Man beheads woman in OK

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**timetowaste85**

Ouze wrote:
Yeah, usually cops are pretty good about pretending they don't want to shoot someone who at the time posed no threat of death or injury to someone.

It's OK, buddy. More fish in the sea, I'm sure you'll get to shoot some fleeing suspect eventually!

Also, not to be a pendantic jerk, but it's Trooper Randolph, not Trooper Nolen - Nolen is the beheading suspect.

I don't really get that feeling from the text-it sounds like hindsight in the officer's comment: they're trained not to shoot fleeing victims (for good reason), but the officer would have broken training if he/she had known the misery this man would cause in the future. That's how I see it anyway. There are plenty of bloodthirsty cops who don't deserve to be cops. I don't think this counts as an example of one. I think this is a case of hindsight wanting to prevent misery.

**Ouze**

Well, that;s your reading, and that's fair. My reading, from her words:

"He kept looking over his shoulder because he knew I wanted to shoot him, but obviously I couldn't shoot him in the back," Randolph told CNN. "If there had been any way to know the things he is alleged to have done a few days ago I would have killed him when I had a chance."

is that she wanted to shoot him because he threw drugs out of the window and then fled. Later on came a situation that kind of retroactively made her initial desire to summarily execute him not-so-bad, that the legal system was all the held her back from doing what she, in her heart, knew to be justice: shooting a fleeing petty drug bust perp.

She should have gone for it anyway: as I understand it if you shoot a guy in the back in Oklahoma, the chief of police can ask the medical examiner to change the autopsy report to make you look better.

**daedalus**

Nothing like wanting to render summary execution on a drug charge.

**Bromsy**

I am super not getting the vibe that she was some bloodthirsty monster who wanted to shoot him because of some drugs. She just would have shot him had she known that he was going to saw some innocent ladies head off a few years later. Which is justifiable, to me.

Sound is busted on this work computer but I could read the transcript at least.

http://www.koco.com/news/betsy-randolph-remembers-runin-with-warehouse-suspect/28277510

**Ouze**

I'll watch the video when I get home - the transcript is problematic. Maybe I'm just reading too much into 2 sentences, or maybe that other Oklahoma shooting is coloring my view.

**dogma**

Ouze wrote:
I'll watch the video when I get home - the transcript is problematic. Maybe I'm just reading too much into 2 sentences, or maybe that other Oklahoma shooting is coloring my view.

Her comments are problematic, but they are pretty clearly motivated by his recent actions. I'm guessing there was a push question that was not included in the final edit.

**Ouze**

Yeah, I watched the video, I think you two are right.

**the shrouded lord**

if you were psychic, and a few days ago, you, knowing what this guy would do, met him while out hunting (or some other situation where you had a gun) would you not be morally obligated to shoot him?

**timetowaste85**

I believe so, yes.

**Co'tor Shas**

If that was your only choice, yes. If you could subdue him without any harm coming to anybody, than that would be the preferred action.

**Jihadin**

daedalus wrote:
Nothing like wanting to render summary execution on a drug charge.

Think China does that

**Peter Wiggin**

Frankly, I'm amazed at the self control of the guy that shot the beheader. Almost as amazed as I am that so many people are clamoring to rationalize what this monster did...

From all apparent data the dude was the black muslim equivalent of a white neo-nazi skinhead. Hate makes people into animals, its sick.

**Frazzled**

the shrouded lord wrote:
if you were psychic, and a few days ago, you, knowing what this guy would do, met him while out hunting (or some other situation where you had a gun) would you not be morally obligated to shoot him?

if I were out hunting and this guy appeared with a big knife he'd be gone anyway.

**the shrouded lord**

Frazzled wrote:
the shrouded lord wrote:
if you were psychic, and a few days ago, you, knowing what this guy would do, met him while out hunting (or some other situation where you had a gun) would you not be morally obligated to shoot him?

if I were out hunting and this guy appeared with a big knife he'd be gone anyway.

wearing a ghilli suit?

**Frazzled**

the shrouded lord wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
the shrouded lord wrote:
if you were psychic, and a few days ago, you, knowing what this guy would do, met him while out hunting (or some other situation where you had a gun) would you not be morally obligated to shoot him?

if I were out hunting and this guy appeared with a big knife he'd be gone anyway.

wearing a ghilli suit?

Especially if he were wearing a ghilli suit.

Now if he were wearing a Tye Dye shirt I'd say share the wealth dude, but thats a different story.

**Easy E**

the shrouded lord wrote:
if you were psychic, and a few days ago, you, knowing what this guy would do, met him while out hunting (or some other situation where you had a gun) would you not be morally obligated to shoot him?

Trick question! There is no such thing as a psychic!

**Jihadin**

Easy E wrote:
the shrouded lord wrote:
if you were psychic, and a few days ago, you, knowing what this guy would do, met him while out hunting (or some other situation where you had a gun) would you not be morally obligated to shoot him?

Trick question! There is no such thing as a psychic!

You say that but some people believe in that and get charge out the freaking nose for a reading...

**Ouze**

Peter Wiggin wrote:
Frankly, I'm amazed at the self control of the guy that shot the beheader. Almost as amazed as I am that so many people are clamoring to rationalize what this monster did...

Can you give a single example of a person in this thread that rationalized what the suspect did?

**Jihadin**

Suspect pleaded not guilty

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ouze wrote:
Peter Wiggin wrote:
Frankly, I'm amazed at the self control of the guy that shot the beheader. Almost as amazed as I am that so many people are clamoring to rationalize what this monster did...

Can you give a single example of a person in this thread that rationalized what the suspect did?

Edit

Going to say we hedging on it not being a Jihadist thing being it

**Co'tor Shas**

Did they ever get a reason for the attack?

**Ouze**

Jihadin wrote:
say we hedging on it not being a Jihadist thing being it

That is not what rationalize means.

**whembly**

Co'tor Shas wrote:
Did they ever get a reason for the attack?

He was going to be fired.

He had issues... thus, "snapped".

**Jihadin**

whembly wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
Did they ever get a reason for the attack?

He was going to be fired.

He had issues... thus, "snapped".

he got suspended for two days I believe.

Ouze...look who I was trying to clarify for.

Spoiler:

**Ouze**

Oh, I see. That was unclear. I understand what you meant now.

**d-usa**

For equality's sake:

Another man in Oklahoma nearly beheads someone with a machete, has a history of religious arguments.

STILLWATER — Covered in blood and still holding a large knife that police say he’d used just minutes before to nearly decapitate his brother’s roommate, Isaiah Zoar Marin dialed 911.

“I murdered someone,” Marin told the operator.

Moments later Wednesday afternoon, police say they found Marin running west near a car dealership on State Highway 51, still carrying the weapon. When they asked Marin where he was coming from, authorities say Marin directed them to a nearby apartment where they found the body of Jacob Andrew Crockett, 19, of Stillwater.

On Thursday, Marin, 21, was charged with first-degree murder. Police say Marin confessed to killing Crockett. The men had been classmates at Stillwater High School, the school’s principal said.

Crockett is the son of an Oklahoma Highway Patrol trooper, police said.

During a video arraignment Thursday afternoon in front of Payne County Special Judge Robert Hert, Marin’s voice sputtered and he appeared to cry as he answered the judge’s questions. Marin was ordered held without bail. He is due back in court Dec. 1.

At a news conference earlier in the day, Stillwater police Capt. Randy Dickerson said Marin admitted to authorities “that he had fantasized recently about committing multiple homicides” and that the victim was “one of his intended targets.”

“The conversation was that he had planned to to do it all at one time,” the police captain said.

The victim’s brother, Jesse Crockett, told police Marin is a “religious zealot” and “heavy drug user,” according to a court affidavit.

Police confirmed there was evidence at the scene that Marin might have been involved in the use of some illegal drugs.

The defendant’s brother, Samuel Marin, said “in the past Jacob and Isaiah had disagreements because Jacob and Jesse were practicing witchcraft and Isaiah had strong Christian beliefs,” a Stillwater police officer reported in the affidavit.

Dickerson was quick to point out at the news conference that the case was not related to recent cases of beheadings by Islamic extremists — including the attack in September by an Islamic convert at Vaughan Foods in Moore.

The police officer who wrote the affidavit, Jeff Watts, reported that the victim had what appeared to be multiple deep slash and stab wounds and the “head was mostly severed from his body.”

Samuel Marin said he and Isaiah Marin were playing a card game in the apartment when “Isaiah picked up a large black sword and removed it from a sheath … and began swinging the sword around,” the officer reported.

Court records show that Samuel Marin and Jesse and Jacob Crockett were roommates in an apartment at 416 S Oakdale, Apt. 6.

Samuel Marin said he asked his brother to be careful and Isaiah replied, “I would never cut you bro,” according to the affidavit.

Samuel Marin said he then heard the noise of someone getting stabbed and looked up “and saw Jacob stand up and blood gushing from his chest,” the detective reported.

Samuel Marin said he fled the apartment, but his brother followed him, trying to calm him down, according to the affidavit.

“Samuel said Isaiah stated he would explain why he killed Jacob from letters he would write while he was in prison,” according to the affidavit.

The defendant’s brother also told police “Isaiah had been watching YouTube videos related to his Christian beliefs and the Book of Matthew” earlier.

During Isaiah Marin’s 911 call, “the caller began rambling about sacrificing and magic,” according to the affidavit. “Asked how … he murdered someone, Isaiah stated, ‘I hacked them to death with a machete.’”

In August, on one of his Facebook pages, Isaiah Marin wrote, “Tried to take on a demon and God had to help me through the tough parts. Got to be careful with my words and pay closer attention to my emotions. Need to figure out how to keep on speaking when I’m with the presence of the Lord God.”

Dickerson said the killing happened at the apartment on S Oakdale, on the west side of Stillwater.

Isaiah Marin was taken into custody after he was found by police jogging along State Highway 51, Dickerson said.

Witnesses called police to say they saw a blood-covered man walking near a car dealership along the highway.

Trish Ellis, a saleswoman at the Janzen Toyota car dealership along SH 51, said “We saw him coming through the parking lot covered in blood. I thought it was a Halloween costume at first, but then people started to get frightened when they saw his weapon.”

Witnesses said Isaiah Marin was taken into custody just west of the car dealership, along the side of the roadway.

The complex of two-story apartments where Jacob Crockett’s body was found is located behind the dealership, which is on the north side of the highway.

A neighbor at the apartment, who declined to give his name, said Jacob and Jesse Crockett were in a “heavy metal band.”

“They were outstanding guys, they were always really respectful,” the neighbor said Thursday afternoon.

Police said Jacob Crockett was a student at the Northern Oklahoma College campus in Stillwater.

Dickerson said the fact that Jacob Crockett’s father is a state trooper has not been shown to be a motive in the case.

Jacob Crockett graduated from Stillwater High School this year, Principal Uwe Gordon said. Isaiah Marin graduated in 2012.

Gordon described Crockett as “an amazing character.”

“I love that kid,” Gordon said. “He was unique and appreciated others’ uniqueness.”

He said students on Thursday expressed concern after hearing about Crockett’s death, and some were asking about the funeral.

“It’s been a tough week for Stillwater High School,” he said.

Marin had worked at a popular Mexican restaurant, El Vaquero, on Stillwater’s west side. Employees there said he was a part-time bus boy for about three weeks before he quit. Workers said they could not recall much about him.

**Dreadclaw69**

The victim’s brother, Jesse Crockett, told police Marin is a “religious zealot” and “heavy drug user,” according to a court affidavit.

Police confirmed there was evidence at the scene that Marin might have been involved in the use of some illegal drugs.

Maybe you could have put some emphasis on his drug abuse too, in the interests of accuracy as well as equality. It'll be interesting to see if mental health issues are at play also

**Kanluwen**

How much more emphasis could be put on the drug abuse?

**Ouze**

Kanluwen wrote:
How much more emphasis could be put on the drug abuse?

As many as it takes to pretend this wasn't an act of religious extremist by a Christian.

**Dreadclaw69**

Ouze wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:
How much more emphasis could be put on the drug abuse?

As many as it takes to pretend this wasn't an act of religious extremist by a Christian.

The pair of you can stop it now. Read what I said;
"Maybe you could have put some emphasis on his drug abuse too, in the interests of accuracy as well as equality. It'll be interesting to see if mental health issues are at play also"
Now read how d-usa choose to frame the incident

d-usa wrote:
For equality's sake:
Another man in Oklahoma nearly beheads someone with a machete, has a history of religious arguments.

He chose the custom title for the URL that solely mentioned his faith as a motivating factor. What he typed does not match the headline of the actual article either. Instead the phrasing deliberately skewed the incident and omitted a vital factor that was not in place in the attack that generated this thread.

So the pair of you can stop being disingenuous. Ouze, I expect better from you.

**Kanluwen**

Oh, I'm sure that it had nothing to do with his Christian beliefs.

It was all the drugs!