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Dysartes wrote:Masterclass Volume 2 (which uses the old paints).

Joined up thinking from FW/GW there

Slinky wrote:

Dysartes wrote:Masterclass Volume 2 (which uses the old paints).

Joined up thinking from FW/GW there

Someone else mentioned that one of the FW Studio painters didn't know how the new paints worked until they (the poster) talked to them (the studio painter) about them (the paints).

So yes, joined up thinking strikes again

winterdyne wrote:Those legs are borked bad. Definitely a reject, and FW will replace them without complaint. Always worth checking purchase while at WHW, you can sometimes exchange for parts over the counter at the store too. Still, that example slightly takes the wind out of the rest of this post. :-) At least you're local enough to just give WHW a ring and pick bits up.

Edit: For checking models wander over to the painting area next to the shop - they've got good lights and even if they're all being used the people there will happily let you check a piece over.

I got myself an Elspeth on Carmine Dragon. Utterly flawless - not one bubble (even pinprick!) on the whole damn thing. The Enforcer is nice too. Resin can work beautifully is the point I'm making, but it's gotta be done right.

Oh you got a enforcer model, have I told you today that I hate you winterdyne

I bought some of Reaper's new Bones line of miniatures. Plastic versions of their metal miniatures. They were totally flawless and less than half the price of the same miniature in metal.

Some of the sculpts are better than others, but hopefully they expand more of their range into this material. Maybe I should buy one and mail it to GW HQ to show them how it's done.

http://www.reapermini.com/Miniatures/Bones/latest/77005

frozenwastes wrote:Plastic versions of their metal miniatures.

Waa? what sorcery is this o_o? linky please?

LunaHound wrote:

frozenwastes wrote:Plastic versions of their metal miniatures.

Waa? what sorcery is this o_o? linky please?

They started with just a smattering of their miniatures as a test (like GW did with Finecast). Unfortunatley for most of their first run, they chose some of their oldest sculpts. Hopefully some of their newer stuff will get the same treatment.

http://www.reapermini.com/miniatures/bones

How about an ogre for $2.49?

http://www.reapermini.com/Miniatures/Bones/latest/77005

What on earth Reaper.... I knew GW was a rip off, but seeing these... totally makes me think GW hates their customers

Way to go Reaper @_@ that is amazing

The main issue I have with Reaper's Bones line so far is that unless I'm doing a fantasy RPG or skirmish game, I'm not likely to need most of the sculpts. I guess if I played WFB, some would be great for characters. But as far as casting quality, mould lines, flash, etc., they are totally better than GW's Finecast.

And the price, well, yeah. That does just show GW hates their customers, doesn't it? GW makes something into a soft plastic that used to be metal? Raise the price! Reaper does it? Half price. Maybe a third of the price for the ogre and troll.

frozenwastes wrote:The main issue I have with Reaper's Bones line so far is that unless I'm doing a fantasy RPG or skirmish game, I'm not likely to need most of the sculpts. I guess if I played WFB, some would be great for characters. But as far as casting quality, mould lines, flash, etc., they are totally better than GW's Finecast.

And the price, well, yeah. That does just show GW hates their customers, doesn't it? GW makes something into a soft plastic that used to be metal? Raise the price! Reaper does it? Half price. Maybe a third of the price for the ogre and troll.

Reaper minis are typically great for other tabletop games like d&d or pathfinder, not warhammer.

Also i believe reapers"bone" product is plastic, not soft resin like finecast

Hope you get one that doesn't suck. Or not ^^ wouldn't have much to write about then.

Rang FW this morning, sending out new parts without hassle! Win!

Cryage wrote:

frozenwastes wrote:

Reaper minis are typically great for other tabletop games like d&d or pathfinder, not warhammer.

Also i believe reapers"bone" product is plastic, not soft resin like finecast

I think you're probably right about the plastic/resin thing. Though we're using the words wrong (and people in the hobby have for decades). When we say resin, we really mean a plastic that cures by mixing separate resins which then react to harden. When we say plastic we mean resins that have already reacted and hardened and then are melted to return them to a liquid state, then they're injected and then they cool back to a solid. All non-epoxy based resins are actually plastic and all petroleum based plastics are made up of resins (before it's then melted and injected).

Back in 5th/6th ed WFB, I used reaper extensively. Almost all of my characters were Reaper Miniatures and some of my infantry blocks had a smattering of them to break up poses and whatnot. But this was the age where Bretonnians actually looked like 100 Years War Historicals, Empire actually looked like Medieval German landschneckt and so on. Before they exagerated everything during the late 6th edition through 8th edition releases.

If I did WFB again, I'd probably go with Mantic Undead with Reaper characters.

Finecast? Hell no.

Serious question.

How many time are we allowed to get replacement with the FC i bought ( and the replacements ) if it kept on having flaws and issues?

Because when I phoned, the operator said " eh you again! " makes me feel like its my fault for asking replacement or something....

well I KNOW its not my fault, so it feels insulting....

I dunno. Don't think there's a limit, really. I'm waiting on replacement 6 on the 25th Anniversary marine, and I got up to 9 before getting bored on Captain Stern.

LunaHound wrote:Serious question.

How many time are we allowed to get replacement with the FC i bought ( and the replacements ) if it kept on having flaws and issues?

Because when I phoned, the operator said " eh you again! " makes me feel like its my fault for asking replacement or something....

well I KNOW its not my fault, so it feels insulting....

winterdyne wrote:I dunno. Don't think there's a limit, really. I'm waiting on replacement 6 on the 25th Anniversary marine, and I got up to 9 before getting bored on Captain Stern.

There is no limit.

There is not limit, but there comes a time when you'll need to realize that you'll never get an acceptable model. At which point you need to tell GW you want a refund.

Finecast is garbage... It was garbage when it was released, here we are almost a year later and it's still garbage, at this rate it always will be garbage.

How do we as consumers express our dissatisfaction with the Finecast product and make GW listen? Simple... Buy the models right from GW, but request a refund when you see that it's complete garbage. This shows GW that yes, there is interest, but the quality is horrid and most importantly requesting a refund demonstrates that there is no faith in the product.

If we keep requesting replacements GW keeps our money and we ultimately just end up with a handful of gakky Finecast models.

Actually no. For every replacement they have to arrange it costs money. 5 minutes on the phone for a CS agent (About £0.60), shipping each replacement out UPS (presumably cheaper than Royal Mail, still going to be £0.50+). The casting of each replacement, picking, packing... All those costs hit GW where it hurts (and where the shareholders / board must eventually pay attention) - the bottom line.

So yes, it's not good. Yes, your chance of getting a perfect (or indeed 'good') cast first time is pretty slim. But you can have an impact by going through the mill a few times - you might get a decent model. You might not.. When you get bored, get a refund. For me, my birthday treat (February) is a nice 25th Anniversary Marine. I'm going to keep going until I get one, and I really don't care how many it takes. I'm also, gleefully enough, doing it quite publicly.

Speaking of this, I was quite clear to the CS guy I spoke to this afternoon (who's chasing up Brother Replacement Number 6) - 'This is for a GD piece. It's got to be good. NO BUBBLES on detail-critical areas, or anywhere where the fix will screw up a blend. [I listed the common problems].' 'Yeah, I can understand that, I'll sort one out for you'. Heh. Wonder how long this will take?

I have to admire your dedication in sticking it out, winterdyne. I think if I were in the same situation, I'd probably have shouted and swore at some poor innocent GW mail order troll by now, and demanded a refund.

Possibly this impatience and hot-headedness on my part is why I'm unlikely to ever be seriously entering one of my painted minis into a GD.

Here's an interesting review of the Warhammer 40,000 25th Anniversary model at the link below. I've got my own extremely mixed feelings about the Finecast product due to very mixed experiences with it. Quality from my experience is a mixed bag, some models in Finecast are terrific, others regularly have many serious flaws in them. Generally and with select exceptions I avoid it, if for no other reason than the price which is outrageous on many kits.

http://chestofcolors.com/warhammer-40000-25th-anniversary-space-marine-model-review/

winterdyne wrote:

Speaking of this, I was quite clear to the CS guy I spoke to this afternoon (who's chasing up Brother Replacement Number 6) - 'This is for a GD piece. It's got to be good. NO BUBBLES on detail-critical areas, or anywhere where the fix will screw up a blend. [I listed the common problems].' 'Yeah, I can understand that, I'll sort one out for you'. Heh. Wonder how long this will take?

Good luck. I had CS rep hunting down some Vanguard Vets for me, after waiting several weeks I decided that enough was enough, send me a new box. Of course they were still complete garbage.

winterdyne wrote:Actually no. For every replacement they have to arrange it costs money. 5 minutes on the phone for a CS agent (About £0.60), shipping each replacement out UPS (presumably cheaper than Royal Mail, still going to be £0.50+). The casting of each replacement, picking, packing... All those costs hit GW where it hurts (and where the shareholders / board must eventually pay attention) - the bottom line.

So yes, it's not good. Yes, your chance of getting a perfect (or indeed 'good') cast first time is pretty slim. But you can have an impact by going through the mill a few times - you might get a decent model. You might not.. When you get bored, get a refund. For me, my birthday treat (February) is a nice 25th Anniversary Marine. I'm going to keep going until I get one, and I really don't care how many it takes. I'm also, gleefully enough, doing it quite publicly.

Speaking of this, I was quite clear to the CS guy I spoke to this afternoon (who's chasing up Brother Replacement Number 6) - 'This is for a GD piece. It's got to be good. NO BUBBLES on detail-critical areas, or anywhere where the fix will screw up a blend. [I listed the common problems].' 'Yeah, I can understand that, I'll sort one out for you'. Heh. Wonder how long this will take?

Help me think of a line to respond when the CS says " you again " or something similar -_-

Ask them "What do you mean by that?"

Then they'll probably say something about how you call in for replacements a lot.

Then tell them that you're consistently disappointed with their products since they switched from metals and you've bought yet another one of their products and it has serious problems you'd like addressed.

If they then try to convince you things are actually perfect with Finecast (or something like that), ask them if they'd prefer to spend the phone call arguing about that, or getting you a product that you're actually happy with.

I imagine they'll never say "you again" again. Stay calm and friendly, but be frank.

Not sure if I'm entirely on subject, but i recently bought a new casting of trazyn for the necron army and when i was cutting the pieces out stuff just started breaking off. his staff broke while it was still on the sprue, and when i looked at it, it was hollow all the way thru.

TAKE PICTURES!

LunaHound wrote:
Help me think of a line to respond when the CS says " you again " or something similar -_-

Just cheerily say 'yup', and get on with the call in a friendly and concise manner. All CS departments follow protocols of some sort, and the guy you're talking to is not likely to actually have much decision making power. Just tell them what the problems are, tell them you're still waiting on good parts x, y an z. Don't lose your cool, as being rude to the guy on the phone just makes them not *want* to help you. Also, it's not their fault, personally.

LunaHound wrote:
Help me think of a line to respond when the CS says " you again " or something similar -_-

That fact that you are calling again means they ****ed up again.

Point out that fact and let them come up with a clever retort.

Welp, I went against my better judgement and purchased two big meks finecast and of COURSE they were TOTALLY not worth the money spent. Half the left side of the body was missing holes in the backpack...sigh...Best part and the part that made me truly angry? His cables weren't long enough to reach the backpack area to look like they were actually connected....thank you again GW -.- so now I'm 0 for 4 on finecrapst.

I'm beginning to wonder what CS turnover is looking like after the last year. In an already high turnover job I imagine it is even worse.

Not to mention having to clean up after all the suicides.

Gharron wrote:Welp, I went against my better judgement and purchased two big meks finecast and of COURSE they were TOTALLY not worth the money spent. Half the left side of the body was missing holes in the backpack...sigh...Best part and the part that made me truly angry? His cables weren't long enough to reach the backpack area to look like they were actually connected....thank you again GW -.- so now I'm 0 for 4 on finecrapst.

Actually, the cables on the big mek KFF (from his arm to his back) are a little short on the metal version too (ie this is a sculpt issue, not a casting one). They need a little spacer adding - cut short pieces of a q-tip stick do quite well. The same is often true for Devastator Marines (metal).

winterdyne wrote:Actually no. For every replacement they have to arrange it costs money. 5 minutes on the phone for a CS agent (About £0.60), shipping each replacement out UPS (presumably cheaper than Royal Mail, still going to be £0.50+). The casting of each replacement, picking, packing... All those costs hit GW where it hurts (and where the shareholders / board must eventually pay attention) - the bottom line.

So yes, it's not good. Yes, your chance of getting a perfect (or indeed 'good') cast first time is pretty slim. But you can have an impact by going through the mill a few times - you might get a decent model. You might not.. When you get bored, get a refund. For me, my birthday treat (February) is a nice 25th Anniversary Marine. I'm going to keep going until I get one, and I really don't care how many it takes. I'm also, gleefully enough, doing it quite publicly.

Speaking of this, I was quite clear to the CS guy I spoke to this afternoon (who's chasing up Brother Replacement Number 6) - 'This is for a GD piece. It's got to be good. NO BUBBLES on detail-critical areas, or anywhere where the fix will screw up a blend. [I listed the common problems].' 'Yeah, I can understand that, I'll sort one out for you'. Heh. Wonder how long this will take?

I still want to know who you're speaking to. Seriously.

Just the amount of times the problems have come and been exactly the same thing - to the point where the 'hand checked' ones were as bad as the first ones!