London, and every city and town in the world, the human race wakes up to the most surprising invasion yet: the trees have moved back in. Everywhere, in every land, a forest has grown overnight and taken back the Earth.
Dark Water / Death in Heaven
"You betrayed me. You betrayed my trust, our friendship, and everything I've ever stood for. You let me down."
In the mysterious world of the Nethersphere, plans have been drawn. Old friends and old enemies manoeuvre around The Doctor, and an impossible choice is looming over him.
There's been some talk about Jenna Coleman leaving sooner rather than later, although it seems she will be in the Xmas special.
Can't wait. Some of those episodes sound pretty cricket cringeworthy from that, but I've also seen some better descriptions of them elsewhere so I'll go into the series with as little preconception as possible. I fully expect Capaldi to be brilliant, it just remains to be seen whether Clara gets any less irritating and more three-dimensional. And seemed to be going that way at Christmas so we shall see.
For those who are unaware, BBC America is currently running Doctor Who all day (barring the 6-8am timeslot for the BBC World News) leading up until the season premiere at 8pm Eastern on Saturday
Paradigm wrote: Can't wait. I fully expect Capaldi to be brilliant, it just remains to be seen whether Clara gets any less irritating and more three-dimensional. And seemed to be going that way at Christmas so we shall see.
A lot of articles that I've seen have strongly suggested that there's a new companion on deck, and we'll meet him pretty soon.... I also recall Capaldi basically saying that if they wrote a love interest into the story between him and Clara he'd quit
From the few snippets we've seen on the TV and what dialogue he's had in them, I do hope they go "dark enough" and not in a Tim Burton Batman sort of way.
Paradigm wrote: Can't wait. I fully expect Capaldi to be brilliant, it just remains to be seen whether Clara gets any less irritating and more three-dimensional. And seemed to be going that way at Christmas so we shall see.
A lot of articles that I've seen have strongly suggested that there's a new companion on deck, and we'll meet him pretty soon.... I also recall Capaldi basically saying that if they wrote a love interest into the story between him and Clara he'd quit
From the few snippets we've seen on the TV and what dialogue he's had in them, I do hope they go "dark enough" and not in a Tim Burton Batman sort of way.
Yeah, I read that as well. The new companion seems to go the role of a Rory/Mickey to Clara's Amy/Rose. It's hardly original, but hey, it could work.
As for darkness, I'm hoping he will occupy a space between Tom Baker, Chris Ecclestone and Jon Pertwee, a little bit eccentric but also capable of condemning entire civilisations without a thought if they piss him off.
As for darkness, I'm hoping he will occupy a space between Tom Baker, Chris Ecclestone and Jon Pertwee, a little bit eccentric but also capable of condemning entire civilisations without a thought if they piss him off.
I think you may be right, but I'd also suspect a bit of the 1st Doctor in there as well... That eccentric old bloke that when he says something, you just stop and listen, and then you do what he says to the letter.
Well, at least one episode is set at Coal Hill, where it all started, so we could end up seeing a bit of Hartnell coming through, given the links to the old days.
Tbh I have lost the love for the show during matt smith, I mean he is a good actor but for me the problem lies with moffat. In my opinion MOffat can write some very good single episodes (Blink was a personal fav of mine) but he cant carry a series, not the way RTD could, but then I hear that Capaldi has had shouting arguments on set with moffat over the script, and has declared he doesnt not like the direction moffat is taking the show and has said he will not be run off the show bring me hope, as I think he will mitigate the damage Moffat can cause when writing a season.
All said, I think of the new doctors Eccleston was the best, especially in the episode Dalek, I really feel from that episode that he is a man who has lost everything, and he boils with rage and guilt and hurt, Dalek is my favourite episode there is.
DukeBadham wrote: but then I hear that Capaldi has had shouting arguments on set with moffat over the script, and has declared he doesnt not like the direction moffat is taking the show and has said he will not be run off the show bring me hope, as I think he will mitigate the damage Moffat can cause when writing a season.
If all that is true, then I have hopes for the show... As Capaldi is an actor who's been around, and doesn't strike me as one who's still trying to build his book and thus won't put up with gak if it interferes with his art form.
Does make you wonder though, if Capaldi's Doctor really becomes popular in this season or less, and BBC sees the "writing on the wall" would they get rid of Moffat, or Capaldi? (as in, they realize that DW is their cash cow, and depending on how popular Capaldi is as the Doctor, would they "save" the show by canning him, or the writer?)
This is all hearsay so I dont know if its true, but its enough to get me to watch the show at least
There are four things I want from the show:
1) A ginger Doctor
2) A female or a non-white doctor
3) An LGBT companion(s) that are proper whole series companions
4) A gay kiss between the Doctor and Jack Harkness (I miss him)
DukeBadham wrote: but then I hear that Capaldi has had shouting arguments on set with moffat over the script, and has declared he doesnt not like the direction moffat is taking the show and has said he will not be run off the show bring me hope, as I think he will mitigate the damage Moffat can cause when writing a season.
If all that is true, then I have hopes for the show... As Capaldi is an actor who's been around, and doesn't strike me as one who's still trying to build his book and thus won't put up with gak if it interferes with his art form.
Does make you wonder though, if Capaldi's Doctor really becomes popular in this season or less, and BBC sees the "writing on the wall" would they get rid of Moffat, or Capaldi? (as in, they realize that DW is their cash cow, and depending on how popular Capaldi is as the Doctor, would they "save" the show by canning him, or the writer?)
Hopefully they would see people feelings on moffat, and put someone else in charge, as moffat is good at writing episodes, but someone else should have the reigns on the season.
Also...what are everones feelings on the episode "midnight"...It still creeps me out watching it
DukeBadham wrote: but then I hear that Capaldi has had shouting arguments on set with moffat over the script, and has declared he doesnt not like the direction moffat is taking the show and has said he will not be run off the show bring me hope, as I think he will mitigate the damage Moffat can cause when writing a season.
If all that is true, then I have hopes for the show... As Capaldi is an actor who's been around, and doesn't strike me as one who's still trying to build his book and thus won't put up with gak if it interferes with his art form.
Does make you wonder though, if Capaldi's Doctor really becomes popular in this season or less, and BBC sees the "writing on the wall" would they get rid of Moffat, or Capaldi? (as in, they realize that DW is their cash cow, and depending on how popular Capaldi is as the Doctor, would they "save" the show by canning him, or the writer?)
They'd be mad to let Capaldi go, he the most high-profile actor ever to have taken the role and ever since he was announced, the reception has been overwhelmingly positive. Moffat, on the other hand, seems to have more people calling for his head after each episode he writes. If it comes down to it, heel go before they loose Peter.
It's worth noting that Capaldi also has an Oscar for directing, so the rumours he's trying to keep the show on track don't surprise me and hopefully pan out.
DukeBadham wrote:This is all hearsay so I dont know if its true, but its enough to get me to watch the show at least
There are four things I want from the show:
1) A ginger Doctor
2) A female or a non-white doctor
3) An LGBT companion(s) that are proper whole series companions
4) A gay kiss between the Doctor and Jack Harkness (I miss him)
Out of interest, why are these things on your list? Do you really think it would/should change the dynamic of the show to have a female/black/gay Doctor? I feel that the Doctor should always be cast as the best man for the job, and that 'man' may well be female or black or ginger and I have no issues with it. However, I think if someone were picked just because of those things, it would be little more than a token gesture to appease sections of the fans.
Also...what are everones feelings on the episode "midnight"...It still creeps me out watching it
I love Midnight, it's a class act in how to perform to perform with very limited space to act in, a small cast of unknown characters, and a budget of about 2p. It seems to have nothing going for it at first glance, but is carried by an amazing script and great acting, and remains one of the creepiest and underrated episodes of the modern run.
There looks to be an episode in the new series along similar lines (small cast/set, lots of dialogue), so hopefully they can pull it off again.
DukeBadham wrote:This is all hearsay so I dont know if its true, but its enough to get me to watch the show at least
There are four things I want from the show: 1) A ginger Doctor 2) A female or a non-white doctor 3) An LGBT companion(s) that are proper whole series companions 4) A gay kiss between the Doctor and Jack Harkness (I miss him)
Out of interest, why are these things on your list? Do you really think it would/should change the dynamic of the show to have a female/black/gay Doctor? I feel that the Doctor should always be cast as the best man for the job, and that 'man' may well be female or black or ginger and I have no issues with it. However, I think if someone were picked just because of those things, it would be little more than a token gesture to appease sections of the fans.
Sorry I wasnt clear, Dont get me wrong, I firmly believe that the best actor should be given the role as the doctor, but what I dont think there is is open casting calls for the role. So I doubt there would be a black or female doctor; I get why they choose to play it safe, but it doesnt mean I wouldnt like some variety.
Also, from all the flirting the doctor did with good ol' Captain Jack, I am at least half certain he is Bi, or some other term under the Bibrella (Bisexual umbrella), but I am a bit of a yaoi fangirl at heart.
And I just wanna see a ginger doctor because of how they complain when they regenerate that they arent ginger, I think it would be funny to see how a ginger doctor reacts. xD
DukeBadham wrote:This is all hearsay so I dont know if its true, but its enough to get me to watch the show at least
There are four things I want from the show:
1) A ginger Doctor
2) A female or a non-white doctor
3) An LGBT companion(s) that are proper whole series companions
4) A gay kiss between the Doctor and Jack Harkness (I miss him)
Out of interest, why are these things on your list? Do you really think it would/should change the dynamic of the show to have a female/black/gay Doctor? I feel that the Doctor should always be cast as the best man for the job, and that 'man' may well be female or black or ginger and I have no issues with it. However, I think if someone were picked just because of those things, it would be little more than a token gesture to appease sections of the fans.
Sorry I wasnt clear, Dont get me wrong, I firmly believe that the best actor should be given the role as the doctor, but what I dont think there is is open casting calls for the role. So I doubt there would be a black or female doctor; I get why they choose to play it safe, but it doesnt mean I wouldnt like some variety.
Also, from all the flirting the doctor did with good ol' Captain Jack, I am at least half certain he is Bi, or some other term under the Bibrella (Bisexual umbrella), but I am a bit of a yaoi fangirl at heart.
And I just wanna see a ginger doctor because of how they complain when they regenerate that they arent ginger, I think it would be funny to see how a ginger doctor reacts. xD
Fair enough, all perfectly reasonable.
I only asked because I get irked when you get period saying the Doctor should be a woman or black or gay 'just because'. If it doesn't do anything for the character or story, then there's no reason for it, and it becomes a token gesture that undermines whatever 'equality' it was trying to represent. If much rather they have a ran for it (is a very impressive actor/actress catches their eye) than just doing it for the same of it.
But I think, when they cast, they have character in mind, and to date, that character has always been a white English male. In the future, who knows?
DukeBadham wrote:This is all hearsay so I dont know if its true, but its enough to get me to watch the show at least
There are four things I want from the show:
1) A ginger Doctor
2) A female or a non-white doctor
3) An LGBT companion(s) that are proper whole series companions
4) A gay kiss between the Doctor and Jack Harkness (I miss him)
Out of interest, why are these things on your list? Do you really think it would/should change the dynamic of the show to have a female/black/gay Doctor? I feel that the Doctor should always be cast as the best man for the job, and that 'man' may well be female or black or ginger and I have no issues with it. However, I think if someone were picked just because of those things, it would be little more than a token gesture to appease sections of the fans.
Sorry I wasnt clear, Dont get me wrong, I firmly believe that the best actor should be given the role as the doctor, but what I dont think there is is open casting calls for the role. So I doubt there would be a black or female doctor; I get why they choose to play it safe, but it doesnt mean I wouldnt like some variety.
Also, from all the flirting the doctor did with good ol' Captain Jack, I am at least half certain he is Bi, or some other term under the Bibrella (Bisexual umbrella), but I am a bit of a yaoi fangirl at heart.
And I just wanna see a ginger doctor because of how they complain when they regenerate that they arent ginger, I think it would be funny to see how a ginger doctor reacts. xD
Fair enough, all perfectly reasonable.
I only asked because I get irked when you get period saying the Doctor should be a woman or black or gay 'just because'. If it doesn't do anything for the character or story, then there's no reason for it, and it becomes a token gesture that undermines whatever 'equality' it was trying to represent. If much rather they have a ran for it (is a very impressive actor/actress catches their eye) than just doing it for the same of it.
But I think, when they cast, they have character in mind, and to date, that character has always been a white English male. In the future, who knows?
I can see, and agree with the first three on that list... But I honestly dont see the point, or reason for the 4th
Every season since the first of the reboot I have seen the new doctor and been like.... man this is going to suck the other guy was so much better....
Then after a few episodes I am like, wow this guy is better (or just as good, no downer to matt but no one can hold a candle to tennant.).....
So yeah I am thinking the new guy is going to suck and that I will miss the old Doctor..... but who know a couple episodes in I may be all like.... hmm this guy is pretty good.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh and PS, you forgot John Hurt... he was a very good Doctor as well.... Potentially better than Matt.
RJCarrot wrote: Every season since the first of the reboot I have seen the new doctor and been like.... man this is going to suck the other guy was so much better....
Then after a few episodes I am like, wow this guy is better (or just as good, no downer to matt but no one can hold a candle to tennant.).....
.
Indeed. Going into Smith's first one I expected terribleness, an hour later my main thought was 'David who?'
That said, I already expect excellence from Capaldi, so hopefully he'll prove me right. All the comments around so far seem to point that way.
Daemonhammer wrote: For a show that claims to be the longest running sci-fi tv series i tought Doctor Who would have more than 8 seasons. But who am i to judge.
Doctor Who started in 1963 and ran the whole time until 1989 when it stopped until the movie in 1996 and then was rebooted in 2005.
Daemonhammer wrote: For a show that claims to be the longest running sci-fi tv series i tought Doctor Who would have more than 8 seasons. But who am i to judge.
It's 8 seasons since it started back up in 2005 after it's original 1963-1989 run.
Daemonhammer wrote: For a show that claims to be the longest running sci-fi tv series i tought Doctor Who would have more than 8 seasons. But who am i to judge.
Doctor Who started in 1963 and ran the whole time until 1989 when it stopped until the movie in 1996 and then was rebooted in 2005.
As a TV show it stopped in 1989, it got a movie in 1996.
Daemonhammer wrote: For a show that claims to be the longest running sci-fi tv series i tought Doctor Who would have more than 8 seasons. But who am i to judge.
The newer ones are 8 seasons. The old ones are around 26 seasons.
I seen the first two episodes. They were screenings so CGI wasn't done, it was in black and white and it had the old intro. Quite like Capaldi.
Daemonhammer wrote: For a show that claims to be the longest running sci-fi tv series i tought Doctor Who would have more than 8 seasons. But who am i to judge.
In case you're serious, you are forgetting the 20 some odd seasons previously made, from the 60s to the 80s.
I live in Ireland and there is these channels from the CBS network (which i think is big in the us) but here they only broadcast tv shows from a few decades ago, which is fine if i want to watch the original series of star trek or TNG, but they recently started advertising that they will play the old black and white Doctor Who episodes. I sometimes joke that Ireland recieves the signal that was sent into space, bounced off something and returned here a few decades later.
Do watch the older ones if you get the chance, some are terrible but most are very good and have some great plots and moments despite the lack of CGI. The Sea Devils, Genesis of the Daleks and Remembrance of the Daleks are personal favourites. Not all the old stuff is in black and white, from Pertwee onward it's in color.
Classic Who definately has some great episodes of awesome sci-fi in its run. It also has some pretty risible dogs, too (any show that ran for 26+ years was bound to have a few stinkers). The infuriating part is that so many episodes no longer exist due to the BBC's sexual attraction to fire during the 60s and early 70s.
Though I literally did the Snoopy Dance when I found out that a bunch of episodes had been found in a TV station in Africa last year.
Some of the older ones were decent watches. That said, they're all very much products of their time, comprised for a very different audience and in a place where TV functioned differently than it does today and served a different purpose. Most of the older stuff I found to be very difficult to slog through, though I did like Genesis of the Daleks and a couple of others.
It is amusing in a way however that there are more missing episodes of Doctor who than the original Star Trek ever made
Well that was... Unexpected. Capaldi was about as excellent as can expected, but the script was a little mediocre and unmemorable. He carried the episode and the character, but the rest of it was far from the best.
Spoiler:
Matt's appearance was cool though, and a nice touch.
The ending was weird... Moffat hinted at an old enemy returning. The Rani, maybe?
Also, I love the new title sequence! Very steam punk!
Paradigm wrote: Well that was... Unexpected. Capaldi was about as excellent as can expected, but the script was a little mediocre and unmemorable. He carried the episode and the character, but the rest of it was far from the best.
Spoiler:
Matt's appearance was cool though, and a nice touch.
The ending was weird... Moffat hinted at an old enemy returning. The Rani, maybe?
Yeah, I can see why people didn't enjoy the episode itself too much. The whole dinosaur setup very much felt like a. "I wrote myself into a corner with the idea of the tardis being coughed up by a dinosaur in the Thames and I want to get rid of that as quickly as possible." - The interview I saw afterwards (I was watching it in the cinema), said that the whole episode started from the idea of that.
Peter Capaldi was good, he had a good mix with Matt Smiths wild movements, plus, what I'm guessing is a more classic character for him. I actually quite liked Clara's reaction to the change. - It seemed quite, I dunno, realistic? to me.
The whole 'Dont Breath' aspect of it was silly and I'm pretty sure Strax's laser gun could have beaten the bots in seconds.
On the other hand, the whole scene with The Doctor and the half-face man in the balloon was good and I quite like the idea of leaving it ambiguous whether the guy jumped or was pushed. - It brings us an edginess to the Doctor now, leaving us as the audience unsure of whether we can 'really' trust him... - Something no doubt that will be part of Clara's storyarc going forward.
I left DW when the resolution to a huge evil sun-thing about to eat a planet was to sing at it and throw a leaf.
I watched the episode today, and was pleasantly surprised that it was a bit less... juvenile?
I mean having either a murder or a suicide as the plot resolution seems a bit more edgy...
Idk
Tactical_Genius wrote: I left DW when the resolution to a huge evil sun-thing about to eat a planet was to sing at it and throw a leaf.
I watched the episode today, and was pleasantly surprised that it was a bit less... juvenile?
I mean having either a murder or a suicide as the plot resolution seems a bit more edgy...
Idk
Matt Smiths doctor was as one reviewer put it, The Childs Doctor. He was Peter Pan, off to whisk you to an adventure.
Tactical_Genius wrote: I left DW when the resolution to a huge evil sun-thing about to eat a planet was to sing at it and throw a leaf.
I watched the episode today, and was pleasantly surprised that it was a bit less... juvenile?
I mean having either a murder or a suicide as the plot resolution seems a bit more edgy...
Idk
Matt Smiths doctor was as one reviewer put it, The Childs Doctor. He was Peter Pan, off to whisk you to an adventure.
Thing is, I liked his acting, just not the storylines at all...
Did his episodes get any better after the giant sun thing?
Some did. But that is what I mean. That is how his doctor is supposed to be. just think. Alot with the original 11th companion was that he took her on adventurers but got her home ontime
The Cold War episode was good (The one after the singing to he sun episode) and Matt Smiths final episodes were good as well - The Name of The Doctor, The Day Of The Doctor and The Time of The Doctor were particularly good and should be watched together as a mini marathon.
I think the other few episodes of the season all contained something that annoyed me a whole lot. - I dunno if it was in this thread, but I went on quite a rant about the 'Nightmare In Silver' episode.
The writing was a little better than the previous season, but still fairly naff. Capaldi's a better actor than Smith at least, though it would help if he didn't have to deliver such horrible lines. The whole thing seemed to be written at the same level as some fan fiction. I skipped the last season, but probably will stick with this one for Capaldi at least. The writing did come across a little too much like Sherlock, as were certain bits pretty cringe worthy (people don't talk like that in the real world...). It'll be nice when the Companion's killed off at least. Something to look forward to (her character was too much for me to put up with with that last series. I'll stick with this one hoping she'll die eventually in an overly weepy manner).
I wonder who wrote all the lines regarding the Scots too? They seemed a bit out of place. I mean I like that there's Scottish actors in this season, but it'd been nice if the writers didn't think they needed to draw attention to them with big signs and arrows. The references to the Independence referendum at the end too seemed pretty odd too (well I took them to be talking about the referendum. The choice of the word "vote" being used implied it to me). Meh, Moffat's a terrible writer.
Spoiler:
And yup, that sure looks like the Rani to me. I was wondering if they were going to do anything with her again.
Wyrmalla wrote: The references to the Independence referendum at the end too seemed pretty odd too (well I took them to be talking about the referendum. The choice of the word "vote" being used implied it to me). Meh, Moffat's a terrible writer.
I thought that as well. - So much so, that when I came back from the cinema, I watched it again at home with subtitles on.
The way the conversation plays out is:
"I uh, I'm don't think I'm a hugging person now."
*Hugs* "I'm not sure you get a vote."
"Whatever you say."
Then....
"Coffee, yeah, coffee would be great. You're buying."
"I urr, don't have any money."
"You're fetching then."
"I'm not sure I'm the fetching sort..."
"Still not sure you get a vote."
It may just have been entirely coincidential (well, maybe the word 'vote' was in the back of Moffats mind, perhaps), but I think the lines are more to show Clara's 'bossiness' asserting itself more.
Oddly enough, I was having that conversation shortly before it came on, where I mentioned the 'bubbly personality hiding bossy control freak' line from Time of The Doctor, where it was countered with 'she didn't really show any of that until that very episode.'
So, maybe they're highlighting it more now, to try to give Clara more personality than the slight 'lost puppy-ness / plot device' she had beforehand with the Impossible Girl storyarc.
Compel wrote: Yeah, I can see why people didn't enjoy the episode itself too much. The whole dinosaur setup very much felt like a. "I wrote myself into a corner with the idea of the tardis being coughed up by a dinosaur in the Thames and I want to get rid of that as quickly as possible." - The interview I saw afterwards (I was watching it in the cinema), said that the whole episode started from the idea of that.
Peter Capaldi was good, he had a good mix with Matt Smiths wild movements, plus, what I'm guessing is a more classic character for him. I actually quite liked Clara's reaction to the change. - It seemed quite, I dunno, realistic? to me.
The whole 'Dont Breath' aspect of it was silly and I'm pretty sure Strax's laser gun could have beaten the bots in seconds.
On the other hand, the whole scene with The Doctor and the half-face man in the balloon was good and I quite like the idea of leaving it ambiguous whether the guy jumped or was pushed. - It brings us an edginess to the Doctor now, leaving us as the audience unsure of whether we can 'really' trust him... - Something no doubt that will be part of Clara's storyarc going forward.
l
I pretty much agree with this. The dinosaur was nothing more than an advert of sorts, so they could put it in the trailer and get people thinking 'look, T Rex', and then was wasted (on another note, it was to big, even if they dealt with that in a throwaway line)
I liked how Capaldi seemed to lose the last vestiges of Smith in his opening scenes, evolving rather suddenly into a new character. There were also some nice parallels with Tom Baker in Robot (his first episode). I can't fault Capaldi at all.
I felt all the Scottish stuff was Moffat doing his bit for the referendum, and was really out of place, not least because the Doctor is Gallefreian, the accent is just an accent.
Clara was better written nor that she's not a plot device, and it was nice to see the Doctor being critical of a companion for once. I still eagerly await her departure, I think that she is easily the weakest of the modern companions.
The balloon scene was great, but unfortunately the other side of the plot let it down. Vastra, Jenny and Strax are really showing signs of being overused now, and while it was almost nice to see a return of the Clockwork Robots, thinking about it more it just seems like Moffat running out of ideas. There was no visual link between the two, they would almost have been better left separate (especially as first episodes are meant to be able to bring in new viewers)
In the end, it left me with the same sense of mediocrity that blighted the last half of series 7, there was nothing that really stood out, and it wasn't massively memorable. Compared to the earlier stuff, particularly Tennant's series and Smith's first couple of series, it just seems flat, and that looks to unfortunately have become the standard. It's a shame, after Name/Day/Time of the Doctor, which were all excellent, but this was just a return to less than stellar form.
Next week, I feel, will either be amazing or terrible. I just cross my fingers it's not another Nightmare in Silver...
poor effects
Tied and hackneyed writing
Wasted opportunity for a dinosaur in London
laughable "enemies" - please hold still whilst I ever ever so slowly raise my sword arma dn then even more slowly try to hit you with it...........
the end was quite nicely done but should have been the start.
The Lizard lady and her maid/husband is fun - but both are apparently completely inept in combat
The Sontarian is just embarassing
I find Vastra and team pretty tiresome to be honest, it the same jokes and things from them. They didn't need to be in this and they didn't interact much with the doctor in a meaningful way. They didn't need to turn up at the end with swords. They could have been written out and the episode shorted to the standard 45 minutes which would focus more on the characterisation of Clara and the new Doctor, who were the best bits of the episode anyway. I felt like the story was longer for writer Stephen Moffat to include his favourite characters. I suppose I should be thankful River Song didn't turn up too. I don't know if Moffat is angling for a spin off series like RTD got with Torchwood, but it sure feels like it.
But that aside, the bits with the Doctor were great. The 'threat' was pretty low in this episode, no risk of planetry destruction or mass death, but still a villain needing to be stopped. That gave time for the Doctor and Clara to shine. The best scenes were with the tramp in the alley and later in the restaurant. That's really where they found their feet and it was lovely. More of that and less of the dead wood with Vastra to tighten this up would have imoroved it a lot. As it is, I found it a bit long which I almost never feel with Dr Who.
True, I think if you were to cut the Heaven bit at the end, cut most of the Vastra/Jenny/Strax stuff, and life the ultimately pointless dinosaur, and it ran for 60 mins rather than 80, there might be something good here.
I thought the new episode was pretty good. Still hate the companion, but I like the new spin on the doctor.
He seems pretty morally ambivalent so far, which is an interesting progression. Did he steal the coat and clothes (I know there was talk about the watch trade, but what good does a watch do to a guy that could freeze)? Did he push the guy out of the balloon? The little speech he gave at the end about being good and bad.
I watched it again, and it was much better the second time. Still nothing on the best of Tennant's era (series 3&4 are really the best of the new era, I think), but then it was never going to be.
I also realised, if you cut about the last 15 minutes, end it with the guy 'falling' from the balloon, it would have been a much better episode. The Doctor abandoning Clara only to come back added nothing at all, I really could have done without the 'plot arc' but at the end, and while Matt's cameo was neat, the episode would be no worse for losing it.
Capaldi has so much potential, I just hope it isn't stifled by bad writing.
I thought it was ok, I feel Capaldi has potential to be a good doctor, though I sincerely hope that a new companion is coming up soon. One question I had though - who was the woman at the very end? I figured it was a call-back to an earlier episode or something?
Dark Apostle 666 wrote: I thought it was ok, I feel Capaldi has potential to be a good doctor, though I sincerely hope that a new companion is coming up soon. One question I had though - who was the woman at the very end? I figured it was a call-back to an earlier episode or something?
There are many theories. The Rani, The Master, River, Clara, a TARDIS personified, but it's not someone we've seen before, at least in this form. Her announced title is 'the Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere', but that is probably just a red herring.
It's also just unnecessary. It would be much better to have a series without a plot arc from the word go. It used to be there were things you could notice, that subtly hinted at a plot arc, like the Bad Wolf references in series 1 or Rose showing up on screens in series 4. Now, there's apparently a need for the plot arc to douse you in cold water to make sure you pay attention, hit you in the face with a cricket bat and scream 'I am a Plot Arc!' at the end of each episode.
Now, there's apparently a need for the plot arc to douse you in cold water to make sure you pay attention, hit you did the face with a cricket bat and scream 'I am a Plot Arc!' at the end of each episode.
Maybe its to draw attention away form how bad the rest of the epsiode is by having something equally dull
It's also just unnecessary. It would be much better to have a series without a plot arc from the word go. It used to be there were things you could notice, that subtly hinted at a plot arc, like the Bad Wolf references in series 1 or Rose showing up on screens in series 4. Now, there's apparently a need for the plot arc to douse you in cold water to make sure you pay attention, hit you in the face with a cricket bat and scream 'I am a Plot Arc!' at the end of each episode.
Welcome to "modern" television series.... It's something that someone at the TV executive level noticed made most shows more popular to people. Now, everything has an expanded story arc, as opposed to a serial story arc.
I do agree with you that there are sometimes, better or more proper ways of handling the plot arc of an entire season, and that Moffatt doesn't really like doing that too much.
Watching the new episode, I'm optimistic about the future, and really liked Capaldi's parts, especially the end with the robot in the balloon, but much of the episode, particularly the Clara parts, felt like a waste of air time.
It's also just unnecessary. It would be much better to have a series without a plot arc from the word go. It used to be there were things you could notice, that subtly hinted at a plot arc, like the Bad Wolf references in series 1 or Rose showing up on screens in series 4. Now, there's apparently a need for the plot arc to douse you in cold water to make sure you pay attention, hit you in the face with a cricket bat and scream 'I am a Plot Arc!' at the end of each episode.
Welcome to "modern" television series.... It's something that someone at the TV executive level noticed made most shows more popular to people. Now, everything has an expanded story arc, as opposed to a serial story arc.
I do agree with you that there are sometimes, better or more proper ways of handling the plot arc of an entire season, and that Moffatt doesn't really like doing that too much.
I don't mind a plot arc, but when you get an entirely unrelated part overshadowing the end of an episode, it just detracts from it and just doesn't need to be there. There's no subtlety to it, that's the problem.
Wyrmalla wrote: The writing was a little better than the previous season, but still fairly naff. Capaldi's a better actor than Smith at least, though it would help if he didn't have to deliver such horrible lines. The whole thing seemed to be written at the same level as some fan fiction. I skipped the last season, but probably will stick with this one for Capaldi at least. The writing did come across a little too much like Sherlock, as were certain bits pretty cringe worthy (people don't talk like that in the real world...). It'll be nice when the Companion's killed off at least. Something to look forward to (her character was too much for me to put up with with that last series. I'll stick with this one hoping she'll die eventually in an overly weepy manner).
I wonder who wrote all the lines regarding the Scots too? They seemed a bit out of place. I mean I like that there's Scottish actors in this season, but it'd been nice if the writers didn't think they needed to draw attention to them with big signs and arrows. The references to the Independence referendum at the end too seemed pretty odd too (well I took them to be talking about the referendum. The choice of the word "vote" being used implied it to me). Meh, Moffat's a terrible writer.
Spoiler:
And yup, that sure looks like the Rani to me. I was wondering if they were going to do anything with her again.
No, it wasn't her.
All the references to paradise, it was
Spoiler:
the villain girl from paradise towers (Sylvester Mccoy episode) and her candy maker robot, the Rani would have been a better choice for villain for the season.
The antagonist in that one was the caretaker guy, wasn't it? I don't remember a girl one.. Unless you mean the gangs (kangs?) and they weren't villains.
pretre wrote: I'm not spoilering, since I think you're way off.
The antagonist in that one was the caretaker guy, wasn't it? I don't remember a girl one.. Unless you mean the gangs (kangs?) and they weren't villains.
no, I meant the happiness patrol. with the kandy robot.
I got the episodes wrong, I will turn in my fan card now.
I finally managed to watch it with my family on catch-up last night. We were all left slightly disappointed and confused.
Peter Capaldi was good.
Clara is as nice to look at as ever but still annoying, however I believe she is due to get written out soon in favour of a male companion. (My daughter calls her a useless version of Amy.) That will finally put paid to the female companion as pseudo girlfriend theme that has been IMO much overused though clearly in this episode the scriptwriter decided to give everyone the news in banner headlines.
I liked the mechanical robots. They don't seem strong enough to be major villains but their leader in this one had a good level of pathos which brought back some of the moral points of the whole Dr Who experience.
I agree about the fighting skills of the Vestra team. I always like Strax though.
My daughter thought the mysterious lady in the robot's heaven was the "Doctor's Wife" i.e. the intelligent core of the Tardis who presumably translated the robot into a virtual envirinment. It may have been the same actress or a similar looking one. I took that character to be this series's plot arc's major villain, in which case we may see the robot come back in a later episode and his attitude towards Dr Who will be interestingly ambivalent.
Mr Morden wrote: I and other friends were hoping for at least one dr to be less shouty - going to see if tonights epsiode is any better than last weeks effort
You are aware that The Doctor is being played by Peter Capaldi this go round, right?
Mr Morden wrote: I and other friends were hoping for at least one dr to be less shouty - going to see if tonights epsiode is any better than last weeks effort
You are aware that The Doctor is being played by Peter Capaldi this go round, right?
Just saw the latest episodes and quite enjoyed it. Capaldi remains quite understated which is nice.
My 2 year old had a late sleep so was playing in the front room while I was watching it. The first sight of the Dalak patient and he jumped up out of the ball pool and leapt on to my lap as watched the rest of the show half hiding his face half watching the whole thing - Classic Dr Who reaction!
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Welcome back Doctor! Brilliant stuff this week. Some parts were a tad predictable, but overall Capaldi was great yet again, the Daleks were handled very well and even Clara was less annoying.
Spoiler:
I could have done without the scene with Missy that utterly killed the tension of that scene, but other than that it was great.
I loved the Doctor's jokes at Clara's expense and the fact he left the guy to die and even used his death, certainly evidence of the darker edge we were promised.
Also, hearing a Dalek say that 'resistance is futile' was far more exciting that it should have been!
This season so far seems to have a thing for having Game of Thrones actors playing cameo roles ...before dying horrible. Taking bets on whether Sean Bean'll show up next week. =P
Ah, but there is some decent actors in this season actually (barring the GoT ones). I've liked Michael Smiley's other roles, and whilst he was a bit underutilised this episode, it was still nice to see him. The writing's still crap though, but its more of a consistent manure rather than the watery dollop that the previous seasons have been. The change in Doctor's character is good, even if its played quite bluntly, though again, its better than chirpy Matt Smith.
I can't help but think a lot of this group will be revisited in another episode.
I know it's a daft thing to say but...
Spoiler:
A surprising number of people, well, actually survived this episode compared to other similar ones (EG Flesh and Stone, the Titanic special). I would thought that Uncle and Niece would have died horribly/tragically, plus Rusty getting killed off after his heel face heel turn. However, those doors remained surprisingly open.
This episode was way better than last weeks, and I'm really liking that they made Daleks truly scary again rather than the tin-pot pushovers they've otherwise been (as the humans simply could do nothing to stop even a single Dalek). Clara's character feels increasingly unnecessary however and forced, and the awkward contrast between her "real life" and the "Doctor's World" serves more to distract from the narrative than aid it. Capaldi however was great and I'm liking him as the Doctor much better than Matt Smith (who wasn't awful, just didn't jive with me much). The darker edge is making me like show a whole lot more.
Actually, the humans DID manage to kill a couple of Daleks in the various battle scenes in the episode.
Which, I actually thought was very good and a massive improvement. If there's a situation where there is literally nothing that can be done, it's not scary to me, it's just boring - it's just marking time until the ***pull happens to save the day.
I think next week will be a more jokey episode from the trailer, which will hopefully lead to guest star Ben Miller getting some good lines. I don't mind more tongue in cheek episodes from time to time, especially if it sets up something darker further in, or even in the same episode (like The Crimson Horror, started funny then got serious and pretty dark)
Compel wrote: Actually, the humans DID manage to kill a couple of Daleks in the various battle scenes in the episode.
Which, I actually thought was very good and a massive improvement. If there's a situation where there is literally nothing that can be done, it's not scary to me, it's just boring - it's just marking time until the ***pull happens to save the day.
Did they? I may have missed it, I'll have to re-watch it.
When he left the guy to be killed by the giant... sorry.. I mean to be killed by the anti bodies I was reminded of Hartnell , the rock and the caveman for just a moment or two.
.. Does Clara remember much/anything of her splintered personalities ? Assuming not as one suspects she might have argued a bit more forcefully about the possibility of a good Dalek.
Gonna go out out on a limb and suggest the scene with the Gatekeeper/Missy "proves" that the Dr didn't push the robot from ep#1, but persuaded him...it... to sacrifice him/itself. An act echoed this week by the other lady soldier -- who I'd thought had disappeared for a moment when they landed in the "soup" .
.... course back in the Tennant era Davros said that the Dr turned people into weapons....
.. so is Missy collecting "weapons" with a grudge ?
Tactical_Genius wrote: I was annoyed that they re-used the "You would make a good dalek" thing from Eccleston's series.
Hmm, that almost annoyed me, but it's a line so brilliant I can forgive them. I've always liked the fact the Daleks see the Doctor as one of them, it says so much about both sides.
I really like the morally gray doctor, he has been very interesting. They seem to be doing a good job showing how he can be good but also has he potential for evil in him.
Wyrmalla wrote: This season so far seems to have a thing for having Game of Thrones actors playing cameo roles ...before dying horrible. Taking bets on whether Sean Bean'll show up next week. =P
Ah, but there is some decent actors in this season actually (barring the GoT ones). I've liked Michael Smiley's other roles, and whilst he was a bit underutilised this episode, it was still nice to see him. The writing's still crap though, but its more of a consistent manure rather than the watery dollop that the previous seasons have been. The change in Doctor's character is good, even if its played quite bluntly, though again, its better than chirpy Matt Smith.
Look back to previous seasons, GoT has had a lot of actors on Who. There's only so many to choose from over there...
Finally a old school style Doctor is back, now we just need a old school style companion like Sarah Jane or even Donna instead of the "please do me Doctor" companions they keep giving him.
Noir wrote: Finally a old school style Doctor is back, now we just need a old school style companion like Sarah Jane or even Donna instead of the "please do me Doctor" companions they keep giving him.
Speaking of companions, when did the doctor take up his "no military" policy?
I actually like Clara "this is the look I give you, right before I smack you" It probably is her last season though, new doctor needs a new companion.
Noir wrote: Finally a old school style Doctor is back, now we just need a old school style companion like Sarah Jane or even Donna instead of the "please do me Doctor" companions they keep giving him.
Speaking of companions, when did the doctor take up his "no military" policy?
I actually like Clara "this is the look I give you, right before I smack you" It probably is her last season though, new doctor needs a new companion.
Yeah, I found the no military thing odd too. As it was never a problem before.
I've been watching the earlier seasons of the new Who recently and I think the Doctor very much was reminded of his conversations with Davros in the Tennant era.
After that, (and losing Amy) the Doctor is probably very much aware that what he needs in a companion is a Morality Pet not an effectively serving soldier (or recently left one), as a soldier would have different considerations, ones the Doctor would already consider.
After all, Daleks are the ultimate soldiers and... The Doctor is a Good Dalek.
In the new era, he's generally been critical of soldiers, from the UNIT pig-killers in Aliens of London to the armed Clerics in Flesh and Stone, so it makes sense he refuses to take Journey.
As for what he needs in a companion, I think this line sums it up rather brilliantly:
'Yes, she's my carer. She cares so I don't have to.'
So yeah, moral compass and nice person to stop him being too, well, like himself. It's the same thing as the 'Just save someone' from Donna. (Incidentally, he's now for the face of the guy he saved. Trying to tell himself something, maybe?)
Noir wrote: Finally a old school style Doctor is back, now we just need a old school style companion like Sarah Jane or even Donna instead of the "please do me Doctor" companions they keep giving him.
Speaking of companions, when did the doctor take up his "no military" policy?
I actually like Clara "this is the look I give you, right before I smack you" It probably is her last season though, new doctor needs a new companion.
It's funny because rumors online have it that "Mr. Pink" is going to be the next companion, or will be a Rory type of companion... which would basically break the Dr.s "no military" rule (although, on a technicality he'd still be following it as Mr Pink is FORMER military )
Seems a bit contrived given that the Doctor hung out with soldiers for years in the 70s and considered them all friends. The closest thing he has to a best friend across his life is arguably the Brigadier and he's had servicement companions, Harry and Ben were both sailors.
The anti-military thing started with RTD and is a bit of a contrived drum to beat. In the 70s UNIT were sometimes right, sometimes wrong, their use of force was supported/condemned by the Doctor depending on the circumstances. If they were wrong, it was shown their heart was in the right place. In the New Series, the military are nearly always wrong so that the Doctor's anti-military stance can be proven right, and the depiction of the military seems a little more mean spirited. Mr Pink could be characterised with a sympathetic view of a military man to set him apart, but I hope they don't make a big thing over how atypical and special it makes him so that the Doctor will take him on board the Tardis.
It could be to do with the fact that most people working on Dr Who in the 70s had either been in the war or done national service, and people today just don't have any experience of the military.
I liked the black soldier girl although she seems to be a one-off. Teacher Pink has possibilities for the future.
Saw the Dalek episode. Why is Capaldi vaunted? The story and his acting seemed like crap. Frankly I was bored to death with the Dalek episode. Oh wow yet another Dalek episode. This didn't seem like the Doctor of Old. It felt tired and straining to come up with an idea and an episode.
Compared to a Breaking Bad, Tyrant, the Bridge, or even an old STOS this series couldn't make it. Sorry but it kind of sucked.
Other theories include, old/future-incarnation of Clara.
Potentially crazy River Song.
The Living Incarnation of The TARDIS from 'The Doctors Wife'
I've even heard people suggest that she's 'The Valeyard' which just makes things messy...
Other theories include, old/future-incarnation of Clara.
Potentially crazy River Song.
The Living Incarnation of The TARDIS from 'The Doctors Wife'
I've even heard people suggest that she's 'The Valeyard' which just makes things messy...
not the Valeyard, more likely the Rani.
I'm leaning towards the girl with the eye patch that kidnapped river now.
In all honesty, I expect it to be someone new. Working on the fairly safe assumption that she ties into the series finale, she'll likely be associated with the Cybermen, rather than a separate force or faction. Maybe harvesting people that door for the Doctor to give them a second chance of life as Cybermen.
Other theories include, old/future-incarnation of Clara.
Potentially crazy River Song.
The Living Incarnation of The TARDIS from 'The Doctors Wife'
I've even heard people suggest that she's 'The Valeyard' which just makes things messy...
I honestly thought that the "head priest" girl from the Papal Mainframe and all that was another regeneration of River Song.....
Also, I'd say she's definitely not the TARDIS, because they aren't even the same actor (and for something as quirky as the TARDIS was, I doubt they'd want any confusion to the matter if she were the TARDIS)
-Shrike- wrote: All I want is an episode where Steven Moffat doesn't insert another of these scenes in his subtle, sledge-hammer-to-the-face way.
Not likely to happen. For the same reason that all episodes mentioned Bad Wolf or the cracks, etc so on in their respective seasons.
I know, I'm just not a big fan of the way Moffat inserts references to an overall story arc. Bad wolf was very well done (IMHO), it was a name drop for the most part, until Episode 11, when the Doctor first commented on it. I don't remember any finale references in series 2 and 3, and series 4 only had Rose appearing on screens in a few of the episodes.
As for the cracks and whatever series 6 was... ugh. Continually zooming in and showing us a crack at the end of every episode was just silly by the end.
-Shrike- wrote: All I want is an episode where Steven Moffat doesn't insert another of these scenes in his subtle, sledge-hammer-to-the-face way.
Not likely to happen. For the same reason that all episodes mentioned Bad Wolf or the cracks, etc so on in their respective seasons.
I know, I'm just not a big fan of the way Moffat inserts references to an overall story arc. Bad wolf was very well done (IMHO), it was a name drop for the most part, until Episode 11, when the Doctor first commented on it. I don't remember any finale references in series 2 and 3, and series 4 only had Rose appearing on screens in a few of the episodes.
As for the cracks and whatever series 6 was... ugh. Continually zooming in and showing us a crack at the end of every episode was just silly by the end.
Every season has 1 or more foreshadowing events that repeatedly came up, tying the disparate stories together into one arc.
Season 1 was Bad Wolf
2 - Torchwood
3 - Mr Saxon
4 - Disappearing planets foreshadowing
4.5 - knock 4 times foreshadowing
5 - Cracks
6 - Silence will fall
7 - Impossible Girl sightings
Automatically Appended Next Post: Even the old series had big arcs like this that tied together. It is nothing new and certainly not unique to Moffat.
Even the old series had big arcs like this that tied together. It is nothing new and certainly not unique to Moffat.
While true, I think the argument is that these overall arcs could be better done than currently.
Well, I certainly see the argument, although I've been a fan of the new series ones, so I disagree.
I have no issue with plot arcs, even the Cracks and Silence that were openly confronted, but if we're going to get a 'Here's a fething plot arc, pay attention' bit being shoehorned into everyone else's episodes, it's going to get very, very annoying.
Even the old series had big arcs like this that tied together. It is nothing new and certainly not unique to Moffat.
While true, I think the argument is that these overall arcs could be better done than currently.
Well, I certainly see the argument, although I've been a fan of the new series ones, so I disagree.
I have no issue with plot arcs, even the Cracks and Silence that were openly confronted, but if we're going to get a 'Here's a fething plot arc, pay attention' bit being shoehorned into everyone else's episodes, it's going to get very, very annoying.
That's the thing though; they've done that in every series of the new Who. I'm not sure why it is suddenly annoying...
Because it's never this intrusive. A word or short scene at the end of each episode was fine, the of comment it the same, but first they put in a big scene in the end of an opening episode, killing the resolution and overshadowing the episode's own plot, and then they hammer in an utterly incongruous scene that completely kills the tension and tone of the scenes on either side. I'd rather have no plot arc than one that ends up taking precedence over the individual episodes.
Paradigm wrote: Because it's never this intrusive. A word or short scene at the end of each episode was fine, the of comment it the same, but first they put in a big scene in the end of an opening episode, killing the resolution and overshadowing the episode's own plot, and then they hammer in an utterly incongruous scene that completely kills the tension and tone of the scenes on either side. I'd rather have no plot arc than one that ends up taking precedence over the individual episodes.
30-60 seconds at the end of the episode isn't taking precedence over the whole rest of the episode. That's like saying that 'Next on... X Show' completely takes precedence over the rest of the episode.
Either way, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
The whole "Next on... X" is a modern thing that started from America. It was already bad enough in the late 70s to be parodied on the series "Soap". Presumably today's British TV viewers are too stupid to understand principles of dramatic development. (I know my daughter is.)
Frazzled wrote: Are you talking about the chickie that looked like an alcie with badly (again read alcie) applied makeup?
Umm... What?
We're talking about Missy:
Spoiler:
Automatically Appended Next Post: Wow. Don't google too much on Missy. Apparently, the end script for this season has been partially been leaked. Let me just go ahead and start drinking until I forget.
I agree, this seasons plot arc seems kinda forced. Atleast with the Bad Wolf stuff it was something that you would notice and be like.... hmm I seen that somewhere else what is that all about.
This it all like CRAZY MARY POPPINS BITCH UP IN YOUR FACE CAUSE WE ARE IN HEAVEN BITCHES!!!
If they keep this up every episode I think it is going to get more annoying.
Either way, we have a Scottish doctor... so there's that.
Either way, we have a Scottish doctor... so there's that.
Which means he can complain about things!! Although, it would be nice to have a tiny throwback comment to Doc 9, in the whole "are you from the north?" "yeah, but then, lots of planets have a north" since Scotland is a wee bit north of where 9s accent was from
Changing subject slightly to thinking about Danny Pink joining the TARDIS.
He might bring an interesting aspect to the show in that, he could be a mirror of The Doctor in a lot of ways.
We know that he's a former soldier, who suffers from some form of PTSD as a result of doing 'some thing' that, not only does he feel exceedingly guilty about himself, but 'some thing' that he expects others to judge him very harshly about.
The Doctor is often described as 'The man who started running and never stopped' being confronted with someone whol had similar experiences to him but DID choose to stop 'running' might make some very compelling tv.
Compel wrote: Changing subject slightly to thinking about Danny Pink joining the TARDIS.
He might bring an interesting aspect to the show in that, he could be a mirror of The Doctor in a lot of ways.
We know that he's a former soldier, who suffers from some form of PTSD as a result of doing 'some thing' that, not only does he feel exceedingly guilty about himself, but 'some thing' that he expects others to judge him very harshly about.
The Doctor is often described as 'The man who started running and never stopped' being confronted with someone whol had similar experiences to him but DID choose to stop 'running' might make some very compelling tv.
I wouldn't necessarily say he feels exceedingly guilty... but he definitely carries the scars of war with him. It does make me wonder the sort of time frame the show writers are giving him from going from killing potentially "non-soldiers" to teaching kids, and whether it'd be realistic at all.
Beyond that, I definitely agree that, in the hands of an excellent writing team, it could make for an excellent story line, and some very poignant well played interactions between Pink and Doc... However we have Moffatt flying basically solo, so we'll see how things turn out.
We are over 10 years past the start of the Iraq and Afghan Wars.
It takes between one and four years roughly to qualify as a teacher in the UK, depending on your initial level of qualifications. There is time for a soldier to have fought in the war, left the army, retrained as a teacher and be employed in a school.
It is surprising where ex-soldiers end up, especially officers who have the advantage of a higher level of education to start with.
My old boss at Sony was a captain in infantry before going into Marketing. The bursar at my daughter's school was an army officer.
I've never really been a fan of the new Doctor Who series, and was never really exposed to the originals in any great capacity, but I've quite enjoyed the two episodes that have been on so far for this season.
Late to the discussion, but tenuous link to this series - the Helmets that Journey and her brother wear when in the space ship fighter thing in the first minute or so are made by the company I work at and are proper flying helmets, not fakey props
Frazzled wrote: Are you talking about the chickie that looked like an alcie with badly (again read alcie) applied makeup?
Umm... What?
We're talking about Missy:
Spoiler:
Automatically Appended Next Post: Wow. Don't google too much on Missy. Apparently, the end script for this season has been partially been leaked. Let me just go ahead and start drinking until I forget.
pgmason wrote: Isn't there some sort of fast-track scheme for ex-forces personnel to retrain as teachers as well,or have I imagined that?
I believe there is, or it was at least planned by the current government.
He would not need it anyway. He would easily have done a degree, followed by a 10 year officer commission including Sandhurst, several tours in Afghanistan, had time to retrain as a teacher afterwards, and still be only 35 years old if he was born in 1979.
Young enough to be attractive to the late 20s Clara. Old enough to have had the life experiences that would make him a very different sort of companion for the Doctor.
pgmason wrote: Isn't there some sort of fast-track scheme for ex-forces personnel to retrain as teachers as well,or have I imagined that?
I believe there is, or it was at least planned by the current government.
He would not need it anyway. He would easily have done a degree, followed by a 10 year officer commission including Sandhurst, several tours in Afghanistan, had time to retrain as a teacher afterwards, and still be only 35 years old if he was born in 1979.
Young enough to be attractive to the late 20s Clara. Old enough to have had the life experiences that would make him a very different sort of companion for the Doctor.
See but that's what I'm getting at... It "only" took me about 1-2 years to be able to talk about certain aspects of my second deployment without choking up in any way (I still have difficulty talking about some things, but that's a whole other thread)... And my question on the timeline was more along if Moffatt has done any sort of research on the subject, and goes with a "he was in the service, got out, and trained for a few years to be a teacher, but his issues are THAT ingrained that even after all this time he has trouble with them" as opposed to "he was a soldier, did some gak, now he's out and couple months later, boom! he's a teacher"
Well, I'm not entirely sure what the golden arrow actually did at the end, but Capaldi definitely made that episode worthwhile. Evidently, nobody at the BBC noticed him subtly flipping the bird at Robin Hood when he was putting his glove on.
I thought the episode was a bit hokey and forced in places but Calpaldi's Doctor certainly carried it through for me. The robot soldiers were an awesome design too, and Ben Miller always makes a good villain. It will be interesting to see how next weeks episode, which from the trailer looks far more cerebral, pans out. Looks like we will be getting at least some answers about Danny Pink too.
Paradigm wrote: Oh god, that was dire even for a jokey episode. The 'next week' trailer was the best bit.
Oh come on! That was great. I'm starting to get a very Pertwee feel to this doctor.
Nah, I'm not convinced. The only redeeming feature was the amazing-as-usual Capaldi, but what little plot there was to spell of was rushed and nonsensical (so, shooting a gold arrow at something makes it work better? I must remember that next time I need to recharge a computer ), Clara was back to being wooden as a chair leg, Robin and Co were just caricatures of themselves and impossible to take seriously.
I get that there are joke episodes, like The Crimson Horror, but they are at least usually entertaining and to some extent serious at the end. This was just bad, down there with Rings of Ahkaten, Nightmare in Silver and Love and Monsters.
On the plus side, next week's is slated to be very much like Midnight (small cast, small set, very character driven) which is one of my all time favourites, so I have high hopes.
I've got admit, I kinda liked this one. You do have to remember that ultimately, Dr Who is a family show though.
The Sherrif was enjoyable as a baddy and I like how he was pretty much played straightly.
The whole concept of Robin Hood being 'too heroic to be real' in The Doctors eyes, contrasting with Clara's thoughts on the Doctor was quite well played as well.
I liked that Clara was making the point that legends can be true (and the Doctor surely has a few), but the episode as a whole (bar Capaldi as has been said) was crap. ...So back to the usual then I suppose. It wasn't so much the poor writing, as the premise of Robin Hood being a real person. It just annoyed me that two thirds of the way through they explained that he was indeed fictional, then went back on that. Has Doctor Who ever (recently) treated a fictional character as though they were real before? To me it was like having an episode in Hogwarts.
Wyrmalla wrote: I liked that Clara was making the point that legends can be true (and the Doctor surely has a few), but the episode as a whole (bar Capaldi as has been said) was crap. ...So back to the usual then I suppose. It wasn't so much the poor writing, as the premise of Robin Hood being a real person. It just annoyed me that two thirds of the way through they explained that he was indeed fictional, then went back on that. Has Doctor Who ever (recently) treated a fictional character as though they were real before? To me it was like having an episode in Hogwarts.
Yep, the 2nd doctor ended up in fairy tale land where all the fictional characters where real.
I think folks have a false sense of what doctor who is sometimes. (I think Compel gets it though. It's a family show with an enormous history. It is very hard to say 'This is how Dr Who is or should be' because it has worked in so many ways over the years.) This was very much an episode in the old tradition of pseudo-historicals. Heck, the 'robots in the past' thing has been done numerous times in the old series. As I said briefly earlier, the Capaldi-episodes are developing a very old school vibe and I'm guessing some nuWHo fans aren't going to like that as much.
Also, re: him being fictional. It isn't that they said he was fictional. It was the Robin Hood realized that he was legen.. wait for it.. dary. The doctor thought that he was fake because it was on the databanks, but he was wrong. It was in the databanks because Robin Hood is still famous in the future. I thought this was kind of obvious.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Paradigm wrote: Nah, I'm not convinced. The only redeeming feature was the amazing-as-usual Capaldi, but what little plot there was to spell of was rushed and nonsensical (so, shooting a gold arrow at something makes it work better? I must remember that next time I need to recharge a computer ), Clara was back to being wooden as a chair leg, Robin and Co were just caricatures of themselves and impossible to take seriously.
I agree with the gold arrow thing, but the caricatures thing just shows that you didn't get it. They weren't caricatures of themselves; that was the point. The idea was that the legends were exactly correct. The Doctor thought they were fake because of that, but the point was that sometimes legends are true, necessary and exactly what was printed on the tin.
I get that there are joke episodes, like The Crimson Horror, but they are at least usually entertaining and to some extent serious at the end. This was just bad, down there with Rings of Ahkaten, Nightmare in Silver and Love and Monsters.
With the exception of L&M (which was written by a fan, wasn't it?), those are all fine episodes. And L&M is only really bad for the end, other than that, it's just mediocre.
On the plus side, next week's is slated to be very much like Midnight (small cast, small set, very character driven) which is one of my all time favourites, so I have high hopes.
I am very excited after the preview. The next week looks great.
Also, for all of those who were raging about the heaven jumps in previous episodes, you'll see that this week was much more subtle.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, little bits:
- Did the doctor flip off Robin at one point (Putting on the gloves)?
- Did he use Venusian Judo to disarm Robin?
Feeling very combination of Pertwee's physicality, hand-on approach and Baker's grumpy humor.
It did look like there was some Venusian martial arts going on, complete with the obligatory yell, which was a nice nod. I noticed the glove thing too, but I think it was just coincidence.
I see where you're coming from with the characterisation of the Merry Men, but I just don't think they needed to ham it up so much. I'd have much preferred to see something like what was done in the Robin Hood series, a more 'realistic' take on it. With how many times Dr Who has put a different spin on history/legend, too see Robin ect shown just like characters from a panto just didn't work for me. I get what they were going for, but I don't think it works.
And I believe Absorbaloff was fan made, but the episode was written by an actual writer. Nightmare in Silver killed the Cybermen with the stupid Borg-like upgrading, it remains to be seen whether this year's finale fixes them.
Paradigm wrote: I'd have much preferred to see something like what was done in the Robin Hood series, a more 'realistic' take on it. With how many times Dr Who has put a different spin on history/legend, too see Robin ect shown just like characters from a panto just didn't work for me. I get what they were going for, but I don't think it works.
I'd argue this was a different spin of things. We've had 20 years now of po-faced Robin Hoods in TV, books and film (Russell Crowe). The episode was playing up this expectation as well - "he can't be real" "it's a trick" "he's a robot" etc and this was then deliberately inverted and ended up making a good point about Heroes and Legends as well.
This all came through to me as a very deliberate attempt at character reconstruction to me.
Vaktathi wrote: eeeehhh I just watched last weeks Doctor Who...
That was...quite awful.
As someone else mentioned, the best part was the "next week" preview
Agreed... Just watched it last night with the wife and a couple of friends, we actually had to pause the show, in order to crack our own jokes and laugh at how bad it was.... But it was good to show us more of the Doctor's current personality.
I really should caveat... It was a "bad" episode in much the same way Monty Python and the Holy Grail is really not a masterpiece of cinema.... There are great lines, and some great acting and overall, it was good fun (as I said we had to pause several times throughout the episode)
I don't think Doctor Who has ever been a masterpiece of television writing. It has been consistently fun, family friendly sci-fi for the last 50 years or so though. On that metric, this was a great episode.
I found it far too gimmicky and...badly re-treading obvious cliches and scenes we've seen done a thousand times over and then sprinkle in some evil robots. It's like it tried to do a joke episode but tried to take itself party seriously at the same time and just failed on both counts. It was not particularly enjoyable to watch. There were a couple of funny lines, but not enough to salvage that train wreck.
For this those that haven't seen it, the Horror channel in the UK are showing a bunch of the classic episodes, in remastered form for the most part. The new 'series' starts the end of this month. Here's a list of episodes that are being shown over the next few months:
http://www.kasterborous.com/2014/09/horror-screen-doctor-who-remastered-classics/
Edit: there's also a few on the same channel before then, including the Masque of Mandragora and the Planet of Evil. They're on at odd times, though, so if you want them it might be best to set them to record.
How old is the Doctor anymore? At one time I thought they quoted something like the 900s, but then I just got done watching the fourth season of Torchwood and they were making references to Jack being over 1000 and it made me wonder how those two are comparing in age at current.
Currently, the Doctor is about 2000. He was about 900ish when the newWho series started in 2005, was about 908 when Smith came in, and then spent about 200-300 years between leaving the Ponds and then going back for them/marrying River, and then spent about 7-800 years defending Christmas/Trenzalore. This, I think makes Smith's the longest incarnation in plot time.
Ah, right, Trenzalore. I imagine that did eat up a good chunk of time. Does seem like they just keep upping the ante with long spans of time and exponentially increasing ages that it loses meaning though.
AduroT wrote: Ah, right, Trenzalore. I imagine that did eat up a good chunk of time. Does seem like they just keep upping the ante with long spans of time and exponentially increasing ages that it loses meaning though.
He was already 900. 2000 isn't exponentially and isn't the big an increase. The big jumps also allow for non-TV continuity to use chunks of time, which is nice for folks who like the extended universe. I believe this is also very true of the time between 8 and 9. (Since 8 has soooooo many stories about him out there in EU, but the least in TV-U.)
AduroT wrote: Ah, right, Trenzalore. I imagine that did eat up a good chunk of time. Does seem like they just keep upping the ante with long spans of time and exponentially increasing ages that it loses meaning though.
He was already 900. 2000 isn't exponentially and isn't the big an increase. The big jumps also allow for non-TV continuity to use chunks of time, which is nice for folks who like the extended universe. I believe this is also very true of the time between 8 and 9. (Since 8 has soooooo many stories about him out there in EU, but the least in TV-U.)
Yeah, but over 1,000 years? That's just unnecessary, even a hundred years (excluding Trenzalore, that's a rant for another time) would seem a little excessive.
-Shrike- wrote: Yeah, but over 1,000 years? That's just unnecessary, even a hundred years (excluding Trenzalore, that's a rant for another time) would seem a little excessive.
It wasn't over 1000 years. 900 was his start of Nuwho (as listed above). He spent approx 700-900 years on Trenzalore (Prose sources).
Somewhat clear milestones:
'First' Doctor Borrows Tardis at 236
First Regen / Second Doctor: ~450
Second Regen / Third Doctor: 748
Fourth Doctor (Ribos Operation): 759
Fourth Regen / Fifth Doctor: 813 * (Prose Source)
Sixth Doctor (Revelation of the Daleks): 900
Sixth Regen / Seventh Doctor: 953
Eight Doctor: 1012 (Prose source)
War Doctor: 800-900 (Day of the Doctor)
Ninth: ~900 (Aliens of London) to ~1136 (Empty Child)
Tenth: 903 (Voyage of the Damned) 906 (End of time)
Eleventh: 907 (Flesh and Stone) 1103 (Impossible Astronaut) 1200 (Town called Mercy) ~1200 (Day of the Doctor) >1500 (Time of the Doctor)
Twelth: 2000+ (Deep Breath)
Several things you'll notice. His age is rarely clear and he lies quite a bit about it. It is even possible he doesn't know how old he is. Were there big jumps between episodes during Eleventh's tenure? Yes. Were they appropriate at the time? I believe so. Eleven was one of his most human regenerations where he had forgotten the most horrible things he had done and tried to immerse himself in emotion and 'family'. I like to think of Eleven as his 'mid-life crisis'.
Either way, the time spent on Trenzalore was part of the story and was used to emphasized the importance of what he was doing. I suppose instead we could have had an entire season where he was trapped on the planet and each episode was another fight there (very Pertwee there), but they chose not to do that.
@pretre, I thought that the 1st Doctor had said he was in the 5-600 year old range???
Anyhow, about the only thing I know for certain, aside from that the 11th doctor lies, is that 12 has said "I'm over 2000 years old, and not all of them were good"
The way he said it leads me to believe that he really is over 2k years in age, but ultimately, he could be 2001 or he could be 2100 and we really dont know.
Ensis Ferrae wrote: @pretre, I thought that the 1st Doctor had said he was in the 5-600 year old range???
Not that I've seen
First Doctor Edit
The First Doctor was eight when he entered the Academy, along with the Master. (TV: The Sound of Drums) He apparently left primary school at the age of 45. (PROSE: Shroud of Sorrow) He later described himself as having been "just a kid" when he first visited the Medusa Cascade, at the age of 90. (TV: The Stolen Earth) He said he was a "teenager" for fifty years. (COMIC: The Time Witch) When the Fourth Doctor was 759, (TV: The Ribos Operation) Romana noted the Doctor had been travelling in the TARDIS for 523 years. This would have made the Doctor about 236 when he first 'borrowed' the TARDIS and left Gallifrey. (TV: The Pirate Planet)
This figure was broadly supported by the TARDIS itself. When transferred into a humanoid body, the TARDIS said the Doctor had travelled with it for 700 years. At this point, the Eleventh Doctor was around 909 years old, putting his age when he stole the TARDIS about 200. (TV: The Impossible Astronaut, The Doctor's Wife) During the time Susan Foreman travelled with the Doctor, Ian Chesterton, and Barbara Wright, she knew that despite his apparent maturity, in terms of their own species the Doctor was considered an adolescent. (AUDIO: Here There Be Monsters) He stated he had been travelling in the TARDIS for 60 years when he visited 64, putting his age at 296. (PROSE: Byzantium!) The Doctor spent "centuries" studying at the Time Lord Academy. (COMIC: Mortal Beloved) Magnus chided the Doctor for not regenerating and for holding on to this incarnation as long as he did (COMIC: Flashback). This incarnation regenerated when about 450. (TV: The Tomb of the Cybermen)
Anyhow, about the only thing I know for certain, aside from that the 11th doctor lies, is that 12 has said "I'm over 2000 years old, and not all of them were good"
The way he said it leads me to believe that he really is over 2k years in age, but ultimately, he could be 2001 or he could be 2100 and we really dont know.
Yep, he could be 2999 for all we know or he could be lying as well.
Paradigm wrote: Well, in Day of the Doctor Smith says 'too old to remember if I'm lying about my age, that's how old I am'. So yeah, I'm not sure he actually knows.
Yeah, I largely agree with the idea that he doesn't really know. Afterall, it's not like he can check the calendar. The only really legit ages we know about are the ones that the Tardis gave, in my opinion, since the tardis should be able to figure that kind of thing out. That puts him at 900+ years minimum (since we know he was 200 or so when he stole the tardis and she said he'd been travelling with her for 700 years).
Gah, really don't know what to think about tonight's one. Pending a rewatch, I think:
Orphanage bit: good
End of Universe bit: good
Rom-com bits: why?
The last bit (you'll see what bit I mean): For the love of Rassilon make it stop, and leave the show alone!
Spoiler:
I'm really in two minds about it. There were some great themes brought up, proper Who-style taking the mundane and making it freaky, and although some of the ground covered had already been covered by the Silents, or still worked. Similarly, the idea of something existing just to hide and reveal itself to the last living being (or not) was a great one. I loved the ambiguity in both scenes like that.
But I have a real issue with the last scene on Gallifrey, though. 1) Clara is already so involved with the Doctor's life after the 'Impossible Girl' incidents, there's no need to have her be the reason he 'fears the dark' as week is just too far. I'm all for companions changing the Doctor, but preferably during their time with him, rather than hiding under the Child-Doctor's bed. 2) It undermined the earlier ambiguity, and while it didn't actually answer the question, it weighted it heavily towards there being nothing there at all.
I'm also not a fan of Danny possibly being a Plot thing, is it too much to ask for a companion who is just a character?
On the plus side, Capaldi was brilliant and even Coleman gave a good showing, particularly in the orphanage scene.
Overall, I think there was some wasted potential, though. It could easily have been a two parter, the first one making more of the orphanage bits and the second the 'last planet' bit. Plenty of Chills/scares to be had there.
What I don't understand is, shouldn't there have been a few references to the 'Sound of Drums' related episodes too? And the Toclafane. It seemed odd to miss that whole thing out.
Compel wrote: What I don't understand is, shouldn't there have been a few references to the 'Sound of Drums' related episodes too? And the Toclafane. It seemed odd to miss that whole thing out.
Paradigm wrote: Gah, really don't know what to think about tonight's one. Pending a rewatch, I think:
Orphanage bit: good
End of Universe bit: good
Rom-com bits: why?
The last bit (you'll see what bit I mean): For the love of Rassilon make it stop, and leave the show alone!
Spoiler:
I'm really in two minds about it. There were some great themes brought up, proper Who-style taking the mundane and making it freaky, and although some of the ground covered had already been covered by the Silents, or still worked. Similarly, the idea of something existing just to hide and reveal itself to the last living being (or not) was a great one. I loved the ambiguity in both scenes like that.
But I have a real issue with the last scene on Gallifrey, though. 1) Clara is already so involved with the Doctor's life after the 'Impossible Girl' incidents, there's no need to have her be the reason he 'fears the dark' as week is just too far. I'm all for companions changing the Doctor, but preferably during their time with him, rather than hiding under the Child-Doctor's bed. 2) It undermined the earlier ambiguity, and while it didn't actually answer the question, it weighted it heavily towards there being nothing there at all.
I'm also not a fan of Danny possibly being a Plot thing, is it too much to ask for a companion who is just a character?
On the plus side, Capaldi was brilliant and even Coleman gave a good showing, particularly in the orphanage scene.
Overall, I think there was some wasted potential, though. It could easily have been a two parter, the first one making more of the orphanage bits and the second the 'last planet' bit. Plenty of Chills/scares to be had there.
But the last bit just ruined it for me.
Agreed on most points, however this one was actually scary. The bit in the orphanage with the blanket, with them looking out of the window, was genuinely creepy and I thought back to my childhood self and I'd be frightened by it and I hope most of the kids watching it were... Because Capaldi Doctor wasn't there to make it all go away with a gurning smile and some fairy tale bs like his two predecessors, he was there to tell you it was bloody scary and you should be scared, just like McCoy Doctor and TBaker Doctor, that you should be ready to run or fight for your life because the universe is filled with things that want to end it.
Spoiler:
I was entirely happy with the episode, I even forgave it the gallifrey tie-in they just had to squeeze in. Because that wasn't the answer, because there still is something under the bed. Because whatever was sitting on the bed in the orphanage was never explained, was it.
I even didn't want to be rid of Clara, because whilst her dates and such were overdone, she's been freed of the fawning over the doctor thing and instead they are developing some interesting barbed banter and his references to her physical appearance are great.
My wife has hated NewWho since it started and has left the room to allow me to watch it, only to come back in when Matt 'Rocky Dennis' Smith has been in the throws of some timey whimey custard fishcake fueled gak and she's just muttered at it and asked me why I'm watching it because I've been so pissed about it. I watched it because it was a remnant of Dr Who. She agreed to watch the new Capaldi ones with me because she loves him so much in The Thick of It and has moderately enjoyed the first few episodes. She and I loved last night's show.
If they'd avoided the indulgent ending, if they'd been brave and fully gone with a sinister race that actually does dwell under the bed, just behind you (presumably playing cards with the vashta narada, the silence and everyone else...), I'd have loved it. I think from the orphanage, they sort of did, they didn't entirely close the book. The figure under the blanket was not explained.
Having watched it again, I liked it more. Still not a fan of the ending but the rest was fine.
I did feel there was a bit to much going on, and kind of got the impression that Moffat started writing with the idea of 'the thing behind your back' and then realised he had to fill more time, so shoved in the last bit by way of making the episode 'significant' and filling the time. He apparently did the same with Deep Breath, starting with the Dino idea and then not quite knowing where to go, hence the recycled Clockwork Droids part.
I'd like to have seen RTD or Pre-showrunner Moffat do this theme, and really make it the scare-fest it should have been.
I did like the orphanage scene a lot, as a) it's the kind of spine-tingling stuff the whole episode should have been, and b) I love the idea of the Doctor turning up and saving someone not because he had to or was and to, but just as a by product of proving a point. It's a very interesting spin on the idea and makes you wonder how many more he saved 'by accident'...
The Clara-Doc dynamic is getting better, mainly due to the Doc being so blunt and irritable, but at the same time an irascible kid that just wants to have adventures and know stuff. It's in this role where Capaldi shines, like when he just turns up and says 'I need you for a thing' and had every bit as much energy as Tennant or Smith, yet still has the presence/authority he shows elsewhere.
Ok so after posting in a few FB group and finding nothing but defensive fangirls who just want nothing but romance in a sci-fi show, I'm hoping to have a decent discussion here for the latest episode.. Listen.
I'm personally 50/50 on the epidosde..
Things I liked:
-The start of the plot was good with the Doctors theroies.
-The monsters seemed genuine interesting to find out about.
-Sass moments are welcome between Clara and the Doctor.
-Capalldi's performance was brilliant.
Things I did not like:
-The plot drifted off after the end of the universe scene, it felt as if Moffat (if he wrote it) got writers block and just thought "I know, I'll just bring back an historic episode that everyone loves, refrences it a shed ton and people will forgive it".
-Little was known about those monsters, Why do they hide? What is there intention? Are they evil or good?
-Another romantic angle.. tbh I'm getting sick of romantic angles being forced into plots, and the date scenes just feel like they were there to cover screentime, and I did just end bored watching the episode as I just wanted to get along with the more sci-fi part of the show.. If I want to see a romance show I will go and see one under that genre so please stop trying to cram it in..
-The end scene, wait wut? It felt forced in and Imo there was no need for it.. what was Clara trying to accomplish? Did she doubt the Doctor if he was going to solve the case? Did she doubt the Doctors confidence? It just felt forced in to as a "solution" to writers block imo..
Altogether I'm going 50/50 it had me interested, kept me engaged as I wanted to know who the monsters were and why are they hiding? However the episode did just fall a lot imo due to drifting off in romantic angles to fill in screentime and then dragging out an old episode for no reason other than "solving" writers block. Capalldis performance was brilliant
I will also agree with points people had posted with the FB groups and say that I do feel NewWho feels held back in terms of scares and Dark Stories, and I felt that Listen was another example of this..
One thing I was truly happy about was that in the "next episode" shows that Ablsom Daak is now cannon!
Paradigm wrote: Gah, really don't know what to think about tonight's one. Pending a rewatch, I think:
Orphanage bit: good
End of Universe bit: good
Rom-com bits: why?
The last bit (you'll see what bit I mean): For the love of Rassilon make it stop, and leave the show alone!
Spoiler:
I'm really in two minds about it. There were some great themes brought up, proper Who-style taking the mundane and making it freaky, and although some of the ground covered had already been covered by the Silents, or still worked. Similarly, the idea of something existing just to hide and reveal itself to the last living being (or not) was a great one. I loved the ambiguity in both scenes like that.
But I have a real issue with the last scene on Gallifrey, though. 1) Clara is already so involved with the Doctor's life after the 'Impossible Girl' incidents, there's no need to have her be the reason he 'fears the dark' as week is just too far. I'm all for companions changing the Doctor, but preferably during their time with him, rather than hiding under the Child-Doctor's bed. 2) It undermined the earlier ambiguity, and while it didn't actually answer the question, it weighted it heavily towards there being nothing there at all.
I'm also not a fan of Danny possibly being a Plot thing, is it too much to ask for a companion who is just a character?
On the plus side, Capaldi was brilliant and even Coleman gave a good showing, particularly in the orphanage scene.
Overall, I think there was some wasted potential, though. It could easily have been a two parter, the first one making more of the orphanage bits and the second the 'last planet' bit. Plenty of Chills/scares to be had there.
But the last bit just ruined it for me.
Agreed on most points, however this one was actually scary. The bit in the orphanage with the blanket, with them looking out of the window, was genuinely creepy and I thought back to my childhood self and I'd be frightened by it and I hope most of the kids watching it were... Because Capaldi Doctor wasn't there to make it all go away with a gurning smile and some fairy tale bs like his two predecessors, he was there to tell you it was bloody scary and you should be scared, just like McCoy Doctor and TBaker Doctor, that you should be ready to run or fight for your life because the universe is filled with things that want to end it.
Spoiler:
I was entirely happy with the episode, I even forgave it the gallifrey tie-in they just had to squeeze in. Because that wasn't the answer, because there still is something under the bed. Because whatever was sitting on the bed in the orphanage was never explained, was it.
I even didn't want to be rid of Clara, because whilst her dates and such were overdone, she's been freed of the fawning over the doctor thing and instead they are developing some interesting barbed banter and his references to her physical appearance are great.
My wife has hated NewWho since it started and has left the room to allow me to watch it, only to come back in when Matt 'Rocky Dennis' Smith has been in the throws of some timey whimey custard fishcake fueled gak and she's just muttered at it and asked me why I'm watching it because I've been so pissed about it. I watched it because it was a remnant of Dr Who. She agreed to watch the new Capaldi ones with me because she loves him so much in The Thick of It and has moderately enjoyed the first few episodes. She and I loved last night's show.
If they'd avoided the indulgent ending, if they'd been brave and fully gone with a sinister race that actually does dwell under the bed, just behind you (presumably playing cards with the vashta narada, the silence and everyone else...), I'd have loved it. I think from the orphanage, they sort of did, they didn't entirely close the book. The figure under the blanket was not explained.
I have one question. WHAT THE feth WAS ON THE BED.
I think it's safe to say it was definitely NOT a figment of everyone's imagination - that'd be cheating.
Pretty much it was left intentionally ambiguous as being either:
A) The secret monster under the bed thing.
Or
B) A kid hiding under the covers playing a prank.
The only thing the ending really 'resolved' was confirming that the Doctors own personal experience back in the barn on Gallifrey was not a monster-under-the-bed, but instead was just Clara. All the other situations are left ambiguous.
There's also apparently the question of, "Who wrote the word 'listen' on the blackboard." - I'll admit I wasn't paying close enough attention, I figured it was just part of the Doctors crazy theories.
However.... It's worth saying, there was no Big-Promised-Land storyarc hints in this episode that I could spot.
I liked the episode quite a bit. I really like the new Clare-Doctor relationship that they are developing more and more.
I liked that they never really said that there is nothing underneath the bed. These things could still be out there, nothing that happened actually says they are real or that they aren't real. Whatever was underneath the blanket could have been something (was the short bit of head we saw something or a representation of their imagination) or a prank. The noises in the station could have been the creatures, or it could have been everything the doctor actually said it was. The door was opening, but was it really the creatures or was it the doctor without realizing it when he hit it with the screw driver (ala Ouija Board)?
While Clara being part of the timeline all over the place is getting to be old news, it did have a lot of interesting relevation and raises interesting questions:
- So to be a Time Lord you HAVE to be a member of the military?
- If you cannot be a Time Lord without being in the military did the Doctor find a way around this rule?
- Did Clara leave "Dan the Soldier" with the young Doctor? Wouldn't he have recognized it when she pulled it out of the box for young Dan?
However.... It's worth saying, there was no Big-Promised-Land storyarc hints in this episode that I could spot.
Unless the Big-Promised-Land ankle includes the TARDIS and the telepathic connection was just a big arrow to remind people that the TARDIS is a separate being.
The scene before the opening credits bit was Amazing as a short stand alone bit. That bit was just really great, and the idea of the hidden monster is cool. The more you explore that idea though, the worse it gets, simply because nothing could ever live up to the hype of the unknown. so the episode gradually went downhill from the start. I don't think it ever got Bad though, and overall the episode was really quite good.
Interesting article, but I think the point it y really resides with me is not that Moffat likes using credit certain devices, but the fact they they're getting tired and overused by now.
Watching some of the earlier stuff recently, I can't say in good conscience that Moffat is a bad writer. The Empty Child is the only episode of anything to actually freak me out. The Girl in the Fireplace and Blink are masterpieces of television. The Silence and the Vashda Nerada were perfect cases of taking something mundane and making it scary (which came through again in the orphanage scene) and remain some of my favourite villains. However...
Those devices that were once new, exciting and scary (not-quite-human kids, tricks with sight/memory, peoples lives running at different speeds) are now just clichéd and have become common, and lost their power in the new episodes. That, and everything seems to be playing second fiddle to trying to make the episode 'matter', either through crowbarring in a
Plot Arc or through making it something revalatory like revealing the Doctor's childhood nightmare (personal preference, but I believe anything before he became The Doctor and stole the TARDIS should be left a mystery).
Looking back, some of the best episodes were the simplest: Blink was just 45 minutes of mystery, hardly any Doctor involved, and ultimately, it could have been removed entirely and that season's finale or the Doctor himself would be entirely unchanged, and that's no bad thing. These days it seems that every episode seems to have to be something profound or revelatory, which, really, should be saved for specials, a couple of episodes a series and finales in my opinion (the return of the two-parter would be welcome here).
On a side note, the othere issue I've realised I have with the new series and the last half of 7 is that every episode seems to take the first 15 minutes just to set it up. There has to be 5 minutes of Doctor doing something, then 5 of Clara, and then 5 of them meeting again, and before you know it, a third of the episode is gone! In the days of series 1-6, there was generally something going on before the credits even hit. We get that each time the Doctor and Clara only travel together occasionally, we don't need to waste time establishing that premise each week! This kind of slow start is fine in 2-part episodes where you have twice the time, but in general, things got going a lot quicker before now.
And once more, just poor. Badly written, unnecessarily drawn out, no engaging characters to speak of. I need a manual memory delete after that myself...
I wouldn't say it was *great* - I'd just call it, well, harmless.
Nothing big, or fancy, just an episode of a tv show. And, it's another episode without that subtle-as-a-brick overarching plotarc (aside from the phone mention). I was inwardly cringing at the thought of another Missy scene when the characters started being "killed off."
Started watching season 8. I'm really liking it so far. The Robin Hood episode was just pure fun
Listen was ok, imo. It was pretty scary and tense, but the ending felt inconsistent. I mean, you saw creature in the background after the bed sheet came off, you saw the airlock handle turning.
I get what they were going for, and it's absolutely brilliant twist, but I just don't think it matched the prior events that well.
Also, aren't the best hiders in the universe the Silence? I mean, they delete memories after being seen. That's pretty effective.
pretre wrote: Finally got to watch it and it was great! I think this doctor's catch phrase may be 'shut up' though.
Could also be "eyebrows" because he keep making reference to them.. whether they're his, and the reason why he's in charge, or Clara's (and her "wide" face)
I liked the bank heist in theory, but I hated the fact that I saw absolutely everything coming from a mile away save for the very end goal. Sometime I wonder if I have seen too much sci-fi shows to be hugely surprised anymore, but it might also be the writing.
Spoiler:
Both goals for the two co-stars, that the Doctor was the Architect, that the "suicide devices" were just get out of jail free cards that teleported them out of the bank, etc.
she'd be ace
