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Made in de
Cataphract





Rhein Main Gebiet

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Arguably they're worse off from them. And that's due to them getting stuff made in China.

If something GW sells out, I know I can typically get my hands on it in a week or three.

FFG? You're talking months in some cases.


Yeah, it did not take GW too long to do the soft cover print run of the first 3 End Times books for Old Warhammer Fantasy.

"What do you want?"
"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next ten generations that some favors come with too high a price. I'd look up at your lifeless eyes and wave like this. Can you and your associates arrange it for me, Mr. Morden?"
Morden and Vir, In the Shadow of Z'ha'dum 
   
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 StygianBeach wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Arguably they're worse off from them. And that's due to them getting stuff made in China.

If something GW sells out, I know I can typically get my hands on it in a week or three.

FFG? You're talking months in some cases.


Yeah, it did not take GW too long to do the soft cover print run of the first 3 End Times books for Old Warhammer Fantasy.


Or the Shadow War: Armageddon book "reprint" that had the PDF contents added to it.

Unlike the SW:A boxed set, which sold out so quickly a lot of people couldn't even preorder.

It never ends well 
   
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I was thinking about how many canon factions you could get in legion for the Empire vs Rebels era.....

Empire

Stormtroopers
Shoretroopers
Snowtroopers
Sandtroopers
Deathtroopers
Scout Troopers
Special Forces - Inferno squad from the latest Battlefront game.

if they are still canon

Imperial Army troopers
Imperial Navy troopers

Rebels

The security troopers from the consular ship in Episode 4
The Hoth base cold climate troopers
The Commandos in tropical gear
The rebel infantry from Rogue One.

Also the rebels are usually from a multitude of races, so they could milk that for a while.

Others

Mandolorian Clans
Tusken Raiders
Hutt Cartel Mercenaries.

There will probably be more once any more era films are produced, since there are usually units created in every movie.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/11/30 16:54:26


 
   
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ewoks, jawas, wookies, etc..
   
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Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios

They could go the Infinity route where each faction has a bunch of Sub-factions.

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SoCal

Guys name Marvo Jadoona.


Really, there's a lot of them, and they're all sandtroopers for some reason.







Wow, this game needs to find a fresh vein in an autocannibalizing franchise. Better bring in Caravan of Courage's giant to really shake things up.

   
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Longtime Dakkanaut






Those aren't really factions, IMO - just different units in the Empire and Rebel factions.

I suppose having Mon Mothma's Rebels, the Lothal rebels and Saw Gererra's partisans would give you three factions, but only the last of those really makes sense fighting the other two, and even that's a push.

Having Sandtroopers fighting Snowtroopers makes even less sense.
   
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 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Guys name Marvo Jadoona.


Really, there's a lot of them, and they're all sandtroopers for some reason.







Wow, this game needs to find a fresh vein in an autocannibalizing franchise. Better bring in Caravan of Courage's giant to really shake things up.


Slag off the Ewok films again, and I'll cut you!

(Loves those films I do.)

Fed up for Scalpers? Why not join us? 
   
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Sniping Hexa




Luton, UK

I posted this a while ago in the Star Wars/FFG subforum down the page, about how I'd personally do Infinity style subfactions:

 Riquende wrote:
What I'd like to see to combat the idea of limited factions is a series of sub-factions, much as Infinity does sectorials really. You could have limited availability of certain troop types of vehicles depending one which part of the army you were building into. They're long out of date, but I always liked the way the West End Games sourcebooks described the organisation of both the Alliance and the Empire. I think I'd probably go for something like this:

Rebel Alliance

Alliance Sector Command - this would be a 'normal' army, with a spread of unit qualities and decent access to older vehicles etc. What we've seen in the demos, basically
Alliance SpecForce - troops retained directly by Alliance High Command, these guys would be an elite army, with every unit highly statted for its role but not particularly multi-talented. The WEG sourcebook lists unit types as Infiltrators, Marines, Pathfinders, Urban Guerillas, Wilderness Fighters & Heavy Weapon specialists. They would probably have limited vehicle support
Alliance Intelligence Cell - mostly irregular forces with perhaps a small number of commando units as backup. I like the idea of 'civilian protestors' who can lay traps etc

Galactic Empire

Stormtrooper Corps - featuring the whole gamut of the boys in white, scouts, zero-G troops, the whole lot. No vehicles larger than a speeder bike to reinforce their fast assault role
Imperial Army/Navy - The basic troopers, this would be the subfaction to go for if you want an armoured assault, with little in the way of elite infantry but above average access to AT-STs
Imperial Intelligence - I wasn't really sure where to go with the third Imperial option, but I think this one would be interesting. You've essentially got 3 areas to look at - the ISB (& COMPNOR), the Ubiqtorate and the Inquisitorius. I think this could work with COMPNOR assault squads as poorly trained yet fanatical infantry backing up teams of intelligence agents and squads of force-using minor Inquisitors as seen in the Rebels cartoon

I mean, it won't happen, but that's how I'd do it.

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Well GW just had what might be their best six months ever. More profit in 6 months than the entirety of last year which was already a decent year for GW. It is safe to say the 8th edition has done very very well for GW. If legion is to take the top spot it will really have to take off.
   
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The thing with 40k is its similar to World of Warcraft. Everyone is trying to kill it but people have invested so much into their 40k armies or warcraft characters that just throwing them out for another game is not feasible to a lot of people.

   
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 auticus wrote:
The thing with 40k is its similar to World of Warcraft. Everyone is trying to kill it but people have invested so much into their 40k armies or warcraft characters that just throwing them out for another game is not feasible to a lot of people.



it also depends on whether they can really channel the popularity of Star Wars. It is obviously far and away a more popular setting (since most people that arent gamers have never heard of nor care about 40k) so if they can time it right and not flub it, should be a easy win. X-wing pretty much toppled 40k from its perch already.
   
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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Guys name Marvo Jadoona.


Really, there's a lot of them, and they're all sandtroopers for some reason.







Wow, this game needs to find a fresh vein in an autocannibalizing franchise. Better bring in Caravan of Courage's giant to really shake things up.


Slag off the Ewok films again, and I'll cut you!

(Loves those films I do.)



Hey, only those of us who enjoyed the films even remember them. If I slag, I slag out of love.

   
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 AndrewGPaul wrote:
Those aren't really factions, IMO - just different units in the Empire and Rebel factions.

I suppose having Mon Mothma's Rebels, the Lothal rebels and Saw Gererra's partisans would give you three factions, but only the last of those really makes sense fighting the other two, and even that's a push.

Having Sandtroopers fighting Snowtroopers makes even less sense.


I suppose I should have called the different Imperials and Rebels sub factions, although I would argue that you're unlikely to see a lot of mix and match in any Imperial Stormtrooper force (beyond scouts and basic stormtroopers)......they are likely to be used to make separate armies, Snowtrooper Hoth army etc.

I also did include other separate factions......

Tuskens, limited to the one planet of course, but they literally hate everyone else (even other tusken tribes) and will fight Rebels, Imperials, local settlers, Jawas, Pirates etc.

Mandalorian, mercenaries willing to work for many different sides.

Criminal gangs (Black Sun), Pirates, Hutt Mercenaries etc. Its probable that the Imperials at least would spend as much time stomping down the criminal element as fighting Rebels.
   
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I'm not even sure why but it really doesn't appeal to me. I love Star Wars, but I don't think the factions excite me enough. As has been mentioned outside of throwing in smuggling cartels it's pretty much down to two. I know people have mentioned other races, but other than wookies they're going to be a bit naff, especially if this is hero focussed. I can't see Wicket giving Darth Vader a good hiding with his spear and slingshot.

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phillv85 wrote:
I'm not even sure why but it really doesn't appeal to me. I love Star Wars, but I don't think the factions excite me enough. As has been mentioned outside of throwing in smuggling cartels it's pretty much down to two. I know people have mentioned other races, but other than wookies they're going to be a bit naff, especially if this is hero focussed. I can't see Wicket giving Darth Vader a good hiding with his spear and slingshot.


It is just a matter of what all they get and can do, If they can leverage all of what Disney owns (and EU like they are doing in X-wing) then there can be some potentially interesting matchups, hell Darth Maul vs Darth Vader
   
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A small town at the foothills of the beautiful Cascade Mountains

Core Set miniatures:
*The Rebel contents contains two unique miniatures - Luke and the AT-RT. The rest of the models contain duplicates, leading to seven miniatures that are included twice.
*The Imperial side is much the same, with two unique Speeder Bikes, and one Vader miniature. The remaining models contain duplicates, meaning there are six miniatures that are included twice.

http://mezmaronslair.blogspot.com/2017/12/star-wars-legion-core-set-miniatures.html

Thoughts on this? I was hoping for more unique sculpts.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/02 20:00:34


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I'm actually surprised they have so many sculpts for the 'basic' troop type (I expected 3 of each sculpt not 2)

(and with the CGI especially in the 2nd set of films you actually did see a bunch of duplicates on screen so its movie accurate)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/02 20:35:06


 
   
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I am not having a problem with generic stormtroopers looking like generic stormtroopers.
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut






Looks like enough so that each squad has no duplicate poses. Seems fine to me. Even with the coloured boxes to highlight duplicates, those photos look fine.

Depending on the moulding machinery, more poses could mean more sprues needed, increasing costs for little if any benefit.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/03 14:39:53


 
   
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Rampton, UK

I can see it selling very well for the models, I know so many collectors of star wars armada but not one person that plays it, I suspect that those type of people as well as gamers will be buying in, but as for it taking the place of 40k, no way.

 
   
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 Rayvon wrote:
I can see it selling very well for the models, I know so many collectors of star wars armada but not one person that plays it, I suspect that those type of people as well as gamers will be buying in, but as for it taking the place of 40k, no way.


Its very possible, I remember folks saying that "magic was just a fad and would never be bigger than D&D" , Star Wars is a much more popular IP than 40k, if they do a good job with the rules and support it, it could easily take 40k's place, especially in the US.
   
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40k stability- can Star Wars take its spot?

Short term? Yes.

Long term? No.

Remember Star Wars RPG? Which one? West End Games? They had the license for a while. Then WotC had it. Now, FFG has it. For now.

Remember Decipher's Star Wars CCG? I do. Decipher had the license for a few years. LucasArts (or Lucas Films) decided that they wanted more money for a card license and rented it out to WotC for a few years.

Remember WotC's Star Wars miniatures? WotC had the license from 2004 to 2010. I can't speak to why it ended as I don't care and can't be bothered to google it.

Now FFG has the board license for at least a subset of game types. They'll continue to have it so long as they AND LucasArts both agree that it's financially viable. Then, it goes poof.

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London

Added to which FFG don’t keep anything going long term. I’ve enjoyed Imperial Assault these last few years but the current expansion seems to be the last, there’s an App to support the game but it’s clear the product is being shelved for development.
   
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 kronk wrote:
40k stability- can Star Wars take its spot?

Short term? Yes.

Long term? No.

Remember Star Wars RPG? Which one? West End Games? They had the license for a while. Then WotC had it. Now, FFG has it. For now.

Remember Decipher's Star Wars CCG? I do. Decipher had the license for a few years. LucasArts (or Lucas Films) decided that they wanted more money for a card license and rented it out to WotC for a few years.

Remember WotC's Star Wars miniatures? WotC had the license from 2004 to 2010. I can't speak to why it ended as I don't care and can't be bothered to google it.

Now FFG has the board license for at least a subset of game types. They'll continue to have it so long as they AND LucasArts both agree that it's financially viable. Then, it goes poof.

I don't really have anything to add that Star Wars Miniatures ended because Wizards of the Coast didn't renew the Star Wars license, and to also remember Star Wars Galaxies, which shutdown due to losing the SW license to BioWare.

Also, the WEG RPG and Decipher CCG were really top of the class and expanded the universe greatly, and a large part of why Star Wars remained relevant during its 25 years off. Wizards, I think, was very limited in what they could do with the Star Wars universe compared to those two, and while their products were largely subpar, it's also possible that there is an inevitable decline that Star Wars licensed products will hit once they've hit the limit of the surprisingly small license. I mean, you can do EU stuff, but it doesn't have the same recognition or selling power. Heck, even the prequels are avoided at all cost, making Star Wars basically a license of 3 movies and some fanservice.

FFG has the benefit of a few extra (subpar) movies, but how many Star Wars miniature games have there been? Three so far, if you don't include pnp RPGs or LEGOs, one of which being another FFG game that's still in production. Star Wars Miniatures is just old enough that you can get most of the almost thousand figures for pennies. How many times will people buy stormtroopers? And what happens when FFG runs out of stormtroopers? Is that why Imperial Assault became Legions at a different scale?
   
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Most Glorious Grey Seer






There’s also something interesting to factor in.

It seems order levels of Star Wars toys are down yet again.

Whilst not exactly conclusive (although I’ve got a complete collection, TFA figure were crap compared to immediately preceding lines, limiting appeal to collectors), it does suggest that the commonly held perception of a Star Wars license being a ‘if we release it, they will come’ moneyspinner may no longer be all that accurate.

And this is a game from a company known to drop lines half way through. And indeed, one who’s business practices aren’t necessarily all that well regarded.

Us nerds are a funny old bunch. To some degree, we’ll simply chuck money at stuff we like. But we’re also incredibly diverse. What pleases Nerd A, can turn Nerd B off entirely, even though both are heavily committed to the same base license.

Example I can immediately think of? Funkopops. My friend loves them. Not in a way ‘must buy every single one’ way, but in a ‘must have all of those from properties I even dimly approve of’. Me? They leave me utterly cold. I just don’t get them. They don’t do anything, and seem awfully cheap in terms of construction for what you’re paying.

In summary? Something being a Star Wars license is not in itself a recipe for success, and some could argue that Star Wars over exposure could be its biggest hurdle.

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SoCal

For the drop in orders, I wonder how much that has to do with the IP versus the products themselves. For example, the micromachines released for TFA and Rogue One were subpar compared to previous micromachines ranges and especially compared to X-Wing minis and those Hot Wheels Die Cast ships (may they rot in warehouse hell). There are no micromachines for TLJ despite there being plenty of starship designs.

I can easily see the following explanation:
1). Company releases crappy toys.
2). Customers realize toys are crappy, don't buy so many of them.
3). Company concludes Star Wars is cold product.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Funkopops release a pheromone. If you are immune to it, please contact the resistance. We need every able body we can get.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/12/21 20:37:49


   
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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
In summary? Something being a Star Wars license is not in itself a recipe for success, and some could argue that Star Wars over exposure could be its biggest hurdle.
The biggest hurdle is that everything Star Wars has already been done, and done better.

A Star Wars RPG? Eh, it's not as good as the West End Games one.

A Star Wars CCG? Eh, it's not as good as the Decipher one.

A Star Wars MMO? Eh, it's not as good as the SOE one.

A Star Wars miniatures game about space ships? Eh, it's not as good as X-Wing.

A Star Wars action figure? Eh, the 80s did it better.

A Star Wars movie? Eh, it's not as good as the original trilogy.

It's not enough to release a new Star Wars item, you are competing with every other Star Wars product released in that genre. So far, FFG has succeeded by bettering past works (Rebellion is better than SW Risk) or by doing a product without a recognizable SW parent (Imperial Assault, Destiny, X-Wing). Their pnp RPG seems passable at best, and Legion doesn't look like it will compare favorably to other Star War miniature games (even Imperial Assault) or miniature games in general. The Star Wars license is filled with best in class examples, and it's a tough legacy to live up to.
   
 
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