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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Spoiler:
Lord Kragan wrote:
Interestingly. People were right, there's smaller SH detachments with no benefits. Hell, there's a detachment that DEDUCES COMMAND POINTS!



Figured as much - didn't expect the fortifications one though. That's handy. The auxiliary is a surprise (and well thought out).

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/05/26 19:05:16


 
   
Made in gb
Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord




 ClockworkZion wrote:
Lord Kragan wrote:
Interestingly. People were right, there's smaller SH detachments with no benefits. Hell, there's a detachment that DEDUCES COMMAND POINTS!


That Auxillary detachment is kind of nuts. I mean I get it if you want to add just one extra FOC option to your army for some reason, but at the same time it's rather punishing.


Looks like a snap from a printed book, are preview copies doing the rounds?
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut




There probably are some rulebooks already in some stores.. It happend with AoS and every signle other edition.
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut






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Daedalus81 wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
 Brotherjanus wrote:
Say you have 3 lascannon hits and 4 bolter hits that have wounded and saves have been failed. You would allocate the successful wounding hits depending on what's best as the defender. For example, a unit of 5 Ork Nobs with 3 wounds each. You would resolve the bolter wounds first dealing 3 damage to a healthy Nob killing it then one damage to a second healthy Nob. You then assign one lascannon hit against the now damaged Nob. Roll for damage. If you roll a 1 the lucky Nob lives to soak the next hit, otherwise he alone is removed (2-6 damage doesn't matter as 2 will kill him). It then goes from 2 total dead Nobs to 5 dead Nobs depending on die rolls. This is one example and it will speed up once everyone plays it a few times.


For defender wouldnt best be bolter, bolter, lascannon, bolter, lc, lc?


If the rules allow it and you wanted to be a cheesy nob then you take bolter hits until you have just one wound left then take a lascannon hit.

I'm sure they'll have stuff governing different weapons and fast rolling in the side bar that we can't see yet.


If it's like AoS, the attacker decides the order in which the attacks are resolved, and they have to be completely resolved before moving on to the next attack. You would have to resolve all bolter shots before moving on to the lascannon, unless the attacker was foolish enough to attack with the lascannon first in this situation.

2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress
2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Dudeface wrote:

Looks like a snap from a printed book, are preview copies doing the rounds?


Some store got their demo copy early i'm sure.
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Imperial Knight

Justyn wrote:
That is the 'sure you can take one guy from that other army for his special rules, but its going to cost you' Detachment.
Very much this and I'm okay with that.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum

 
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





 Mymearan wrote:
Daedalus81 wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
 Brotherjanus wrote:
Say you have 3 lascannon hits and 4 bolter hits that have wounded and saves have been failed. You would allocate the successful wounding hits depending on what's best as the defender. For example, a unit of 5 Ork Nobs with 3 wounds each. You would resolve the bolter wounds first dealing 3 damage to a healthy Nob killing it then one damage to a second healthy Nob. You then assign one lascannon hit against the now damaged Nob. Roll for damage. If you roll a 1 the lucky Nob lives to soak the next hit, otherwise he alone is removed (2-6 damage doesn't matter as 2 will kill him). It then goes from 2 total dead Nobs to 5 dead Nobs depending on die rolls. This is one example and it will speed up once everyone plays it a few times.


For defender wouldnt best be bolter, bolter, lascannon, bolter, lc, lc?


If the rules allow it and you wanted to be a cheesy nob then you take bolter hits until you have just one wound left then take a lascannon hit.

I'm sure they'll have stuff governing different weapons and fast rolling in the side bar that we can't see yet.


You couldn't do that because I, the attacker, would roll all the bolter shots first, tell you to resolve them, then move on to las cannons.


Well if you want to optimize lascannons unless nob survives at which point you switch to bolters to finish. Prevents bolters leaving wounded which lascannon overkills.

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





Harlequins getting hq or taking them donks your cp? All seem to require hq...

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

Inquisition seems to be changing since it was 1 HQ and a set number of Elites per Inquisitor and that fits none of those detachments.
   
Made in de
Aspirant Tech-Adept






 ClockworkZion wrote:
Youn wrote:
This edition will seriously weaken Celestine from the tank she used to be. I guess you could put her closest from unit in a hope that your opponent fires at her vs the unit she is next to.

I never saw her as tanky. Mostly because of ID and her lack of EW.


Uhm... she has/had EW.
   
Made in es
Brutal Black Orc




Barcelona, Spain

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Inquisition seems to be changing since it was 1 HQ and a set number of Elites per Inquisitor and that fits none of those detachments.


Actually it hasn't changed. If memory serces right it was 3 elites and one additional HQ per mandatory HQ. That's a Vanguard detachment (3 elites-minimum, though- and 1-2 HQs)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Dryaktylus wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
Youn wrote:
This edition will seriously weaken Celestine from the tank she used to be. I guess you could put her closest from unit in a hope that your opponent fires at her vs the unit she is next to.

I never saw her as tanky. Mostly because of ID and her lack of EW.


Uhm... she has/had EW.


That was just after gathering storm, though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/26 19:17:29


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Connecticut

Wow, a lot of those detachments don't even require Troops. That's incredible.

Blood Angels, Custodes, Tzeentch, Alpha Legion, Astra Militarum, Deathwatch, Thousand Sons, Imperial Knights, Tau, Genestealer Cult.

I have a problem.

Being contrary for the sake of being contrary doesn't make you unique, it makes you annoying.

 Purifier wrote:
Using your rules isn't being a dick.
 
   
Made in gb
Member of a Lodge? I Can't Say





I like the Aux detachnebt. Probably means I could bring a guard platoon (assuming they haven't just gotten rid of those). Hell, I could bring a random GK Grand Master. Since they refer to it as a super-heavy detachment I'm assuming Chapter Masters as LoW are gone.
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

 Dryaktylus wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
Youn wrote:
This edition will seriously weaken Celestine from the tank she used to be. I guess you could put her closest from unit in a hope that your opponent fires at her vs the unit she is next to.

I never saw her as tanky. Mostly because of ID and her lack of EW.


Uhm... she has/had EW.

Not in her original form. She went down like she had a glass jaw if she got hit with S6+. I haven't looked at the Gathering Storm rules in a while, but gather that's where she gained it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Cephalobeard wrote:
Wow, a lot of those detachments don't even require Troops. That's incredible.

Well the Deathwing crying should be over since it has a detachment now.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Lord Kragan wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
Inquisition seems to be changing since it was 1 HQ and a set number of Elites per Inquisitor and that fits none of those detachments.


Actually it hasn't changed. If memory serces right it was 3 elites and one additional HQ per mandatory HQ. That's a Vanguard detachment (3 elites-minimum, though- and 1-2 HQs)

I missed that. Probably scrolled too fast.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/05/26 19:20:25


 
   
Made in us
Potent Possessed Daemonvessel





I like the aux detachment idea it allows you to include a single ally unit, or an additional unit in a single slot. At a cost, so if you want say a spearhead detachment but want 7 heavy support units you only get 2 command points. Or more likely a battalion detachment with 4 heavies etc. I kind of whish additional detachments had some built in penalty. The way I see it is if I have cheap HQs there is no reason not to take say a vanguard detachment if I want 3 elite choices in my army. I could easily get 4 CP. It also seems like MSU benefits from the CP system as long as the units are cheap.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I find it strange that the Patrol Detachment gets you absolutely nothing, but the Vanguard, Spearhead, and Outrider all give you +1 Command Point. Outside of incredibly small games where you can't afford 3+ of any one choice, I can't see a reason to ever take it.
   
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Wait, so one LOW is no penalty, but one anything else loses you a CP? That's... dumb.
   
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Potent Possessed Daemonvessel





skarsol wrote:
Wait, so one LOW is no penalty, but one anything else loses you a CP? That's... dumb.


Everything else is part of the other FOCs. I had the same though as you initially, but then thought better of it.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Assuming Rubrics are troops for Thousand Sons it seems like the best balance to get CP is one battalion and one patrol since there is no (smart) way for me to fill out a brigade.

That would require 4 troops and 3 HQ and give me enough slots for whatever I want. If a LoW pops up I can add it as a single detachment. So, 4 CP tops assuming nothing else to grant them in matched play.
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

Deadawake1347 wrote:
I find it strange that the Patrol Detachment gets you absolutely nothing, but the Vanguard, Spearhead, and Outrider all give you +1 Command Point. Outside of incredibly small games where you can't afford 3+ of any one choice, I can't see a reason to ever take it.

It's basically for super small games. Like teaching people to play or using just the stuff in the starter.
   
Made in us
Potent Possessed Daemonvessel





Deadawake1347 wrote:
I find it strange that the Patrol Detachment gets you absolutely nothing, but the Vanguard, Spearhead, and Outrider all give you +1 Command Point. Outside of incredibly small games where you can't afford 3+ of any one choice, I can't see a reason to ever take it.


It is the old Allied detachment, 1 HQ 1 troop, so it is the cheapest access (without losing CP) to units from other factions. The other FOCs require a much larger investment. Now if you want 3 of a slot then yes no reason not to take one of these.
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

skarsol wrote:
Wait, so one LOW is no penalty, but one anything else loses you a CP? That's... dumb.

Because we want to force people to take 3+ LoW in their lists all the time?

One of anything else makes sense because it's on top of whatever else you're already running. So if I want 4 Heavies in a list with 0-3, that's -1CP.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/26 19:29:51


 
   
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*Current meatspace coordinates redacted*

Well, that supreme command detachment answers our Orky questions about how to get as many HQs into a list as we'd like. Nice. Now with added command points!

He knows that I know and you know that he actually doesn't know the rules at all. 
   
Made in us
Potent Possessed Daemonvessel





Daedalus81 wrote:
Assuming Rubrics are troops for Thousand Sons it seems like the best balance to get CP is one battalion and one patrol since there is no (smart) way for me to fill out a brigade.

That would require 4 troops and 3 HQ and give me enough slots for whatever I want. If a LoW pops up I can add it as a single detachment. So, 4 CP tops assuming nothing else to grant them in matched play.


I thought some characters gave you more CP.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Also, have they specified what "Faction" means? Is it any keyword on the datasheet? So you could have Nurgle Daemons in a detachment with Nurgle CSM? Or not?

Edit: NM, I see "Faction Keywords" have their own section.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/26 19:32:42


 
   
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I believe you get 3 CP by default.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Breng77 wrote:
It also seems like MSU benefits from the CP system as long as the units are cheap.


I pondered filling out a brigade with cheap cultists, but ultimately i'd have a ton of useless units. Armies that can fill those slots and still be useful are not the elite ones. And if they aren't elite then they'll have lots of small and vulnerable units.

   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

skarsol wrote:
Wait, so one LOW is no penalty, but one anything else loses you a CP? That's... dumb.

It might have been if you could take a Lord of War in anything other than a Super Heavy or Super Heavy Auxiliary detachment.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
 
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