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 Nightlord1987 wrote:
My most favorite HQ models are equipped with twin lightning claws. They look so badass, but I would always want a combi weapon over that second claw on the tabletop, and Damage 1 melee isnt that great.

I personally never understood the pricetag of the pair of claws.

Yeah sure you can reroll wounds but is that worth that much?
Especially considering a combi-bolter is 2 a combiplas 11 pts...
Heck even a mace or sword for 4 or a chainaxe for 1 pts seem like a better Investment.

I'm partial to Phoenix Lords and their corresponding Aspects. This includes Drazhar and Incubi.

I really hope when GW comes out with new models for the Craftworlds they find a way to allow shrine oriented lists to be viable. They then expand Drazhar and Incubi in some fashion to make lists based off them as well.

Imagine if they found some way to make generic aspect themed vehicles and such with each having a unique weapon and rule based off the shrine they chose. Aspect themed wraithguard and wraithlords for some heavy weapon support.

Just things like that.

But that's basically what I want. a Scorpion and/or Incubi themed list. You could do it with the old DE book because incubi wargear was available to leaders and such. Reallly miss those days.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
My most favorite HQ models are equipped with twin lightning claws. They look so badass, but I would always want a combi weapon over that second claw on the tabletop, and Damage 1 melee isnt that great.

I personally never understood the pricetag of the pair of claws.

Yeah sure you can reroll wounds but is that worth that much?
Especially considering a combi-bolter is 2 a combiplas 11 pts...
Heck even a mace or sword for 4 or a chainaxe for 1 pts seem like a better Investment.

That's because they are a better investment. A single claw picks up the reroll to wound but loses AP, that's comparable to a Power Axe maybe. 5 points, tops. The pair gives an extra attack, chain swords do that for free. An extra claw attack is probably worth a point or two though.

On topic: I like the heavy version of Hellblasters, but I couldn't justify building a squad of them.

Warp Talons, one of Chaos' best looking units. Even as standard raptors they're not very good on the table.

 Huron black heart wrote:
Warp Talons, one of Chaos' best looking units. Even as standard raptors they're not very good on the table.

Well the baseline for the unit is 25 pts i / model now isn't it.

It also doesn't help that they are w1 and also reeeaaally limited in terms of attacks.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Huron black heart wrote:
Warp Talons, one of Chaos' best looking units. Even as standard raptors they're not very good on the table.

Well the baseline for the unit is 25 pts i / model now isn't it.

It also doesn't help that they are w1 and also reeeaaally limited in terms of attacks.

Too much depends on them getting into combat after deep strike, if they don't they die and if they do they don't do enough damage, and then die

Martel732 wrote:
They were not too good at 35. Thats a fallacy. Now in 8th, theres nothing even worth putting in them. I can tell you i wouldnt use them at 25.

Melta is terrible in 8th. Its not worth anything to me to try to mobilize and overcosted unit with melta.

I might not even use them if they were free because the units that go in them are so bad.

For ~15 pts I'll use them as SB platform and little antiDS spot. Probably will put it in my deployment turn1 instead of putting it into reserve.

 Huron black heart wrote:
Warp Talons, one of Chaos' best looking units. Even as standard raptors they're not very good on the table.

Warp Talons are useful. Like other units that have a specific purpose, it is quite hard to judge them solely on their stat line. But generally even THIS Night Lord player doesn't use them even though I sorely always want to.

 Huron black heart wrote:
Warp Talons, one of Chaos' best looking units. Even as standard raptors they're not very good on the table.

Warp Talons CAN be good, but you really have to build around them. Host Raptorial with a Tip of the Spear Lord is the minimum, and you ideally want them to be Khorne, have a Herald of Khorne to deepstrike alongside them for the charge reroll and have them be Black Legion or World Eaters for the extra attack on the charge (BL only with the stratagem).

Anyway, for me it's Thunderwolf Cavalry that's not a Lord on Wolf. Just too expensive for what they do.

 G00fySmiley wrote:


dual choppa nobz are one of the best units on the codex. mix in a few big choppas, if you haev points to spare consider giving the boss nob a power claw but not required.

nobz vs boys add a 4+ armor save, 1w, +1str, +1 attack all for twice the cost of a boy (5 nobz 70 vs 10 boys 70) dual choppas means you lose shooting (which was terrible anyway) but onyl lose 1 attack vs 2 boys but at Strength 5 meaning wounding most infantry on 3's and vehicles on 5's and the bonus of 4+ means they last longer.

throw multiple units in the same transport and be sure o throw an ammo runt to eat expolosive casualties/wounds (oh no you overcharged plasma and killed my... ammo runt)

5 Dual Choppa nobz are as expensive as 10 boyz, very true. Of course the difference is that the +1 wound and 4+ armor means exactly nothing against so many competitive weapons that the enemy can just kill them AS easily as regular boyz when they are left in the open which means you need a transport, and Orkz do not have a single transport worth its cost. A trukk is so flimsy at its current points value and lacks any purpose after unloading its cargo and eating overwatch; A battlewagon on the other hand is just bad. So you have to take a unit which is roughly as effective as Boyz at low model count (When you go to 10 nobz the boyz get 20 boyz which means +1 attack, so instead of 60 attacks they get 80) but is nowhere near as durable due to multi damage weapons and suddenly you now have to take an expensive transport that doesn't have any real shooting capability and is borderline useless in CC except to eat overwatch. So those nobz are now hamstrung by a 60+ pt increase due to the need for a transport.

Nobz are good on paper....that is about it.

SemperMortis wrote:

 G00fySmiley wrote:


dual choppa nobz are one of the best units on the codex. mix in a few big choppas, if you haev points to spare consider giving the boss nob a power claw but not required.

nobz vs boys add a 4+ armor save, 1w, +1str, +1 attack all for twice the cost of a boy (5 nobz 70 vs 10 boys 70) dual choppas means you lose shooting (which was terrible anyway) but onyl lose 1 attack vs 2 boys but at Strength 5 meaning wounding most infantry on 3's and vehicles on 5's and the bonus of 4+ means they last longer.

throw multiple units in the same transport and be sure o throw an ammo runt to eat expolosive casualties/wounds (oh no you overcharged plasma and killed my... ammo runt)

5 Dual Choppa nobz are as expensive as 10 boyz, very true. Of course the difference is that the +1 wound and 4+ armor means exactly nothing against so many competitive weapons that the enemy can just kill them AS easily as regular boyz when they are left in the open which means you need a transport, and Orkz do not have a single transport worth its cost. A trukk is so flimsy at its current points value and lacks any purpose after unloading its cargo and eating overwatch; A battlewagon on the other hand is just bad. So you have to take a unit which is roughly as effective as Boyz at low model count (When you go to 10 nobz the boyz get 20 boyz which means +1 attack, so instead of 60 attacks they get 80) but is nowhere near as durable due to multi damage weapons and suddenly you now have to take an expensive transport that doesn't have any real shooting capability and is borderline useless in CC except to eat overwatch. So those nobz are now hamstrung by a 60+ pt increase due to the need for a transport.

Nobz are good on paper....that is about it.

Tellyporta and Da Jump? Nobz also have the advantage that they have less bodies and thus have an easier time to get everyone stuck in CC. Although that can also be a disadvantage if you want to make a wide multi-charge. Overall I'd say that the biggest disadvantage Nobz have is that they don't generate nearly as much CP as Boyz do, which is a quite significant thing in an army as CP hungry as Orks.

Tellyporta and Da Jump also relies on a 9' charge unless you are Evil Sunz. Tellyporta is also 2CP and Da Jump can only be used once a turn. So in essence you are wasting 2CP for a minimum squad of nobz to accomplish what a squad of boyz can do, OR you are tying up the Weirdboy for 1 turn to get 5 nobz into charge range and hoping they get in, because if they don't they are boned.

Realistically there is no happy middle ground and jumping or teleporting nobz doesn't make sense because its expensive and/or it is risky because if they fail their charge they are left exposed and in the open.