Now that the djinn is out of the lamp re: the Predator, I wonder if GW is going to make us wait another week or two for the official reveal as-planned, or will they release the official photos and complete trailer immediately.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Now that the djinn is out of the lamp re: the Predator, I wonder if GW is going to make us wait another week or two for the official reveal as-planned, or will they release the official photos and complete trailer immediately.
Yea they tend to do an official unveiling asap rather than leave unintended leaks circulating, lately.
Nice. Dome turret Predator was my favorite tank, until GW "upgraded" it with horrible rivets and armor detail. Glad to see they kept the turret smooth.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: Ah jeez so it's not even that those upgrades are available this weekend? It's just a reveal. I'm going to stop trying to follow releases. Just annoying.
Preorder announcements only happen on Sunday (for next Saturday).
Whatever else happens during the week is just reveals
Any chance the old dome predator with the metal twin assault cannons will be legal? I have one sitting in a box somewhere I was going to Orkify, but never got around to it.
Umm. Sunday announces preorder, saturday every week same time goes on preorder for gw store, friday for fw. Can't get easier. Super simple predictable pattern.
Goreshrek wrote: Any chance the old dome predator with the metal twin assault cannons will be legal? I have one sitting in a box somewhere I was going to Orkify, but never got around to it.
It's an option for IF & BA, as assault cannons were still prototypes and being tested by those legions.
Ok, so if one wants to make a Standard Whirlwind (as documented in the supplemental PDF), this predator kit's frontal hull plate is the one to get. I was wondering when we'd be seeing it, since the Deimos Rhino kit didn't have it.
As a BA player, a Baal pred loadout would have been nice but I reckon we'll be seeing more variants soon enough.
tauist wrote: Ok, so if one wants to make a Standard Whirlwind (as documented in the supplemental PDF), this predator kit's frontal hull plate is the one to get. I was wondering when we'd be seeing it, since the Deimos Rhino kit didn't have it.
As a BA player, a Baal pred loadout would have been nice but I reckon we'll be seeing more variants soon enough.
Legion specific upogrades will... sadly, likely be only avaliable from FW in resin :(
tauist wrote: Ok, so if one wants to make a Standard Whirlwind (as documented in the supplemental PDF), this predator kit's frontal hull plate is the one to get. I was wondering when we'd be seeing it, since the Deimos Rhino kit didn't have it.
As a BA player, a Baal pred loadout would have been nice but I reckon we'll be seeing more variants soon enough.
Legion specific upogrades will... sadly, likely be only avaliable from FW in resin :(
Potentially kitbash-able depending on the specific upgrades. There are a fair amount of weapons on various sprues (and obviously more coming)
The Phazer wrote: Those are the first ones that seem to coherently fit with the Mark VI kit.
They're great.
The iron warriors lack beaks, but they’re also intended to be MK 6. They have the lights on the helmet, for example. As for the rest…
Yeah, the IW helmets were clearly Mk VI even without the beak.
Shave off the 'light' thingie though, and they look a lot more like mk4's imho as they also have the cables running to the mouth piece. I'll be replace my beaky heads with em anyways.
Edit: derp it was announced a few months back and I forgot. D:
Although, they did only announce the basic version. Not any of the interesting options.
I would surmise that the other versions will be plastic, so far it seems to be how the design process has been going with all the announced/released stuff.
angel of death 007 wrote: I have been looking at starting Horus Heresy but I have a feeling it will follow the GW regular codex crap. I know right now they did those Liber Astartes and Liber Hereticus but that reminds me of when they came out with a new release of 40k and did those indexes which were only good for like a few months while they released codexes for each army.
Honestly the box set looks like a decent value or starting point but I am still kinda fearing GW will do the GW thing.
Anyone know if they will go the codex route with HH?
Those two main books are your army books. Do you really think each single legion will get a dedicated book? That would be 18 books! No one will support such crap in the community. It would be even worse than Bookromunda.
We will get in a couple of months Cults/Militia and Mechanicum. And that´s it. There will be no need to turn your gaming room into a library. This is the main advantage of 30K over 40K: Less factions which warrant more fun.
LOL well see if GW let's that stand and for how long.
angel of death 007 wrote: I have been looking at starting Horus Heresy but I have a feeling it will follow the GW regular codex crap. I know right now they did those Liber Astartes and Liber Hereticus but that reminds me of when they came out with a new release of 40k and did those indexes which were only good for like a few months while they released codexes for each army.
Honestly the box set looks like a decent value or starting point but I am still kinda fearing GW will do the GW thing.
Anyone know if they will go the codex route with HH?
Those two main books are your army books. Do you really think each single legion will get a dedicated book? That would be 18 books! No one will support such crap in the community. It would be even worse than Bookromunda.
We will get in a couple of months Cults/Militia and Mechanicum. And that´s it. There will be no need to turn your gaming room into a library. This is the main advantage of 30K over 40K: Less factions which warrant more fun.
LOL well see if GW let's that stand and for how long.
Their primary purpose seems to be to sell dead trees, but I hope they can restrain themselves this time.
Boosykes wrote: LOL well see if GW let's that stand and for how long.
You do know the Liber books aren't like the 8th Ed Indexes right? They're the full package of units and army rules. For all intents and purposes, these are the Codex equivalents.
Matrindur wrote: Seems like somebody made a mistake and uploaded the plastic Predator trailer
I'm not actually sure it's a mistake - there's been an issue recently with film and game trailers where it appears there are people in some Eastern territories who have admin access at YouTube as staffers selling or leaking access to videos that have been uploaded and kept private so they're ready to go when the reveal is. It looks to me like like this might be a repeat of that situation.
I am quite surprised Google haven't got a grip on it.
H.B.M.C. wrote: How dare people want to be able to model what's in the rules.
This is the kind of gak that led to no model/no rule, or did you forget that
1 - You can buy the Infernus and the Executioner variants off FW.
2 - HH is a month old and not every single kit under the sun is going to be out within a month.
3 - The kit is giving half the turret options and all of the sponson options.
4 - Get off the NMNR train because so far it hasn't applied to HH.
H.B.M.C. wrote: How dare people want to be able to model what's in the rules.
This is the kind of gak that led to no model/no rule, or did you forget that
1 - You can buy the Infernus and the Executioner variants off FW.
2 - HH is a month old and not every single kit under the sun is going to be out within a month.
3 - The kit is giving half the turret options and all of the sponson options.
4 - Get off the NMNR train because so far it hasn't applied to HH.
Look who you're replying to.... save your keystrokes.
How dare people want to be able to model what's in the rules.
This is the kind of gak that led to no model/no rule, or did you forget that
On the other side, we don't know what else is coming with a kit that hasn't been officially shown yet. People really, really need to chill out. It's pretty clear from what we have so far that this release is being handled with a different philosophy when compared to their other two games.
One big thing to note is that the Liber books are written in an entirely different, and more adult way than the 40K recent materials have been. To me, that signals a different philosophy from the design perspective. I never in a million years expected to the see the heavy weapon and special weapon upgrade sprues. Something I've long thought should be the standard for their games. Let's see what happens.
Togusa wrote: On the other side, we don't know what else is coming with a kit that hasn't been officially shown yet. People really, really need to chill out. It's pretty clear from what we have so far that this release is being handled with a different philosophy when compared to their other two games.
One big thing to note is that the Liber books are written in an entirely different, and more adult way than the 40K recent materials have been. To me, that signals a different philosophy from the design perspective. I never in a million years expected to the see the heavy weapon and special weapon upgrade sprues. Something I've long thought should be the standard for their games. Let's see what happens.
I think if the kit had more options it would'a been in the trailer.
You are very much correct in that there is a different philosophy for either game, with HH being clearly superior. Insectum and many others have been praising the sheer amount of options in the Liber books, and having finally had a chance to look at them yesterday it is staggering just how much stuff is in there.
Meanwhile, my Chaos Codex just arrived, and they ain't even got lightning claws in the HTH weapon list.
beast_gts wrote: Can Techmarines losing Conversion beamers and Indomitus Terminators losing some of their options be considered NMNR?
The former maybe but the latter IMO no mostly because Terminators as a whole have been changed from one shared entry into separate ones and Indomitus also gained some options in return.
I also want to point out that being extremely picky for unit options instead of units doesn't prove NMNR, especially when there is a whole PDF with stuff that doesn't have models but does have rules (regardless of how good or bad those rules may be).
It appears there are 3 different mounting plates/mantlets for the turret weapons with the volkite and twin liked lascannons sharing one. Hopefully all will be mangetisable.
Togusa wrote: On the other side, we don't know what else is coming with a kit that hasn't been officially shown yet. People really, really need to chill out. It's pretty clear from what we have so far that this release is being handled with a different philosophy when compared to their other two games.
One big thing to note is that the Liber books are written in an entirely different, and more adult way than the 40K recent materials have been. To me, that signals a different philosophy from the design perspective. I never in a million years expected to the see the heavy weapon and special weapon upgrade sprues. Something I've long thought should be the standard for their games. Let's see what happens.
I think if the kit had more options it would'a been in the trailer.
You are very much correct in that there is a different philosophy for either game, with HH being clearly superior. Insectum and many others have been praising the sheer amount of options in the Liber books, and having finally had a chance to look at them yesterday it is staggering just how much stuff is in there.
Meanwhile, my Chaos Codex just arrived, and they ain't even got lightning claws in the HTH weapon list.
Told you that you'd like it. Just wait until you see the Core rules. That's when you'll really realize just how much better the HH writers are compared to the 40k team.
I think they will go the Leman Russ route of two kits with different weapon options.
(Same with the Leviathan with a shooty and a melee version)
Now whether they both release at the same time or the second one will come later no idea.
(Also if both will be available from FLGS or if one will be direct only)
It could go either way on the turret options. There are 4 pictures, one with each of the sponson options. All Las, which is new for heresy, all volkite since choom, classic autocannon and heavy bolter, and then flamer sponsons with conversion beamer. If there was a flame turret they could have shown it on the flame sponson picture, but then there would be 3 pics of all the same load outs.
There is plenty of room on the sprue for all the guns. The rhino hatch sprue is only half size, and that is taken up with doors and top hatches, which could be combined with the side and top hulls for the rhino version. The sponsons are a separate sprue, leaving plenty of space for the single turret and multiple guns and mantlets.
The pics also don't show any pintle mounted weapons, so it would also be possible to extrapolate that the kit included just hatches and no accessory sprue.
As someone who hasn't played Heresy previously, is there any new options in this kit or is it just a plastic reimagining of what was already available?
H.B.M.C. wrote: And we may be all wrong and every option is in the box. But it's not fething "entitlement" to want the basic options from the book to be in the box.
I think it's most likely there'll be two boxes with a few options in each. The same as the Leman Russ.
I don't really mind that idea, while I would like all options in one box the reality is that it would likely require another sprue and probably bump the price up by another 20 to 25% or more. So the question becomes would you rather have all options, or half the options and cheaper. Given I can only play with one at a time, I'd rather the latter.
I've not been a fan of the trend to include more options but increase prices such that you have to spend more money to get the same number of models on the table. Options are nice, but when it comes to GW the prices are already high enough that a streamlined option is nice.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: As someone who hasn't played Heresy previously, is there any new options in this kit or is it just a plastic reimagining of what was already available?
The Graviton cannon and Volkite macro-saker are new options for HH 2.0 available in the new kit. There's also the Neutron blaster, which was added as an option but there's never been a kit available.
In total, Heresy predators have 9 weapon options (ones in the new kit are bolded):
AllSeeingSkink wrote: As someone who hasn't played Heresy previously, is there any new options in this kit or is it just a plastic reimagining of what was already available?
The Graviton cannon and Volkite macro-saker are new options for HH 2.0 available in the new kit. There's also the Neutron blaster, which was added as an option but there's never been a kit available.
In total, Heresy predators have 9 weapon options (ones in the new kit are bolded):
As peeved as I am that they didn't show what melta/flame looks like, it's not really a big deal for myself. Luckily the box with my deimos pred turret/weapons didn't get jacked so when I grab a plastic one, I will have ALL the options...("every silver linings got a touch of grey")
Hopefully we all get some infantry options soon, either as add on packs or a new kit.
Sense would be a stand alone breacher shields kit that can be attached to existing plastic kits, with it designed to primarily work with Mk3 but use able with all marks.
Also, plastic Mk2 and Mk5 would be hella cool.
Dr. Mills wrote: Hopefully we all get some infantry options soon, either as add on packs or a new kit.
Sense would be a stand alone breacher shields kit that can be attached to existing plastic kits, with it designed to primarily work with Mk3 but use able with all marks.
Also, plastic Mk2 and Mk5 would be hella cool.
More so than breacher shields I think a jump pack upgrade sprue / assault squad are in order. Only the mk3 tactical box has non-sergeant melee elements (chainswords). Which is just silly considering the sheer number of characters and veteran units who get access to jump packs.
I'm still hoping that other units are used as a back door to redo other armor marks. Mk IV with jump pack or normal packs to make assault marines, despoilers, or destroyers. MK III with breacher gear or melee weapons. Rapier platforms with MK II crew to get the CAD files expanded from vehicle crew.
morganfreeman wrote: More so than breacher shields I think a jump pack upgrade sprue / assault squad are in order. Only the mk3 tactical box has non-sergeant melee elements (chainswords). Which is just silly considering the sheer number of characters and veteran units who get access to jump packs.
The MkIV kit has the large knives that were supposed to represent a chainsword equivalent in the 1.0 rules. But I guess that sort of counts-as might not fly as readily now that there's specific rules for non-chainsword basic close combat weapons.
If they do jump packs as as upgrade sprue, hopefully they have alternate chest plates for the harnesses. Could tie them to poses like the special weapon instructions.
MajorWesJanson wrote: If they do jump packs as as upgrade sprue, hopefully they have alternate chest plates for the harnesses. Could tie them to poses like the special weapon instructions.
Considering that the chest plates are integrated with the legs they’re either not bothering with straps or we’ll be getting more poses (for peak aerial dynamism).
Or I suppose they could supply modular plastic straps that go over the existing chest plates. But that seems even less likely.
Somehow I can't see them doing jump pack assault marines without jump pack assault poses. Maybe not flight stands, but certainly *something* to suggest movement and oomph.
Ideally we’ll get “assaulty” running poses, with jump packs and separate straps. Use them to make destroyers, assault squads and just a regular tactical squad out for a jog.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: As someone who hasn't played Heresy previously, is there any new options in this kit or is it just a plastic reimagining of what was already available?
Graviton and Volkite turret weapons plus the Volkite sponsons are new.
Togusa wrote: On the other side, we don't know what else is coming with a kit that hasn't been officially shown yet. People really, really need to chill out. It's pretty clear from what we have so far that this release is being handled with a different philosophy when compared to their other two games.
One big thing to note is that the Liber books are written in an entirely different, and more adult way than the 40K recent materials have been. To me, that signals a different philosophy from the design perspective. I never in a million years expected to the see the heavy weapon and special weapon upgrade sprues. Something I've long thought should be the standard for their games. Let's see what happens.
I think if the kit had more options it would'a been in the trailer.
You are very much correct in that there is a different philosophy for either game, with HH being clearly superior. Insectum and many others have been praising the sheer amount of options in the Liber books, and having finally had a chance to look at them yesterday it is staggering just how much stuff is in there.
Meanwhile, my Chaos Codex just arrived, and they ain't even got lightning claws in the HTH weapon list.
Yep! The options are pretty nice. I love being able to design my own characters. I jumped ship on my Chaos Marines, traded them in for four painted Termite Siege Drills to use in my Heresy armies.
A note about the other options, we were thinking the same thing about the Leviathan, which was originally shown off with only ranged options. But as I recall later pictures have shown their to definitely be another upgrade sprue for CC for that kit.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Somehow I can't see them doing jump pack assault marines without jump pack assault poses. Maybe not flight stands, but certainly *something* to suggest movement and oomph.
I think an assault squad would want new legs, maybe not jumping (so they can also be used for ground pounding melee units) but at least something beyond the "stand still" or "slowly walk forward" poses of the regular kits.
Well, good to know a possible name for the 40k equivalent of the chaos 'soulshatter lascannons' (the d6+2 damage version).
Gravis isnt equivalent to the soulshatter. It's basically used in place of "twin" since twin linked in HH is for rerolls. It's double the number of shots, not extra damage.
Well, good to know a possible name for the 40k equivalent of the chaos 'soulshatter lascannons' (the d6+2 damage version).
Gravis isnt equivalent to the soulshatter. It's basically used in place of "twin" since twin linked in HH is for rerolls. It's double the number of shots, not extra damage.
Well, that is, except the gravis plasma cannon (not TLed, just better), or the gravis melta (multi meltas alredy had "twin" exhausts), or the gravis power fist, or the gravis chainfist...
It also isn't double shots all the time: it is sometimes (melta, lascannon, plasma is large blast instead of small one), but not other times (boltcannon is Heavy 6 instead of 4 and TLed, autocannon is Heavy 3 instead of 2 and TLed...). And of course, the CC weapons are their own thing.
Looking at the Ultramarine RoW strikes me as a good mix of tanks and infantry seems like it would work well. Not going full armored spearhead, but definitely planning a solid mechanized part of my list.
drbored wrote: It's all good to see all these new plastic kits
But we actually need to be able to buy them
True. But given the lack of CSM kits, and the two week period for paints, I think something has gone wrong again.
I'd love to see some HH previews of pre-orders tomorrow.
ArcaneHorror wrote: I have to say, I am impressed by how fast the legionary helmets are being released.
Do you mean the speed of the previews, or is this just sarcasm?
Because the only ones on sale at the moment are the IF (Sons seem to be out of stock), same with the shoulder pads, other than reissuing the DA and IW stuff (for non-mk6 armors)
ArcaneHorror wrote: I have to say, I am impressed by how fast the legionary helmets are being released.
They really need to just get on with releasing the helmets/pauldrons...so they can MTO the legion torsos for mkiii/iv, cuz I've got some replacin' to do!
It’s worth trawling whatever local stores and FLGS might be local to you.
From running the Loot Group, you’d be genuinely surprised how often high demand, or short run items can languish on a shelf somewhere.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh, and as soon as we know the Deredeo chassis is crossing the Rubicon Plasticaris? I’m gonna do a Fury of the Ancients too.
I knew there was a crap pun in it somewhere. Took a while, but here it is!
Rubicon Plasticaris. The process by which any Forgeworld Kit makes the transition to a plastic Citadel kit.
The first kit to cross the Rubicon Plasticaris, pointless fact fans (as in fans of pointless facts. Not the fact fans being pointless) was of course the Tau Piranha. And an amazing kit it was too for its day.
Eiríkr wrote: Rapidly losing interest in starting HH, it's been over a month since the MK.IV and III kits have been in stock. :(
They keep coming back into stock, then selling out after a few hours - I ordered some MKIII yesterday.
I've been subscribed via email for notification on the MK.IV and III for three weeks now, and haven't had anything come through to say stock is available.
Third party don't seem to have access to the reboxed kits for selling on? gak out of luck, oh well.
Third parties can get the mark iii / iv but they make less on them because they are direct. My guess is they have about a 20% margin as most places sell them at the GW cost price or 5-10% off.
It’s worth bearing in mind that even Warhammer World, which I live near , hasn’t had a good stock of the boxes or the books since after launch weekend. So it’s not just traitorous colonials that are seeing stock shortages 😂
It’s also worth bearing in mind that right now we are coming upon the big U.K. school holidays so a lot of places experience 4-6 weeks of running on far fewer staff due to people with kids being on holiday.
A quick note for folks on the fence about buying ForgeWorld HH stuff due to quality issues. Lately the resin quality seems to have finally caught up to the prices and I have been very pleased with orders from an Achilles dread to SoH helmets.
I am not one of those who thinks its ok for resin to show up covered in release agent, or sweating no matter how many times it is washed, etc. So for me this is a big deal that I can order with some consistency.
I'm glad the stuff is out of stock everywhere, all the time. It means I'll actually have opponents to play the game against. You know what doesn't sell out? Aeronautica starter boxes. Coincidentally I am totally unable to find a game of that anywhere in the Southern half of Florida.
Crimson wrote: Could someone tell me how many of the 'accessory sprues' the 20 marine box of beakies comes with? Two?
'Accessory Sprue' is a misnomer, it really is essential - but you get one per two marine sprues. The "accessory" sprue has the rest of the bits for a squad of ten that are not on the 5-man sprues, such as ten holstered bolt pistols and pouches/grenades, in addition to the vexilla and sergeant bits.
'Accessory Sprue' is a misnomer, it really is essential - but you get one per two marine sprues. The "accessory" sprue has the rest of the bits for a squad of ten that are not on the 5-man sprues, such as ten holstered bolt pistols and pouches/grenades, in addition to the vexilla and sergeant bits.
Eiríkr wrote: Rapidly losing interest in starting HH, it's been over a month since the MK.IV and III kits have been in stock. :(
They keep coming back into stock, then selling out after a few hours - I ordered some MKIII yesterday.
I've been subscribed via email for notification on the MK.IV and III for three weeks now, and haven't had anything come through to say stock is available.
Third party don't seem to have access to the reboxed kits for selling on? gak out of luck, oh well.
Asked my LGS about ordering some and was told their out of stock until August at the earliest. Sounds like it may be a bit of a wait!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Toofast wrote: I'm glad the stuff is out of stock everywhere, all the time. It means I'll actually have opponents to play the game against. You know what doesn't sell out? Aeronautica starter boxes. Coincidentally I am totally unable to find a game of that anywhere in the Southern half of Florida.
I've seen it played once and then never again. I found the game to be awful, but the models are cool. I bought a bunch to use as terrain for my AT tables.
Toofast wrote: I'm glad the stuff is out of stock everywhere, all the time. It means I'll actually have opponents to play the game against. You know what doesn't sell out? Aeronautica starter boxes. Coincidentally I am totally unable to find a game of that anywhere in the Southern half of Florida.
Whether something sells out or not isn't terrible dependent on actual popularity and is instead largely down to how well GW gauge interest vs actual interest, therefore how much product is made vs how much is sold. A lot of the last wave of Aeronautica DID sell out and was restocked. Dominion didn't sell out and I can still buy boxes of it now even though I'm sure it sold more copies that a lot of things that did sell out, it's just GW assumed people were going to go gaga over it. Most of the HH stuff hasn't sold out here even though I'm sure it's popular, it's just the MkIII and MkIV... I'm guessing they didn't produce a lot and were instead expecting the overwhelming majority to want the MkVI kits.
Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
And this perfectly fine. Legions employed several hundred thousands of marines strewn around the milky way so gear will invariably vary as supply chains will differ from one location to another.
Yea that's my answer to anyone who tries to question it. When I was deployed, we had guys wearing all kinds of stuff. I would see AOR1, AOR2, M81, and Multicam in the same squad. At some point in war you start using what you can get your hands on and what you personally like regardless of what SOP is.
Toofast wrote: Yea that's my answer to anyone who tries to question it. When I was deployed, we had guys wearing all kinds of stuff. I would see AOR1, AOR2, M81, and Multicam in the same squad. At some point in war you start using what you can get your hands on and what you personally like regardless of what SOP is.
This. Use what is to hand, anyone squabbling over armor marks is not worth playing.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
MajorWesJanson wrote: Besides the proportions, Mk III and IV just look better than beakie suits.
Forgot MK2.
Oh, I'm also one of those guys who don't want to pay GW to play a new system. So I will be using my Necrons as Iron Hands and say these are the warriors who shed all their weak flesh and replaced it with robotic bodies, leaving only the brain. The vehicles, flyers and walkers - heavily modified by a long lost STC found on planet Cheaparia
Does anyone have a full list of all the units/upgrades for HH that they have confirmed are on the way, but not released yet? So Predators, Sicarans, etc? The drip drip drip but never actually release anything method they do ends up with me forgetting half the stuff
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
BigOscar wrote: Does anyone have a full list of all the units/upgrades for HH that they have confirmed are on the way, but not released yet? So Predators, Sicarans, etc? The drip drip drip but never actually release anything method they do ends up with me forgetting half the stuff
As far as I know we're still waiting on:
Leviathan
Contemptor
Plastic Praetor Kit
Spartan
Demios Predator
Rumored Demios Vindicator
Land Raider Proteus
Two more Heavy Weapon kits
Rumored Breachers/Assault kits
Sicarian
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Threatening violence because someone used models they wanted goes beyond that.
It's been explained many times to you now but if you're actively trying to prevent people from playing HH because they want to use MkVI or are doing test games with 40k models, then yes you are absolutely being a gakky individual.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Ah, the old who’s the real toxic argument to justify toxicity.
It doesn’t really stack up when GW’s oft repeated mantra is, ‘it’s your hobby, do what you like”.
Voss wrote: I'm more surprised they sold out than that GW produced too little.
Between the secondary market having their claws on them for years and the scale change of the mk6, I'm surprised there's so much demand for the 3 & 4.
They're at a much better price point now than they have been in years and the scale change may be part of the reason there's demand, as people might be aiming for mk3/4 instead of the mk6 to maintain scale consistency with their current collections.
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Threatening violence because someone used models they wanted goes beyond that.
It's been explained many times to you now but if you're actively trying to prevent people from playing HH because they want to use MkVI or are doing test games with 40k models, then yes you are absolutely being a gakky individual.
Agreed.
Part of me now wants to make a Heresy army using Primaris marines just to annoy the minority of toxic idiots in the hobby.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Not as toxic as threatening violence against someone over a made up history of a game. Not even close. It’s pretty damn toxic to try and defend that.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Not as toxic as threatening violence against someone over a made up history of a game. Not even close. It’s pretty damn toxic to try and defend that.
Fortunately most of our group has been very welcoming and positive. Once we iron out the troublemakers, I imagine things will be quite good.
Part of me now wants to make a Heresy army using Primaris marines just to annoy the minority of toxic idiots in the hobby.
Thing is, there's no point in doing that. By all means, make a Primaris army using a HH scheme, plenty of people have, or convert the Primaris into HH-era gear to be true scale but don't actively seek out people to annoy because that doesn't help anyone.
You need to let them out themselves by doing perfectly reasonable things like using Iron Warriors with MkVI or doing non-standard colour schemes.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wha-Mu-077 wrote: "It's toxic to expect people to care about the background of a game, and we should kick them all out"
You know that's not what the issue is and it never has been. Find something else to whinge about.
Wha-Mu-077 wrote: "It's toxic to expect people to care about the background of a game, and we should kick out everyone who does so."
Try 'people shouldn't throw tantrums and threaten violence' if you want to accurately reflect the arguments being made.
But if you really want to stick to the 'respect the background' argument, keep in mind the original HH game ONLY had Mk6 and Mk7 armor in it. So really the frothing weirdos* are simply wrong about the background they're ranting about.
*the ones making threats, not people with a personal preference for other marks.
BigOscar wrote: Does anyone have a full list of all the units/upgrades for HH that they have confirmed are on the way, but not released yet? So Predators, Sicarans, etc? The drip drip drip but never actually release anything method they do ends up with me forgetting half the stuff
As far as I know we're still waiting on:
Leviathan
Contemptor
Plastic Praetor Kit
Spartan
Demios Predator
Rumored Demios Vindicator
Land Raider Proteus
Two more Heavy Weapon kits
Rumored Breachers/Assault kits
Sicarian
Excellent, cheers, very helpful.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Being toxic is never about why you are doing something or what you are doing it about. It's about how you are doing it.
Part of me now wants to make a Heresy army using Primaris marines just to annoy the minority of toxic idiots in the hobby.
Thing is, there's no point in doing that. By all means, make a Primaris army using a HH scheme, plenty of people have, or convert the Primaris into HH-era gear to be true scale but don't actively seek out people to annoy because that doesn't help anyone.
You need to let them out themselves by doing perfectly reasonable things like using Iron Warriors with MkVI or doing non-standard colour schemes.
MkVI Iron Warriors in gold armour it is then
Joking aside though, the only edition of 40K I ever actually played was Rogue Trader. Any marine not in MkVI is a retcon to me.
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Threatening violence because someone used models they wanted goes beyond that.
It's been explained many times to you now but if you're actively trying to prevent people from playing HH because they want to use MkVI or are doing test games with 40k models, then yes you are absolutely being a gakky individual.
Agreed.
Part of me now wants to make a Heresy army using Primaris marines just to annoy the minority of toxic idiots in the hobby.
The best part about the community, which is excellent, is that people like you don't actually show up in real life. All this talk on the internet is thankfully just that, talk.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is 40k the most toxic fanbase around for anything? I've been around Ohio St vs Michigan, Auburn vs Alabama, Formula 1, NBA, MLB, NFL, car shows where guys argue chevy v ford or porsche v bmw or ferrari v lambo all day, watch guys who are snobs for a certain brand, Star Wars conventions, and tabletop games from multiple companies. I have never seen anything else like the GW fanbase. Guys will act like you committed a war crime because you 3d printed or bought a recast of a model GW doesn't even make any more. Guys will act like history buffs when they point out that your iron warriors are in the incorrect armor mark...in a sci-fi game about made-up universes 30k years in the future where the corpse of a living god fueled by souls of the innocent uses his psychic powers to help spaceships navigate. People will show up to a social function with zero personal hygiene, social skills, or self awareness. Sure you will have Star Wars fans who will defend the new trilogy until their dying breath like it was the greatest thing in the history of cinema, or the drunk guy at the car meet acting like his 95 Mustang in 3 different colors of primer is the baddest thing on the road and anyone who disagrees is an idiot, but they feel like outliers. In 40k, it seems like that's the general population and the outliers are reasonable people with other hobbies, a wife, their own home, personal hygiene, etc.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is 40k the most toxic fanbase around for anything? I've been around Ohio St vs Michigan, Auburn vs Alabama, Formula 1, NBA, MLB, NFL, car shows where guys argue chevy v ford or porsche v bmw or ferrari v lambo all day, watch guys who are snobs for a certain brand, Star Wars conventions, and tabletop games from multiple companies. I have never seen anything else like the GW fanbase. Guys will act like you committed a war crime because you 3d printed or bought a recast of a model GW doesn't even make any more. Guys will act like history buffs when they point out that your iron warriors are in the incorrect armor mark...in a sci-fi game about made-up universes 30k years in the future where the corpse of a living god fueled by souls of the innocent uses his psychic powers to help spaceships navigate. People will show up to a social function with zero personal hygiene, social skills, or self awareness. Sure you will have Star Wars fans who will defend the new trilogy until their dying breath like it was the greatest thing in the history of cinema, or the drunk guy at the car meet acting like his 95 Mustang in 3 different colors of primer is the baddest thing on the road and anyone who disagrees is an idiot, but they feel like outliers. In 40k, it seems like that's the general population and the outliers are reasonable people with other hobbies, a wife, their own home, personal hygiene, etc.
You win for most ridiculous post. I think you probably just made all of that up, because it is so far from reality. Try going to a home game at LSU. Routinely people are physically assaulted at MLB and NFL games.
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Threatening violence because someone used models they wanted goes beyond that.
It's been explained many times to you now but if you're actively trying to prevent people from playing HH because they want to use MkVI or are doing test games with 40k models, then yes you are absolutely being a gakky individual.
Agreed.
Part of me now wants to make a Heresy army using Primaris marines just to annoy the minority of toxic idiots in the hobby.
The best part about the community, which is excellent, is that people like you don't actually show up in real life. All this talk on the internet is thankfully just that, talk.
I don't know. I'd probably say that the best part is the models. But I guess we all have our preferences.
Toofast wrote: Some people are sticklers about fluff and want only Mk2-3-4 for their whatever legion. I don't really care and will happily field 40 MkVI in my Iron Warriors army.
Since launch of the new edition we have already had to kick four people from our discord for being the most salty of neckbeard over HH stuff. One fellow in particular was making deranged threats of violence against anyone who ran Iron Warriors in the new MK.VI Armor as "They never had in in the fluff." Another poster came completely unhinged when pictures of a game between two other players were uploaded, in which one of the players was using HH rules with his heavily converted primaris Salamanders army. I love the Heresy. The models, the rules. Lots of fun, but my God in all my years of gaming, the only other toxic community of this level I've come across was the Star Wars fandom.
Is 40k the most toxic fanbase around for anything? I've been around Ohio St vs Michigan, Auburn vs Alabama, Formula 1, NBA, MLB, NFL, car shows where guys argue chevy v ford or porsche v bmw or ferrari v lambo all day, watch guys who are snobs for a certain brand, Star Wars conventions, and tabletop games from multiple companies. I have never seen anything else like the GW fanbase. Guys will act like you committed a war crime because you 3d printed or bought a recast of a model GW doesn't even make any more. Guys will act like history buffs when they point out that your iron warriors are in the incorrect armor mark...in a sci-fi game about made-up universes 30k years in the future where the corpse of a living god fueled by souls of the innocent uses his psychic powers to help spaceships navigate. People will show up to a social function with zero personal hygiene, social skills, or self awareness. Sure you will have Star Wars fans who will defend the new trilogy until their dying breath like it was the greatest thing in the history of cinema, or the drunk guy at the car meet acting like his 95 Mustang in 3 different colors of primer is the baddest thing on the road and anyone who disagrees is an idiot, but they feel like outliers. In 40k, it seems like that's the general population and the outliers are reasonable people with other hobbies, a wife, their own home, personal hygiene, etc.
You win for most ridiculous post. I think you probably just made all of that up, because it is so far from reality. Try going to a home game at LSU. Routinely people are physically assaulted at MLB and NFL games.
I grew up in Columbus OH, my entire family had season tickets. I then lived in Hoover AL for 7 years where I had season tickets and went to away games. Yes someone got shot over the Iron Bowl 1 year. However, people will criticize the university. If Alabama tried to double the price of tickets every year, they would not have the majority of their fanbase defending the decision on message boards. The majority of the fanbases have personal hygiene and social skills, at least when they're sober. The majority of the fanbase has other hobbies and interests. They have significant others. In my anecdotal experience playing Warhammer for 25 years, it's just a different crowd. Same with cars, guns, watches, or any other hobby I've dabbled in. I wish this weren't true but I have an extremely hard time finding people through Warhammer that I would have over to my house for a cookout. Not the case at a tailgate, car show, or the shooting range. It's at the point where a small group of us have started playing warhammer at our houses and not telling anyone from the stores just to avoid your "average warhammer 40k enjoyer". I don't have a degree in psychology so I won't pretend to know why this is, but that's been my experience in 3 different states.
I don't know. I'd probably say that the best part is the models. But I guess we all have our preferences.
100% agree. The models and the universe are the big draw for me. I play this game despite the community. I can always find a small group of guys at the local FLGS or Warhammer and eventually form a club type environment at home by having the space, tables and terrain. If pickup games at the FLGS were the only option I would be a painting/lore guy only. My best friend and I quit MtG for years until Arena came out specifically because of the average player at our local stores. It was only enjoyable to play against each other which gets old quickly. Anywhere that isn't a GW store probably has those same people in their Warhammer playerbase as well.
Is 40k the most toxic fanbase around for anything? I've been around Ohio St vs Michigan, Auburn vs Alabama, Formula 1, NBA, MLB, NFL, car shows where guys argue chevy v ford or porsche v bmw or ferrari v lambo all day, watch guys who are snobs for a certain brand, Star Wars conventions, and tabletop games from multiple companies. I have never seen anything else like the GW fanbase. Guys will act like you committed a war crime because you 3d printed or bought a recast of a model GW doesn't even make any more. Guys will act like history buffs when they point out that your iron warriors are in the incorrect armor mark...in a sci-fi game about made-up universes 30k years in the future where the corpse of a living god fueled by souls of the innocent uses his psychic powers to help spaceships navigate. People will show up to a social function with zero personal hygiene, social skills, or self awareness. Sure you will have Star Wars fans who will defend the new trilogy until their dying breath like it was the greatest thing in the history of cinema, or the drunk guy at the car meet acting like his 95 Mustang in 3 different colors of primer is the baddest thing on the road and anyone who disagrees is an idiot, but they feel like outliers. In 40k, it seems like that's the general population and the outliers are reasonable people with other hobbies, a wife, their own home, personal hygiene, etc.
I agree with you that the Warhammer community is easily in medal table for toxicity. If not most toxic, then probably top 3 or 5.
But I genuinely laughed out loud when you said Warhammer 3D printing as that community is somehow on average another level more toxic than the general Warhammer community.
You can see this directly on youtube. The respectable gold standard for warhammer youtubers are people like Lueten09, Arbitor Ian, and Baldemort. All very down to earth normal people who I would have over for a beer. The least toxic people imaginable. Every day blokes on the street. Salt of the earth.
And on the extreme other end of this scale you have people like Gamza and Arch. Gamza is a toxic hate monster, and Arch was leaked saying some flat out inarguably racist gak, and his mods are just as bad if not worse. Them and their communities are far far more toxic than the general warhammer community. Both them and their entire toxic followings are all in on the Warhammer 3D printing train and are a major part of it.
I'm half hoping that these people and their communities drift off to another IP honestly, because it seems like the most toxic elements of the entire Warhammer community have coalesced around them. If they and their entire communities left for Starwars tomorrow then Warhammer would instantaneously drop down the ranking for most toxic community by a massive amount. I absolutely guarantee it.
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Threatening violence because someone used models they wanted goes beyond that.
It's been explained many times to you now but if you're actively trying to prevent people from playing HH because they want to use MkVI or are doing test games with 40k models, then yes you are absolutely being a gakky individual.
Agreed.
Part of me now wants to make a Heresy army using Primaris marines just to annoy the minority of toxic idiots in the hobby.
The best part about the community, which is excellent, is that people like you don't actually show up in real life. All this talk on the internet is thankfully just that, talk.
I always thought that the best part of the community is that most people in the hobby can spot when someone is just joking
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Disrespect the authors? Seriously? Have any of the authors come out and said their writing should be taken as gospel?
I've heard the argument of "respect history" in the context of games based on actual historical events, but "respect the authors"?
I'd be very surprised if the authors care what you do with your toys.
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Disrespect the authors? Seriously? Have any of the authors come out and said their writing should be taken as gospel?
I've heard the argument of "respect history" in the context of games based on actual historical events, but "respect the authors"?
I'd be very surprised if the authors care what you do with your toys.
I’ve heard several GW employees say the exact opposite. The Horus Heresy isn’t history, rather it’s the ancient mythology of the ‘now’ that is 40K. The novels are just one version of what might have happened.
godardc wrote: Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Disrespect the authors? Seriously? Have any of the authors come out and said their writing should be taken as gospel?
I've heard the argument of "respect history" in the context of games based on actual historical events, but "respect the authors"?
I'd be very surprised if the authors care what you do with your toys.
I’ve heard several GW employees say the exact opposite. The Horus Heresy isn’t history, rather it’s the ancient mythology of the ‘now’ that is 40K. The novels are just one version of what might have happened.
Every instance I've heard of GW refer to the lore, even in the Designers Notes of codexes and the core rulebooks, in White Dwarf articles, and in interviews, their stance is the same: The lore is there to inspire. It is not gospel. It is not set in stone. It is not a book you're meant to beat other people over the head with.
In so many ways, GW has given opportunities within their games and settings to allow players to make their own lore, create their own faction, and do their own thing. If you want to adhere to the correct iconography of the 124th Chapter of the Ultramarines Legion, you can absolutely do that. If you want to paint your Raven Guard as yellow, you can do that too.
In so many ways, GW has given opportunities within their games and settings to allow players to make their own lore, create their own faction, and do their own thing. If you want to adhere to the correct iconography of the 124th Chapter of the Ultramarines Legion, you can absolutely do that. If you want to paint your Raven Guard as yellow, you can do that too.
The Canari guard: they are the advanced warning system of the legion, they are a 'suicide squad' type of organization meant as censure for Legionnaires that fail in their duties. They go far in advanced positions and if they stop emitting their signal it means that they were wiped out and that a proper response is needed...
The issue with "lore accurate" is that whose lore at a what point in time? The lore is not exhaustive and it keeps getting expanded and outright changed. Like it has been said, originally there absolutely were mark VII in the HH. Marks other than VI and VII are the retcon. And in the future the lore will be changed again. So it seems bizarre to be hung about it on the level of such minute details.
I personally enjoy my own little head canon as to what my different units are and why they have this or that type of armor. They are my dudes, and so must abide by the rules i set. That being said, there is a minimal level of WYSIWYG that needs to happen so that games are clear, but apart from that, no trouble...
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
Considering basically every interview with Rick Priestly about the Horus Heresy contains a line to the effect of "That wasn't my intent but the company went a different direction I guess", GW itself "disrespects the authors".
That's oversimplifying a fair bit (as a company product is by necessity going to be a collaboration, not a singular vision ever)
Button trivial is annoying enough in real life (because there are multiple manufacturers, scrounging, looting, etc), but for made up stuff with a history retcons, ad hoc justifications, change of direction and a general attitude of 'this sounds cool at this moment,' Its pretty much absurd from day one.
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
For me the toxic part is gatekeeping other people's hobby... You can go as deep as you want in your lore exploration, you can enjoy when people paint their armies in fully 100% lore-accurate livery, and you can leave the people who paint their raven guard bright yellow to enjoy their fun...
Voss wrote: That's oversimplifying a fair bit (as a company product is by necessity going to be a collaboration, not a singular vision ever)
Button trivial is annoying enough in real life (because there are multiple manufacturers, scrounging, looting, etc), but for made up stuff with a history retcons, ad hoc justifications, change of direction and a general attitude of 'this sounds cool at this moment,' Its pretty much absurd from day one.
Which is my entire point, yes(toneless internet and all that). Saying people are "disrespecting the authors" by doing something creatively different is absurd and is exactly like demanding GW never strays from Priestley's original notes on the Heresy.
GW / FW ignoring their own fluff is common enough. For example, the side-bar fluff for Medusan Immortals states "the Immortals wore no symbols of their clan or Legion, save its numeration and the black-on-white death’s head symbol which proclaimed their mortal intent" while the models have their Legion symbol on their shields and shoulders.
Is it toxic to respect the background of the game of is it toxic to join a game and disrespect the authors, the fluff and others gamers, heavily invested in it ?
For me the toxic part is gatekeeping other people's hobby... You can go as deep as you want in your lore exploration, you can enjoy when people paint their armies in fully 100% lore-accurate livery, and you can leave the people who paint their raven guard bright yellow to enjoy their fun...
Reminds me of the saying about religion: when your religion says YOU can't do something, that's fine. When your religion says I can't do something, then we have a problem. Apply that to most other areas of life and it's amazing how well you can get along with everyone despite cultural differences.
People doing their own thing is fine, people not liking what that might be is also fine. Expressing that opinion is also fine. The beautiful part about life is that you have agency. You can simply avoid those who do things or have opinions you don't like.
ChaosDad wrote: I personally enjoy my own little head canon as to what my different units are and why they have this or that type of armor. They are my dudes, and so must abide by the rules i set.
I think basically every hobbyist (and fan of other expansive IPs) uses head canon to some degree. These sprawling IPs are filled with inconsistencies and contradictions, and people filter that information to shape those universes to their tastes. Sometimes conflicting head canons bump into one another on electronic forums and nerdplosions result.
We’ll be seeing this hulking monstrosity hit the front lines a little bit before the long-range version. You’ll also be able to pick up the melee weapon kit separately should you wish to mix and match loadouts, while a similar kit full of massive guns will be released on its own in the near future.
Glad the weapons are also a separate release. A wise move there I feel, as it should also open us up to the Legion Specific chassis from FW, assuming the fittings are the same.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Just checked the boxed set, and I reckon we’ll see the same for the Contemptor kits.
Warhammer Community wrote:We’ll be seeing this hulking monstrosity hit the front lines a little bit before the long-range version. You’ll also be able to pick up the melee weapon kit separately should you wish to mix and match loadouts, while a similar kit full of massive guns will be released on its own in the near future.
Assuming price isn't so high might just as well buy 1 of both. If for 1.7 leviathan you get 1 with options might just as well have 2 with wide range of options anyway.
Not Online!!! wrote: Still waiting on the Predator... or autocannon heavy weapons.
Personally i found it always wierd that there was a melee leviathan but that's just me.
Well at least it's on walker designed for cramped narrow areas.
Not Online!!! wrote: Still waiting on the Predator... or autocannon heavy weapons.
Personally i found it always wierd that there was a melee leviathan but that's just me.
Well at least it's on walker designed for cramped narrow areas.
TBF, the contemptor is already larger than the box dread and the Leviathan beats the Deredo ontop of the others... (sans rocket battery on the deredo), i don't buy it.
but that is just nitpicking.
Still waiting on contemptors aswell. But it's nice to know that we will get predators, heavy weapons, Contemptors and Leviathans which are atleast dual varieties.
the only core things missing then would be Recon Marines, Assault marines (dual kit hopefully), and upgrade sprues for mortalis options there? Oh and breachers but those could just be a shieldpack.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: It’s also something you can bung into a Mastodon to further increase your breaching fun.
Mastodon does the Curtain Wall. Siege Leviathan becomes Mr Handy Door, followed by Breachers, ready to sweep the side rooms.
Much like how I'd sell a testicle for a Plastic Fellblade/Glaive kit, a Plastic Mastodon would be an auto-buy for me. Probably two of them. I wouldn't even bother looking at the price, just take my wallet and go.
and remember folks your FLGS/online supplier may get the separate weapon sprue for the launch (fingers crossed) but it's highly likely to go direct only immediately after launch
tneva82 wrote: Assuming price isn't so high might just as well buy 1 of both. If for 1.7 leviathan you get 1 with options might just as well have 2 with wide range of options anyway.
Either way need 1-2 hulls and both weapon sprues.
I’ve already got 2 resin leviathans with all weapons except siege drill and melta. One is built as an iron hand in the Deathwatch, and the other isn’t built yet.
Can’t see myself needing more than two already, but I don’t know if I can help myself lol
I like the shoulder armor plates because I can easily cut some cog shapes into it for Iron Hands. Could also easily extend them all the way back with green stuff or plasticard or miliput for the full effect.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: It’s also something you can bung into a Mastodon to further increase your breaching fun.
Mastodon does the Curtain Wall. Siege Leviathan becomes Mr Handy Door, followed by Breachers, ready to sweep the side rooms.
Much like how I'd sell a testicle for a Plastic Fellblade/Glaive kit, a Plastic Mastodon would be an auto-buy for me. Probably two of them. I wouldn't even bother looking at the price, just take my wallet and go.
Sweet baby emperor, don’t tempt me with a plastic mastodon. That’s one of those kits I could never, ever justify buying in resin, but if they made a plastic one I’d be in trouble.
Looks great, properly chonky like it would Hulk Smash it's way through a wall, or a tank, or just about anything.
Also, excitingly, my copy of the base game has finally been shipped. After waiting more than 3 weeks for Element to get the new stock in and send me my copy, I managed to instead get a copy from Wayland who bafflingly just have a bunch of them instock and dispatched it same day. So Element order cancelled and hopefully a box full of beakies is on the way soon!
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: It’s also something you can bung into a Mastodon to further increase your breaching fun.
Mastodon does the Curtain Wall. Siege Leviathan becomes Mr Handy Door, followed by Breachers, ready to sweep the side rooms.
Much like how I'd sell a testicle for a Plastic Fellblade/Glaive kit, a Plastic Mastodon would be an auto-buy for me. Probably two of them. I wouldn't even bother looking at the price, just take my wallet and go.
Sweet baby emperor, don’t tempt me with a plastic mastodon. That’s one of those kits I could never, ever justify buying in resin, but if they made a plastic one I’d be in trouble.
I had one a few years back that I purchased from... "a dude" online. It was a nightmare for my friend to build for me, but God when it was done, that thing was incredible. I wish I'd not sold it.
tneva82 wrote: Just wish we had some idea of release day!
Might be my first new(as in not 2nd handed) 40k model(rather than AOS) in about a year. My all dread blood angels drooling over these
Not the contemptors? They seem more flexible to me
I kinda forgot the Proteus and dreadclaw for the core things that are missing and would be nice to have..
Btw there was the rumor going around that predators would come in batches, is that still likely or are we looking at 1/ box?
I already HAVE those
Though the new GT pack put bit of a curveball to my all dread list. As in I can't field these or relic contemptors or even have warlord trait...
But want...more...DREADNOUGHTS!
Dreadnought fever is a serious condition, it is a natural mutation from Kanfever, leading to symptoms such as:
- empty wallet.
- empty fridge
- death through pile of shame avalanche.
- Wife taking the kids and leaving.
- Pile of grey shame.
Do you want to develop existing games for the Specialist Design Studio ranges and design new ones from the ground up?
Are you excited about working collaboratively within a studio of professional miniatures designers, artists and writers to produce new rules for games set in the The Horus Heresy setting?
Within the Specialist Design Studio, writers, editors, miniatures designers and artists all work together collaboratively under the direction of the Product Design Managers. The Games Developer role is a key position within an integrated, multidisciplinary process of end to end product design.
In this role you will be responsible for creating all types of rules and background content for Warhammer: The Horus Heresy and any future games set in the Age of Darkness . You will be expected to take a top level design brief and, under the eye of the team’s lead writer, turn it into a finished set of rules or background, coordinating any playtesting and interacting with other teams within the Specialist Design Studio.
To be successful in this role, you will have in-depth knowledge of the Horus Heresy setting, and specifically the Warhammer: The Horus Heresy wargame. Ideally, you will have gaming or publishing industry experience, but if this is not the case and you are offered a position, this will be at the Trainee level where you will learn the ropes under the supervision of the lead writer.
This is a busy role and we need someone who can deliver and support exciting rules that fulfil the product brief, to a tight deadline. If you enjoy getting involved in the detail and will relish the challenge of taking responsibility for the quality of published material, we want to hear from you!
Do you want to develop existing games for the Specialist Design Studio ranges and design new ones from the ground up?
Are you excited about working collaboratively within a studio of professional miniatures designers, artists and writers to produce new rules for games set in the The Horus Heresy setting?
Within the Specialist Design Studio, writers, editors, miniatures designers and artists all work together collaboratively under the direction of the Product Design Managers. The Games Developer role is a key position within an integrated, multidisciplinary process of end to end product design.
In this role you will be responsible for creating all types of rules and background content for Warhammer: The Horus Heresy and any future games set in the Age of Darkness . You will be expected to take a top level design brief and, under the eye of the team’s lead writer, turn it into a finished set of rules or background, coordinating any playtesting and interacting with other teams within the Specialist Design Studio.
To be successful in this role, you will have in-depth knowledge of the Horus Heresy setting, and specifically the Warhammer: The Horus Heresy wargame. Ideally, you will have gaming or publishing industry experience, but if this is not the case and you are offered a position, this will be at the Trainee level where you will learn the ropes under the supervision of the lead writer.
This is a busy role and we need someone who can deliver and support exciting rules that fulfil the product brief, to a tight deadline. If you enjoy getting involved in the detail and will relish the challenge of taking responsibility for the quality of published material, we want to hear from you!
They should hire that guy who keeps making helpful criticism/suggestion videos on youtube. He's obviously very passionate about the game and I found his videos to be helpful as someone peripherally following the game.
tneva82 wrote: Just wish we had some idea of release day!
Might be my first new(as in not 2nd handed) 40k model(rather than AOS) in about a year. My all dread blood angels drooling over these
Not the contemptors? They seem more flexible to me
I kinda forgot the Proteus and dreadclaw for the core things that are missing and would be nice to have..
Btw there was the rumor going around that predators would come in batches, is that still likely or are we looking at 1/ box?
I already HAVE those
Though the new GT pack put bit of a curveball to my all dread list. As in I can't field these or relic contemptors or even have warlord trait...
But want...more...DREADNOUGHTS!
Dreadnought fever is a serious condition, it is a natural mutation from Kanfever, leading to symptoms such as:
- empty wallet.
- empty fridge
- death through pile of shame avalanche.
- Wife taking the kids and leaving.
- Pile of grey shame.
please consider asking a professional for help.
You lucky son of a gun! Wives usually set a man´s miniature collection on fire before they leave.
tneva82 wrote: Just wish we had some idea of release day!
Might be my first new(as in not 2nd handed) 40k model(rather than AOS) in about a year. My all dread blood angels drooling over these
Not the contemptors? They seem more flexible to me
I kinda forgot the Proteus and dreadclaw for the core things that are missing and would be nice to have..
Btw there was the rumor going around that predators would come in batches, is that still likely or are we looking at 1/ box?
I already HAVE those
Though the new GT pack put bit of a curveball to my all dread list. As in I can't field these or relic contemptors or even have warlord trait...
But want...more...DREADNOUGHTS!
Dreadnought fever is a serious condition, it is a natural mutation from Kanfever, leading to symptoms such as:
- empty wallet.
- empty fridge
- death through pile of shame avalanche.
- Wife taking the kids and leaving.
- Pile of grey shame.
please consider asking a professional for help.
Kink shaming is not cool. Some people just like Dreadnoughts. And an empty fridge is actually a BENEFIT because it's a natural lightbox roomy enough to take pictures of DREADNOUGHTS.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: and remember folks your FLGS/online supplier may get the separate weapon sprue for the launch (fingers crossed) but it's highly likely to go direct only immediately after launch
This is exactly why I'm not a fan of separating this stuff, it's the same with AT titans. On the one hand it's nice that you can get them separately, but why not just include everything in one box . At least you can buy the model from your FLGS with a discount and only have to get the overpriced weaponsprue from GW I suppose.
Albertorius wrote: Particularly DLC that they only sell direct with no possible discounts.
In the UK/EU FLGSs can order Direct Only items (Goblin Gaming's Direct Only category, for example), with the discount and minimum order size varying by account. Is it not the same in the US?
Not every store can provide discount as margin is so small it's practically breakeven even without discount. Customer service rather than straight profit.
Also gw sends those really sporadically so i can be waiting for month even if i order via flgs
Albertorius wrote: Particularly DLC that they only sell direct with no possible discounts.
In the UK/EU FLGSs can order Direct Only items (Goblin Gaming's Direct Only category, for example), with the discount and minimum order size varying by account. Is it not the same in the US?
Not the US, Spain (not sure why the flag shows as such), and no. I mean, they probably can, but they usually won't. And if they do, it is with no discount. So not any better than buying direct.
lord_blackfang wrote: The pricing on loose weapon sprues is so outrageous they can't possibly be seen as a positive.
Compared to them not being available at all, though?
No, not even then. GW prices are already stupid high as it is, we don't really need DLC on top of it.
Particularly DLC that they only sell direct with no possible discounts.
TBF, compared to say Havocs or Devastators (which players tend to want equip with the same weapons for specialisation reasons), ironically the Weapon sprues are cheaper.
F.e. full lascannon havoc squads requires me to buy 2 havoc squads at 50 CHF each. so 100 for "1 full" squad (nvm reaper chaincannons.)
for that i can get 20 69 CHF mark VI and a sprue of special weapons/ heavy weapons at 37.50. for 6.5 CHF more.
If i want 15 Havocs with lascannons then the math gets even more lopsided.
Granted however in HH you are kinda forced to bulk buy but is that a negative?
lord_blackfang wrote: The pricing on loose weapon sprues is so outrageous they can't possibly be seen as a positive.
Compared to them not being available at all, though?
No, not even then. GW prices are already stupid high as it is, we don't really need DLC on top of it.
Particularly DLC that they only sell direct with no possible discounts.
Sorry, but I need to challenge you describing this as DLC, because I really don’t think that can be justified.
Is it an add on to another kit? Yes. But, consider the context here. These simply aren’t weapons available to the basic Legion Tactical Squad. Rather, they’re weapons for specific specialist squads. So they’re not something we can reasonably say should’ve be packaged in with the 20 man units.
The alternative, given those squads must have uniform equipment loadouts would be a set for each type of squad - which by no means would be comparatively cheaper, or potentially boxes of 10 Marines, with say, 3 types of Special Weapon, with two variants to cover all options. You’re still buying exactly the same content that way, but if you want just a single 10 Man squad, but all the weapon options? You can do that the way they released them.
Selling them as they do? Blob of Tactical Blu-Tak, or getting handy with magnets, and you can field a wide variety of units from game to game, off the back of just two purchases, rather than having to buy a Single Box or more.
lord_blackfang wrote: MDG, we're talking about how Titans, and soon Leviathans, come with only half the stuff in their unit entry and the other half is DLC.
Yes, but you have a choice of two sets to buy, so you buy the set containing the options you want, the extra sprue being available then gives an option if you want to get into magnetising etc. without having to buy a second full kit, but I imagine a lot of people will build for a specific load out. They could have stuck everything in one box but then the price would go up as there's an extra sprue in there, which would mean people would be forced to pay for a bunch of options that they may not want.
Theres an absolute ton of options and it looks like you get enough to dual wield the melee weapons on the leviathan kit. I really don't see the issue. I'd rather have the optional kits and the weapon sprue option than having to buy a whole kit with EVERY possible combination and being forced to pay for an extra sprue to be honest. It also makes it easy for people to gear up the forgeworld dreads with a full suite of weapons far cheaper than buying resin ones or individual plastic ones off bits resellers would be.
lord_blackfang wrote: The pricing on loose weapon sprues is so outrageous they can't possibly be seen as a positive.
Compared to them not being available at all, though?
No, not even then. GW prices are already stupid high as it is, we don't really need DLC on top of it.
Particularly DLC that they only sell direct with no possible discounts.
Sorry, but I need to challenge you describing this as DLC, because I really don’t think that can be justified.
Is it an add on to another kit? Yes. But, consider the context here. These simply aren’t weapons available to the basic Legion Tactical Squad. Rather, they’re weapons for specific specialist squads. So they’re not something we can reasonably say should’ve be packaged in with the 20 man units.
The alternative, given those squads must have uniform equipment loadouts would be a set for each type of squad - which by no means would be comparatively cheaper, or potentially boxes of 10 Marines, with say, 3 types of Special Weapon, with two variants to cover all options. You’re still buying exactly the same content that way, but if you want just a single 10 Man squad, but all the weapon options? You can do that the way they released them.
Selling them as they do? Blob of Tactical Blu-Tak, or getting handy with magnets, and you can field a wide variety of units from game to game, off the back of just two purchases, rather than having to buy a Single Box or more.
So…it’s not DLC. At all.
Also, ebay exists, so my very expensive 10 plasma guns also nets me a bunch of other support weapons I can sell to others on ebay, probably making all my money back, or I can be the buyer and instead just buy my 10 plasma guns at probably a very reasonable price.
lord_blackfang wrote: MDG, we're talking about how Titans, and soon Leviathans, come with only half the stuff in their unit entry and the other half is DLC.
It’s….still not DLC. You want a shooty Leviathan? Buy that kit. Fighty? Buy that kit.
Bit of both? No need to buy both kits.
Remember the size of the weapons on these fellas is pretty large, so expecting the shooty one to double up each gun in the base kit seems….optimistic.
And, from what we’ve seen, the kits do seem to be built with easy magnetisation in mind, easing things considerably for those who want maximum flexibility for minimum purchase.
Also keep in mind that prior, you had to buy each chassis and each weapon separately. In resin.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: It’s….still not DLC. You want a shooty Leviathan? Buy that kit. Fighty? Buy that kit.
Bit of both? No need to buy both kits.
Remember the size of the weapons on these fellas is pretty large, so expecting the shooty one to double up each gun in the base kit seems….optimistic.
And, from what we’ve seen, the kits do seem to be built with easy magnetisation in mind, easing things considerably for those who want maximum flexibility for minimum purchase.
Also keep in mind that prior, you had to buy each chassis and each weapon separately. In resin.
"It was worse before" doesn't equte to "it's good now", you know.
Let's see how the sprues are laid out and billed and then we'll be able to say. But what 's true, currently, is that these new dreads can't double up of anything except apparently leviathan fists.
As to it being big... is it somehow bigger than a Predator or a Kratos? Those seem to be better in the weapons department, for some reason. Is the contemptor as big as the Leviathan, somehow? Because that one has the same fething problem too...
I'd justify it by saying that if it had all the options it would be too expensive but then instead of complaining that one box didn't have all the options (which very few kits have might I add) you'd be complaining about it being too expensive.
Why be happy that this will be far cheaper and easier to build/paint than the FW one when it isn't 100% perfect.
Gert wrote: I'd justify it by saying that if it had all the options it would be too expensive but then instead of complaining that one box didn't have all the options (which very few kits have might I add) you'd be complaining about it being too expensive.
Why be happy that this will be far cheaper and easier to build/paint than the FW one when it isn't 100% perfect.
Sure, given you know what I'd say then, of course you can retort like that. And sure, it will be cheaper, this is GW after all, they strive to make stuff affordable, its all they think about.
Sure.
"Cheaper than the FW one" is damning with very faint praise if I've ever heard it.
lord_blackfang wrote: MDG, we're talking about how Titans, and soon Leviathans, come with only half the stuff in their unit entry and the other half is DLC.
Yes, but you have a choice of two sets to buy, so you buy the set containing the options you want, the extra sprue being available then gives an option if you want to get into magnetising etc. without having to buy a second full kit, but I imagine a lot of people will build for a specific load out. They could have stuck everything in one box but then the price would go up as there's an extra sprue in there, which would mean people would be forced to pay for a bunch of options that they may not want.
The price for both sprues in the one box would probably end up cheaper than the separates anyway, and I imagine the vast majority of people who magnetise will be buying everything anyway.
I like the concept of close combat Leviathan but I like the look of ranged one better. I'll probably buy one of each anyway and would buy two even if all the weapon options came in the same kit.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: It’s….still not DLC. You want a shooty Leviathan? Buy that kit. Fighty? Buy that kit.
Bit of both? No need to buy both kits.
Remember the size of the weapons on these fellas is pretty large, so expecting the shooty one to double up each gun in the base kit seems….optimistic.
And, from what we’ve seen, the kits do seem to be built with easy magnetisation in mind, easing things considerably for those who want maximum flexibility for minimum purchase.
Also keep in mind that prior, you had to buy each chassis and each weapon separately. In resin.
If you want both you will end up price of nearly 2 for 1.
lord_blackfang wrote: MDG, we're talking about how Titans, and soon Leviathans, come with only half the stuff in their unit entry and the other half is DLC.
Exactly so.
I agree. GW is now reaping the true rewards. Starter box is a HUGE steal for customers. However this business practice is geared towards maximum profit. There is only one consolation for me about this Leviathan affair: I think the ranged weapon version is a waste as the dreadnought truly excels spending time in melee. So at least for me there is no loss.
20% discount on warlord, full price for weapon. 81.5 pounds. 2 warlords, 108. So for price of weapon sprue and bit more another body so you have 2 titans and 2 weapon sprues,
TalonZahn wrote: I love watching you all do mental gymnastics to justify a company splitting bits and kits into other bits and kits.
There is ZERO reason, other than money, to split many of the kits they do.
There's no reason for 2 Leviathan kits. Just put the ranged sprue in.
And Doc, don't pretend the Ranged one and the Melee one aren't going to cost the same price. It will literally be 2 for 1.
Also, is the whole "Citation needed" some new trend you guys across the Pond have picked up and started trending?
I feel like there is a difference between the Upgrade sprues for infantry weapons and the obvious rather wierd "cut content" on the dread. There's no point cutting the melee weapon sprue or the shooty sprue from the leviathan.
TalonZahn wrote: I love watching you all do mental gymnastics to justify a company splitting bits and kits into other bits and kits.
There is ZERO reason, other than money, to split many of the kits they do.
There's no reason for 2 Leviathan kits. Just put the ranged sprue in.
And Doc, don't pretend the Ranged one and the Melee one aren't going to cost the same price. It will literally be 2 for 1.
Also, is the whole "Citation needed" some new trend you guys across the Pond have picked up and started trending?
I feel like there is a difference between the Upgrade sprues for infantry weapons and the obvious rather wierd "cut content" on the dread. There's no point cutting the melee weapon sprue or the shooty sprue from the leviathan.
See, for example, how for the most part people is not complaining about the infantry weapon boxes.
Although to be fair the Mk6 sprues are some of the most stingy product GW has ever made, from the size of the sprues they look like GW crammed an infantry kit into an Aeronautica production slot or something.
lord_blackfang wrote: Although to be fair the Mk6 sprues are some of the most stingy product GW has ever made, from the size of the sprues they look like GW crammed an infantry kit into an Aeronautica production slot or something.
I feel like some less Bolt pistol holsters and a HB / ML and PG /Flamer would've gone a long way to endear it more, since then you could feasibly also run the squad out of the box as 2 veteran squads.
lord_blackfang wrote: Although to be fair the Mk6 sprues are some of the most stingy product GW has ever made, from the size of the sprues they look like GW crammed an infantry kit into an Aeronautica production slot or something.
Unfortunately true, yes.If they had used the same resources as in the older HH plastic marks (3 full sprues instead of one and a half), they would have been glorious.
lord_blackfang wrote: Although to be fair the Mk6 sprues are some of the most stingy product GW has ever made, from the size of the sprues they look like GW crammed an infantry kit into an Aeronautica production slot or something.
I feel like some less Bolt pistol holsters and a HB / ML and PG /Flamer would've gone a long way to endear it more, since then you could feasibly also run the squad out of the box as 2 veteran squads.
Cutting holsters would have driven me crazy, particularly due to the rather unique appearance of thr mk6 holsters. It's not as if it comes with extras, unless you build a sergeant with a plasma pistol and even then I want a holster for that as well even if I have to cut out the grip myself.
Not Online!!! wrote: I feel like some less Bolt pistol holsters and a HB / ML and PG /Flamer would've gone a long way to endear it more, since then you could feasibly also run the squad out of the box as 2 veteran squads.
TBF the idea of the kit seems to have been to avoid that so people starting out wouldn't just run Pride of the Legion and play their HH armies like 40k Marines. It was a big problem in our group when BaC came out that almost everyone was running PotL because they built the MkIV's with Special and Heavies because they all thought HH Tacticals were the same as 40k. It made for extremely boring games where everyone basically used the exact same list despite having the potential to take different units and RoW.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
Mystic grostnik ? Can you also give us answer to the question if the rumor is accurate for the Predators to come in bundles?`
Not Online!!! wrote: I feel like some less Bolt pistol holsters and a HB / ML and PG /Flamer would've gone a long way to endear it more, since then you could feasibly also run the squad out of the box as 2 veteran squads.
TBF the idea of the kit seems to have been to avoid that so people starting out wouldn't just run Pride of the Legion and play their HH armies like 40k Marines. It was a big problem in our group when BaC came out that almost everyone was running PotL because they built the MkIV's with Special and Heavies because they all thought HH Tacticals were the same as 40k. It made for extremely boring games where everyone basically used the exact same list despite having the potential to take different units and RoW.
I mean, fair enough from that perspective but it would've been better if that was just an option provided as a goodie for players.
Also it would've been dead easy for players to just get another box of marines and create enough special / normal dudes to stand in and make the squads modular for list building.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
I think with how much focus it's been getting on community, it's more likely to be the new Warcry box next week.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
I think with how much focus it's been getting on community, it's more likely to be the new Warcry box next week.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
Oh Mystic Grotsnik, what are this weekends lotto numbers please?
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
Just an aside, are monthly pay packets the norm in the UK?
There are generally 24/26 pay periods in the US in a year, with strong movement towards paying people weekly or even following their shift in the case of hourly work at larger employers. I'm impressed with the planning prowess and patience of those of you across the pond.
As someone who works in payroll, monthly is the most standard. Although you do get weekly, bi-monthly, 4 weekly etc. But they're normally smaller companies that run those.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
Just an aside, are monthly pay packets the norm in the UK?
There are generally 24/26 pay periods in the US in a year, with strong movement towards paying people weekly or even following their shift in the case of hourly work at larger employers. I'm impressed with the planning prowess and patience of those of you across the pond.
I've never been paid any other way than "monthly" (or monthly with two "extra" pays on december and about august, for 14 yearly payments) and "on delivery".
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Mystic Grotsnik predicts HH Wave 2 will be next weekend’s pre-orders, as that should coincide with the most common, end of the month, pay dates.
Mystic Grotsnik also predicts “one of everything” to come in around £250-£300.
Just an aside, are monthly pay packets the norm in the UK?
There are generally 24/26 pay periods in the US in a year, with strong movement towards paying people weekly or even following their shift in the case of hourly work at larger employers. I'm impressed with the planning prowess and patience of those of you across the pond.
monthly is normal here too, has to do with bureucracy and social systems. Makes it far easier to deduct social security pay.
The CC Leviathan is up for pre-order next weekend! (WarCom)
Spoiler:
Plus the "Leviathan Siege Dreadnought Close Combat Weapons Frame"
Firepower-focused Praetors planning to pick up a Leviathan packing powerful ranged weapons when it arrives need not fear a lack of options, as the Close Combat Weapons Frame will also be available to order direct from the Games Workshop webstore. This frame includes the two melee fists from the full Dreadnought kit, which can each be built as siege drills or siege claws for all of your Loyalist/Traitor grinding/crushing needs, and is a great way to add weapon options to any future Leviathan Siege Dreadnoughts you might add to your army.
I used to like the Leviathan but, for some reason, over the years it became quite goofy looking to me. I do quite like the look of this CC variant painted in SoH though. I'll probably get one CC Lev but no more than that, and also I really doubt I'll get the shooty version (though in general I prefer the look of shooty dreads or combined arms dreads over pure CC dreads)
proably waiting for better launch windows. remember there is a LOT of HH/CSM release so GW's proably not wanting to do massive dumps along side the CSM stuff
Kind of amazed they've not released the Sicarian yet, it seemed like they were planning on releasing it pretty much on release yet it's pretty much disappeared since then
Someone in logistics is going “feth, we can barely keep up with demand for rhinos‽ How can we be barely keeping up with demand for rhinos of all things? We’re going to have to ramp up hard if we want to sell a brand new vehicle.”
IDK if this counts as HH news but they recently moved Paul Norton from main studio to specialist. I know Specialist are known for their grittier style, which can sometimes look great, but also, how many times have you seen "It might be good, I can't tell, the paint is horrendous" spoken about an SG release? Well, anyway, 'eavy metal painter moves to SG, might count as news to some https://www.instagram.com/p/CgHoTzZtebn/
JWBS wrote: IDK if this counts as HH news but they recently moved Paul Norton from main studio to specialist. I know Specialist are known for their grittier style, which can sometimes look great, but also, how many times have you seen "It might be good, I can't tell, the paint is horrendous" spoken about an SG release? Well, anyway, 'eavy metal painter moves to SG, might count as news to some https://www.instagram.com/p/CgHoTzZtebn/
LOL, well said. Glad to see GW is investing more resources into these games!
JWBS wrote: IDK if this counts as HH news but they recently moved Paul Norton from main studio to specialist. I know Specialist are known for their grittier style, which can sometimes look great, but also, how many times have you seen "It might be good, I can't tell, the paint is horrendous" spoken about an SG release? Well, anyway, 'eavy metal painter moves to SG, might count as news to some https://www.instagram.com/p/CgHoTzZtebn/
ya I'm all about the gritty I mean look at gal vorbak and then look at the new possesed. The gal vorbak are like 10x better.
Yes it's good when it's good. Some of their paintjobs are just straight up bad though. Personally I prefer the main studio more stylised look anyway, so I have an obvious bias, but sometimes the SG paintjobs are objectively bad (not literally objectively since it's clearly my opinion, but about as close to objectively as is possible. In my opinion).
62.5e for leviathan. Could be worse. Primaris dread 55e so close. As expected web order for separate sprue limiting flgs discount so most likely will get 1 of both as don't expect price diffrence between 2 flgs discount full box be that much bigger than 1 plus no discount sprue
I know this is gonna sound alarmist, and out of character for me….
But GW really need to pull their finger out on Horus Heresy.
We’ve already been shown a Contemptor Kit, further heavy weapons, the Sicaran, Predator and Shooty Leviathan kit officially, and unofficially the Landraider Proteus dual kit.
These are of course highly desirable by new and established players both. So….where are they?
We are of course aware GW had issues surrounding their production capacity pre-plague years, and the status of their additions is ambiguous (lots of “I was told that” type stuff). But….seriously.
Get releasing already. I wants my shiny toys, and I don’t want Heresy to lose momentum. As someone who loathes resin, Ive waited a long time for plastics. And I dare say I’m far from alone in that.
Yeah kinda glad I'm not such a huge fan of the Leviathan, it'll be one and done for me.
As for GW to GW comparisons, it looks decent value compared to Abaddon (a model I am actually a fan of, but can't really justify buying at £30 from most discounters. I predict I'll buy him when they announce the next wave of price rises and include Abaddon in there, and I'll convince myself "Actually better value now!!! Better than it will be next month!! Great deal, I'll buy!".
/Edit - how big do you reckon Abaddon is compared to the Leviathan, in terms of volume? I don't own either but a rough guess, maybe at most one third? (much better looking model imo, but still doesn't justify being over two thirds of the price of a Leviathan at only 1/3 the size. That's a bit like paying double. Even knowing well the wonky GWenomics it sticks in my throat a bit). edit2 - Actually Abby is like 80% of the price of the dread, not 65% as just said a minute ago. Makes me slightly queasy : (
I got a hunch that the HH stuff is goinna be higher priced then 40k stuff, it'll be, in theory, justifable but if you get into HH, as always expect to have a expensive army
beast_gts wrote: The (Legion specific) bodies from FW are £58.50, and the arms are £15.50 each so it's half the cost of the FW resin one.
That's nice and all, but it's not like "FW prices are even crazier than GW ones" is exactly a hot take.
Better compare GW things with GW things, no? I'm sure they are grownup enough not to need anyone to try and justify anything they do.
Well redemptor is only tad cheaper. How do they size up comparatively?
This sucks price wise if you want just one with one melee and one gun arm and rest of 4 weapons are worthless(and somehow can't find buyer) for you. Other than that decent price in gw terms.
If this is too expensive just stop gw models as prices won't be better so why stick? This isn't worse than usual and infact was cheaper than iexpected.
BrianDavion wrote: I got a hunch that the HH stuff is goinna be higher priced then 40k stuff, it'll be, in theory, justifable but if you get into HH, as always expect to have a expensive army
or to 3d print it
The Deimos rhino is £28 and the sisters of battle one is £35.
I'm not saying that all HH stuff is gonna be more expensive or that GW is imposing a "HH tax" they're not, and for what we GET the HH kits are pretty well priced, but rather due to larger unit sizes more points, etc HH is going to have a larger cost outlay and I do think we're OCCASIONALLY gonna get cases of sticker shock, at least until we look at the contents of "Box X" and go ......... "thats actually pretty good"
BrianDavion wrote: I'm not saying that all HH stuff is gonna be more expensive or that GW is imposing a "HH tax" they're not, and for what we GET the HH kits are pretty well priced, but rather due to larger unit sizes more points, etc HH is going to have a larger cost outlay and I do think we're OCCASIONALLY gonna get cases of sticker shock, at least until we look at the contents of "Box X" and go ......... "thats actually pretty good"
I don't know if it is fundamentally more expensive to play 2000 pts of 40k vs 3000 pts of 30k. FWIW there are already army set ups and factions in 40k that math out close enough to all resin armies from fw...
I also don't know if 3000 pts will be what the 30k community will play around with locally.
This is the part where the unpaid defenders argue an upgrade sprue costing half the price of an entire kit is better than just including all the options in the box.
I'd be happy with that price if it had all the weapons. With only 2 arms and 4 hands in the kit and the other sprue being probably 25€ standalone, it's a "think thrice" purchase for sure. Looks like Heresy affordability was only a launch day special.
lord_blackfang wrote: I'd be happy with that price if it had all the weapons. With only 2 arms and 4 hands in the kit and the other sprue being probably 25€ standalone, it's a "think thrice" purchase for sure. Looks like Heresy affordability was only a launch day special.
Or, what could be likely, GW prices for Points and army slots, which would make dreads very efficent to build an army and by extention prices them like they price HQ... by basically going straight to lala-land.
Get releasing already. I wants my shiny toys, and I don’t want Heresy to lose momentum. As someone who loathes resin, Ive waited a long time for plastics. And I dare say I’m far from alone in that.
Pretty much lost interest in starting 30K already... I really thought that this release / core product would be launching with almost everything available, or at least weekly / large monthly drops. I commented on this before, but who is going to be the unlucky sod whose legion of choice is the last to receive upgrade packs? It's going to be a long wait for sure! I've been signed up for email alerts on the Mark III and Mark IV restocks with the website, but haven't had a single peep about them appearing. My third party stockists of choice (Element Games and Goblin Games) have never seen these arrive, and show no sign of them being made available in the near future. I wanted to buy a couple of boxes of the mentioned armour marks, mix them in with some of the earlier Mark V resin pieces I've had for years, and start moving towards building an Emperors Children force.
Everyone wants something shiny and new for their game system of choice, but Heresy is/was flagged as a new core line - the drip feeding of info, and even slower releases, is pretty poor IMO.
Get releasing already. I wants my shiny toys, and I don’t want Heresy to lose momentum. As someone who loathes resin, Ive waited a long time for plastics. And I dare say I’m far from alone in that.
Pretty much lost interest in starting 30K already...
I really thought that this release / core product would be launching with almost everything available, or at least weekly / large monthly drops. I commented on this before, but who is going to be the unlucky sod whose legion of choice is the last to receive upgrade packs? It's going to be a long wait for sure! I've been signed up for email alerts on the Mark III and Mark IV restocks with the website, but haven't had a single peep about them appearing. My third party stockists of choice (Element Games and Goblin Games) have never seen these arrive, and show no sign of them being made available in the near future.
Everyone wants something shiny and new for their game system of choice, but Heresy is/was flagged as a new core line - the drip feeding of info, and even slower releases, is pretty poor IMO.
The Mark 3 and 4 kits you have to keep an eye on the webstore for. People are claiming the email notification is buggered? But I've looked and they do appear for a bit, then vanish, then appear again a few days later.
The big online discounters don't seem to be stocking them at all because of the margins. I've a couple of friends who ordered from Battleground Gaming and had theirs arrive a week ago after ordering around the big box preorder.
Hmm yeah that's pretty bad actually. I checked all my regular sellers for mk3 and most don't have them listed as a product they sell. I mostly disagree with the impatience that people are expressing here, but I can somehow understand being disappointed by this one thing in particular (I can still find them but only in a couple of places).
lord_blackfang wrote: I'd be happy with that price if it had all the weapons. With only 2 arms and 4 hands in the kit and the other sprue being probably 25€ standalone, it's a "think thrice" purchase for sure. Looks like Heresy affordability was only a launch day special.
Leviathan should be around £40 from a discounter, which is more palatable to me. Still not cheap, but better all the same.
They still need to get the Predator and Sicaran out on the shelf though. I’ve got an Ironwing to collect, build and paint. I’ve even accidentally found a local Heresy Group in Folkestone, via the Loot Group.
The Mark 3 and 4 kits you have to keep an eye on the webstore for. People are claiming the email notification is buggered? But I've looked and they do appear for a bit, then vanish, then appear again a few days later.
Yeah, the e-mail notifications are buggered as feth on both the main GW and FW sites. I've clicked the button and had items go back in stock that day with no e-mail.
I've taken to checking periodically through the day knowing that it's basically useless to use the notifications.
JWBS wrote: Hmm yeah that's pretty bad actually. I checked all my regular sellers for mk3 and most don't have them listed as a product they sell. I mostly disagree with the impatience that people are expressing here, but I can somehow understand being disappointed by this one thing in particular (I can still find them but only in a couple of places).
Yea mk3/4 are web order so while flgs can order they pay nearly full retail themselves...so it's not exactly profitable business for them.
I'm just waiting for Lucius and the EC upgrades. Its annoying that they do reveals weeks or months before release. I'd rather they just kept reveals until they are available for purchase.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: I'm just waiting for Lucius and the EC upgrades. Its annoying that they do reveals weeks or months before release. I'd rather they just kept reveals until they are available for purchase.
But GW really need to pull their finger out on Horus Heresy.
We’ve already been shown a Contemptor Kit, further heavy weapons, the Sicaran, Predator and Shooty Leviathan kit officially, and unofficially the Landraider Proteus dual kit.
These are of course highly desirable by new and established players both. So….where are they?
We are of course aware GW had issues surrounding their production capacity pre-plague years, and the status of their additions is ambiguous (lots of “I was told that” type stuff). But….seriously.
Get releasing already. I wants my shiny toys, and I don’t want Heresy to lose momentum. As someone who loathes resin, Ive waited a long time for plastics. And I dare say I’m far from alone in that.
Yeah, at this rate I’m looking forward to getting into Heresy in about 10 to 15 years when they start work on moving the other HH factions into plastic.
tneva82 wrote: You are in minority here. Most are annoyed how little gw shows of future releases.
Gw is lose-lose. Preview stuff people complain, don't preview people complain.
And of course leaks make people who don't want previews angry anyway.
Or they could just tell people when they plan to release them. You seem to be ignoring queen anne's second post and I kind of agree with the sentiment. I like seeing the models early, but I do find it kind of annoying that I have no idea when they're coming out and spoils the hype a bit when you see a model and think "oh cool!" then months later you haven't seen it again and don't know when you'll see it again or when you'll be able to get your hands on it.
Get releasing already. I wants my shiny toys, and I don’t want Heresy to lose momentum. As someone who loathes resin, Ive waited a long time for plastics. And I dare say I’m far from alone in that.
Pretty much lost interest in starting 30K already... I really thought that this release / core product would be launching with almost everything available, or at least weekly / large monthly drops. I commented on this before, but who is going to be the unlucky sod whose legion of choice is the last to receive upgrade packs? It's going to be a long wait for sure! I've been signed up for email alerts on the Mark III and Mark IV restocks with the website, but haven't had a single peep about them appearing. My third party stockists of choice (Element Games and Goblin Games) have never seen these arrive, and show no sign of them being made available in the near future.
Everyone wants something shiny and new for their game system of choice, but Heresy is/was flagged as a new core line - the drip feeding of info, and even slower releases, is pretty poor IMO.
The Mark 3 and 4 kits you have to keep an eye on the webstore for. People are claiming the email notification is buggered? But I've looked and they do appear for a bit, then vanish, then appear again a few days later.
The big online discounters don't seem to be stocking them at all because of the margins. I've a couple of friends who ordered from Battleground Gaming and had theirs arrive a week ago after ordering around the big box preorder.
Hard to tell if it's a messed up email notification system or a rare example of GWIT actually working really well...... if there are fare more notification requests than copies of the item being notified about (and this very much seems the case), maybe they're only notifiying that small proportion of the want list thats at the top ? so as to avoid the really crappy 'it's back, but then you go to the site and it's not there' issue
But GW really need to pull their finger out on Horus Heresy.
We’ve already been shown a Contemptor Kit, further heavy weapons, the Sicaran, Predator and Shooty Leviathan kit officially, and unofficially the Landraider Proteus dual kit.
These are of course highly desirable by new and established players both. So….where are they?
We are of course aware GW had issues surrounding their production capacity pre-plague years, and the status of their additions is ambiguous (lots of “I was told that” type stuff). But….seriously.
Get releasing already. I wants my shiny toys, and I don’t want Heresy to lose momentum. As someone who loathes resin, Ive waited a long time for plastics. And I dare say I’m far from alone in that.
Given I still cannot buy Mozzarella at my local walmart and it's been almost 5 weeks, nor have I been able to get one of the returned Mexican Pizza's from Taco Bell because they're sold out nation wide, it might just have something to do with the current state of world affairs and likely isn't something they have any control over.
I want stuff too. I understand the hunger for models, I even feel like I can't work on all my MK6 because I still haven't been able to get the special weapons box just yet. But we're just going to have to be patient and wait. Sadly.
Deimos showing as "No Longer Available Online" on the main GW site?!
What is this, GWIT guys are on holiday or what. Aint no way that kit is discontinued even before the Deimos variants are out!
It’s the Website. It often shows stuff as Gone Forever when it’s just Out of Stock.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also showing In Stock in the U.K.
If I go to the UK store, I get the same message, ie when I go to the product page it says "No Longer Available Online"
Just spoke with my LGS and they confirmed from their Rep that the deimos will be back in August, currently still sold out. I have an outstanding order for two of them!
tneva82 wrote: You are in minority here. Most are annoyed how little gw shows of future releases.
Gw is lose-lose. Preview stuff people complain, don't preview people complain.
And of course leaks make people who don't want previews angry anyway.
Or they could just tell people when they plan to release them. You seem to be ignoring queen anne's second post and I kind of agree with the sentiment. I like seeing the models early, but I do find it kind of annoying that I have no idea when they're coming out and spoils the hype a bit when you see a model and think "oh cool!" then months later you haven't seen it again and don't know when you'll see it again or when you'll be able to get your hands on it.
Indeed. A week or maybe 2 weeks lead time seems reasonable enough to me. Theres no way a large company like gw isn't capable of that.
tneva82 wrote: You are in minority here. Most are annoyed how little gw shows of future releases.
Gw is lose-lose. Preview stuff people complain, don't preview people complain.
And of course leaks make people who don't want previews angry anyway.
Or they could just tell people when they plan to release them. You seem to be ignoring queen anne's second post and I kind of agree with the sentiment. I like seeing the models early, but I do find it kind of annoying that I have no idea when they're coming out and spoils the hype a bit when you see a model and think "oh cool!" then months later you haven't seen it again and don't know when you'll see it again or when you'll be able to get your hands on it.
Indeed. A week or maybe 2 weeks lead time seems reasonable enough to me. Theres no way a large company like gw isn't capable of that.
It's the dribs and drabs nature. Most scale model companies put out a list annually (typically at the start of the year but not always) advising on what they are planning to release that year. Usually dates of close things are reveled down to the month (say first quarter) then anything else which quarter it will be. They then usually update through the year with design updates as new models get closer (CAD images typically 6 months or so out, despite likely being complete for some time). This gives a good feel over spending over the year for the customer as well as meaning you can get hyped for a release at the right time. I understand that the same may not entirely work for GW but something more stable would at least let every one know where we stand (see a model in an rumor engine, its a year out, tease is 6 months, preview show is this quarter and so on).
I feel that these types of complaints are only common in this community (this site in particular) though I could be wrong. Thinking about it a bit more, I suppose GPU buyers or whatever have people that feel this way. I just don't, never really have from what I can remember and I'd guess my opinion on this is of the majority.
Any firm confirmation on the UK price for the Leviathan yet? I *could* extrapolate from the EU price but GW exchange rates are so random it seems a bit pointless.
ListenToMeWarriors wrote: Any firm confirmation on the UK price for the Leviathan yet? I *could* extrapolate from the EU price but GW exchange rates are so random it seems a bit pointless.
Go to gw site, very bottom games workshop submenu, retailerr(leads to , https://trade.games-workshop.com/), view all resources, from drop down guidance docs, order forms. Here you can find price lists. Sunday preorders next week announced, Monday price available.
And prices aren't random as such. If you find matching price it's same.
Units: UM Nemesis Destroyer Squad - Themed Destroyers DG Mortus Poisoner Squad - Themed Destroyers WE Red Hand Destroyer Assault Squad - Themed Destroyers WS Dark Sons of Death Squad - Themed Destroyers IW Dominator Cohort - Themed Terminators (Cataphractii) IF Huscarl Squad - Themed Terminators (Cataphractii) NL Atramentar Squad - Themed Terminators (Tartaros / Contekar?) DA Inner Circle Knights Cenobium (Order of the Broken Claws) - New variant EC Sun Killer Squad - Heavy Weapon / Support Squad RG Deliverer Squad - Themed Terminators (Cataphractii) WB Procurators - Themed Assault Squad SW Jorlund Hunter Pack - Themed Despolier Squad (Hand Flamers) SoH Chieftain Squad - Command Squad / Retinue
And are waiting for Blood Angels, Iron Hands, Thousand Sons, Salamanders & Alpha Legion -
Andy Hoare wrote:We’re getting towards the end of the Exemplary Battles series now, with only a handful of Legions remaining to cover – but I hope you’d agree the format has worked out well, so there’s no reason not to go back and do more articles in the future.
only 375 points for a command squad equivalent with power weapons. We get to re-roll 1s against Independent Characters and Primarchs, and cost 100 points more than the jump-pack equipped dawnbreaker cohort/locutarus storm squadron, or 140ish points more than a similarly equipped ACTUAL command squad. Wtf?
Oh, right, banestrike bolters!
I'm getting the feeling that GW is overpriced power weapons on Sons of Horus because they want Sons of Horus to be good at killing unarmored things (so comparatively cheap chainswords, chainaxes but abhorrently expensive power weapons and better on our unique weapons).
Not a useful niche to be in the Horus Heresy.
