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Thank goodness for some nice tangible news about IG.

I was looking at other recent releases, and it seems that there are two weeks of releases per wave, with the second week being a smaller batch. If this is the 'may 2nd' release, then there is probably a may 16th release with less stuff in it.

Given what we know or are pretty sure of, what is coming out in the next week's releases?

I keep hearing a recut leman russ. But I don't remember ever seeing any kind of confirmation on this.

How about that commissar lord we saw a while back?

A new special character?

Another 5/6 model metal box like ratlings?

Any other plastic kits that were rumored? Are we forgetting about something? I seem to recall that the stormtroopers in plastic weren't going to make it into this wave. Something else? Maybe the hellhound/griffon?




As far as all that is rumored. I'm way more interested in rules rumors, because like 90% of active guard players, I'm neck deep in the models i need to play.

ratlings. I bet they'll look cool. I'm really hoping both abhuman units will be competitive. I could have given or taken both ratlings and ogryns, but since they are choosing to stay with both units, I'm hoping we can see them be really useful. I'm sure we will.

new plastic command squads. I'm happy for the plastic guard players. I've got enough vostroyan command squads to not be jealous.

repackaged infantry squads. could be 8 and a weapons team... but also realize that it could be 10 with a special weapon only. Until we get a confirmation on what's in it, we won't have any insight into the squad structure. If I recall there were 5 guardsmen to sprue, so a non-recut repackage would be 10 foot guardsmen. A simple recut could change that... but that would count against our 'new plastics'

primaris psyker. I've only been playing for 7 years. But by the reaction this guy's name is getting, he was some kind of bad-ass. I'd love a fear inducing, complaint inspiring, power character. Maybe this is one.

Valkyrie... sure, I'm on board. Its a smart way to balance guard and make them competitive without going to the insane shoot you off the table power level. Not really 'in character' but, guard looks to be getting a little modernization. I'm not a reactionary, so I'll adapt.

Sentinels. What was that rumor about support sentinels? Maybe that is a wave 2 thing. At this price point I'm guessing we get the 4 guns, a chainsaw, a catachan driver and hopefully a resculpted cadian driver, that'd be worth using some of our 'new plastic allotment'. Even though i wouldn't use it. Throw a closed top in there too.


Those release schedule came just in time. I thought I was going to go a little crazy without any confirmed rumors. GW needs to loosen the reins on the rumor mill a little bit. I'd kill for a test codex

I've always seen Guard in 40k as the elite, Gaunts ghosts type engagement. There aren't enough to be the normal, regiment sized battles we read about. For this reason, having things like Valkyries makes sense as they would be available to a small strike team like force.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

Ozymandias wrote:I've always seen Guard in 40k as the elite, Gaunts ghosts type engagement. There aren't enough to be the normal, regiment sized battles we read about. For this reason, having things like Valkyries makes sense as they would be available to a small strike team like force.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

And GW is clearly seeing them the same way.

It's a heroic 28mm scale game, with every model being 10 feet tall. There is little to no realism to speak of. So, sure, lets just have the guard army be a group of supermen too. Just with a lower armor save...

I'm not being sarcastic... I'm kind of excited to see them demand some respect, instead of just being faceless fodder.

But I do lament the more fatalistic, 'dig a hole and die in it' WWI esque feel. It made guard a bit different from everything else.

You just can't balance a table top game with a pure gunline. Its either all shooting phase, with one guy bitterly scooping up handfuls of models, or it is the assault phase vacuum cleaner, that tables the gunline after their unsuccessful bid to eradicate the other army.

Lets see some rules GW!

Well we either need to be beefed up in terms of what our models do, representing elite hit units, or need to have a HUGE Point drop across the board for our subpar stats and truly show everyone what a Horde army is. 4pt Guardsmen...tops. 4 points if we are going horde......TOPS I SAY!!!

@Shep: GW knows there's a *ton* of interest in Guard - that's why the keep stoking the fires, bit by bit, month after month.

I'd say we're about 2 months away from the Codex leaks hitting the ground, and can't wait to see them.


I don't know what's in the rest of Wave 1, but assume that plastic Storms will be in it to go with the Valk. Along with yet another redone Commissar. Or two.


I don't hugely care about the rest, as I'm just mired in Guard as it is (see my IG project in the P&M Blog). The announced Codex, Valk, and Sentinels will be just fine for me this year, and I'd hate to blow my entire annual hobby budget on IG...

Primaris Psyker used to be badass, but he got nerfed hugely down to the current crappy Sanctioned Psyker. Right now, if you want a "proper" Primaris Psyker, you're better taking an Elite WH / DH Inquisitor "counts as". I'm hoping the Codex gives us something essentially similar.

I think the FW Valk is a bit large, so the plastic one could stand to be ensmallened by 5-10% for play purposes. It'd still be cool.

Per your question on Sentinels, I'm expecting closed top to be an option, along with Multi-Laser, Heavy Flamer, Lascannon, and Autocannon. That would leave Multi-Melta, Plasma Cannon, (classic) Assault Cannon, and Rocket Pod as the alternate "support" sprue, probably with Grav Chute.

Recut Leman Russ wouldn't hold any interest for me, as the design is horrible and needs to be redone in toto. A big, bulky, Land-Raider-sized Russ would be interesting, and I might actually buy some. I'm hoping that this and the Hellhound are Wave 2, along with the Griffon. That makes for a well-themed "Armored Company" Wave 2.

livingregret wrote: Well we either need to be beefed up in terms of what our models do, representing elite hit units, or need to have a HUGE Point drop across the board for our subpar stats and truly show everyone what a Horde army is. 4pt Guardsmen...tops. 4 points if we are going horde......TOPS I SAY!!!

i think we are a lot more likely to see an emphasis on elites and heavy support.

Troops seem to be universally designed as "we don't die easily" objective scorers these days. There are more aggressive troops being designed, and people tend to use them as mini-elites to try and get massacres on capture and control missions, but mostly, they are just stationary, survivable units.

I'm willing to bet competitive guard armies will have a focus on either stormtroopers/valkyries, abhuman spam, or leman russ spam. With troop platoons and armored fist squads having the honor of "don't die and stand here please". Guard are going to be elite... Just like Ozy is saying.

Shep wrote:
Troops seem to be universally designed as "we don't die easily" objective scorers these days. There are more aggressive troops being designed, and people tend to use them as mini-elites to try and get massacres on capture and control missions, but mostly, they are just stationary, survivable units.

I'm willing to bet competitive guard armies will have a focus on either stormtroopers/valkyries, abhuman spam, or leman russ spam. With troop platoons and armored fist squads having the honor of "don't die and stand here please". Guard are going to be elite... Just like Ozy is saying.

I agree, we will not be going the Horde route. We will be forced to rely on our Elites/Heavy choices to win our games. One of the problem facing guard is quite simple....we do die easily. To everything. As much as many of my local Marine players lament there bolters they seem to forget that it ignores a lot of basic troops armour saves. We get cut down very easily and are forced to rely on cover saves(5th ed)from screening ourselves to have a chance to live against anything stronger than a slight breeze. I would hope that we can be a viable army w/ out relying on something as annoying as Leman Russ spam but who knows. W/ out a radical point drop on Infantry squads we will have to rely on our non troops to win us

Before we all start waving any white flags, let's see what the Codex actually does...

Based on recent codexes, there will be 1-2 power spam builds and a bunch of 'gee, that's nice, but too many points' with troops that aren't real killy, but can be big or survivable (sometimes, both).

What are the power spam builds from the space marine book. I have yet to see a single power build at all from the book that is anything more than a flash in the pan idea that fails to win tournament games then disappears.

Cadian sprues will need to be completely recut if our geniuses are correct in assuming that a heavy weapon team will be in it as well. Currently each Cadian sprue holds enough parts for five men. Catachans same thing if I remember correctly, though it has been over a decade since I last messed around with one of those kits.

One thing that does sort of surprise me is the lack of special characters for this initial release. I would expect at least one or two named characters to be included with the first release of the codex. Maybe next year then.

cadian sprue holds 4 cadians, not 5. 2 of those, and a heavy weapon sprue gets you your 10 man unit.

Five.

ShumaGorath wrote:What are the power spam builds from the space marine book.

I'm guessing it's supposed to be 10-man Tactical Squads with Transport? There doesn't seem to be anything else that's competitive in there...

Since the current sprues hold five basic cadians, what would be nice is to keep two of those and toss a HW sprue in as well. That way, if we want a HW team in the squad we can have one, if we don't, we've got ten men in the box. It works well for GW as they don't need to recut anything. Winners all round!

I doubt that'll be how they do it, though. Why let people buy one box when you can have them buy two? Even if it costs them more in the short term to recut the sprues, they'll more than make it back over the next few years.

Like I mentioned before, we don't even know if infantry squads will have heavy weapons options. There is nothing that proves or disproves that infantry squads will remain "tactical squad clones"

Here are the options.

1. the new box is a repackage. It comes with 10 guardsmen with an option for a grenade launcher, flamer, vox-caster, and sergeant arms

2. the new box is a recut. The infantry squad follows the same options as before, and we get 8 guardsmen with an option for a grenade launcher, flamer, vox-caster, and sargeant arms plus the two small frames for a single heavy weapon team.

3. the new box is a recut. It includes options for the new infantry squad, options that are new and different.


If option 1. it is quite possible that heavy weapons won't be available to infantry squads.

If option 3. Maybe infantry squads will move to a 'double special weapon' rig.

I'd probably put my money down on option 2. But I wouldn't bet a lot. Unlike space marines that have pages and pages of background describing the weapons fit of tactical, devastator, assault and terminator units, IG isn't hampered by so much detail.

If they split their heavy weapons and their special weapons into support units and infantry units, it doesn't invalidate the gaunts ghost series or any of the Imperial Infantryman's primers.

Its highly unlikely that the command squad is going to include a heavy weapons team. Which, if you follow their packaging pattern lately, is likely to mean that command squads aren't going to have heavy weapons options... (they generally aren't putting options for units in the rulebook if they can't fit the option into the plastic kit.) then the idea of a support unit, consisting of 3 heavy weapons teams, becomes a lot more plausible.

Now I'm just delving into deep speculation. I would like to see the 'imitation tactical squad' format go away for guard. infantry squads aren't tactical or self sufficient, they should use outside support for firepower. the platoon itself should emulate the tactical squad, but should be split by squads based on their role.

How about you guys? Do you like one heavy one special? Or would you rather move to a 2 special format?

Well, Guard is known for the inflexible structure of its platoons and units. Plus that turd Guilleman wrote a thing or two on how the Imperial Army should go to war.

I expect that the new 10-man Cadian / Catachan boxes will be new sprues reshuffling already-designed parts around:
- 10 legs & torsos
- 12 heads (1 shouting Sergeant)
- 10 pairs Lasgun arms
- LP&CCW arms
- Flamer, Melta, Plasma, GL bitz (various configs)
- ML & loader bitz and arms
- Vox bitz
- pouches & other bitz

This should all fit on a single full-sized sprue, breaking to fit 1 per squad box.

I think they should get assault cannons and the closed top upgrade reduced to 5 points.

Twin Linked Assault Cannons on a Sentinal would look really freaking cool methinks. Like one on each side. That would totally kick ass.

Screw Assault Cannons, that donkey cannon is way overpriced now (read: SM codex).

Give me Sentinels with Multimeltas and PlasmaCannnos

And give me 20 point Sentinels with multilasers

I would like to see them do other things, like being able to site a target, letting an ordnance barrage reroll the scatter dice, stuff like that.

Guard have plenty of things that shoot, some units that alter tactics would be appreciated at least by me.

That said though, it would be cool to have the rocket pod sentinals similar to what forge world did, where they can fire indirectly.

Ya know, 2 special weapons a squad would be cool, as long as stubbers are allowed.

10 man box set for a squad. That kinda scares me. What if the solution to platoon killpoint problems is one squad per FOC slot... They can't... can they?

An army based on the platoon, rather than the Company?... naw... /gulp

<Cold sweat while the terror passes>

@Reckless - I could deal with it, as long as Tanks were Squadronable...

Platoons will stay for obvious reasons.

A recut of the current Cadian and Catachan sprues might not be such a bad idea, they did the same with the Ork Boy sprues and look at how well those turned out. A recut infantry squad sprue might yield more bits, more variety in heads, the addition of dare I say the plasma gun and meltagun, maybe some kneeling legs as a standard.

Here's hoping they fix those crappy Catachan arms while they're at it.

Recklessfable wrote:10 man box set for a squad. That kinda scares me. What if the solution to platoon killpoint problems is one squad per FOC slot... They can't... can they?

I almost wish they would. At the moment, my minimum Troops allotment costs ca. 400 points, which is a lot of points to pay for useless footslogging infantry with inaccurate heavy weapons

Heavy weapons have been the bread and butter of IG since their 1st published army list in RT. I'll eat 2 dishes of crow if GW changes that with the next codex.

Oh come on now ladies! You might as well assume that the Reds will be parachuting into your back yard this very moment.

BrookM wrote:Oh come on now ladies! You might as well assume that the Reds will be parachuting into your back yard this very moment.

Crap! I gotta get home!


Really though, I would rather like to see guard get a 2 special/ 1 special + 1 heavy option. Sort of like SoB Celestians, only instead of the full range of heavy weapons, they could have access to the less specialized types, like ML, HB, HStubber and the like. If you could then add a "heavy weapons squad" to your platoons that then had 3 teams with HB, LC, AC and that sort of stuff, that could be really cool.

I think that would make it easier to fit certain squads to a certain purpose, instead of being a little bit of everything like Marines.