Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So, while browsing through the forums, I came upon a guy mentioning the movie Team America. Now, he did this in a way that was mildly baffling to me, see, he described it as a "very american movie" in an attempt to point out that another user had been quite a dick to the op.

Now... this incited some mixed feelings for me. On the one hand, if that movie is what people outside of America view as "american movies" then I personally am embarassed for my country... On the other hand though, I felt partially responsible to be defensive about it. Now, I lack an outside perspective to the US. I view it as my home, so it is hard to take the anthropological perspective and view the US as an outsider. I mean, everyone has their conceived stereotypes, but I am actually curious...

How would you guys describe your view of the "stereotype" of the USA?

Now let's keep this civil. Brutal honesty is good, but it's a fine line away from just starting a flame war, and that's the exact opposite of what I want this to turn out to be.

I always hear Americans described as "awesome", "super-cool", "Freedom Fries", "the awesomest", and "very very awesome", and I think that follows your Team America: World Police assessment, as that was a very awesome movie.

Fat and stupid. I deal with it a lot at my work.

I think that and the 'World-Police' stereotype is accurate to what others see us as, and to be honest it's true. America was/is(your pick) trying to police the world.

I think others world view of us might be changing though, with Barack at the helm. No matter how much people in this country baw their eyes out about him he is doing a good job of making us look intelligent for picking him as our leader. The leader of any nation is usually to blame for the current world view of their populace based on their attitude and actions. At least that's how it works in developed countries.

Never seen team america. Nothing in the world would convince me to sit through a movie full of wooden marionettes. Except possibly lightsabers Hahaha!!!

Hahaha, I would suggest never watching it, personally. It's a mildly amusing satire on the world's view of America, while trying to remain funny using horrible low-brow humor that really just isn't funny... it goes for the gross-out and mass profanity appeal...

I watched that movie for 30 minutes. 30 minutes I will never get back.

I have memories of American students at a college here in Australia drunkenly singing the "America, feth Yeah" song. Ugh.

Comin' again to save melon-fething day yeah!



:EDIT: Melon-Fething? Awesome word-filter!

:EDIT2: I mean, Awesomest word-filter!

I see americans as a largely diverse population with many opinions, ideas, and traits. Unfortunately I also see them as stupid, poorly educated, and intentionally ignorant.

Arrogance is the crime of americans.



As for team america its a hilarious movie. A hilarious comedy movie with puppets. If you take any sort of political ideology from it or find any sort of commonality in its characters and the ideas presented you should be shot to death.

When i see Americans, i see 2 types.

1 that does resemble the one in team america movie

and the others that makes decisions through logic and reason.

Although it doesnt exactly help when the 2nd type doesnt think the first type exists.

The one down side to America being the World Police, apparently we'll be pepper spraying all the other countries.

LOL!

ShumaGorath wrote:Arrogance is the crime of americans.

This is what I hear the most often. The second most often would be that they like Americans but dislike our what our government does. I think the latter often is what can create hostility/dislike.

Team America wasn’t making any reference to the US as a whole. The writers were saying action movies are dumb but also awesome, while also making fun of everyone involved in the political debate in the lead up to Iraq. Mostly though, it was crude silly humour and very, very funny.


In terms of the US, it’s hard to describe the stereotype because there are so many. There are probably a dozen or more stereotypes for New York city alone. In terms of the Americans I’ve met, I’ve found them to be some of the friendliest and hospitable. They’re also the most, I don’t know, forthright, I guess… the least likely to use sarcasm or irony, the most likely to state an opinion plainly.

There are odd cultural ideas that seem unique to Americans. The gun and abortion fixations (for or against, the rest of have our levels of control and we’ve moved on to bigger issues). There are also a lot of weird ideas Americans have because you generally don’t know that much about the rest of us (not understanding many other countries have as much immigration as you lot, not understanding socialised medical care. The idea of independence or self-reliance also has a lot more track in the US than elsewhere (the small amount of relevance libertarianism has, it only has in the US because the rest of more or less understand the idea of society).

That’s based on meeting a few dozen of you, and properly getting to know a half dozen.

sebster wrote:There are also a lot of weird ideas Americans have because you generally don’t know that much about the rest of us

Add thinking we don't know much about anything outside the US to the list of stereotypes.

Ahtman wrote:Add thinking we don't know much about anything outside the US to the list of stereotypes.

Not knowing a lot about the world isn't really a stereotype because it doesn't define a person. If it was extended to overall ignorance it would be a stereotype, but then it would also be, in my opinion, wrong, because Americans tend to be pretty well informed about things. Or at least no more stupid than the rest of us.

But when it comes to the world knowing about the US compared to the US knowing about the world, the difference is considerable. Most folk could name a dozen cities in the US without thinking about it, could most Americans do the same with Europe? Most folk could give a brief rundown of the history of the US, at least give the basic narrative. I think a much smaller number of US citizens would be capable doing the same for another country. I've had few instances lately, I think one was on this board, where Americans have talked about their own country as one of immigration, and I've then seen them suffer strong cases of cognitive dissonance when I tried to explain that US immigration is on par with immigration to other developed nations. Most folk have a general understanding of the US style of government, the role of the president and of congress. There are a lot of Americans who are very, very confused about the workings of, say, the EU or even just the Westminster system.

The idea that we know more about you than you do about us isn't some value judgement, it's just the basic result of so much of the world's media being created in the US. We watch your TV shows, watch your movies, read your books.

Meanwhile, odd that you run right past all the positive things I had to say about Americans, and picked out the negative observation.

Just out of curiosity Seb, have you ever laughed or do you just wait for obviously light remarks to be made so you can jump in and point out the obvious while missing the point all together?

sebster wrote:Not knowing a lot about the world isn't really a stereotype because it doesn't define a person.

Sure it can be. If a persons first thought when meeting an American (or any country) is "oh those people don't know anything outside their country", then they are stereotyping. If you meet someone from another country and you automatically assmue they know nothing about yours you are stereotyping them. Get to know them, then proceed to call them an idiot.

sebster wrote:Meanwhile, odd that you run right past all the positive things I had to say about Americans, and picked out the negative observation.

Well I think it's odd that somewhere you lost the ability to tell a lighthearted joke from SERIOUS INTERNET BUSINESS.

Ahtman wrote:Just out of curiosity Seb, have you ever laughed or do you just wait for obviously light remarks to be made so you can jump in and point out the obvious while missing the point all together?

It's really hard to tell on the internet. I spent a lot of my early time on the internet congratulating people on dry humour, only to find out they were deadly serious. Part of it is that its a text based medium, and doesn't have the tone and pitch of verbal communication, or the body language. Part of it is that the reader doesn't know the writer, I've read a few of your posts, but obviously not enough to know if you were making a joke or not.

Sorry for missing the joke.

Sure it can be. If a persons first thought when meeting an American (or any country) is "oh those people don't know anything outside their country", then they are stereotyping. If you meet someone from another country and you automatically assmue they know nothing about yours you are stereotyping them. Get to know them, then proceed to call them an idiot.

Fair point.

Hyper competitive.
+ Successful, positive, not a drag
- lacking empathy, bullying, antagonistic, awkward, superficial

So a bit like Team America.
People are all different though of course.

Though that sounds negative; so I admit English people are equally crappy, just in a different manner

The mean ones i have encountered are like:

-You are with us, or against us.
-Doesnt matter what you like.
-Why we do it? "cuz we can" simple as that.
-There is nothing that cant be solved with force.
-Doesnt matter who attacked first, or why. If we
get hurt, we'll hurt them back 1000x worse no questions
asked.
-Let god sort them out later.

I have american friends that agrees with it , so im pretty aware not ALL americans behave the same way i listed.

I also realize this applies to many different type of people, different countries too.
But the one main thing is , US have the weapons to back it up .

Lets see, the stereotypical american: Arogant, fat, stupid, self righteous, fake, trigger happy. Generally formed by your image in the media and by your political actions. As always though, a stereotype is a stereotype.

Being from the midwest, the two stereotypes I am most familiar with are the poor redneck who is for the most part open and forthright about his racism and the upper middle class redneck who is equally racist but prefers not to discuss it openly and if confronted stammers and backpedals a lot.

Ah another stereotype created from an odd movie, I don't think that TA can truly represent Americans, it's just a movie that was created from a bunch of guys screwing around.
You can have a stereotypical view of a certain race but there is always the majority that is completely different to that and unique in their own way.

In fact looking deeply down at it, we're all the same to each other.

Hahah shame i Loved team america!
and i don't know how everyone views you guys as a whole but the only thing i have ever heard said are that your suposed to be dim witted and very superficial but i know thats not true, how could it be? you cant base a country on a couple of people.

and remember "Freedom isn't freeeee!" sorry i couldnt help it.

Team America was okay, if you like the South Park style humor. The Pearl Harbour sucks song was golden

As for American stereotypes. I'm with David Bowie & NIN with this one

Orkeosaurus wrote:The one down side to America being the World Police, apparently we'll be pepper spraying all the other countries.

Except for Southeast Asia and Latin America. They would take our pepper spray and use it to season baby milk to give it a slight kick.

Javenero peppers. Nature's way of saying I AM GOING TO feth YOU UP NOW.
http://blog.hotpepper.ca/archives/2005/08/hot-peppers/

-There is nothing that cant be solved with force.

EDITED for spelling-this time change is kicking my teeth in.

There was a marvelous quote in Steven Fry (who is rather ironically a perfect English stereotyoe, but in the most lovely way) 's documentary series in which he visits each of the states (well worth watching if you get the chance, it's really well put together, it's like getting a nice warm hug for your brain off the telly).

"Anything you say about America or Americans is true."

I wholeheartedly believe that. Americans as a people are rude and friendly, racist and tolerant, ignorant and bafflingly clever etc etc. ad infinitum.

There are too many different USAs to give any stereotype to be honest.

A whole bunch of adjectives are associated with Americans:

Positive -- Self-reliant
Generous
Helpful
Polite
Friendly
Open
Outspoken
Can-do attitude
Energetic
Respect the law
Fair

Negative --

Selfish
Loud
Brash
Arrogant
Aggressive
Legalistic
Parochial
Over-confident
Ungrateful

etc.

Everything is true, same as it would be of any nation.

The point is that the eight years of the Bush administration lead to the world's image of the USA becoming slanted towards the negatives.

I am an expat, working with expats from a huge number of other nations. I don't hear much spontaneous offering of opinions regarding Americans, and I don't ask much since it just doesn't cross my mind to do so. Some people go on rants about how they can't stand Americans, but they are mostly just donkey-caves being donkey-caves who cannot seem to see that they treat everyone like gak and everyone detests them for it.

I get along with the vast majority of people out here. Few give me problems, and I try not to give problems to anyone. Really, people just seem to look most at whether or not you are making their lives harder by how you do your job.

Now, please don't feel I'm being overly negative here, but I would like to make a comparisson....

Europe is of course, ever so slightly older than the USA. And I feel that this shows in the various attitudes.

European countries are more like middle aged folks. Bit more balanced in most views, definitely stuck in their ways in others, but overall fairly mature in their dealings with the wider world.

The USA however, is closer to someone not long out their Teens. They have discovered the World isn't a terribly nice place, and whilst trying to figure out their own way, make silly mistakes which are all too easily judged as immature, rather than due to a lack of experience (there IS a difference!)

Also, the USA can be fairly schizophrenic, down entirely to which party is in power. The GOP are generally regarded as a bunch of Spear Rattling Bullies. Now sometimes, this approach is of course appropriate, but often the GOP are felt to take things far too far. Ref George W Bush and his 'with us or against us' speech, and his rather childish 'Axis of Evil' which suggested, completely incorrectly, that Al Qaeda, The Taleban, North Korea, Iran etc were all in it together. Which they aren't. Iran actually regards The Taleban and Al Qaeda as enemies. Indeed, Iran was actually instrumental in bringing their Afghan Allies, the Northern Alliance, into the fold, accounting for much early success in Afghanistan. They may not have rolled up their sleeves and pitched in, but they opened the route for dialogue to get at least some Afghans on side...

Then we have the Democrats, who have a softer approach. They appear more willing to talk to their enemies, using Military Action as a persuasion technique. After all, the US Military is a very powerful entity, and nobody really wants to pick that sort of fight if they can possibly get away with it.

Now please remember, this is a view garnered purely through the media, and I do not pretend for a second that it is terribly accurate, and it is of course really rather sweeping.

However, the USA does seem to have a more positive public image when the Democrats are running the show, than when the GOP are. Of course, each administration faces it's own challenges. Had Bush lost the original election, and 9/11 happened with Gore as President, I don't think the response would have been any different. Iraq might not have happened, but Afghanistan most certainly would have.