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On a side note, maybe I should mention my "Un-friender" list.
Take the triple Baneblade formation, including 212 Arethusia and a Stormsword, and Celestine. Flavour with Veterans or Platoons.
Make 212 your Warlord.
Deploy so that every Super Heavy is within 12" of Celestine and on your first turn trigger her ability that gives all LoW within 12" of her IWND for the entire game.
Use the Stormsword to deal with enemy infantry blobs and 212/whatever else you brought to pop transports/act as multi purpose threat removers and bring the infantry for mopup/anti assault duties.

Whilst not the strongest list ever it is guaranteed to make the WAAC's and TFG's in your FLGS cry cheese.

Does that trick also work with Warhound Titans that can shoot over / get cover saves from the HWT-filled Stormsword & BB? How about Knight households with the +1 Sv++? Yes? Ok then!

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Does that trick also work with Warhound Titans that can shoot over / get cover saves from the HWT-filled Stormsword & BB? How about Knight households with the +1 Sv++? Yes? Ok then!

.....Yes?

 master of ordinance wrote:
On a side note, maybe I should mention my "Un-friender" list.
Take the triple Baneblade formation, including 212 Arethusia and a Stormsword, and Celestine. Flavour with Veterans or Platoons.
Make 212 your Warlord.
Deploy so that every Super Heavy is within 12" of Celestine and on your first turn trigger her ability that gives all LoW within 12" of her IWND for the entire game.
Use the Stormsword to deal with enemy infantry blobs and 212/whatever else you brought to pop transports/act as multi purpose threat removers and bring the infantry for mopup/anti assault duties.

Whilst not the strongest list ever it is guaranteed to make the WAAC's and TFG's in your FLGS cry cheese.

Sadly, the TFG's will be right in this case because you're not following RAW.

1. Arathusa isn't a character, it just gets a warlord trait when its your warlord. The only way for this to happen is if you don't have any other characters in your army.
1.a The baneblade sisters require a techpriest for the formation
2. Formations don't allow for named characters except when they explicitly do, such as potentially with Cawl in this case.
3. Forgeworld + formations has a really big question mark over it right now

Nice idea :<


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Otto von Bludd wrote:
Had a "fun" game vs SW last night, Thunderwolves+Celestine, multiple Wulfen units, Relic Sicaran, drop pod meltas. Maelstrom mission one, Dawn of War deployment. My list was decent for a Guard list, including multiple Wyverns and a Punisher Vulture, multiple mounted melta-Veteran units and some backfield Forward Sentry lascannon vets in ruins. All his melee units made it into combat top of t2 with minimal casualties. Only my aircraft were left alive by turn 3.

I sure hope the future holds something good for Guard because games like that make me question what the point of playing them anymore is.

Been there far too often.

It's not so much imba (thought there is that), it's you're playing in two completely different problem spaces, with TWC being a solution in both, wheras the guard munitions delivery service only works in the one.

Tarpits aside, and those are fairly easy to bypass nowadays, IG don't do melee, and don't have the gubbinz and mobility of Tau to counteract that. The exception is the flyers which in nearly every situation, can't punch out their cost against dedicated CC units who of course have the advantage of 'not ever getting shot at unless they want to be'.

 malamis wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
On a side note, maybe I should mention my "Un-friender" list.
Take the triple Baneblade formation, including 212 Arethusia and a Stormsword, and Celestine. Flavour with Veterans or Platoons.
Make 212 your Warlord.
Deploy so that every Super Heavy is within 12" of Celestine and on your first turn trigger her ability that gives all LoW within 12" of her IWND for the entire game.
Use the Stormsword to deal with enemy infantry blobs and 212/whatever else you brought to pop transports/act as multi purpose threat removers and bring the infantry for mopup/anti assault duties.

Whilst not the strongest list ever it is guaranteed to make the WAAC's and TFG's in your FLGS cry cheese.

Sadly, the TFG's will be right in this case because you're not following RAW.

1. Arathusa isn't a character, it just gets a warlord trait when its your warlord. The only way for this to happen is if you don't have any other characters in your army.
1.a The baneblade sisters require a techpriest for the formation
2. Formations don't allow for named characters except when they explicitly do, such as potentially with Cawl in this case.
3. Forgeworld + formations has a really big question mark over it right now

Nice idea :<

Well actually from how I read it 212 IS a character. The entry is actually for Maximillian Wiessman whom is the commander of 212, as Pask is for a Leman Russ.
Wiessman/212 also has the special rule "Warlord".

Either way, it is a pity that he cannot join the formation, but still, three IWND Baneblade chassis with the Techpriest repairing them would be a great meta shaker, although its lasting effects would see it quickly countered.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Otto von Bludd wrote:
Had a "fun" game vs SW last night, Thunderwolves+Celestine, multiple Wulfen units, Relic Sicaran, drop pod meltas. Maelstrom mission one, Dawn of War deployment. My list was decent for a Guard list, including multiple Wyverns and a Punisher Vulture, multiple mounted melta-Veteran units and some backfield Forward Sentry lascannon vets in ruins. All his melee units made it into combat top of t2 with minimal casualties. Only my aircraft were left alive by turn 3.

I sure hope the future holds something good for Guard because games like that make me question what the point of playing them anymore is.

Been there far too often.

It's not so much imba (thought there is that), it's you're playing in two completely different problem spaces, with TWC being a solution in both, wheras the guard munitions delivery service only works in the one.

Tarpits aside, and those are fairly easy to bypass nowadays, IG don't do melee, and don't have the gubbinz and mobility of Tau to counteract that. The exception is the flyers which in nearly every situation, can't punch out their cost against dedicated CC units who of course have the advantage of 'not ever getting shot at unless they want to be'.

 master of ordinance wrote:

Well actually from how I read it 212 IS a character. The entry is actually for Maximillian Wiessman whom is the commander of 212, as Pask is for a Leman Russ.
Wiessman/212 also has the special rule "Warlord".

IA:1 2e pg 272 wrote:
Unit Type
Super-heavy vehicle
(Tank,Unique)

A character he is not~

Its also an Apocalypse unit... and there's no 'Lord of War' update in FW's 'These things are Lords of War' sheet which it appears forgeworld no longer has on their website (?).

Just be careful; there's nothing quite as unpleasant in the hobby as gearing up to school one of the tiresome types, only to have it backfire on you ;\

So the "Warlord" rule?

I don't want to get anyone too excited buuuuuut...

The heads are in line with the current FW respirator heads, but the torsos are not the standard GW Cadians or the FW Cadians. There's not really a way to do that pose either from the plastics/resins without extensive work.

So they might be doing another "in plain sight" thing and I'm trying not to get too hyped personally.

They look a lot like the left open arm in the Cadian Shock Troop box combined with the Missile Launcher right arm from the HWTs. That could just be the conversion mind working overtime though...

They look exactly like the Cadian torsos and as mentioned above look like the arms currently in the range. Otherwise great picture.

 General Annoyance wrote:
They look a lot like the left open arm in the Cadian Shock Troop box combined with the Missile Launcher right arm from the HWTs. That could just be the conversion mind working overtime though...

The pauldrons and torsos are the thing you should be looking at.

There's a very noticeable "bulk" difference between the FW respirator helmets and the Cadians proper. It's actually why when building mine I've trimmed off the back of the neck on the respirator helmets/heads to make the head sit a bit more flush and look as though it's an environmentally sealed clothing part.

For reference, here's the FW promo shots.

Pay close attention to the pauldrons.

I see what you mean by the Respirator Helmets, but I don't see the distinction between the torsos and the pauldrons in both photos.

That arm pose in the first photo is oddly familiar. I'm going to go poke around and see if I can track it. Taking your word that these could be new parts for now though.

Where is that picture from?

 Otto von Bludd wrote:
Where is that picture from?

Regimental Standard.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 General Annoyance wrote:
I see what you mean by the Respirator Helmets, but I don't see the distinction between the torsos and the pauldrons in both photos.

That arm pose in the first photo is oddly familiar. I'm going to go poke around and see if I can track it. Taking your word that these could be new parts for now though.

Pauldrons on the FW pieces are much closer to the arm, the plastics have them being kind of "bulked" out.

You can actually spot the difference in the photo I gave, as the one on the left is all resin arms while the one on the right uses the plastic bits.

I haven't handled FW stuff before, but I see what you mean now. Thanks for clarifying.

If any of you were planning on starting or expanding a DKoK army, you might want to do it now. Looks like they are going the way of the dodo. I beat all the rumor sites, your welcome. Once kits like this start getting discontinued, its only a matter of time.



Pray to the emperor GW has something massive planned for IG this year. We've lost almost all of our heroes, even more now that Kell/Creed are gone. Cadia is gone. DKoK on the way out. Hasting remarks certainly didn't instill any confidence in the future of the IG.



If we use the end of Gathering Storms books as a guide the most likely scenarios in the near future take place on Armageddon & Attila. Perhaps we will see Salvar Chem Dogs? Plastic Steel Legion? An Attilian horseback regiment?

One can dream...

Oh man, I was worried about Krieg going away, especially since they haven't restocked on Grenadiers for a while.

All thanks to the HH, no doubts.

Commissar Benny wrote:
If any of you were planning on starting or expanding a DKoK army, you might want to do it now. Looks like they are going the way of the dodo. I beat all the rumor sites, your welcome. Once kits like this start getting discontinued, its only a matter of time.

Yeah...that's what was said about the Thunderhawk.

Pray to the emperor GW has something massive planned for IG this year. We've lost almost all of our heroes, even more now that Kell/Creed are gone. Cadia is gone. DKoK on the way out. Hasting remarks certainly didn't instill any confidence in the future of the IG.

DKoK were never really one of the "main" Regiments.

If we use the end of Gathering Storms books as a guide the most likely scenarios in the near future take place on Armageddon & Attila. Perhaps we will see Salvar Chem Dogs? Plastic Steel Legion? An Attilian horseback regiment?

One can dream...

Attila's a useless backwater. It's probably going to get destroyed.
Armageddon's "Steel Legions" never really go off-planet, so nope.

I really wish people would stop trying to play it like Cadia being destroyed means that Cadians are gone. It just shows how little knowledge of the Astra Militarum they actually exposed themselves to.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Bobthehero wrote:
Oh man, I was worried about Krieg going away, especially since they haven't restocked on Grenadiers for a while.

All thanks to the HH, no doubts.

More likely it's them wanting to redo the molds, if anything.

They've been marking stuff as "SOLD OUT" and leaving it up when they're revamping molds in the past.

Umm, cadia being destroyed means that there is now a finite (and thanks to GW's terribad fluff, rapidly depleting) number of Cadians, so there might as well not be.
Of course, that is the least worrying thing about the whole affair.

As to the Death Korps, I do not want to sound like a downer, but it would not surprise me if they where permanently being discontinued. Sold out, Not Available and no indication that they will ever be redone. Yeah, the prospect is not looking good.

The destruction of Cadia was a given if GW was going to advance the story line. Cadia' main export was troops, so their are plenty sill around.

I'm really not surprised the DKoK are being discontinued. Beautiful models, but far too delicate for play.

Far to pricey as well.

What if the DKoK are being remade into plastic?

I'll be super gutted if they are being discontinued. They're too awesome to discontinue. :(

There are already two set of plastic guard. I find it highly unlikely GW would risk doing a third. Maybe when they retire one of those lines. I wouldn't put any money on the Catachans going anywhere soon. The Cadians have at least another decade before the revamp them.

 master of ordinance wrote:
Umm, cadia being destroyed means that there is now a finite (and thanks to GW's terribad fluff, rapidly depleting) number of Cadians, so there might as well not be.
Of course, that is the least worrying thing about the whole affair.

Cadia being destroyed doesn't mean jack.

The big thing about Cadia was always the culture/training. Since mustering out regiments can found colonies/settlements, do you really expect them to be a bunch of laze-abouts after?

As to the Death Korps, I do not want to sound like a downer, but it would not surprise me if they where permanently being discontinued. Sold out, Not Available and no indication that they will ever be redone. Yeah, the prospect is not looking good.

When do you ever do anything beyond "sound like a downer"?

It looks like some of you were smart & heeded my advice. 2 more DKoK kits gone overnight. Looks like Elysians are on their way out also. If you plan on buying them, do it now. Once stuff like this happens, they are on their way out. Last warning. Fortunately the rumor sites STILL haven't picked up on it so you have a chance.



Hopefully this means FW plans on adding new 40k models. I highly doubt it though. Its been so long since a 40k model has been released through Forgeworld the new releases tab & preorders don't even exist anymore...

Go ahead and call me a conspiracy theorist, but the implications are troubling. Since they are moving solely to supporting 30K/Horus Heresy & the direction the lore is heading, do not be surprised if 40K quickly becomes a Primarch circle jerk & marines fighting marines every month.

Commissar Benny wrote:

It looks like some of you were smart & heeded my advice. 2 more DKoK kits gone overnight. Looks like Elysians are on their way out also. If you plan on buying them, do it now. Once stuff like this happens, they are on their way out. Last warning. Fortunately the rumor sites STILL haven't picked up on it so you have a chance.

Counterpoint: they're advertising Shadow War kill teams of these factions and have likely just run out of stock after a spike in demand. Sold Out doesn't mean Gone Forever, just that stock on hand is gone. As early as a week ago the Valkyrie Sky Talon was listed as Sold Out, but now it's back.

 Formerly Wu wrote:

Commissar Benny wrote:

It looks like some of you were smart & heeded my advice. 2 more DKoK kits gone overnight. Looks like Elysians are on their way out also. If you plan on buying them, do it now. Once stuff like this happens, they are on their way out. Last warning. Fortunately the rumor sites STILL haven't picked up on it so you have a chance.

Counterpoint: they're advertising Shadow War kill teams of these factions and have likely just run out of stock after a spike in demand. Sold Out doesn't mean Gone Forever, just that stock on hand is gone. As early as a week ago the Valkyrie Sky Talon was listed as Sold Out, but now it's back.

Is it possible they might have found an extra supply of Valkyrie Sky Talon that they weren't aware of? In the past, whenever an item has stated "No longer available" that is it, its gone. Otherwise they usually state its temporarily unavailable & give you an option to have them email you when it gets back in stock. I've seen numerous items get discontinued without warning & not giving customers a last chance to buy.

Has anyone emailed FW to ask about the DKOK? A few years back they started going out of stock so I just emailed and asked and they said they would be back after a while, the moulds were just getting repairs.

FW are usually pretty straight with their replies when you ask them about stuff going out of stock, they also told me when the specialist games stuff went out of stock that it wasn't coming back.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Has anyone emailed FW to ask about the DKOK? A few years back they started going out of stock so I just emailed and asked and they said they would be back after a while, the moulds were just getting repairs.

FW are usually pretty straight with their replies when you ask them about stuff going out of stock, they also told me when the specialist games stuff went out of stock that it wasn't coming back.

I already sent them an email yes. Usually takes them a few days to reply & with the holiday weekend I suspect we'll hear back next week.

 Kanluwen wrote:

As to the Death Korps, I do not want to sound like a downer, but it would not surprise me if they where permanently being discontinued. Sold out, Not Available and no indication that they will ever be redone. Yeah, the prospect is not looking good.

When do you ever do anything beyond "sound like a downer"?

Well, given the gak state of the Guard and that FW seem to be discontinuing the only decent Guard figures out there (either that or a millionaire has decided to play IG) there is little to be up about. SoB are getting nothing (as usual), IG are just getting screwed and shafted..... What is there to be happy about?