I quite enjoyed the Infantry and Vehicles aspect of Battletech, although it was always very clear that Mechs' rules the battlefield. Integrating multiple tricks and tactics with different types of fighting units could lead to victory using fewer resources, which is realistically desirable.
The rules mention a max of 30% of other resources, and I would tend to agree.
I assume infantry would be extremely vulnerable to, say, a volley of missiles, whereas a laZ0r hit could vaporize some soldiers, but be too much of a narrow beam to incapacitate them fast enough, for instance. For static defence, I'd still bet on tanks and infantry, at the very least for the backlines or less strategic areas.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: I quite enjoyed the Infantry and Vehicles aspect of Battletech, although it was always very clear that Mechs' rules the battlefield.
I'd disagree and hope that Mecha Front allows Infantry but doesn't make them too effective.
Infantry and Tanks in BattleTech were extremely effective - in many cases more effective than a similarly pointed (combat value, battle value, bv2) mech, especially once Battlesuits came into the game.
Mechs only ruled the field if you stayed with the fluff that everyone wanted to be a MechWarrior - which is what my group did after one of us took nothing but infantry and tanks in a largeish battle and dominated the field.
Oh wow. Our experiences differ. A friend of mine was good at combined arms, but never in a way you describe.
I think I gave up the game (stupid real life...) before Battlesuits became a big thing. Just to be sure, we're not talking Elementals, but the slightly bigger ones, like in the books, right?
I wouldn't worry about that, ultimately, though. Paulson seems to have a good vision for his game and it is mecha-centric. He even says so in the rules.
The different flavors of Elementals and the Inner Sphere versions of them. But Infantry were still strong before that.
The amount of long range firepower you can get in vehicles is in-fricking-sane in BTech. I'm not saying that MF will fall into the same rut - indeed I have confidence that it won't. I'm just saying that before adding combined arms elements in things need to be looked at.
I checked my mail about 20 minutes ago and skipped all the way back to my house I was so happy.
While I love posting up new art this is by far my favorite type of Monday update as I have a brand new print to show off. I quickly pressed stuff together with sticky-tac for the photos.
(Had to repose him several times as the heat from the shop lamp I use for photos makes the sticky-tac lose its grip pretty quickly). This is the raw master a couple panels and the cockpit window will need a very light touch of sanding but everything came out great. I can't wait to get him molded and have some resin casts on hand
The variant parts are being sent in for printing this week and if all goes well I'll have everything ready for pre-order within two weeks.
That subscription service would be a great idea. End of the month? Oh look, I have enough put away for a Lynx. Rough end of the year with no gaming to relieve the pressure? How about a new Kodiak?
Lol, The Mech of the Month Club does have a nice ring to it. Although I'm just not sure I'm organized enough to keep a club running on a strict monthly timing.
JoshInJapan wrote: Will you be offering other weapon options for the Raptor as well?
Yes both mecha will have parts done for two more variants, so they'll each have 3 configurations available.
I'd like a complete line of war machines eventually including power armour, armoured vehicles, helicopters, hover jets and more.
One thing I would hope is that the physics engine be realistic enough that armoured vehicles of a similar tonnage to the mecha have superior armour and firepower. Though the mecha be graced with some compensentory agility.
Here is a mini batrep, hidden by spoilers for those who don't want to read. It is follow by the meat of my review, which is to be taken as constructive criticism, not an attack on Paulson. I want this game to succeed more than anything.
Spoiler:
First off, I had made a cheat sheet of the tables and most common modifiers. Indispensible when you are trying to game quick. I didn't format it, so not pretty, but very effective.
We chose the following forces: I played NorAm with two alpha Raptors, two alpha Lynxes and a beta Wolverine (FTW!!!!) Ironbovin played with two alpha Goshawks, two alpha Ospreys and an Alpha BlackWolf. We deployed the full DPM Entire Town in a Box in a loose buildings formation, with tree copses in the middle and all around, with a more industrial section to one side. We deployed opposite, about 6 to 10 inches from the table edge. N scale buildings need to be at least four storeys high to hide more than a light mecha. Three storeys do a fine job with those.
We played around a bit with movement at first, doing no more than ranging shots at each other, feeling the terrain for the first and second turn.
By turn three, his Blackwolf suffered an engine failure, as did one of my Lynxes. Turn four he lost a Goshawk after I had pummeled it ridiculously for three turns, but he downed my second Lynx and my Wolverine. With only light mecha left and his two medium mecha almost fresh, I gave him the game.
We had a few rules quandaries, but essentially the book-keeping was light, will be made better with proper mech cards and a good cheat sheet (à la Battletech 2nd Edition, that sucker had everything!)
Here are our impressions, some stuff we had questions about and our suggestions. I tried to put them in order of importance:
0)We didn't use anything else than rookie pilots, it influences my comments on initiative and edge.
1)Initiative. We need this to change. Bad. By rolling everyone publicly, a savvy player can totally game the system and there is little tactical decision left to players, it becomes lockstep. It was fresh, we tried it, and we didn't like it. We thought of a way to combine "reactionnary fire" with an initiative system that randomizes activation order but not so much as to make it hard to keep tabs on, and lets players be tactical. We're taking a page from Two Fat Lardies, with a deck of cards representing all units (one card per unit). We even keep the variable turn length by having the "Commercial break" card that can shake things up a bit. First mecha is revealed. He declares how many actions he will perform, between 1 and 3(N). Any mecha can interrup this turn by performing, immediately before this mecha, N-1 action. Once these have been resolved, the original mecha can then "do his thang." When the activation cards are revealed for mecha having interrupted an activation, they are ignored for this turn.
2)By having the potential to call up to three actions, we see this as supplanting the need for an edge pool. I used edge to engage in reactionnary fire twice during the game (we weren't sure if -1d was applied to reactionnary fire or not, so we did). The rest of the time, we would use edge to grant our units a third action 90% of the time, and it was very often to duck behind cover. We feel that with the initiative mechanic proposed above, it would become an extra layer for comparatively little gain.
3)We love the concept of sensors, and we thought of more ways to make use of this. a)we were foggy if target locks remain until the end of the turn or until the issuing mecha's next activation. b)What if the issuing mecha or target break LOS, does the target lock remain? c)what is the difference exactly between a target lock and a sensor dice? Can anyone at any point in the turn claim the sensor dice, but the target lock needs to have the mecha itself enter LOS of the target? d)we'd love to see sensor points spent to counter a target lock or a sensor point usage. An ECM if you will. Sensors could become EW points instead. d)Ironbovin would have loved to use a target lock or a sensor point to be used for a called shot. Either as a general sensor dice expenditure (I think this is too powerful) or requiring a LOS at some point during the turn by the sensor-sporting mecha. The BlackWolf would then really become a hot commodity, which he felt was not that hot.
4)Missiles. The rules need to clarify if they are auto-hit or not. The bold seems to say auto-hit, but then the paragraph discusses to-hit dice and such. If you need to roll to-hit, he feels they are not worth it. I tend to agree.
5)I didn't find a definition for a "Rapid" weapon in the document. Oops. I'm curious though.
6)He wanted me to write this down verbatim: Make regular damage faster and critical damage slower. My interpretation is this: regular damage came in very slowly, usually two or three points of damage per action, even with my linked quad-autocannons on my Wolverine. Critical damage, however, was relatively easy to achieve and tended to incapacitate mecha either completely, or not at all. Out of five dead mecha, two were engine shut downs, often on their first critical hit. His BlackWolf had almost no scratched paint, but its engine was busted. Another 2 were cockpit hits after engine damage did nothing at all. He proposed to randomize critical damage on the hit location rather than automatically get your engine slammed right away. We also think that engine damage should be a recurring roll every turn, so you might be able to restart the damn thing, but it might shut down on you again. We also noticed that there is no 7-9 Engine Damage result on the chart. oopsie!
7)Leg actuator damage might be even better if it was half-movement, so there is a penalty to having it damaged. You can still do a "full move distance" but at the cost of shooting.
8)Ironbovin suggests we could maybe tweek damage potential between classes of mecha, because right now it really feels like light ones, unless they are very lucky, can't do much to a heavier mecha fast enough to survive the encounter. (Although I will temper his assessment by saying that he still used his very well by circling my force and getting shots at my blind sides often enough)
9)Y U 8 LaZ0rs so much? He felt like the laser was the red-headed step-child of the weapons groups. He felt his BlackWolf was a bit emasculated with them, and that for a coherent beam of light that can literally reach anywhere instantly, they suck. I'll admit I didn't even fire my Raptors' lasers, I used the machine guns instead. Moar dice felt like better odds. Even with the modifiers.
10)We didn't feel like "infinite range" was an issue. -2d modifier is more than enough to make fire wildly inaccurate at best.
11)There needs to be a little bit more oomph to buildings, otherwise they fall like so many houses of cards. Had we realized this earlier, make a killing field would have been child's play. Especially using edge points to do so.
Don't get a negative impression, we got the feeling this game can be a lot of fun, and we really tried to pick it apart as much as possible. I listened to Rob's podcast today and it was fresh in my mind (as much as I could remember). I need a lot more terrain, and much higher terrain. With what is coming in the mail, I should have almost enough buildings, but styrofoam hills (that I gave away...) are a necessity.
You'll notice, maybe, that I upgraded by destroids with Paulson weapons. Those will be used for a small Tau auxiliary to my IG, hence the sticky-tacked bases.
Thanks for the critique and feedback. I typed up a bunch of replies for the various questions, it's posted up on the yahoo groups page. This type of stuff is a major help for helping close some of the holes and figure out where revisions need to be made.
As for infantry vehicles etc there's a place in the game, but its certainly not center stage as its a game meant to be focused on mecha. There's plenty of other options for playing soldier games. I've had many past experiences with Battletech where the game was really slowed down and soured by mobs of vehicles and infantry. I don't mind some mixed forces but I've had plenty of games where I had a mech forces square off against a huge horde of savannah masters and it makes for a very dull game. If I wanted to play micro armor games I would have been doing that, I play mech games because of stompy robots, not to use hovercraft or power armor.
I'm not aiming to make the next "Joe Grunt" soldier game, so In short don't place overly high expectations on the non-mecha elements.
Been looking at the goshawk, and one thing keeps bothering me. It's the ankle joint. It's he same circle with three little lines on it that the raptor has. I guess I'm weird because I would think that different factions would have different parts, but I guess their is the possibility that multiple upper powers would buy ankle joints from one producer. It's a simple I'd for me, I can shave the tiny lines off the Russian ones that I get. It's just when I looked at it in the pic I thought "oh a second American mech".
Also, could you put links into your signature for he mechafront.com site and he yahoo groups, might help newer people to the forum find their way here.
Paulson: after playing the game, I agree about the infantry and vehicles. The mecha keep it tidy and fast, and I get the feeling this is the way to go with the game.
What the community could help you achieve though is a set of scenarios to offer in the main rulebook. King of the Hill is fine for playtesting, and intro games, but it'll feel, to me, like other games again. We can really increase your playtesting pool and offer fun, different ways of playing. Infantry and vehicles could be set pieces in a scenario. This would be measured not against the cost of the opposing mecha, but against the scenario difficulty level; as a result they would remain "costless" so people wouldn't easily be able to run a table full of Savannah Masters or power armoured elementals.
Theophony: I caught on that at first too, but my immediate reaction was the opposite. It made it much more realistic. Coming up with walker tech must be quite a leap, and some parts are just the best that tech can be, so it got spread around the world. They must use ther same screws, eh?
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh and when we compared your mecha to WizKids' BattleMechs... it wasn't even close. The big, cartoony hands, I don't seem to remember those in my days of BT (Sure, they had hands, but not like that). Ironbovin left with a couple of Paulson Games weapons to try and man up his mechs a bit.
First, is it ok if we address you by your first name?
Second. I have a hankering to do a bit of converting. Let's say someone had access to more sentinels that he'd know what to do with them, and wanted to convert them into Mecha Front minis...
Is there still a goal to have all the guns and mechas priced out by the time the rules are done, so we can customize, say, a mercenary force?
I've been waiting for the past three codices to make Sentinels cool and viable. Tired of waiting.
Theophony: I caught on that at first too, but my immediate reaction was the opposite. It made it much more realistic. Coming up with walker tech must be quite a leap, and some parts are just the best that tech can be, so it got spread around the world. They must use ther same screws, eh?
I'm fine with people calling me either Jon or Paulson, it's "Mr Paulson" that feels weird
The construction rules will have point values for each chasis and weapon/equipment option so you'll be able build models out of whatever spare stuff you have around. I have a bunch of dougram and macross models that I'll like be using for stand-ins during playtesting.
As for the ankle servos, there's going to be some shared parts between mecha because like most real world tech individual components don't tend to vary all that much although the combined whole may look very differant. For example tank treads tend to look and function the same regardless of if they are US, Russian or even Iraqi. Or if you compare truck tires almost anywhere in the world you'll see a central hub with exposed lug nuts. The design of the driver cab or their cargo bed may look very differant but the mechanicals are all very simular.
They will ship no later than the end of August (if I'm able to manage they'll ship out sooner). Everything will ship in the order they are recieved so the first orders in are the first to be shipped.
Also for anyone who previously orderd with the first batch of Raptors, you'll be getting an email shortly with a discount code as a special thank you for your help in supporting the line.
Thanks for the email and order placed for one of the new mechs.
I remain very happy with my initial purchase but want to ask if you will be selling weapon packs so I know if I am gluing or magnetising the launchers.
I'm curious about separate weapons packs as well. I really like the look of your mechs and honestly plan on purchasing a few just to paint and convert for fun. I don't even play any kind of game in this scale but have some friends who do. Who knows maybe your rules and models will actually get me to try smaller scale games.
I'll be doing weapon packs at a future point. The attachment points are all being standardized from here out so they'll be swappable. The first generation of Raptors have slightly smaller connection points, I've had those pieces reprinted so that the second generation parts will also fit with all the new weapons.
Not sure just how soon the packs will be available but they are in the works.
Reposting this as the page rolled over and didn't want it to get buried.
They will ship no later than the end of August (if I'm able to manage they'll ship out sooner). Everything will ship in the order they are recieved so the first orders in are the first to be shipped.
Also for anyone who previously orderd with the first batch of Raptors, you'll be getting an email shortly with a discount code as a special thank you for your help in supporting the line.
Thanks for the update on the weapon packs. Now that I know they will be available at some point, I'll magnetize the mechs I order now to be ready for them.
paulson games wrote: I'll be doing weapon packs at a future point. The attachment points are all being standardized from here out so they'll be swappable. The first generation of Raptors have slightly smaller connection points, I've had those pieces reprinted so that the second generation parts will also fit with all the new weapons.
Not sure just how soon the packs will be available but they are in the works.
Reposting this as the page rolled over and didn't want it to get buried.
They will ship no later than the end of August (if I'm able to manage they'll ship out sooner). Everything will ship in the order they are recieved so the first orders in are the first to be shipped.
Also for anyone who previously orderd with the first batch of Raptors, you'll be getting an email shortly with a discount code as a special thank you for your help in supporting the line.
Oh, I got ninja'ed here and didn't even notice it . Thanks for clarifying about the packs.
Yeah, those packs are going to be awesome. I'm still not sure how the railgun is going to be switcheable with the light laser (or laZ0r), but conversions are our bread and butter.
Ironbovin and I were having this discussion: I had assumed that the quads would have multiple crew. Their bases being bigger than most of the buildings I own, would you say that it is reasonable to think that it takes more than a single person to operate such a behemoth?
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Ironbovin and I were having this discussion: I had assumed that the quads would have multiple crew. Their bases being bigger than most of the buildings I own, would you say that it is reasonable to think that it takes more than a single person to operate such a behemoth?
I think the problem with this idea, is that the Quad mechs would be vastly more stable than the biped ones. Current robotics can make a functional quad, but perfect bipeds still elude us. If Paulson was to make a super duper heavy 6 legged mech, it would be more stable again. So I think the actual piloting difficulty goes down with weight in this setting. Maybe it has too many weapons to be easily targeted by one pilot and his targeting computer? But I don't see any rear facing turrets or anything that would require a second pilot. I think it is just fine with the 1 pilot.
Just so everyone knows, you should head over to facebook and look at the gallery Jon has set up for all the mecha entries. There is some definite talent in there.
paulson games wrote: Quads are crewed by two pilots, one serving as a driver and one as a gunner.
Did not see this one earlier.
Sounds good, some mechs with apache or hind style dual cockpits would be cool
Spoiler:
I heard your name mentioned, in that you might be chatting to catalyst about coming in with Shimmering Sword and remaking battletech minis together. FYI I would be 100% behind this move, even if it slowed down mecha front. Godspeed.
The main body is an Airfix WW1 female tank, the torso railguns are Paulson Games, the arm machine guns/autocannons are Wargames Factory. Battlefleet Gothic antennae, Crotch sensor is Dreamforge mule head, hips and feet are GW sentinel, and leg extensions are plasticard.
Yes, I paint the forward and front firing arcs, blind-siding a mecha is such a good strategy that it is important to remember where it is.
Hi guys, finally got round to unpacking my Raptors - review, thoughts and pics on the new blog here - Friendly Fire!
I think I've missed the painting comp (too much Real Life in the way) but thought I might as well post it up anyway!
He is, and stop rubbing it in. Some of us are not part of the cool kids.
I am seriously considering buying the autocannon raptor this month... if I can scrounge the money. I just, believe it or not, bought a car. I'm still reeling from the financial implications.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Ironbovin and I were having this discussion: I had assumed that the quads would have multiple crew. Their bases being bigger than most of the buildings I own, would you say that it is reasonable to think that it takes more than a single person to operate such a behemoth?
I think the problem with this idea, is that the Quad mechs would be vastly more stable than the biped ones. Current robotics can make a functional quad, but perfect bipeds still elude us.
Sorry GBL, you obviously have not heard of "Asimo". The worlds first self contained bipedal robot capable of running. Yes, that's right, a propper running robot that gets both feet off the ground at the same time. OK, it's not "perfect", but then again, nothing ever is.
So we may be closer to the sort of bipedal armour that Jon is designing than you think, we obviously already have the software so it's just a matter of the complexcities of scaling the small sized Asimo up to something that size.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Ironbovin and I were having this discussion: I had assumed that the quads would have multiple crew. Their bases being bigger than most of the buildings I own, would you say that it is reasonable to think that it takes more than a single person to operate such a behemoth?
I think the problem with this idea, is that the Quad mechs would be vastly more stable than the biped ones. Current robotics can make a functional quad, but perfect bipeds still elude us.
Sorry GBL, you obviously have not heard of "Asimo". The worlds first self contained bipedal robot capable of running. Yes, that's right, a propper running robot that gets both feet off the ground at the same time. OK, it's not "perfect", but then again, nothing ever is.
So we may be closer to the sort of bipedal armour that Jon is designing than you think, we obviously already have the software so it's just a matter of the complexcities of scaling the small sized Asimo up to something that size.
Oh I have. Its just that Quads are always more stable. I never argued that they bipeds are unlikely, just that the quads will be more stable than the bipeds (and thus less likely to need assistance driving)
GBL wrote: Oh I have. Its just that Quads are always more stable. I never argued that they bipeds are unlikely, just that the quads will be more stable than the bipeds (and thus less likely to need assistance driving)
I don't think it's a matter of driving assistance though. If we're talking 'guy in a chair wiggling joysticks' then computers would have to be taking care of all movement and balance issues beyond 'move in this direction at this speed'. Maybe when traversing difficult terrain the driver would designate foot placement zones via the same gaze-tracking used to control targeting but anything more than that would be too clumsy.
The second occupant could be due to the quads having enuff dakka to keep the first suitably amused, because they move slowly enough that the driver can do his thing without throwing off the gunner's aim, because they can have an extended cockpit without too much weight and bulk penalty from the extra armour*, because it's a good place to have a commander in the thick of it directing the rest of the force, or because it just seems right that the bigger mech has a bigger crew.
* Though the heavies look like they could make room for a co-pilot without hassle as well. Even if those are better piloted by only one guy at a time, the endurance advantages from having a second to provide hot cocoa and backrubs would seem to make it a no-brainer. But I guess that's not the genre convention.
RiTides wrote: Oh man, didn't realize Paulson was here! Must've missed him :(
Yeah, you've got to be quick with the iron nails before his footprints disappear.
Revised stat cards are now uploaded to the Yahoo Groups file section.
The new changes should hopefully make the cards a bit easier to follow and also now have basic point costs for playtesting.
An average force size would be 150 points.
Non-Armor Systems and advanced ammo types cost 5 points per selecton. Armor systems cost 10 points. Veteran pilots cost 15 point each and an Ace is 30 points. (Weapon costs are still being worked on so ignore them for now).
You cannot have more than 2 vet pilots on a force, or more than one ace. You cannot mix vet and ace pilots in the same force.
Great idea to differentiate each weapon. It makes it more imposing visually, but a lot more intuitive to sort out which weapon has fired, is damaged or is on the mecha, period.
That is a thing of beauty! I am just waiting for funds to transfer into my Paypal account, and I will be placing an order for that and the other new variant on Saturday or Monday
Missiles have a varying number of dice assigned to them depending on the weight class of the weapon. Light missiles giving 3d hits, I think 3 look appropriate... and won't have the consequence of requiring quads to look all: "Yo dawg, I heard you like missiles!"
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Missiles have a varying number of dice assigned to them depending on the weight class of the weapon. Light missiles giving 3d hits, I think 3 look appropriate... and won't have the consequence of requiring quads to look all: "Yo dawg, I heard you like missiles!"
Its not the amount of damage that concerns me, its simply the empty real estate on the front of the launcher. Just a minor concern.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Oh, then yeah, maybe. Personally, I prefer the old launchers that had three tubes protruding slightly. I guess they must have been a pain to cast.
And the little elves convinced me to get a second goshawk.
The change to the missiles was to make a differant launchers option. Currently the stats have it armed with the same misisles as the alpha raptor however when Iget to the point where I revise all the mechs to include the advanced rules and builds the gamma sniper will c arry heavy missiles instead of the normal light version.
The tube missiles are giant pain in the butt to cast, but not the reason for the change.
Here's the Beta striking his best Rifleman pose.
In between rounds of casting I decided to start slapping some color on this guy, aiming for a low visability scheme for night hunting (he's still WIP).
Nice paint job. I really ought to get myself a lighter background for my pictures. I can't help but think my Raptors were hard to discern when I see all the great lighter paint schemes.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh and Jon, do send me my credit card back when you're done with it!
Valhalla42nd, we need to get to get together for a skirmish sometime since we are local . I should be ordering the other 2 raptor variants today, so I will have 3 NorAm, and you will have 3 Neo Bloc! I also have 2 packs of Dropzone Commander city terrain. Maybe we can try this out at Dropzone Games some weekend
This one pleases me to no end. I love the random element that activation cards bring to the table, hopefully there will also be an interrupt card to vary the length of a turn.
I've had the honor of being asked to attend as a guest speaker at U-Con in Nov.
I'll be giving a seminar on aspects of game design, sculpting, and general Q&A stuff about being part of the gaming industry.
I'll also be hosting games and demos of Mecha Front in a "game with the designer segment". There'll be plenty of freebies from my Paulson Games bits selection and I'll even arrange to give away a few of my Mecha Front models.
So if you want to throw down for a game, or just want to learn to play mark your calendars now.
Nov 22 - Nov 24 U-Con Gaming Convention
U-Con hosts independent gamemasters running miniatures games, board games, role-playing games, collectible card games, and special events throughout the weekend. They will also be hosting tournaments for Warmachine, Warhammer 40K, Dominion, and Magic: The Gathering.
http://ucon-gaming.org
(If my schedule allows I want to try and get in a couple rounds of Dominion)
Automatically Appended Next Post: This should hopefully be the last update until this weekend as I need to lock myself away in the casting dungeon.
paulson games wrote: I've had the honor of being asked to attend as a guest speaker at U-Con in Nov.
I'll be giving a seminar on aspects of game design, sculpting, and general Q&A stuff about being part of the gaming industry.
Congrats! Any chance you might record the audio of the seminar, for those of us who can't make it?
I'm due for a couple of games of Mecha Front in the next few weeks. One with Ironbovin, and another one with a friend of mine who got me into BTech, 15 years ago. I hope he likes the gridless experience.
Flashing fell right off. Here's the worst mold line on the entire mech:
Here she is, put together (weapons magnetized for future weapons releases), primered shiny metal, a crap coat of grey and a base coat of city camo grey (detail and wash to come later):
Sorry for the crap photos, but thought people might like to see the kit!
I try not to let out any stuff with heavy flash or mold slip. Minor amounts of flash that flake off with a finger nail (or a toothbrush) is ok but anything heavier goes into my miscast pile. (which is rare) Glad you're happy with the model
silly question .. where are those flat round bases from? Been seeing em a lot lately, I'd like to get em for some wobbly trees. I was using GW's old flat titan bases for them before when you could get em in a big bag for cheap, but now they only sell them in packs of 3 for like $8,000.
I must have been ahead in the queue, or Canada Post has just opened a Paulson--->Mathieu pipeline, because mine came in today. And the package didn't jam the mailbox like another package did, so yay!
The cockpit section on my Alpha kit had 3 gates, but 0 mold slippage or lines. Smooth as a baby's bum.
Glad that stuff has been showing up quickly and that the sculpt quality is up to what was expected I always push to make the best stuff I can and your feedback helps me determine if I'm hitting that goal or what I may need to make adjustments to.
Next mecha in the works will be the Blackfrost medium. Initially I'd been planning on the NorAm lynx, and the mercs were going to be released only once the main two factions were done. However I realized that by offering the merc mecha earlier I could put out a mech that both factions could use equally. That way the wait for a given faction wouldn't be as awkward. It also lets me get a third visual style out there as everyone has different preferences.
Also I should have weapon packs available within the next two weeks. Depending on interest I might create another set of weapons for each of the light mechs to have a delta configuration. Is there interest in making sets of rare earth magnets available? Or is that something you guys are already properly situated with?
Lastly I tried uploading the rules to the website but I'm not sure if the download feature is working correctly. (it's the same copy as what's available on the yahoo groups page) If you try and download them from the mecha front site and run into any issues please let me know so I can get ahold of tech support. I haven't used any digital products on the site before so I'm not sure if everything is set up correctly yet.
I know most people here must be swimming in magnets, but I always find it a hassle to shop for these on eBay, and I don't like paying 15$ for 10 magnets here locally either. If you were to bump the price up by a buck (or two) to include a set of magnets that will fit, I would pay for the convenience (value added).
That being said, I will enjoy weapon packs... but my finances have to catch up first (long story involving an overzealous accountant).
And I was wondering when Blackfrost would make an appearance. The design for it is top notch, I think it would be great to introduce it as a kit. Plus since we are in playtesting mode, it's not as if we aren't doing plenty of "count as."
That's pretty sweet the camo came out great. I'm likewise painting up orange cockpits on my bloc mechs which is a departure from the red or blue lenses I typically do.
(also good improvement on your camera quality).
BobtheInquisitor wrote: That looks pretty sweet. I'm trying to avoid spending any money on this before the Kickstarter starts, but you make it look too good...
For the time being I'm holding off on doing a KS in favor of just doing these models a single release at a time. (I'd posted about it on facebook, but I think I forgot on here) The KS route creates a lot of extra hoops to jump through when it's faster & easier for me to get people the models as I finish them vs piling it up for one big release. So instead of KS I've changed my plan to trickle these out 1-2 mechs at a time.
Josh: Those digital ones are very promising, looks very much like something I'll be backing and a very good excuse for me to finally get an airbrush.
Hmmm... maybe we can convince him to do a pattern for the stripper silhouette camo?
I just wish I'd known that the airbrush I was buying only had 3 tip sizes and none of them are small enough for modelling purposes. Aside from big swathes of paint or undercoating, that is. So I'm still doing everything by hand...
Thank you, the camera is my fiancee's, and her tripod, and our shop's improvised studio. The lighting was directional, unfortunately, because we took out the neon strips and it was night-time.
Automatically Appended Next Post: If you ever change your mind about a KS... having your molds ready and more than renders is the way to go, I think. For one, you'd look a lot more serious than other companies going into it.
Speaking of which, had another playtest on tuesday, have to do a bit of writing on the newsgroup.
for the express purpose of painting up these mecha. Hopefully it will improve my camo-painting technique...
I'm in on the aibrush stencil campaign, too, and will also be using them on my mecha front models (as well as Dropzone Commander models). Sweet that he made the smaller version of the digi camo and hexo camo for 10-15mm scale vehicles.
I'm thinking of painting Blackfrost à la Captain Canuck, all white and red with the maple leaf prominently displayed, would it be too conspicuous on the battlefield?
Offical models will feature camo or at least standard military drab paint schemes.
People are always welcome to paint their stuff how they wish, but offical game fluff will depict the stuff patterned after modern day paint schemes. I've yet to see any real world nations offerring up their tanks in bright colors or in a set of racing flames.
For the time being I'm holding off on doing a KS in favor of just doing these models a single release at a time. (I'd posted about it on facebook, but I think I forgot on here) The KS route creates a lot of extra hoops to jump through when it's faster & easier for me to get people the models as I finish them vs piling it up for one big release. So instead of KS I've changed my plan to trickle these out 1-2 mechs at a time.
Wait. I thought you were only releasing the limited edition resins currently, with metal models coming out for the the Kickstarter. I may be confused because I kind of blocked out everything but the word Kickstarter. So, what is the release schedule like now?
Having a billing issue with my cc company and until its fixed the site will be down for a few days.
Right now I'd doing resin, once I have the line rounded out a bit more and I shift stuff to general production they'll likely be in metal. (Still exploring final options)
I don't have much that's newsworthy for mondays atm, but I should have some more stuff soonish.
Painting Contest II
I'm going to hold another painting contest, which will run from now until Nov 15th.
You can enter any of the mecha you wish, with the exception of models that were submitted for the first painting contest. Either email me submissions or post them on the facebook page.
I'll pick the top 3 that I like best and the painters will recieve a free model of their choice.
I have a basic game setting together, it had been posted on the site but it's down ATM. I'll have it reposted on the Paulson Games site along with the 1.4 version of the rules.
(I'm making a few revisions for the combined arms units and will be uploading everything once the cards are done)
Despite being invaded by family for a full week and enduring a computer crash I am still alive...
Things have been moving slowly but progress is happening. Here's where I'm at with the NorAm Lynx (medium mecha) it's about 60% done and I'm hoping to have it finished up by end of the week. Lots of work to do in the meantime. (The lower legs and shoulders are still only blocked out and have no details yet).
Regarding the camo vs. no camo discussion, I think the model suggested by MWO would be a good compromise between "realistic" sci fi sensors available and the need for camo.
Even if you have a target lock that is boxed by the HUD, with direct fire weapons you would still need to aim and such and camo would definitely make it more difficult to target sensitive components, or moving mechs in a busy environment, especially when up against a building or in a forest etc.
Essentially with the sci fi sensors, you know what direction to aim in but no guarantee you would hit.
Missiles not so much though.
About the battleship camo, that was about thwarting range finders and such in initial exchanges buying the targeted ship time to return fire or evade.
Hmm, I noticed that yeah. Good prints are still pricey.
The stuff you've put out so far is pretty inspiring, you manage to put the right amount of detail in there. I noticed that I sometimes go overkill with it because it's so easy to do in 3d software. The challenge is to keep in mind what remains possible to print, but also what will work visually.
That should work well for games, typically what we've been using for games during play testing is 3 light, 2 med, 1 heavy. A group of 5-6 mechs will be the standard force size and you can always go larger. When it's 3 or less mechs per side the game can get lopsided depending on how the initiative order pans out.
Not really sure as I don't want to set a hard date, lots of stuff can impact that window. Sometimes models take longer than expected or if I'm having a slow sales period I have less funds to get new prints made etc. Realistic answer is I'm pushing for Feb but can't say for certain.
All the mecha that have color art are going to be done. (including the quads)
My plan is to work my way up in weight classes, I currently have the lights available and I'm working on the mediums, after that it'll be onto the heavies and the quads will be the last set. I'd hazard a guess at sometime around summer for the quads but I can't say for certain.
Well, it looks a bit plain compared to the light mech, to me. The light mech's profile is also more interesting with the missiles sticking out, whereas this one is more contained.
Some specific thoughts:
-The large flat surfaces on the shoulders I think could use something
-The image on the right of your first picture, I think the side view should stand out more. Maybe some drum mags hanging off the guns? Some sort of vent sticking backwards off of the main body? Something to break up that profile / make it a bit more interesting!
-The feet aren't as interseting as the light mech's
Hopefully that doesn't sound too harsh, I just think you might want to let it sit over the weekend and come back to it / see if inspiration strikes. The light mech is absolutely fantastic, but this one looks like a great base but needs more "oomph". A little too conservative right now, is my take.
No worries, constructive criticism is always good and I've also got thick skin
Foot design probably isn't as hot as the light mecha but not sure how else I'd approach it without redesigning the whole foot. The wider more open foot fits the light mech IMO as it's meant for speed where the medium and heavy mecha tend to be slower and heavy so their feet would be a bit more compact. There might be a way to tinker with it but at the moment I'm not sure.
The shoulders I'll do some thinking on. The guns block a few of the details which can't be seen from these angles with them in place. The outer armor panels are rather featureless which I'll think about.
Remember the flat space on the shoulders isn't always a bad thing, as it is a nice area to paint on unit designations (or use decals if you go down that way, wink-wink)
I can buy the foot explanation as well. Lesser speed could mean a smaller need for lateral(?) support as turning wouldn't cause as much stress and risk toppling.
You're almost there! I think the should needs a tiny bit of work, like RiTides suggested, but not too much so it's still possible, to quote Vain "use decals" if you'd wanted to.
I like it .... but I like the art more. The slope of the body in the art seems to be a single angle, where the 3D file it has been broken down into two different angles. The 'shoulders, where I imagined the ammo storage for the guns was, have a bigger chamfer than the 3D model. The lower leg armour seems bigger in the art and that would have been a great place to put 'squad' markings so that troops know what mech they are looking at being stomped by.
All of those were parts of the design I liked. I don't know if they were removed to make moulding easier, or not, but it seems a shame to me that they are no longer there.
Ah, thanks for adding the art pic to your post for easy comparison! Two things that stand out to me as different is that the shoulders and cockpit both look "longer and thinner" in the art, and are a little more squat / flat on the model. The second thing is that the guns hang out over the width of it's stance in the art. I don't know if this means the legs are closer together, or the guns just stick out more, but it makes for a more interesting profile. The guns also look a bit longer in the art, I think.
Should be possible to get there with just some tweaks to geometry you've already modelled, hopefully . Basically it just doesn't have that "awesome" factor that the light gives off as soon as you look at it just yet, but I think it can.
I think it's ace. I know it doesn't help, but I really like it the way it is. I'd also be ok with what the others above have said. You're just providing such great quality.
Just one thing though: heavies for February seems like you're forgetting to give yourself some family time during the holidays. I think most of us can say you've deserved a break, eh?
The color art is painted on top of a 3d shell, I use that same shell as a guideline when making the 3d model to help me keep the proportions correct to the drawing. The guns are the same length as the wireframe that's used to generate the 2d art, but camera angles in the render make it look a bit different. If you look at the side shot of the mecha you can get a better perspective of how long the guns are. They measure 40mm which is over half the height of the mech (75mm) so they are very large compared to the size of the weapons on the raptor.
The lower legs were beefed up as they were very thin based on the reference frame. Not all of the armor panels are able to be modeled as drawn, the 2d art has the ability to eliminate angles and have parts flow into each other that in a way that isn't possible to replicate in fully 3d. object at least not with flat surfaces. Several of the surfaces in the drawing appear to be flat but they join together at seam points as though they were rounded. What works well in 2d to help give elements of perspective doesn't always translate the same when it's made into an actual object. So it's a bit of a mix when trying to match details in the draw with what comes out in 3d, sometimes I have to improvise and sometimes changes are also undertaken to aide with the casting side.
I did widen the shoulders a bit, what isn't seen in the 2d art is that there was a large cylinder connection the center torsos to the shoulders and there was a significant gap in between and it made the cylinder shape painfully obvious which created a look where it appeared to be held to the body with a large dowel rod that was sticking out too far. The cylinder is still present but the gap was narrowed so it's not as glaringly obvious.
I made a few minor changes in the hip connection and body to tie it a bit closer to the raptor in construction, I wanted to keep the appearance of being the same technology base but just on a large frame. The center torso will be made slightly longer than it currently is, I need to finish adding the rear detail which will lengthen it a bit. (Right now it ends in a straight line so it appears to end a bit abruptly)
Just explaining the process for some of the details, I do appreciate the feedback. I'll likely keep tinkering with it over the weekend as there's no urgent push to get it in for printing. (other than just wanting to see it in hand)
Here's a side by side with the original base mesh vs the more final one, main areas of change are the shoulder width and spacing, also the groin piece was narrowed a bit and the "chin" on the center torso was narrowed to match it to the raptor better.
Only comment I can make - in the art rendering it looks like the guns are on an about 45 degree angle to each other - in your 3d model it's a much more obtuse angle. I like the tighter angle more.
That's helpful, and it makes sense that you wanted to hide the cylinder by widening the shoulder. Maybe you can just add to the shoulder, then, to give it that leaner look the art seems to have.
The guns were moved a bit they are probably more of a 60 degree angle now. That was due in part to trying to fit a connection between them so that when I cast them they can be a single piece rather than two separate guns with a third piece for the connection. (The Raptor ACs are 3 parts and a giant pain to cast).
Also added a reference pic above for the original framework that was used for the 2d art. Appears I actually lengthened the guns by about 5mm so they are about 15% longer than what was used to the 2d piece. The torso and arms appearing much wider than the legs/hips is due to the perspective angle in the art.
paulson games wrote: The guns were moved a bit they are probably more of a 60 degree angle now. That was due in part to trying to fit a connection between them so that when I cast them they can be a single piece rather than two separate guns with a third piece for the connection. (The Raptor ACs are 3 parts and a giant pain to cast).
And there's no way to get a single cast out of them at a smaller angle? :-/
I guess I don't understand why if the connection from the guns to the shoulder is on the top gun, changing the angle allows you to cast them differently. Probably because I'm not a resin caster.
Really that's the only thing that jumps out and makes the model look... "bad" isn't the right word. "Not outstanding" is a closer thing to what I want to say.
The difficulty was in part with how I wanted the guns to nest with the shoulder piece. The shoulder piece I was doing in a similar design to the raptors so that it allows it to be a universal piece that a variety of weapons to attach to without me needing to reprint a new shoulder each time I add a weapon to the design. I wanted both guns to be a single part and the bridge that joins the two guns also needs to wrap around the shoulder piece in a way it can be slid on and off.
(lower right head on view) If I move the lower gun further to the left the bridge piece needs it's right edge moved over as well making it too thin
And if you move it over too far you'll covver the shell ejection port... yick.
I'm not a modeler or designer but I'll try and think of potential ideas for that. If I'm the only one thinking it should be a sharper angle I'll shut up though.
The shared components idea is a good one not only because it makes it easier/cheaper for you,
but because that's just what modern militaries do, making components that will work on several projects at once, giving a certain 'look' to their forces
As noted in my Paulson Games thread the Paulson Games website will be closing down Jan 25th, all of the Mecha Front items will remain available on the dedicated website.
I've also started the pre-orders for the Lynx on the Mecha Front website.
In order to fund this item I need to sell 25 copies of the model. Once I have all 25 pre-order slots filled it head out for printing and molding. This process will take aproximately 30 days from the point that funding is achieved. There is a $5 discount on the pre-order pricing.
I will accept pre-orders until Feb 15th (or until all 25 slots are filled) If the project does not fund by the the 15th I will refund all pre-orders purchases in full.
Any additional models (such as the raptor or goshawk) that are ordered at the same time as this item will not ship until the lynx itself ships out.
Also please take note that all of the resin models are limited run items, I'll be doing 100 copies of each. At a later point I'll be introducing the production pieces as metal.
The Raptor Alpha has sold around 80 copies so there won't be many left, once this last set of molds wears out it'll be out of stock until I can get he metal versions done. The other's all have around 50-60 copies remaining.
(The render is not the final, I accidentally saved over the wrong file. I will have an updated pic shortly).
Sweet, I'll be ordering a few of them today or tomorrow!
Just one question, I need to check when I get home but I thought you had offered weapon packs for the Raptor on the site, but I don't see them now. Any chance you'll be making an alternately armed Lynx?
I'd be happy to preorder that even without a render... just would prefer not to arm them the same if I'm getting two.
But if you'll be offering a weapon pack for it I can always get an alternate armament later... I just don't want to lock myself into getting 2 duplicate mechs.
RiTides... from my playtest, the Lynx performs ok with the four Laz0rs(tm), but it is an ungodly machine when fitted with the railguns. And I think Paulson makes excellent railguns for conversions!
Just my 5¢.
Automatically Appended Next Post: And although there are certain expenses that cannot be avoided right now, I'll try to get a couple ordered soon.
I just wanted to ask about the weapons packs, as then I wouldn't mind buying 2 identical ones now. I understand if the packs would need to be limited, just want to make sure I'll be able to get a hold of different weapons for at least one of them.
griffen127 wrote: I really like your quads. Can you show a size shot next to a battle tech figure. Thanks
The quads will be a while, here's how the light mechs scale vs BTech stuff. The mechs use a 60mm base, when the quads are finished they will use a 120mm base. (possibly larger)
RiTides wrote: Sweet, I'll be ordering a few of them today or tomorrow!
Just one question, I need to check when I get home but I thought you had offered weapon packs for the Raptor on the site, but I don't see them now. Any chance you'll be making an alternately armed Lynx?
I'll be doing additional weapons, not sure how quickly but at the very minimum I'll be making a set of lasers for it and also railguns. They'll all be based on the same mounting point so if you pick up the mechs you'll be able to use them with the later weapons just fine. The joints are going to be on a universal size for each weight class so you can mount weapons on any of the factions. It'll take a bit to fill out but I plan to do option packs for all the available weapons in each weight class.
I held off on starting on the extra weapons ATM as a set of two weapons runs almost as much as printing whole mech. The pricing gets weird when you are dealing with lots of individual pieces, it's largely based on how much prep time it takes to set up as opposed to just material.
Well, that's two ordered for me then and I'll order the other weapon packs when they become available.
Is the light weapons pack still available, though? In the end I think I'd like to have a quad, a few heavies and mediums, but a bunch of lights. Tempting to order more of them now since they're running low (for the raptor). Any chance you could extend that one to 150 copies, since it's so popular?
And am I just blind, and the weapons pack is still on the site for them and I'm just missing it?
I'll get the light weapon packs up again shortly, I'm in the process of making molds and this super cold weather is stalling things. Silicone & resin are very sensitive to the environment and do not respond well to cold.
Quads I'm hoping to have ready by summer but that's a very loose estimate.
9 slots left on the pre-orders, at the current rate everything should be filled up by week's end. If that is the case it'll be out for printing on Monday
I think the build layers are under 3-5 microns but I'm not exactly sure what resolution it is, I just tell my print guy do the best you can do, he charges a bunch of cash, and the result is insanely smooth and crisp which is all I need to know about the process. I do a bit of hand clean up on the masters but it's very minimal. Despite all the stuff I use computers for I am not a techy guy, when it comes to the specs I let my printing guy handle it, I just build models and do the casting.
Back on page 25 are some sorts of a raw master that's had no final cleaning done yet, they arrive pretty much good to go the only things I need to touch up are occasional rough spots from the support material or any tiny chips (which is rare).
I'm going to have to opt out of the Lynx, unfortunately. I had to bring my geriatric cat to the vet today... let's just say I could have paid for a whole phalanx of those beauties with that money.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: I'm going to have to opt out of the Lynx, unfortunately. I had to bring my geriatric cat to the vet today... let's just say I could have paid for a whole phalanx of those beauties with that money.
Oh, I've been there. My wife once rescued a cat that wound up costing more in medical bills than a mortgage payment!
Mathieu Raymond wrote: I'm going to have to opt out of the Lynx, unfortunately. I had to bring my geriatric cat to the vet today... let's just say I could have paid for a whole phalanx of those beauties with that money.
One of mine had to have 2 teeth out just before Xmas which was a blow (they're totally worth it though)
I totally understand. My dog gets to the doctor more often than I do, when I'm sick I typically tough it out as that's my call but when he's ill he goes to the vet cause I'm a good daddy.
I had an emergency visit to the vet a while back, I'd just got back from GenCon and was just getting ready to take my dog out for a walk when he got attacked on my front steps by my hillbilly neighbor's pit bull who was running loose at 1 in the morning. Which meant a very expensive trip to a 24hr emergency hospital for stitches as my dog got his stomach and groin got tore open pretty badly. (my dog is a beagle mix that's barely 25lbs, the pit is well over 90lbs) The trip ended up costing the better part of $900 and my dog took a couple weeks to recover.
Despite the fact his dog is very aggressive and had previously been used for fighting my neighbor didn't "like" to keep it on a leash and his yard is not fenced in so it'd roam the block whenever it wanted, the police got called and in order to keep himself out of court he had to pay a fine and also agreed to cover the vet bill, but since he's "broke" I had to carry the bill until he paid it back over the next 6 months. (this was also his second incident, one more and he looses the dog) Despite being "broke" he always managed to find money for his beer and hold parties 2-3 nights a week. He'd been dodging more than half the payments until I finally went over to his house with a baseball bat during one of his parties and suddenly he found the remaining $500 that he owed me.
While he's been keeping it on a leash, he now has second pit that's even bigger which just so awesome.
Since then my yard has been fenced in and my neighbor has been warned that if either of his dogs are ever loose on my property again they'll be shot. (I don't want to hurt the dogs but they are dangerous and we have a toddler around a lot)
The world would be a better place if there were more beagles and dachshunds then pits. Although a well loved and trained pit I'm sure is just great too.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: The world would be a better place if there were more beagles and dachshunds then pits. Although a well loved and trained pit I'm sure is just great too.
(They'll be hosted on there from now on as people were having a lot of difficulty with the yahoo groups page)
Lots of new stuff added to the advanced rules. Infantry, ground vehicles, vtol craft, airstrikes, artillery, advanced ammunition types, advanced mecha systems, pilot skills, it's a lengthy list of new toys.
Also the Lynx is headed out for printing on Tuesday, I still have a couple pre-order slots open but I'm close enough to fund things. The pre-order slots will remain open until they sell out.
(They'll be hosted on there from now on as people were having a lot of difficulty with the yahoo groups page)
Lots of new stuff added to the advanced rules. Infantry, ground vehicles, vtol craft, airstrikes, artillery, advanced ammunition types, advanced mecha systems, pilot skills, it's a lengthy list of new toys.
You should throw them up on WargameVault, then you can just send automated e-mails to everyone that downloads it when you update.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: The world would be a better place if there were more beagles and dachshunds then pits. Although a well loved and trained pit I'm sure is just great too.
my Pit is a rescue...
she thinks she is a Chihuahua...
i call her a Pitwawa...
she was raised right, and sleeps in the bed with us...
she is amazing with people, but i still don't trust her around some other dogs, so i don't let her run wild...
Paulson, man, your Mechs are coming along nicely...
painted up, they look great...
i really hope that your game becomes huge...
Mathieu Raymond wrote: The world would be a better place if there were more beagles and dachshunds then pits. Although a well loved and trained pit I'm sure is just great too.
Its not the breed, its the owner.
It's mostly the owner, but I'd rather live next to a beagle with a bad owner, than a pitbull with a bad owner.
The Lynx parts are in and looking absolutely beautiful. I'll be molding these up ASAP and with luck the first batches may start shipping out as early as next Fri.
I'm toying with some alternate missile launcher designs for the Raptor. (which would be available as a weapon upgrade pack) The current missile pods with the attached shields represent a single shot launcher, I'm looking to do parts for a launch that has a two shot capacity. (and loses the shield)
I like the way the missiles are stacked on 1, but maybe have them connected like on 4 where they are vertical. I initially liked 3, but it makes the mech wider, and when trying to manuever between buildings, wider is not better .
The Lynx parts are in and looking absolutely beautiful. I'll be molding these up ASAP and with luck the first batches may start shipping out as early as next Fri.
What are the infantry models on those bases? They look pretty interesting.
Also, I would vote number 4. Looks the best, although I would think if you had rocket tubes arranged like that they would be mounted in a "box" superstructure for stability, kind of like what you see on a Madcat or a Catapult from Battletech.
I'm looking at doing 3 different missile launchers, likely 4, 6, 7 that way everyone can have a decent amount to pick from. I'll work on the 3d a bit more and post more finalized renders shortly along with front profiles. (#7 can switch sides to make option 8 as well)
Here's some additional parts I'm toying around with for a potential weapon pack (4 linked machine guns)
RiTides wrote: How many guns is the raptor going to get? I'd like to see another set for the medium mech
As many as possible There's a total of 10 weapons open to each weight class, and I'm going to have to make plenty of those, particularly if I want to have stuff for stretch goals... and yeah I'll have more info on that shortly Once I get a good base set of weapons pieced together I'll be scaling them up and tweaking them for Lynx and other mecha.
While more enticing to my wallet if I was to get into Mecha Front, I really like the 15mm scale stuff as that is what I'm collecting for the most part.
Also, in a pinch the 15mm Mecha can stand in as ROV drones in 28mm scale games of Tomorrows War, or other suitable Sci-Fi.
paulson games wrote: Working on setting the stuff to 1/285 scale (6mm) Let me know what you think.
(quad is 90mm wide!)
The quads are big boys They are at an angles which makes them look a bit thicker, but even head on they are massive and about the torso width of the heavy mechs. There's a reason they do 11d worth of damage against things they come into contact with. If you let a quad stomp one of your mechs it'll probably kill it and with good reason
The plan is to maintain both a 6mm and 15mm line so people can opt for whichever scale they want. 6mm helps for those on a budget, 15mm is for the people who want detail and display models. Right now I'm doing some final numbers crunching and once I have final quotes in hand I should be putting the 6mm stuff up on kickstarter very soon.
Oh, I get it now- those would be much smaller than they are currently (I was just looking at relative size). Will be interested what others think of that size.
I expect to have the master in hand late next week and I should have them shipping out by the end of the month.
I'll be making 100 copies of these in resin, after that they'll end up being produced in metal and available as part of the upcoming Kickstarter (which will only be for the 6mm models). \
The metal models likely won't be available for another 6-12 months.
So if you want the 6mm version well before the KS delivers, or prefer resin over metal you'll want to put in an order now.
Like I said, I'm very interested to see what the take on 6mm is. I guess that still makes them quite a bit larger than battletech mechs, right?
I have 5 of yours in resin already at 15mm so probably won't be tempted by the preorder here (particularly since I got 2 of this same model in that scale ). But very intrigued by how it turns out in the smaller size!
1st pic has railguns, the other pics have lasers. So they are a bit of a visual break from the autocannons and machine guns that have been on earlier models.
Yeah, I'm in that same boat, kat. I would be really interested to see more folks' thoughts on 15mm or 6mm... I'm kind of locked into 15mm as I've bought 5 of the mechs and some weapon packs, but then again I could just use these for Infinity or somesuch.
6mm will make things a lot cheaper for folks, but make the whole thing a lot smaller... I have always been intrigued by that scale but don't actually know anyone who games in it (unless FoW is that scale).
Right, which is why 15mm was so cool. Ain't nobody doing kick ass pew pew mechs in 15mm.
The times I've play tested Mechafront at a store (with my 1 NeoBloc light mech and a bunch of paper, waiting on the medium!), everyone was shocked that that was the LIGHT mech and that sparked some interest.
Granted, buildings and terrain will be easier to wrangle up for 6mm...
Automatically Appended Next Post: I guess t he big thing is, whatever gets kickstarter is what I'm sticking to as that will be the main line. It will be first to market and first adopted and most readily available. Kicking 6mm will most likely kill or greatly diminish 15mm and vice versa.
Battlefront Miniatures Limited is a New Zealand company which manufactures 15mm (1:100) Scale models and miniatures from World War II for wargaming and collecting.
Okay, so what's happening with this game? Is to move to 6mm a permanent thing, or are you trying to launch two separate scale miniature lines and use the same rules? Or is 6mm now the primary scale for the game?
I don't mind either way, but I do think it's a headache to have two scales going at the same time.
6mm would allow for more maneuverability and openness on the tabletop, like battletech. The warmachine sized mechs look awesome, but take up so much tablespace things can get a bit silly, especially if you have ample terrain.
Sorry about the confusion on the FOW, my local store carries a bunch of 6mm WWII models, never played it or paid much attention to it but I'd assumed they were FOW must have mixed it up in my head with a different line.
The 6mm line would be offered in addition to the 15mm stuff, so there'd be two lines.
I have to say- that looks pretty darn good in 6mm!
The only issue with offering it in both scales is possibly splitting the player base (well, almost assuredly doing so) between the scales. Even though I've bought 5 of these mechs in 15mm, I feel like you may want to pick one scale or the other- even if it ends up being 6mm instead of 15mm.
It's currently being molded so it'll be a bit before I can take more pics. The model itself is 45mm tall and it's shown on a 40mm base (same base size as terminators and crisis suits)
Ok, thanks. I wouldn't have pegged that mech as being on a 40mm base but rather a standard 25mm visually (and incorrectly). The addition of a 6mm scale and the possibility of Paulson products squaring off on the tabletop against Kevin Siembada products is both juicy and ironic on multiple levels.
The irony is that despite having no working capital, being a single person company, and creating new designs from the ground up yet I managed to get stuff into production 10 months ago. (and needed less than 3 months from launch)
Meanwhile Palladium has numerous people working for them, using designs that were established 30 years ago, multiple sculptors and artists, 1.4 million in start up funds and still not a shred of plastic to show for all that. It's all good as I'm sure they'll get there at some point.
Switching to 6mm and kickstarting... how much faster does that get you to full scale mech murder versus 15mm? After the pics you posted of that 6mm I'm pretty well sold on switching to 6mm and never looking back.
The RBT kickstarter for Palladium is about paying off Palladium's existing debts and putting as little of the KS money as possible into speeding up production and hitting release date goals. Anyone who dodges being in business with Kevin Sembeida should be relieved.
katfude wrote: Switching to 6mm and kickstarting... how much faster does that get you to full scale mech murder versus 15mm? After the pics you posted of that 6mm I'm pretty well sold on switching to 6mm and never looking back.
There's not much of a difference time-wise between working in the two different scales. Currently what has been a major strain on getting things out in a timely fashion has been the shoestring budget as it limits me to working on the game part-time (and doing all the casting work myself). If the KS covers the budget concerns and I'm able to focus on it full time I estimate I can have the remainder of the line finished and shipped out within 6-7 months.
Not working with them was a major blessing, as I would have been in a tar pit with no escape and it gave me the opportunity to work on my own project which has been one of the most personally rewarding things I've done in my life as it allows me to be creative in the manner I wish without needing to shackle my energies to people who have no experience in the industry.
RiTides wrote: Not sure about the smaller gun, but that first pic (railguns??) I really love
That one is my favorite, too. I would love to buy it in 6mm scale.
Uh, maybe I'm blind but I don't see the shipping section on your site. What are the shipping charges like?
$4 of US, $6 for Canada/Mexico $10 to rest of the world. It's a flat rate so there's no extra charge if you purchase multiple models.
So if you're in the US and buy 3 models the shipping is only $4 for the entire order.
I'll need to put up a shipping page, I'd added the info into the shopping cart system but in transferring things over from the Paulson Games site forgot to have it listed on the site, oops. Thanks for the catch.
Yeah, that's exactly what I'm thinking... I actually think what you're calling the "6mm" height is super attractive, but the "6mm" descriptor is not . Mechadrome's models are basically that exact same height, or maybe a little smaller, and labeled as 15mm... and Dropzone Commander's stuff which is labelled as 10mm is wayyyy smaller.
I think it comes down to interpretation of scale and the technology base for the mechs/robots. The mechadome stuff to me seems more like a suit of powered armor then a true mech, but that's based on my view of mechs being stuff like battletech size or gundam sized and are very big. For newer generations of anime fans they may like smaller more compact designs.
Classic example is the Macross series mechs in Robotech vs the later Cyclones in Mospeada one is a 50 ft tall stompy robot the other is only 8 ft yet according to the rpg materials delivers more fire power and is roughly as tough. It doesn't make much sense to me but it's not like kids cartoons need to.
6mm is the standard term for large array of historicals and micro armor games, both Battletech and Robotech are in that scale so I'm not sure why anyone would be freaked out by that term for scale as it's been around as long as 28mm (if not longer). It likely comes down to the fact that this is primarily a GW based forums who tend to have blinders on when it comes to other systems and scales. I've also had people completely puzzled about 15mm like it was some completely new invention. ::shrug::
I could easily call it "Epic" scale and everyone would likely make that connection due to their GW familiarity, but I won't because GW is a bunch of legal douche nozzles and believes they created everything miniatures related (including common scales)
Oh man, maybe not officially, but just calling it "Epic scale" on a forum like this would be a really good idea, imo!
Speaking of this- now that both scales are being offered, I would be interested in selling my 15mm mechs (3 Raptors with ALL weapon options for each, and 2 Lynx) here and putting the money right back into paulson's hands for his 6mm mechs.
If you're interested in a good deal there, please PM me for pics and details!
I'd call it "fun scale" myself. Although I will be using the 6mm walkers as 28mm enforcement droids or something like that.
RiTides wrote: Oh man, maybe not officially, but just calling it "Epic scale" on a forum like this would be a really good idea, imo!
Speaking of this- now that both scales are being offered, I would be interested in selling my 15mm mechs (3 Raptors with ALL weapon options for each, and 2 Lynx) here and putting the money right back into paulson's hands for his 6mm mechs.
If you're interested in a good deal there, please PM me for pics and details!
How good a deal are we talking here? Are you open to trading?
28mm droids is a good idea . My 15mm ones are already pending, though- sorry about that.
I've actually wanted to do a similar droid idea for awhile, it really opens up the possibilities when you consider models intended for other scales, but that happen to be the right size!
I stumbled across this KS, looking for 6mm resources in anticipation of the change in scale. It might be worth a look, especially for those in North America.
I've also sent the master model out for metal spincasting and should have some test casts in about 2-3 weeks. I'm thinking I'm going to hold the launch of the KS until those come in that way I have a finished model to show to new backers.
I know what my personal standards are and I think most of my current customers know what to expect from my models, but I'd prefer to have at least one model complete in order to demonstrate the product they can look forwards to. Too many KS projects offer just renders or concept art which leaves a lot of doubt as to their ability to deliver on those products.
I want people to see what I'm going to actually deliver, rather than show some flashy renders and wave jazz hands... ::robotech::
The current plan for the KS is that I'll do 4 initial mechs, the Raptor, Goshawk, Lynx, and Osprey. I'll offer one variant for each initially and once the initial goal is hit I can add on stretch goals for additional variants as well as introduce more mecha.
I'll be aiming for about a 5-6 month delivery target for the lights and mediums, if they all fund and I'm able to add on the heavies and quads it'll like take that out to a 8-12 month target.
The other option would be to do a KS for just the lights and mediums as one group, then split the heavies and quads into a second KS. If I go that route I may be able to deliver on the first group of models as quickly as 3-4 months since most of those designs are already complete.
Or just do a two wave approach, as lots of campaigns do, if it did well enough to warrant it.
What drives the 6 month lead time on the mediums and lights, since they're already sculpted? I would've thought the lead time would be half that for metal casts, but I must be missing something obvious...
I'm trying to avoid two waves as it's a killer on overseas shipping. It's not so bad when you have packages that ship for under $5 in the US but when that same package costs $25 to send to Europe it gets expensive really fast, two packages would be the better part of $50 for shipping it means I have to sell a lot more minis or charge an insane amount to non US addresses and risk having them think I'm trying to shaft them when all I'd be doing is charging as close to actual postage as possible. Over seas shipping of metal models is ugh.
I'm estimating with bit of wiggle room on delivery times. Actual production times on metal is pretty quick but it needs to fit into my casters schedule and between now and Adepticon he's incredibly busy. Even if I gave him the go ahead today on the Lynx the soonest I'd have production copies being made would be in two months. They could cast them all in a week or two but then I have to wait on delivery before I sort out all the parts and pack them etc. Dealing with multiple models increases that workload. I could probably get a couple light mechs together and done in a 3-4 month timeframe, but as we've all seen KS projects tend to hit all sorts of delays. I'd rather estimate with a longer window and deliver early then estimate too short and run past that date.
(I also need to have prints made which depending on the printer's schedule can sometimes take a month to get in hand before I can turn around and send them to the caster)
paulson games wrote: I'm trying to avoid two waves as it's a killer on overseas shipping. It's not so bad when you have packages that ship for under $5 in the US but when that same package costs $25 to send to Europe it gets expensive really fast, two packages would be the better part of $50 for shipping it means I have to sell a lot more minis or charge an insane amount to non US addresses and risk having them think I'm trying to shaft them when all I'd be doing is charging as close to actual postage as possible. Over seas shipping of metal models is ugh.
I can't speak for anyone else, but as a non-US resident, I have come to accept paying more for postage. Usually, even outrageous shipping costs from the US don't exceed Japan prices, so I can live with it.
It's definitely good to leave wiggle room on the delivery times, I'm just thinking that being able to offer more than 1 light and 1 medium for 2 factions would be good (or at least, being ready to in the event that it makes sense).
It's a tough call for me whether just being more conservative, or going for the whole thing would be better... I just feel like 2 unit types and 2 factions isn't enough. Obviously, I'd love for the quads to be made... but even if it's just the heavies, that might help add some variation to appearance and gameplay.
RiTides wrote: It's definitely good to leave wiggle room on the delivery times, I'm just thinking that being able to offer more than 1 light and 1 medium for 2 factions would be good (or at least, being ready to in the event that it makes sense).
It's a tough call for me whether just being more conservative, or going for the whole thing would be better... I just feel like 2 unit types and 2 factions isn't enough. Obviously, I'd love for the quads to be made... but even if it's just the heavies, that might help add some variation to appearance and gameplay.
Just some thoughts
In the same way that every tank in 40K is based on identical chassis (i.e. Rhino, Chimera, Falcon), Mecha Front mecha are all the same, just with different weapons. I, for one, am OK with that.
If I release the basic lights and mediums that a total of 4 mech chassis, each will have 3 variants that's a total of 12 models to work with in the basic miniatures pool and that doesn't include any of the blackfrost mechs or the scout chassis models I have in reserve. It would expand that to about 20 models.
If I tally up all the various chassis and variants of lights thru quads the line will have between 40-50 separate models, that's a lot of stuff for a basic line. Most of the chassis can actually support up to about 5-6 different unique weapon load outs, I won't model all of them at this time as it will get kind of crazy on set up costs but there's potential for a lot of different sku units. I'll expand as quickly as I'm able .
40-50 variants would definitely be good as an eventual goal (not including if the game does well a possible additional faction *wink*), but I think about 12 variants from the get-go would be a good start to pitch the game and show off the pretty models. Of course, a quick bump-up to 20 models would help keep the buzz up after initial release (like post-kickstarter).
I want to pick up the rules and possible jump into your eventual kickstarter. My mecha itch needs to be scratched (especially after Robotech dropped the ball hard), and your models look beautiful so far.
I'm planning on attending Adepticon next week and if I can secure a table I'll be doing Mecha Front demos likely on Fri & Sat afternoon. People participating in the demo's will get free stuff.
I'll also be hanging out there a bit so if you are attending and would like to meet up and chat feel free to shoot me a message or track me down in the demo area.
(I think it's over towards the vendor hall but not sure)
I'd say look for the overweight guy with glasses, but that's not going to be much help. I'll likely be the only guy there with Mecha Front models and I'm going to see if I can get some sort of t-shirt made that says Mecha Front on it so that I'm a bit more visible.
I'd also like to get some people together for dinner likely on Friday evening after the dealer hall closes (7:30ish?). You can't come to the Chicago area without hitting Giordano's for some of their stuffed pizza. So if you want to meet up for some great food I've got $100 towards buying.
(You're on your own for drinks) Watch this spot or the FB page for info.
If you're worried about visibility, you should consider a nice orange or pink shirt.
Just sayin'...
I'll repeat myself, even if you have to charge premium prices, you could offer the 15mm models as a "last chance to grab them" in resin. Am I right in assuming there haven't been over 150 made of each model? The rarity might be something some people go for.
Blackfrost medium would be cool as hell. I think you're being extremely smart in hedging your bet with the estimated delivery time. Better to surprise everyone and come out on time, or a bit early, rather than pull a Defiance, or a Robotech.
That's it! Once I have a real job, I'm going on a gaming road trip. I can't stand knowing you're all on average less than 24 hours drive away!
. Thanks for clarifying about the packs.
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