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Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:

Lexx wrote:Hormgaunts are one of the only other tyranids able to reproduce. At least once it seems. In the tyranid codex entry it mentions they lay eggs when they make planet-fall. These mature fast and become a second wave to replace their parents dying in the main attacks. Not sure if its just a one use trick or if those offspring can also do it though.

What about Genestealers then.

Heyyyy...... forgot about them.
Well, as Genestealers are meant to live semi-autonomously, so I'd say it made sense for them to be able to breed.

They are usually the initial wave to weaken defences and start rebellion.

Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:

Lexx wrote:Hormgaunts are one of the only other tyranids able to reproduce. At least once it seems. In the tyranid codex entry it mentions they lay eggs when they make planet-fall. These mature fast and become a second wave to replace their parents dying in the main attacks. Not sure if its just a one use trick or if those offspring can also do it though.

What about Genestealers then.

I think i would agree with Melissia its more of a parasitical relationship than breeding. Interesting on the infected orks spores not being affected though.

Yes but then in the 5th generation the sentient looking genestealers give birth to full genestealers.

Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:Yes but then in the 5th generation the sentient looking genestealers give birth to full genestealers.

This also confuses me. As how would Ork hybrids do this since theyre effectively genderless.

Lexx wrote:

Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:Yes but then in the 5th generation the sentient looking genestealers give birth to full genestealers.

This also confuses me. As how would Ork hybrids do this since theyre effectively genderless.

Uhhhhhh...
MAGIC!

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

Lexx wrote:

Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:Yes but then in the 5th generation the sentient looking genestealers give birth to full genestealers.

This also confuses me. As how would Ork hybrids do this since theyre effectively genderless.

Uhhhhhh...
MAGIC!

"Orks. How do they work!"

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

Lexx wrote:

Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:Yes but then in the 5th generation the sentient looking genestealers give birth to full genestealers.

This also confuses me. As how would Ork hybrids do this since theyre effectively genderless.

Uhhhhhh...
MAGIC!

That's precisely why I blieve that Orks don't really produce full genestealer infestations.

THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS ORKS.










Wait, there actually isn't. Oh well, that puts paid to that particular meme...

Lexx wrote:

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

Lexx wrote:

Blood Raven 5th Company wrote:Yes but then in the 5th generation the sentient looking genestealers give birth to full genestealers.

This also confuses me. As how would Ork hybrids do this since theyre effectively genderless.

Uhhhhhh...
MAGIC!

"Orks. How do they work!"

Hey thats what we have been trying to figure out
Still i think genestealer is more of a mutation so
Ork drops spore.
Spore grows.
Spore opens.
Genestealer pops out.

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:I'm afraid I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. The orks aren't like the Imperium; they are constantly inventing new and dangerous stuff to use on their enemies. Constantly. Orks didn't have gargants until they encountered an Imperial Titan, so their response to it was to build one of their own, only bigger and with more guns. The Deffkopta, too, is a recent orkish invention, as is the Shokk Attack Gun. The orks developed teleportation devices after the Second War for Armageddon, so as to launch lightning assaults on entrenched foes, and what they don't outright invent they just steal from other races. Just ask the T'au (well, you know what I mean) whose weapons have often been looted and used against them, with some suitable "addishuns" for even more firepower.
Orks, a static race? Not on your life.

Read back to one of my earlier posts. The orks as a species have not evolved in millions of years, as a species they are static. Okay, now that's out of the way again.

As far as we know, the Brain Boyz were the ones who invented all of the amazing technology, but, realising they were dieing out, put the knowledge of how to build some of that advanced technology into the Orks, even then only Meks and even then, not all Meks have the ability to reproduce the truly advanced technology that must be buried in their minds somewhere.

On the other hand there is the technology that Orks have produced after encountering other races. Again this isn't really invention is it. Orks saw a Titan, reckoned it was awesome and copied it. Exactly how many millions of years had Orks been around before they encountered their first Titan, that's a long time without even one Ork, not even once imagining the possibility of a Gargant. The same goes for most, maybe even all the other technology Orks utilise, they steal or copy technology invented by other races but at the least they have the inbuilt, instinctual knowledge of how to build a lot of technology that the Brain Boyz invented. Like you say, they have recent 'inventions', technology they have only started to use in the last few thousands of years so what were they doing for all the rest of the time they existed?

I'll go back to my earlier point, Orks don't progress. As an organism they are the same, as a culture they are the same. Certainly they adopt certain technologies developed by other races if it means Orks can go faster or kill better but can that truly be called progress, that's just Orks doing what Orks were bred to do and have been doing since they were created. The Orks that exist in the 41st Millennium are the same as the Orks that have ever existed. Compare them to the Tau; six thousand years ago they were a primitive race, barely more advanced than hunter-gatherers and now they are a space-faring people, with a philosphy and an ideaology, developing and inventing new technologies and incorporating other races into their Empire. Orks a million years ago were doing the sme as Orks are doing in the 41st Millennium, sacking world for plunder and for a laugh, holding some world to ransom but usually burning a city here or there just for the lulz and the boss keeps a few slaves to make himself look more important but basically they are the same, they have gone backwards like a lot of human world (although the Snakebites might wish they would) and they haven't really gone forwards either.

In a way that's the tragedy of the Orks, the actual culture they were created to protect, the true thinkers and inventers don't exist any more, what you have is a Frankenstein's Monster of a race, still rampaging around according to the preset commands they were bred with even though the master is long, long dead. It's almost futile but then the endeavours of the 40K races are futile, that's the point I suppose.

Oh, I see. Okay.
Well, arguably, Orks have had no need as a species to evolve then. Evolution, despite what the 'Nids might tell you, isn't a pick-and-choose process as such; really, it's heavily reliant on the chance that something in an organism's biology might be useful. In this sense, orks have reached the same stage of evolution that sharks have, in a way; both species have changed very little over the millennia from their basic design because there's no real need to. This is especially pronounced in orks, as their biology is so tailor-made towards fighting and surviving that there's no real evolutionary impetus for it to change.

Also, some good points on technology, but even so, it cannot be argued that orks are not constantly inventing things. In rules terms it's hard to show them all, as after all there's only so many pages in a codex, so they get lumped into generic categories. Still, the point remains that things like Shokk Attack Guns are a unique weapon to the ork race (no other race I know of uses this sort of weapon) and the deffkopta, in theory, covers everything from the crude helicopters of the codex to experimental skimmers (that, admittedly, aren't quite as efficient or even safe as those of other races) the Big Meks have built in their spare time.
I'll admit, they aren't the most inventive race in the galaxy, but at the same time, they aren't just another Imperium.

Actually they pretty much ARE the most inventive race in the galaxy.

They just don't have any use for inventions outside of those used for warfare.

Streamlined inventiveness, then? Well, either way, my point still stands. Orks invent stuff constantly, and they are so well adapted to their chosen lifestyles that evolution isn't really necessary.

It's better to say that they just don't give a damn about anything other than war. So they don't really bother for such silly things like safety, comfort, convenience.

Heck, fighta-bommas often don't even have brakes to assist with deceleration, amongst other things we'd normally view as "Standard Equipment". But Ork fighta-bommas still put up a good fight against Imperial aerospace assets.

Well, even crude things like Rokks are feared by the people having to engage them, as despite that crudity they are still excellently adapted for the theatre of war. In many ways, orks are the undisputed masters of wartime construction and mechanics.

Orks reproduce via Fungus spores,wich fall from them when they die,wich grow in almost every type of enviroment,thus is the reason why they are basically everywhere! Which is the reason why they are so resileint to physical damage,b/c they have so much in common w/ fungus and why they are so green b/c they have so much fungai in there blood.

Here is a question (it may have already been answered and i just didn't see):

When greenskins "hatch" or break from there pods at birth, are they full grown orks/grots/snotlings/ect. or are they "Children" and then grow to what we see?

I recall a diagram in an old Codex that showed a fully grown Ork in a kind of sack underground. Pretty sure they grow decently fast and emerge fully grown, with basic knowledge of how to operate weapons and machinery embedded in their memory.

And a basic knowledge of war, combat, and battle.

Orks are born with tactical knowledge and skill that Marines have to strive for centuries to obtain.


Orks hatch as a "yoof", who is slightly smaller than a normal Boy, who is smaller than a Scarboy, who is smaller than a Nob, who is smaller than a Warboss, who is smaller than a Warlord.

Interesting... and ork "yoof"s grow into a predetermined greenskin (grot/boy/nob/ect)?

A "yoof" is merely a statement of size, as they're smaller than the average Boy of their particular region. Basically if they survive their first fight they're probably a regular Boy by then.

A Yoof can become a regular Boy, or any of the Oddboyz. A Nob, however, is most assuredly a veteran, as they've been in tons of fights and have thus grown to a massive size.

Grots are born as grots and die as grots. They're an entirely different subspecies of orkoid, whereas "Yoof" is just an ORk translation for "Youth" (they have problems with th and h sounds becaues off their biology).

Melissia wrote:Orks are born with tactical knowledge and skill that Marines have to strive for centuries to obtain.

You really shouldn't exaggerate like that.


Ork yoofs are roughly equivilant (in ork terms) to a human adolescent; orks basically emerge as teenagers. Whilst they do not possess the skills instantly it only takes a short time for a yoof to develop the facility for speech and an understanding of fairly complex mechanics and automotive processes.

Oddboyz are 'born' oddboyz, but it isn't until they get older that the latent knowledge they contain slowly starts to come to the fore.

Gogsnik wrote:You really shouldn't exaggerate like that.

I'm not.

Orks are born with an instinctive understanding of battlefield tactics. The most direct quote I can think of for this is, surprisingly enough, the Ciaphas Cain series (Caves of Ice).

Orks are also BORN with skill equivalent to WS4.

You'd think they would have caught Kayvan Shrike if that was the case...

Melissia wrote:The most direct quote I can think of for this is, surprisingly enough, the Ciaphas Cain series (Caves of Ice).

Hardly centuries worth of Astartes tactical skill though is it. Besides, I can give you a quote from an actual source book; 'Even with the genetically engineered Adeptus Astartes, it takes almost ten years of intensive therapy and physical alteration to perfect what an Ork knows instinctively!'

With some logical extrapolation, based on the fact that an ork yoof is said to be equivalent to a human adolescent and given that the Astartes recruit from around ten years old or younger, ten years for the recruit places them in their late teens so where a human has to grow up (and be modifed) an ork is 'born' fully grown and already modified. That still makes orks very impressive.

Orks are also BORN with skill equivalent to WS4.

Firstly, the stats from the game aren't really that helpful in determining the in-universe qualities of a given warrior et cetera. Secondly, no they aren't, yoofs start out with a WS of 2.


EDIT: spelling.

-Loki- wrote:You'd think they would have caught Kayvan Shrike if that was the case...

You mean the Raven Guard guy who's had centuries to perfect his tactics? They're not gods, you know!
Besides, you kind of have to have that story attached to a hero, as it doesn't sound anywhere near as impressive as "Kayvan Shrike did well for three months and was then caught and strung up by the greenskins, Emperor rest him."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Melissia wrote: "Yoof" is just an ORk translation for "Youth" (they have problems with th and h sounds becaues off their biology).

Meaning their lips don't work like ours.

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

-Loki- wrote:You'd think they would have caught Kayvan Shrike if that was the case...

You mean the Raven Guard guy who's had centuries to perfect his tactics? They're not gods, you know!
Besides, you kind of have to have that story attached to a hero, as it doesn't sound anywhere near as impressive as "Kayvan Shrike did well for three months and was then caught and strung up by the greenskins, Emperor rest him."

I know. But I mean, a single squad of Space Marines on a planet infested with supposedly tactical equivalents... Orks should have caught them pretty quickly.

-Loki- wrote:I know. But I mean, a single squad of Space Marines on a planet infested with supposedly tactical equivalents... Orks should have caught them pretty quickly.

More pertinently, if Orks were born with the tactical knowledge and skill that Marines have to strive for centuries to obtain then what the hell have the Orks been doing for the last sixty million years? If the Orks were literally that good they would have conquered the entire galaxy long, long ago.

Gogsnik wrote:

-Loki- wrote:I know. But I mean, a single squad of Space Marines on a planet infested with supposedly tactical equivalents... Orks should have caught them pretty quickly.

More pertinently, if Orks were born with the tactical knowledge and skill that Marines have to strive for centuries to obtain then what the hell have the Orks been doing for the last sixty million years? If the Orks were literally that good they would have conquered the entire galaxy long, long ago.

Here is my thought on this: Orks are born to fight, they know battle tactics from their ginetic coding, most just choose not to use them? Though Blood axes have used tactics in fights. Also (this is all speculation from what ive read so far in this forum) Gork and Mork are the strongest gods out there right? And only reason they keep other gods alive is for entertainment? So wouldn't that mean that they would "help" both sides of wars? If the Orks conquere the galaxy, then that would be the end to Gork and Morks fun? So they would do anything they had do to keep fights going? Even helping the enemy?