What i think so far:

Death throes should be renamed to falling over something like that. A lot of things can do mortal wounds now.

A Dakka Fex is now 97 points. In 7th 2 were 300 so you can now take 3 Dakka Fexes instead of 2 for the same points cost. And 3 will do the same amount of hits in 8th. compered to 2 in 7th. melee Fex drop from 120 to 97

Zoan's got nerfd IMO

Almost everything is cheaper now.

My last army list i build drop 400 points. feth yeah

It was:

2 Hive Tyrants
2 Liktors
20 Termagants
3 dakka Fexe
3 Zoans
6 Ripper
3 Biovores
2 Mawloc

1 Malanthrope (assuming its 85 points)

So more stuff on the table for Nids

EDIT: melee fex points were corrected

Here's the thing: ALMOST EVERYONE GOT NERFED. When everything gets nerfed, it's no longer nerfing, it's a balance overhaul!

That said, Melee Carnifex is 94 points; carnifex + monstrous scything talons (two pairs) (carnifex) + thresher scythe = 94 points.

 Shadelkan wrote:
Here's the thing: ALMOST EVERYONE GOT NERFED. When everything gets nerfed, it's no longer nerfing, it's a balance overhaul!

That said, Melee Carnifex is 94 points; carnifex + monstrous scything talons (two pairs) (carnifex) + thresher scythe = 94 points.

I believe OP is saying they got buffed.

 Shadelkan wrote:
Here's the thing: ALMOST EVERYONE GOT NERFED. When everything gets nerfed, it's no longer nerfing, it's a balance overhaul!

That said, Melee Carnifex is 94 points; carnifex + monstrous scything talons (two pairs) (carnifex) + thresher scythe = 94 points.

I am not complaing. I just want compere 7th to 8th. And most of the Tyranid units got buffed IMO.

While I'm excited for the buff to Tyranids as we needed something it does feel like the game is shoehorning several factions in favor of the armies that are going to be more prominent in the new storyline. I could be wrong but that's the way it seems.

On another note, time to break out the Fex trio again!

Only the current popular stuff got nerfed.

Have you seen the Genestealers? Holy crap they haven't actually been a creditable threat for editions! And Old One Eye is actually cheap enough in points for consideration.

Also one thing I noticed about the fex is that it's one of the few monstrous creatures that doesn't lose stats as it loses wounds (although this doesn't apply to Old One Eye).

nordsturmking wrote:
What i think so far:

Death throes should be renamed to falling over something like that. A lot of things can do mortal wounds now.

A Dakka Fex is now 97 points. In 7th 2 were 300 so you can now take 3 Dakka Fexes instead of 2 for the same points cost. And 3 will do the same amount of hits in 8th. compered to 2 in 7th. melee Fex drop from 120 to 97

A dakka fex with Devourers (67+8+8+8+8+7= 106pts) is worse than one with Deathspitters (67+10+10+10+10+7= 114pts) so it would be better to pay the extra 8pts for +1S and -1AP on your shots.

A melee fex is 94pts (67+20+7) or 103pts if you take Bio-Plasma.

I think the first 1/2 hour of my starter games of 8th will be checking my opponents worked out their points correctly, before the battle even starts. You need a maths degree to write an army list now.

I used to love facing off against stealers and carnifexes... Hope to see the old nids back.

Damn, I need to get more small bugs and carnifexes! I threw together a list of what I'd like to play with, and at 2000 points I only had 87 models for my Nids, and 60 of those were Termagants, and other 20 were Genestealers. I'm itching for a game to see how that goes, and then do another match where I just bring ALL of my Gaunts and Genestealers and gribblies to see how that goes!

If you owned less than 400 models for Tyranids, you weren't doing it right

There is a lot of good stuff for Nids. I've already built a bunch of lists based on my collection. Really feel I can put together things I wanted to play with a combination of Nids and Stealer cults.

so far I've got an Ambush! list:

Battalion Detachment
Hive Tyrant with Wings and 2x Monstrous Devourer with Brainleach Worms (199)
Hive Tyrant with Wings and 2x Monstrous Devourer with Brainleach Worms (199)
11 Termagants (44)
11 Termagants (44)
11 Termagants (44)
1 Mucolid Spore (20)
1 Mucolid Spore (20)
1 Mucolid Spore (20)

Vanguard Detachment
Patriarch (150)
17 Purestrain Stealers (306)
19 Purestrain Stealers (342)
17 Purestrain Stealers (306)

Supreme Command Detachment
Primus (76)
Primus (76)
Primus (76)
Primus (76)

And I'm working on a nidzilla list and a termagant swarm list.

Drager wrote:
There is a lot of good stuff for Nids. I've already built a bunch of lists based on my collection. Really feel I can put together things I wanted to play with a combination of Nids and Stealer cults.

so far I've got an Ambush! list:

Battalion Detachment
Hive Tyrant with Wings and 2x Monstrous Devourer with Brainleach Worms (198)
Hive Tyrant with Wings and 2x Monstrous Devourer with Brainleach Worms (198)

Edit: Missed off the tail.

Monstrous Devourers are 7 points a piece, not 8 points. 8 is for Deathspitters. He's only off by 1 point (because he did not account for the prehensile tail)

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Monstrous Devourers are 7 points a piece, not 8 points. 8 is for Deathspitters. He's only off by 1 point (because he did not account for the prehensile tail)

Whoops, looked at the wrong line.

Yep. Forgot the tail. Oops ie. I'll drop a termagant .


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I've been talking about onslaught with a friend of mine:



I think this is saying that if you advanced in your movement phase you are good to shoot without penalty on Heavy and Assault weapons and are ok to charge.

He thinks the same, but with the addition that you get to make an advance move in the psychic phase.

I can't get his reading out of that power. What do the rest of you think?

Drager wrote:
Yep. Forgot the tail. Oops ie. I'll drop a termagant .


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I've been talking about onslaught with a friend of mine:



I think this is saying that if you advanced in your movement phase you are good to shoot without penalty on Heavy and Assault weapons and are ok to charge.

He thinks the same, but with the addition that you get to make an advance move in the psychic phase.

I can't get his reading out of that power. What do the rest of you think?

My assumption is that you don't get to advance during the psychic phase but instead it drops the restrictions from having already advanced. During the movement phase you will need to decide to advance and hope the power goes off or to choose not to advance and avoid it's associated restrictions.

edit: i can see how he can read that from the wording if you isolate the "That unit can advance..." but I suspect that if the power was letting you do something out of turn order it would be more explicit.

Am I the only one that's tempted to just fill the table with meleefexes? they look terribly awesome under current rules

Shadeseraph wrote:
Am I the only one that's tempted to just fill the table with meleefexes? they look terribly awesome under current rules

Nope. Sing it brother. I'm already scouring second-hand fexes to bulk up my army (before the muggles here realizes how awesome they are).

I like most of the changes but there are few things that are weird:
1. Hive Tyrant/Swarmlord has its 5++ named Psychic Barrier instead of Warp Field?
2. Tervigon and Tyrannofex are double kit but for some reason identical looking limb on 1st is named Massive Scything Talon and on 2nd a Powerful Limb.
3. Haruspex/Exocrine model has a tail Tresher Scythe option but no rules for it.
4. Tyrant Guard in crowded Elite slot.
5. Sprocyst's Spore Node with 9'' range.

1. Hive Tyrant/Swarmlord has its 5++ named Psychic Barrier instead of Warp Field?

Probably couldnt copyright "Warp Field" #RoddenberrysGhost

 Ratius wrote:

1. Hive Tyrant/Swarmlord has its 5++ named Psychic Barrier instead of Warp Field?

Probably couldnt copyright "Warp Field" #RoddenberrysGhost

Jokes aside (although I liked that one being ST fan) Zoans still have their 3++ named Warp Field, so definitely not the case

 Shadow Walker wrote:
5. Sprocyst's Spore Node with 9'' range.

Why do you consider this weird?
I feel it makes sense considering you can be within 9" of an enemy unit when you deploy and if the node's range was any shorter nobody would come into range and if it was any longer you'd probably place it further back.

opu wrote:

 Shadow Walker wrote:
5. Sprocyst's Spore Node with 9'' range.

Why do you consider this weird?
I feel it makes sense considering you can be within 9" of an enemy unit when you deploy and if the node's range was any shorter nobody would come into range and if it was any longer you'd probably place it further back.

Yet it also has Deathspitters with range 18'' and can have cannons with range 36''.

Genestealer got a (please do not swear) huge buff +1/+2 if 10 or more A 5++ and a 2 point drop what the (please do not swear)^^ and i got 60 of these guys

This is gonna be the time of the genestealer and the Carnifex.

 Shadow Walker wrote:

2. Tervigon and Tyrannofex are double kit but for some reason identical looking limb on 1st is named Massive Scything Talon and on 2nd a Powerful Limb.

The Tervigon actually comes with a second set of scything talons that go where the bio-cannon arms on the Tyrannofex goes. Similarly, those scything talons can be replaced with crushing claws. The Powerful Limbs are just there to represent the Tyrannofex's old MC rules so it wouldn't be a giant mass of lumpy flesh when the enemy assault marines have a hankering for some tyrannoburgers.

Also a lot more units outside of the stealer and Carnifex got buffed. the Tervigon now it creates 10 termagants straight up and no chance of getting blue balls. The Exocrine's Ravenous Maw, if I'm reading it correctly, can potentially let it go up to 12 attacks (D3 hit rolls per attack), which would make it far more useful than it is now. Even the humble Hormagaunt and Termagant got better since now you can reroll to Hit rolls of 1 when there's more than 20 models (and if you take any less at the beginning, you're doing it wrong ).

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:

 Shadow Walker wrote:

2. Tervigon and Tyrannofex are double kit but for some reason identical looking limb on 1st is named Massive Scything Talon and on 2nd a Powerful Limb.

The Tervigon actually comes with a second set of scything talons that go where the bio-cannon arms on the Tyrannofex goes. Similarly, those scything talons can be replaced with crushing claws. The

You are right on that one, my mistake

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Yet it also has Deathspitters with range 18'' and can have cannons with range 36''.

True, though the chance for that many mortal wounds is too good and of course comes at a reasonable risk of being that close.
I feel if the spore node was any longer range it'd get a little too op as the risk is lessened.

Cult genestealers are too expensive, ambush should be rolled on with loads of acolytes and metamorphs. I prefer metamorph claw, even after they took nerf when losing rend. Patriarch or magus with power might from beyond, to help metamorphs, and if you really push it, get icon ward too. At the moment, Im gathering couple of flyrants with 2x twin devourer, even if its little old fashioned.. gotta love forge world.

opu wrote:

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Yet it also has Deathspitters with range 18'' and can have cannons with range 36''.

True, though the chance for that many mortal wounds is too good and of course comes at a reasonable risk of being that close.
I feel if the spore node was any longer range it'd get a little too op as the risk is lessened.

It could be their intention but Biovore has the same Spore Mines rules and range of 48'' and the brood of them is the same power level as Sporocyst.

Also I don't think anyone has talked about it, but the infamous Pyrovore isn't useless anymore.

It's not *good*, but at least it isn't completely useless. While it still has a low number of attacks, it's not as bad when compared to other melee units, so it might actually get to use that Acid Maw of his. Plus now there's a good number of chances for him to "explode' or at least bleed on the opponent without having to die to an instant death shot.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Also I don't think anyone has talked about it, but the infamous Pyrovore isn't useless anymore.

It's not *good*, but at least it isn't completely useless. While it still has a low number of attacks, it's not as bad when compared to other melee units, so it might actually get to use that Acid Maw of his. Plus now there's a good number of chances for him to "explode' or at least bleed on the opponent without having to die to an instant death shot.

Agreed. Pyros are definitely better. They can now mess a bit with enemy squads. I hope that new kit for Pyros/Biovores is on the way.

I like how this thread is the only faction thread with any sort of positivity.

Everyone else has been like "waaah our units are worthless!" while we've been salivating at genestealers and co.

Because nid fans know that at the end we will eat

speaking of which the local shop has a Tyranid Swarm box that hasn't sold in years.

I probably should snatch that up while it's still there. Mmmm all dem gribblies.

Small critters are now so much fun (so do get that box). I really like Hungering Swarm and Hail of Living Ammunition rules.

I'm stoked at trygon's new tunnel rules. It now works!

And the beast itself is also really good

Anyone noticed that GW article mistook Toxic Lashes rules for Lash Whip ones? Tbh I would prefer that units with LW would be attacking first rather than being able to attack dispite being slain. It would simulate living lashes well.

Holy Mother of God the Haruspex is a beast.

GW figured out how to make anti-horde melee critters.

Alcibiades wrote:
Holy Mother of God the Haruspex is a beast.

GW figured out how to make anti-horde melee critters.

Yeah, it is a beast but also 278 points.

I don't know why anyone would go Dakka Fex. Screamer Killer. Take the twin scything talons, grab some bio plasma, take 2, and throw them near OLD One Eye who adds +1 to hit with his other guys.

So Carnifexes hit on a 3 up rerolling 1s and get an additional attack. With every swipe of your scything talons dealing 3 dmg ap-3.

Why would you ever give them a gun?


Also Biovores.... just handing out mortal wounds from 4 feet away.

 Lance845 wrote:
I don't know why anyone would go Dakka Fex. Screamer Killer. Take the twin scything talons, grab some bio plasma, take 2, and throw them near OLD One Eye who adds +1 to hit with his other guys.

So Carnifexes hit on a 3 up rerolling 1s and get an additional attack. With every swipe of your scything talons dealing 3 dmg ap-3.

Why would you ever give them a gun?


Also Biovores.... just handing out mortal wounds from 4 feet away.

While I agree that Screamer Killer is back in glory (as it should), I think that cheap, tough weapon platform also have it uses. Especially that now you can buy 3 for 1 slot but still they will act separately = none is wasting its potential. You can have 2 cc and 1 for shooting. Good mix

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
speaking of which the local shop has a Tyranid Swarm box that hasn't sold in years.

I probably should snatch that up while it's still there. Mmmm all dem gribblies.

I just got that to start my tyranid army. Pretty good deal cost wise. I put some together that didn't have loadout options and then I was waiting for the book to figure out how to build the rest.

That's the great thing with the fex in this edition: it's back to what we oldblood nid players remember. A Flexible platform that can function well with a little customization for any role. It's still nowhere near as customizable as in 4th or 3rd (no 2+ armor, no extra wounds, no improving every stat with points, etc) it's probably got as close as it can get for the foreseeable decade.

EDIT: Also I think the DISTRACTION CARNIFEX tactic might also be back, since you can spam them with relative impunity and the Fex doesn't lose stats as it gets hurt unlike our other MCs. This means that a few lone fexes can be herded towards important enemy units on the cheap and they have to choose to either completely destroy one (as oppose to just cripple it by reducing it to half health like other MCs or vehicles) or ignore it and have their crap pushed in.

I think at this point taking OOE and spamming barebones fexes is the best choice at the moment for heavy support.

I would really, REALLY love to take the Tyrannofex with the Rupture cannon but even with his news rules and stats I don't think he is worth taking over the 2, almost three carnifex I could take in his place.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
I like how this thread is the only faction thread with any sort of positivity.

Everyone else has been like "waaah our units are worthless!" while we've been salivating at genestealers and co.

I think that's cause you faction essentially 'got what it wanted' being a faction below the top tier power.
All I literally ever heard about nids was, make 'fexes better, make genestealers better, more ways to play than flyrants, pyrovores need to be useful.

I'm genuinely happy for tyranids getting these kinds of buffs they are good and justified.

The negativeity comes from things going too far the other way in the other factions.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
I like how this thread is the only faction thread with any sort of positivity.

Everyone else has been like "waaah our units are worthless!" while we've been salivating at genestealers and co.

SoB are pretty stoked too.


Mostly because they forgot to make celestine unique so we can take 5 of them and make our whole army 2++ and heal 6d3 wounds or return 6 models per turn.

Stoked as in stoking the fire of never ending sadness.

 Boniface wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
I like how this thread is the only faction thread with any sort of positivity.

Everyone else has been like "waaah our units are worthless!" while we've been salivating at genestealers and co.

I think that's cause you faction essentially 'got what it wanted' being a faction below the top tier power.
All I literally ever heard about nids was, make 'fexes better, make genestealers better, more ways to play than flyrants, pyrovores need to be useful.

I'm genuinely happy for tyranids getting these kinds of buffs they are good and justified.

The negativeity comes from things going too far the other way in the other factions.

See I have an eldar army too (three in fact) and two of them are pretty happy about the new updates too. One of them is Biel Tan Aspect Warriors and the other is Alaitoc Pathfinders. Banshees are finally useful again, especially since a wave serpent is now a viable transport for them again. My Dark Reapers are better too, especially since I can finally field their Exarch with the Shuriken Cannon and not have him being a waste of points (due to everything having splitfire).

As for pathfinders, I should not have to explain how bad snipers have been so far, so it's refreshing to see them become useful again.

But nooooo all I hear from the eldar thread is "My bikes/Wraithlord/D-weapons are now useless!". Too many people there are so obsessed with their 7th edition "I win" buttons that none of them are looking at the other stuff. That or they're complaining about Dire Avengers (who come with a slew of special rules) being slightly more expensive than a potato in power armor.

For the record, I fully intend on fielding my aspect warriors now. The new detachments (I think vanguard is the one?) perfectly fits my idea for Aspect Warriors, since the majority of them are Elites. It even helps me dodge the whole Dire Avenger issue.

IG can't blob apparently and Vets became Elite with a loss of Carpace armor as a choice.

Gonna say the issue with Purestrain Genestealers attached to a Tyranid List is that they don't get the immunity to Moral unless the Patriarch is close to them, as Synapse effects <Hive Fleet> not Tyranid

Any thoughts on lictors? I feel they are a bit more ....fragile this version.

Maybe I am missing something.

Also, I am VERY excited for my bugs - finally going to have some presence on the table (I was never a big flyrant guy).

davethepak wrote:
Any thoughts on lictors? I feel they are a bit more ....fragile this version.

Maybe I am missing something.

Also, I am VERY excited for my bugs - finally going to have some presence on the table (I was never a big flyrant guy).

Lictors are a lot better this edition, one of the few units to get buffed

Anyone trying to hit them is at -1 (-2 for Deathleaper), and also get +2 save from cover

They also can reroll charge from DS

and have a 2shot Str6 assault weapon that can shoot into combat

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
I like how this thread is the only faction thread with any sort of positivity.

Everyone else has been like "waaah our units are worthless!" while we've been salivating at genestealers and co.

I have a feeling 8th is going to be a pretty good edition for Nids

GodDamUser wrote:
Gonna say the issue with Purestrain Genestealers attached to a Tyranid List is that they don't get the immunity to Moral unless the Patriarch is close to them, as Synapse effects <Hive Fleet> not Tyranid

Not sure why you'd bother taking purestrain in a nid list when regular genestealers are plain cheaper.
True they don't benefit from the cult ambush rule, but honestly the option for a trygon assault is way more spicier and the option for poison sacs (although a bit costy) is a boon, especially as the cost of a GS with both rending claws and poison doesn't even reach the base cost of a purestrain.
That and synapse is 8" base for most models in the nid list which beats the patriarch's 6"

opu wrote:
and the option for poison sacs (although a bit costy) is a boon

I wouldn't bother with poison myself..

But Adrenal glands giving that +1" charge is worth it

GodDamUser wrote:
I wouldn't bother with poison myself..

But Adrenal glands giving that +1" charge is worth it

'Fraid Glands aren't actually an option for genestealers, I guess the fact they can advance and charge is supposed to cover it

Trygons or anyone with 2 or more sets of scything talons are brutal now. The extra attacks generated are just nuts compared to every other option.

Each set reads "if the bearer has more than 1 set of scything talons it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"

You get 2 bonus attacks if you have 2 sets of scything talons. Trygons get 3.

If you have 2 sets of talons, and distribute your attacks between them, you get 1 prehensile pincer, 2 attacks with the first set, and 2 attacks with the second set. Each has their ability that gains you a bonus attack when attacking with "this weapon". It will trigger twice as you are using both weapons, so a tyrant ends up with a prehensile pincer attack and 6 monstrous scything talon attacks!

Mr ghoti wrote:
Trygons or anyone with 2 or more sets of scything talons are brutal now. The extra attacks generated are just nuts compared to every other option.

Each set reads "if the bearer has more than 1 set of scything talons it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"

You get 2 bonus attacks if you have 2 sets of scything talons. Trygons get 3.

If you have 2 sets of talons, and distribute your attacks between them, you get 1 prehensile pincer, 2 attacks with the first set, and 2 attacks with the second set. Each has their ability that gains you a bonus attack when attacking with "this weapon". It will trigger twice as you are using both weapons, so a tyrant ends up with a prehensile pincer attack and 6 monstrous scything talon attacks!

Pretty sure it's 1 extra attack total if you have more than one set.

The way I read it is that if the bearer has 2 or more sets of talons, it gets +1 attack. That's all. It's worded differently than the chainsword and it has an effect when used alone. Still though, the Trygon is still nothing to scoff at. Between being a pseudo-drop pod and face mulcher for a pittance more than an actual drop pod, it is every bit as terrifying as it should be.

I also think the Prime might be used more than the basic variant. For about 30 points more you get Synapse, which is very useful for deepstriking trygons with units in subterranean assault, due to possibly being far away from your existing synapse, and the stronger containment spines will be good for softening up enemy attackers.

Also if I'm reading this correctly, you can have a Carnifex Brood put into the tunnel. Since they're considered a single unit until deployment, you can probably daisy-chain them around the Trygon as it comes out, essentially popping out 4 face-eating monstrous creatures (that are wholly independent if you took the prime) for just over 500 points!

Mr ghoti wrote:
Trygons or anyone with 2 or more sets of scything talons are brutal now. The extra attacks generated are just nuts compared to every other option.

Each set reads "if the bearer has more than 1 set of scything talons it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"

You get 2 bonus attacks if you have 2 sets of scything talons. Trygons get 3.

If you have 2 sets of talons, and distribute your attacks between them, you get 1 prehensile pincer, 2 attacks with the first set, and 2 attacks with the second set. Each has their ability that gains you a bonus attack when attacking with "this weapon". It will trigger twice as you are using both weapons, so a tyrant ends up with a prehensile pincer attack and 6 monstrous scything talon attacks!

But unlikely to be RAI and likely to be changed.

EDIT: Woops, replied to the wrong person.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:

Also if I'm reading this correctly, you can have a Carnifex Brood put into the tunnel. Since they're considered a single unit until deployment, you can probably daisy-chain them around the Trygon as it comes out, essentially popping out 4 face-eating monstrous creatures (that are wholly independent if you took the prime) for just over 500 points!

\I thought so at first too. But no. It has to be a troops.

AH buggers knew there was something I missed.

EDIT: Well I guess I can have some fun popping out a bunch of mucolids. Still though, would have been hilarious if we could have Fexes pop out.

EDIT: Crap again, Mucolids are fast attack now. Bleh I guess I will have to settle for stealers then.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
AH buggers knew there was something I missed.

EDIT: Well I guess I can have some fun popping out a bunch of mucolids. Still though, would have been hilarious if we could have Fexes pop out.

There would be no reason to do anything else lol.

Loopstah wrote:

Mr ghoti wrote:
Trygons or anyone with 2 or more sets of scything talons are brutal now. The extra attacks generated are just nuts compared to every other option.

Each set reads "if the bearer has more than 1 set of scything talons it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"

You get 2 bonus attacks if you have 2 sets of scything talons. Trygons get 3.

If you have 2 sets of talons, and distribute your attacks between them, you get 1 prehensile pincer, 2 attacks with the first set, and 2 attacks with the second set. Each has their ability that gains you a bonus attack when attacking with "this weapon". It will trigger twice as you are using both weapons, so a tyrant ends up with a prehensile pincer attack and 6 monstrous scything talon attacks!

Pretty sure it's 1 extra attack total if you have more than one set.

But theres more to the rule with that, the weapon specifies that to get the bonus attack you have to have 2 or more weapons yes, but then it says that you may make an additional attack "with THIS weapon when you fight". The first part is just the requirements for the ability to trigger. If I fight with a set of scything talons after meeting the requirements, I get the effect. This is true for each set of talons.

Its the same if I was a marine with 2 chainswords. Each chainswaorsa grants me an additional attack with this weapon. So if I had 2 attacks, and attacked with each chainsword, I would get a bonus attack from each weapon and thus have 4 attacks.

Well that will be one for the FAQs. I'm still confused on how splitting attacks work so hopefully they will clear this one up with a flat number stated (They really should have, at least for the trygon, as it's weapon is listed uniquely in its profile and in the points value section, and it's not like it can take anything OTHER than 3 sets of talons anyhow).

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Well that will be one for the FAQs. I'm still confused on how splitting attacks work so hopefully they will clear this one up with a flat number stated (They really should have, at least for the trygon, as it's weapon is listed uniquely in its profile and in the points value section, and it's not like it can take anything OTHER than 3 sets of talons anyhow).

Pretty straightforward actually. If you have multiple attacks and multiple weapons you can split them between any profiles you want in any number.

With a lightning claw and power fist and 3 attacks you can put them all on the fist, all on the claw, 2 on the fist/1 on claw, or 2 on claw/1 on fist.

Edit: Looked more closely at the wording.

First they all state "each time the bearer fights", so you don't even have to use the weapon to get a bonus attack, as it doesn't say "with this weapon" or "attacks with this weapon".

Two chainswords would give you 2 bonus attacks, one from each as it triggers when you fight, even if you used a third weapon somehow.

Lightning Claws state "is armed with two lightning claws" and "1 additional attack with them" so I would say Lightning Claws are limited to 1 bonus attack as it states "them" i.e. the pair.

Scything talons state "has more than one pair of Scything talons" and "with this weapon" so it's more ambiguous as it's worded like the Chainsword rather than Lightning Claws so could indicate an extra attack per attack, as it would say "with them" like on Lightning Claws if it meant overall.

Technically Fexes and Tyrants will have 2 pairs, and Mawlocs and Trygon have 3 pairs, which are all seperate weapons, as there is no listing for "Two pairs of Scything talons" or "Three pairs of Scything talons" in the wargear list.

Still feels unintended but hey-ho!

Loopstah wrote:
Edit: Looked more closely at the wording.

First they all state "each time the bearer fights", so you don't even have to use the weapon to get a bonus attack, as it doesn't say "with this weapon" or "attacks with this weapon".

Two chainswords would give you 2 bonus attacks, one from each as it triggers when you fight, even if you used a third weapon somehow.

Lightning Claws state "is armed with two lightning claws" and "1 additional attack with them" so I would say Lightning Claws are limited to 1 bonus attack as it states "them" i.e. the pair.

Scything talons state "has more than one pair of Scything talons" and "with this weapon" so it's more ambiguous as it's worded like the Chainsword rather than Lightning Claws so could indicate an extra attack per attack, as it would say "with them" like on Lightning Claws if it meant overall.

Technically Fexes and Tyrants will have 2 pairs, and Mawlocs and Trygon have 3 pairs, which are all seperate weapons, as there is no listing for "Two pairs of Scything talons" or "Three pairs of Scything talons" in the wargear list.

Still feels unintended but hey-ho!

Two pairs of Scything talons are listed on the points table.

I ran the numbers and i can't see a reason why i should use crushing claws on a Carnifex. Talons are just better and cheaper. I think crushing claws should have AP -4 or some thing.

That's the beauty of the Fex in this edition. For the cost of a rhino you get a badass face mauler.

What do people think of Mawlocs now? The ability to do Mortal Wounds to multiple units seems pretty good, but you can't charge after arriving unlike the Trygon (though I guess a guaranteed charge would be a bit much) and all for 105pts!

Cheaper and more reliable, i like it.

I'm thinking Swarmlord with 6 stock tyrant guard, OOE, two brood of screamer killer, an exocrine. Fill out the rest of your list with gant/gaunt/stealers and you're good. Maybe a Broodlord for extra psychic.

Just realised the datasheet and points index have two different brood sizes. 1-3 in points index, or 3+1-3 On the datasheet. Maybe we can start asking GW about some of these typos and discrepancies now that stores have display copies.

Have the stores actually received these indexes with the errors? I remember a while back that the 5th edition Grey Knight codex got leaked before the preorder and it turned out to be a beta copy and some stuff got changed around before the actual release. Maybe the typos got fixed?

nope. My flgs had display copies last night. Typos and oddities galore.

StarHunter25 wrote:
I'm thinking Swarmlord with 6 stock tyrant guard, OOE, two brood of screamer killer, an exocrine. Fill out the rest of your list with gant/gaunt/stealers and you're good. Maybe a Broodlord for extra psychic.

Just realised the datasheet and points index have two different brood sizes. 1-3 in points index, or 3+1-3 On the datasheet. Maybe we can start asking GW about some of these typos and discrepancies now that stores have display copies.

If you're talking about the Tyrant Guard here, it is odd how there's two different unit sizes though someone pointed out to me it may be for if you're playing a power level game over matched play.
Still odd and hopefully it just a mistake that gets fixed as its confused a lot of people already.

What's the best loadout people are using for gaunts

Thor0298 wrote:
What's the best loadout people are using for gaunts

I assume you mean Termagants (?), and really it's all down to how you want to spend your points.

A regular gaunt is the classic 4 each, no change there, you're wanting at least 20 to gain their special rule, but fleshborers are kinda trash being of Bolt-pistol standard without being pistol.
Devilgants (devourers) have always been the strongest option, no difference to pts change either (4+4) but that still makes them 1 Devilgant : 2 Fleshborers.
You'd be wanting the squad of 20+ again as having 60 shots, re-rolling 1's to wound means some damage.

Now with the fact you can choose which models die no matter where they are to the side of the unit getting shot at, you're quite unlikely to want your pricey Devilgants being taken away.
Combined with the fact not all in the Termigant squad have to have the same gun; the strongest option would probably be 20 Devilgants and 10 Fleshborers.
That is a spicy 200pts total for 70 S4 shots, with re-roll 1's to wound.

Now there's currently some who-ha about it but if we throw in a Tervigon next to our unit, said Tervigon can spawn 10 Termagants with Fleshborers only.
This can be a new unit or replenish lost guys in an already existing unit.
Looking at reinforcement rules though you have to pay for additional models you bring to the game (like with daemon summoning).
Though it only mentions to do so when they make a new unit or go over the unit's size threshold.
Here if your Tervigon is replenishing lost guys in a unit, you're technically not party to those rules as any excess is destroyed so you're not going over the unit limit and you're not making any new units.
So say you have you squad of 20 Devilgants + 10 Fleshborers, whenever the squad gets shot at and loses guys, you remove your Fleshborers, and then your Tervigon can replace those meatshields for no cost, protecting your Devilgants for longer.
This may get FAQ'd if it wasn't intended but right now a lot of people are using it like this.
The Tervigon can also provide that unit with re-roll 1's to hit which is even more of a boon.

I wouldn't consider putting adrenal glands or toxic sacs on them as they're only close combat bonuses and the points could be used elsewhere.


If you were meaning Hormagaunts...
Again the unit of 20+ rule is nice.
They're speedy af but if you want that extra charge " Adrenal Glands could help, and Toxin Sacs are nice as well.
It's all down for your points there as I feel even plain they're not bad.

 Imateria wrote:
What do people think of Mawlocs now? The ability to do Mortal Wounds to multiple units seems pretty good, but you can't charge after arriving unlike the Trygon (though I guess a guaranteed charge would be a bit much) and all for 105pts!

I think their best use is getting at Characters who are hiding in the back of units. As with their deepstrike rules you can make them the closest choice if your opponent is careless.

I'm looking forward to having two Mawlocs take out precious characters and soaking up damage before either the rest of the swarm arrives or they burrow. Three of these guys can even gobble up Roboute Guilliman on a good day!

opu wrote:

Thor0298 wrote:
What's the best loadout people are using for gaunts

I assume you mean Termagants (?), and really it's all down to how you want to spend your points.

A regular gaunt is the classic 4 each, no change there, you're wanting at least 20 to gain their special rule, but fleshborers are kinda trash being of Bolt-pistol standard without being pistol.
Devilgants (devourers) have always been the strongest option, no difference to pts change either (4+4) but that still makes them 1 Devilgant : 2 Fleshborers.
You'd be wanting the squad of 20+ again as having 60 shots, re-rolling 1's to wound means some damage.

Now with the fact you can choose which models die no matter where they are to the side of the unit getting shot at, you're quite unlikely to want your pricey Devilgants being taken away.
Combined with the fact not all in the Termigant squad have to have the same gun; the strongest option would probably be 20 Devilgants and 10 Fleshborers.
That is a spicy 200pts total for 70 S4 shots, with re-roll 1's to wound.

Now there's currently some who-ha about it but if we throw in a Tervigon next to our unit, said Tervigon can spawn 10 Termagants with Fleshborers only.
This can be a new unit or replenish lost guys in an already existing unit.
Looking at reinforcement rules though you have to pay for additional models you bring to the game (like with daemon summoning).
Though it only mentions to do so when they make a new unit or go over the unit's size threshold.
Here if your Tervigon is replenishing lost guys in a unit, you're technically not party to those rules as any excess is destroyed so you're not going over the unit limit and you're not making any new units.
So say you have you squad of 20 Devilgants + 10 Fleshborers, whenever the squad gets shot at and loses guys, you remove your Fleshborers, and then your Tervigon can replace those meatshields for no cost, protecting your Devilgants for longer.
This may get FAQ'd if it wasn't intended but right now a lot of people are using it like this.
The Tervigon can also provide that unit with re-roll 1's to hit which is even more of a boon.

I wouldn't consider putting adrenal glands or toxic sacs on them as they're only close combat bonuses and the points could be used elsewhere.


If you were meaning Hormagaunts...
Again the unit of 20+ rule is nice.
They're speedy af but if you want that extra charge " Adrenal Glands could help, and Toxin Sacs are nice as well.
It's all down for your points there as I feel even plain they're not bad.

Yeah I meant termagants. Thanks for the help. As a previous AOS player, I didn't read all the nid rules yet, but I'm guessing the tervigon ability will cost points. Usually it had to say it was replenishing an existing unit.

I think Hormagaunts are outperformed by Genestealers. Even though the latter costs three times as much, the sheer amount of damage even a single stealer can do (not to mention their improved survivability) makes them so much better than hormagaunts. Especially the ability to charge after Advancing.

If termagants withdevourers are slain. Can the tervigon bring them back but just with fleshborers? Or is it only if they had that loadout to begin with. I have 40. I made ten fleshborers and thinking of doing 30 devourers.

From what I can see the Tervigon doesn't revive models from the slain unit, just adds up to 10 termagants with fleshborers each turn.

Assuming I did the points correctly how does this look for a starting point for 1000.

Tervigon 277
Trygon prime 188
30 Termagant 200 with toxic sacs +30 (20 devourers, 10 fleshbourer)
3 warriors 72
3 venomthropes 93
10 genestealer 140


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One question about trygon prime. So it has three pairs of scything talons. So six total. Base attacks is 6. So 36 attacks at -3 AP and d6 damage. Is that correct?

Thor0298 wrote:

One question about trygon prime. So it has three pairs of scything talons. So six total. Base attacks is 6. So 36 attacks at -3 AP and d6 damage. Is that correct?

I am wondering how you got to the magical number of 36

Well that's why I'm asking it seems like too many. But three oairs is six scything talons at six attacks each. 6*6=36. It seems ridiculously crazy that's why I'm asking. Basically how many scything talons attacks does a trygon prime get

Thor0298 wrote:
Well that's why I'm asking it seems like too many. But three oairs is six scything talons at six attacks each. 6*6=36. It seems ridiculously crazy that's why I'm asking. Basically how many scything talons attacks does a trygon prime get

Considering more than 1 'Pair' give you +1 Still wondering how you are getting to 6x6

Edit: reread the wording.. and here we go

"If the bearer has more than one pair of (massive, because GW forgot a word) Scything Talons, It can make 1 Additional attack with this weapon each time it fights."

So it fights once and uses these for at least 1 attack it get +1 Atk

So in total

it is 5+1A with Massive Scything Talons, and 1D3 Atks from Pincer tail

So just 6. That makes more sense. Seems like a decent price point for that considering it's AP-3 amdnd6 damage

Thor0298 wrote:
Assuming I did the points correctly how does this look for a starting point for 1000.

Tervigon 277
Trygon prime 188
30 Termagant 200 with toxic sacs +30 (20 devourers, 10 fleshbourer)
3 warriors 72
3 venomthropes 93
10 genestealer 140


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One question about trygon prime. So it has three pairs of scything talons. So six total. Base attacks is 6. So 36 attacks at -3 AP and d6 damage. Is that correct?

Toxin Sacs are kinda pointless on Termagants because the sacs only function in the Fight phase, and you should never have your termagants in melee. Genestealers are also 12 points a piece, not 14 (they only have Rending claws with are 2 points and they cost 10 points base).

I would also drop the warriors for more genestealers. You should try to have a squad of 20+ to gain the benefit of +1 attack with them.

I think more than 1 pair might give you +1 per pair. So +3, making it... 8? I think. Not sure though this is an ongoing discussion in YMDC. Many RAW and RAI arguments.

Best RAW in favour: Matches with Chainsword. Each weapon has the wording, they aren't a set of 3.

Best RAI in favour: 3 sets costs more than 2. If they didn't give more attacks then they would cost the same.

Neither is totally solid and can easily be argued the other way. I don't have a strong stance yet, but am leaning towards +3 for Trygons.

Currently I am leaning towards +2...has Talons, so 6, extra pair? +1, Extra extra pair? +1...seems to read that way anyhow...

Anyone look much into the sporocyst? On paper seems pretty good at dishing mortal wounds

Drager wrote:
I think more than 1 pair might give you +1 per pair. So +3, making it... 8? I think. Not sure though this is an ongoing discussion in YMDC. Many RAW and RAI arguments.

Best RAW in favour: Matches with Chainsword. Each weapon has the wording, they aren't a set of 3.

Best RAI in favour: 3 sets costs more than 2. If they didn't give more attacks then they would cost the same.

Neither is totally solid and can easily be argued the other way. I don't have a strong stance yet, but am leaning towards +3 for Trygons.

The rule says if you have more than 1 pair you get +1 atk

Not you get +1 per pair

GodDamUser wrote:

Drager wrote:
I think more than 1 pair might give you +1 per pair. So +3, making it... 8? I think. Not sure though this is an ongoing discussion in YMDC. Many RAW and RAI arguments.

Best RAW in favour: Matches with Chainsword. Each weapon has the wording, they aren't a set of 3.

Best RAI in favour: 3 sets costs more than 2. If they didn't give more attacks then they would cost the same.

Neither is totally solid and can easily be argued the other way. I don't have a strong stance yet, but am leaning towards +3 for Trygons.

The rule says if you have more than 1 pair you get +1 atk

Not you get +1 per pair

No it doesn't. It says you get +1 with this weapon and all the weapons say that independently. If it said:

"You can re-roll hit rolls of 1 when attacking with this weapon. If the bearer is yellow, it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights."

Would it get +1 or +1 per pair? That is functionally the same wording with a different condition. Now I'm not saying it's definitely +1 per pair. I am saying it's unclear.

"You can re-roll hit rolls of 1 when attacking with this weapon. If the bearer has more than one pair of (they forgot to say Massive) scything talons, it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"

So it says +1 if it has more than

pretty clear tbh

Yes it says +1 if the bearer has more than one pair. Each weapon says this. This is equivalent to the hypothetical I posted, but I replaced the trigger. Does that make sense?

Should probably move this talk to ymdc where there is a thread.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727792.page

I wonder why they lowered the save of the T-fex from to 2+ to 3+?

I hadn't noticed that, good question. Maybe to just bring it in line with the other monsters? It is a little odd.

GodDamUser wrote:
"You can re-roll hit rolls of 1 when attacking with this weapon. If the bearer has more than one pair of (they forgot to say Massive) scything talons, it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"

So it says +1 if it has more than

pretty clear tbh

You keep cutting out the "With this weapon" part that is also there and very important. In 8th you can split your attacks up with different weapons. So if a model gets 4 attacks and uses 1 pair of Scy Tal with 3 of those attacks it gets +1 attacks "With this weapon." If it then uses the other 1 attack with the other pair it also gets +1 attacks "With this weapon". Each weapon gets the bonus for having 2 pairs.

You are misunderstandings the use of "this weapon".

It doesn't indicate a requirement to attack with that weapon, it indicates that the extra attacks uses the profile of that weapon.

The only requirement for the extra attacks is that the bearer fights, and this requirement can be triggered for every weapon with that rule if you have multiples.

Loopstah wrote:
You are misunderstandings the use of "this weapon".

It doesn't indicate a requirement to attack with that weapon, it indicates that the extra attacks uses the profile of that weapon.

The only requirement for the extra attacks is that the bearer fights, and this requirement can be triggered for every weapon with that rule if you have multiples.

Which is a fair interpretation but amounts to the same thing. Each weapon would still be granting 1 more attack individually for 2 extra attacks.

At this point I think we should just shif tthe ScyTal thing to YMDC. My conclusion: Ambiguous, needs FAQ.

What do people think of using 2 GSC Primus guys with a unit of 20 Purestrains and a Patriarch (Supreme Command Detachment) as a bolster to a nids force? The rerolls to the cult ambush rule make it pretty reliable and that many attacks popping up and charging is tasty.

Man, Onslaught is terribly worded. It's trying to say everything at once. Was there a limited amount of space left on the page or something?

 Lance845 wrote:

Loopstah wrote:
You are misunderstandings the use of "this weapon".

It doesn't indicate a requirement to attack with that weapon, it indicates that the extra attacks uses the profile of that weapon.

The only requirement for the extra attacks is that the bearer fights, and this requirement can be triggered for every weapon with that rule if you have multiples.

Which is a fair interpretation but amounts to the same thing. Each weapon would still be granting 1 more attack individually for 2 extra attacks.

But is important for stats of attack if you have weapon A as well as the pair with weapon A being better. Extra attacks would be with scything talon stats. Similar to how power fist and chainsword marine can attack with all attacks with fist except the bonus attack that's on chainsword stats.

And yeah tactical marine with 2 chainswords would have 3(1 base+2 for 2 chainswords). Logic gets screwed with at least chaos terminators(who have wording similar to scything talons) that provides +1 when armed with pair of lightning claws(so +1 total) and warp talons that get +1A per lightning claw(so 2 total).

Question - What's the point of giving a Trygon prime a useless tail attack when you're never going to attack with it?

 AaronWilson wrote:
Question - What's the point of giving a Trygon prime a useless tail attack when you're never going to attack with it?

Better than being forced to attack with it like the Trygon is.

Quick question. Looking at the Hive Tyrant, it says it may take wings but I didn't see a power increase for it, nor points. Am I missing something or is it just a completely free upgrade. Also if it's free, why would you not take them?

The Winged Hive Tyrant has a different point cost (170) in the table at the back.

Drager wrote:
I hadn't noticed that, good question. Maybe to just bring it in line with the other monsters? It is a little odd.

Very, considering they were overpriced in the past and have had their cost readjusted like the other larger TMCs. It seems weird to have them still be somewhat overpriced and takeaway their 2+

They're literally 1 of the only things in the Index that isn't either good or amazing so I'm not too phased.

Drager wrote:
The Winged Hive Tyrant has a different point cost (170) in the table at the back.

Thanks, figured I was missing something.

 Zande4 wrote:

Drager wrote:
I hadn't noticed that, good question. Maybe to just bring it in line with the other monsters? It is a little odd.

Very, considering they were overpriced in the past and have had their cost readjusted like the other larger TMCs. It seems weird to have them still be somewhat overpriced and takeaway their 2+

They're literally 1 of the only things in the Index that isn't either good or amazing so I'm not too phased.

They may have overestimated it's power in the new edition due to the ability to fire at multiple models.

I think it's because the Tyrannofex gained some rules, like the Rupture Cannon becoming AP -4 if both shots hit and being able to fire each weapon twice if it remains still.

Still kinda overcosted at 200+ points. I think they may have raised the cost due to the rupture cannon being one of the only Tyranid ranged weapons that has high AP and damage (it's essentially a +1 strength 2 shot lascannon if both shots hit) when nids rarely ever get something like this.

The thing is for a minimal investment we can take Guard with lascannons via GSC if we want. Kind of makes it superfluous.

 AaronWilson wrote:
Question - What's the point of giving a Trygon prime a useless tail attack when you're never going to attack with it?

Increasing its cost. You can trade the biostatic rattle for one of the worse versions (toxispine or prensile pincer tail) which are slightly cheaper, but force you to use them at least once.

Drager wrote:
The thing is for a minimal investment we can take Guard with lascannons via GSC if we want. Kind of makes it superfluous.

I think it may be for those really narrow occurances where you must have them all be Tyranids, not with GSC allies. That would be my guess. Still though I'm not that torn up. Even the 5th Edition Dark Eldar codex (widely considered one of the best codexes ever written for it's time) still had it's Mandrakes.

where are you guys finding this stuff isnt the book not out yet?

 Goob89 wrote:
where are you guys finding this stuff isnt the book not out yet?

All the books were leaked a week or so ago. Plus many stores have preview copies now.

Hopefully in the full codex we will get the Lord of War that is not resin model from FW. Maybe the rumours about plastic Dominatrix will come true?

They will probably announce a Dominatrix Model only to reveal that it's a new SoB unit

Or do the reverse.

Also we could get our Flyers into Flyers slot. It is weird that Crone that is basically an interceptor for air and space is in a Fast Attack slot.

It was pointed out to me that Hive Tyrants, uniquely, can choose between monstrous scything talons and monstrous rending claws. Carnifexi similarly use monstrous weapons but are only given the option to exchange scything talons for crushing claws. Do people think that it is intentional that you can save 62 points on a Tyrant this way? I guess it does come at the cost of 2 attacks. Or would it not be kosher to make this substitution to take cheap Tyrants?

if it is an option then it's an option.

The Trygon prime has the option to downgrade his Biostatic Rattle for a tail weapon with less points in exchange for being forced to use one of his attacks on the tail weapon.

EDIT: also it wouldn't be 62 points, just 41 points. The Index at the back has an entry for two pairs of scything talons for the Hive Tyrant, so if you have two sets of talons, you only pay the combined price, not individually.

Dionysodorus wrote:
It was pointed out to me that Hive Tyrants, uniquely, can choose between monstrous scything talons and monstrous rending claws. Carnifexi similarly use monstrous weapons but are only given the option to exchange scything talons for crushing claws. Do people think that it is intentional that you can save 62 points on a Tyrant this way? I guess it does come at the cost of 2 attacks. Or would it not be kosher to make this substitution to take cheap Tyrants?

The Hive Tyrant has had the option to take Rending Claws in 6th and 7th, nobody really acknowledged it.
The save on points has probably been looked over like many other things in the index.
Would be nice to see a new arm set for the actual model though.

Why do Spore Mines have a 7+ save?

xmbk wrote:
Why do Spore Mines have a 7+ save?

If not a typo, likely meant to give it no armor save while allowing them to benefit from cover.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Hopefully in the full codex we will get the Lord of War that is not resin model from FW. Maybe the rumours about plastic Dominatrix will come true?

Well they have done the Warlord Titan.. So Dominatrix isn't too far of a Stretch


But I am keen to see the rules for the Hierodules

I expect Hierodules to be in the 400-500 points to match Imperial Knights and Wraithknights, and Hierophants to be in the 900-1000 points to match Stompas.
Harridans probably will be somewhere around 700.

Hopefully they release a plastic version of the Hierodule. That model has not aged well with the rest of the line, and the current plastic biotitans can easily recreate him for a fraction of the cost.

Also the fw nid models have super odd faces that dont match the rest of the nid asthetic at all. I would never buy a heirodule just because of that. Rather kit bash something together.

Only the malanthrope escapes this and thats because its face is just a bunch of tenticles.

 60mm wrote:

xmbk wrote:
Why do Spore Mines have a 7+ save?

If not a typo, likely meant to give it no armor save while allowing them to benefit from cover.

A whole bunch of Dark Eldar things are like this too. Yeah, presumably it's about taking advantage of cover.

Interestingly, some things still have a "-" save. Or at least one of the Tau Ethereals does.

Dionysodorus wrote:

 60mm wrote:

xmbk wrote:
Why do Spore Mines have a 7+ save?

If not a typo, likely meant to give it no armor save while allowing them to benefit from cover.

A whole bunch of Dark Eldar things are like this too. Yeah, presumably it's about taking advantage of cover.

Interestingly, some things still have a "-" save. Or at least one of the Tau Ethereals does.

Cover would give a 6+ save. Anything with a save of "-" can never get an armor save. Any modifiers, such as cover, don't work either.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Hopefully they release a plastic version of the Hierodule. That model has not aged well with the rest of the line, and the current plastic biotitans can easily recreate him for a fraction of the cost.

Yeah, they could easly make a double kit for Scythe/Barbed. Although I would still prefer Hierophant to be first, yet I think until there is a plastic Warhound then we can only dream.

 Lance845 wrote:
Also the fw nid models have super odd faces that dont match the rest of the nid asthetic at all. I would never buy a heirodule just because of that. Rather kit bash something together.

Only the malanthrope escapes this and thats because its face is just a bunch of tenticles.

The FW nid's faces made more sense when you remember that most of them were made for 3rd edition, where everyone had gooky faces (the "Alien Queen" hive tyrant, Grinfex, Orky Biovore, etc). I think only the Dimachereon-orwhatever and the Malathrope were made based on post-3rd aesthetics.

As a person who owns both heriodules, and a harradin - I just want them to be strong, but balanced.

Too many times in the past the tyranid superheavies have just been dismal for the points (especially in the era of the knight titan and the Leviathan dred).

Also, just a note on our "flyers" - we have none.

Our previous flyers (harpy, crone, flyrant) none have the usual keywords with flyers (supersonic, hard to hit, airborne, etc.) but instead are more like big long range jump units.

This is kind of bummer considered they still have poor armor saves (harpy crone) at least they have more wounds.

davethepak wrote:


Also, just a note on our "flyers" - we have none.

Our previous flyers (harpy, crone, flyrant) none have the usual keywords with flyers (supersonic, hard to hit, airborne, etc.) but instead are more like big long range jump units.

This is kind of bummer considered they still have poor armor saves (harpy crone) at least they have more wounds.

Something that I hadn't thought of until it was pointed out to me is that both the Harpy and Crone have a minimum movement but can still be charged. So any turn they are in close combat and they didn't charge they must disengage. They have fly so they can still shoot but if they were to stay in close combat they will fail to move the minimum and then die.

A friend of mine sent me this picture earlier as kind of a joke. I then realised that this is 100% Battleforged and legal in matched play. Tyranid Detatchment + GSC detatchment. Not terribly efficient, and they dont synergize at all. But think of all the tactical genius happeing.

wizerdree wrote:

davethepak wrote:


Also, just a note on our "flyers" - we have none.

Our previous flyers (harpy, crone, flyrant) none have the usual keywords with flyers (supersonic, hard to hit, airborne, etc.) but instead are more like big long range jump units.

This is kind of bummer considered they still have poor armor saves (harpy crone) at least they have more wounds.

Something that I hadn't thought of until it was pointed out to me is that both the Harpy and Crone have a minimum movement but can still be charged. So any turn they are in close combat and they didn't charge they must disengage. They have fly so they can still shoot but if they were to stay in close combat they will fail to move the minimum and then die.

This is an excellent point. I suspect this was an oversight - and hopefully we will either lose the minimum move, or gain actual flyer keywords.

The reaction does fit the lore though; Harpies and Crones apparently can't land unless they die so if they're stuck in combat for more than one turn, it could be that their attackers pulled them down to the ground.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
The reaction does fit the lore though; Harpies and Crones apparently can't land unless they die so if they're stuck in combat for more than one turn, it could be that their attackers pulled them down to the ground.

I thought this was true of everything with wings except the Hive Tyrant (due to multipurpose use for the Hive Mind on a battlefield)

The only fluff I'm aware of that says a flying tyranid can't land is for the Harridan. It does make sense for the same thing to apply to Hive Crones and Harpies though, as they also don't have legs.

(The same bit of fluff for the Harridan also says there is a theory among some xeno-biologists that it can slither around on the ground like a snake.)

So far im really happy of the new codex. Indeed, flyrant seems to be good but other units are now appealing ! IMO exocrine is now an auto-take and playing a swarm isnt useless anymore. Looking forward for this new edition !

The new index is awesome. So many units that seem good, very few that appear to be lame (maybe we just have to figure something out).

However, I am trying to figure out the role of the new biovores.

Not saying they are good or bad, just ....very different.

Any thoughts?

davethepak wrote:
The new index is awesome. So many units that seem good, very few that appear to be lame (maybe we just have to figure something out).

However, I am trying to figure out the role of the new biovores.

Not saying they are good or bad, just ....very different.

Any thoughts?

Biovores? They are great. They dish out mortal wounds on a very cost effective platform and when they miss you place area denial models (They help bog down enemy movement) without scatter that if the enemy doesn't stop and shoot will start handing out more mortal wounds.

Given they inflict 1 mortal wound on average per hit I would use them like heavy weapon squads; used to inflict mortal wounds on exceptionally hard to wound enemies. A squad of 3 can probably take out a independent character in about two turns, which can help cripple enemy units when they lose their buffs.

Alternatively, their BS of 4+ means they will miss half the time. You could use that as a way of saturating the area with spore mines to make manouvering tough.

Basically it can be used to mess up enemy movement or harass otherwise tough, low-wound opponents.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Given they inflict 1 mortal wound on average per hit I would use them like heavy weapon squads; used to inflict mortal wounds on exceptionally hard to wound enemies. A squad of 3 can probably take out a independent character in about two turns, which can help cripple enemy units when they lose their buffs.

Alternatively, their BS of 4+ means they will miss half the time. You could use that as a way of saturating the area with spore mines to make manouvering tough.

Basically it can be used to mess up enemy movement or harass otherwise tough, low-wound opponents.

I have found that a single mortal wound is not that much on a tough unit - of course, if this is repeatable.....

With a 4 bs, it feels more luck driven. Also, before, spore mines were good because the other player had to dedicate an entire unit to shooting one spore mine - with the new rules for split fire - I found them much easier to deal with (besides being a nid player, I play against them often).

Also, they can't target characters ....unless of course, that character is the closest unit.

In the past they were good for forcing saves on infantry - now they are good for just plinking a few mortal wounds here and there?

I am not complaining - I am just asking if that is what they seem to be - or is there something else. I mean, that might be enough; they are fairly cheap.

Call me crazy...but I'd like to figure out a way for Pyrovores to work...right now I'm thinking Trygon Tunnels

You have to be a Troop unit for that don't you?

Likely so... Put'em in a Pod? Use swarmy?

StarHunter25 wrote:

Spoiler:

I cannot exalt this enough.

davethepak wrote:
The new index is awesome. So many units that seem good, very few that appear to be lame (maybe we just have to figure something out).

However, I am trying to figure out the role of the new biovores.

Not saying they are good or bad, just ....very different.

Any thoughts?

Biovores are much better on paper but I actually never fielded them because of my plastic only policy. I expect Biovores to be the first plastic kit when rumoured Octarius campaign arrives and then they will be tested to death.


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Malanthrope stats https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/06/12/forge-world-index-xenos-preview/

Frontline posted a Batrep on Youtube, and Biovores did quite well. They seem to toss out Mortal wounds like crazy, and can place extra mines like always.

Can someone please explain spirit leech? Specifically why can it restore 3 wounds when you are only ever going to be able to restore 2 on a zoanthrope

Well, it says the _unit_ regains d3 wounds. Theoretically, even though it isn't supposed to happen via wound allocation, you could end up with multiple models damaged.

Alternately, it can rez dead models? I'd think that would be stated specifically though.

Voss wrote:
Well, it says the _unit_ regains d3 wounds. Theoretically, even though it isn't supposed to happen via wound allocation, you could end up with multiple models damaged.

Alternately, it can rez dead models? I'd think that would be stated specifically though. Don't forget you can take Mortal wounds from Perils as well...

pinecone77 wrote:

Voss wrote:
Alternately, it can rez dead models? I'd think that would be stated specifically though. Don't forget you can take Mortal wounds from Perils as well...

Mortal wounds from perils are allocated to the unit, so no multiple wounded models from that.

I had the same thoughts on the dead models.