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d-usa wrote:

Mad4Minis wrote:So am I the only one who sees a lot of this as rules made to sell models?

And 5th was a rule set to sell us parking lots.

Dont get me wrong, I didnt like 5th either, but 6th just seems to be a blatant sales tool.

I am looking forward to batreps to see how it all works out though...

Still hit a vehicle in the rear armour in close combat? A power axe might be a fairly decent anti vehicle weapon if so.
Can you double check the power axe? Is it minus 1 to Initiative or is it specifically I1? Request from warseer.

[–]Rixitotal[S] 1 point 1 minute ago
has the unwieldy rule same as a powerfist. make you I 1. and yes still rear Armour.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I just turned the corner on allies - unfair advantage to those who use it at less than 2000 points. See:

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago
no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

[–]jamesterjlrb 1 point 8 minutes ago

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

permalink

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago

no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

Well, we can finally put this ridiculous argument to rest.

When you perform Overwatch, is it possible to kill enough models so they dont actually make the distance into CC with you?
If 2 or more units charge 1 unit, can you overwatch both of them? If 4 units charge 2 units, can both units shoot each unit or is it limited to 1 charging unit only?
Any change to Swarms? Still double wounds from blast and template?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 4 minutes ago
swarms are the same.
you over watch first and take from the front. so yea can affect assults. only 1 over watch a turn.

Flamestorm cannons are good defenses on land raiders who fear scarabs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another one I just thought of: How are models in combat measured? Is it still 2" from models in base to base with enemy models?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 1 point 1 minute ago
yup still the same, but models pile in in I order instead of all at the start.

tetrisphreak wrote:
And I just turned the corner on allies - unfair advantage to those who use it at less than 2000 points. See:

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago
no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

You hear that?

It's the sound of every Tyranid player putting a gun in their mouth.

You hear that?

It's the sound of every Tyranid player putting a gun in their mouth.

I find double FOC's hilarious at 2000 points. No way that makes any sense. 2500 points maybe but 2000 points isn't big enough for 6 heavies. 2000 point lists will be wildly imbalanced. Tournaments would therefore be run at 1999 points at most.

tetrisphreak wrote:Still hit a vehicle in the rear armour in close combat? A power axe might be a fairly decent anti vehicle weapon if so.
Can you double check the power axe? Is it minus 1 to Initiative or is it specifically I1? Request from warseer.

[–]Rixitotal[S] 1 point 1 minute ago
has the unwieldy rule same as a powerfist. make you I 1. and yes still rear Armour.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I just turned the corner on allies - unfair advantage to those who use it at less than 2000 points. See:

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago
no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

So right when the norm was becoming 2000 pt games again. It got capped. I can't see 2000pts being popular in casual games if it jacks up the FOC. I don't like it.

Fafnir wrote:

tetrisphreak wrote:
And I just turned the corner on allies - unfair advantage to those who use it at less than 2000 points. See:

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago
no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

You hear that?

It's the sound of every Tyranid player putting a gun in their mouth.

Fearless Wounds being removed is promising.
Plus, Rage giving all out-of-synapse "Feed" Tyranids +2A is nice too.

- Cannot disembark from a vehicle that moved more than 6".

- Measuring who's in combat is the same, except the pile in goes at initiative order.


Well, that kills off Wagon Rush.

EDIT: insaniak clarifies: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/2010/456706.page#4439970

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

Mandor wrote:As tetrisphreak posted.



Confirmed ally chart.

Again, that's the ally chart from one of Games Workshop's doubles tournament a few months ago, hardly "confirmed".

How are SoB and Black Templars an UN-holy alliance. Aren't they the exact opposite? I'd assume that they'd be BFB.

So right when the norm was becoming 2000 pt games again. It got capped. I can't see 2000pts being popular in casual games if it jacks up the FOC. I don't like it.

They should've made it over 2000 points for double FOC so we could use that round number for our games while still keeping things reasonable. Oh well, tournaments will just have to write 'single FOC' down in the rules package.

lord_blackfang wrote:

[–]jamesterjlrb 1 point 8 minutes ago

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

permalink

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago

no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

Well, we can finally put this ridiculous argument to rest.

Even the fancy charts weren't colored in for the same type army to ally. Kinda straight forward.

*oops at least the one I saw!

AresX8 wrote:- Cannot disembark from a vehicle that moved more than 6".

...but you get to move 6" after disembarking. End result is the same as now.

insaniak wrote:

AresX8 wrote:- Cannot disembark from a vehicle that moved more than 6".

...but you get to move 6" after disembarking. End result is the same as now.

Ah, indeed it is.

Therion wrote:

Yes, but DC come with FNP and FC built in, have plenty of lovely weapon options, and are WS5. This makes them an incredibly good standalone hammer for pretty much any army in the game.

Jumping to conclusions eh? There are quite a few armies that don't want to have absolutely anything to do with 35 point Space Marines with normal 3+ saves and no invulnerable save.

Only 35 points if you buy a jump pack per model, and now FNP is invul to power weapons.

Not to mention, if you add Lemartes or Astorath, they get rerolls to hit and wound with WS5 S5 I5, and because they're jump infantry they get an I10 hit, yeah?

You'd be insane not to consider Death Company as a viable unit. Run the math and see how many MEQs a unit of Death Company can put out on the charge.

Plus, Rage, is now going to confer 2 hits on the charge, in addition to DC's 2 base, +1 for pistol +1 for charge, rerolls hitting and wounding on 3s, yeah, sorry, that unit is incredible in the assault.

AresX8 wrote:- Cannot disembark from a vehicle that moved more than 6".




Well, that kills off Wagon Rush.

Transports in general...

Last minute rush to score or contest as well.

So... Scoring units embarked in transports still scoring? Vehicles no longer contesting yes/no?

Absolutionis wrote:

Fafnir wrote:

tetrisphreak wrote:
And I just turned the corner on allies - unfair advantage to those who use it at less than 2000 points. See:

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago
no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

You hear that?

It's the sound of every Tyranid player putting a gun in their mouth.

Fearless Wounds being removed is promising.
Plus, Rage giving all out-of-synapse "Feed" Tyranids +2A is nice too.

I honestly don't see those two additions being nearly enough from removing the nids out of the "joke army" category.

Tyranids will be using fairly mediocre units against armies that are allied to have some of the most optimized units available now. Instead of going against armies that had exploitable weaknesses, they'll be facing armies that cover up their weaknesses with allies, while the Tyranids' own will be more painful than ever.

insaniak wrote:

AresX8 wrote:- Cannot disembark from a vehicle that moved more than 6".

...but you get to move 6" after disembarking. End result is the same as now.

Depends. Can embarked scoring units still score?

Only 35 points if you buy a jump pack per model, and now FNP is invul to power weapons.

Not to mention, if you add Lemartes or Astorath, they get rerolls to hit and wound with WS5 S5 I5, and because they're jump infantry they get an I10 hit, yeah?

You'd be insane not to consider Death Company as a viable unit. Run the math and see how many MEQs a unit of Death Company can put out on the charge.

They're still more vulnerable to everything in the game than Assault Marines under the Sanguinary Priest bubble because they have 75% less wounds, not to mention the fact that they also do less damage than those Assault Marines because there's more of the AM. DC and especially jumping ones are overpriced. Are you saying your DOA BA army doesn't have multiple Sanguinary Priests around? Assault Marines outperform DC in every respect point by point and by taking only masses of them you're not providing your opponent any juicy targets to cash in from. If you can't see this we have nothing further to discuss. It's from the ABC of army list building.

...but you get to move 6" after disembarking. End result is the same as now.

End result is not the same. Firstly the transport itself will be further away than before, and secondly from what we've heard disembarking isn't the same. You no longer disembark 2" away from the doors but in base to base contact with any part of the vehicle's hull or base. Someone could confirm this from the dude on reddit if they have the time.

Byte wrote:

tetrisphreak wrote:Still hit a vehicle in the rear armour in close combat? A power axe might be a fairly decent anti vehicle weapon if so.
Can you double check the power axe? Is it minus 1 to Initiative or is it specifically I1? Request from warseer.

[–]Rixitotal[S] 1 point 1 minute ago
has the unwieldy rule same as a powerfist. make you I 1. and yes still rear Armour.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I just turned the corner on allies - unfair advantage to those who use it at less than 2000 points. See:

Can you ally with yourself to expand your FOC?

[–]Rixitotal[S] 2 points 1 minute ago
no you may not. but at 2000 pts you get a second FOC if you want it.

So right when the norm was becoming 2000 pt games again. It got capped. I can't see 2000pts being popular in casual games if it jacks up the FOC. I don't like it.

Most Fantasy players play to 3000 points (which is alot closer to 2000 in 40k ) but ignore cap for doubling of Special and Rare slots. This will be no different.

Therion wrote:

Only 35 points if you buy a jump pack per model, and now FNP is invul to power weapons.

Not to mention, if you add Lemartes or Astorath, they get rerolls to hit and wound with WS5 S5 I5, and because they're jump infantry they get an I10 hit, yeah?

You'd be insane not to consider Death Company as a viable unit. Run the math and see how many MEQs a unit of Death Company can put out on the charge.

They're still more vulnerable to everything in the game than Assault Marines under the Sanguinary Priest bubble because they have 75% less wounds. Are you saying your DOA BA army doesn't have multiple Sanguinary Priests around? Assault Marines outperform DC in every respect point by point and by taking only masses of them you're not providing your opponent any juicy targets to cash in from. If you can't see this we have nothing further to discuss. It's from the ABC of army list building.

Within their own codex, sure, Assault Marines will outdo the Death Company, but as far ally material, Death Company are some fantastic. Low maintenance, very powerful, with plenty of options to be incredibly deadly. A minimally equipped unit with Lemartes is going to be something to watch for.

At the risk of being slow::

So if jump infantry get a free I10 attack, do they use their regular weapons for that?

So Vanguard Vets with power fists or thunder hammers strike first?

Mad4Minis wrote:So am I the only one who sees a lot of this as rules made to sell models?

Yes, you are the only person in this entire thread of almost 70 pages to make that insightful comment.

Within their own codex, sure, Assault Marines will outdo the Death Company, but as far ally material, Death Company are some fantastic.

I'd rather ally with IG, and if I was IG I'd rather ally with Necrons. Necrons get a bonus Vendetta and a CCS with officer of the fleet, while IG get a couple solar pulses to protect their stuff with night fighting, and a Doom Scythe. Bless the Emperor for the unholy alliance of the Imperial Navy and the Necrontyr.

Reddit rulebook guy has decided to call it a day. Still, quite a wealth of information just from that 2 hours or so he blogged with all of us. I've made sure all his responses were highlighted in orange for those who need to scroll back and read through them. Just filter the thread.

d-usa wrote:At the risk of being slow::

So if jump infantry get a free I10 attack, do they use their regular weapons for that?

So Vanguard Vets with power fists or thunder hammers strike first?

Was wondering about that as well...
anyone come across this yet?

Thanks Tetris. Hopefully he will add those warlord abilities tomorrow.



His last answer was to tell us who wrote the rule book.

Requiem wrote:

d-usa wrote:At the risk of being slow::

So if jump infantry get a free I10 attack, do they use their regular weapons for that?

So Vanguard Vets with power fists or thunder hammers strike first?

Was wondering about that as well...
anyone come across this yet?

Fairly certain I read in this thread that it's base strength not using your cloce combat weapons.

Stu H wrote:

Requiem wrote:

d-usa wrote:At the risk of being slow::

So if jump infantry get a free I10 attack, do they use their regular weapons for that?

So Vanguard Vets with power fists or thunder hammers strike first?

Was wondering about that as well...
anyone come across this yet?

Fairly certain I read in this thread that it's base strength not using your cloce combat weapons.

Seeing as how they're Impact hits and not so much swings of swords/fists/folding chairs, i think that's right. 1 A per model, at base strength and I10. So probably AP- as well.

tetrisphreak wrote:

Stu H wrote:

Requiem wrote:

d-usa wrote:At the risk of being slow::

So if jump infantry get a free I10 attack, do they use their regular weapons for that?

So Vanguard Vets with power fists or thunder hammers strike first?

Was wondering about that as well...
anyone come across this yet?

Fairly certain I read in this thread that it's base strength not using your cloce combat weapons.

Seeing as how they're Impact hits and not so much swings of swords/fists/folding chairs, i think that's right. 1 A per model, at base strength and I10. So probably AP- as well.

Just for that I am going to build an ork army weiling folding chairs as CC weapons and wearing wrestler tights hehe.

I did not catch him in time to ask about the instant death rules.