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Made in gb
Mighty Vampire Count






UK

 Mr_Rose wrote:
Even the dakkajets were preceded by a couple of Ork fighters made by Forge World, though the resemblance is less strong.

Do they predate the ones used in the boardgame where you have to bomb bridges and such?

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 Mr Morden wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Even the dakkajets were preceded by a couple of Ork fighters made by Forge World, though the resemblance is less strong.

Do they predate the ones used in the boardgame where you have to bomb bridges and such?


Those would have been the metal Fighta Bommers that GW made in the days of Epic 40k, those horribly scaled ones that were probably closer to 2mm scale than 6mm scale.

I dunno what the timeline was, I know of those metal Epic 40k ones from the 90's, then I believe the FW 40k scale one came a few years later, then the resin AI one also from FW a few years later that looked the same as the FW 40k model, then the plastic GW one that they sell now for 40k which to me looks like an adaption of the FW one.

But maybe there's some other iterations I don't know about.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/09 17:07:01


 
   
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Oh yeah, if you go back far enough, all the flyers started out in Epic, though they also looked quite different. Like the Nightwing used to be a tank, then it became the Nightwing Interceptor with fixed half-moon wings, kinda like the Batwing, and all Eldar flyers had a hex grid carved into their armour for some reason.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/09 18:37:35


"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







I believe the grid was so that Eldar pilots could simulate Aeronautica Imperialis on their planes between sorties...

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 Kanluwen wrote:
This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.

Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army... 
   
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 Dysartes wrote:
I believe the grid was so that Eldar pilots could simulate Aeronautica Imperialis on their planes between sorties...

Ah, yes, the little known and less understood “mode 7” setting on the holofields…

"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






 Mr_Rose wrote:
 Dysartes wrote:
I believe the grid was so that Eldar pilots could simulate Aeronautica Imperialis on their planes between sorties...

Ah, yes, the little known and less understood “mode 7” setting on the holofields…


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 MajorWesJanson wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
 Dysartes wrote:
I believe the grid was so that Eldar pilots could simulate Aeronautica Imperialis on their planes between sorties...

Ah, yes, the little known and less understood “mode 7” setting on the holofields…


Holo-FIFA

I suspect the Craftworlders have too much of a stick up their butts to play a thinly-disguised casino on their planes...

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 Kanluwen wrote:
This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.

Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army... 
   
Made in us
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Speaking of actual tiny planes, was everyone else aware that the plastic Nightwings have functional swing wings? Not just pick a pose and glue it but an actual toothed mechanism to let you change them as you want if you assemble them correctly…

"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in au
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 Mr_Rose wrote:
Speaking of actual tiny planes, was everyone else aware that the plastic Nightwings have functional swing wings? Not just pick a pose and glue it but an actual toothed mechanism to let you change them as you want if you assemble them correctly…


Yeah, I noticed on the sprue pics they had little gear teeth on them, and one of the warcom articles said "The Nightwings even have wings that can be fitted without glue in order to let you swap them between sub- or supersonic flight positions in real time."

From memory even the resin FW ones had wings like that, though all mine are glued fixed, I think that was an option.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/10 01:22:18


 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Mr_Rose wrote:
Oh yeah, if you go back far enough, all the flyers started out in Epic, though they also looked quite different. Like the Nightwing used to be a tank, then it became the Nightwing Interceptor with fixed half-moon wings, kinda like the Batwing, and all Eldar flyers had a hex grid carved into their armour for some reason.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/333298998573

That was what Nightwings originally looked like at the end of Epic 2nd edition and Epic Titan Legions. They were of the old Eldar look, i.e. more organic and alien, without need to be aerodynamic.

Then Epic 40K edition came and the Nightwings were changed (and the Phoenix introduced).

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/File:EpicNightwing.jpg

The hex grid was a poor attempt at detail. The Eldar epic miniatures all had ugly surface detail put on and they were widely reviled as hideous.

Epic 2nd edition Phantom Titan: http://www.coolminiornot.com/371765

Epic 40k Phantom Titan: https://i.ebayimg.com/d/w1600/pict/363337384148_/Epic-40k-Eldar-Phantom-Titan.jpg

   
Made in au
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Just received my 2 boxes of Wrath of Angels. Didn't know they were doing deliveries on Sundays. The models do look pretty nice as usual, though these sets were packaged a lot worse than the previous one and some of the Xiphons got pushed out of their sprues. No major damage other than the sprue attachment point being very rough due to being forced out, but nothing that'll be too hard to fix.

Looks like there's a new scenario, "Death from Above", on the scenario pamphlet in the boxed set.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I dunno if it's an error, but the Twin Bright Lances are listed as Aerial Attack for the Phoenix, but not for the Nightwing.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/10/10 07:14:02


 
   
Made in de
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Hamburg

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

I dunno if it's an error, but the Twin Bright Lances are listed as Aerial Attack for the Phoenix, but not for the Nightwing.

This has been discussed before in this thread (page 54). Disappointing to hear that it‘s this way in the actual rules as well.
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User




TheGoodGerman wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:

I dunno if it's an error, but the Twin Bright Lances are listed as Aerial Attack for the Phoenix, but not for the Nightwing.

This has been discussed before in this thread (page 54). Disappointing to hear that it‘s this way in the actual rules as well.


The stats in the rulebook are like that, however the stats on the back of the instructions for both have Aerial Attack.

Which is itself still stupid, as the fluff always had bright lances and pulse lasers used in the ground attack role as well - can't understand all the upgrade weapon options on the phoenix BOMBER being Aerial Attack! Eldar are going to struggle in any mission which requires more than minimal ground attack capabilities and (with no vampire in sight) no transport option also simply can't do a chunk of the scenarios at all.

Have to admit, pretty disappointed with the Eldar part of the release. Will be house-ruling a few modifications for sure.
   
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I'm sure Fore World will give us premium priced resin fliers to allow the Eldar to play all the missions.

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Wouldn't tyranids and dark eldar be good too?
That would be all major factions from the game?

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 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Wouldn't tyranids and dark eldar be good too?
That would be all major factions from the game?

Wouldn’t dark Eldar be just Eldar but spiky at the level of abstraction in AI? I mean go ahead and release models because they’re cool lookin’ but what meaningful difference is there, mechanically speaking?
Unless they get close combat (as in literal physical contact between aircraft) attacks somehow…?

Tyranids have been discussed and there’s the issue of biological flight tending to be hilariously slow compared to everyone else. But so manoeuvrable… speed 0-2, thrust 3, agility 1-9 and jink on everything? Plus a billion spore mines.

The only other faction with flyers though would be Necrons. Be an interesting one t approach; do they have low HP and self-repair, or just lots of HP? High speeds and thrust but low agility and poor pilots?

"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Procrastinator extraordinaire





Edinburgh, UK

Got my box on Saturday, some lovely sculpts and appreciate you can change modes on the Nightwings. Not the best packaging inside the box though, just seemed a bit thrown in rather than what I usually come to expect from GW box sets. The Eldar dice are also lovely, nice weight and texture to them, almost like wraithbone

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/10 22:46:21


   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




Current Dark Eldar aircraft would be pretty awful as they're basically similar to the Lightning but the missiles they carried are for infantry.
   
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 Mr_Rose wrote:


Tyranids have been discussed and there’s the issue of biological flight tending to be hilariously slow compared to everyone else. But so manoeuvrable… speed 0-2, thrust 3, agility 1-9 and jink on everything? Plus a billion spore mines.


I always thought of Tyranid Harridans as blimps with teeth.

And surrounded by thousands of Gargoyles in a cloud so dense it takes a lot of shooting to get through to the Harridan.

But that's just my mental image of how they would work. Not sure about Aeronautica, but in at least some editions of Epic the Harridans zoomed on and off the board just like other jets. Always thought that was a bit silly--would prefer them to work more like slow-moving Squat airships.
   
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The Crone is an air superiority melee fighter so no matter how your headcannon works, GW clearly thinks they can catch up to jets. I don't know why we have to keep having this discussion.

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AllSeeingSkink wrote:
...though these sets were packaged a lot worse than the previous one and some of the Xiphons got pushed out of their sprues. No major damage other than the sprue attachment point being very rough due to being forced out, but nothing that'll be too hard to fix....


Damn it, I was wrong, one of the Phoenix models has some damage on its nose. You'd think for the amount of money GW charges for their models they might be able to package them properly.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
GW clearly thinks they can catch up to jets.


And sometimes GW writes crap fluff and makes poor models, like the eagle chariot or Santa Grimnar.

I still hope AI sticks to the older concept of Tyranids not having high speed fighters, especially not flapping wing ones.





This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/11 08:26:15


 
   
Made in gb
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London

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

Those would have been the metal Fighta Bommers that GW made in the days of Epic 40k, those horribly scaled ones that were probably closer to 2mm scale than 6mm scale..


Well horribly blue or not it was a deliberate decision to scale first Titans and then aircraft at roughly 1/600 with the ground stuff being vaguely 1/300.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Of course GWs currently scale is a bit odd - they insist a normal guy would be 6mm tall (1/285) but the consensus is they are more 8mm (1/200) productions to date…

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/11 08:56:36


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




AT scale is just 40k hit by the shrink ray to somewhere between 3 and 4 times smaller, isn't it?

I know we heard early on that normal guys would be 6mm and Marines at 8mm, but that doesn't seem to make much sense.
   
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The_Real_Chris wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:

Those would have been the metal Fighta Bommers that GW made in the days of Epic 40k, those horribly scaled ones that were probably closer to 2mm scale than 6mm scale..


Well horribly blue or not it was a deliberate decision to scale first Titans and then aircraft at roughly 1/600 with the ground stuff being vaguely 1/300.


What some call horribly scaled, I call sensibly sized to fit in a carry case and move around on a table.

My general impression of the new Aeronautica is that the plane models would have been better off scaled smaller relative to the hex map, for more convenient gameplay.

Really small-scale vehicles are cooler anyway. (yes I was into Micro Machines as a kid)
   
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Fresh-Faced New User




Would it be possible to have a Chaos Vs Necrons, with the lore being one of Abaddon's crusades against the Necron Pylons that Abaddon had to break to cause the whole scar thing?
And to Tyranids, why not have a Daemons vs Tyranids box, where the rules for flying Monstrous Creatures could play out? Put a Bloodthirster or Lord of Changes vs. a Hive Tyrant.
Personally I would like to see a Helldrake for Chaos. Paint him yellow and make it like an evil Woodstock (Snoopy's companion in the Peanut comics/cartoons)
   
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London

Zenithfleet wrote:

My general impression of the new Aeronautica is that the plane models would have been better off scaled smaller relative to the hex map, for more convenient gameplay.

Really small-scale vehicles are cooler anyway. (yes I was into Micro Machines as a kid)


I have played with my old Epic models, works great

I still dream of rescaling BFG so my cruisers are the length of the base's diameter...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mr.Pickels wrote:
Would it be possible to have a Chaos Vs Necrons, with the lore being one of Abaddon's crusades against the Necron Pylons that Abaddon had to break to cause the whole scar thing?
And to Tyranids, why not have a Daemons vs Tyranids box, where the rules for flying Monstrous Creatures could play out? Put a Bloodthirster or Lord of Changes vs. a Hive Tyrant.
Personally I would like to see a Helldrake for Chaos. Paint him yellow and make it like an evil Woodstock (Snoopy's companion in the Peanut comics/cartoons)


Would be a good idea, though with all the provisos of non supersonic vs supersonic.

Nids would make a cool campaign where you are doing stuff in clouds of rising bioforms. Kinda like navigating an aggressive maze

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/11 14:37:20


 
   
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San Jose, CA

Zenithfleet wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:


Tyranids have been discussed and there’s the issue of biological flight tending to be hilariously slow compared to everyone else. But so manoeuvrable… speed 0-2, thrust 3, agility 1-9 and jink on everything? Plus a billion spore mines.


I always thought of Tyranid Harridans as blimps with teeth.

And surrounded by thousands of Gargoyles in a cloud so dense it takes a lot of shooting to get through to the Harridan.

But that's just my mental image of how they would work. Not sure about Aeronautica, but in at least some editions of Epic the Harridans zoomed on and off the board just like other jets. Always thought that was a bit silly--would prefer them to work more like slow-moving Squat airships.


This, and not just for Squats reasons.

They should be rather slow moving but with a picket of spores, gargoyles, etc surrounding them. We already have grot bomms & tau drones so having a couple small bases to represent them modelwise isn't farfetched.

Rules wise would be the problem.
   
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The_Real_Chris wrote:
Of course GWs currently scale is a bit odd - they insist a normal guy would be 6mm tall (1/285) but the consensus is they are more 8mm (1/200) productions to date…

That's marines, bub


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Vorian wrote:
AT scale is just 40k hit by the shrink ray to somewhere between 3 and 4 times smaller, isn't it?

I know we heard early on that normal guys would be 6mm and Marines at 8mm, but that doesn't seem to make much sense.


It kinda does, TBH. marines are supposed to be massive after all.

Spoiler:



This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/11 17:50:43


 
   
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I mean more that 6mm is not big enough for regular people.
   
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Vorian wrote:
I mean more that 6mm is not big enough for regular people.

...any reason in particular? I'd say the difference between an unarmored human and an armored space marine is quite on point.
   
 
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