Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hi
As I was drinking my coffee this morning while reading DakkaDakka (beats any newspaper ) I started to wonder what kind of influence forums like DakkaDakka and Warseer has on the manufacturers. A lot of people are annoyed with GW for instance and writing a lot about it here. Do you think/know that they are reading? Do we have any example of where they have directly referenced DakkaDakka or any suggestion being stolen / implemented that we know originated here?

I ask this because I am a regular at a forum here in Sweden that seems to generate newspaper-articles. Whenever a story is written about there it takes about 3 hours and then it is on the newspaper websites.

So: Is GW/Privateer Press/etc listening?

/Grindah

They certainly listen to Yakface when it comes to FAQs, he's been credited in all the new ones.

I think dakkadakka is a voice for a certain sort of standard. I think Warseer is just noise to dakka's pay per view.

Thing is, if it wasn't dakka it would Citadel Journal or something else. There is money in the tournaments.

I don't think that answered your question but that's my answer.

We see GW people posting here not infrequently, particularly the events staff (who are awesome).

GW staff of varying sceniority post here and on Warseer and on other forums (such as TLA) from time to time. How seriously they take the points raised? Who knows? They certainly used to studiously ignore their own forums in the old days. I think they are a little more savvy now and recognise that forums are one branch of public opinion, if not particularly a well-behaved or scientific one.

As for PP, they regularly post on their own forums, so probably tend to pay less attention to others. Same goes for Rackham.

Sometimes I wonder if those in power look at the rantings and ravings of Dakka and do just the opposite of what is being bitched about..

It's just a gut feeling.

Gav Thorpe posts on the warhammer uk forum.

Gav posts every now and then on Warseer, too. Gary Morley (who like Gav is no longer with GW) posted there recently also. It was interesting to hear what the real story was behind that Nagash model.

Low population internet forums have far larger an impact on the community then they do the manufacturers. And even that impact is pretty damn miniscule.

Mostly we just cause ruckus at their events *nodnod*.

gorgon wrote:It was interesting to hear what the real story was behind that Nagash model.

He was told they were doing "Warhammer Armies: Clown Kingdoms" rather than Undead?

No seriously, what was the story?

BYE

From what I've been told, his original was judged just a little too scary.

And he has said in public (well, White Dwarf) a few times he was never that pleased with the released one.

Osbad wrote:They certainly used to studiously ignore their own forums in the old days.

Everybody ignored THAT forum...

A few years back, one of the GW staff referred to Dakka as a sharkpit. And Paul Sawyer got offended by Penguindude and left. So yeah you could say we have an influence of a sort.

they had a pretty good unofficial Space Marine FAQ on the old GW site at one point. Techmarine Servo Harness Plasma Pistols count as an additional close combat weapon, if I remember.

Actually on the old GW forums Andy C flamed me for my comments regarding their supposed non-plans for a sisters codex.

Apparently, I was wrong because I didn't know what they were planning in secret

H.B.M.C. wrote:

gorgon wrote:It was interesting to hear what the real story was behind that Nagash model.

He was told they were doing "Warhammer Armies: Clown Kingdoms" rather than Undead?

No seriously, what was the story?

I think you can find the whole story in the introductions section there.

But the Reader's Digest version is that the head isn't the head he originally sculpted. The original head was more zombie-like and fit the body better. After he showed it around, meddlers got involved and said they wanted more of a skull head because it fit the look of the line better. So he sculpted up the clowny skull head in like a day, thinking there's no way they'll choose it over the original.

The joke backfired when he was told they liked the skull head and greenlit it for production. Which shocked him. And yeah, he said he swore he'd redo that model before he left. Which he didn't, but he also said he's going to sculpt a new "Nagash" on his own and offer it through his Web site, IIRC.

So he pretty much hates the Nagash model as much as or more than we do.

Edit: As a creative professional, I can feel for the guy. It sucks when someone meddles too much and completely screws up something you created, yet your name stays attached to it as "your" work. Meanwhile, you just want to stick your head in the sand and hope everyone forgets about it soon...

M_Stress wrote:

Osbad wrote:They certainly used to studiously ignore their own forums in the old days.

Everybody ignored THAT forum...

There's a reason why people referred to it as 'the eye of terror.' I used to enjoy the community on Warseer (back in it's Portent days) but it seems like in the major swell it got after the GW forums were shut down changed the atmosphere to something much less conducive to me.

Well I've heard my old 'Space marine preview' sigs were pirated in a quite a few forums and even translated to Spanish.



Mama would be proud.

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Dakka and Warseer like most forums are 90% crap and 10% gold. It is all about how much you want to muck around to find the nuggets you want/need. I would hesitate to offer my first opinion of Dakka since it was so intensely negative as to not deserve utterance. Forums are great ways to find out about sneak peeks and early rumors but beyond that what they provide to me most of all is entertainment.

Here at dakka we like to think of ourselves as maintaining at least 11% quality. Can't speak for Warseer.

I think the web in general and sites like Dakka have been a boon to companies that are looking for feedback on game and miniatures design. Not only GW (which has a mixed history in that regard--though it's been improving, especially, as mentioned before, with the events staff) but many of the smaller-to-medium sized companies post, if not here, than at The Miniatures Page, Lead Adventurers' Forum, The Frothzones, and Tabletop Gaming News, actively soliciting feedback (I'm thinking of Rattrap Productions, Bob Murch, The Perrys, Hasslefree [which has its own forum shared with Heresy]) etc. For better or worse, designers have a much better ear to the ground and enthusiasts have a plethora of choices and access that they never had before the intrawebs.

The problem with forums is you do not know how well the members match a balanced sample of the population you want to study.

For example, there are some members on Dakka who make an awful lot of posts. That could be because they have a lot to say or because they like the sound of their own typing. They do not necessarily represent a majority opinion.

On the other hand, it's much cheaper to read forums than organise a proper survey with structured questions that could produce quantitative results.

Crimson Devil wrote:A few years back, one of the GW staff referred to Dakka as a sharkpit. And Paul Sawyer got offended by Penguindude and left. So yeah you could say we have an influence of a sort.

What did Penguindude say to offend him?
Seems like we have a story worth telling there =)

/Grindah

Crimson Devil wrote:A few years back, one of the GW staff referred to Dakka as a sharkpit. And Paul Sawyer got offended by Penguindude and left. So yeah you could say we have an influence of a sort.

If my memory isnt playing tricks on me, wasnt it called snake pit? ssssssss

Well I think companies in general read random parts of forums and ignore most of it... Ussually minis companies think they know everything... and they have a vision thats why most end up in tight spots.

@ Grindah:

Peguindude explains it here:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/60/175561.page#178714

@ NAVARRO:

No I'm pretty certain it was sharkpit.

Well I do have to say i've seen Dakka become alot more hostile and negative in recent years-
Then again I've seen this over much of the internet- people see the anoynmity as a means to let them get abit carried away with over the top negativity, outlandish claims, inflated egos and horrible spelling.

heck easiest way to see this is the number of views/posts on the negative view of GW staff vs the "good staff" thread- its much easier to bash than praise.

Take a new model.
10% hate it, 10% love it, 80% think its ok and usable.
The 10% will cry out they hate it, maybe one or two of the love its will speak out... and get batted down by the vocal haters and erm...well the 80% may sneak a word in but they are abit lost

Bignutter wrote:Well I do have to say i've seen Dakka become alot more hostile and negative in recent years-
Then again I've seen this over much of the internet- people see the anoynmity as a means to let them get abit carried away with over the top negativity, outlandish claims, inflated egos and horrible spelling.

Did somebody say horrible spelling?

The main GW people pay no attention to the web, To many people with to many varied views, its enuff to make a guy go crazy

It's been this nasty before. The negativity comes and goes in cycles, and we're much bigger than we've ever been before. Plus all of us old guard are more bitter and cynical too! All the little stuff seems to add up, but I still think we've got a pretty good thing going here.